How to prepare for divorce, divorce confidence, divorce mistakes, custody, finances, and what women need to know before making major decisions.

What happens when a divorce lawyer has actually lived through a difficult divorce herself?

In this episode of Doing Divorce Different, I sit down with family law attorney and divorce survivor Hannah Hembry Bell for an honest conversation about how to prepare for divorce with more clarity and confidence.

Hannah married young, became a mother to three children in quick succession, started law school while raising her family, and then found herself navigating her own divorce and an incredibly difficult custody situation. At one point, she had to borrow $10,000 against a paid-off car just to fund her initial attorney retainer.

Today, Hannah uses that lived experience in her work with women going through divorce.

We talk about one of the biggest mistakes she sees women make: using hope as their strategy instead of getting prepared. We discuss why understanding your finances, gathering documents, learning about the divorce process, and building the right support team can help you approach divorce differently.

But this conversation goes far beyond how to prepare for divorce.

Hannah also shares the message behind her TEDx talk and challenges us to look at whether we're actually enjoying our lives—or simply getting through them.

We talk about want, worth and willingness: acknowledging what you really want, believing you're worthy of it, and developing the courage to take action even when you're afraid of being overwhelmed.

Whether you're considering divorce, already navigating one, rebuilding afterward, or simply wondering if you've become too comfortable playing it safe, this conversation will encourage you to take one thoughtful step toward a life that feels more intentional.

Because how to prepare for divorce isn't only about paperwork.

It's about information, support, confidence—and learning to trust yourself again.

Timestamps

(00:00) Meet divorce survivor turned family law attorney Hannah Hembry Bell

(03:00) Marrying young and becoming a mother to three children

(07:00) Law school, motherhood and beginning to question her marriage

(11:00) The moment Hannah realized something wasn't right

(15:00) Entering divorce completely unprepared

(19:00) The financial reality of a contested divorce

(23:00) Making the heartbreaking decision to move without her children

(28:00) Divorce, law school and graduating valedictorian

(33:00) Returning to court for a custody modification

(38:00) How Hannah's own divorce changed the lawyer she wanted to become

(42:00) Why women need to prepare for divorce differently

(46:00) The mistake of using hope as your divorce strategy

(49:00) Creating My Confident Divorce and a different model of legal support

(54:00) Why divorce involves more than legal paperwork

(58:00) Hannah's TEDx message and the “medium suck life”

(1:02:00) Want, worth and willingness

(1:06:00) Lesa opens up about her fear of becoming overwhelmed

(1:10:00) How to build your courage muscle

(1:15:00) Why Hannah started saying yes to more experiences

(1:19:00) Letting go of certainty and making room for surprise and joy

(1:23:00) The question to ask yourself this week

Key Takeaways

• Hope is not a divorce strategy. If divorce may be happening, gathering information and preparing yourself can help you make better decisions.
• You don't have to know everything to become more confident. Confidence grows when you understand your options and know which questions to ask.
• Divorce is more than a legal process. Emotional support, mindset, finances, parenting and community can all be important pieces.
• Want, worth and willingness matter. Give yourself permission to acknowledge what you want, believe you're worthy of a meaningful life, and consider what you're willing to do to create it.
• Build your courage muscle. Sometimes growth happens by doing one uncomfortable thing and discovering you're okay on the other side.

Guest Bio

Hannah Hembry Bell is a family law attorney, entrepreneur and divorce survivor whose personal experience navigating divorce and a difficult custody battle helped shape the way she practices law today.

After attending law school while raising three young children and going through her own divorce, Hannah graduated valedictorian and began her career in a large law firm. She later left Big Law to create the kind of family law practice and support she wished she'd had during her own divorce.

She is also the creator of My Confident Divorce, a model designed to combine legal representation with education, mindset support and community for women navigating divorce.

Resource Links

OsteoStrong Minnesota — Lesa's affiliate link:

https://osteostrongmn.com/affiliate-referral-koski/

Soberlink — Lesa's affiliate link:

https://www.soberlink.com/divorce/family-law?utm_source=affiliatelink&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=lesa-koski-affiliatelink

Affiliate disclosure: Some resource links may be affiliate links, which means I may receive a commission if you purchase through them, at no additional cost to you.

Tags/Keywords

how to prepare for divorce, divorce preparation, divorce confidence, women and divorce, divorce advice for women, divorce mistakes, preparing financially for divorce, divorce finances, divorce custody, child custody, family law attorney, divorce lawyer, divorce support for women, divorce mindset, divorce recovery, divorce planning, divorce education, women over 40 divorce, My Confident Divorce, Hannah Hembry Bell, Doing Divorce Different, Lesa Koski

Welcome back to Doing Divorce Different.

2

I'm so thankful that you're here.

3

We're gonna kinda do something

a little different today.

4

I'm talking to Hannah Hembry

Bell, and she is a divorce

5

survivor turned divorce lawyer.

6

So we're gonna, you know, we're

gonna throw in some stuff about

7

divorce, but I'm so excited to

chat with Hannah because I was just

8

trying to dig up your TEDx talk- Yes

9

that you did.

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I couldn't find it.

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Yeah.

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But you're gonna tell us

how- It's not published yet.

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Oh.

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It's so funny that it's not.

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No wonder you couldn't find it.

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It's, like, still in the hopper.

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Oh, goodness.

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Okay.

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Well, we'll figure that out.

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Maybe by the time this comes

out it'll be out there.

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Yeah.

22

But I think what's gonna be so fun

about talking about that and getting

23

ready for that is I always want women

to feel more confident, right, as

24

they're going through this and after

this, and I just think learning what

25

you went through to get there and what

your message was is gonna be amazing.

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But before we dig into that, I wanna

know your story and what led you

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to help people through divorces.

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Yeah, so, I mean, there's all kinds

of layers as all of our stories are.

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But the, in broad strokes, what

happened was I got, uh, married

30

when I was 21 years old, um, and

didn't know nothing about nothing.

31

Certainly didn't have any

business getting married.

32

I don't know if I should've

been allowed to vote yet.

33

You know, not cooked.

34

Um, and really did it from a

place of oh, you know, you go to

35

college, you come back married.

36

I'm from a small town in East

Texas, and I just thought, you

37

know, it's kinda what you do.

38

So okay.

39

Um, and I started having

kids really early.

40

I got, actually got pregnant on

birth control my first, um, my first

41

one, Lucy, when I was 23 years old.

42

So I started having kids pretty

much right away, 'cause I was 21,

43

but turned 22 shortly thereafter.

44

So about a year or so in, I'm

already starting to have kids.

45

Um, and that really shaped that, that

part of our marriage and my growing up.

46

I was in my 20s having babies, and

then a- my first one, and then 18

47

months later I had her brother, and

15 months later I had their brother.

48

Wow.

49

So I had these … When I brought

the youngest big kiddo f- home from

50

the hospital, my oldest was not yet

three, and my middle was not quite

51

walking 'cause he was a big, cute,

little tubbo baby and was- Yeah

52

not walking.

53

And then I had this tiny baby.

54

So yeah, I just give that context

for anybody listening who is in that

55

phase with all these little kids.

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You know or you can

imagine what that was like.

57

It was survival only.

58

Yeah.

59

So, like, I'd started to have

some questions early on in my

60

marriage, like six months in.

61

Um, I remember thinking and,

and actually saying to my mom

62

that I've made a big mistake.

63

Um, but I was only six months in.

64

Like, ah, and God doesn't want

you to get divorced and, you know,

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all of these thoughts that I had.

66

So I stayed, but then I started

having kids, so there was no

67

thought to the marriage or

your feelings or your emotions.

68

You're just trying to raise

little, tiny children.

69

Mm-hmm.

70

Uh, with three of them so close together,

that's, that's what it was like.

71

Um, and then really we'd moved a couple

times for my ex-husband's job, and,

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um, then as the kids started, like,

maybe, you know, getting everybody out

73

of diapers, you know, go … It's like

you start to come up for some air.

74

So a lot of women, I think,

have that exact same experience.

75

Um, and that's for me.

76

And so I was looking, um,

at a different career.

77

I had started a recruiting business and

had been an entrepreneur in that way,

78

but I just didn't feel like this was it,

this was the job, this was my purpose.

79

Um, and considered a few different

things, and anyway, um, along the way

80

I got my MBA in pursuit of that and,

and ended up going to law school.

81

Um, and one of … I had taken

a business law course in my

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MBA And fell in love with it.

83

Yeah.

84

That's kind of how I…

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I, I mean, I would have

never considered law school.

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Like, I had no idea.

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Nobody in my family is lawyers.

88

We didn't know any lawyers.

89

Mm-hmm.

90

I mean, nothing like that.

91

But exposure to, through that

class really was like, "Hey, wait a

92

minute, there's something to this."

93

So I started, um, surprisingly with

three kids in tow, law school at St.

94

Mary's.

95

Um, now I lived about an hour

and 20 minutes west of there.

96

So I drove into school, um, and ran

r- my recruiting business at the same

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time- Wow … and had the three kids.

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I, this is, I mean, I just explained

the level of wildness of my life.

99

This is not advisable.

100

This is not the way to do it.

101

Um, you know, I ended up getting divorced.

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And so I go there to law school

and start living a d- you know, a

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different li- it's like I started

to kind of grow up as a woman.

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I'd just been growing up as a mom.

105

Mm-hmm.

106

And the things that people do in their

20s, and the, it, the awareness they

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have, and the thoughtfulness about

themselves, and self-reflection and

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all that, I was just starting to have

as I was, like, turning 30 years old.

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Yeah.

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Because I'd not done any of that.

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So I, it, and the more I've thought

about this over time, I've kind of…

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You know, the way you talk about

your divorce changes as you grow and

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change afterward- Yeah … you know?

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So anyway, so then, um, I started to feel

the difference in how I felt at home, how

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I was treated at home, what the context

of our marriage was, as opposed to, or in,

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in, you know, comparison to m- how I was

at law school for me, what that was like.

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And they were very, very different.

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And I was like, "Wait a minute."

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You know, at home I kind of felt like

a silly idiot who couldn't quite get

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anything right and was only decent

at being a mom at best, et cetera.

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And then there was the law school me,

who everybody treated like a princess

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and like I was the smartest, best, cutest

thing there ever was, and this great mom.

123

And I was like, "Wait a minute.

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All of th- this, these cannot

both be true about me."

125

And I looked around and said, "I

think you people at school are right.

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I think he's wrong."

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And that I didn't, that's when

I started to really wake up

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to, whoa, how did I get here?

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And I think so many women in our

divorce story have that moment.

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Whoa.

131

Yeah.

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How did I get here?

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And, and for me, that's came when I

started to see that, that distinction.

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And then ended up, um, so a bunch

of stuff happened, and ended up

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deciding to, to get divorced.

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Um, the problem was I was at the end of my

rope emotionally, psychologically, i- in

137

every way, because I'd tried everything.

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Gone to therapy, you know,

all of the things like we do.

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Um, and really none of it was a solution.

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And so, um, I didn't…

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I had to borrow $10,000 from,

against a paid off car that I'd had.

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I'd have a paid off car.

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Borrowed $10,000 for that first retainer.

144

Um, and I just thought, "Oh, I'm the mom.

145

My kids will come with me.

146

We'll go move into San Antonio," 'cause

my ex-husband idea, had ideas about us.

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Like, my, my career to him was

always gonna be second to his,

148

and I was gonna need to move

along with his educational career.

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And I was like, "Wait a- I don't wanna

move to some little bitty, tiny town.

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Like, I'm doing real good in school.

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I g- I have opportunity now."

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I did real good in school, so I was

gonna get to get this big fancy job.

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And so I needed to get

rooted in San Antonio.

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So that's what I thought.

155

I thought I'd just walk out,

leave with the kids, he'd

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see them every other weekend.

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That is not what happened.

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And I was woefully unprepared.

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I was not prepared for that.

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And the, um, it ended up that, because

I was in law school and commuting,

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and I was doing the moot court team,

like, there was just so much going on.

162

Yeah.

163

And he caught me flat-footed.

164

He was like, "You're not

leaving with these kids.

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You can go, but they're not going,"

and just turned into this big war.

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And in looking at it at the time, if

an objective third party looked at our

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life- I mean, he took the kids to school.

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He al- you know, a few months out-

Yeah … had said he wanted to take

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the kids to school in the mornings,

and he, he worked at the school, so

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he just walked them up there, right?

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All the facts that I would need as

a lawyer in their case, um, didn't

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look great for me, 'cause I was

in the middle of school, right?

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It's like the worst time to

try to go, and I didn't know.

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I didn't know any…

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There wasn't content.

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There wasn't Lisa's podcast, you know?

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There was nothing that's…

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that I was aware of at least back then.

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Yeah.

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And so, um, anyway, after the, the

$10,000, he would call and, b- he was pro

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se, like on his own, and would talk to the

lawyer and run down my retainer, and then

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the retainer was out and he got a lawyer.

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Um, and they told me,

you know, my divorce…

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'cause we'd had some rental properties

we'd accumulated along the way.

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I had this little recruiting business.

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Like, "Oh, yeah, this

is $100,000 divorce."

187

And I'm like, "I have $10,000."

188

Yeah.

189

Um, and they're like, "Uh, well,

then you better start making a deal,"

190

and there's, there was no deal he

was gonna make that didn't involve,

191

you know, absolute victory to him.

192

Um, and so I made the, the, the

choice and realized I, I had to go.

193

And it, my, my parents didn't

have any money, um, to give me.

194

They'd given me that car, but his family

had access to more funds, and he told

195

me, I don't know if this is true, but

what he told me they'd said was they'd

196

pay every dollar, they'd take my case to

the Supreme Court, which is funny now.

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You don't…

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That's not a thing, but- … at

the time it was a thing.

199

Um, and so I, I left.

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I made the decision to leave him,

which involved at the time my

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kids staying behind, um, with him.

202

Oh, my gosh.

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I can't even believe all that you

went through, because I'm thinking

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of, I'm thinking of law school.

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I also had an infant and a baby- Mm

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when I went back, and I cannot

imagine throwing in there running a

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business and going through a divorce.

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And it was- And then how, how long?

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How long.

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You know, it's like, I, and I say

that one time I heard my dad talk,

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who's now, who's now passed away.

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But I heard my dad and my mom

talking about me, and I was like, uh,

213

accidentally like in the hallway coming

down the hall and heard, heard them.

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And she was saying, "Oh, she's so busy.

215

She does all this."

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And I heard my mom say, or my dad say to

my mom, "Peggy, she does this to herself.

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That's what she does."

218

It's like I guess that's what I do, is

I stir up a lot of stuff all the time.

219

And, um, I think in a lot of ways

it was all just exactly meant to be.

220

You know, all of that experience

is, you know, to your point, I

221

mean, uh, the fast-forward version

is, uh, I ended up going back and

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filing a custody modification,

having a seven-day jury trial.

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My kids relocated and

lived with me primarily.

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I had exclusive decision-making rights.

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Like all this stuff.

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We had a child custody evaluation.

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I am like the divorce example, the

custody example of, of how it goes.

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Okay.

229

Well, let's go back 'cause

I in, I interrupted you.

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Yeah.

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And I'm sorry about that.

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No.

233

So you were saying that, so you,

you left 'cause you're in the

234

middle of school, and he, you

don't have money to, to fight this.

235

Mm-hmm.

236

And so he's keeping the kids, and he

works in the school, and you know,

237

you're probably trying to think of

the wellbeing of your kiddos too.

238

I mean, it's so much.

239

It's so much.

240

So you left and went back to school.

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What kind of a timeframe was that?

242

Hmm.

243

Let's see.

244

It was, I went back to law school.

245

I mean, that was like a couple year per-

So I go back to school, finish school, and

246

really had like resigned into and settled

into my option B, like plan B life, right?

247

'Cause I was like- Okay, so

did you go through the divorce

248

while you were in law school?

249

Yeah.

250

Oh, I'm sorry, yes.

251

That's what I- So I started my first

year, and then it was in my second year

252

the divorce happened, and then I did my

third year, um, aft- post, it was like

253

after the divorce was final in September

of my, I think that was in my third year.

254

And I was, and I, and I had to drop

the moot court team, but I ended

255

up still graduating valedictorian.

256

I mean, I just worked hard.

257

Wow.

258

I'm good at school.

259

I did school, you know?

260

Yeah.

261

And then the timing is

like a couple years later.

262

I mean, the way it all played

out, it was a whole big, long

263

custody, um, situation that my…

264

It was really just my kids were

facing some challenges, and I was

265

like, "I cannot just let this be."

266

Like, I was trying to just be like,

"Okay, I have learned all the judgments

267

I ever made of anybody in my life

were, uh, you know, ill-found."

268

I, I describe it as like chewing

gravel in my mouth, like any judgment

269

I'd ever had of a mom whose kids

weren't with her or whatever.

270

Yeah.

271

Um, and, and so like, okay, well, I'm just

gonna be the best version of this, but it,

272

it wasn't enough and it wasn't working.

273

Um, and so that's why I tr- I went back

and filed to change just a few small

274

things to try to get some relief, and then

the whole can of worms got opened, and I

275

spent a couple of years dealing with it.

276

Um- For sure.

277

So were you coming back and

seeing your kids on the weekend?

278

Is that- Yeah, so I was in San

Antonio and they were an hour and

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20 minutes, hour and a half west.

280

So I was the quote-unquote

like, you know, other parent.

281

Okay.

282

So I had, I paid child support.

283

I had them every other weekend.

284

Okay.

285

I saw them for dinner during the week for

an hour and a half, um, during the week.

286

An hour and 15 minutes I think.

287

Um, and that, and then I had them the

month in the summer and all of that.

288

I took the bar in the

middle of all of this.

289

Geez.

290

Started at the big law job

in the middle of all of this.

291

It…

292

That's the thing, it's like that, that

experience is what informs, um, my, my

293

practice and why I went, left the big

law firm and went and decided to do this.

294

How long did you work

for the big law firm?

295

Just two years.

296

Two years.

297

And so that was while you were

going through the divorce,

298

getting your kids back.

299

Yep, so that wa- is exactly right.

300

Well, it wasn't…

301

The divorce was done, but

the custody modification.

302

Right, the custody.

303

Yeah.

304

Yeah.

305

So I was doing that pretty,

pretty shortly thereafter.

306

Um, that all was kicked up when

I was trying to make those, those

307

adjust- And the thing is, I started,

um, as a clerk for the big law firm

308

while I was still in law school.

309

Yeah.

310

So that third year- Yeah … I was

working for them, so it's like somewhere

311

along the way, um, we kicked stuff

up because at first the partner I

312

was working under mostly, Donna, she

was like the person on the pleadings,

313

like the court papers, and I was

drafting them and she would file them.

314

And then it came to a point of like,

"We are officially too far into this.

315

You have to like, go get a real lawyer,

a real custody lawyer to do this."

316

Um, and so it was, and I had to

figure out a way to get the money.

317

So I've just lived that story of what

it's like- Yeah … because people say

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like, "Oh, I would've never left my kids.

319

I would've done anything," et cetera.

320

And number one, I didn't leave them,

but number two, even if you saw it that

321

way, like at the lawyer's office, they

don't take checks of I would never leave.

322

They want like actual dollar money,

and I d- I just didn't have any, um,

323

and didn't have a way to get any.

324

I didn't have any like

401built up to borrow against.

325

I th- you know?

326

So it's like I also understand

what it's like to try to…

327

People tell you how, what they would

do, but they're not in the middle of

328

it and they're not- Yeah … gonna

write you a check for the $10,000

329

the lawyer wants, you know?

330

Yeah.

331

Mm-hmm.

332

I love that, and I love what you say

about the, the gravel in your mouth.

333

Mm.

334

That judgment.

335

Mm.

336

Yes.

337

Yeah.

338

It was…

339

And I had- You know, I've just been a, I

have discernment as a s- as a, an internal

340

trait of mine, but that discernment can

have an edge, you know, with a, like right

341

and wrong and, and, and better or worse.

342

Yeah.

343

And I definitely had, um,

judge- judgmentalness.

344

I don't anymore.

345

No.

346

Um, that's for sure.

347

That's one of the silver linings, um, for

anybody who's in the middle of this, you

348

may or may not know this yet, but probably

your judgmental traits will go away.

349

Mm-hmm.

350

Um, the divorce has a way of kinda-

Rooting those out of you Yeah, yeah.

351

Okay, so you went through all that, and

then you get your kids back, and you're

352

like, "I'm gonna help women, or men."

353

You're gonna help people

divorce a better way, kind of?

354

Yeah, so I get all that, and then

it was so difficult for me to find a

355

lawyer, then go through the process-

Okay … get access to the money.

356

A- and my lawyer who ended up trying my

case was a excellent courtroom lawyer,

357

Hector, he's the best, but he also isn't

the guy that, you know, is gonna hold

358

your hand on a Friday night when they're

not showing up or what to do, you know?

359

Right.

360

I mean, he can, but it's not

his, his, um- … his lane.

361

And so I was like, "I've gotta

go back and help the people.

362

You know, I, I've gotta go back and

be the sort of lawyer I wished I

363

would've had from the beginning, um,

and give people advice so they don't

364

get back in this exact same situation."

365

So that's right.

366

So then it was just sort of like

going back and s- leaving the big law.

367

Everybody thought I was completely

insane, um, leaving that behind.

368

I got, uh, my, my then boyfriend, who's

now my husband, Drew, um, Drew gave me a

369

loan for $10,000, which was the amount of,

like, two months worth of living expenses.

370

Um, at the time, I didn't have

any, like, actual business money,

371

which is very funny now, now-

372

doing it the way I do it.

373

Um, and that's how I did it, and

started, and it was me and my

374

sister who started the whole thing.

375

She helped me, um, as my legal assistant

and intake and everything back then, and

376

then it's just kind of grown from there.

377

That's so amazing, and tell

me about My Confident Divorce.

378

Tell me a little bit of m-

more about what that is.

379

Yeah, so this or- this

originated as a prep course.

380

Because what I found is, in helping men

and women, that o- over the years of

381

helping hundreds, and even now thousands

of women through the firm, women make

382

similar mistakes over and over and

over again of not being prepared, using

383

hope as their strategy, not having

their documents and things together.

384

And I was like, oh my God, and people

from all over God's green internet

385

would try to ask me questions,

and I'm like, "I'm only a lawyer.

386

I can't be your lawyer.

387

You know, we can't be your lawyer

in Maine or wherever you are."

388

Mm-hmm.

389

Um, but I can make this course that

helps them get prepared and tells them

390

the things I wish I would've known.

391

So that's how it all kinda started,

was trying to get those women…

392

And, and the reason for

women is I, I am one.

393

That's my life experience.

394

Mm-hmm.

395

I teach from lived experience.

396

Like, guys need to get

prepared in their own way.

397

I just don't have the same understanding

of how their brain works or anything.

398

So I was like, okay- I went

back and created that course.

399

And then, it, so got that going.

400

At first I sold it for money,

and then it was like, too many

401

women need this, and the…

402

It was like $300.

403

It's, that money is standing

in the way of them getting it.

404

Like, I c- I cannot do that.

405

I do not feel right about that.

406

So I just made it free inside

of my, um, women's circle.

407

There was this idea of like be around

and with women who are going through

408

the same thing, having that community,

and you can access the course.

409

And then, anyway, so then fast-forward,

um, still just observing the

410

way that women handle divorce.

411

Um, and I had forever ago trademarked

the phrase women divorce differently

412

And I had, um, 'cause I knew that

and I understood that, but the way

413

a lot of my colleagues would talk

or whatever, it'd be like, "Look,

414

leave your emotions out of this.

415

Go talk to your therapist."

416

They just saw their job as

only moving paperwork forward

417

and, like, the court, right?

418

That's it.

419

But there's so much more.

420

Mm-hmm.

421

And I think that women for a long

time have sort of bought into that,

422

'cause that's just the way it's done.

423

And like, ah, I don't really think it

has to be done that way, and I don't

424

think that that's what's best for us.

425

I think that there's

another way to do this.

426

And so I set on the, um,

journey of reimagining divorce.

427

That's sort of a little bit of

coaching meets legal, right?

428

Yeah.

429

In one place.

430

So they can have access to the

things that I w- basically, I'm just

431

recreating what I wish I would've had.

432

That's a, a place to belong.

433

Yeah.

434

It removes the shame and stigma,

which I don't think there should be.

435

Um, adds…

436

We have mindset calls, in-person events,

virtual events, to sort of wrap around

437

this gal going through this and, and I

decided to do it in a subscription model.

438

So you have the same costs, um, it's women

only, the same cost every single month.

439

Now, that cost is determined, that price,

on what's going on, how complicated, how

440

many assets, how much conflict, et cetera.

441

But that way you know every

single month what to expect.

442

Instead of one month your bill

may be $70, one month your maybe,

443

uh, bill may be $7,000, right?

444

Yeah.

445

That, that question mark for some people,

um, is too stressful and prohibitive.

446

Now, there's some people who really

wanna do it in the, the typical,

447

traditional billable hour way,

and that's how Henbridge Law runs.

448

For people who want to get ex-

pay for exactly what they get,

449

you know, that sort of model.

450

So i- in my, my thinking was

it gives women the choice.

451

Um, and My Confident Divorce

is very pink and girly- Mm

452

and you, you get w- you get this access

to a portal that we've created, um, that

453

adds some course kind of elements and

things like that along the way to try to

454

really innovate- Okay, so- … the way

it's done … it's so interesting because

455

it sounds like it's individualized.

456

It sounds a little bit different

than your normal community.

457

You know what I mean?

458

Yeah.

459

Like, you're saying that you

pay depending on what you need.

460

So do they get, like, one-on-one coaching?

461

Oh, yeah, it's full legal representation.

462

And so it's like- It's

full legal representation.

463

Cool.

464

Yeah, so it's not the…

465

It's, the community part is

kind of a bolt-on, right?

466

Gotcha.

467

To getting the law done, but to g- to

give them a place to get that support, and

468

they have a concierge, not a paralegal.

469

So it's like, it's just a

different way of thinking about

470

it- Yeah … where you have access.

471

We have a, an initial strategy

session and your sister session,

472

like we've designed it through,

but it's full legal representation.

473

Um, right now we're only, um,

and as of this exact minute-

474

Mm-hmm … uh, working with, like

amicable situations while we, um- Yep

475

at this stage, but literally tomorrow,

um, when we're recording this, we are

476

mapping out the rest of the stages

because there's been, there's such

477

a demand for women who want us, and

they're like, "When can I start?"

478

Like, okay, we need to be able to,

'cause there, not that many are just

479

truly amicable, as I know you know.

480

Right.

481

Even if they think they are, they're

like- Right … one, one of them said,

482

uh, bless her heart, like, "Oh yeah, we're

really amicable," and then later realized,

483

"Oh, but he won't sign anything."

484

And I was like, "Okay.

485

That does not- … that

does not mean amicable.

486

That means- That's not gonna work.

487

Yeah.

488

So yeah, it's full legal representation,

but they can come to mindset calls

489

that I do and have access, um,

to their lawyers in a different

490

way with a different portal.

491

We're building out, um, some AI components

to it and, and trying to give women the

492

peace of mind as it comes to the way

the bill works, and then also a place

493

to, I don't know, be more of ourselves.

494

That's the theory.

495

Yeah.

496

That's the thought.

497

We're new, you know, we're working

it out, but that's the, the thinking.

498

People seem to really be

reacting to it, for sure.

499

Yeah.

500

I love it.

501

I love that you're doing that.

502

Okay.

503

The last thing that I wanted to touch

on is you had the courage to do the

504

TEDx talk, and I know you can't really

give it away, but tell me about- Can

505

you share your message or can you not?

506

Yeah, I think so.

507

I think so.

508

Um, really, the, the idea had been

on my mind, it's sort of the thing

509

I, I preach and say wherever I am,

is that like, um, women, we don't

510

have to live a medium suck life.

511

Mm-hmm.

512

And I just find that so many of us,

sometimes myself included, live in

513

this way of like, "I've just gotta

get through these next two weeks."

514

Yeah.

515

And then.

516

A- and they're never really

happy or enjoying it.

517

It's out of this should and duty and

obligation, and never desire and want and

518

yearning and, and joy and fulfillment.

519

And it goes through the steps of like,

okay, realizing that you're in the

520

middle of it is the first thing, and

then how to get your way, uh, out of it.

521

And it was quite an experience, um,

to do it, and I loved it because

522

it was TEDx Round Rock Women.

523

So Round Rock is this, like a nor- just

north of Austin, and it was women only.

524

The messages were focused on women,

which was just, like, perfect.

525

Yeah.

526

A good fit for me.

527

Yeah.

528

Well, tell me about that.

529

So it'll be coming out.

530

Like, they…

531

So what happens is you do

the, the talk in front of a…

532

Our s- audience was like, I don't

know, 75 people or something like that.

533

And then, um, they do some editing

on their end, and then submit that

534

up to TED, TEDx, like the red dot,

you know, corporate or whatever.

535

Mm-hmm.

536

And then they go through an approval

process, and I'm booga, booga, I

537

don't know what they do, and then

they make the decision of who

538

they put out on their YouTube.

539

So that's sort of when you get access

to it is hopefully, um, you make it

540

to the TEDx YouTube, and then can

share the, the info far and wide.

541

That's cool.

542

Okay, before we go, give us, like, the

first tip to get out of that medium suck.

543

It's to realize and admit to yourself

that you want to, that you want, um, a

544

blow the doors off version of your life.

545

Like, can you make peace with the wanting?

546

'Cause I think most of us spend

a lot of our energy stuffing

547

desire down, stuffing…

548

And I, and the, the word desire,

like, you hear it and you think

549

automatically, like, sexual desire.

550

It's not.

551

I'm talking about for fulfillment and joy

and a good cup of coffee and some money

552

in the bank, and whatever that is for you.

553

Mm-hmm.

554

I mean, again, I teach

everything from lived experience.

555

This is an ongoing thing for me,

to make peace with, with actually

556

wanting something, and that takes

a vulnerability in yourself.

557

Mm-hmm.

558

So the first step is to acknowledge

that you're in the medium suck

559

life, and make peace with the fact

that you want something different.

560

Got it.

561

I got it.

562

And you know, I'm gonna just share

something about myself with you.

563

Yeah.

564

I think sometimes I get a little

bit stuck because I'm concerned

565

I'm gonna get overwhelmed.

566

Mm.

567

Now, you lady, you don't

sound like you overwhelm.

568

Like, I may have just waited to do

that divorce until I was done with it.

569

You know what I mean?

570

Yeah.

571

But you don't.

572

It's- Yeah … it's cross with my nature.

573

I am impulsive and impatient I'm not,

yeah, I'm not patient either, but I

574

do have this thing, and I see my mom.

575

She's very controlled and doesn't ever

wanna be overwhelmed, and I'm like,

576

"Okay, how do I get out of that?"

577

Because that, that fear, like right?

578

We can't listen to that fear.

579

But I think that's what the

fear of being overwhelmed s-

580

makes me pull back a little bit.

581

Yeah.

582

I think that the way we develop

muscle, courage muscles.

583

Um, and, and ultimately I think

in there is a little bit of a

584

courage muscle to face the feeling

of overwhelm, whatever that is, is

585

by doing the thing and not dying.

586

Right.

587

And making the decision.

588

So the…

589

I, I, I think I can just tell

you the rest of the talk.

590

So it's want- … worth and

willingness, wil- being willing.

591

Yeah.

592

First you, you admit to yourself

that you want the thing.

593

Then you make peace with the idea that

you're worthy of it, that you're wor- I

594

think we actually have a worth problem.

595

Yeah.

596

That we're worthy of

this version of our life.

597

Not some gal over there, some

us in the future, us right

598

now, that we're worthy of it.

599

And then the third one, which is the part

I'm talking about, is are you willing?

600

Are you willing to do what it takes?

601

Because that's when it's

time and we count the cost.

602

And we see, hey, I may feel overwhelmed.

603

I may get stuck.

604

I may feel crappy in some way.

605

Well yeah, maybe.

606

But it's like that Dolly

Parton quote, bless her heart.

607

Saint Dolly.

608

Right.

609

Yeah.

610

Um, that's going around right now too.

611

It's like, well, if you're afraid

of the, you know, you're never

612

gonna be out in there, right?

613

That cute sound that's going around.

614

And it's like for me, I, I

relate to that so much too.

615

And so the way I try to work

at it is do that thing anyway,

616

especially if I'm uncomfortable.

617

And there's like healthy fear,

right, of like don't jump

618

off the side of the building.

619

Right.

620

That's a healthy fear.

621

But this, this natural hesitancy,

this natural pullback for whatever

622

reason, say, "Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh.

623

There, there it is,

and I'm gonna dive in."

624

I'll share it for me, Lisa,

what this is looking like.

625

At, my talk convicted me.

626

I wrote it for me- I love

that … as much as for all of us.

627

Yeah.

628

And, um, when I did, I, I really

thought, man, in so many ways,

629

like are you actually happy?

630

You know, you're doing all this

stuff and I'm busy, busy, lots

631

of accomplishments stacking up.

632

Am I actually happy?

633

And so the little micro adjustments

that I'm making, which are kind

634

of macro really, kind of a big

deal to me, are making a little

635

bit of a different decision- O-

over and over again in situations.

636

For instance, um, a week or so ago, uh,

Drew and I, like were talking about there

637

was some school event at my daughter's

school, and it's normally something I'm

638

like, "Meh, I'm not gonna go to that."

639

Right.

640

But some friends of ours asked us to go.

641

And it's a Friday night, and on a

Friday night I'm tired, you know,

642

I- Yeah … and then it was like,

"Well, okay, we'll go 'cause they

643

want us to go," and I'm thinking

we'll go to this thing and be done.

644

Like, well, but maybe we can

get dinner, so like, din- okay.

645

Eh, but you know, b- by the time you

do the math, it's dinner's gonna be at

646

9:00, and I'm like, "Dinner at 9:00?

647

Who do you think I am?"

648

You know?

649

And it, the, the me that would normally

just not do that 'cause I need to get

650

good rest, you know, the perfectionist

in me, I was like, "You know what?

651

No.

652

I'm gonna say yes and I'm gonna go."

653

And I had the best time, and I was tired

the next day, and I ended up even taking,

654

like, a two-hour nap in the afternoon.

655

And, you know, and I

didn't even drink nothing.

656

I just was exhausted.

657

Mm-hmm.

658

Um, and I didn't…

659

But I had so much fun, and now I have

that memory and I proved to myself- Right

660

… that I could step into the thing that

made me a little bit uncomfortable, and

661

they were relatively newer friends, so I

didn't really know how it was gonna go.

662

Um, another example, this week I

traveled to New York City for work.

663

I was on, on New York City

TV, which was so exciting.

664

Woo!

665

I know, woo-hoo.

666

New York City.

667

And anyway, I normally at the end

of the workday, and I did this and

668

that, I would just, like, come back

to the hotel or even order food in.

669

It's just me.

670

I don't need to go to dinner, whatever.

671

Yeah.

672

I'm not gonna go, whatever.

673

But I was like, "Okay,

Hannah, let's do it."

674

And I went out to a Broadway show by

myself, and I had- Wow … the best time.

675

It was Ridiculous Titanique.

676

It was, like, ridiculous and so much

fun, and in the moment as it's happening,

677

I'm like, "Man, I almost missed this."

678

Yeah.

679

"I almost missed this."

680

In favor of what?

681

And so it's like, I think, Lisa, those

little bits, when something in you

682

says, "Ooh, but I may get overwhelmed."

683

Well, nobody died of overwhelm.

684

Right.

685

You know?

686

Right.

687

What if I just did this one thing one

time, and then let's check in and see.

688

But I think we make these

it's all or nothing deals with

689

ourselves that- I think I do.

690

Yeah.

691

Mm-hmm.

692

Because I think, I think, you

know how they say, "Don't do

693

it unless it's a hell yes"?

694

Is that really serving us?

695

Because- I don't think

so … you know what I mean?

696

I mean, I think there's some areas-

'Cause you may feel that hell

697

yes to go out with those people.

698

Mm-hmm.

699

And so that gets in your head,

like, "Well, it's okay that I

700

really don't wanna do that."

701

But what you don't understand is

that you might wanna do it, and

702

you're not giving yourself the

chance to see if you would have fun.

703

Yeah.

704

I guess for me that's exactly right.

705

Like, I mean- I, I don't fully ascribe

to if it's not a hell yes, don't do it.

706

Now, I think there's something to not

doing things that are a hard no for you.

707

Yeah.

708

Um, and, you know, getting,

finding some boundaries.

709

I'm not the best expert to talk

about this, but I do a lot of things

710

that are not hell yes that are smart

for, like, my future and et cetera.

711

And sometimes it's like, let's be

honest, do you have enough context to

712

know whether or not this is a hell yes?

713

Right.

714

And sometimes there's no sure thing.

715

Right.

716

You don't know.

717

I might have gone to that school

thing, and I might have gone to

718

dinner and been miserable and bored.

719

Right.

720

And then I would've given myself the

permission to be like, "Oh, gosh.

721

Ooh, look at the time.

722

I can't go to dinner.

723

I gotta go.

724

I'm really tired.

725

Bye."

726

Yada.

727

Um, and so I think that there is a

place for making decisions of an already

728

full plate hell yes or no, or nothing.

729

I get that in some broad

strokes, but if we don't go when

730

there's some question, we're…

731

We want so much certainty.

732

Right.

733

You know?

734

Right.

735

And, like, certainty is boring.

736

You know what makes things exciting?

737

A little bit of I don't know.

738

Oh, I saw this on Instagram too.

739

It was somebody that said something

like, um, how you should be so excited

740

that you don't know how it all ends.

741

Oh.

742

You should be so excited that you

don't have it all figured out yet.

743

Yes.

744

Isn't that exciting?

745

I love that.

746

And, like, if we could get some

of that energy of instead of the

747

trying with everything we have to

get everything figured out in these

748

little boxes and controlled, and

then feel kind of flat about it.

749

Because delight and wonder and all

of that has some- Yeah … element

750

of surprise- Right … um, to it.

751

And, you know, I…

752

Especially people say, "Oh, I hate

surprises," I'm always like Yeah.

753

Do you have to keep holding onto that?

754

Right.

755

Why don't you let yourself be surprised?

756

It's this give up of control, you know?

757

Yeah.

758

Of like, um, I don't know what's gonna

happen, and, and that really to me

759

unearths do you think there's a good

universe out there working for you

760

or a bad one working against you.

761

You know, I, I've come to,

gosh, I love a surprise.

762

I think it's the best.

763

I'm going on a trip with my…

764

So I'm second, second husband, right?

765

Second husband energy, Drew.

766

Yeah.

767

I'm going on a trip to I

don't know where, somewhere

768

international for- … over a week.

769

I don't know where I'm going.

770

I'm just- Mm … gonna see what

happens when I get there, and my

771

friend is helping me pack my clothes.

772

I'm not even gonna know.

773

I'm not gonna know till I go

to the gate where I'm going.

774

That is so awesome.

775

I love that.

776

When are you doing that?

777

That's in like d- uh, right about a month.

778

Oh.

779

So the beginning of October.

780

Very cool.

781

I love that.

782

I love that.

783

Yeah, so- Okay … just for everybody

listening, you know, where could

784

you give a little room for some

surprise and delight to find you?

785

Yeah.

786

And even if you're worried you

might be tired or a little bit of

787

overwhelmed or all these things,

you just don't have to, you don't

788

have to know all of that in advance,

and you probably won't die from it.

789

So- Right … and you might have

the best time and create this fun

790

memory and just- Mm-hmm … learn

something new about yourself.

791

Yeah.

792

Like, when I went to the musical,

I've done it before, but it's, like,

793

solidified in me, man, I love this.

794

I feel like this is peak human experience.

795

Yeah.

796

A musical with a whole room together.

797

Yeah.

798

Getting that energy, what if I would

have foreclosed myself that opportunity?

799

Right.

800

You know?

801

For a good night's sleep.

802

Yeah, and even then, debatable.

803

Right.

804

43 years old, a good night's

sleep is a question mark.

805

Let's be honest.

806

Right.

807

Right.

808

Who knows?

809

Yeah.

810

Who knows?

811

There could've been a fire alarm in

the middle of the night, you know?

812

Right.

813

Just whatever.

814

I'd have probably messed around and

815

Yes.

816

I love it.

817

I love it.

818

I love chatting with you.

819

This has been so insightful, and

I know you're gonna get that TEDx.

820

I can't wait.

821

I'm gonna be looking for it.

822

You're gonna have to send me a

little note so I can- Oh, yes.

823

Oh, for sure … send it out to my peeps.

824

All right.

825

We will do it.

826

Oh, Lisa, thank you so much for having me.

827

This was so much fun.

828

Thank you, and thank you

for what you're doing.

829

Oh, yeah.

830

Thanks.

831

All right.

832

You take good care.