Bill Eschenbaugh, our esteemed guest today, offers a profound connection to the Civil War, having been raised in the very farmhouse built by his great-grandfather in 1890. This ancestral lineage is enriched by the history of his forebears, including one who fought valiantly with the 14th Pennsylvania Cavalry at Gettysburg, while another tragically perished in the notorious Andersonville prison. Through his novel, "Up the Shenandoah," Eschenbaugh narrates the poignant journey of a young man striving to safeguard his family farm amidst the tumult of war, encapsulating the essence of duty, faith, and the moral imperatives that motivated those who lived through such turbulent times. His work serves as a vital reminder of the enduring significance of our historical narratives and their relevance to contemporary life. We invite you to immerse yourself in this discussion that traverses the realms of history, heritage, and personal storytelling, as we welcome Bill Eschenbaugh.

On this episode of Spirits and Stories, Donald sits down with author and historian Bill Eschenbaugh, a man whose roots run deep into the soil of American history. Bill wasn’t just raised around Civil War stories—he was raised in them. Growing up in the very Pennsylvania farmhouse built by his great-grandfather, Bill inherited more than land; he inherited legacy.

With ancestors who served in multiple regiments—including one who never returned home from the horrors of Andersonville Prison—Bill brings firsthand family accounts, battlefield insights, and generational memories that textbooks simply can’t capture.

In this powerful conversation, Bill and Donald explore:

• Life on a farm where every field held echoes of the past
• The harrowing realities Union soldiers faced on the march, in the snow, and under fire
• The moral, spiritual, and patriotic motivations of Northern soldiers
• Bill’s deep dive into ancestry research that uncovered centuries of family service
• How his novel Up the Shenandoah brings his family’s Civil War story to life
• The rugged resilience, sacrifice, and everyday humanity of men who answered Lincoln’s call

Bill’s stories remind us that history isn’t something we read—it’s something we inherit. And in this episode, listeners get a rare look at the Civil War through the eyes of a family that lived it, survived it, and carried its lessons forward.

Pull up a chair, pour a drink, and settle in for a journey through courage, hardship, and the unbroken American spirit.

Bill Eschenbaugh, a remarkable guest on our podcast, embodies a unique connection to history, particularly the Civil War. Raised in the farmhouse built by his great-grandfather in 1890, Bill's lineage is steeped in military tradition, with his ancestors having fought valiantly in pivotal battles, including Gettysburg. This profound familial history has not only informed his identity but also inspired his literary work, particularly his novel 'Up the Shenandoah'. Through the lens of a 16-year-old protagonist, Will Eschenbaugh, Bill narrates the struggles faced by young men during the tumultuous times of the Civil War, exploring themes of duty, sacrifice, and the moral imperatives that drove many to the battlefield. The novel serves as a bridge connecting modern readers to the valor and convictions of those who came before us, reminding us that the echoes of history still resonate in our contemporary lives.

As we delve deeper into the conversation, Bill shares poignant anecdotes about growing up on the family farm, where stories of his ancestors' hardships and triumphs were commonplace. He recounts how the land itself holds memories, from encounters with Native American history to the challenges of transforming a wild landscape into productive farmland. Bill's narrative is enriched by his personal experiences and the spiritual connection he feels to the land, evoking a sense of place that is palpably tied to his family's legacy. By intertwining personal history with broader historical themes, Bill not only educates but also engages listeners in a dialogue about the importance of understanding our roots and the sacrifices made by previous generations.

In our discussion, we also explore the broader implications of the Civil War and the moral complexities that accompanied it. Bill articulates the varied motivations of soldiers on both sides, emphasizing that while many were driven by a sense of duty to their country, others were influenced by the socio-economic realities of the time. He reflects on the duality of the conflict, where patriotism and moral duty intersected with the harsh realities of war. This nuanced understanding encourages listeners to contemplate the legacy of the Civil War in shaping contemporary American society. Bill Eschenbaugh's insights not only illuminate the past but also inspire a deeper appreciation for the values of courage and conviction that continue to shape our national identity today.

Takeaways:

• The podcast features Bill Eschenbaugh, who eloquently recounts his familial ties to the Civil War, emphasizing the depth of his historical knowledge.
• Raised in the same farmhouse as his great grandfather, Bill offers a unique perspective shaped by personal history and family stories.
• His novel, 'Up the Shenandoah', tells the poignant tale of a young man navigating war's complexities while trying to protect his family farm.
• Bill’s narrative connects modern life with past convictions, illustrating the enduring influence of the Moravian Church’s abolitionist beliefs.
• The episode underscores the importance of understanding history, particularly how familial legacies shape our identities and values today.
• Listeners are encouraged to reflect on how the sacrifices of those who fought in the Civil War continue to resonate in contemporary society.

Links referenced in this episode:

• thedirtdog.com

Do you have a story that needs told, Reach out here to be a guest: https://www.podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/1749520244560583e16c8276d

Today's guest brings history to life in a way few can.

His great grandfather Andrew fought with the 14th Pennsylvania Cavalry at Gettysburg.

Two other ancestors served in different regiments.

One never came home, dying in the infamous Andersonville prison.

Bill has walked the same where they rode and fought from Winchester through the Shenandoah Valley to Richmond, giving him a perspective that no classroom can teach.

His novel up the Shenandoah tells that story through the eyes of 16 year old will Eschenbaugh, a young man struggling to protect his family farm before joining his father on the battlefield.

Rooted in generations of faith, duty and the Moravian Church's abolitionist beliefs, Bill's work connects our modern lives to the courage and conviction of those who came before us.

He's not just a novelist, he's a storyteller, bridging the gap between history and heritage, reminding us why the past still matters today.

Please welcome Bill Eschenbaugh.

Hey, good afternoon, Bill.

Welcome to the show.

Good afternoon.

Good to be on.

Thank you.

Yeah.

So why don't we dig into a little bit because this is going to be a very fascinating episode.

I love history, especially military history, and I, a lot of my listeners are going to resonate with this as well.

So I'm kind of excited.

Let's start out a little bit about what was life growing up with your grandfather and the stories you may have heard.

Well, I grew up on a farm.

My dad was 52 days before I was born.

Oh, okay.

So we, we cover a large generation.

My dad had obviously a great connection to that whole history.

Our family farm actually came to us as a result of an early ancestors service in the Revolutionary War.

And he was a private.

And so, you know, the Continental army had no pay from the Continental Congress and they said, look, you can get paid if you take land out there.

And out there was the other end of Pennsylvania from Philadelphia and, and all that.

So I grew up on that.

My dad, because he grew up in the age of horses, had a collection of arrowheads, for example, because he walked behind his plow and there were Seneca Indians who had obviously had encampments on some of our land.

So I just was always thrilled to Think that, wow.

Only 100 years before my dad was born, perhaps the Senecas were camped here on the cornfield.

So it was just a spiritual sort of thing to be tied to the land and listen to the stories and how even down to my father's generation, they were still clearing it because it had huge oak trees on it.

And in the wintertime they would cut down trees, they would use dynamite to blow out stumps and burn them out.

And then all those burnt ashes became fertilizer on the field.

So it was just very integrated process of changing forested land into farmland.

Yeah.

You know, it's kind of sad because it seems like a lot of our younger generation has.

Has not really put the thought into, for example, that phrase you meant out there.

You know, nowadays they get in their car, they can drive through civilization all the way to California if they wanted to, you know, but back then out there meant the unknown and the unprotected and a lot of other new things that they're gonna have to find and figure out.

You're kind of cut off from resources.

So this isn't for the faint hearted that that says, okay, I'll take some land out there.

One of one of the stories that I've read in the history of Butler county, which is where our farm is located, was as they established their fields, they had a hard time protecting them from the bear deer and everything else that wanted to eat their crops.

And so they organized two teams of 30 hunters each.

They went out in the field for a week and their competition was that the winners got a meal cooked by the losers on how many animals they harvested.

I don't know what all the animals were, I don't know that part.

But you think about that.

They had a single shot gun that you had to load with the ball and you know, put the powder in all this kind of stuff.

That 30 people killed, an average of 100 each of the animals.

Yeah.

Okay.

In six days, that's 15 to 20 per person every day.

Holy moly.

That's all.

That's a lot of shooting.

And I'm guessing the animals weren't particularly gunshot at that point.

You know, that the bang.

What was that noise?

You know, not like today, if you shoot a deer, the rest of them are gone, you know.

Yeah.

Because they know that's dangerous.

So it's just, just interesting to.

Trying to figure out some of that out.

Yeah.

And, and especially if you're a hunter you got to be asking yourself, you know, to shoot a bear with a musket, man, that, that's ballsy.

You're.

You literally are only getting one shot, not just a wound, but to kill.

Because it will be on you by the time you get it reloaded.

I would rethink that.

Even with a 30 odd six today, I'd probably want something a little bigger.

You know, I got a 44 mag sitting over in the corner here.

Maybe.

44 mag at close range, you know, but something like that.

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

So, you know, it is very fascinating about how the Civil War happened and, and, and I was just recently up to Gettysburg for a paranormal convention.

We set up a booth for our non profit up there and man, it just, it just feels so.

In tune, I guess is the word for, you know, when you're walking on the land that, that people had fought.

I mean, you know, after that war, the grass was no longer green, it was red and there was blood everywhere and a lot of death.

But just to be on those grounds and to think about how brave those, those young men at that time were, were fighting and for their beliefs, right or wrong, on whichever side they, they still had this ambition that their side was right and, and they've stood up for their, their thought process and their way of life and, and fought.

I can't even imagine how you feel in your house.

I mean, with, with the ties that, that come to these stories.

You know, can, can you explain a little bit about what was it like when you decided, you know what, this is something that needs to be shared.

We need to not just, you know, keep this in our family stories and our legacy and, and keep it as diner talk, but the world needs to know about this.

And, and so what was that like when you decided to start coming out with this?

Well, a couple things.

I.

A few years ago, and maybe seven or eight, nine, I came here now.

I decided to do the family history.

And so I had a place in Utah.

I went and spent time with the, the church out there who's, you know, ancestry.com is maybe one of the greatest resources for something like that.

And that evolved into 700 and some odd pages of family history.

Put that together.

I hired someone from the church to do a family tree.

And it just kept getting bigger and bigger as we found more and more people on it.

And I put that together and I made a copy of it for my brother who was still alive then, both my sisters and in my mentor in life, my cousin, who was a little bit older than me.

And each of them proudly displayed that family tree in their house.

And we now have little eight, nine year olds going, well, can somebody tell me who that was way up on the top up there?

You know, so it's kind of nice that it's a visual for them.

Yeah.

So, yeah, that really stimulated more interest in it.

And then.

Three or four years ago, right after Covid, I guess, I decided that I needed not to waste this information.

So I put together a compendium of each of the grays that I could remember in Pennsylvania in our family cemeteries.

There were two out there.

And just, okay, here's.

Here's Andrew, who's one of the main people in this book.

Here's his history.

Here's his son William, another one of the people in the protagonist in the book.

And so I did a little.

And then I did a family graveyard crawl and I invite them all to Pennsylvania.

We had the church open up, that's next door and let us have a picnic lunch inside there.

And we did a tour around both cemeteries and stopped at each one and told the story.

And so those two things were really working through my system going, okay, what do I do next?

And in my company, we decided to hire a. I guess a motivator for each of our young people, a coach for each of our young agents in my land company.

And it came to me and I said, are you going to sign up for a coach?

I said, yeah, maybe as a.

Just as an example.

I'm not sure I need any coaching for career goals and all that stuff, but yeah, sure.

So I get this young guy, he's about 35.

He's my coach.

He said, well, what are your long term goals?

I'm 82 years old.

Get up tomorrow morning.

It'd be a goal, you know, we had to work our way through that.

And I sit down.

He said, all right, make me a list.

It doesn't have to be a business goal.

Make a list of some of your personal goals, huh?

I made two for him for the next week.

And first one was to try and cut down my cussing.

I. I ran a trucking company.

I know every word, cuss word, and every combination you can use.

And I probably use it myself.

I've certainly heard them.

And I was on a phone call in between while we were putting this all together with a female land broker.

There are not too many of them.

And this woman was.

Every other word was, you know, some curse word.

And just on and on.

And I hung up and go, wow, I hope I Don't sign that bad.

I wonder that.

I think she was trying to prove she's as tough as the men on the call.

I'm not sure what her goal was, but it impressed me that it was pretty awful to listen to it.

So I set my goal down to let's.

Let's start with only one swear word a day and then we'll see if we get down to one a week and maybe we get down to none for a month and sort of thing.

And so I think I've pretty well cleaned it up.

I did reserve the right if I'm in earshot of my horses, no one else is and they do something bad, I can still let it out on them.

I could use whatever words I went to there.

So that was goal number one and goal number two was I want to condense my thoughts perhaps into a book.

He said, well, perfect.

He had written three or four motivational type books and said well great, when you're ready, let me know.

I have a.

Someone who is out in Colorado and he can do a lot of proofreading and give you some guidance on books and some ideas with it as well.

So that was the beginning of it and that's.

That really started in the summer of 23.

We actually had a 30 day cruise we were doing in the Mediterranean and there were some days we're just at sea and, and you know, just times on a ship with nothing to do, no, no tours off the ship and one dinner time and all that kind of stuff.

So I sat in my deck of this beautiful ship and banged away on my computer that got it started and then finished it up here this year.

So that was fun.

It was, that was how I got motivated to do it.

Yeah.

You know.

It'S ironic listening to you because, because it sounds like the younger me, you know, I owned a trucking company as well for about six or seven years.

My mom turned ill and so I closed it and moved to Missouri to be home and help take care of her.

And I have also recently.

I'm on my third book now that I've published.

So it is ironic to hear those thoughts.

Going from the most over regulated industry in the world to writing a book.

You probably should have said let me have three cuss words a day because I know I was frustrated when I started writing a book.

My father in law owned a company.

I was, I Think maybe the second person with a college education in a company.

He said, here, you work for an insurance company.

Figure out the insurance.

I work for insurance company.

I lent money.

I don't know anything about insurance files you.

Well, nobody else does either, so figure them out.

So that was my introduction to it.

But we went.

I went from where there as a rookie trainee all the way to president of the company.

We lost one 60 and 70.

We were organized by an offshoot of the Teamsters called fash.

And even our owner operators got included in a bargaining unit which meant they owned their own truck.

They had the right to go where they wanted to, but they also had to pay them on two check systems and benefits.

That was like the worst possible world you could be in.

And I lost at the NLRB because it was under lbj.

It was pretty left wing.

National Labor Relations Board lost all my appeals.

So I stuck with those guys for 12 years until Carter deregulated the industry.

And we said, okay, we've had enough.

We cannot operate you guys.

All your benefits and every work rules, all that stuff against non union competition.

Our own guys here will be your competition.

They're going to go buy their own trucks and.

And it's all truckload lot stuff.

You know, there's no LDLs.

You don't need a big system.

You got a tractor trailer.

You can haul the same stuff for 80 or 75 rates.

Yes, we should give us a new contract or we're out of here.

And they voted something like 301 to 1 against us.

It was a really miserable year in between because I had a big company.

We had to give a year's notice in Pennsylvania.

We're quitting if we wanted to.

And it was a miserable year.

I had guard in my house and I wouldn't let my wife and daughter answer the phone because it was usually some bad message on there at night.

Yeah.

And you turn in 357 on you and a car being behind you.

And I'm just, you know, it was a tough life, man.

I'm so happy to go.

I'm going Florida, man.

See you guys.

Yeah, Yeah, I don't blame you, you know, I don't, I don't miss it either.

You know, it is, it was, it was a tough business, man.

And everybody always asked me as an owner operator, what is it like to own your own truck?

And I said, well, well, picture you're standing on i95 right in the center between north and southbound traffic, it's packed to pack, cars are flying by you.

Well, that is your bank account.

Money's coming in, money's going out and every once in a while you try to reach out and grab some.

But that's exactly the way it is.

You get a savings and then you need an in frame or a set of tires and then that dwindles and you have to build it back up and it's just a never ending cycle.

But I, I do like being retired now.

It's, it's much better.

Good.

Yes, I like being here.

My, my worst day here, somewhere around my best day there, you know.

So.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

So let's dig into a little bit of your, your, your grandfather and, and some of the stories.

What can, can you talk about as far as what it was like when, when they, when they first decided that they were gonna go fight?

What, what was that thought and what was their ages?

And I think he went for the money.

There wasn't a scheme then.

If you were wealthy, you could hire some poor guy to go for you and you paid the government 300 bucks and you paid the guy 300.

So I think my grandfather probably went the first time just for the 300 bucks.

That's a lot of money.

Yeah.

And yeah, I think as much as anything, probably a patriotic.

Our county, Butler county was one of the highest contributors of men to the calls from Lincoln.

So I think that was part of it.

Part of our heritage was that our original ancestor to Pennsylvania was a Moravian missionary.

And the Moravian church was a right wing church, but their whole philosophy was predated Martin Luther by 100 years.

They believed that the Catholic church had gone off track.

They believed you did not need to speak to a priest to get your message to God.

You didn't have to give money to somebody to take your, your confessions necessarily.

So they believed that everyone was equal.

Women were ordained ministers, women were equal in the pulpit, as were blacks.

And one of the reasons they came to Pennsylvania was to be a haven for runaway slaves, freed slaves and Native Americans.

And the church eventually evolved into a huge operation in North Carolina and the Caribbean and in Africa because it was appeal to being equal across the board.

So I think part of his philosophy was we got to, we got to, we got to do our Share to set these people free.

Yeah, so 12 bucks a month and, and, and a moral mission I believe were what drove him on.

So I, I know a lot of people.

Well, well, one I want to comment.

You know, at that age, 37 was, was pretty high up there for during those time periods, if I'm not mistaken.

You know, the average lifespan was probably not much more than that.

40, 45 at the most.

And so for him to, to re enlist, to go back at, you know, is, is one just shows you his determination and his, his belief in the cause.

I know a lot of people, especially from the South, I grew up in.

Well, I didn't grow up, but I retired out of the military in, in Georgia and I spent over 10 years of my career there.

And you hear a lot of the people talk about how people have it wrong, that the war wasn't about slavery.

You know, on the south side it was.

We were afraid we were going to lose the way of our life and, and, and whichever.

And yes, it was about slavery.

But what was the thought process on the, on the, the northern side, Would, would you say it was about uniting America or was it about freeing the slaves or was it just a combination of the Both?

I think the first was, was keeping the country united.

You know, we were, we were what, 65, 75.

About 80 years from when we got our independence from Great Britain.

Yeah, a couple generations, but so I think there was a great desire to keep our nation together.

And I think that Lincoln appealed to a lot of people on the patriotism level.

Great.

I'm in, man, I'm going.

12 bucks a month wasn't bad.

And you know, a little bit of money involved for a private to go in.

So I think all this ain't on top of the moral issue.

I think there were lots of guys probably who served it had no idea why they, they had no moral compunction.

They were just there because it was a call because your buddies are going, you know, if you're 19 years old, that's an adventure.

You're going off to war.

You have no idea what it's going to look like when somebody gets shot beside you.

But you know, so there's just a whole lot of reasons.

But I, I do think that there was a moral compunction amongst a lot of the folks.

And I try to bring that out in some of the dialogue because well into my book we start talking about around a campfire about why are we here?

You know, and I just Imagine some of that dialogue.

I mean, I don't know if it's exactly right on target or not, but it, it was interesting.

We, we grew up in a high school, had had some black students.

Not too many were small farm country areas, so there weren't too many blacks around, but they were equal.

We had black high school players on the football team.

We were friends with them.

They came and stayed overnight to farm.

They came and worked on the weekends on the farm and stayed Friday night and Saturday night, went back home on Sunday.

You know, I didn't think anything of it.

I didn't realize.

Yeah, some other people didn't think that might be right.

I don't, I wouldn't say I was liberal.

It just seemed like the right thing to do.

It seemed like a Moravian thing to do, I guess would be the.

When I look back at it.

Yeah, you know, it is.

It's been a topic that, that has affected us for years.

I don't think I can think of any other topic that, that has, has affected America more than, than that topic right there.

I remember as a kid, you know, I myself did not know what racism was at a very young age.

However, my father was racist and we were, they were foster parents.

When I say my father, it's actually my grandfather, but.

We had, the state brought us some children.

And I'll never forget this, we lived in a small town in Nebraska similar to like what you said, a farming area.

And a couple of the children they dropped off were, were mixed children.

And it was like overnight I went to school the next day and people were calling me a zebra family.

I had no idea what they were talking about.

You know.

I just shrugged it off because it didn't make no sense to me.

And it was probably after that point when I seen my, my dad's reaction to them being brought to us and, and everything else.

And you know, I always gave my father a hard time about that all the way up till he passed away.

You know, he never changed his views.

But I think the military gives you some context.

You know, regardless of what you're feeling when you're in combat, everybody's green.

You know, you're depending on everybody to, to keep you alive.

And so I can imagine the, the north side, the, the United or Union soldiers were probably more bonded together than the southern military because of that same thing that you were just talking about, about the rich paying some.

You know, I think in the south they were, they were telling the, some black people that if you went to war for my son when, when you, if you live, when you come back, you're free, we'll let you go.

And, and I think even that right there with the belief probably would cause some divide between the, the.

The ranks compared to the North.

When, when you're, when your family went in and, and it sounds like they.

They were fighting for their morals as well.

Would you, Would you agree that.

That the, the north side, it was.

Was more organized, more.

Resilient, I guess would be the right words.

They had rank structures.

They had full military.

Training.

You know, I don't believe the south ever got as organized.

No, I think that's correct.

I think the south operated more on an emotional level.

The, the north certainly had a lot of things in their favor.

Manpower, you know, just keep bringing these immigrants in, swear them in the army and send them South.

For example, the patriotism call and more people.

To begin with, the base was bigger.

Yeah.

When you make your call to New York City and Philadelphia and Pittsburgh and, you know, the big cities in those days, they just had a huge base to call from.

So I think.

And then they had.

They had the war machine, the, the iron and steel foundries and the raw resources, iron ore and coal, coke and everything to make steel.

And then.

You know, the south is an agrarian community.

They, they had great horsemen.

They had much better calvary in the early days of the war.

They had a bigger will to fight, I believe, than the North.

That's.

That was a turning point for.

He finally won Vicksburg the same day that we had the standoff and maybe the victory at Gettysburg.

Whatever, you know, I'm not sure that was a victory.

It was a turning point.

But the north leaders, up to.

Up to Grant before Grant wouldn't follow up.

Now we had Gettysburg.

We had him on the run.

So Lincoln finally said, give me Grant.

This guy wins battles.

Yeah, he.

Someone says he drinks a lot.

Good.

Get some of that whiskey for the rest of my generals, you know, so let's, let's get some fighting generals.

And of course, he organized the eastern army.

He brought in Sheridan, Sherman.

And, oh, good grief Custer, who's the boy general.

He brought in people who wanted to fight.

I mean, I've got a painting on my Wall here and it's in my book with Phil Sheridan leading the charge at the last.

Third charge at Winchester.

The third, they call it the third Winchester.

He's leading the charge.

He's on his horse at the front.

Wow.

You know, I read descriptions of that, of what a fantastic charge that was.

A bright September day and all the glistening sabers in the air, you know, And I mean, you get 9, 000 horses together.

I've ridden and rides with 500 horses.

They get nuts around 499 other horses, you know.

So yeah, that 5,000, I'm out there all charged up, everybody's ready to go.

And you're riding full tilt across the battleground into the, into the smoke and the bullets coming at you and wow.

I mean, that's just.

To me, that's just about as fabulous as it gets if you're in the military.

Yeah, no, I would agree.

And, and you don't see that in today's military anymore.

You know, there's, there's been a lot of things that have gotten lost from, from those days, you know, all the way back to George Washington.

George Washington was the same way.

He believed in leading from the front and as a rarity, he was also one of the few generals that listened to his commanders and before he made decisions, he gathered as much information as he could before he even spoke.

And so those are all things that have been lost in today's world, I think, as well as in our younger troops.

They, you know, I know growing up through the military, I came in as 19, I did 20 years.

I retired at the age of 39, and I spent 68 months in combat.

And I can tell you that nobody in today's military would reenlist if they had to go through and fight wars the way they did back then.

You know, no getting in trucks and driving and being dropped off and, and then having a two or three click mounted or unmounted patrol into an area.

You know, we're talking about people that covered states, you know, using horses to pull cannon, canyon cannons, walking in ranks, you know, only to get to a spot where people are going to stand in front of each other and start firing.

Whole different mentality back then.

I have a little bit of experience in between in that.

My kid brother was in the 82nd Airborne that sent to Dominican Republic during some revolution down there and had some combat on the ground, then got sent to Detroit during the race wars of 67.

Said that was the worst thing because you couldn't fire back.

People were sniping at you from tops of buildings.

And, you know, you were just there to try and suppress riots.

And then they.

Then his reward for all that Is got transferred 101st at Fort Campbell and shipped to Vietnam in December of 67, just in time for Tet.

Spent his full year there.

Came back with two Purple Hearts and a bronze medal.

But, yeah, tough, tough road to hoe, but they were.

Yeah, that was.

So I heard a lot of his stories and.

And I'm sure a lot more that he could have shared.

He was killed in a car accident a few years after he got back.

Just.

He was in.

Yeah, he's into drinking a lot.

And it's never, never.

He's one of those typical ones.

Saigon, Tokyo, Honolulu, San Francisco, all within a week, you know, stand on the docks in San Francisco with a fresh GI here, cutting a clean uniform, going, wow, who are these people that don't like me, you know?

Yeah, yeah, I, you know, it is.

The Vietnam War was.

Was a very brutal war.

And, And I'm not talking about just the fighting, right?

The.

The g. What war?

The last 20 years that we fought, we have been fortunate.

We came back to a country that was supportive and behind us.

And I think that's the main reason why so many soldiers are open, or at least not as hard to get them to open up and talk about some of the things that they witnessed.

Vietnam soldiers did not have that when they came back from Vietnam.

They, they didn't have anybody share.

They didn't have a VA that had any organizations or any funding to even do anything.

And it was almost like, you know, you left the army and now you're damaged, but you still have to suck it up and pretend there's nothing wrong because there is no support.

So I do believe that they had.

They had it the hardest out of everybody when it comes to returning, you know.

Technology wise.

You know, they, they.

They did have a good technology based behind them with helicopters and, and vehicles and.

And so forth, but the fighting was just brutal.

You know, the terrain, the weather and, And I can't even imagine, you know, being up in Gettysburg.

I don't know what time of the year Gettysburg actually fought, but, you know, just the winners up in Yalls area.

You know, it was July 1st, 2nd and 3rd, very hot.

Okay, well, that's why, yeah, most of Civil War battles were over by November and didn't start again until April or May.

Okay.

Both sides just.

And there were some patrols and skirmishes, but no big battles were fought other than during the fairly good weather.

Yeah, yeah.

You know, because that's just kind of the route I was getting at was can you imagine, you know, having to trudge through weather to get to an area and still have the energy to fight.

I mean you're gonna lose people on the way just from, you know, not having the proper gear and, and storms and so forth.

You know, the lower ranked people, they slept outside in little, you know, if they had a tent, I don't even know if they had little makeshift lean to tents type things.

But at the end of the day it's.

They had a puff tent and two privates would share it.

So each half of it and it would attach.

It was no ground floor to it, you know, just a little bit of shorter from the rain, no ends to it.

It was just two pieces of canvas.

But one of the toughest battles, and you brought up a really good point was when Grant took them south through the Wilderness.

Of course we didn't have fertilizer like we do today.

So those plantation owners moved somewhere else.

And that soil was so depleted it just grew up in brush.

Not there's no nice trees that came up in it.

It was just brush and there were thousands of acres of it and but it was in the path of the direct route to Richmond.

Lee suspected that Grant was going to go around the wilderness and why wouldn't you?

You know, that's what all the other Norman normal Northern generals would have done is take the easy route.

Granted we're going through the wilderness.

I lost two great grandfathers there.

One captured only third or fourth day in battle for him.

He listed.

He also enlisted at a late age of 37 or 38 years old in February and by April he's captured and by August he's dead at Andersonville.

That was one another one had was just a month short of a three year enlistment at Spotsylvania when they made a charge at Spotsylvania, just south of the Wilderness against a very dug in and Confederate position.

Don Ray or Don charge up a hill and he was shot, mortally wounded, evacuated back to Washington D.C. and died a month later there in the, in the hospital from the injuries that he received out in the field.

But you just, you think about these guys went through in the Wilderness.

They talked about the brush caught on fire when the Cannonballs, you know, came down, they were hot, all kind of hot things happening, set on fire and a wounded guy be laying there and nobody could rescue him because he's surrounded by fire.

And that.

That was a.

That's just an awful scene.

It's like Dante's inferno for a battle.

And.

And we're not talking about small amounts of losses either, you know, on both sides.

You know, you're talking about when the battle's over, fields filled full of bodies.

You know.

I don't.

Very, very few wars.

I think after that, you know, there might have been some battles after that that, that, you know, World War I and 2 and Vietnam that you would.

You would see something of a sign like that where there was lots of casualties because there was some big battles in Vietnam especially.

So I'm sure there was those kind of issues.

There were 27,000 casualties at Antietam.

Now that's north and south combined.

Right, but they're all Americans.

Right?

Yeah.

We didn't lose that many people in one single day ever.

Normandy.

Yeah.

Nowhere since it was the biggest single loss of life and casualties of U. S. Born troops, I guess, because it was a confederate and the union, but still, imagine 27, 000 people one day.

It was just unbelievable.

Yeah.

To put that in context, you know, the.

The unit I was in was.

And there was 16 people that died.

And up to that point, that was the single largest loss of Americans in.

In a single day, was 16.

Wow.

So that's a long cry from 27,000.

Sir, yes, sir.

You know, so it is.

It is just insane to.

To think.

I mean, we're talking.

We're talking about bigger than most little towns today.

27,000 there.

I can.

I can name tons.

My town I'm currently in doesn't have 27,000 people, you know, so.

So we're talking about a town worth of people.

Small cities of today's size, dead.

And just insane.

I just.

You can't even imagine.

It is.

I had the opportunity a few years ago to.

To go up to Virginia, go to Winchester, which is, you know, the crossroads of both highways and railroads.

Back in the day, it was.

It was the single most taken city by the north, by the south, by the north, by the South.

In other words, it changed hands more times than any other property or city or whatever in the whole war.

Sometimes in the same day, it'd be Union and North and Confederate tonight or next day it'd be Union again.

It was that kind of thing.

But yeah, I had a chance to go there, go to the battlefield and then drive from there.

They like I say, down through all the highlighted points that I wanted to.

Could see all the way down to Richmond.

Yeah, a great movie to me to go stand where one great grandfather was wounded with another one was captured and where the third road and our.

Somehow he must have some political connections.

And he's the commanding officer.

But wow, this is pretty rapid.

So he must have had some connections.

Don't know what they were.

When the war was over, he became the president eventually of the Erie Lackawanna Railroad, which was a big deal back in the day.

It was a big freight line.

But he also won the Congressional Medal of Honor for their charge at Winchester for the third Winchester because they took a fort on the.

On the right side, if you're Union guy on the right side of the line went up, took the fort and then they rolled down the back of the Confederates because they took the fort, rolled behind them, which is a terrible thing if you're on the other side.

You know, a great thing if you're on the winning side of that whole thing.

It chased all those guys back through Winchester, running hard as they could run to get out of there, headed south and that was as far north as the Confederates were for the rest of the war.

So the war was over in 65.

But yeah, it was.

It was pretty cool to read.

Oh he and I had some.

Some help in some of my facts on stuff because he commissioned a couple of his officers to write a book about their episodes of how the 14th Pennsylvania Calvary maneuvered and.

And presented it after the 20th anniversary to the men that showed up for.

They all got a copy of his book on it.

But they wrote over 6, 000 miles.

There were a hundred.

Over 100 engagements.

And I forgot how many men they lost.

But it's just.

It's pretty spectacular to have that kind of knowledge and to be able to look at and go, oh yeah, there's my grandfather.

Asian Company M. Yeah.

Nowhere is he mentioned about being a hero.

Nowhere is he mentioned about being injured or anything else.

I don't.

I think he just did his time.

Yeah, but one of the shocks for him at the end of the war and you talk about the end of the war and we didn't celebrate Vietnam.

We did some of the other wars there was the grand review for the Union troops.

And they got to come back to Washington D.C. got them bathed and shaved, new uniforms, cleaned them up and then they all marched in the grand reviews day after day after day.

Each outfit at a chance to go up and down Pennsylvania Avenue.

And I'm sure they must had a pretty good time in Washington D.C. you know, but my, my great grandfather's outfit said, oops, sorry guys, you are posting to the rail station and you're shipping out.

That's.

What do you mean we're shipping out?

The war is over.

I said, no, you enlisted for three years.

It didn't say the end of the war.

It said three years.

And March them down to the railroad station.

They tried to make them get on flatbed cars, wouldn't tell them where they're going.

They said, we're not doing that.

You can, you can kick us out of the army, but we're not getting on flatbed cars and ride in April.

It's cold, it's rainy, it's whatever, you know, at least you're going to take us somewhere, get us coaches that we can sit in seats in the coaches.

And then they basically pulled a strike.

So we're not doing this.

A couple days later they found a bunch of cars and load them up.

And they stopped in Pittsburgh for fuel, water and everything else the train needed and said, if you leave the train and dessert, you will not get your pension and will probably come after you as a deserter.

About 10% of them still said, yeah, we're out of here, we don't care.

But they took my.

My great grandfather and his whole outfit, put him on a steamship down to.

They took them by train to Cincinnati, then a steamship to St. Louis, up the Missouri, to Fort Leavenworth.

Fort Leavenworth, Kansas.

They arrive there in probably May and they are assigned to chase natives, chase Native Americans, chase Indians around the plains.

They never have any encounters.

They just.

They just can't believe they're out here riding how hot it gets in Kansas in the summertime and how endless the sky is.

You know, it's just flat as to me.

And finally in August, they still had three months to go in their enlistments the government like they would do after any war.

So, okay, we need to curtail our budgets.

Brought them in and said, you're all going home next week.

And so they sent them home at the end of August and discharged him in Pittsburgh.

So it's just.

But they, they were not very happy about spending an extra three or four months out there.

And part of us is, is my dad always told the story.

It upset my, my great grandfather so much because everybody else is coming back, getting a job.

Yeah, he's not coming back for four or five months later.

All of them not coming back till later.

They're, they're at the tail end of the queue of any jobs that are being put back together.

When the war was over, though, it was tough on him.

He, he couldn't really find his way.

He came back to the farm.

Small farm, and now he has grown sons with him there.

Hard to make a living.

He thought it was a great city and he, he, he thought he could either make a living as a shingle maker, which he had done as a young man, or a mason, which he had done.

So he went back to St. Louis.

Now here's how poignant things get sometimes.

My great grandmother ran an ad in several newspapers, including one I found in a Boston newspaper.

He said, searching for Andrew Eschenbach.

Eschenbach last known to be in St. Louis, but departing back to Pennsylvania.

Don't know if by rail, by water or by foot or horseback.

But if anyone has any knowledge of them, please write me.

Post office box West Sunbury, Pennsylvania.

I mean, here she is.

She has no idea where her husband is.

I didn't find him in either Pennsylvania or in the St. Louis era area.

So I don't know what the story was.

But he came back eventually, came back to the farm.

By then his sons are in the oil well drilling business because oil, as you remember, was found in Pennsylvania right before the Civil War.

So the oil business is booming.

There's thousands of wells being drilled in Pennsylvania, New York, West Virginia.

Then my grandfather and his cousin, or his brother, excuse me, Andrew, both got in.

Albert, both got into oil drilling business and did well.

They made money as oil well drillers for the rest of their lives.

So it's just interesting because my great grandfather never quite found.

Found his way after he came back at 40 some years old, you know, just couldn't quite ever get back into the groove, I guess.

I don't know story.

I, I mean, well, you, you think about what he's gone through at that point.

I don't care how strong you are, it's going to affect you.

And, and so that, that part of that would make absolute sense of just, you know, going from constantly on alert and marching to, you know, now the, the I've got to get up to make sure I feed the cattle or feed the animals or, or whatever whole different scenario.

You know, the, the loss of adrenaline and, and the, the ha.

The reason to be on alert and, and all those things that, that the, the body just adapts to is.

It's just insane of what we can put ourselves through and, and still find ways to, to make it through.

Sure.

So let me.

I wanna, I know we're getting close to the, the top of the hour, but I want to dig in a little bit into your book.

Is there, is there a few sections of your book that, that you could share as far as maybe some of the battles or, or some of the things that, that you were left antique wise that, that you cherish or, or any of those types of things?

I think there's one scene where they ride in December.

They're in West Virginia, right in the Virginia, West Virginia border.

They're ordered into Tennessee and they are ordered to ride out tonight.

And they ride in the rain through the mountains and they're talking about.

It's such tough terrain that you had to hold on the tail and the horse in front of you so you didn't get lost.

And you crisscross the same streams over and over.

Because they had to go up and over a ridge down the other side, pick up another stream and they rode deep into Tennessee to a major rail junction.

And then without.

Well, in 23 or 24 hours they hadn't had any sleep.

They finally, sometime late at night come to a place where they can dismount and rest their horses and rest them in a little bit.

And they lay down to sleep and the rain turns to snow.

Now they've been getting rained on all the time.

These guys don't have raincoats.

They got a big heavy wool coats maybe, but they don't have raincoats, right?

Yeah.

How miserable and cold they were already.

They lay down on the ground and they fall asleep.

And at dawn the trumpeter, whose job is to wake them up comes out to blow the trumpet and he looks over and there's, there's about this much snow had fallen, fresh snow and it gotten cold after the rain turned to snow cover these Guys.

And all I can see just mounds and mounds of guys laying in the snow just covered up completely.

So he blows the trumpet.

They saw, and he thought it was really funny watching him jump up out of the snow and.

But one of the guys went to jump off of the snow and couldn't get up.

His long hair had frozen in the mud, so someone had to go get a knife and cut his hair loose.

I think I. I would be so stiff.

I probably have a cold so bad I wouldn't able to be.

Able.

I'd be dead in a couple days with pneumonia from that kind of exposure, I would think.

Yeah.

But they then rode on from that and they tore up.

They came to the junction, they tore up miles and miles of Confederate rail track, and they called it Pennsylvania bow ties.

They would take the railroad ties, put them in a big pile, set them on fire, and put the rails over top of them.

When they got red hot, they would take two mules and take those ties and find a tree and bend those railroad ties in a U so that the Confederacy couldn't just come back and lay them down again.

They were scrap at that point.

So I just think about.

I think about that.

What.

I mean, you're riding, you're exhausted.

You're.

You're laying on the ground and mud turns to snow.

Now you get up and you work your tail off.

And all this time you're wondering, where's Confederate calvary?

They're going to come get us while we're here.

You know, and I'm on a tired horse.

I cannot run a fresh Confederate horse with a good rider.

What this is.

This had to be about as bad as it could be, I would think.

But they turned around and they rode back and it was, you know, it was a couple hundred miles from West Virginia into Tennessee, where they went and back, and they did all in a few days with very little sleep and very little rations.

And.

Yeah, I'm not that tough.

I couldn't even do the ride down there in the summertime, I don't think like that, you know.

So.

Yeah, wow.

I mean, I think I can ride a horse, but I can't ride a horse like those guys could have.

No.

No way.

So, yeah, that's, to me, was one of the more poignant times in the story and thinking, just trying to put yourself in your shoes.

I can't even begin to do that.

Yeah, Yeah.

I was just sitting here thinking, you know, that area is like.

Is like the same area as Kingsport, Tennessee, which is right there by the North Carolina, Tennessee line.

But that same mountain region runs all up through there around Knoxville and, and all that stuff.

I, I remember taking loads up there on a highway.

And even still there's some steep poles to get up there.

You know, I believe one of them's Fancy Gap if they're on 77.

But anyways, I can't imagine trying to go through the wilderness on ridge lines and following paths in that same area.

That just blows my mind.

And to be so bad, you're holding onto a tail on a horse in front of you.

Yeah.

How's that horse just not get tired and kick somebody?

I mean, it's just to me, the whole.

I, I do a lot of riding.

I do.

One of my hobbies is 100 mile trail rides.

Okay.

20 miles a day.

And I've been on something in, in Florida.

Been kind of cold, it got down to 30s at night and been on one where it rained all day on us.

Yeah, it's just miserable.

I can't imagine doing that for 24 hours straight.

Worrying about somebody shooting while I'm doing it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That is absolutely just insane, man.

You know, it is no doubt in my mind, you know, I've always said, and I never thought about it, but, you know, the, the Men of Men was obviously definitely World War I and 2.

But you think back even further now and you start including.

Because a lot of people leave the Civil War out of it.

They, they, you know, when they talk about wars, they stop at World War I.

They forget, you know, that, that we did fight the French with a very small amount of military, did not do well in Canada.

We fought Indians, we fought each other.

You know, there was a lot of skirmishes that, that happened before World War I, and, and when you, you look at the technology that World War I had and then take it back to what these guys had, I think, I think you see where that, that bloodline was, was born from, you know.

Well, I think the, the last charge at Winchester, the third Winchester battle with the 9,000 or so so mounted troops making that attack, I believe that might have been the last biggest calvary charge.

Because after the Civil War was winding down at that point, I don't know that there's anything bigger in the Civil War.

Well, from there on, the Spanish American War with Teddy Roosevelt was much smaller in his charge at San Juan Hill.

And this war is World War I.

And we've all seen the movie War Horse or the play War Horse.

Horses are obsolete.

The Germans were, you know, turning machine guns on the British Cavalry, and that was, whoa, this is not a good place to be, man.

We shouldn't be out here in a horse.

And so I think.

I think in some aspects, the perspective of this being maybe the last great Calvary charge ever romanticizes it somewhat.

And in.

In the book that my commanding officer, my great grandfather's outfit, had written, it talked about the glistening sabers on a bright September day with the sunlight.

And you know, how.

How amped up everybody was to go do this, because they know that this.

If they can drive the Confederates out of Winchester, they've got them on the run.

They're going to now take them all the way to Richmond and get this thing over with.

And.

Yeah, so there was.

There was a lot of emotion.

I'm sure it went into it, but I just.

I just.

Yeah, I'd love to see.

I'd love to be on Hill watching that.

I'm not sure I had to.

I don't know if I have the guts to have been into it, but maybe.

But I would love to have seen it.

I think it's just been magnificent, if you like war at all.

Oh, yeah, no, absolutely.

Right.

I. I wish there was a way, you know, all these.

These rich people are paying to go up in space, but.

But I'm going to tell you, if I was wealthy, what I would save my money for is to be able to get it on a time machine and go back and see some of these events that happened, you know, way back then.

You know, storming of the beach of Normandy.

You know, as long as you can watch from a third person, I'm like you.

I don't want to be in it.

But.

But it would be pretty fascinating to.

To watch and, and knowing the.

The history behind it.

I mean, it's just.

Just amazing, man.

And I said, I was born 100 years too late.

22 years old.

I'd have been in it, you know.

Wow.

Yeah, maybe.

Wow.

You know?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We.

We say.

We say.

Well, I think a lot of nine, 11 people that entered after that, you know, that everybody wanted to go do their fighting and patriotism and everything else.

Yeah, I. I know a lot of people that said, maybe it wasn't.

Wow.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But, yeah, it is.

It is impressive, man.

The, the history and, and like I said, I was up there for a different event up in Gettysburg and, and not even being there for the purpose of celebrating patriotism and, and history and everything else, you.

You just can't help but to feel it.

I, I just, you know, I, I took my, my bed up there and, and just driving the.

The back hills, you know, in my car, just, just thinking, you know, back then this road wasn't there.

You know, people walk this area with rifles and was fighting on.

On the ground that I'm driving on.

It's just.

It is just so impressive, man.

It really, really is.

Well, I'm.

I'm gonna give you the opportunity to tell everybody where they can find your book and, and follow you and, and learn more about what your family's done and, and maybe what holds the future for you guys.

Well, sure.

My.

Website, I guess, or my email address.

My email address is bill@thedirtdog.com the name comes from being a land broker.

That's Bill at the T H E D I R T D O G dot com.

Be glad to fulfill any subscriptions from there and just really looking forward to the book coming out.

My, My wife read it recently.

She's had some disabilities where she had a hard time reading, but she sat down and read it.

And she's a publisher of business magazines of 40 years experience.

And she said, where did this come from?

This book got my attention.

It held my attention.

I didn't want to put it down.

Did you write this?

You know, kind of thing.

Credulous that I might have written the book.

And I, I'm just, I was so.

Emotionally pleased and excited that she had that reaction to it because I value her opinion.

I mean, we've been married for 37 years.

He's just a great, great person, a great resource for me.

But she was not able to help me with the book.

I was hoping early on when I started that having a publisher in a household here would be some help, but she just, she can't focus on read online these days, so didn't have that help.

But I had such a tremendous reaction for her that I'm hoping their readers go, wow, this is really cool.

This, this is humanized.

This is, you know, something that makes me feel like I'm in the family.

Makes me feel like I'm listening to letters written home.

I made up letters I wrote home between my great grandfather and my great grandmother.

And and, and my grandfather and to his mother.

That's all pretty much made up.

But it's based on family stories from my father and my cousin, who knew my grandfather fairly well.

So just trying to humanize who they were, what they might have been feeling, what they might have been discussing around a fire campfire as they proceeded up the Shenandoah Valley.

And up to Shenandoah is a little bit of a play on words.

The Shenandoah river is one of the few in North America that flows north.

And so, you know, typically when I would go up the river, I would think I was going north, but in this case, up to Shenandoah was southbound to Richmond.

And so that, that to me was a little bit of a play in the words that I kind of like to, to, to incorporate in the book and the title to it.

All right.

Yeah.

I mean, I can't, I can't wait.

When does the book actually come out?

We come out on November 12th.

November 12th.

Okay.

I will make sure that I get me a copy.

If I go through your website, can I get a signed copy?

Yeah, and I have your email.

I can, I'll give you the link to it as well.

Sounds great.

Sounds great.

And I'll make sure we put the links in and everything in, in this so that people can, can get this book.

I'm, I'm excited.

I can't wait.

I love, I love history, especially military history.

So it is really fascinating to, to know what we've accomplished as, as Americans, you know, without the, the desire for something in return.

You know, it's not like the manufacturing, you know, those were amazing things that we did too, but it was all out of, you know, self desire.

These guys had no self desire.

It wasn't about them.

And that's what I find fascinating.

It was.

We were able to weave in a little bit of the stories of some of the industrialization with the repeating rifles and the pistols.

You know, when the war started, everybody had a single shot where you had to load it and prime it and take one shot.

And maybe if you're really good, you get a shot off every 12, 15 seconds.

And along came a couple of rifles, including dispenser repeating rifle, that you get off seven shots in, you know, seven seconds.

That changed the game.

And the calvary under Grant was one of the first ones to get those carbines.

And so it changed the game for those guys.

They go into battle with two pistols, two big Colt pistols, a carbine and a saber.

And they were, they were pretty formidable.

Yeah, Going into it, you know, so I just look at the wall I saw.

I have the.

The painting that was done as the charge of the third Winchester.

And they're sharing in the front with a saber just right into that battle.

And I.

And I just think, wow, they came with so much more firepower than.

Than their opposition.

You know, the Confederates got off one shot, and they were good marksmen, but now you're reloading while somebody's pumping the next six or seven back at you.

It was a game changer.

So the technology was a game changer back in those days as well.

And then I'm glad that the calvary was equipped because my ancestors lived through it, so.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

And, you know, that's even another thing that's.

That's impressive is.

Is how many of them actually lived through it because of, you know, just fighting the elements.

You know, it wasn't even about people dying from war, but disease and.

And weather and.

And all that other stuff was taking people out as well.

So, yeah, man, I'm very fortunate.

My.

My dad lived to be 98.

My grandfather will, in the book, live in 92.

And he fell out of the top of the barn when he was mowing back hay and got all busted up and died of complications from his fall.

Which begs the question, why are you on top of the barn at 92?

But, you know, she's tough guy, and his.

My great grandfather Andrew, lived to be 88.

Now, these guys had no medicine.

They salted everything they ate, but everything they ate was natural, you know, hormones or anything involved in it.

When I grew up as a kid, we ate red meat 20 meals a week, and we had chicken on Sunday, so it was red meat every day.

Pork, bacon, and ham steak.

You know, you can beef, you name it.

So those people did really well on.

On their diets, I guess, to live that long, and it was exceptional.

I don't know that other families had anywhere near that kind of lifeline because she was an old, really old person.

For a lot of families, very fortunate.

Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

Well, I hope all you guys got something out of this, because I know I sure did.

You know, just take the time to think back about what our history has done and the amount of people that have fought to be a part of what we call America today.

So if anybody out there is inventing the time machine, I'm a buyer.

Take my money.

I want to go.

I want to go for these rides and.

And see some of the stuff that, you know, I never got a chance to so I hope all of y' all enjoyed this.

I know I did.

Don't forget.

Make sure you subscribe like and.

And hit that bell.

And don't let the day kick your ass.

Kick the day's ass.