Transcripts
Welcome back to Unboxing Logistics.
Speaker:You know the drill.
Speaker:I'm your host Lori Boyer of EasyPost and today is going to be a super fun episode.
Speaker:I have been so excited to record today's episode.
Speaker:We're going to be talking about porch piracy.
Speaker:No, I'm not somebody who loves porch piracy.
Speaker:You'll find out why I'm excited for the episode in a minute.
Speaker:But we're gonna be talking all about the myths that surround theft, packages, porch piracy.
Speaker:There are a ton out there.
Speaker:So, I have brought in today a guest who does spend way too much of his time
Speaker:learning and dealing with package theft, all the challenges surrounding that.
Speaker:I have invited Eric Thorson.
Speaker:Welcome back.
Speaker:He's a returning guest of Norton Shopping Guarantee with Package Protection by EasyPost.
Speaker:They are an incredible company.
Speaker:And Eric, introduce yourself a little bit and tell us about your background.
Speaker:Hey, Lori.
Speaker:It's great to be back again.
Speaker:So my name's Eric Thorson.
Speaker:I'm the general manager of Norton Shopping Guarantee.
Speaker:And a little bit about my background in the mid two thousands, I started
Speaker:my ecommerce career at McAfee.
Speaker:And I was a, a lead in the web security group.
Speaker:And I kind of fell in love with the psychology of purchasing online.
Speaker:You know, back then it was just pretty, pretty novel and new.
Speaker:This whole idea of purchasing from going to a screen, putting your credit card
Speaker:and having stuff show up at your house.
Speaker:But I noticed that a lot of shoppers, they were hesitant and they, I became obsessed
Speaker:with understanding exactly why that was.
Speaker:And then initially people were just wary of buying online because they, it was so new.
Speaker:And, you know, a lot of people feared that their credit cards and their personal data was at risk.
Speaker:And in 2010, I met a really charismatic entrepreneur named Jeff Grass.
Speaker:He came up with this sort of new approach to addressing emerging concerns around shopper
Speaker:anxiety And what we kind of saw was this, was shopper's anxiety moving away from security
Speaker:and moving towards the actual people themselves and whether they could be relied upon,
Speaker:whether they'll honor their terms of service.
Speaker:And, and we, Jeff and I sort of came up with this idea of creating a super guarantee,
Speaker:a third party shopping guarantee, which inevitably holds brands accountable.
Speaker:And by doing so that, that increased the confidence, the first time shoppers, and we
Speaker:were able to measure a higher conversion rate.
Speaker:If you are a criminal and have nefarious intent, you don't want to spend more than 5 or 10 minutes
Speaker:with Eric because he's into that psychology.
Speaker:He will, he will catch you so fast.
Speaker:Very true.
Speaker:Watch out.
Speaker:Absolutely.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:So today's episode is going to be so fun.
Speaker:Eric and I are going to be reviewing some clips online of some of the, you know,
Speaker:the situations that are caught on cameras and Ring doorbells, all of those things
Speaker:out there that people use porch pirates.
Speaker:We're going to see, you know, what went wrong, what myths maybe people had surrounding those.
Speaker:And then we're going to be talking about it a little bit.
Speaker:So that's going to be a really fun, different way to approach this episode.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:But before we even begin, Eric, what is your favorite comfort food?
Speaker:Everything.
Speaker:The, all the columns on the McDonald's menu.
Speaker:You're an equal opportunity food eater.
Speaker:Oh, man, that's hard.
Speaker:Why do you have to ask these hard questions?
Speaker:I was hoping this was gonna be a softball.
Speaker:So my go to is, I know it's not very it's not very original, but I love pizza.
Speaker:Just a pizza junkie.
Speaker:I had pizza for lunch today, Eric.
Speaker:It was delicious.
Speaker:I am.
Speaker:I'm in the comfort zone.
Speaker:So I completely agree.
Speaker:Pizza is usually my answer as well.
Speaker:Great one.
Speaker:Today, takeaways.
Speaker:So on this topic, I always like that if somebody just is able to listen for a few
Speaker:minutes and boy, You're not going to want to listen for a few minutes today because
Speaker:watching these videos is going to be so fun.
Speaker:But if you were only able to hear what Eric has to say right now, what are you know, one
Speaker:or two, three, whatever takeaways, what do you want them to remember from today's show?
Speaker:I'd say the three that I would really want people to resonate with is I see so many websites so
Speaker:many brands not not signaling or having any sort of consumer third party consumer trust assets.
Speaker:It's such an underutilized yet simple and in many cases free opportunity
Speaker:for them to boost their confidence.
Speaker:And I always say to brands, I go, look, if you're getting 100 percent conversion rate.
Speaker:Then what I'm saying is, is nonsense.
Speaker:However, you're not, you're probably getting around a 2 percent conversion rate, which means
Speaker:there's a lot of opportunity to to improve.
Speaker:My second observation and suggestions to brands is to, is if you're not tracking your
Speaker:package incidents, you should start doing so.
Speaker:Many times I find myself engaged with brands where I'll ask the simple question,
Speaker:so how many times in a quarter do you have package theft related issues?
Speaker:Just, just that one alone.
Speaker:And the, and the answer is the common answer I get is, I don't know.
Speaker:And I think it's fascinating because I think it perhaps it's just the
Speaker:bandwidth of actually doing it.
Speaker:I think perhaps there's a little bit of, deny it.
Speaker:They're in kind of a denial where they don't really want to kind of, some brands just don't
Speaker:want to face that problems, you know, head on.
Speaker:And so I really strongly recommend that they do that.
Speaker:So they at least know what that, what their exposure is.
Speaker:And then lastly.
Speaker:This is this is insane, but the 2 percent of the annual revenue loss that a brand experiences,
Speaker:2 percent of that entire number is directly attributed to package related delivery related
Speaker:issues, primarily around the big three, which is package theft, damaged or lost.
Speaker:And I recommend that you at the very least whether it's a problem or not, you should at
Speaker:least provide your shoppers the option of having that additional peace of mind towards a checkout.
Speaker:I think you'll find that your shopper, your your confidence of your first time visitor will
Speaker:increase, they'll convert, and they'll be more likely to remember you and come back again.
Speaker:I was just on a webinar last week and we were talking about this
Speaker:very thing about providing options.
Speaker:And things like insurance came up organically on that conversation.
Speaker:And somebody had pointed out in the comments, yeah, you can even, you know,
Speaker:sometimes make it a profit center.
Speaker:You can have them and then get a little cut, but there are a lot of ways you can
Speaker:do it that's totally, totally affordable.
Speaker:That is what's really, really key for ecommerce businesses, retailers, providing those options.
Speaker:I love, so looking at your website, making sure you've got trust signals
Speaker:on there and especially third party.
Speaker:And tracking your incidents.
Speaker:Really, really critical.
Speaker:And then making sure you're providing options to your customers when it
Speaker:comes to things like insurance.
Speaker:All really great insights.
Speaker:So, okay, so without further ado, what we're going to do now is we
Speaker:are going to watch our first video.
Speaker:We're going to react.
Speaker:Now, for our audio listeners out there, I am going to go ahead and describe it for you.
Speaker:You may want to hop over to YouTube and, and check this out there so
Speaker:that you can see the video yourself.
Speaker:But if not, I will describe it for you.
Speaker:And then Eric, I'm going to throw at you, maybe a myth that I see or, or, you know,
Speaker:comments that I see around these videos.
Speaker:So are you ready?
Speaker:I'm ready.
Speaker:Alright, let's bring it.
Speaker:Here we go.
Speaker:Video number one.
Speaker:Alright, we got a porch here.
Speaker:Typical porch.
Speaker:Love those couches.
Speaker:We got a delivery guy.
Speaker:He scanned it.
Speaker:Dropped it off.
Speaker:Knocked on it.
Speaker:Ha!
Speaker:Ha!
Speaker:Ha!
Speaker:He goes, whoa!
Speaker:Friday fail.
Speaker:A man ran up, stole the package, took it, while the delivery guy
Speaker:is still literally standing there.
Speaker:Hey, Eric, what'd you see?
Speaker:Listen, joke's on him.
Speaker:I hope he enjoys that hemorrhoid cream.
Speaker:Ha ha ha ha ha ha!
Speaker:Exactly yeah, you don't know.
Speaker:So, I couldn't help but notice the scan.
Speaker:The beep!
Speaker:Okay, he scanned it.
Speaker:It's in!
Speaker:It's there!
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:The package has been delivered.
Speaker:Unfortunately one myth that a lot of businesses have is once it's been delivered, once it's
Speaker:been marked as delivered, that your job is done.
Speaker:How is this not true?
Speaker:How is this a myth, Eric?
Speaker:Yeah, it, it, the job is never done.
Speaker:Many of the brands that I've engaged with over the years are obsessed about customer service.
Speaker:And, you know, clearly, if you're the CEO all the way down you know, to the entry level day
Speaker:to day worker, it's the, the, I'd say, in my opinion, the real heroes are the ones that have to
Speaker:take those inbounds to service their customers.
Speaker:And they are reps.
Speaker:They are really obsessed.
Speaker:It just never ends.
Speaker:The responsibility is well beyond the product being delivered.
Speaker:Once it goes into your home and once the consumer starts to use your product,
Speaker:they have a relationship with you.
Speaker:And that relationship will last as long as you're around if you continue to
Speaker:do a good job and service them well.
Speaker:Yeah, we hear a lot about customer loyalty.
Speaker:So I have to imagine that that would be dinged as well.
Speaker:Oh, yeah, I mean, because what happens is, is that, is the shopper doesn't
Speaker:blame the thief or the carrier.
Speaker:They're, they, they, they hold the, the merchant responsible in their mind.
Speaker:And it's kind of a bad, you know, it's kind of unfair.
Speaker:It's kind of a bad rap for the merchant.
Speaker:You know, they're, you know, certainly they didn't do that, but, but it leaves that association
Speaker:of that, that bad experience and it just sort of you know, aligns itself back to the brand.
Speaker:So it's just not good.
Speaker:I think that as well, you know, as we have human nature, we want to kind of blame somebody.
Speaker:And so I was like, this is your fault.
Speaker:My package was stolen.
Speaker:But it kind of brings me back in a way, Eric, to your third takeaway that
Speaker:you shared, that providing options.
Speaker:Sometimes I think that if you provide an option for insurance, maybe it puts the
Speaker:risk or the benefit or the blame or whatever back on the shoulders of the consumer.
Speaker:I don't know.
Speaker:Have you seen that?
Speaker:Yeah, what's what we see in the data is is just over 50 percent of consumers who are presented the
Speaker:offer of optional protection take advantage of it.
Speaker:And I just think that that's a testament of what's going on in society with this problem.
Speaker:And I can, we'll probably continually see the take rates rise on that.
Speaker:And the shopper, yeah, they, they kind of are provided the opportunity to take on some of that
Speaker:responsibility, but they're also, they just want to, in their mind, they want that peace of mind.
Speaker:And they're happy to, they're happy to engage it.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:So it's like if I sign up for it, we're like, yeah, well, I, I, great.
Speaker:I signed up for insurance.
Speaker:I'm, I don't need to worry about the fact that this was stolen.
Speaker:But even if I didn't sign up I kind of think, darn it, I should
Speaker:have signed up for that insurance.
Speaker:I chose not to, to grab it.
Speaker:And some of that heat is taken off of the business as well.
Speaker:So just having that option there is, is critical.
Speaker:Okay, awesome.
Speaker:Let's move on to our next video.
Speaker:What the heck?
Speaker:Okay, for our listeners, somebody is creeping up to a door, literally in a garbage
Speaker:bag, to steal the package off the porch.
Speaker:I guess the camera can't see who they are.
Speaker:So they've got a garbage sack completely covering them, and they just walked up like a little
Speaker:child, stole the package right off the porch.
Speaker:Okay, Eric, thoughts on this?
Speaker:Have you ever been in a garbage sack?
Speaker:Stolen something off a porch.
Speaker:Was it you, Eric?
Speaker:I've seen it all at this point.
Speaker:I think we can just stop.
Speaker:We can just, we're done.
Speaker:What else could we do here?
Speaker:I think it's ironic that he's wearing a garbage bag and stealing, stealing a package.
Speaker:I just, it's unbelievable.
Speaker:I've never seen this one, by the way.
Speaker:I've seen a lot of these, Lori.
Speaker:Where did you dig this up?
Speaker:Hey, that, that goes on one of our producers, Jason.
Speaker:Shout out to Jason.
Speaker:So it brings up the myth for me, though, the idea that sometimes you think,
Speaker:well, I've got the doorbell camera.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:So I'm safe.
Speaker:Nobody's gonna be stealing a package.
Speaker:I'll see their face.
Speaker:It's gonna be, you know, John down the street, and I'll catch him on my camera.
Speaker:But obviously, this didn't this didn't play off that way.
Speaker:So it is clear thieves will do thieving, thieves will be thieving, even with cameras.
Speaker:What is your thought around this myth?
Speaker:Yeah, I think cameras have been in our society for a long time, not just so much on porches.
Speaker:And, you know, I don't think they're the deterrent that we all want them to be.
Speaker:I think they do serve a good, they do serve to provide evidence.
Speaker:So from that standpoint, cameras are valuable and having that footage is valuable.
Speaker:But you know, I also think the thieves have figured out kind of this loophole because
Speaker:most brands are very, are very good natured.
Speaker:And they know the thieves know that the merchant will inevitably step in and
Speaker:provide a resolution to that shopper.
Speaker:And I think they're taking, you know, obviously they're taking advantage of that
Speaker:of the, of the good nature of those brands.
Speaker:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker:What do you think?
Speaker:So as a business, you know, what can I do to educate my customers that, you know, even a
Speaker:camera might not be enough to deter a thief?
Speaker:Well, I think, I think first, I think being the victim of that first, I think that
Speaker:person and people who have their packages stolen have a, and there's a lot of them
Speaker:by the way, in the, in our U in the U.S.
Speaker:alone, they sort of, they've become sort of advocates by going through that experience.
Speaker:And they've become sort of believers in this package protection option
Speaker:that a branch should be offering.
Speaker:So, you know, that's certainly one thing to factor, but I just think, I think you know,
Speaker:whether the person that the actual, whether you've been actually victimized yourself
Speaker:and, or you're probably two to three degrees separated from anybody else, from friends
Speaker:and family who have gone through that too.
Speaker:And so again, it really just, it comes down to the option, you know,
Speaker:we're not, we don't want to force you.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:We don't want to force you.
Speaker:No, just give them the option.
Speaker:I love that.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Let's check out our next video.
Speaker:All right, we got somebody who's, oh, was catching
Speaker:the the thief as he tried to steal the package.
Speaker:It's snowy though, and he backs on to a big snowbank.
Speaker:Gets, gets stuck in the snow.
Speaker:The people are yelling that he's gonna get in trouble.
Speaker:The police are coming.
Speaker:Oh man, is that just karma?
Speaker:It sure is.
Speaker:Maybe he can, maybe there was some snow tires or chains in that box he stole.
Speaker:That was just crazy.
Speaker:It makes me think as well of the the myth of the idea that like maybe package protection
Speaker:is only needed during certain times of year.
Speaker:That is a myth that I've heard.
Speaker:Of course, this is snow, but it could be that maybe you know, you only need package protection
Speaker:at peak season or you only should offer, you know.
Speaker:What what do you have to say about the myth that package protection is, you know seasonal?
Speaker:It's busted.
Speaker:Absolutely busted.
Speaker:Here, if crime only happened at a certain period of time, that would be, wouldn't that be.
Speaker:that would be nice.
Speaker:It's certainly less, less of an issue in our, in our society.
Speaker:Look, it's you said it, Lori.
Speaker:It's, you know, clearly peak season, holiday season, fourth quarter.
Speaker:That's when obviously the most volumes being shipped.
Speaker:So that means that's going to be equivalent to the most packages stolen.
Speaker:But it is a year round opportunistic crime that is way out of control
Speaker:and isn't, isn't letting up at all.
Speaker:Yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker:This whole industry, there are full organized crime rings that are just doing porch piracy.
Speaker:And I mean, it's a, it's a massive source of revenue, income for them.
Speaker:And obviously a massive headache for the rest of us in who are trying to deal with it.
Speaker:So unfortunately as you said, time does not stop thieves, but they're gonna do it regardless.
Speaker:So great point.
Speaker:Okay, next video Okay, so this says this is a thief who apparently, after getting tired of
Speaker:having presents stolen from his porch, this homeowner set up a surprise for his porch pirates.
Speaker:Apparently he was really struggling with it.
Speaker:At first I was just gonna put a box out and then I thought, you know, be kind of classic
Speaker:the old you know poop on a doorstep type thing.
Speaker:So.
Speaker:That is hilarious.
Speaker:So as as he said and explained in the news story, he put a dirty diaper and so he was able
Speaker:to steal a dirty diaper That's pretty fun.
Speaker:How would you feel Eric if you thought you were getting stealing a Playstation
Speaker:and ended up with a stinky diaper?
Speaker:It's pretty crappy.
Speaker:No, I would say look, that's the youngest hero I've ever heard of.
Speaker:That baby is a superhero and he or she doesn't even know it yet.
Speaker:So great job.
Speaker:Great job.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:So myth then Eric are only high value packages at risk?
Speaker:I'm thinking this dirty diaper was not so high value.
Speaker:No, again, it's a crime of opportunity.
Speaker:It's a, it's a great, it's always a gamble for them for the thief.
Speaker:You know, you could you could have a big box contain a diaper or you can
Speaker:have a small box contain a diamond.
Speaker:I mean, it's just you just never know.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:And so that is a myth that is busted also because again, it's opportunity.
Speaker:When it presents itself, people are going to take advantage of it.
Speaker:Now, obviously, Eric, if you do ship high value items, I would think that then
Speaker:insurance and, you know, package protection and all of the things that we talked about
Speaker:before become even more important though.
Speaker:No, look, it, it, there's a correlation between value and, and, and what, what we find is,
Speaker:is that as that value goes up, so does the anxiety, and the heightened awareness, and the
Speaker:what if and they play it out in their mind.
Speaker:And and they, they want to take all the measures they can to help protect themselves.
Speaker:So let's say you are a high value person then.
Speaker:You're selling diamonds, you're selling alcohol, some fancy wine, I don't know,
Speaker:something that's going to cost money.
Speaker:Your first takeaway earlier was about like the importance of your website having trust signals
Speaker:and looking I think in general just looking legit.
Speaker:What recommendations do you have in terms.
Speaker:So first of all, what is a trust signal on a website?
Speaker:Yeah, trust signals they come in a variety of different different brand,
Speaker:you know brands and presentations
Speaker:specifically around Norton, Norton is one of the most globally recognized
Speaker:trust brands for the last 30 years.
Speaker:It's, it's, it's synonymous with many across the world as just, you know,
Speaker:comfort, confidence, peace of mind.
Speaker:And, and what we're trying to convey and what a brand should try to do is you know,
Speaker:brands themselves often will find themselves making lots of promises and guarantees.
Speaker:They'll even use the word guarantee or best or low.
Speaker:And unfortunately, those are just merely clip art.
Speaker:It's, you know, it's, it's artwork on a website.
Speaker:It really, it just doesn't have any meaning to it.
Speaker:And what we wanted to try to do is, is, you know in our partnership with Norton, build a product
Speaker:that would give all those claims credibility.
Speaker:And and provide again.
Speaker:What I said earlier is that we want to provide a guarantee.
Speaker:We want to guarantee the guarantees.
Speaker:You know, we want guarantee to actually mean something to the, to that first time
Speaker:shoppers so that they have that, that comfort of the what if and if something does happen
Speaker:it will be resolved one way or another.
Speaker:So it's kind of a third party a separate unit outside of just the business
Speaker:saying I guarantee it's gonna arrive.
Speaker:It's a way to provide trust right up front and then continue.
Speaker:All right, let's let's check our next video.
Speaker:All right, FedEx drivers trying to deliver.
Speaker:Whoa, two guys are fighting this FedEx delivery.
Speaker:Oh, that FedEx delivery guy.
Speaker:That's right, two guys are trying to fight it off.
Speaker:Okay, so let me explain it a little bit.
Speaker:A FedEx driver is dropping off a package when a person comes up to him on the porch
Speaker:and says, oh, that's mine and I have it.
Speaker:And he's like, Whoa, you live here or what?
Speaker:And he's like, yeah, it's mine.
Speaker:And, and then he's like, no, I don't think you live here.
Speaker:And then a second guy comes up and they kind of try to forcefully take it from him.
Speaker:In the meantime, the homeowner eventually opens up the door and is like, oh my
Speaker:word, I'm so sorry, I can't believe this.
Speaker:And, yeah, crazy.
Speaker:Two different thieves at once.
Speaker:Eric.
Speaker:Yeah, I also picked up on when the driver said, yeah, I deal with this all the time.
Speaker:You think they're, I wonder if he's, they're not paying him enough to go through that, right?
Speaker:No, no, and oh boy, really, it is a risk.
Speaker:The poor carriers, I speak with carriers all the time.
Speaker:And it is a constant struggle keeping their people safe.
Speaker:And so this does bring up the myth as well, though, around the customer experience.
Speaker:What's interesting here is the customers coming out and kind of saw this whole thing take place.
Speaker:And she was like, oh, I'm so sorry.
Speaker:And and she felt bad.
Speaker:And and overall, it was just like sort of a weird experience for her.
Speaker:I guess the myth I'm thinking here is as long as the package got there safely, then it was fine.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:Well, no, the package did get to this customer in this case, but she
Speaker:experienced something traumatic.
Speaker:What do you what do you have to say about that?
Speaker:Look, You know what?
Speaker:People have enough going on in their world and lives, right?
Speaker:They don't, they don't, not, not only does the driver not need to deal with
Speaker:this nonsense and nor does, nor does the shopper or the homeowner for that matter.
Speaker:And I think it puts them, I think they're both potentially at risk.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I really want to hope that that's an outlier.
Speaker:But Lori, I'm seeing more of those type of videos all the time.
Speaker:And they're, you know, it's just every day there seems to be just a new batch of them.
Speaker:So it's, it's, it's, it's insane.
Speaker:Crazy and scary.
Speaker:Okay, we got one more video.
Speaker:All right.
Speaker:First thing I noticed on this video is it's night time.
Speaker:Porch pirate runs up, immediately starts to take off.
Speaker:And the police come around the corner.
Speaker:Did he drop it, Eric?
Speaker:Looked like he dropped the package.
Speaker:He's like, la la la la.
Speaker:Almost feel bad for this porch pirate.
Speaker:He did happen to run right into the police the second that he got caught.
Speaker:Thoughts, Eric, on this one?
Speaker:Yeah, no hoodie.
Speaker:Rookie mistake.
Speaker:I love how he dropped the package just there on the ground.
Speaker:This is kind of an just a random question.
Speaker:A myth that I hear is sometimes people avoid getting things like package protection
Speaker:because they think it makes just the whole operational process more complicated.
Speaker:Why is that a myth?
Speaker:You know, I think in the earlier days that was true.
Speaker:And, and, and what's happened over the last several years is it's just, it continually
Speaker:gets better and more refined and more seamless.
Speaker:More transparent, more real time.
Speaker:You know, platforms like Shopify and WooCommerce have done a really good job of partnering with
Speaker:companies like ours to, to make that entire experience a very positive and, and and,
Speaker:and very well, and a very intuitive one.
Speaker:And so, you know, in fact, by having that program, having those programs being offered,
Speaker:it actually does some of the heavy lifting where the brand would normally have to take
Speaker:that on and they don't have to go it alone.
Speaker:Like, you know, find a good partner who's willing to share that responsibility with you, with
Speaker:that, with them and in those events, and they'll find that their customer loyalty will go, go up.
Speaker:And their revenue will increase as well.
Speaker:I love it.
Speaker:So so so true and so well said.
Speaker:Eric since I have you here and I've had a ton of fun looking at these
Speaker:videos and talking about myths.
Speaker:But since you're here and you're really an expert on all things package
Speaker:protection, all things porch piracy.
Speaker:I thought that I would throw in a few additional myths just directly
Speaker:about package protection at you.
Speaker:Things that I'm hearing from our community and an audience and questions kind of they have
Speaker:around this whole getting package protection.
Speaker:So first, if I offer a package protection to my customer, it's just sort of one more thing to do.
Speaker:It's going to make them confused.
Speaker:It's just going to, you know, maybe be one more barrier between them actually closing the deal.
Speaker:I'd say that was again, you know, just going back a few years, I'd say that would have been
Speaker:that would have been more true than it is today.
Speaker:But in fact, in fact, the process, what's gone on over the last several years and in coming
Speaker:out and going through COVID and coming out of COVID, where the volumes were just in enormous
Speaker:amount of purchases online were being made, were just incredibly high, unprecedented.
Speaker:What happened during that period is that the shoppers became conditioned.
Speaker:And what, what we are seeing now is.
Speaker:We're seeing consumers almost going to brands where they should, they're expecting
Speaker:to see package protection as an option.
Speaker:Just as you know, back in 2015, 2016, one, a company called Affirm came on the scene.
Speaker:Well, they're the ones that pioneered this concept of buy now, pay later.
Speaker:And back then it was this sort of unusual novelty thing.
Speaker:But today, if you go to any website in the world, and if you don't see a buy
Speaker:now pay later, you're going to sit there and go, what's wrong with these guys?
Speaker:We're starting to see that now more and more with package protection offers as well.
Speaker:I think it's a great point.
Speaker:As consumers, things are weird when you're first introduced to them.
Speaker:You know, early on with online shopping for me, I didn't even like to buy
Speaker:anything except on Amazon or something because I knew exactly what to expect.
Speaker:I knew I could trust them 100%.
Speaker:I knew exactly when it would arrive.
Speaker:But we're way past that at this point.
Speaker:As you said, COVID and whatnot got us so familiar that we're now getting our pharmacy
Speaker:delivered and our groceries delivered.
Speaker:And, you know, we're used to it more.
Speaker:And so I think that that's a great point.
Speaker:So another myth then that I've heard is that we offer our own insurance.
Speaker:And so that's good enough.
Speaker:Yeah, consumers are smarter than a lot of people give them credit for.
Speaker:And one of the big, one of the big tells or clues of when you go to a store, when you see
Speaker:a package protection and it's in a generic state, there's really no company that seems to
Speaker:be backing it up shoppers have figured that out, not all of them, but lots of them have.
Speaker:And what they, their first, their first thought that they have once they see it is
Speaker:they go, oh, these guys are just trying to justify, they're just trying to get more
Speaker:money out of me and it's a money grab.
Speaker:It's just bad, it's not, it's not good optics, guys.
Speaker:I get it, like I get it, brands, why you do it.
Speaker:It's a, you're, you're, it's a, it's a, it's a lot of revenue for you, it's.
Speaker:You're hedging against the potential of a, of a problem or not.
Speaker:However, it's turning a lot of shoppers off.
Speaker:And they want a third party, a credible brand that they've placed their trust into, which
Speaker:when they buy package protection, they know they're actually getting real package protection
Speaker:underwritten and regulated by an underwriter.
Speaker:Yeah, I love how earlier you, you made that, that vision in my mind of just the guarantee.
Speaker:I can just see some sort of clipart guarantee where nothing flashes more, I think in my mind of
Speaker:like opposite of guarantee, what's happening here?
Speaker:This is not real.
Speaker:So yeah, great point.
Speaker:Okay, what about package protection being a cost center?
Speaker:That it is really costly.
Speaker:That's another myth I hear.
Speaker:Not only is it not a cost center because again, I have to give credit to the, to the,
Speaker:you know, the state of the art platform, Shopify, WooCommerce and, you know, countless
Speaker:others out there, they've really made the entire integration process very streamlined.
Speaker:And then once it's installed, we've gone through great lengths to really make sure that it is
Speaker:smooth, self sufficient, almost, almost somewhat automatic, but it gets even a little, it's, it
Speaker:gets better because it's actually, it could be potentially for the right opportunity or for the
Speaker:right merchant could be a profit center for them.
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker:That's really exciting.
Speaker:So you basically turn a problem into profit.
Speaker:And, and typically these type of things, at least I understand from Norton Shopping
Speaker:Guarantee, and we'll talk a little bit about more who you are at the end, but it
Speaker:shouldn't cost money to the business.
Speaker:It should be free.
Speaker:So if somebody is trying to charge you to do any of these things, that's like a big red flag.
Speaker:Correct.
Speaker:And again, savvy shoppers are figured, have figured that out.
Speaker:And again, it's just, it just leaves a bad taste and a bad impression.
Speaker:And you can't afford to have that because that might've been your only chance to get that
Speaker:person to make their first purchase with you.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:or their 62nd purchase.
Speaker:You know, we want it as well.
Speaker:It helps us with the loyalty, so I think that's great.
Speaker:So the last myth that I have here is that, you know, there's insurance offered by carriers.
Speaker:I can just use it.
Speaker:Why do you think that that's a myth?
Speaker:That's a common one, I hear that quite a bit.
Speaker:And it's a logical one because that's, there's the lion's share of that is true.
Speaker:But carriers, all major carriers by default offer, it's usually a hundred
Speaker:dollars, up to a hundred dollars and it, and it protects against damage or loss.
Speaker:But you notice that I didn't say higher, you know, theft, package theft.
Speaker:That isn't covered.
Speaker:And not only that, if you sell an item that's over 100, which the AOVs for lots of brands
Speaker:are much higher than that, well, you're, then you, then you're reaching into your pocket.
Speaker:The company is then exposed and is the ones who are inevitably going
Speaker:to be the ones paying that out.
Speaker:Remember that 2 percent I said earlier in the, in this, in this cast, you know, that's where
Speaker:that 2%, that's why it adds up so quickly.
Speaker:One percent, two percent.
Speaker:I mean, those can become massive numbers numbers.
Speaker:Yeah, very quickly.
Speaker:So awesome.
Speaker:This has been really, really great.
Speaker:I want for you to share a little bit with us about Norton Shopping Guarantee with Package Protection.
Speaker:What is it?
Speaker:And how does it work for our audience?
Speaker:Yeah, Norton Shopping Guarantee is a consumer confidence platform that is which
Speaker:is basically a four in one guarantee.
Speaker:And it's free for merchants to use.
Speaker:And it's, it's it's, it's the funding or the cost of it is provided by the consumers
Speaker:themselves at their, at their free will.
Speaker:And what it does is it not only provides tackles the package delivery issues that
Speaker:we've been kind of focused on here, but we also provide three other relevant tangible
Speaker:guarantees that all help provide that peace of mind around the shopper's identity.
Speaker:We also provide a guarantee around the merchant and, and, and stating that that merchant you're
Speaker:about to purchase from is a reliable merchant.
Speaker:And all the promises they make, they're going to keep.
Speaker:And then lastly, and this one's quite frankly, I think it's one of the most popular messages
Speaker:that we offer, which is the low price guarantee.
Speaker:There, there have been many cases where I've purchased things online and I've gone back
Speaker:to that store two days later or a week later, only to see that that price was dropped.
Speaker:And I kind of said to myself, well, why I should have either waited or
Speaker:gone or gone to Amazon for that matter.
Speaker:And we provide the merchant that resolution or that monetary remedy to their shopper for
Speaker:a low price claim for up to a hundred dollars.
Speaker:You know, lots of brands offer low price guarantees, but when they do, they're
Speaker:paying for it out of their pocket.
Speaker:When you partner with us, it comes out of our pocket.
Speaker:Oh, that's fantastic.
Speaker:So if somebody wanted to learn more about Norton Shopping Guarantee with Package
Speaker:Protection, how should they do that?
Speaker:You can certainly reach out to our web, our primary websites norton.buysafe.com.
Speaker:You could certainly find me on Twitter, Eric Thorson, you know, love to connect
Speaker:with you, you know, and no, no matter what.
Speaker:And if you have any questions or curiosities, you know, again, please reach out.
Speaker:Yeah, fantastic.
Speaker:Lots of great information.
Speaker:Please, if you are an ecommerce business out there, I absolutely recommend
Speaker:connecting with Eric just to get tips.
Speaker:He's, you know, to get ideas and you, you're facing a situation
Speaker:maybe that you haven't faced before.
Speaker:He is the guy who knows.
Speaker:He's been doing this for years.
Speaker:He knows all about package protection and security.
Speaker:And of course, he's always super excited to help you if you're interested in
Speaker:Norton Shopping Guarantee of any of that.
Speaker:But also, I know Eric, he's a great guy, and he just loves to help people.
Speaker:So, Eric, thanks so much for being here.
Speaker:Lori, thanks for having me again.
Speaker:Good to see you.
Speaker:Yeah, so great to see you.
Speaker:Any final tips as we close out today?
Speaker:Yeah, just, you know what, don't, the one thing I would advocate, brands, is please, if you're
Speaker:doing this, stop denying that there's a problem.
Speaker:It may not seem obvious.
Speaker:Dig in, be courageous, look at the problem, and we'll tackle it together.
Speaker:Fantastic.
Speaker:Couldn't say it better myself.
Speaker:Thanks so much, and we'll see you guys next time.
