Artwork for podcast Saint Louis In Tune
1964 Cardinals: A Team, a Season, and a Showdown for the Ages
28th October 2024 • Saint Louis In Tune • Motif Media Group
00:00:00 00:49:23

Share Episode

Shownotes

In one of the most exciting seasons in baseball history, the 1964 St. Louis Cardinals surged in the final months to steal the pennant and top the mighty Yankees in seven games to capture the World Series. How did an unlikely assortment of people and events come together for such a monumental achievement?

Look no further than ’64 Cardinals, a photo-illustrated story of promise, turmoil, and triumph. Discover how the famous trade for Lou Brock provided a jolt that reversed a summer swoon. Witness superstar pitcher Bob Gibson ascend to dominance down the stretch and meet the other indispensables—Curt Flood, Dick Groat, Bill White, Julian Javier, Tim McCarver, Mike Shannon, Barney Schultz, team captain Kenny Boyer, and others—who helped power the team through the National League meat-grinder and the ultimate clash of historic heavyweights. High drama wasn’t limited to the field, thanks to a hard-driving owner, Gussie Busch, and his “special consultant,” Branch Rickey. Key facts, engaging anecdotes, and direct observations from players who lived the experience this rare volume will bring to life a truly thrilling season.

An exhilarating ride for any baseball fan, ’64 Cardinals also heralds the return of the writing team of baseball historian Robert L. Tiemann and broadcast journalist Ron Jacober, who co-authored the local bestseller Immortal Moments in Cardinals History. Whether you watched the 1964 Cardinals in person, or have just heard the stories passed down over the years, this book is the capstone on any baseball lover’s collection.

This is Season 5! For more episodes, go to stlintune.com

#stlcardinals #1964worldseries #nyyankees #bobgibson #loubrock




Transcripts

Arnold Stricker:

Greetings, listeners in listener land.

Arnold Stricker:

Welcome to St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in tune with Arnold Stricker and Mark Langston, where we size up current and historic events involving people, places and things in areas such as the arts, crime, education, employment, faith, finance, food, health, history, housing, humor, justice and sports.

Arnold Stricker:

We originate from and connect the gateway city to our country and international culture and lives.

Mark Langston:

Hello, Arnold.

Arnold Stricker:

What's happening?

Mark Langston:

Mark, I know this.

Mark Langston:

Cardinals,:

Mark Langston:

And this is the reason I can't speak is because of the Cardinals.

Mark Langston:

Okay.

Mark Langston:

So I went to the opening day a week ago.

Mark Langston:

It was cold, maybe even a little rainy.

Mark Langston:

I don't know.

Bob Thieman:

There was very, very little, but I went too.

Mark Langston:

Did you.

Mark Langston:

And I screamed quite a bit, but I said, you probably had one of those sweets or something.

Bob Thieman:

No, but our seats are underneath.

Mark Langston:

Okay, he's just making it worse.

Mark Langston:

So I've kind of lost my voice.

Mark Langston:

I've had my COVID test, I've had my bronchi.

Mark Langston:

Whatever.

Mark Langston:

I've had every test that you can imagine, even my IQ test, and they're all negative.

Mark Langston:

So that's good news.

Mark Langston:

But my voice is finally starting to come back.

Mark Langston:

I won't be talking much today, but shame on the Cardinals for doing this to me.

Mark Langston:

It's their fault.

Mark Langston:

They should give me free tickets, I think, for the rest of the year, don't you?

Arnold Stricker:

Especially it's opening day next year.

Mark Langston:

Right.

Mark Langston:

And you know, can I just.

Mark Langston:

I know you have things to do, but I've never been to an opening day.

Mark Langston:

And I'm in my 60s and my whole family's gone.

Mark Langston:

My kids have gone.

Mark Langston:

My one son works in the broadcast booth with the Cardinals with.

Mark Langston:

Well did with Mike Shannon and with John Rooney and all of them.

Mark Langston:

But they've all been.

Mark Langston:

And I've never been, ever.

Mark Langston:

They always left me home.

Mark Langston:

So my youngest son got tickets and invited me.

Mark Langston:

So I was really excited to go and got my chance to go my very first time.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Arnold Stricker:

And they won.

Arnold Stricker:

And your voice.

Mark Langston:

They did win.

Mark Langston:

And my voice is gone.

Mark Langston:

And I guess this is what I get.

Arnold Stricker:

That's right.

Mark Langston:

So I'm never going again.

Bob Thieman:

You just have to make sure you go to games that they don't win.

Mark Langston:

No.

Arnold Stricker:

Go to games when it's warm.

Mark Langston:

Okay.

Mark Langston:

That's a good idea, too.

Arnold Stricker:

Our guest is Bob Thieman.

Arnold Stricker:

first Stan Musial home run in:

Arnold Stricker:

He's an award winning baseball historian.

Arnold Stricker:

He's written several books, contributed to and edited many journals for the Society for American Baseball Research.

Arnold Stricker:

And he is the co author of Ten Stories of the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Cardinals World Championships.

Arnold Stricker:

He's also the co author, with Ron Jacober, of a new book, 64 Cardinals, a Team, A Season and a Showdown for the Age is Bob.

Arnold Stricker:

Welcome to St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in Tune.

Bob Thieman:

Well, thanks for having me.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, I was really intrigued by this book when I first saw this because this is along with probably the 67 series and 68 series.

Arnold Stricker:

That whole 60s Cardinals group really resonates with me.

Arnold Stricker:

Cardinal baseball from him in:

Arnold Stricker:

So I also remember listening to these games on my transistor, my turquoise transistor radio with my Earp pieces underneath the sheets when my parents thought I was in bed.

Arnold Stricker:

Listen to Harry Carey and Jack Buck.

Bob Thieman:

Okay.

Bob Thieman:

Well, a lot of people did.

Bob Thieman:

I was not living in St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis at the time, but I used to do a lot of that listening under the covers, too.

Arnold Stricker:

Now, how'd you get to be a baseball historian?

Bob Thieman:

Well, I studied history in college, but there was no.

Bob Thieman:

You couldn't do baseball history back in those days as a serious academician.

Bob Thieman:

But it sort of became an avocation and I got with the Sabre, the Society for American Baseball Research.

Bob Thieman:

I got involved in 19th century research especially.

Bob Thieman:

So I've got all the.

Bob Thieman:

I've been working on the:

Bob Thieman:

So.

Arnold Stricker:

Wow.

Bob Thieman:

Box scores for all the games we had to create statistics for the very first league.

Bob Thieman:

And that was of my biggest projects for Sabre.

Bob Thieman:

But then all major league history has just been my menu venue for years and years as an advocation.

Bob Thieman:

But not.

Bob Thieman:

It doesn't pay much, though, except in.

Arnold Stricker:

A lot of enjoyment.

Bob Thieman:

A lot of enjoyment.

Bob Thieman:

That's right.

Arnold Stricker:

What was the bug that got you going in this?

Arnold Stricker:

Was it watching Musial hit that home run or.

Arnold Stricker:

When did you first.

Bob Thieman:

Well, yeah, that was:

Bob Thieman:

That's the first baseball I really remember.

Bob Thieman:

And ever since, I've been following baseball avidly.

Arnold Stricker:

Now you have these books that you've written and obviously you've been a Cardinals fan for a long time, but you weren't initially here in St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis.

Arnold Stricker:

No.

Bob Thieman:

Well, I was born in St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis, but when I was one year old, Anheuser Busch opened their first branch brewery in Newark, New Jersey.

Bob Thieman:

My dad was one of the cadre moved from St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis out there.

Bob Thieman:

So from age 1 to 15, I lived in New Jersey.

Arnold Stricker:

So did you see Musial hit the home run out there at the Polo.

Bob Thieman:

Grounds the last Cardinal Giants game at the Polo Grounds.

Arnold Stricker:

Wow.

Mark Langston:

Cut it out.

Mark Langston:

Wonderful.

Bob Thieman:

Back to back with Wally Moon.

Bob Thieman:

I can still remember it.

Arnold Stricker:

Wow.

Arnold Stricker:

Now, let me ask you this before we kind of get into the book.

Arnold Stricker:

As you look back on the history of the people that you've seen play on for the Cardinals, who would you.

Arnold Stricker:

How would you rank players or who's a player that stands out to your players that stand out to you?

Bob Thieman:

Well, you know, the 21 and 2 would be museum and Pujols, but I had my own favorites.

Bob Thieman:

I mean, not necessarily the best players, but my favorites.

Bob Thieman:

But I, I was big Mike Tyson fan.

Bob Thieman:

Not, not the boxer, but the second base shortstop in the 70s.

Arnold Stricker:

Okay.

Arnold Stricker:

What fascinated you about him?

Bob Thieman:

Oh, the fact that he made a career out of not a great deal of talent and he was pretty scrappy, especially in those around those double plays.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, right, right.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

And there was another player you mentioned.

Bob Thieman:

You thought, oh, well, John Tudor was just so fun to watch pitch when he, he could make.

Bob Thieman:

Guys like I remember, especially Von Hayes, who played for the Phillies, had a big, wide open stance and Tudor could throw him slow, slower and slowest.

Bob Thieman:

And Hayes, you can just see the smoke coming out of his ears when he's trying to hold that back.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah, all of them.

Bob Thieman:

Really?

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, but that's cool.

Arnold Stricker:

So this 64 cardinals book, why that year and why this book?

Bob Thieman:

Well, in many ways, first of all, the Cardinals had gone 18 years without winning a pen and getting the World Series.

Bob Thieman:

And there were no playoffs or anything, just the World Series.

Mark Langston:

They're kind of on their way now to that.

Mark Langston:

Yeah, never mind.

Mark Langston:

Sorry.

Bob Thieman:

But.

Bob Thieman:

And it was just so.

Bob Thieman:

It was a very unique season.

Bob Thieman:

All the turmoil.

Bob Thieman:

There was turmoil in the front office, turmoil in the clubhouse.

Bob Thieman:

The team wasn't.

Bob Thieman:

Looks like it wasn't going to go anywhere.

Bob Thieman:

So Gussie Bush was at wit's end, what to do.

Bob Thieman:

Fired the general manager in August, was going to fire the manager and bring in Leo deroser for the new manager.

Bob Thieman:

But he said, well, we'll wait till after the end of the season for that.

Bob Thieman:

Then they win the pennant.

Bob Thieman:

Johnny Keane, the manager that won the pennant, had already decided he was going to quit.

Bob Thieman:

So they have the day after the World Series, first of all, in New York, the Yankees fired Yogi Berra the day after the World Series, even though they'd won the pennant.

Bob Thieman:

He'd won the pennant in his first year as a manager.

Bob Thieman:

And then the Cardinals had a press conference at the brewery and we're going to announce a new contract for Johnny Keene.

Bob Thieman:

Said Keen handed Gussie Bush his resignation letter, which had been dated two weeks before, saying, you know, I've had enough, no more.

Bob Thieman:

And then five days after that, Johnny Keane signs to manage the Yankees.

Bob Thieman:

So he kind of had this deal in his back pocket the whole time playing against, even playing against the Yankees in the World Series.

Bob Thieman:

So it's just odd or unique circumstances all year long.

Arnold Stricker:

It was very unusual.

Arnold Stricker:

You lead up to that series with a variety of historical facts and kind of stats on the team and how the team was built.

Arnold Stricker:

And would you go into that a little bit?

Bob Thieman:

Well, Busch bought the team.

Bob Thieman:

Anheuser Busch bought the team with Gussie Bush as the president of the club, as well as the president, of course, of the Brewery.

Bob Thieman:

And he didn't know much about baseball.

Bob Thieman:

So the first general manager that they had was a guy named Dick Meyer, who was a brewer.

Bob Thieman:

He didn't have any baseball background.

Bob Thieman:

So they eventually hired a guy named Frank Lane, who was a professional general manager.

Bob Thieman:

Trader Frank.

Bob Thieman:

He traded every.

Bob Thieman:

He wanted to make trades, you know, every morning it seemed he traded Red Shane Deanston.

Bob Thieman:

That was not very popular.

Bob Thieman:

And he was about to trade.

Bob Thieman:

He was working on a trade for Stan Musial.

Bob Thieman:

And the Brewery said, no, you can't do that.

Bob Thieman:

That'll ruin our fan base.

Bob Thieman:

So Lane quit the team.

Bob Thieman:

Then, you know, said, well, if I can't make the decisions, you know, I'm gone.

Bob Thieman:

So Lane's assistant, Bing Devine, who was a St.

Bob Thieman:

the team before World War II,:

Bob Thieman:

Then there was a trade in the works for Ken Boyer, for Richie Ashburn to the Phillies.

Bob Thieman:

Now Ashburn's a Hall of Fame center fielder, but a little older than Boyer.

Bob Thieman:

And Devine decided he was going to build a team around Bowyer.

Bob Thieman:

And so he, very methodically,:

Bob Thieman:

Then they brought in Dick Grote.

Bob Thieman:

And there was some guys coming up through the minor league system too.

Bob Thieman:

Tim McCarver, Bob Gibson, most notably.

Bob Thieman:

And it was SLOW Going until 63, they finally made a run at the pennant.

Bob Thieman:

They, they got with a month to go, they were six, seven games out behind the Dodgers.

Bob Thieman:

And then they won 19 games out of 20 over a 17 game day period.

Arnold Stricker:

Wow.

Bob Thieman:

And suddenly they were only a game behind.

Bob Thieman:

And with two weeks to go and here we go.

Bob Thieman:

Cardinals are going to win.

Bob Thieman:

Then the Dodgers came to town, swept a three game series and Carl's Penner hopes for 63 were gone.

Bob Thieman:

But they were in good shape for 64.

Bob Thieman:

Everybody thought they'd be real contenders and of course they got off to a bad start.

Bob Thieman:

And Divine made his last big trade then at the trading date to bring in a guy named Lou Brock.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, huge trade, a huge trade.

Bob Thieman:

And initially when the trade was made for Brock, everybody said, well, we gave up our opening day starter, ERNIE BROGLIO.

Bob Thieman:

Won 18 games the year before, won 20 previous years, and all we get is this guy Brock who can't seem to find his way with the Cubs.

Bob Thieman:

The Cubs wanted Brock to be a power hitter and he did have some great power.

Bob Thieman:

He hit the only home run ever into the center field bleachers at the polo or the right center field bleachers at the polo ground.

Bob Thieman:

Pretty small window there to, to hit but 480 foot home run.

Bob Thieman:

Wow.

Mark Langston:

Wow.

Bob Thieman:

So he could, you know, hit the ball far, but struck out a lot.

Bob Thieman:

And the Cubs were not a running team at all.

Bob Thieman:

Well, the Johnny Keane, the Cardinal manager, he got Brock specifically to add some speed to the offense, aggressiveness.

Bob Thieman:

So Brock came to the team and immediately won the fans and the team, his teammates over the Cubs, they thought that, you know, he was a very quiet guy, very intense, but the Cubs thought, you know, that means he's indifferent.

Bob Thieman:

But and the Cardinals though, they found out that he was just, you know, that's the way he was and he was really driven to be a great to greatness.

Bob Thieman:

And when he got to what Keane said, you just go ahead and run, don't worry about hitting home runs, you know, steal bases, get on, you know, get your base hits.

Bob Thieman:

And that really impressed.

Bob Thieman:

The team was impressed pretty quickly and the city was agog.

Bob Thieman:

It took him like 10 days to steal seven bases with the Cardinals to tie for the team lead at that point.

Arnold Stricker:

You kind of mentioned in the book that he did not get a lot of direction in Chicago.

Arnold Stricker:

He played baseball late I guess in high school and really didn't have a lot of focus from the managers back then.

Bob Thieman:

No, no.

Bob Thieman:

Well, the Cubs didn't even have a manager back then.

Bob Thieman:

They had college of coaches, they called it, with one coach being designated as head coach.

Bob Thieman:

They did it for four years.

Arnold Stricker:

That explains things.

Mark Langston:

Chicago and the Goat.

Mark Langston:

Yeah, the whole thing, the whole thing.

Bob Thieman:

But, but one.

Bob Thieman:

But finally the last Cub head coach told Brock just before he got traded actually that, you know, you're thinking up there, you, you go up there to bat and you're thinking too much.

Bob Thieman:

Just, just swing the bat.

Bob Thieman:

And so then when he got to the Cardinals, he didn't have to think, you know, just get on, you know, I'm not, don't have to worry about the long ball.

Bob Thieman:

This so he could play his game, which, know, his game was a Hall of Fame as Hall of Fame ball players.

Arnold Stricker:

You know, you bring up a great point there that sometimes when I watch a game, whether it be baseball or football or basketball, and I'm thinking, sometimes guys overthink and then sometimes guys don't think at all.

Arnold Stricker:

And in, in baseball, how much you know it, I don't want to say it's some guy's going to become a head case, but they can psych themselves out.

Arnold Stricker:

Or does management put so many screws on people that they've got so much going on they just can't naturally go out and have fun and enjoy what they've done?

Bob Thieman:

Well, that, you know, that's always a debate.

Bob Thieman:

You know, the Cardinals, Johnny Keenan and Red Chain names, they were just let the players play, you know, develop their own talent.

Bob Thieman:

Develop their talent, do what you can to help them, but then don't try to make them fit your mold.

Bob Thieman:

Exactly.

Bob Thieman:

manager ever was John McGraw,:

Bob Thieman:

Won 10 pennants for the Giants and he controlled, he called all the pitches and players.

Bob Thieman:

You know, the famous story that he sent guys, was sent up to bunt, he had a home run and McGraw fined him for not bunting.

Bob Thieman:

So, so, so there's, you know, two different ways to look at it.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, right.

Bob Thieman:

I, you know, letting the guys play has worked pretty well for the Cardinals, so over many decades, though.

Arnold Stricker:

So right now, Ernie Broglio, he did not actually turn out to be the pitcher that Chicago thought he was going to be.

Bob Thieman:

No, he was, he was damaged goods, really.

Bob Thieman:

He'd had a little bit of a problem, shoulder problem with the Cardinals and missed a couple starts in 64, but he never really overcame it.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Bob Thieman:

So he, you know, won like six set games after that as a Cub entirely.

Arnold Stricker:

So you get into something that, and we might do this in the second half where this whole aspect you bring in history into this book, you talk about a little bit about Stam Musial being brought onto the presidential fitness program after his retirement.

Arnold Stricker:

And I'm sure he was disappointed that they didn't win in 63 because he wasn't a part of the team after that.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Arnold Stricker:

ts or the Civil Rights act of:

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

The first big Civil Rights act since really reconstruction.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Arnold Stricker:

And when we come back after the break, we got several, several minutes yet.

Arnold Stricker:

But in our, in our next segment, I want you to talk about how the Cardinals dealt with that because they dealt with that in a unique way.

Arnold Stricker:

I'm kind of teasing the listeners right now to stay.

Arnold Stricker:

To stay over because they dealt with it, you correct me if I'm wrong, more uniquely than any other team at the time.

Bob Thieman:

That's a.

Bob Thieman:

To the general consensus that when Marvin Miller, the player union head, came, he would visit each club and he remarked later that the Cardinals seemed to have the best harmony of any clubhouse, any team.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

And that harmony extended in spring training.

Arnold Stricker:

And we'll get into a couple stories about that.

Arnold Stricker:

Now, you did this co.

Arnold Stricker:

Did this book with Ron Jacober.

Arnold Stricker:

How do you co.

Arnold Stricker:

Write a book together?

Arnold Stricker:

What's that?

Arnold Stricker:

How do you do that?

Bob Thieman:

Well, we, there's various ways, but I did most of the historic text and he interviewed the living players to get their specific memories.

Bob Thieman:

And he, you know, added some of his insights too.

Arnold Stricker:

But, and most people know Ron Jacober.

Arnold Stricker:

And if you've been in St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis a while, you know, he was a news broadcaster, television and radio and a sports broadcast.

Mark Langston:

He.

Mark Langston:

Sports broadcaster announced the, he used to announce the games on what, I guess Channel 5 for a while.

Arnold Stricker:

Right?

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

Yep.

Mark Langston:

And he, when they used to like share it with like five would do it this couple of these games and then somebody do.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

He says that they had like 30 games a year was the most they ever did, but that was, you know, and that was all you got except for the Saturday game of the week.

Arnold Stricker:

Well, and to give Ron his, his due here he's covered sports on radio and television for 47 years.

Mark Langston:

Wow.

Arnold Stricker:

Cardinal, baseball, blues hockey, college basketball on ESPN, college football, soccer games, hundreds of them.

Arnold Stricker:

The Olympics for CBS Radio, a longtime sports director for KMOX Radio, he's a member of the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Radio hall of Fame, St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Media hall of Fame, St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Sports hall of Fame, and the Missouri Sports hall of Fame.

Mark Langston:

Now I also remember Ron announcing the most boring sport ever.

Mark Langston:

Golf.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah, maybe he may have.

Mark Langston:

I thought he did something he was.

Bob Thieman:

With, he, he worked with at Channel 5, Jay Randolph.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Jay Randolph was the golf guy.

Mark Langston:

Okay.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Mark Langston:

All right.

Mark Langston:

All right.

Mark Langston:

Well, that could be.

Mark Langston:

All right.

Arnold Stricker:

Jay Randolph, he broadcasts the most boring sport, golf.

Mark Langston:

It's the worst.

Mark Langston:

I mean, I like golf.

Mark Langston:

Don't get wrong My family, my wife's side loves golf.

Mark Langston:

But boy, to watch golf.

Mark Langston:

I think watching paint dry is better.

Bob Thieman:

Oh yeah.

Bob Thieman:

You know, it's, it's so three dimensional.

Bob Thieman:

And you watch on two dimensional screen.

Mark Langston:

Okay.

Bob Thieman:

And you see the ball, a blue dot in the black.

Mark Langston:

I know.

Mark Langston:

Where is it?

Mark Langston:

How do they follow it with the camera?

Mark Langston:

I'm like, okay, sorry, I didn't mean to take that.

Bob Thieman:

But we digress.

Mark Langston:

Right.

Arnold Stricker:

So if we have time to get to answer this question, why is the game so slow Now I remember Bob Gibson pitching the game would be like an hour and 55 minutes.

Bob Thieman:

They do take, well, the batters as much as the pitchers, you know.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Take it out.

Arnold Stricker:

Taking off the gloves and.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Arnold Stricker:

You know, knocking the shoes and.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

Getting out, just stepping out and.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Mark Langston:

In and out.

Bob Thieman:

But the.

Bob Thieman:

It's also another thing, maybe too thinking too much.

Bob Thieman:

You know, we got to study those charts.

Bob Thieman:

Now you don't see those same teams as much as you used to.

Bob Thieman:

So oftentimes, you know, you're not nearly as familiar.

Bob Thieman:

You know, Bob Gibson knew exactly what he was going to do with Henry or try to do with Henry Aaron every time.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

So but you know, then you get a.

Bob Thieman:

Tampa Bay comes in once every other year and you don't know any of those batters.

Bob Thieman:

So yeah, you got to figure out, you know, study your card inside your hat.

Mark Langston:

That's true.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

You got to do your homework ahead of time.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, just blow it by him.

Mark Langston:

I love it.

Mark Langston:

This is great.

Mark Langston:

I'm enjoying this interview.

Arnold Stricker:

This is.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

Well, we're going to get into some real fun stuff and about the stadiums also, man.

Arnold Stricker:

Sportsman's Park.

Arnold Stricker:

What a, what a real deal.

Arnold Stricker:

That was.

Arnold Stricker:

That was unbelievable.

Bob Thieman:

ame played on that lot was in:

Mark Langston:

Wow.

Mark Langston:

Holy smokes.

Mark Langston:

Was that the Negro League then?

Bob Thieman:

That was the original.

Bob Thieman:

The first pro team, the St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis Brown Stockings.

Mark Langston:

Okay.

Bob Thieman:

The next year the National League got founded and was a member of that league.

Mark Langston:

Wow, this is wonderful.

Arnold Stricker:

We're going to come back and talk to Bob Thieman some more.

Arnold Stricker:

We're talking about his new book with ron Jacober, the 64 Cardinals, a team, A Season and a Showdown for the Ages.

Arnold Stricker:

We'll be right back after our next segment.

Arnold Stricker:

You're listening to St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in tune with Arnold Stricker and Mark Langston on the U.S.

Arnold Stricker:

radio Network.

Arnold Stricker:

Welcome back to St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in Tune.

Arnold Stricker:

This is Arnold Stricker with Mark Langston.

Arnold Stricker:

We're talking to Bob Thieman.

Arnold Stricker:

He's award winning baseball historian and author.

Arnold Stricker:

And he's an author with Ron Jacober of The new book 64 Cardinals A Team, A Season, A Showdown for the Ages.

Arnold Stricker:

And that book, folks, is available from reedy Press in St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis here.

Arnold Stricker:

It's a hardcover book, 11 by 11.

Arnold Stricker:

It's just got great photos, wonderful, wonderful story in here.

Arnold Stricker:

And there's going to be an upcoming book signing also at St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Public Library, the Schlafly branch on euclid.

Arnold Stricker:

That's Tuesday, April 26th at 6pm there's an author presentation at the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis City Library.

Arnold Stricker:

That's Grants View.

Arnold Stricker:

That's at 7pm on May 17th.

Arnold Stricker:

And then at Barnes and Noble out at Mid Rivers Mall.

Arnold Stricker:

th from:

Arnold Stricker:

So I'll repeat those at the end of this segment and you can get this book again from reedy press.

Arnold Stricker:

That's reedypress.com so Bob, we were kind of talking off air about Dick Groat and he was the shortstop at the time.

Arnold Stricker:

And in the book you mention he and Johnny Keane, they, they kind of clashed a little bit.

Arnold Stricker:

And you were commenting about, well, Grote.

Bob Thieman:

Was the league batting title and mvp, batting champion, MVP for the Pirates.

Bob Thieman:

And he, you know, was the along with, well, he was the sort of senior member or with the most seniority in the league, at least not with the team.

Bob Thieman:

So when the Cardinals got him in 63, he almost won the batting title again.

Bob Thieman:

He's finished second in the league MVP voting, you know, and was sort of the star of the team.

Bob Thieman:

And he was very good at hitting to the opposite field, the right hand hitter who could hit, hit and run behind the, the guys on base, Kurt Flood, for instance.

Bob Thieman:

And that worked out very well.

Bob Thieman:

But then at 64 and Grote would call it himself, he would say I'm going to hit and run.

Bob Thieman:

He'd signal to the batter or the Baserunner.

Bob Thieman:

And in 64 he kept doing that, but it wasn't working out as well.

Bob Thieman:

And so Johnny Keane, the manager of the Cardinals said, said you can't call it on your own anymore.

Bob Thieman:

I'm going to take away your privilege, hit and run privilege.

Bob Thieman:

And that really riled Grote and Groat was, you know, kind of a, an agitator by nature.

Bob Thieman:

You know, he would, he would get on the younger players if they made a mistake and you know, tell them in no uncertain terms, you know, what they should have done.

Bob Thieman:

You know.

Bob Thieman:

So although he did, he didn't really cause too much friction in the clubhouse But Keane thought his authority is being questioned.

Bob Thieman:

So they had a kind of a clubhouse meeting right after the All Star break.

Bob Thieman:

And Grote, or Keane called him out, laid down the law for Grote.

Bob Thieman:

Grote apologized to the whole team and sort of cleared the air.

Bob Thieman:

Now, this had some effects later in that Grote complained about losing his hit and run privilege to a number of people, including Eddie Matthews of the Braves.

Bob Thieman:

Now, Eddie Matthews daughter was dating Gussie Bush's or Eddie Matthews was dating Gussie Bush's daughter.

Mark Langston:

Oh, boy.

Bob Thieman:

So Gussie heard about the friction between Kean and Groat through his daughter, through the Braves, and he thought he'd been left out of the loop.

Bob Thieman:

And so that was one of the last straws that broke the back that, you know, Gus says, we're going to have to clean house.

Bob Thieman:

And first he fired the general manager, Bing Devine, and then it was.

Bob Thieman:

Everybody knew that Johnny Keane would go at the end of the year.

Arnold Stricker:

But when did Grote leave the card?

Mark Langston:

Never knew any of this.

Bob Thieman:

He paid 66.

Bob Thieman:

65 was his last year.

Bob Thieman:

He was traded away.

Arnold Stricker:

I'm surprised he didn't get traded right away.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah, well, he was too good a player, really.

Bob Thieman:

And also then for the second half, you know, the problem, you know, there was.

Bob Thieman:

He wasn't a problem.

Bob Thieman:

So, you know, the heart, you know, the harmony finally was restored.

Arnold Stricker:

And you mean, you mean he didn't have to put it on Twitter or social media.

Arnold Stricker:

You know, he just, he just told another famous player who has happened to be dating the owner's daughter.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, you know, yeah, well, I think.

Bob Thieman:

You know, he probably killed a lot of other players, too.

Bob Thieman:

So, you know, but Matthews and Groat were about the same age, you know, and so they'd been in the league together, playing his rivals for a long.

Arnold Stricker:

Time, another wonderful player, Eddie Matthews.

Bob Thieman:

Yes, There you go.

Arnold Stricker:

Now, 64.

Arnold Stricker:

We're talking about the 64 series here, but prior to that, with integration.

Arnold Stricker:

And by the way, if you're listening, today, it's April 15th.

Arnold Stricker:

If you're listening, and this is being played in July.

Arnold Stricker:

Oh, well, it's April 15th when we're broadcasting this.

Arnold Stricker:

This is the anniversary of Jackie Robinson coming into the league at the Brooklyn Dodgers.

Arnold Stricker:

And there's a connection there with the person who brought him in and the person who used to actually work for the Cardinals.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

The Robinson was signed by the Brooklyn Dodgers and their general manager, Branch Rickey.

Bob Thieman:

Now, Rickey had been with the St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis Cardinals from:

Bob Thieman:

He had sort of invented this farm system turned The Cardinals from no, you know, perennial losers into, you know, the powerhouse of the National League.

Bob Thieman:

And but then he, his general manager, he was the president of the team, was Sam Braden.

Bob Thieman:

And so Braden would pick the manager and Rickey would build the team for the manager.

Bob Thieman:

And also Ricky also had a deal where if he sold contracts for players and he signed lots of young players, lots of talent, and there was lots of players that he sold to other National League teams.

Bob Thieman:

And so Ricky got a cut of all those sales or percentage.

Bob Thieman:

So Ricky was doing pretty well for himself.

Bob Thieman:

Now Braden was doing pretty well for himself too.

Bob Thieman:

But at one point in:

Bob Thieman:

And Braden a year later, fired Blades.

Bob Thieman:

And so Ricky's, you know, the tension which has always been there between the two, that was finally it.

Bob Thieman:

Rickey's contract ran out in:

Bob Thieman:

And Rickey had always been in the back of his mind that he's going to try to integrate the, you know, bring African Americans into the big leagues.

Bob Thieman:

Now, St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis was not the place to do that, right.

Bob Thieman:

But Brooklyn was.

Bob Thieman:

So he hired, had his scouts, scouted, Negro leagues, a lot of talent there.

Bob Thieman:

But he focused on Jackie Robinson, who was college educated, been an officer in the army and, but was not known for his baseball skills.

Bob Thieman:

He was a football star, track star at ucla, but hadn't played much.

Bob Thieman:

He only played one year of professional Negro league baseball.

Bob Thieman:

And when he was the guy that they signed, a lot of the Negro League players thought, well, we got a lot better than him.

Bob Thieman:

Why they used to using him.

Bob Thieman:

And a lot of the players like Bob Feller, who'd been a barnstorming, who barnstormed against Negro Leaguers for a long time, he said, oh, you know, he's not that good.

Bob Thieman:

You know, we can tie him up with inside fastballs.

Bob Thieman:

He won't make it in the big leagues, but actually turned out to be a star player and a great clutch hitter and outstanding feeler and a baserunner extraordinaire.

Bob Thieman:

So he turned out to be more than anybody expected of him, except maybe Ricky and his scouts.

Arnold Stricker:

And when you think about being the first player like that.

Arnold Stricker:

I know I read an article recently that he also wasn't from the south, he was from the West Coast.

Arnold Stricker:

And so he was not accustomed to how blacks were treated back then in the South.

Arnold Stricker:

And you want to try to make things successful, not stumble.

Arnold Stricker:

And I think Branch Rickey Thought that Jackie Robinson, you know, army officer, you know, UCLA graduate, you know, star, you know, and he wasn't from the south, that this was going to be.

Arnold Stricker:

He was going to be more successful than somebody else who.

Bob Thieman:

Oh yes, he, yes, definitely had the temperament and the dedication.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

To be the self control.

Arnold Stricker:

Endure.

Bob Thieman:

To endure.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Arnold Stricker:

What he did.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

Now if you, if you wouldn't mind, get into what, what the Cardinals did in the early 60s and it was really led by a couple of players, right.

Bob Thieman:

The Cardinals and the Yankees both used to have their spring training in St.

Bob Thieman:

Petersburg, Florida and for many years.

Bob Thieman:

So from the end of World War II up through the mid-60s and, and every year the Florida, the St.

Bob Thieman:

Petersburg Chamber of Commerce held a big luncheon to highlight We're a big baseball town.

Bob Thieman:

And they'd invite all the white players, but none of the black or Latin players.

Bob Thieman:

And this was:

Bob Thieman:

The, there was laws against certain, I guess there were mixing of races.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

And Bill White, who was born and actually been born in Florida, but raised in Youngstown, Ohio.

Bob Thieman:

He, he was not a rabble rouser by any means, but he told a New York sports writer that, you know, you know, he complained about that and said, you know, when are they going to treat us like humans?

Bob Thieman:

And so this Art Rickman, the sports writer, published that in New York.

Bob Thieman:

It got picked up here in St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis and I think one of the newspapers, the Globe Democrat said, you know, let's boycott Budweiser, you know, because they're supporting racism.

Bob Thieman:

Racism?

Bob Thieman:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

So Bush said, well, you know, that's not good for sales.

Bob Thieman:

And Bush was not known, you know, for his.

Bob Thieman:

Any racial prejudices in his workplace.

Bob Thieman:

So he arranged to have some of his associates or friends of his, they bought two adjacent motels outside of St.

Bob Thieman:

Pete down by the Skyway, if you know the area there.

Bob Thieman:

And one for the.

Bob Thieman:

We had the whole team during spring training stay at that one motel and all the players, both white and black, all their families, even Ken Boyer, Bill, Stan Musio, the big stars who, you know, been there many years and had private arrangements, you know, they'd rent a house or, or go stay with, you know, the same guys, same friends.

Bob Thieman:

They all joined the team at the motel.

Bob Thieman:

The wives got to get together, you know, barbecue out on the patio.

Bob Thieman:

The kids, there was like 30 kids at one point, you know, during spring break saying here.

Bob Thieman:

And the white and black kids swimming would swim in this.

Arnold Stricker:

Now hang on folks.

Arnold Stricker:

Say that again, Bob.

Arnold Stricker:

Say that again.

Bob Thieman:

White folks would swim in the same.

Bob Thieman:

The swimming Pool together.

Arnold Stricker:

And that was unusual.

Bob Thieman:

That was illegal, actually, although nobody tried to enforce it, thank goodness.

Bob Thieman:

But people would drive down the highway.

Arnold Stricker:

And stop and sell tickets.

Bob Thieman:

But it made for a very close team.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

Cohesive.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Yes.

Bob Thieman:

And it also, within the next couple years, all the teams had integrated their.

Arnold Stricker:

Living facilities because at the time, if you were a black player, you had to go stay in the black section of town.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah.

Mark Langston:

Oh, yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Bob Gibson talked about his first spring training.

Bob Thieman:

You know, he flow flew in, gets a taxicab that goes to the hotel in downtown St.

Bob Thieman:

Petersburg, says, I'm with the Cardinals.

Bob Thieman:

You have room for me?

Bob Thieman:

The desk clerk says, oh, here's the cab driver address to take him to a private home in the Negro section of St.

Bob Thieman:

Pete.

Bob Thieman:

And the next year then Gibson thought, well, you know, now I'd probably make the team.

Bob Thieman:

So a lot of people would bring their families.

Bob Thieman:

So he drove with his wife and kid down from Omaha, Nebraska, where he born and raised and said it was the worst trip ever because they could buy gas, but they couldn't use the restroom.

Bob Thieman:

And the gas stations they had or, you know, only restaurants along the road.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Bob Thieman:

And, you know, guys like white and Gibson and Kurt Flood, who's from California, you know, they.

Bob Thieman:

They just couldn't stand, you know, the segregation.

Bob Thieman:

And they, they were pretty outspoken about it.

Bob Thieman:

Although, like, say they weren't, you know, militant, you.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, right.

Bob Thieman:

But.

Bob Thieman:

And they, you know, they would make a point of inviting some of their white teammates to go out to dinner or whatever.

Bob Thieman:

You know, just so you know, we're.

Bob Thieman:

We're a team.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, right.

Bob Thieman:

And they really did become a team.

Bob Thieman:

And guys like Tim McCarver, whose dad was a Memphis cop, who, you know, Memphis was not the most friendly, friendly to Negro citizens.

Arnold Stricker:

And he's spoken about that and Gibson's spoken about their relationship and how Bob Gibson really kind of helped Tim McCarver understand, you know, things aren't that different, you know.

Bob Thieman:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

And there was, you know, sort of a quiet assistance.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

That they do.

Bob Thieman:

And then, of course, McCarver and Gibson were, you know, friends for life.

Arnold Stricker:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

You know, even in their 70s, they were touring the wine country of France together.

Mark Langston:

Except for them.

Arnold Stricker:

What's your favorite story of the 64 World Series or the 64 season?

Bob Thieman:

Well, the 64 season.

Bob Thieman:

The final week of the season.

Bob Thieman:

The final two weeks of the season were unbelievable.

Bob Thieman:

Really?

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

What happened to the Phillies?

Bob Thieman:

The Phillies, well, six and a half game lead with 12 to play, and then they lost 10 in a row, including.

Bob Thieman:

Including three to Cincinnati and three to St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis second and third place and four to Milwaukee was fifth place.

Arnold Stricker:

They were just sharing the brotherly love.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah, yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Well they, they lost their last seven home games that were booed out of the even though they've been in first place the whole year.

Bob Thieman:

They were booed out of Philadelphia.

Arnold Stricker:

Couldn't happen to a nicer team.

Bob Thieman:

But the Cardinals then won eight in a row and the Reds had a nine game winning streak.

Bob Thieman:

So they both passed the Phillies.

Bob Thieman:

But then the Reds lost several games and the Cardinals got to the final series of the season three games to go against the Mets.

Bob Thieman:

The Mets were terrible.

Bob Thieman:

The their third straight hunter loss season and the Cardinals the Mets had an eight game winning streak.

Bob Thieman:

The Cardinals had or Mets had an eighth game losing streak.

Bob Thieman:

Cardinal just won eight in a row.

Bob Thieman:

So all the Cardinals had to do is win all three to clinch the pennant.

Bob Thieman:

Since nothing Cincinnati would have been able to do to catch him right.

Bob Thieman:

Cincinnati had two games to play against the Phillies and the Cardinals lost on Friday to the Mets.

Bob Thieman:

Bob Gibson got beat one nothing.

Bob Thieman:

Cardinals had the base or a couple men on base and got what looked like a game tying base hit and the ball hit the umpire dead ball.

Bob Thieman:

They had to send the runner back.

Bob Thieman:

Guy never did score.

Bob Thieman:

So the Cardinals complained that we lost because the Mets had an extra infielder.

Arnold Stricker:

He was dressed in blue.

Bob Thieman:

But luckily the Reds lost.

Bob Thieman:

The Reds suddenly had some problems too.

Bob Thieman:

And then on Friday, Saturday The Cardinals lost 15 to 5 to the lowly Mets made six errors then.

Bob Thieman:

So it comes down to Sunday, the Cardinals are a game ahead of both the Phillies and they're tied with the Reds in a game ahead with the Phillies.

Bob Thieman:

So it could have been a three way tie.

Bob Thieman:

If the Phillies won and the Cardinals lost, the Reds would lose them to the Phillies.

Bob Thieman:

So even though the last day it could have been a three way tie, the Phillies after having their 10 game losing streak snapped the game before they won easy 10 to nothing.

Bob Thieman:

The Reds were just, they had internal problems and just didn't show up.

Bob Thieman:

Basically the Cardinals finally were able to beat the Mets.

Bob Thieman:

A slugfest.

Bob Thieman:

Bob Gibson won one day's rest, came out, pitched four innings in relief, just ran out of gas.

Bob Thieman:

In the ninth day they brought in Barney Schultz, their reliever who was a key to their pennant run.

Arnold Stricker:

Knuckleballer.

Bob Thieman:

The knuckleballer, yeah, he'd been a, it was his 21st professional season.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah he was, he was up there.

Bob Thieman:

In age, he was but you know the knuckle ball he throw forever right as Johnny Keane Said, well, he can't pitch long, but he can pitch every day.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Bob Thieman:

And he pretty much did down the stretch.

Bob Thieman:

So the Cardinals won the Penner on the final day of the season.

Bob Thieman:

Harry Carey finished his broadcast from right behind the Cardinal dugout, sitting right next to Gussie Bush.

Bob Thieman:

And so the last batter, you can hear Gussie Bush on the radio saying, come on, get him out, get him out.

Bob Thieman:

And then they get him out.

Bob Thieman:

Harry starts screaming, the Cardinals win the pennant.

Bob Thieman:

The Cardinals win the pennant.

Arnold Stricker:

I remember listening to that.

Bob Thieman:

The Cardinals win the pennant.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, that was crazy.

Bob Thieman:

It was crazy.

Bob Thieman:

And so the miracle, it finally happened.

Bob Thieman:

They actually won the pennant after nobody had given them a chance almost all year.

Bob Thieman:

So.

Arnold Stricker:

And then to come up against the Yankees, who had this dynasty, you know, you had Mantle, you had Maris, you had Yogi, and it just seemed like all these great pitchers, you know, it was Whitey Ford and Stalomayer.

Bob Thieman:

Yeah, Stoudemire was a rookie, but Whitey Ford, Jim Bouton, yeah, he would beat the Cardinals twice that series.

Arnold Stricker:

That was a challenge.

Bob Thieman:

It was a challenge.

Bob Thieman:

The Yankees had won.

Bob Thieman:

This is the 14th pennant in 16 years for the Yankees.

Arnold Stricker:

Oh, my gosh.

Bob Thieman:

But.

Bob Thieman:

And then they, you know, be another 12 years before they won another pennant, so.

Arnold Stricker:

Reminds me of a team that beat the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Rams at a time.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, I'm not even going to mention their name.

Arnold Stricker:

So the final game, you know, we're tied three to three, three, three wins apiece.

Arnold Stricker:

And the Cardinals come in and man, they're just.

Arnold Stricker:

They just start to blow it open.

Bob Thieman:

Well, they, yeah, they've got out to a three nothing lead.

Bob Thieman:

The first run.

Bob Thieman:

And the Yankees really played bad defense the whole series.

Bob Thieman:

The first run, The Cardinals scored one.

Bob Thieman:

The Yankees tried to turn a 3 to 6 to 1 double play with the pitcher covering, throw went behind and the man from second base wound up scoring.

Bob Thieman:

Then they had a double steal.

Bob Thieman:

Mike Shannon hadn't.

Bob Thieman:

Well, it was supposed to be a hit and run, but Maxville swung and missed.

Bob Thieman:

Dal Maxville, the substitute second baseman for the series.

Bob Thieman:

The Elston Howard, Yankees catcher, another big star.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, Right.

Bob Thieman:

He threw down the second base.

Bob Thieman:

Bobby Richardson, the second baseman, saw that Tim McCarver broke from third when Shannon went to steal second.

Bob Thieman:

The double play, the regular double steal.

Bob Thieman:

And so Richardson cuts in front, sort of ignoring Shannon.

Bob Thieman:

Shannon tried to slide right into him, got a little piece of him.

Bob Thieman:

The ball was in the dirt and McCarver stole home.

Bob Thieman:

Then.

Mark Langston:

Wow.

Bob Thieman:

So they.

Bob Thieman:

And then Lou Brock hit a home run.

Bob Thieman:

Ken Boyer actually hit a home run that game Too.

Bob Thieman:

The Cardinals had a six nothing lead until Mickey Mantle hit a three run homer in the seventh inning.

Bob Thieman:

And oh, you know, so for six innings the Cardinal fans are going crazy.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

And now suddenly it's a little tense here.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

Well, Boyer hit a home run to make it 7 to 3.

Bob Thieman:

And in the ninth inning, Gibson, who is running out of gas, he's pitching on two days rest after having pitched 10 inning complete game.

Mark Langston:

Right.

Bob Thieman:

A couple days before, he gave up two solo home runs.

Mark Langston:

Oh my.

Bob Thieman:

But Johnny Keane left him in and he finally got the last out, a pop up.

Bob Thieman:

Al Maxville was under it.

Bob Thieman:

Dick wrote yells over, don't let it hit you in the coconut, Maxie.

Bob Thieman:

And so Maxville, oh, suddenly he got nervous, but he made the catch.

Mark Langston:

I'd be very nervous.

Mark Langston:

I would have been.

Bob Thieman:

So the Cardinals win the game.

Bob Thieman:

There's a great picture, famous picture of Dick Bob Gibson collapsing into the arms of Ken Boyer at the mound.

Mark Langston:

Yeah, they're hugging.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

You know, you could see, you know, just given every ounce he had.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

And people asked Keane afterwards, well, why didn't you take him out?

Bob Thieman:

You know, he's obviously losing.

Bob Thieman:

And Keane's great quote was, oh, I had a commitment to his heart.

Arnold Stricker:

Oh, that's absolutely, absolutely.

Bob Thieman:

And then keen good for him in the locker room, then gave Gibson a big hug.

Bob Thieman:

Keane had been the manager in Omaha when Gibson signed his first right.

Bob Thieman:

Pro contract right at his home, played for his hometown Omaha Cardinals.

Arnold Stricker:

So he knew him really well.

Bob Thieman:

Very well.

Bob Thieman:

Yes.

Bob Thieman:

s manager of the Cardinals in:

Bob Thieman:

But then in the locker room, he gave Gibson a big hug.

Bob Thieman:

He sent that.

Bob Thieman:

Way to go hoot.

Bob Thieman:

Nothing can stop you now.

Bob Thieman:

And Gibson, you know, was.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, the rest is history on that.

Bob Thieman:

The rest is history, certainly.

Bob Thieman:

But Gibson didn't realize that Keane was going to quit the next day.

Arnold Stricker:

Right, right.

Bob Thieman:

And he was saying good.

Bob Thieman:

He was just saying goodbye was his way to say goodbye.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

We've been having a great conversation with Bob Thieman.

Arnold Stricker:

He is an author with Ron Jacober of a new book, 64 Cardinals.

Arnold Stricker:

It is available at Reedy Press.

Arnold Stricker:

64 Cardinals, a team, a season and a showdown for the ages.

Arnold Stricker:

And I want to remind folks, on April 26th at the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Public Library Schlafly Branch that's on Euclid at 6pm there's going to be a book signing, also a book signing.

Arnold Stricker:

June 4th at Mid Rivers Mall, Barnes and Noble, 11 to 12 o'clock.

Arnold Stricker:

And on May 17th, an author presentation at the St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis City Library, Grants View.

Arnold Stricker:

That's at 7:00pm Bob, this has been a great book.

Arnold Stricker:

I really enjoy these kinds of things.

Arnold Stricker:

And I think you and Ron did a great job of capturing the essence of where the team was and how they got there and then kind of framed it with some historical things.

Arnold Stricker:

It's just marvelous book.

Arnold Stricker:

Kudos to you.

Bob Thieman:

Thank you.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Bob Thieman:

That Grants View Library is county library.

Arnold Stricker:

County library.

Arnold Stricker:

Sorry about that.

Bob Thieman:

Music Road and graboi.

Arnold Stricker:

That's correct.

Arnold Stricker:

St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis County.

Mark Langston:

That's kind of a new one, I think.

Mark Langston:

That's a new library library they put.

Arnold Stricker:

Down here by Bayless.

Mark Langston:

Yeah, yeah.

Mark Langston:

By that new.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Mark Langston:

Subdivision there and everything.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

So, April 26th, St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis Public Library, Schlafly Branch, 6:00pm, May 17th, St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis County Library, Grants View, 7:00pm Will they.

Mark Langston:

Have the books for sale there?

Mark Langston:

Will we be able to.

Bob Thieman:

Yes.

Mark Langston:

Okay, great.

Mark Langston:

Because they're wonderful books.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

They're also.

Arnold Stricker:

Also check your local bookstore.

Arnold Stricker:

So, Bob, thanks for coming on St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in tomb.

Arnold Stricker:

We greatly appreciate it.

Bob Thieman:

Well, thank you.

Mark Langston:

How much fun.

Mark Langston:

Yeah, great fun.

Arnold Stricker:

Great fun.

Mark Langston:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

I love these kinds of things because it takes me back to my childhood.

Mark Langston:

You were a child once.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Mark Langston:

Really?

Arnold Stricker:

Okay.

Mark Langston:

I didn't know that.

Arnold Stricker:

And favorite times that I recall in my memory, you know, listening to Harry Carey and Jack Buck, you know, broadcast the game.

Arnold Stricker:

Those kinds of really interesting memories.

Bob Thieman:

I got to see the final game of the season against the Met because it was on TV in New York.

Bob Thieman:

So, you know, a lot of.

Bob Thieman:

I don't think here in St.

Bob Thieman:

Louis.

Arnold Stricker:

Yeah.

Arnold Stricker:

Well, that's all for this hour.

Arnold Stricker:

Thanks for listening.

Arnold Stricker:

Don't forget, even when the Martians invade, there's only one race, the human race.

Arnold Stricker:

And every one of us have different characteristics and is uniquely valuable.

Arnold Stricker:

St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in tune is a production of Motif Media Group and the U.S.

Arnold Stricker:

radio Network.

Arnold Stricker:

For St.

Arnold Stricker:

Louis in Tune, studio manager Derek Abbott, co host Mark Langston and Arnold Stricker, a member to walk.

Arnold Stricker:

Work worthy and let your light shine.

Chapters

Video

More from YouTube