We are going back to April of 1989 to cover the depression era drama, Winter People. And... I’m going solo today.

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Hello.

2

Hello.

3

I'm Katie and welcome to Retro

Made, your pop culture rewind.

4

We are going to go back to April

5

of the release of Winter People.

6

Since this is a little lesser known

Kurt Russell movie and it's not

7

super readily available to stream,

I'm going to go solo today, so

8

hopefully that's okay with you all.

9

But I do want to Sincerely, thank you all

for listening, going along this journey

10

so far with me before we get into the

time capsule just remember, you can

11

keep in touch with me also by sending

an email to retromadepodcast at gmail.

12

com.

13

I'm going to read a listener

email here in a little bit.

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So you can be like, so,

oh, also the Facebook page.

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There's other nostalgia.

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Keep up with what's going on over there.

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And as always, I do really

appreciate ratings and reviews.

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If you can spare a couple of minutes.

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If you're new to the show, welcome.

20

I cover retro movies and the TV music

and other pop culture of the time.

21

So in terms of listener emails

this one's long overdue.

22

So this is from Zoe Richardson and he

is from Backlook Cinema, the podcast.

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I've guested on that.

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He's guested on this show as well.

25

And he always has very well thought out.

26

Emails, and I just haven't had a

chance to read this 1 on the show yet.

27

It's actually in reference to the

episode that I did with Jamie and

28

Milo covering the remake of roadhouse.

29

The 1 with the 2024 1

with Jake Gyllenhaal.

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So, if you have not listened to that

episode, be sure to market to go back

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to, or go listen to that and come back.

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Be sure to listen to this one as well.

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And if you recall, we didn't love it.

34

I'll just say that.

35

So I'm synthesizing down a

little bit, trying to catch

36

the main points of Zoe's email.

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It was a lovely email.

38

So thanks again, Zoe, for that.

39

But I'm not going to read the whole thing.

40

So he says, so I heard your review

of Roadhouse and I assume you've

41

seen my video and I take it that

you didn't like it that much.

42

So yes, Zoe did see.

43

Your video and you guys go check

out those response to the movie.

44

He continues.

45

He says, honestly, I'm a little

surprised and not surprised at all.

46

I'm sure that, you know,

my feelings about it.

47

I thought that it was pretty good.

48

I was immensely entertained , in

spite of some of its flaws.

49

I think that some of the things that

you guys hated about the film were

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the things that I loved about it.

51

Now, I'm not going to try and convince you

as to why you should like it rather here.

52

We have an opportunity as to

why we see the film differently.

53

So, he goes on to talk about remakes

in general, the fact that me and

54

my guests didn't even really want.

55

We didn't want this movie.

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Therefore, he didn't think that

we were as open minded as maybe

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we could have been, which is fair.

58

I will just reiterate that I am a big

fan of Jake Gyllenhaal and I tried,

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or at least I told myself that I was

going to be open minded because of that.

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I thought if, if it could be good,

It could be good because of Jake.

61

Let's see.

62

He also, he just thinks that maybe we

missed some things that he really enjoyed

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like, not realizing certain things.

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And I don't know if maybe, maybe

some of us did and some of us didn't.

65

I just think we didn't, I don't know

if it's that we missed those things.

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I think it's that we caught

them, but we didn't, still didn't

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like it or that it just didn't.

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It just felt very disjointed.

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So then there's a point at which some

of the flaws in the remake, that

70

we attributed as it's flaws elements

of the remake that were in the

71

original, like, he says, you noted

that this town was full of bad guys.

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Yeah, so is the remake.

73

Like Dalton seemed invincible, but he

was kind of invincible in the original,

74

and this is a trope in action movies.

75

A friend of mine would call it

an invincible white man trope.

76

Admittedly, they really went past

the limit with Dalton's invincibility

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in the remake, but it wasn't

enough to derail my enjoyment.

78

Speaking of enjoyment, I

mentioned that there were things

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that I loved that you hated.

80

I loved the fight scenes.

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I didn't even know that

some of it was CGI.

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I totally bought into the scenes.

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I guess in this case,

your mileage will vary.

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Some people were able to

discern CGI and others couldn't.

85

I never stopped to think about it.

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Now this I'm begging for you guys.

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To write in I, that was my biggest beef.

88

I'll just say that was my

biggest beef with the movie.

89

There was no stakes in

it for me because it was.

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Basically, a Marvel movie, like,

it was a cartoon didn't seem real.

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And that was 1 of the things

that we loved about the original.

92

It had excellent real fight sequences.

93

So I'll just reiterate that.

94

I, yes, I hated the CGI fights.

95

It took me completely out of

it, but I realized that I'm not

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the only opinion that matters.

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So I'd love to hear anyone

else's thoughts on this.

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Also.

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So Zoe goes on with a few other

examples, you know, about.

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Dalton's character being

a little bit different.

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And so in the context of so in

the original Dalton, rips out

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the throat of a guy in the remake.

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This is what so says.

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In the remake, they

contextualized this element.

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The act of killing someone and

wrapped the whole movie around it.

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Instead of a random stranger,

it was Dalton's friend.

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Instead of a purposeful act,

it was done by accident.

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This is a man suffering with PTSD

and is struggling to cope with it.

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He doesn't know how to get close to people

again, and so we don't get the sex scene

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and we don't get the rom com ending.

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Both elements that we brought

up, though, says by the end of

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the movie, he's still struggling,

but perhaps handling it better.

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There was something about him getting

on the bus at the end that I really

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liked this aspect of the character.

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That is his struggles with his guilt and

anguish felt more real and accessible to

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me than a guy with a degree in philosophy

who chooses to work as a bouncer.

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Good point.

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So good point.

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But it was the 80s.

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That's what it was about.

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Okay.

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So says, don't get me wrong.

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This roadhouse remake

had a lot of problems.

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There were jumps of logic

that didn't make any sense.

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There were scenes that

carried on too long.

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There were a lot of things that

you pointed out that were just bad.

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And I sort of agree with some

of your points, but I also

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was too thrilled to care.

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Jake carried the fuck out of this

film, more than anything else,

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he really made this thing work.

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Before I stop typing, I want to

address the comment, no one asked

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for this, or who asked for this.

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I'm not a fan of this sentiment, as

it's contradictory and illogical.

134

The answer to this question or

statement is that no one asks for

135

anything, and you get exactly what

you asked for, you'll hate it.

136

The trick is to give you something new

and unexpected, yet somehow familiar,

137

and that's what this movie brings.

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You might like it, you might

hate it, but that's the chance

139

that's taken in creating a thing.

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It has very little in common

with the original film, but

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that's what makes it good.

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They know the legacy of the original,

so they're not trying to create an exact

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duplicate of the original, rather a new

story using elements of the old one.

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Thank you, Zoe.

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He has other points, I'm not gonna

read all of his email, but that's Very

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good points, Zoe, and I will say, I

attribute some of this to the changing

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landscape of movies and moviegoing

experiences nowadays, but I clearly was

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in the minority here because they are

already slated to make a sequel to it.

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All right, you guys, let

me know what you think.

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Now we can open the time

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So, this is Nielsen ratings from 88 to 89.

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I feel like we've covered a lot of these

before, but just to refresh your memory.

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We have the Cosby show Roseanne, which

was its premier season now on this.

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I actually was considering

expanding on Roseanne since it was.

155

It's premiere season, but I really

don't want to rush that discussion

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because there's a lot there.

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So I'm going to save it for

another upcoming episode.

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So if you like Roseanne, keep

listening, keep watching.

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Also big top rated shows.

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That season was a different world.

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Cheers.

162

The Golden Girls, of

course, Who's the Boss?

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Murder, She Wrote, Empty

Nest, and Anything But Love.

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And yes, that does sound familiar.

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I think we've covered anything but

love before, because I recall not

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remembering it and looking it up.

167

Let's see.

168

It stars Richard Lewis and Marty

Gold and Jamie Lee Curtis as

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coworkers at a Chicago magazine.

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It had 56 episodes, apparently.

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That's kind of shocking

to what four seasons.

172

Wow.

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Don't remember it at all.

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Does anyone?

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So the shows that weren't necessarily

in the top, but premiered.

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Which would make them all 35 years

old now, good morning, miss bliss.

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You guys please tell me you remember this.

178

It actually was let's see.

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It was only a single season because

so miss bliss is Haley mills and

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it's the saved by the bell kids.

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But like, in junior high school, and

then when they got into high school,

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they swapped some characters, but.

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It was on the Disney Channel originally,

also kind of known to be the junior

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high years of Saved by the Bell.

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We also have Just the 10 of

Us premiering this season.

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I'm going to have to expand

on that in a future season as

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well, because I adore that show.

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Coach Lubbock from Growing Pains

was spun off into his own TV show,

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and that was Just the 10 of Us.

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China Beach.

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Do you guys remember China Beach?

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, Empty Nest, which was the Golden

Girls spinoff, also very good.

193

Murphy Brown, Dirty Dancing.

194

Yes, I said Dirty Dancing.

195

So this was a super short lived

series after the success of the movie,

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Dirty Dancing, of course, but there

are, is not a single cast member.

197

From the movie that's in the TV show,

but Malora Hardin starred in it.

198

Jan from The Office, Malora

Hardin, that's who she is.

199

Let's see.

200

We also have The Wonder Years,

Garbage Pail Kids, and Yo MTV Raps.

201

And then some of the shows

that ended this season.

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American Bandstand, Highway to Heaven,

Kate and Ali, Small Wonder, Moonlighting,

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Webster, and The California Raisin Show.

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Interesting grouping there.

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Yeah.

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So that is the popular TV

from the 88 to 89 season.

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Now the specific week that winter

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The songs that were big Billboard

top 10 number one song is she drives

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me crazy by fine young cannibals.

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The look by Roxette is number two.

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Ooh, there's a lot of girls

Madonna with like a prayer

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oh god.

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I still I love this video

like a prayer Yeah, good one.

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The bangles with eternal flame.

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That's a goodie and Girl,

you know, it's true by Millie

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Vanillie is the number five song

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Number six is Stand by REM.

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Number seven is Funky

Cold Medina by Tone Loke.

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Now I think people probably assume or

just they have good thoughts about that

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song or oh yeah that's a great song.

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It's good in theory is what my opinion

is because it's the most repetitive

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song ever and if it's played at like

uh some sort of a wedding or a dance

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or something it it's not fun to

dance to because it's so repetitive.

224

It's just too repetitive

and gets old real quick.

225

My two cents anyway.

226

Number eight, did not

know what the song is.

227

I looked it up.

228

Superwoman by Karen White.

229

Does anybody know this song?

230

It is like a sad love song.

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And after watching the video,

it is extremely clear that

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Beyonce borrowed from this.

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Very much borrowed from this for her.

234

If I were a boy video, it's like the

same kind of, and I love that video.

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I like Beyonce's better, but at any rate,

number nine is you got it by Roy Orbison.

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And number 10 is your mama.

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Don't dance by poison.

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I think this is maybe one of the most

varied genre wise top 10 we've ever had.

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It's literally a little bit of everything.

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Wrapped into it.

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And so, you know, that's

what the eighties was.

242

This is 1989

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news and events is like

mostly sporting things.

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Tons of sports news.

245

Do you guys remember WrestleMania five?

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Apparently Hulk Hogan beat Randy

Macho Man Savage for the WWF

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heavyweight title in April of 1989.

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It was a certain NBA stars last game,

any guesses, Kareem Abdul Jabbar

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and Mike Tyson got in some trouble.

250

He both strikes a parking attendant

when asked to move his car and

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then separately from that gets a

speeding ticket for drag racing his

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Lamborghini in Albany, New York.

253

Hillsboro disaster.

254

Hmm.

255

England.

256

Yeah.

257

Okay.

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So 96 people are crushed to death

and 766 people were injured at the

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Hillsboro football stadium in Sheffield,

England during a semifinal between

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Liverpool and Nottingham forest.

261

96 people were crushed to death.

262

Oh, wow.

263

I don't know.

264

I feel like I've heard of

this, but I don't remember it.

265

Well, also the central park 5.

266

I'm sure you all have heard of them.

267

5 teenagers were wrongfully

convicted and each spend between

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6 and 12 years in prison.

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For the violent rape of jogger, Tricia

melee in New York City's central park and.

270

This is one of the most widely

271

And yes, they were wrongfully convicted.

272

I think one of them is in

New York, he's on the city

273

council or something like that.

274

No, I want to say George W.

275

Bush and Edward W.

276

Rose become joint CEOs

of the Texas Rangers.

277

I did not know this.

278

And he did anyone else,

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Massachusetts declares

new kids on the block day.

280

And this is wild 1989, you guys,

April, the World Wide Web, WWW

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is first launched in the public

domain by computer scientist.

282

Anybody knows name Tim Berners Lee.

283

I did not know that.

284

A couple of famous

weddings happened in April.

285

Jon Bon Jovi weds his high school

sweetheart, Dorothea Hurley,

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at Graceland Chapel in Vegas.

287

Also, actor and comedian Robin

Williams weds nanny Marsha Garces

288

at a private ceremony in Lake Tahoe.

289

We have a couple of deaths, though.

290

American boxer, Sugar Ray Robinson.

291

Now, I don't Okay, I don't know

what the deal is in boxing,

292

why everybody is named Sugar

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and Sugar Ray.

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Like, every Like, there's a Sugar

Shane, there's a couple Sugar Rays.

295

What's the story with the sugar?

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Boxing.

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Does anyone know Anyway, I don't

think I knew Sugar Ray Robinson,

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but he was the World Welterweight

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He was the middleweight champion from

51 to 52, also in 55 and 58, and he

300

dies of Alzheimer's disease at age

301

Lucille Ball died.

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Of a heart attack at age 77 and

Sergio Leone, the Italian director

303

who invented spaghetti westerns.

304

For example, the man with no

name trilogy, he died of a heart

305

attack also, but he was only 60.

306

All right, let's move past the sadness

with other big movie releases of the time.

307

Field of Dreams.

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Pet Cemetery, Major League, K

9, The Dream Team, Say Anything,

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She's Out of Control, and Cyborg.

310

I don't realize.

311

I sort of thought Cyborg was not a

hit, but it must have been pretty big.

312

It was one of the bigger

movies in April anyway.

313

Hmm.

314

All right.

315

Well, without further ado,

let's get into the movie.

316

Winter People released April 14th, 1989.

317

It was PG and I, so it has a 6.

318

2 out of 10 on IMDb, which is actually

kind of high, I think, considering.

319

It did not do well with critics and I

just feel like no one talks about this.

320

I don't really know anyone

who's seen this movie.

321

So you guys will have to let me know.

322

The director is well known.

323

We actually just talked about him

because he directed Uncommon Valor with

324

our other everyman, Patrick Swayze.

325

He also directed First Blood

and Weekend at Bernie's.

326

Ted Kochef.

327

Hmm.

328

Interesting.

329

So this was based on a book

by John Ellie or E H L E.

330

Not entirely sure how to pronounce that.

331

Apologies.

332

It was a novel of written in 1982

that this film was based on and the

333

other writer was Carol Sobieski.

334

And she's known for tons of TV movies.

335

Also a couple of fantastic movies, fried

336

I'm going to have to find a way to

cover that because I love that movie.

337

Anyone else?

338

Okay.

339

So our Everyman Kurt

Russell stars in this.

340

He plays Wayland Jackson.

341

So he is a young widower who moves

with his daughter into a North

342

Carolina mountain town in 1934.

343

So this is the depression.

344

He quickly takes up with a young

woman played by Kelly McGillis.

345

She plays Colly Wright.

346

You guys know her from Top Gun, but she

was also in Witness and The Accused.

347

So they're the couple in this movie.

348

So he quickly takes up with her and

she has an illegitimate baby, which

349

was like an enormous deal at the time

350

.

So first he must prove himself to her father and her three brothers.

351

He does so first by joining them on

a bear hunt and then by designing

352

a clock tower for the small.

353

Community trouble comes when it is

revealed that the baby's father is the

354

demented son of a mean clan across the

river and they want revenge for his death.

355

There's a lot of people in this

because so this is like a dueling

356

families story a little bit.

357

Sort of the backdrop in like Appalachia

during the depression, right?

358

So that's kind of the stage that we're

in and each clan has several brothers.

359

So, it kind of gets confusing, I

think Lloyd Bridges is also in this.

360

He plays Collie's father, William Wright.

361

So we have the Wrights,

which is Collie's clan.

362

Collie, yes, Collie is

spelled like the dog, Collie.

363

I've never, I've never heard

that before, but I like it.

364

There's actually, actually to that

point, the names in this are wild.

365

Okay, so we have Wayland, Collie,

William is normal, but so Lloyd Bridges

366

plays William, and we talked about him

in the North Eye, actually, because

367

I did that solo as well, talked about

him in the North and South episode

368

because he played Jefferson Davis.

369

And I don't know if I, I mean,

I knew he was like Hollywood

370

royalty, but when I looked him up,

371

I don't think I realized that.

372

It's Lloyd Bridges.

373

And then Drury Campbell.

374

He is the patriarch of the Campbell clan.

375

They're like across the river.

376

Drury.

377

D R U R Y.

378

He is played by Mitchell Ryan, and we

talked about him in Uncommon Valor as

379

well, because he played Chief Tom Riordan.

380

He is a familiar face and

he's in a ton of things.

381

You definitely know him.

382

He has that.

383

Despite him playing in this, not

necessarily like a regal person,

384

he is typically playing like

a regal older man type role.

385

I'm pretty sure he played Greg's

dad in Dharma and Greg, and he was

386

also the general in Lethal Weapon.

387

So that's Mitchell Ryan.

388

Now, Paula Jackson, Waylon's

daughter, so he, his wife dies, and

389

he moves with his daughter, Paula.

390

She is played by Amelia Burnett,

and she did not continue acting.

391

Like, this is it for her.

392

Annie Wright is played by Eileen Ryan.

393

Does anyone know Eileen Ryan?

394

It did not ring a bell to me, but

she is Sean and Chris Penn's mom.

395

So there you have it.

396

Now we have another brother,

another Wright brother.

397

So we have William as the dad, Collie,

daughter, and then here are the brothers.

398

Gudger?

399

Yes.

400

Like, the names are wild.

401

G U D G E R, he's, he's

played by Lanny Flaherty.

402

I don't know if I'm

pronouncing that right.

403

Sounds very Irish.

404

Not well known, but his parts tended

to be, like, always sort of that just

405

disheveled looking old timey outlaw type.

406

Sort of what, what he usually plays.

407

Another brother, his name is Young.

408

Like he's young right at first.

409

I thought they were like just saying

like the young right boy, but no his name

410

is young and He's played by Don Michael

Paul who played Craig Bodie on Models

411

Inc if anybody remembers that show from

the 90s And he also directs a lot of

412

small budget straight to video movies

or straight to streaming, I guess now.

413

And then Milton, right?

414

Yet another brother is

played by David Dwyer.

415

And this is actually

his first movie credit.

416

But he also played the sheriff in The

Highwaymen and a prison guard in the Firm.

417

And recently, if anybody

has seen the movie Hillbilly

418

Elegy, he plays Uncle Arch.

419

Or Uncle Archie.

420

That's who David Dwyer is.

421

Now, the Campbells.

422

Now here are the three Campbell brothers.

423

The other clan.

424

See, I don't know why

there's so many brothers.

425

It's hard to keep everyone straight.

426

So Cole Campbell is, spoiler

alert, he's the baby's father.

427

The illegitimate baby's father

from the clan across the river.

428

So it's like very risque.

429

Cole Campbell is played by Jeffrey

Meek, and he is a little bit familiar.

430

He had a really long run on

As the World Turns, as Craig

431

Montgomery, that's who he played.

432

He also played Remo Williams in the

TV movie, Remo Williams, The Prophecy.

433

And he was also in the

Mortal Kombat, Conquest.

434

TV series did not watch that.

435

But if anyone did, he will be familiar.

436

Now we have Skeet in addition.

437

So Cole and Skeet.

438

Skeet is played by Bill

Gribble, who's not well known.

439

And then the third brother is Harmon.

440

So we have Drury as the father,

Cole, Skeet, and Harmon, Campbell.

441

Harmon is played by Wallace Merk, and he

is not well known, but since we brought up

442

that one of the writers, Carol Sobieski,

is known for writing fried green tomatoes.

443

Wallace Merck is also in

that movie in a bit role.

444

He plays a KKK guy.

445

So isn't that lovely?

446

All right, so that's our cast of

characters It seems like a lot and I

447

I guess I got a kick out of the names

more so than their characters because

448

they didn't really Do a whole lot

449

The music I wasn't familiar with the

name John Scott It's good music,

450

and it's very fitting for the setting.

451

And he is an English composer and music

conductor who's collaborated with a ton

452

of well known directors including Mark

Damon, Richard Donner, Charlton Heston,

453

Mike Hodges, Hugh Hudson, Norman Jewison,

Urban Kirschner, and Roger Spottiswood.

454

We talked about him too in what did he do?

455

The best of times, I think.

456

Now I could not find what the

budget for this movie was.

457

AI tells me it was 500,

000 really low, right?

458

I don't know if that's accurate

or not, but it would track

459

based on the box office.

460

It only made 2 million.

461

So there's that.

462

Not available to stream, as I said,

so it's kind of annoying to cover.

463

Thus I'm doing it solo again.

464

Okay.

465

There is a whole situation

around Wayland played by Kurt.

466

He comes to town.

467

He's a clockmaker.

468

So he, everyone's commenting on,

like, he doesn't have calloused hands.

469

He has nice hands and that

they think that's, you know,

470

for this area, a little odd.

471

So he is Talking with Kali's father

and brothers about the idea of building

472

a clock tower in the town center.

473

While this conversation is happening,

Kali makes a suggestion about

474

it, but she quickly apologizes.

475

And at first I was like, what,

what did I miss something?

476

But then no, no gasp.

477

She apologized because women certainly

should not have nor express ideas.

478

Silly rabbit.

479

1 of them though is super jazzed

about the idea and he's like, oh, and

480

it can have a bear coming out of it.

481

Like, I don't know if that was

a big thing back then they have,

482

like, instead of a cuckoo clock.

483

This is like, a big town square

clock tower, but a bear kind of.

484

Comes out of it and rings the bell.

485

So that's what they're talking about.

486

So they need to go on a bear

hunt and , kill a bear to put

487

in , this tower, apparently, and

they try to convince Wayland, Kurt

488

they try to convince

him he's not into it.

489

He's a clockmaker.

490

And plus his daughter's like,

it's not cool to kill animals.

491

So they try to convince him that, you

got to be a real man and only real men,

492

I don't know, march into an animal's

habitat while he's minding his own goddamn

493

business and kill it for no reason.

494

So this is pleasing to his daughter's

ears, but he's like, no, thanks.

495

I'm, I'm not curious about that.

496

Like, I don't need to kill

something to feel like a man.

497

And so.

498

His daughter's right.

499

It's dumb.

500

And she's a smart kid, but what's what

doesn't make sense is then the next scene.

501

I feel like there was some editing

issues or something, or the

502

story just was cobbled together.

503

Oddly, because the next scene is.

504

He goes, he's like all happy and they're

getting ready to go and Collie and the

505

daughter, 'cause they're staying with

Collie at her house and with the baby, or

506

like in the, not in the house, but there's

like a, I don't wanna say an outhouse,

507

but it's like an outbuilding, like a shed

of sorts that they're kind of staying in.

508

So it's, you know, it's on the up and up.

509

But of course they fall in

love, but, so they're apparently

510

the, these hunting trips.

511

Take a very long time because

they're all gearing up and getting

512

ready and they're all excited.

513

And so there's a scene where they're

putting things in trucks and there's

514

all the hunting dogs are around.

515

One of the brother's dogs is

apparently really mean and

516

he's, he's super proud of that.

517

And then he gets into a

fight with the other dogs and

518

apparently that's hilarious.

519

I don't understand how

this is supposed to work.

520

Like, how are they supposed to do

their quote unquote hunting job?

521

Anyway, I just, not for me.

522

I don't like those kind of things.

523

It's not funny.

524

But I, I get it.

525

It's a movie.

526

I get it.

527

But it's like, are we

supposed to like these people?

528

Because I don't.

529

They're laughing at the dog being

mean and fighting the other dogs.

530

They're making fun of their sister,

to the man who's courting her.

531

And they're making fun of her to him,

like, basically calling her a huge

532

slut because she has a bastard baby.

533

I don't know.

534

It was weird.

535

I was not endeared to these brothers.

536

And then, Wayland, somehow, there's a

whole sequence of They attack the bear,

537

so then the bear, the bear obviously

is trying to defend itself and young.

538

1 of the brothers is in danger.

539

And so Wayland ends up being kind of the

heroic 1 jumps on the bears back and it's

540

like, just with a knife going to kill it.

541

And then Greg shoots it.

542

And then they proceed to argue

about who gets credit for the kill.

543

So , they get their bear.

544

They kill their bear.

545

This will come back into place later.

546

So hold on to the fact

that they get their bear.

547

And the purpose of this bear hunt was that

they needed a bear for this clock tower.

548

Okay, let's remember that there's

additional, I thought, extremely heavy

549

handed foreshadowing, like several times.

550

Kurt slash Wayland is being warned,

you know, about, oh, you know,

551

you better stay away from Kali.

552

There's a lot of that.

553

So we see it coming from

a bazillion miles away.

554

What's what's going to happen.

555

So Cole Campbell, the youngest of

the Campbell brothers from again,

556

apparently feuding families.

557

We don't ever see anything

like no, even a little bit of a

558

backstory about why they feud.

559

It's just they're a feuding

family from across the river.

560

And so that's why they can't be together.

561

So Cole is the baby's father.

562

The reason that he's not a part

of the baby's life or that they

563

couldn't get married is because

of this feuding family situation.

564

Apparently it was again.

565

I found this a little bit off because.

566

I'm not sure how to describe it, but

something just felt really off, either

567

about the writing or the editing.

568

Now, I've not read the book, so I

don't know if it is a better portrayal.

569

But the whole Cole and Collie thing,

I don't know, it was weird because,

570

so Cole, apparently, the reason

that they even know each other.

571

Is because Cole was

friends with Young, right?

572

Young, as in Colly's brother,

Young but the Campbells have no

573

knowledge of said friendship at all.

574

So there's that.

575

And then Colly, when she's

telling Weyland About the baby's

576

father and how that happened,

577

she indicates, I thought unless I got

it completely wrong, but the way that

578

she's telling him about it is that

it was not a consensual situation.

579

But

580

then, and so, okay, that tracks.

581

Okay.

582

And we see Cole being kind of a

shithead, not kind of a major shithead.

583

He's really got his, anger

is a bit out of hand.

584

We see him being violent towards Kali.

585

We see her he even like later in

the movie attempts to rape her.

586

So we don't see them and she's

like hesitant to kiss him or, or be

587

near, like, she seems afraid of him.

588

But then she also says in another scene,

in more than one scene, I think, that they

589

actually really did want to be together,

but it was the family dynamic that they,

590

they couldn't and that she loved him.

591

So, I don't know.

592

I'm, I'm not really sure what I

am supposed to think, or maybe

593

I'm supposed to have, you know,

mixed emotions about it, perhaps.

594

I don't know, but Cole ends up dead

and, his dead body does arrive at

595

Collie's house because his horse

knows the way to Collie's house.

596

Everyone comes there to view the body

and to mourn him, after he's already

597

in a coffin and everything, which

seemed odd to me, like, why wouldn't

598

he be at his own home, especially given

the rift between the families, like

599

they couldn't have moved the coffin

to Cole's house across the river.

600

I don't know.

601

That seemed odd to me.

602

But you'd think now would be a great time.

603

To maybe have the police called.

604

This dude ends up dead.

605

People are suspicious of how that

happened, but no, no, no, no, no.

606

This is not the type of people nor

the time to call, call in the law.

607

No, no, this is a vengeful people.

608

This is a eye for an eye type

people, a life for a lifestyle

609

revenge that never ends.

610

Right.

611

You kill my person, I kill your person

and on and on and on and on and on.

612

Right?

613

There's a famous saying about that, right?

614

An eye for an eye leaves

the whole world blind.

615

Something like that.

616

Okay.

617

Well, what to do about this revenge

situation, because obviously the

618

Campbell's either think that.

619

Kurt Russell's character Wayland

was responsible for the death

620

or one of Collie's brothers.

621

Right?

622

So they're having this discussion

and she's going to lose the love

623

of her life because he decides that

he'll take the blame and leave town.

624

And he thinks that that will kind of

solve the problem if they think he did

625

it, but now he's nowhere to be found.

626

They can't kill him.

627

End of story, but he

also has the daughter.

628

So, what's going to happen?

629

Is the daughter going to stay with Collie?

630

What's the situation?

631

I don't really know, but the next

scene is we see this dramatic scene

632

where Collie with the baby is like

in cold winter time crossing the

633

river to go to the Campbell household.

634

And she wants to make a deal with

the patriarch Drury that she sort

635

of asks, like, Does a life for

a life have to be a life lost?

636

You see where she's going with this.

637

This is your son's child.

638

I am now willing to give

him to you to raise.

639

Therefore, it's an even trade, a

life for a life, quote unquote.

640

So she makes this deal, right?

641

And obviously, she now goes

into a deep depression.

642

Wayland stays by her side.

643

I'm not sure how long this

lasts, but time passes.

644

He makes her a musical clock and they

are actually engaged to be married.

645

And so he's, he's trying to

get her out of this depression.

646

He goes to the Campbell's encampment and

tries to ask them like on a human level.

647

Hey, in the springtime at Easter,

Colleen and I are going to get married.

648

Would you please at least bring baby

Jonathan to the wedding so she can

649

see him one last time or, or whatnot.

650

, This is not well received and

they sort of shoo him out of camp.

651

So he's like, assuming

that the answer is no.

652

Then, you know, it's springtime

and it's now a combo ceremony.

653

We have the wedding ceremony combined

with the unveiling of the clock

654

tower in the town square, right?

655

Well, what do you know?

656

Somebody's coming along on the

horse with a baby and Drury does in

657

fact bring the baby to the wedding.

658

, gives him to Collie and she's

holding him and crying and the end.

659

So at first I thought Kurt asks him

to bring the baby to the wedding.

660

And he thought about it and was like,

I'll be a human and at least, you know,

661

bring the baby to his mother's wedding.

662

But then I thought, well, maybe

we're meant to believe that this

663

is like a major act of kindness

and that their feud is over because

664

does he actually give back the baby?

665

He decides.

666

It's not fair.

667

He's being a good, a good person.

668

The bigger man, shall we say.

669

So, I don't know.

670

What do you guys think?

671

Do you think that he's being the bigger

man, giving the baby back to her?

672

Or is he just bringing the

baby to attend the wedding?

673

What do you think?

674

Also, don't forget about

the bear in the clock tower.

675

The bear that comes out to ring the

bell in the clock tower is not actually

676

the stuffed bear that they killed.

677

It's just like a, I don't

know, a figurine of a bear.

678

So I don't know, I was

really let down by that.

679

What was the whole point of the bear hunt?

680

Why'd you kill that bear?

681

Okay, there's really not very much

trivia about Winter People, you guys,

682

again, I had never even heard of this

movie to be honest with you until

683

I started doing the season of the

Ultimate Everyman on Kurt and Patrick.

684

So I really do want to hear from you

guys on socials or email or what have

685

you, if you've seen this or have you

read the book, please let me know.

686

The only trivia I could find is

that this is actually the first film

687

produced by Castle Rock Entertainment

and that this movie was filmed

688

on the Toe River in Speer, Ohio.

689

Which is Avery County, North Carolina,

and the current, apparently, I don't

690

know how true this is, the current

residents still talk about meeting

691

Kurt Russell and Kelly McGillis.

692

And they especially remember how kind

Goldie Hawn was to the local residents.

693

I would like to, I would

like to think that's true.

694

All right, you guys, while

I really am intrigued by old

695

timey Appalachian stories.

696

I definitely don't want to

live in its depression era.

697

So I'm happy to return to present day

reality until next time, be kind, rewind.