Host Quajay Donnell and producer Chris Lindstrom explore the "little things" with June's featured photographers, Noah and Liam, who reflect on their artistic processes and the influences that shape their unique perspectives.

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It’s A Lot

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Hello.

Hello, and welcome back to another episode of the behind the Glass Gallery podcast.

It's been a hot minute.

It has been.

It has been.

And we've had a lot of things going on in that minute.

I think the podcast that we did not.

Or the show we didn't do a podcast for was our May show, which was a very exciting show with students from Webster who had taken photographs, taken mostly by Richard and myself, and interpreted them in this amazing way.

I was gonna say, how did it turn out?

I've had a lot going on.

I haven't been able to get out for the shows.

How'd that all turn out?

That was a great show.

Great show.

Great turnout.

A lot of parents, you know, come out, you know, a lot of folks from the community.

But the thing that I thought was, and this was something that we had thought about from day one, how cool it would be.

These are mostly ninth graders.

Oh, wow.

Mostly ninth graders from school, you know, Todd Stahl's students.

And, you know, just this confidence, you know, boost, I would imagine, as a ninth grader to show your work outside of the school, right outside of those four walls of your classroom and not even thinking of it as, you know, was it even an option?

Was it something that was in there in their.

Something that they were thinking about at some point?

And now, you know, maybe some of those students are continuing down that path.

Maybe they're showing work later.

But also, maybe this is a one and done.

But just to think about that opportunity for them at that age.

And, you know, it was a really cool show.

A lot of great, you know, compliments about the show.

And, you know, we had the.

Their work, the photograph that it was referencing.

It's kind of cool when you saw the two together because they had taken some liberties in color, they had taken some liberties in composition.

So, you know, what was it?

The.

Their eyes are.

Their eyes.

Our hands.

So, you know, our eyes and, you know, their hands were the ones that kind of interpreted.

So it was really cool.

Really good work.

Well, and I love that, too, because it's, you know, there's not often the chance to see the process to, you know, to see that process, to see the original, see the creativity.

And you've been to.

I've been to some of those, you know, the high school shows or the, you know, the elementary school shows.

They have all the things and I don't know, there's always this.

I don't know, maybe it's just.

Me personally is like, you just see people almost humoring, like they're humoring them by showing up like, oh, wow, what a great.

What great work.

And it's great to see it in, like, this is in the public.

And everybody gets to see and say, hey, you know what?

This.

This hits this.

This matters to me.

And I think that's really cool because it's a different experience when it's not in the school, when you're out in the community.

And that showing that you're part of something bigger than just bigger than just the school year that you live in.

And that's.

It's one of the great things to show, like, hey, we're all part of that same community.

Yeah.

And it was a.

To us as well, it was a cool connection because many of the references were from scenes around the city, many that were downtown.

And so, you know, we're working with students that, you know, maybe they're not exploring the city as much.

Maybe they're only downtown for, you know, one or two things a year.

So here's this opportunity for them to take these.

These images and interpret them in their way, but also to come downtown and downtown and see that.

And so that was a really cool experience.

And, you know, we've had a couple other things in between our partnership up at the Strong Hospital, the Unity Gallery with the group of neurologists and residents.

And it's a really cool space there that we have workup and then, you know, our partnership with Coffee Party Rock and AM fm.

So we've been a little busy.

Yeah, I was gonna say I'm super excited to catch up on all that stuff on here too, like getting everybody into, you know, round up and really get this back to, you know, covering, you know, covering all these stories.

Because that's.

It's.

Part of the joy of doing this is we've gotten to really hear the stories in detail from the different groups.

And now that.

Now that there's, like the expanded behind the Glass averse.

Yeah, I joke with people.

I think I might have joked with these guys.

I can't recall, but it's, you know, it's like that Marvel Universe, and you've got these.

All these branches happening and, you know, shout out to Richard.

You know, a lot of people are like, oh, wow, this stuff is, you know, really kind of going crazy.

This is the house that Richard built.

Right.

Richard Colon.

And many of these things were already in motion prior to his departure from the city for a bit.

But also many of these connections started because of someone reaching out to him.

So the partnership with Strong and Sean Dunwoody and the Unity Gallery, that was him reaching out to Richard and then kind of passing it off to Rob and me.

But a lot of these things are just the.

That whole community over competition, right?

That's, you know, something that we've.

We've lived by since.

Since really day one.

And so being able to.

To expand a bit, you know, still under the behind the glass, you know, moniker and sometimes confusing people, people are like, wait, which.

Which opening is this?

At which location?

So we may need to do something to like, you know, separate that out a little bit.

Little differentiation.

Yeah.

And if you want to hear more.

More from Richard, if you haven't heard a lot of the story about his departure to the southern lands, he was just a guest on Rob Bell's other podcast.

Plants and Beats was a very good episode.

It was tremendous.

Rob's been killing it on that show, both with music and interviews.

So tune into that.

You know, subscribe to Plants and Beats, hear more from Rob talking to people from his life.

Get to hear his awesome lo fi music as well.

So.

But that episode with Richard was.

Was killer.

And you got to really hear the, you know, it's.

It's never an easy decision to leave your town.

And it was.

It was very.

It was worthwhile to hear his perspective on that.

Yeah.

And it's a.

It's a brotherhood.

Right.

And so, yeah, you know, we are continuing.

I mean, the guy's still around, right?

Like, doing.

I was gonna say Richard Colon's untimely demise.

It's.

But a lot of it is, you know, just making sure that we continue.

Continue that.

That work and.

And keeping that.

That legacy alive and, you know, finding partners that really live up to that community piece of it.

Right?

So folks that are engaged in doing great things, so, you know, Golden Supply, you know, working with AM FM and.

And so many other great folks as well as our.

Our artists.

And we have two of them in front of us here today.

And so wanted to.

To jump into our.

Our June featured folks, and Noah is someone we've.

We've.

You know, I think I was on the way over here, I was thinking, like, it's two years in Rochester or three.

About that, right?

Two and a half.

Yeah.

Two and a half coming up on three.

Yeah.

So happy anniversary soon to your Rochester.

So Noah is someone I've known for a bit.

You know, I remember him popping in when I had a show and we talked quite a bit, and it seemed like, you know, from that moment forward, you know, he was.

I saw him everywhere, you Know, I saw him involved in a lot of different things.

And, you know, he is also a Connecticut guy.

So shout out to Connecticut.

And I lived in Connecticut for a majority of my life and I was born in New Jersey, but Connecticut is what raised me.

And so I consider Connecticut home.

Home.

But one of the things that I thought was really interesting, and I knew it from previous conversations, but it seemed like it resonated with a lot of folks.

In your bio it says, Noah is a hard of hearing photographer.

And when I read that, it made me think of how your work looks and how it makes me feel.

Right.

I want to sit and be with it without any noise.

I just want to kind of sit with your work.

Talk to us a little bit about that journey for you as being hard of hearing and how it translates into the work that you create.

Yeah, I mean, that's a good question.

First of all, thank you both for having me.

This is really cool.

I've listened to a bunch of the episodes and yeah, just, it's been really fun being a part of this community and meeting so many new people.

And I mean, at this point, I'd say 90% of my friends are here in Rochester.

I've just made through photography, so it's been really nice.

But, yeah, I'm born hard of hearing.

I've been wearing hearing aids since I was 4 years old, so it's an everyday thing.

But it's funny when I.

When I'm at a.

Like a really pretty scene or.

I think the first time I did this, I was in California at Point Reyes on one of the hikes.

And it was just so pretty that I had the thought to myself, you know what, I want to like, experience this without anything else.

So obviously, phone in the pocket, and I just took my hearing aids out.

I'm like, this is really nice.

Like, I can't hear the wind rustling over the speakers of my hearing aids.

Like, it's just.

I don't know, it was just.

It was just a nice experience.

So I've been doing that, like, every time I go to a really pretty place that I just want to like, fully experience.

Right.

Like, without any aid, pun intended, I guess, but.

And I do feel like that kind of has a effect on how I see the world and then in turn how I try and take photos.

The goal is just.

Has always kind of been for people to feel calm when they look at my photos and to, like, there are a lot of details that I put in there.

Right.

And a lot of effort that gets spent.

But I don't want people looking at it being like, ugh, there's a light leak here.

Photo's not good.

Like, I just want them to appreciate it as it is, which is kind of the goal for me.

Yeah, I think of when I, when I look at your photos and I know we've had this, the, the back and forth via DMS as you, as you share especially in your stories and you know, you had mentioned in your bio intro, you know, about having people have that common that you, you make work for, for yourself, you know.

And I, when I look at your work, I think of the, the image first and then the technical is like four or five down the road for me.

And I know you're, you're, you love the technical.

I've never heard anyone talk like so fluently technically, but also have that ability to like, you know, switch back into, I guess, layman, layman speak for the, for the folks that may not be so technically in tune, but there is that there is this technical aspect to your, to your work when you're taking photographs.

Like, what comes first?

Is it the chicken or the egg?

Is it the technical or the filling?

Yeah.

Well, I'll apologize first.

You've probably been on, probably been on the receiving end of a lot of info dump sessions on my part.

I know Liam here, definitely I love him and I'm not gonna apologize cause asks me the questions.

But you don't necessarily ask.

No, I love it.

So I apologize for that.

But I don't know what comes first, the technical or the creative and the photo itself.

I think it's funny every time I get a, like if I get a new camera, new to me camera, or a new lens or any new equipment, I spend a lot of time trying to make it feel as comfortable to me as possible because I don't want to be thinking about the technical aspects while I'm out taking photos as much as I want to be thinking about what I'm trying to capture.

I don't play an instrument.

I'm not a musician.

But I would imagine it's kind of like if you're, I mean, I'm looking at Liam because you are, you do, you are a musician.

But I would imagine it's kind of like you're learning to play guitar.

So you're thinking about all the notes that you're playing.

And then once you get good enough and proficient enough, you aren't thinking about what your hands are doing.

They're kind of just doing it.

Like, I mean, it's like Language, Right.

Like when you're learning a new language, every word, every piece of grammar is like, thought out before you actually say it.

But then once you become fluent, it kind of just flows.

And you are technically, like, I'm gonna say correct, but I've had these conversations before.

But languages or linguists are descriptive, not prescriptive.

But when I say correct, I just mean, like, conventional grammar says that you're being correct, and that just comes second nature.

So you are like, the technical aspects of it are good, but you're not thinking about the technical aspects.

Even though if someone looks at it after what you said or what you wrote, they'll be like, oh, wow, this is technically correct.

But I think the goal was always to say what you wanted to say.

Yeah, well, and I think the way you're really describing so many of the things that you're doing both with learning the technical so you don't have to think about it.

And those choices of how to perceive the world falls into the world of intentionality.

Right.

That you're making purposeful choices to dive in to learn so much that you don't have to think about it, that you're trying to perceive things on purpose and not.

It's really hard to luck into greatness.

You can luck into being good.

You can't look into being great.

And I think that's part of that process of continually trying to learn more and more.

And that's always a decision that you have to make.

Definitely.

I remember when I.

So I won't go through my photography resume bio?

No, no, we want you to.

Oh, where does photography start for you?

Okay, well, then I'll include what I was about to say in all of that.

That's kind of funny.

Speaking of luck into, I view this as not a coincidence, but like, somewhat of a coincidence.

I've always enjoyed taking photos.

Like, I don't know, there are photos in my icloud photo library of just like taking photos of trees and the canopies I've always loved just like the silhouette of trees against the sky.

Like, that was always a photo I would take.

But then I never considered myself a photographer at all.

Welcome to behind the Glass.

Yeah, exactly.

And then I. I was watching.

So it was during COVID I was living alone.

I was basically house sitting at my uncle's house because he, I guess, for lack of a better word, got stuck in Japan with his family.

And so I was kind of house sitting for them.

My girlfriend at the time, fiance, now Jess, was in Boston at college.

So I Had this house to myself and I was watching the iPhone.

And they talked about like, oh, a new feature on this new phone is that you can now shoot raw photos.

I was like, oh, cool.

I think I know what that is.

Matter of fact, I think Jess has a camera that she got when we were like 14 for her birthday.

I should ask her if she still knows where that is and I can borrow it because that would be kind of fun to play around with.

So I asked her.

She's like, yeah, I think it's in my closet somewhere.

So I asked her if I could borrow it.

She said sure.

And then I started taking photos.

Went to the park, took some just terrible photos.

I mean like the worst photos I've ever taken, which I would hope so.

Cause they were like the first photos I had ever taken.

And terrible edit jobs.

I mean they were like, just obscene.

I was learning Lightroom at the same time.

It was terrible.

And then I just kept taking more photos.

Took a couple photos that I really liked.

I feel like a lot this might be a common experience for other photographers, but sometimes some of those first photos you take, you feel like you're never gonna take a better photo.

Like there's just.

It might be irrational, but there's something in there that's like, yeah, that's a, that's a good photo.

So, yeah, just kept taking photos.

And then after a couple years, I wanted to expand like just what I was taking photos of and how I was taking photos.

I was interested in like starting to shoot on film and so back to the intentionality part of it.

Before making the switch, I wanted to know what shooting on a manual focus and manual aperture lens would be like to see if it would be something that I would feel comfortable doing.

So I bought a manual focus, manual aperture lens for my digital camera with no autofocus.

Realized that, oh, okay, I can do this.

I like this.

This is.

This is attainable for me.

And then, well, that's when the gear acquisition syndrome started and I bought way too many cameras.

Gas for the uninitiated.

So yeah, and then it was just off to the races and learning as much as I could in as short an amount of time as possible.

And info.

Dumping all the information onto my fiance, Jesse.

Shout out and sorry, but I don't know, it's trying to be intentional about it at least.

There's also, you know, you.

You had mentioned in your.

The piece that we did about you on Substack you know, talking about the.

You know, how the Old Masters kind of shaped your eyes, you know, through European paintings, and, you know, how you, you know, sought to make some of that photography or some of it kind of stand out in some of your photography.

And I know, you know, some of my favorite stories are the ones when you're, you know, out at a museum and you're sharing some of your.

Your favorite works.

I love, like, paintings and just that that era of.

Of imaging, like, imagery is just so beautiful and so, like, you know, someone's, like, painting this, and it's like these, like, crazy scenes.

And every time you look at it, just like a really good photo, you notice something else.

You notice something differently or maybe something that you took, you thought was gonna be the prominent feature that people will look at becomes something else.

Like, you know, people are like, no, no.

Actually, I really love this detail in the corner that has nothing to do with what your intention was.

You know, what was that journey for you, like, with, you know, using, you know, these.

These European painters and going to museums and how that influences your work today?

That's such a good question, because I don't know the answer.

I was never an artistic person.

I mean, I grew up being an athlete, like, played three sports.

I mean, I was kind of the black sheep in the family.

And so far as my whole family are musicians, aside from, like, a couple people on my mom's side, everyone was, like, a musician or an artist of some kind, but I was the one who played sports.

And then I kind of got into photography.

It's like, oh, okay.

I guess I could do both.

Like, it's not a jocks versus creative type thing as we see, like, in those high school drama shows.

And so I just.

Yeah, I got into photography, got into art, realized that actually going to museums is kind of cool.

Funny story about going to museums.

My favorite museum in the world is the Met in New York.

I think if anyone's been to the Met and they say it's not their favorite museum, they better have a good museum that they're talking about instead, because it's genuinely, like, the greatest museum on the planet.

I love it so much.

And when I was, I don't know, I want to say, six years old.

Yeah, I think I was about six.

I was there with my family, and my uncle and I were walking, and we were walking by, like, a tour, a Torah group.

And he jokingly, but, like, I guess somewhat seriously said, like, kind of, like, shooed me along and was like, hurry up, let's like, walk past them before we learn anything, setting it as a joke.

But I still think about it years later, just because, like, that's a funny thing to say to a kid.

Like, no, don't learn anything about this.

But I've just.

Yeah, just going to museums, seeing all of the.

All of the amazing paintings that have been done or that are being done, it's just.

I don't want to say it's inspiring because it's not.

It's dejecting because I know I, like, physically can't paint or, like, draw.

I'm terrible at it.

But seeing the product of it is really inspiring because I know what it makes me feel when I see it.

And I guess my photos are me trying to make myself feel the same way as when I see a painting that I really like.

So which it feels.

Like.

It feels like that's never going to.

I'm never going to feel the same way.

But I have to tell myself, well, it's because, you know the process that went into it, so you're never going to feel like that.

But I guess sometimes I feel like Sisyphus in Lightroom, but, yeah, I'm Adobe Sisyphus.

It's also so rare where an artist feels great about the work that they've done, regardless of how good it is.

I can't tell you how many times I've watched my wife, like, create something, and she's like, it's not right.

I'm like, one.

If the.

The time is going to take you to get this from 95% of what you want to 100% might be the entire time it took you to get to 95%.

Yeah, but you know what they say.

It doesn't have to be finished.

It just has to be perfect.

Just has to be perfect.

But the perception of perfection is.

Is the thing that the artist sees the least.

Right.

Their.

Their perception of perfection is so far elevated over what the majority of people see the work as.

So.

Only thing I'll say is, like, yeah, it's.

Sometimes you have to.

You have to listen to others.

You can't just listen to your.

Not to say it should drive the direction of your work, but, like, when people give you real feedback, you're like, oh, you're like, I see the blur on the edges.

I see this, I see that.

And they're like, well, this hit me emotionally.

And you're like, yeah, but you don't see all the problems with it.

Yeah, no, I don't care how it hit you.

I want it to Hit me.

Right?

It's funny, you know, we had talked about this particular pairing, and I.

You know, I've always wanted you to be in Beyond a Glass, but it was always about the right moment.

But I knew you would never feel that the moment was right.

Like, I just felt like that was, you know, in conversation.

It was just like, yeah, maybe.

Maybe right now is not the right moment.

And then I think I. Transparent.

Yeah, yeah.

I'm pretty decent at reading, folks.

But I thought the.

I think I walked into Ugly Duck, and you guys were having a conversation one day, like, kind of waved over at you.

And then.

I don't.

I think it was before.

I think that was before you guys had the show, that group show at the.

I forgot the name of the gallery.

The.

The one on Goodman.

Gallery 31.

Yeah, Gallery 31.

I don't know if that was before or after, but I remember seeing.

That was probably before.

Yeah, that's well before.

Yeah.

So I seen you guys having coffee, and then I saw Gallery 31.

I think it was in that order.

And then I saw your work together, and I said, oh, this would be a great pairing.

And then I think we were doing a photo walk, and Noah said to me, it was a good thing you picked Liam.

Liam hates his photos just as much as I do.

And I was like, yeah, I think maybe this was a good pairing.

It just kind of works.

But I think, you know, when.

When you think of your.

Your own work, and I. I struggle with it all the time.

You know, I think people see and say, oh, well, Q is confident.

He does that.

Man, I could be the further from.

I'm really good at cosplaying.

Right.

And I play.

I play confident on tv, if you will.

But it's the.

I think, to me, sometimes I just almost like that example you had given.

You know, take your hearing aids out for a moment and not listen to the noise that is around you or even your.

Your inner thoughts and kind of how people feel about it.

And, you know, Rob does this.

You know, I'm reading it right now.

You know, there's this, you know, solitude and stillness are there threads that you follow in your work, and it's not just in your images, but how you hope people feel when they stand before them.

And I watch people.

You know, I always watch people.

It's.

It's one of my.

I don't know if it's a toxic trait or a good.

I don't know.

But I like to, you know, see how people interact with things.

And I watch Folks interact with your.

Your work on opening day, and we'll.

We'll talk a little bit about, you know, those.

Those pieces in just a second.

But it was this beautiful interaction.

And then when you threw out that little nugget about which one is digital as opposed to film, and people are like, wait, Noah shoots digital?

I thought he only did film shots.

And I was like, yeah, I know.

Everything can't.

Everything's not film that he takes.

What was that experience like having your work on the wall at behind the Glass?

I know you've had it up previously other places, but what was it like to be there?

And then also how it felt for folks to interact and ask questions, Especially that digital question.

It was really nice.

It felt.

I don't want to say rewarding, but it definitely felt, well, rewarding.

I'll say it when I.

Long story short, or medium.

When.

So I went to rit, graduated, moved back to Connecticut, and then came back like a year later for Jess to do her master's at ritual.

And when I got here, I don't know what possessed me to think it was a good idea, even though it was pat myself on the back, to just go all out and getting involved in the photography community.

I think it was probably, you know, when you're in college, it's obviously, like, to yourself, it's obviously temporary that you're moving away from home.

But then after you graduate now you're, like, on your way to being an adult, I guess.

And then you move away from home, and then that realization hits of like, oh, yeah, I'm alone.

There's no family within five hours of me.

I need to make friends that aren't, like, just the friends that I had in college.

So I just started, like, going to every photography event that I could find, like, online.

The first one I went to was your show.

And I remember I went.

Cause I just wanted to talk to you.

I thought you were, like, cool and interesting.

I went to that show.

You heard him say thought but not thinks.

I'm just joking.

I was gonna say, that makes one of us.

That feels fun.

I thought at the time you were an interesting person.

I have since learned that you still are.

And so I went there.

I think that was the first time I had ever seen Richard, too.

Didn't end up talking to either of you.

You were, like, way too busy.

It was the opening, and then I can't remember if I messaged you after the fact saying, like, oh, it was great to see your show.

I would love to come by and talk with you, or if I just kind of showed up, hoping you'd be.

There, I think you came back.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, I just.

I went back and we talked for, like, 30, 40 minutes or whatever.

And then I called Jess, like, on my way home.

I was like, it was great.

Like, I was talking to another photographer about photos, and it was, like, really cool.

That's the first time I've ever done that.

Like, I just, like, felt hopeful, right, that, like, us being here was the right thing.

And then ever since then, like you've said earlier, I just, like, try to go to everything, like, make new friends, support friends with, like, at their shows and stuff like that.

I don't remember the question you asked.

I think that was the answer.

Okay.

I don't know.

It was a good journey.

But, yeah, I think my advice to you after the end of that whole conversation that we had was just keep going out.

And, I mean, I think our stories are similar in that, you know, when I moved here, I moved here with my girlfriend at the time, then became fiance, then wife.

But I.

One day I decided I was just going to go out because I needed to make friends.

Like, it was the same thing.

I was like, I'm here and my friends are five hours away that I'm used to talking to.

And anytime I want to do something, I remember telling Chris about this.

I was just getting on a train or a car, and I would go, and I'm like, I'm driving five hours every time I want to do something fun.

This is silly, right?

Like, there's got to be something here.

And then, you know, that's kind of when I got involved with art and then photography and then, you know, really so many other folks.

So it's also the single most valuable thing you can do is be a part of a community.

And not.

It's not just about finding, like, that those friends necessarily, but feeling like you're part of something that's bigger than you is so valuable, especially if you're someone like me who doesn't have, like.

Doesn't have religion, doesn't have other things like that.

Like, this is.

These communities are so important to be around people that are just trying to do cool things, like, and being involved.

For me, it was food and drink that made a big impact on my life.

You're writing and doing that.

But showing up, that's the thing we tell people so many times is the thing you do most that matters is show up, is be there in person, contribute, be a part of the thing yeah, it's super valuable, sir.

Thank you.

It's interesting because.

And I say this to anyone listening who, for some reason, selfishly doesn't want to put themselves out there.

And I'm saying this disclaimer, this is the selfish reason to do it, is that you feel so much more confident.

Like, before I had a hobby.

I mean, like I said, I played sports and stuff, but before I had a hobby, I like.

I mean, I still don't necessarily consider myself to be a confident person, but when I'm in this photography community or I go to a photo walk, like in New York, in the city, and I don't know anyone or like, I know one or two people there, I still feel confident because, like, in my head, I have this, like, my work to fall back on.

It's like that meme of the guy in the corner with the.

With the cup of water, whatever.

It's like they don't know I know this.

So it's like.

Like I can feel confident.

It's like they don't know that.

Like, I take photos too.

Yeah.

But so, again, selfishly, that's a really good reason to put yourself out there unselfishly.

It's really nice to be a member of a community and also to see how you're impacting others, how other people are impacting you, and to see how other people impact each other for sure.

Well, thank you for sharing that story and thank you for sharing your work.

And I know as I pivot here to Liam, the photo of Jess in the gallery is beautiful.

I've always loved that photo, the silhouette.

And when we talk about the portraits and the painters, that's one of those photos that really makes me think of being in an art gallery.

Like, seeing that.

And there's.

There's no color.

I mean, there is color.

I know it's a color photograph, but you don't get hit with all of, like, you.

You're one with yourself.

And I remember.

I think it was your mom.

It was a couple people I. I pointed this out to, but it was.

Your mom was trying to take a photo, and she's like, oh, I can't.

It's just kind of this reflection.

And I was like, the cool thing about this photo is that you're reflected in it, that you're.

You become a part of that image.

You become a part of, you know, what he was feeling and what he was going through, I think.

Right.

And that's how you.

That's how people see all art.

It's.

You're Kind of making an assumption about the artist.

And she took the photo with her as the reflection, which I thought was kind of cool.

That's a great way to absolve me of being too cheap to use museum glass.

I appreciate it.

Listen, I've been at the counter and someone says, museum glass.

I said, how much?

You know, what, you go with the regular or plexi, Whichever one.

Whichever one works for you.

Artistic choices.

Yeah, that's what it is.

Listen, museum glass, it gives it a look, but man, does it.

It hits you differently when the bottom line comes along.

All right, thank you, Noah.

So, Liam, welcome to.

Welcome to the show.

Welcome to Behind a Glass.

You know, I love in your intro, it says, currently Rochester based.

Yeah.

So tell us.

Tell us a little bit about your journey to.

To Rochester.

It's been a.

A long one.

Rochester.

In my life.

It's my eighth move.

Starting when I was five, I've lived in, including the US Three countries and seven states now.

Oh, wow.

So I've been.

I've been bouncing around a while.

Still got a few left to go, I think, before I'm settled anywhere but here.

I'm trying.

I'm trying.

Yeah.

So before Rochester, I was out in Madison, Wisconsin.

That was right after I graduated college.

I went to college in Virginia.

I was in Virginia for seven years.

So that's home base right now.

That's where my family is.

And really, it was.

There's kind of a split there between why I needed to move around before and why I move now.

Because everything up through college was like a familial thing.

That was my dad's job, had us going everywhere.

So graduating university out to Wisconsin was the first time.

It was like, this is for me.

I was out.

It was.

It was.

Relationship took me out there.

Didn't quite work out.

And so I was out 12 hours from anything I knew and was familiar with.

And I was like, oh, shit, sorry.

No, you can curse on it.

This is an adult program.

Yes.

I had.

I had that moment.

I was like, I don't have, like, a driving thing directing where I go next.

I can go wherever I want.

DC Was expensive.

Didn't want to go back there.

And so I landed on Rochester.

I had a friend who graduated college, moved up to Rochester for their first job.

They're like, hey, you know, maybe consider it.

So I took a look at it and like, everything.

Everything I learned to appreciate about Madison felt like Rochester.

But Rochester, I was born in Manhattan.

I've never lived in the city, but, like, east coast is What I identify as home.

And so Rochester was like my east coast Madison.

So I was like,.

What did you go to school for?

Computer science.

Computer science.

When did photography kind of come become part of your journey?

High school.

High school.

My dad did photography.

He used to make a little money on the side while he was in college, selling, like, flower prints and stuff.

And at first it started as a tech thing, going back to, like, what you're thinking about the technical versus the artistic side.

For me, it started almost completely technical.

I was into computers, and so I was into digital cameras in the same way I was into computers.

And it was maybe six years before I was like, okay, this is something I can do more with than just pixel, peep and get excited about the latest sensors anymore.

And so, yeah, that's the last three, four years is where the art has started and come from.

You call your work the little things, like how you.

These details in your work, and also these quiet moments kind of similar to Noah, when you see the work in the gallery and I don't know if you guys had conferred before you put the pieces up, but they speak to each other.

There's a language that's happening, and the language is, you know, quiet, calm, but very tuned in on details.

And so the little things.

Can you tell us a little bit about, you know, what that means and how it translates to your work?

I think it just comes from how I am.

I'm coming up on the end of my first year in Rochester, and.

If.

You've met me here, it's like a far cry from the person I've historically been.

Very, very reserved, very low key.

And so it's really just a reflection of that.

There's things to still be seen in quiet moments.

And I think that's something I've reflected on a lot more with regard to street photography at large is a lot of people, I think, have gravitated towards more like New York City stuff, where the cacophony, the energy is what draws them in.

But when I was getting into street photography, it was, you know, Joel Merowitz, Stephen Shore, William Eggleston, who were doing something with more everyday stuff.

Right.

You can't walk down the street and run into a parade every day of your life unless you live somewhere like New York.

But that doesn't mean there's not anything to see.

And that's the importance of it to me is I. I appreciate that.

And photography helps me continue to appreciate that and not forget about it.

That's interesting.

Yeah.

The.

The one point you Know, just that, you know, working with your surroundings.

I think a lot of people say street photography, and immediately they want to create those images from big cities.

Right.

They want to create those like, in your face.

Like, look at this.

Like, I'm using a flat.

Like, there's a lot of things, but you're not going to see that every day in Roger.

Like, you're not going to see, you know, businessmen walking up and down Main street, you know, on their way to the subway or to the bus or to their jobs.

Like, there's, there's these different images and I, I feel like that translates and it kind of comes back to your original piece of being moving around and finding your place in each of those.

Those areas.

Do you feel like you've.

You found some sort of home in Rochester and how you.

Yeah,.

It's been a long time since I've felt anywhere near as myself as I've felt in Rochester.

Again, being a part of a community, being a part of something bigger than yourself, that drives a purpose.

I think that was the thing that made me appreciate being out of the D.C. area was the D.C. area is.

So there's a lot of pressure in.

Kind of numbs you to the pace.

It numbs you to the very grindy, exhausting, you know, lifestyle that it takes to live in a bigger city and to really slow down, to kind of, you know, step out the door.

And it's like I can feel the stuff around me through my souls.

It's.

It's so important to learn how to feel that or find a place that teaches you how to feel that.

Because especially these days, it feels like the paces, go, go, go, go.

And you just can't keep going like that.

Well, there's also this anonymizing thing that the big cities offer, but it's the kind of thing as not, not to stereotype.

How old are you guys?

26.

So there's.

There's something to be said.

There's this anonymizing thing that is comforting when you don't want to be seen.

Yeah, you want to be.

You want to feel that energy.

You don't want to be seen as a person.

And there's something about, you know, cities like Rochester where there's this opportunity to be seen, to be more visible because you don't have to be the street photographer in New York City to be seen there.

You're just doing it.

And nobody's.

Nobody can ever, nobody ever know you're doing it.

Yeah.

And here you can be in a gallery and have 100 people go see it, you know, just because, you know, people are paying attention to a smaller pool of people.

Yeah, it's.

It's the thing that's easiest to say with time that I think, you know, Q and I can say at this, at our age is that it's the thing that's most valuable is eventually knowing yourself.

Right.

And part of doing that is participating, putting yourself out there, being visible and learning how to.

Learning how you fit in all these things.

And what can I contribute?

What am I actually good at?

Yeah.

And what makes me feel good about doing these things.

And it's not that it's not self aggrandizing.

It's not, it's not thinking you're better than you are.

It's really embracing your strengths and figuring out how to be part of something bigger than yourself.

So how have you found, how have you found that being a little more visible and you know, coming out of yourself a little bit more and being part of a group,.

It's been refreshing.

I feel like a lot of the photographers that I meet are newer photographers, you know, coming out of COVID They picked it up in lockdown and stuff like that.

And so something that's always driven my desire to try and interact with photography communities is to find peers.

Noel, I'm sure can.

Can tell you it's hard at a certain point to find people with the right vocabulary to continue to drive you forward.

Well, that's a real collaboration.

We talked about that on one of the shows a long time ago.

The differences between how we can do this together.

But real collaboration is hard to find and that's, you know, I know Q can speak about that, but having like a real collaborator and Richard.

Right.

That the value of having a real collaborator doesn't have to be forever, but that it's one of those super valuable things.

Yeah, so that was, that was like the main thing that I had started going to photo walks and stuff for was to see who's around, who can I.

Who can I try to surround myself with, to continue to learn and grow?

And I think there's a point where you kind of flip.

You realize, okay, these are the people who I can turn to to sort of seek guidance, seek again, seek peers from.

And you start to see your place in growing the community and being that person for others and it becomes a more social thing.

Less of a technical pursuit anymore.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, I spend most of my time on photo walks just talking or taking photographs, other photographers so I could have the information or the Pieces for later for a post kind of shout.

Folks out, but Quadra to now special.

Yeah.

The unwanted selfie.

Yeah, I get you sometimes, but it's, you know, it is that finding the, you know, folks to have in the community of, you know, just being around people.

And I, you know, when you were talking about the, you know, living in D.C. my four years prior to Rochester were D.C. and, you know, I was on that grind.

I remember moving around and just loving it, but also remember not really being able to breathe.

Like, it was like, man, you go to something and you knew, you know, you want to go and see the cherry blossoms, like it was going to be a thing.

Yeah.

But you can go see the Lilac Festival and not feel that same.

Like, you know, people are coming from all over the world just the same, but it's not that same level of being overwhelmed by it.

You know, going to a festival, going to, you know, Rochester feels like the capital of festivals, man, every weekend and, you know, during the spring and summer and early part of fall is festivals.

But you don't always.

You don't never feel like, wow, this is like, I can't move.

I can't be comfortable.

Yeah.

And then being able to create in.

In those spaces or just enjoying yourself.

And so, you know, I definitely, that.

That resonates, you know, a lot with me as well.

And, you know, once you kind of look around, it's amazing.

You know, I.

When you said coming up on a year, man, I felt like you've been here a lot longer, especially, you know, based on, you know, some of the reaction that folks had to you showing.

And people were like, oh, that's my boy.

That's my boy, Liam.

I know Liam.

And I think the first time we officially met was like, well, after I'd asked you to be a part of beyond the Glass, you were coming out of one of the Golden Supply last Friday shows, and I was like, oh, hey, Liam, I'm Q.

And you're like, oh, yeah.

And then that was our meeting.

But I had known the work.

I'd, you know, known what you were doing and, you know, you know, thought that this would be a great pairing, you know, kind of similar to Noah.

You know, he found his, you know, some of his inspiration and paintings.

You found some of yours in horror movies.

Is that.

Or the kind of that influence of, you know, the cinematic and, you know, those pieces?

Not.

Not exactly.

I get a lot of my photographic inspiration from photography and film broadly.

I think for street specifically, it is so important to be paying attention to be empathetic, to be able to tune in to what's going on around you.

And that's where the horror piece came in, was it takes a lot of looking into a different perspective to really appreciate what's going on in any of the best horror movies.

And so it's more of a practice of that, that aspect is staying in tune with other people's perspectives.

Staying in tune with just the practice of paying attention to, okay, what, what, what is being communicated from someone else's eyes.

And that, that's so important in being successful in any, any genre of photography.

But I think street, particularly because it's, you know, you gotta, you gotta be paying attention.

Any second something could happen.

And it's, it's.

To recognize when it's saying something.

To recognize what it's saying takes paying attention to people.

Are there any specific horror movies that spoke to you when it comes to, like, the framing or, or even just the emotions that you're, that you're getting at?

Alien was my, my favorite for a long time, but I actually just saw obsession, and I think it's been, it's been dethroned.

I mean, Aliens got this beautiful, claustrophobic, visceral thing with that, the dripping and the, you know, all those.

When you're talking about little things, all those little aspects that feel.

Just everything feels like it could be danger at any moment.

Yeah, yeah.

And there's.

That's, that's one of the best parts about.

I, I'll tell anyone.

Alien is one of the most perfect movies ever made.

There's, there's very few, if anything, details like that that are wasted.

I mean, you think about the world building that exists on the ship alone.

Right.

It tells a story of how dangerous it is to be out in space.

Like the ship itself is a weapon.

You know, other entries, they go through those, like, maintenance hatches, whatever.

And there, there are those.

It's.

It's an aperture.

Yeah.

And you, you look at that and you're like, man, you get caught in that, you're done.

Like, it's, it's just to be out there is, is something else.

Well, then it's class struggle too, right?

It's like we talk like, oh, parasites, this beautiful thing.

Quest struggle.

Like Alien also did class struggle.

Yeah.

The whole thing was about just profit over people and, you know, and that, oh, they're.

These are just maintenance people.

Who cares what happens to them?

And it's those things and where all those little things add up to a bigger hole, which is pretty special.

When you think about all the little things it takes to take a photograph.

You know, like, every single thing needs to be right.

Yeah.

For it to have been a bigger thought, a complete thought.

Yeah.

It's interesting that, you know, as we begin to wrap up this segment here, you know, you talk about the little things and you talk about, you know, no wasted details.

And one of the.

One of my favorite photos in your.

The show that you have up right now with beyond the Glass is the image of the two people swimming.

And what's so great about that image of the two people swimming is you don't see them initially because you're so caught up in the brush, all of the things that are around them.

And so you just assume that that's part of the scenery.

You assume that that's part of the brush or twig or.

Or something.

And then your eye focuses out and you're like, wait, that's a person swimming.

That's another person.

And, you know, they're kind of almost perfectly composed on separate ends of that.

That image.

But it's those little things.

It's the not wasting a detail, you know, that image.

And it's kind of similar to what I was talking about with Noah.

You know, how, you know, you look at something for the first time, a painting for the first time, and then you revisit it, and then you revisit it again and you notice those things, and it's just a.

It's just a beautiful.

And beautiful.

I mean, all of the images are beautiful, but that one, you know, and I was like, wait.

Someone was like, it's a person.

It's people.

And I was like, what.

What are you talking.

I looked at this.

I hung this.

Like, I looked at this a million times.

I made sure to.

What are you talking about?

And so it's a really, really great image.

Thank you.

I thought there was only one person in the photo when I first saw it.

Yeah.

Not proud to say.

I'll admit it.

I thought it was stick.

So, I mean, I think you're one up.

So we're going to take a quick commercial break, and then we're going to come back and, you know, kind of wrap up with, you know, where can you find these guys?

And, you know, the overarching.

What do you.

What.

What do they want folks to feel about their work that's.

That's currently on display and if they have anything coming up?

So we'll be right back.

All right, we are back.

And so as we.

We end this.

This episode, great conversation, and definitely Enjoyed hearing more about you, your work and your journey.

But where, where can folks find, you know, where can, where can folks find you?

Online,.

Primarily Instagram.

It's Noah H. Fox.

That would be N O A H H F O X. I mean, that's my handle on everything.

But don't look too hard.

Yeah.

You have anything coming up?

Any shows or any other.

Just a wedding.

Yeah.

No, nothing.

No, no photography related things, but yeah.

Got the wedding.

Shout out.

Jesse.

Shout out the wedding.

Shout out.

Joan of Arc painting by Jules Bastien La Page.

My favorite painting, also at the Met.

My favorite museum.

Only wedding advice I will give is make it the most you two, you can make it.

Don't worry about what everybody else wants.

Make it the most you, you can make it.

Because hopefully you're only doing it once and you're making it like, just make it.

It's your day.

It's not about the auspices of what everybody else wants out of a wedding.

Make it the most you.

You can make it.

Yeah.

My advice is I'm ordained and I can just do it for you.

We already have someone doing it.

I mean, I mean, if the pressure becomes a thing and you're like, hey, you know what, let's just get married.

Kind of like Pam and Jim on the office.

Like, I could just.

You just have to have the paperwork I can sign.

All good.

I'll think about it.

I know, I know.

One of us would really not be happy.

I will think about it.

Yeah, one of us that's not named Noah.

And then the last question is, you know, someone's hesitating about joining the next photo walk.

You know, they're hesitating about coming out because they don't think that they're a real photographer.

What do you say to them?

Well, the nice thing to say is who cares?

The mean thing to say is shut up.

Like, if you want to be a.

Photographer, you're a photographer.

Yeah.

No, it's just, who cares if you're, if you feel like you're a photographer or not?

I didn't feel like I was a photographer until, I don't know, like a year or two ago.

And I still don't feel like I'm a photographer because, like, I don't know, I've never sold anything.

So that feels like the benchmark for when you become a photographer.

But like, this community is so great.

I mean, it's unlike any community I've ever been a part of.

And everyone is so nice and the people that aren't really nice or Supportive.

You see them a couple times and then you don't see them again.

Because, like, this is the.

This group is for the nice people, which is.

It's really nice.

Awesome.

So, Liam, where can folks find you?

Same.

Same thing.

Instagram.

Boxcam, Beckett, B E C K E T. Boxcam, Beckett, B E C K E T T. You know, the first.

Time I saw your handle and I didn't have now have a new prescription so I can see a lot better.

But I thought it said boxcar.

And I was like, that's interesting.

And then it took me a little while.

I was like, no, that's not it.

Because I think I was trying to find you and I' why isn't it coming up?

Boxcar.

Boxcar.

Boxcar.

And I was like, no, it's not box camp.

Got it.

Where's this hobo style photography?

Brody's already done all that.

Do you have anything coming up?

Photography?

No, just been trying to get back into the swing of habit after the winter.

Hopefully by the end of the summer, I'm.

I want to get a portfolio site up.

Awesome.

Maybe I have that and the same question for you.

You know, someone's hesitating about, you know, joining a photo walk or DMing someone to have that cup of coffee to sit down and just kind of talk through, you know, advice that they have, but they're hesitant.

They don't, you know, they don't think of themselves as a real photographer.

What's that advice that you're giving to them?

Definitely, definitely, definitely.

For trying to find local people DM who you want to dm.

That's how Noah and I met.

That's how I've met a lot of the other.

That's how I first started meeting a lot of the other people in this community and then go on the photo walks just to.

Just to learn.

There's so much you pick up just listening to people talk about it and it'll really push you forward.

Yeah, it's something that changes everything.

Not necessarily photography, but your life.

I think photography for me was that thing where I had that moment where I was like, you know, people.

People ask you or someone asked me why I do it.

Because street photography is so like 90% bust on going out and getting the thing you care about.

And I had never asked myself that question, but I realized it was.

It was the first thing that made me feel or made me see that I could make something beautiful, make something artistic that could be appreciated.

So even if it's not photography, whatever, whatever art thing you're you're on the fence about starting, do it.

Awesome.

Yeah.

So thank you.

Thank you both for being a part of Beyond a Glass.

I always say to our folks, thanks for saying yes.

It sounds silly, but I think it's important to always acknowledge that you could have said no.

You could have, you know, hesitate, hesitated, but you said yes.

And you're a part of this and, you know, now part of a larger collective of folks that have all said yes before you.

And if you have someone out there thinking about saying no, you know, encouraging, encouraging them to say that yes is super important.

So thank you so much.

Thank you.

Yeah.

And make sure if you want to check out other things going on in Rochester, check out some of the other shows on the Lunchadore Podcast Network.

My show, Food About Town is kicking off, I think within the next week.

I've got at least three episodes recorded.

Trying to really focus on a lot of the small minority owned restaurants I worked with with Nominate and some of the guests I've never had on because I'm terrible at booking people.

So stay tuned for that.

And also our new show, Reader's Advisory.

Rochester's Book Club should be starting up in the next month with four local librarians.

I'm super excited for everybody to start hearing that.

But in the meantime, go out in the streets, take some pictures, and we'll see you next time.

Behind the glass.

This has been a presentation of the Lunchadore Podcast Network.

26.

Ugh.