Visiting the Museum Ship Valley Camp in Sault Ste Marie
Episode 12425th August 2023 • Total Michigan • Cliff Duvernois
00:00:00 00:31:31

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Next to the Soo Locks, the Museum Ship Valley Camp is a staple in Sault Ste Marie. From the history of Sault Ste Marie to the history of shipping in Lake Super and the Soo Locks, the Valley Camp covers it all. In this episode, Curator Paul Sabourin takes us on a tour of not only the Valley Camp but the history surrounding Sault Ste Marie. Including some fascinating exhibits from the Edmund Fitzgerald and some

Links:

Museum Ship Valley Camp Website: https://www.saulthistoricsites.com/museum-ship-valley-camp/

Trailer for The Men Long Forgotten: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pcYRLJiNVQ

Director's Edit for The Men Long Forgotten: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFKcsF_XDDE

Address:

501 East Water Street

Sault Ste. Marie, MI 49783 

(906) 632-3658

Transcripts

Paul Sabourin:

One of their main purpose was to secure a

Paul Sabourin:

waterfront site for tourists.

Paul Sabourin:

In 1966, the Valley Camp freighter was then decommissioned.

Paul Sabourin:

And consequently, the purchase was made.

Paul Sabourin:

And in 1968, on July the fourth, the ship was tugged across Lake Superior

Paul Sabourin:

right here to Sault Saint Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

Hello everyone and welcome back to Total Michigan.

Cliff Duvernois:

I am your host, Cliff DuVernois.

Cliff Duvernois:

If you paid attention to the episode that we did with Captain Scott with

Cliff Duvernois:

the Famous Soo Lock Boat Tours, he made a comment about how they

Cliff Duvernois:

do some of the tours in French.

Cliff Duvernois:

And of course I hear this and I want to be a part of it.

Cliff Duvernois:

But anyways, we're lucky because right next door to the Famous Soo

Cliff Duvernois:

Locks is the Valley Camp, and this is a nationally recognized museum.

Cliff Duvernois:

One of the must.

Cliff Duvernois:

stop points if you're going to be making a trip to Sault Ste Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

And today we've got the honor and the privilege of talking to not only the

Cliff Duvernois:

French speaker for the tours of the Famous Soo Locks, but also a curator and

Cliff Duvernois:

a tour guide here at the Valley Camp.

Cliff Duvernois:

Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the show, Paul Sabourin.

Cliff Duvernois:

Hey,

Paul Sabourin:

Thank you very much, Cliff.

Paul Sabourin:

It's a pleasure and an honor to be here in your company and to be able to share

Paul Sabourin:

with your viewers and listeners all of the historical aspect of Sault Ste Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

Can I?

Cliff Duvernois:

So I gotta say, I love how you say that in French, so let's

Cliff Duvernois:

get that right off the bat.

Cliff Duvernois:

I love that.

Cliff Duvernois:

And I really, there's so much here that we need to dive into 'cause I'm

Cliff Duvernois:

learning so much about Sault Ste marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

But before we get into that, Paul, I'd like to know a little bit more about you.

Cliff Duvernois:

So where are you from?

Cliff Duvernois:

Where did you grow up?

Paul Sabourin:

I was born in Northern Quebec in a small community,

Paul Sabourin:

which was a mining community.

Paul Sabourin:

And then my parents were there moving from Ontario back in the thirties.

Paul Sabourin:

And from there I then relocated with the family back in Ontario.

Paul Sabourin:

Went to school in English at University.

Paul Sabourin:

Okay, and as soon as I graduated and I was in Toronto, then I

Paul Sabourin:

took a beeline for Montreal.

Paul Sabourin:

And I studied in recreation.

Paul Sabourin:

And I was the assistant Director of recreation in on the island of Montreal.

Paul Sabourin:

Then I also went to Hydro Quebec in the James Bay Project

Paul Sabourin:

as a recreation director.

Paul Sabourin:

After that, then I decided after three years I'd warm up.

Paul Sabourin:

So I canoed down to Mississippi,

Paul Sabourin:

Okay,

Paul Sabourin:

four months and met this beautiful young lady in Marquette.

Cliff Duvernois:

That's how these stories always

Paul Sabourin:

We are celebrating our 47th anniversary.

Cliff Duvernois:

Congratulations.

Paul Sabourin:

That's you.

Paul Sabourin:

Thank you very much with our three daughters, Simon Rashelle and

Paul Sabourin:

Adele, and five grandchildren.

Paul Sabourin:

So being here in Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie, she was born and raised here in Sault St.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie.

Paul Sabourin:

Then I went to work across the river, I should say, across the St.

Paul Sabourin:

Mary's River on the International Bridge with the Ministry

Paul Sabourin:

of Culture and Recreation.

Paul Sabourin:

Ministry of Culture and Recreation dealt with naturally with

Paul Sabourin:

recreation, sports and fitness.

Paul Sabourin:

But also it dealt with the culture side of the ministry, which was art

Paul Sabourin:

literature, libraries, museums, and I emphasize museum because that was one

Paul Sabourin:

aspect of my work that I really enjoyed.

Paul Sabourin:

30 years of working over at in Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie, Ontario.

Paul Sabourin:

A good friend of mine who at that particular time was the executive

Paul Sabourin:

director of the Sault Historic Sites, the owner of the museum, ship Valley

Paul Sabourin:

Camp, Richard Brawley, and also part owner at this point here, and also.

Paul Sabourin:

with this Famous Soo Lock Boat Tour.

Paul Sabourin:

So Richard says, said, Paul says, why don't you come in?

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

I retired on a Friday and on the Monday I was here on the Valley Camp.

Paul Sabourin:

So I think I had two days of, semi-retirement.

Paul Sabourin:

And I say semi-retirement because I put in three days a week,

Paul Sabourin:

Tuesday, Wednesdays, and Thursdays.

Paul Sabourin:

And the rest of the time I am free to do as I wish.

Paul Sabourin:

I enjoyed working here on the Museum Ship Valley Camp.

Cliff Duvernois:

So let me ask you this question.

Cliff Duvernois:

There's a whole bunch of questions I actually want to ask.

Cliff Duvernois:

So let's go back to the beginning.

Cliff Duvernois:

So your wife, your daughters, are they fluent in French as well?

Paul Sabourin:

Adele speaks the French.

Paul Sabourin:

And even my her son, Logan even said the other day, he says, I'm gonna

Paul Sabourin:

have some creme glacée ice cream.

Paul Sabourin:

with this here, my wife tried.

Paul Sabourin:

But then it was pretty difficult at that particular point.

Paul Sabourin:

And, we do have, yes, conversations in French with the rest of the family.

Cliff Duvernois:

Beautiful.

Cliff Duvernois:

Love it.

Cliff Duvernois:

I gotta ask you this question.

Cliff Duvernois:

What is it, 'cause you, you said before about, being involved with

Cliff Duvernois:

museums and you really liked it.

Cliff Duvernois:

What in particular drew you to that type of work?

Paul Sabourin:

Well, it was the provincial government and it was

Paul Sabourin:

ministry, and it was rec recreation.

Paul Sabourin:

This was my particular background, and with that, then I had applied

Paul Sabourin:

10 years, three times, and finally ended up here in Sault Saint Marie,

Paul Sabourin:

with that particular position.

Paul Sabourin:

It was a covering an area that also dealt with francophones.

Paul Sabourin:

My position was a designated bilingual position.

Paul Sabourin:

So I had to be able to speak both languages.

Paul Sabourin:

Sure.

Paul Sabourin:

So English is my second language and I know that, it was somewhat difficult

Paul Sabourin:

at first trying to pronounce the.

Paul Sabourin:

T h if I say my mother and my brother.

Paul Sabourin:

Yeah.

Paul Sabourin:

And all of this here and the feather.

Paul Sabourin:

So this is when I'm doing tours, I usually then let people know that,

Paul Sabourin:

yes, this is gonna be my accent.

Paul Sabourin:

But nevertheless anyway, it was then a good opportunity to be able to be involved

Paul Sabourin:

here with the Museum Ship Valley Camp.

Paul Sabourin:

Because in the seventies, to be more exact.

Paul Sabourin:

In 78, 77, the Edmund Fitzgerald sank in 1975.

Paul Sabourin:

Indeed, it sank in Canadian water.

Paul Sabourin:

And it was the province of Ontario through the archeological branch.

Paul Sabourin:

and I was with the regional services branch.

Paul Sabourin:

And we had our archeologists in the office.

Paul Sabourin:

And I pretty much had to send a lot of briefing notes dealing with the recovery

Paul Sabourin:

of the bell from the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Paul Sabourin:

So then I got to know pretty much the history.

Paul Sabourin:

And as a matter of fact, tie in with this here Gordon Lightfoot,

Paul Sabourin:

when I was in Toronto in Yorkville.

Paul Sabourin:

Back in the sixties, Gordon Lightfoot was in Yorkville performing.

Paul Sabourin:

I also had the opportunity when he was in James Bay of seeing him doing

Paul Sabourin:

his canoe trip down the Rupert River.

Paul Sabourin:

And last but not least, the last time that he was here in Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie at the Kewadin Casino, I had the opportunity along with

Paul Sabourin:

a good friend Bruce Lin and his wife, and my wife of sitting with.

Paul Sabourin:

And being backstage.

Paul Sabourin:

Bruce is with the Great Lake Shipwreck Historical Society.

Paul Sabourin:

So we do have very much common activity between both of us here.

Cliff Duvernois:

So for our audience, I do I want to say that for this particular

Cliff Duvernois:

conversation here, Gordon Lightfoot wrote a song about the Edmund fitzgerald.

Cliff Duvernois:

And not only that, but he recently passed away.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

because it was all I know.

Cliff Duvernois:

It was all over my Facebook feed.

Cliff Duvernois:

Especially 'cause being here in Michigan and Edmund Fitzgerald

Cliff Duvernois:

was in Lake Superior, like you said on the Canadian side.

Cliff Duvernois:

so yeah,

Paul Sabourin:

This is definitely, yes, a loss with Gordon Lightfoot and the

Paul Sabourin:

legend lives on from the Chippewa on down on a big lake they call Gitche Gumee.

Paul Sabourin:

This is the start of the song itself.

Paul Sabourin:

There's also an obituary that I took out from the newspapers and all of the

Paul Sabourin:

literature, and it's posted right here.

Paul Sabourin:

Sure.

Paul Sabourin:

At the ship because we have here inside the museum, ship Valley

Paul Sabourin:

camp, three artifacts or three debris from the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Paul Sabourin:

Lifeboat number one, only half of it.

Paul Sabourin:

Because it was ripped in half.

Paul Sabourin:

Lifeboat number two, it was found on the shore, on the Ontario side,

Paul Sabourin:

and a portion of a life ring.

Paul Sabourin:

And we have a beautiful display about the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Paul Sabourin:

This was one of my first project that I was able to accomplish

Paul Sabourin:

here when I arrived here.

Paul Sabourin:

And thanks to the Michigan Council of arts and cultural affairs, they provided the

Paul Sabourin:

funding for brand new displays, all of the names of the 29 sailors, what they did,

Paul Sabourin:

and also being able to talk about the dive that was done on the Edmonds Fitzgerald

Paul Sabourin:

by the Woodrush and Captain Jimmy Hobaugh talked about the Calypso and the one time

Paul Sabourin:

that they were here on Lake Superior.

Paul Sabourin:

So the whole background of the Edmund Fitzgerald can be seen here

Paul Sabourin:

at the Museum Ship Valley Camp.

Paul Sabourin:

And as well, the bell.

Paul Sabourin:

When it was retrieved from the bottom and replaced by another bell.

Paul Sabourin:

And that bell is now at the Great Lake Shipwreck Historical

Paul Sabourin:

Society every November 10th.

Paul Sabourin:

It is rung, 30 times.

Paul Sabourin:

And I can still feel the shiver in my back when I was able and invited

Paul Sabourin:

to ring it for the Captain McSorley.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

So let's unpack a little bit here about, 'cause I know that I've said

Cliff Duvernois:

several times that we're talking about Valley Camp, but this is Sault Ste.

Cliff Duvernois:

Marie historic sites.

Cliff Duvernois:

So why don't you talk to us, when people see the flyer or the brochure

Cliff Duvernois:

for the historic sites, what does that, in, what does that entail?

Cliff Duvernois:

What does that include?

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

Sault Ste Marie itself was founded as a permanent mission in 1668

Paul Sabourin:

by Father Jacques Marquette,

Cliff Duvernois:

Which makes it one of the oldest

Paul Sabourin:

It is the oldest city in the state of Michigan.

Paul Sabourin:

I say city one has to be qualifying it because it is a

Paul Sabourin:

permanent established mission.

Paul Sabourin:

Roman catholic.

Paul Sabourin:

And consequently also, there's also the comment that it is

Paul Sabourin:

the third oldest in the US.

Paul Sabourin:

But one has to make that particular comment.

Paul Sabourin:

Also, it is with St.

Paul Sabourin:

Augustine and Santa Fe, the third oldest permanent established mission.

Paul Sabourin:

Where masses Roman Catholic were held.

Paul Sabourin:

Right?

Paul Sabourin:

So in 1968, the city of Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie was celebrating its tricentennial 300 years.

Paul Sabourin:

And the board under Don Gary Sr.

Paul Sabourin:

then established the creation of the site and the creation

Paul Sabourin:

also of all of the activities.

Paul Sabourin:

One of their main purpose was to secure a waterfront site for tourists, right?

Paul Sabourin:

And consequently, the word got around and in dilute.

Paul Sabourin:

In 1966, the Valley Camp freighter was then decommissioned.

Paul Sabourin:

And consequently, the purchase was made.

Paul Sabourin:

And in 1968, on July the fourth, the ship was tugged across Lake Superior

Paul Sabourin:

right here to Sault Saint Marie.

Paul Sabourin:

Also, in addition to that, the Sault Historic site was able to

Paul Sabourin:

acquire the Tower of History.

Paul Sabourin:

The Tower of History is one particular site that, so you say Sault S A U L T.

Paul Sabourin:

Historic sites, plural.

Paul Sabourin:

So the Tower of History was a building that was then built in 66 by the Diocese

Paul Sabourin:

of Sault Ste Marie, and Marquette.

Paul Sabourin:

The church itself, the fifth church that was with the Roman

Paul Sabourin:

Catholic Diocese of Sault Ste Marie needed to have some repair.

Paul Sabourin:

it was discussed by the parishioners and the various diocese, employees

Paul Sabourin:

said, instead of renovation, let's build a brand new one.

Paul Sabourin:

So they started with the bell tower, okay?

Paul Sabourin:

And once that was completed, expenses and budgets were limited.

Paul Sabourin:

So they did repair the church, fortunately.

Paul Sabourin:

Late 1800 church, beautiful St.

Paul Sabourin:

Mary's pro cathedral.

Paul Sabourin:

Then when the debt was paid on the tower, they then turned it over to the

Paul Sabourin:

Sault Historic site to own and operate.

Paul Sabourin:

So we do have those two particular sites.

Paul Sabourin:

In addition to this also, we also contract with the River of History Museum.

Paul Sabourin:

It is a separate organization.

Paul Sabourin:

It is referred to as Sault Ste Marie Foundation for Culture and History.

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

It is a beautiful site.

Paul Sabourin:

The history going from the Ice Age, all the way to our 1910 governor

Paul Sabourin:

and all the times in between.

Paul Sabourin:

It is located on the Main Street, Ashman Street.

Paul Sabourin:

And beautiful site where you can visit all three sites for a deluxe

Paul Sabourin:

combination ticket that can be purchased at the Valley Camp, the

Paul Sabourin:

Tower History, or the River of History.

Cliff Duvernois:

Nice.

Cliff Duvernois:

For our audience, we're gonna take a quick break to thank our sponsors.

Cliff Duvernois:

When we come back, we're going to learn a little bit more from Paul, exactly

Cliff Duvernois:

what you can expect when you come here and how you can make the best of

Cliff Duvernois:

your visit should you choose to come.

Cliff Duvernois:

We'll see you after the break.

Cliff Duvernois:

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Hello everyone and welcome back to Total Michigan.

Cliff Duvernois:

I'm your host Cliff Dubon Law.

Cliff Duvernois:

Today I'm at the Valley Camp in Sault Ste Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

And I'm sitting with Paul Sabourin, a museum, curator

Cliff Duvernois:

and a tour guide all around Mr.

Cliff Duvernois:

Information, especially historical information about Sault Ste.

Cliff Duvernois:

Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

Before the break, Paul, we were talking a little bit about, the

Cliff Duvernois:

Sault Historic sites, and you mentioned the Tower of History.

Cliff Duvernois:

You also mentioned the river.

Cliff Duvernois:

Talk to us a little bit when we say the Tower of History, just

Cliff Duvernois:

give us a picture of what that is.

Cliff Duvernois:

What does that look

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

the Tower of History, naturally, if you look up, way up,

Paul Sabourin:

210 feet, nice to be exact.

Paul Sabourin:

Then it is a cement structure next to the St.

Paul Sabourin:

Mary's cathedral.

Paul Sabourin:

It has an elevator that can whisk you up 45 seconds.

Paul Sabourin:

Thank you.

Paul Sabourin:

Or if you wish, 292 steps to take you to the top.

Paul Sabourin:

And there's three observation platform.

Paul Sabourin:

One is enclosed with displays and with information with binoculars.

Paul Sabourin:

And also an interactive marine traffic so that you know which ship you're

Paul Sabourin:

able to see that's coming by on the St.

Paul Sabourin:

Mary's river.

Paul Sabourin:

Nice.

Paul Sabourin:

The other two, and if you're challenging yourself to be out in the open air,

Paul Sabourin:

then there's two observation decks.

Paul Sabourin:

One that's a little bit higher.

Paul Sabourin:

It's open air and one that's a little bit lower where you can pretty well see 360

Paul Sabourin:

degrees of the city of Sault Ste Marie.

Paul Sabourin:

From there, you've got a very nice view of what's left of the St.

Paul Sabourin:

Mary's Rapid, but also you can see over in Sault St.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie, Ontario, Canada, and Sault Ste Marie, Michigan.

Paul Sabourin:

The other side that we do have, and as I pointed out a little bit earlier,

Paul Sabourin:

was the River of History Museum.

Paul Sabourin:

Yes.

Paul Sabourin:

And the river, again, as I say, is located downtown.

Paul Sabourin:

It's our trifecta of history here for Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie.

Paul Sabourin:

You get a pretty good idea of the history of Sault Ste.

Paul Sabourin:

Marie, and especially with the River of History.

Paul Sabourin:

When you do walk in, you're handed a au, which has a recording.

Paul Sabourin:

And you press on the various station in order to get the history of the native

Paul Sabourin:

Anishinaabe Chippewa ban of Ojibwe, of the fur traders of John Johnston,

Paul Sabourin:

who married Oshahguscodaywayquay, the daughter of Chief Waubojeeg.

Cliff Duvernois:

who I'm gonna have trouble saying that one

Paul Sabourin:

Oshahguscodaywayquay.

Paul Sabourin:

Wait, I'll let you say it.

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

John called her then Susan.

Paul Sabourin:

Susan Johnson.

Paul Sabourin:

Susan.

Paul Sabourin:

I can say

Paul Sabourin:

Susan, you can say.

Paul Sabourin:

And these are some of the houses, for instance, that are on Water Street

Paul Sabourin:

right next to the Valley camp, the original house of John Johnston.

Paul Sabourin:

But let's get to the Valley Camp.

Paul Sabourin:

The Valley camp itself, 1917 in Loraine, Ohio.

Paul Sabourin:

She was then launched for

Cliff Duvernois:

that's when she was

Paul Sabourin:

ARS in

Paul Sabourin:

Yep.

Paul Sabourin:

1917, that's when she was built and launched.

Paul Sabourin:

And she was carrying Coal for all of the furnaces and coal for all of the locations

Paul Sabourin:

that then produced metal in 1955.

Paul Sabourin:

She then was purchased by Republic Steel and named the Valley Camp

Paul Sabourin:

to commemorate the Valley Camp Coal Company out of Pennsylvania.

Paul Sabourin:

She sailed until 1966 and at that particular time, she is a coal fired

Paul Sabourin:

furnace, triple expansion steam engine.

Paul Sabourin:

She was then decommissioned and laid up in Dilute, and this is when the Sault

Paul Sabourin:

Historic site then made a purchase.

Paul Sabourin:

From that particular time onward, as a non-profit organization, we

Paul Sabourin:

then develop all of the interior and exterior of the ship itself.

Paul Sabourin:

At this point here, we have an excess of about 150 models of ships that are

Paul Sabourin:

inside the Museum Ship Valley Camp.

Paul Sabourin:

Yeah.

Paul Sabourin:

We also have then this particular room that we're in right now,

Paul Sabourin:

about four years ago, the shipping company and the Sault Historic site

Paul Sabourin:

coordinated a, an approach to create an environmentally controlled room, and

Paul Sabourin:

the reason is to be able to house the beautiful eagle that you see next to

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

For our audience, if you're watching this on the YouTube channel, you

Cliff Duvernois:

can definitely see it, but that is definitely a work of art.

Cliff Duvernois:

So yes.

Cliff Duvernois:

Talk to us about the eagle.

Cliff Duvernois:

Where did the eagle come from?

Cliff Duvernois:

Why is it significant?

Paul Sabourin:

Well, the eagle itself was, 1873 was carved out of number

Paul Sabourin:

of pieces of wood that was connected together, and it was put on the top

Paul Sabourin:

of the pilot house of the Vienna.

Paul Sabourin:

Now the Vienna was a ship that sailed up till 1786 and.

Paul Sabourin:

During that particular time, it was foggy in Whitefish Bay and

Paul Sabourin:

it got struck by another ship.

Paul Sabourin:

It was brought as far to the close to the shore as possible, but about two

Paul Sabourin:

miles away from shore in Whitefish Bay.

Paul Sabourin:

It sank.

Paul Sabourin:

In the seventies, the in Department of Fisheries and Wildlife were

Paul Sabourin:

doing some research and the nets caught on to the fish.

Paul Sabourin:

At that point, divers went down and they were able to recover

Paul Sabourin:

the eagle that we see right here.

Paul Sabourin:

Beautiful.

Paul Sabourin:

It was shared with a space that was environmentally in control at

Paul Sabourin:

the Great Lake Shipwreck Historical Society in Whitefish Point.

Paul Sabourin:

And once we were able to make this particular room here,

Paul Sabourin:

which is the John p Wellington Great Lakes marine hall of Fame,

Paul Sabourin:

It is environmentally controlled, so you can imagine right now it's

Paul Sabourin:

probably about 75 degrees outside.

Paul Sabourin:

And right now it is a cool.

Paul Sabourin:

55, 60 degrees with lights and humidity with that, then the eagle landed and

Paul Sabourin:

it came here back to the Valley Camp.

Cliff Duvernois:

What I would like to do is, let's talk about if I was

Cliff Duvernois:

gonna bring a family here, like I've never been to the Valley camp before,

Cliff Duvernois:

but this is gonna be something cool.

Cliff Duvernois:

We can go in here, we can see a bunch of history.

Cliff Duvernois:

We can learn a lot about shipping through the Soo locks and the whole area.

Cliff Duvernois:

what could it, what could somebody expect when they come here?

Paul Sabourin:

when a family comes in, it could be, a family, one of

Paul Sabourin:

30,000 people during the six month that we're open seven days a week

Paul Sabourin:

from mid-May to the end of October.

Paul Sabourin:

Then the children themself from, up from eight years old.

Paul Sabourin:

To 17, our children's rate, any younger, it's no admission charges.

Paul Sabourin:

So the family can come in here and the first thing that really the children

Paul Sabourin:

are attracted to is the aquarium.

Paul Sabourin:

We do have fish that are swimming here.

Paul Sabourin:

There's beautiful rainbow trouts.

Paul Sabourin:

There's blue gills.

Paul Sabourin:

And the kids really enjoy that particular one.

Paul Sabourin:

Once they're down in the bottom, of the ship itself, then there's an

Paul Sabourin:

interactive area where they can be either the captain or the watchman or

Paul Sabourin:

the wheel person and pretty much steer the ship that they're in charge of.

Paul Sabourin:

So those are some of the main attractions.

Paul Sabourin:

But again, as I say, the history of all of the various maritime.

Paul Sabourin:

Locations and the first lock in Sault Ste Marie, we have a beautiful display.

Paul Sabourin:

It's a model of the 1855 state lock that was built here in Sault Ste Marie.

Cliff Duvernois:

Now, and you kind of alluded to this before, but I do wanna

Cliff Duvernois:

explore this and basically this is the Valley Camp giant freighter ship that

Cliff Duvernois:

has been converted into a museum and from stem to stern is not only like

Cliff Duvernois:

historical remnants of the Valley Camp, but all of these other ships as well.

Paul Sabourin:

Yes.

Paul Sabourin:

lots of other ships are being depicted here.

Paul Sabourin:

We have models, again, as I say, 150 of them.

Paul Sabourin:

We have models also of a few of the 13,000 footers.

Paul Sabourin:

We have a model of the Walter Jim McCarthy, Jr.

Paul Sabourin:

We have a model of the Carl D.

Paul Sabourin:

Bradley.

Paul Sabourin:

And with the Carl D.

Paul Sabourin:

Bradley, that particular one is very good, presentation.

Paul Sabourin:

But there is also something of very close interest, especially

Paul Sabourin:

to our particular area.

Paul Sabourin:

Because in 58, in November of 58, the Carl D.

Paul Sabourin:

Bradley broke in half.

Paul Sabourin:

To give you a little bit of a background, the crew was ready for

Paul Sabourin:

winter birth and they got a call when they were leaving Chicago and

Paul Sabourin:

getting ready to go to Green Bay.

Paul Sabourin:

And they say, you need to go and load up another load of limestone.

Paul Sabourin:

So the captain changed the course and the storm started brewing.

Paul Sabourin:

And when it reached around the area of close to the Strait of

Paul Sabourin:

Mackinac, then it broke in half.

Cliff Duvernois:

Ooh,

Paul Sabourin:

Four of the sailors were tossed overboard along with the life raft,

Paul Sabourin:

but the rest went down with the ship.

Paul Sabourin:

It was 7:30 at night.

Paul Sabourin:

It was November.

Paul Sabourin:

It was a storm.

Paul Sabourin:

And of the four, that were there on the life raft, two of 'em froze to death.

Paul Sabourin:

But two of 'em survive.

Paul Sabourin:

Elmer Fleming and Frank Mays.

Paul Sabourin:

It was 13 hours later that the US Coast Guard was able to find them

Paul Sabourin:

the next morning and save them.

Paul Sabourin:

Since then, Elmer Fleming has passed away.

Paul Sabourin:

He was a much older person.

Paul Sabourin:

But Frank Mays was a gentleman who just passed away two years ago.

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

But Frank wrote a book about his episode on the Carl D.

Paul Sabourin:

Bradley.

Paul Sabourin:

And three years ago we had a young man from the Coast Guard,

Paul Sabourin:

Andrew Tamlin, Stempki from St.

Paul Sabourin:

Igance, who wrote a script, recruited all of the casts, and for three days

Paul Sabourin:

in December we were on top deck and also inside the Museum Ship Valley

Paul Sabourin:

Camp, doing a movie documentary about the wreck of the Carl D.

Paul Sabourin:

Bradley.

Paul Sabourin:

As you can imagine.

Paul Sabourin:

We are now in the final stage of setting it up.

Paul Sabourin:

So it's gonna be continuous in cargo hole number one.

Paul Sabourin:

But if you're interested at this point here, going on YouTube and looking

Paul Sabourin:

for trailers of The Man Long Forgotten

Cliff Duvernois:

The Man Long Forgotten

Cliff Duvernois:

okay.

Paul Sabourin:

Those are the indication that's gonna be with the cd.

Paul Sabourin:

There will be then production ongoing.

Paul Sabourin:

But also the other interesting thing is we have, as I mentioned, the lifeboat

Paul Sabourin:

and the ring from the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Paul Sabourin:

We also have a theater, or I should say two of ' em that

Paul Sabourin:

have the Fitzgerald Controversy.

Paul Sabourin:

It is the fourth.

Paul Sabourin:

Ooh, yes.

Paul Sabourin:

There was the wreck.

Paul Sabourin:

And there was the mystery.

Paul Sabourin:

Now it is the controversy is the title of this one.

Paul Sabourin:

It's an hour and 20 minutes.

Paul Sabourin:

So if you spend time on the Valley Camp and you're interested in learning

Paul Sabourin:

all about the Edmund Fitzgerald, we have then this video that's

Paul Sabourin:

running from opening to closing.

Paul Sabourin:

And then you can pretty well listen to all of the interviews, listen to all of

Paul Sabourin:

the documentation about the Fitzgerald, and learn everything about the fitz.

Cliff Duvernois:

Now, I do want to ask this question here.

Cliff Duvernois:

And I want the audience to actually look it up for

Cliff Duvernois:

themselves if they're into a good.

Cliff Duvernois:

controversy or mystery, but tell us a little bit about why it is the

Cliff Duvernois:

controversy or what is the mystery.

Paul Sabourin:

I usually answer it by saying I've got three answers.

Paul Sabourin:

I don't know.

Paul Sabourin:

I don't know, and I don't know.

Paul Sabourin:

There we go.

Paul Sabourin:

Thank you

Cliff Duvernois:

a documentary for yourself and decide for yourself.

Paul Sabourin:

Because there was an investigation naturally that was

Paul Sabourin:

carried out by the US Coast Guard.

Cliff Duvernois:

Yes.

Paul Sabourin:

And as

Cliff Duvernois:

as within commonplace, whenever there's a

Cliff Duvernois:

shipwreck or an airplane goes down or anything, there's always an

Paul Sabourin:

Yes.

Paul Sabourin:

And the investigation is not conclusive.

Paul Sabourin:

But it is a theory of what happened.

Paul Sabourin:

'cause nobody survived.

Paul Sabourin:

And even the people, or the people, the sailors that were on the Arthur M.

Paul Sabourin:

Anderson,

Paul Sabourin:

And Bernie Cooper was the captain in communication with Captain McSorley.

Paul Sabourin:

They do not have any indication except to see what happened on that particular

Paul Sabourin:

night of November the 10th, 1975.

Cliff Duvernois:

Oh, I love, love love a good mysteries.

Cliff Duvernois:

Now I gotta, I know, I gotta check it out.

Cliff Duvernois:

So Paul, if somebody is, listening to this interview and they wanna

Cliff Duvernois:

check out more, of the Valley Camp, of, the website when you're open,

Cliff Duvernois:

how best they could plan their trip.

Cliff Duvernois:

What's the best way for them to find you, find you online, social media, whatever.

Paul Sabourin:

Okay.

Paul Sabourin:

If you have a G P S and you're in Sault Saint Marie, then 5 0 1 East

Paul Sabourin:

Water Street, 5 0 1 East Water Street.

Paul Sabourin:

This is our location of the ship store and the offices and the archives.

Paul Sabourin:

And we're located right next to the Famous Soo Lock boat tour

Paul Sabourin:

and the Valley Camp on the water.

Paul Sabourin:

Naturally, yes, the ship is floating.

Paul Sabourin:

Only about a third of it is in the ground.

Paul Sabourin:

So the best way also is to log in and check our name of the organization,

Paul Sabourin:

Sault, S A U L T, historic sites.com.

Paul Sabourin:

You'll be able then to see information about the Museum Ship Valley Camp, the

Paul Sabourin:

Tower of History, the River of History.

Paul Sabourin:

And also the historic homes, which are located right next.

Paul Sabourin:

And they're owned by the city and manned by the docent from the

Paul Sabourin:

Chippewa County Historical Society.

Cliff Duvernois:

Nice.

Cliff Duvernois:

So

Paul Sabourin:

there's the history in a handful.

Cliff Duvernois:

And for our audience, you can always go over to Total Michigan.com.

Cliff Duvernois:

Click on Paul's interview and see the links that he mentioned above.

Cliff Duvernois:

Tune in next week for another exciting story about an ordinary michigan, or

Cliff Duvernois:

do some pretty extraordinary things.

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