Transcripts
Foreign.
Speaker B:Welcome to another episode of Design Under Influence.
Speaker B:I'm your host here, Alex Osinenko.
Speaker B:I work at a company called ARC it.
Speaker B:We do, you guessed it, it for design, engineering and architecture space.
Speaker B:That's all we do.
Speaker B:And I have some super guests today who do something a little bit different.
Speaker B:They help folks migrate and set up their.
Speaker B:Their software going from AutoCAD into a BIM world, which is Revit in our case here.
Speaker B:So, ladies, I do want to say hello.
Speaker B:Maybe we'll do this very quick.
Speaker B:Megan or Elizabeth, can you.
Speaker B:Or maybe take turns, introduce yourself real quick and tell us about the company because you're running this very successful consulting gig.
Speaker B:We have a lot of clients together.
Speaker B:Things are gelling.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So talk a little bit about your business and then we'll jump right into the topic.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:I can jump in first.
Speaker A:So I'm Megan Hansen.
Speaker A:I actually started Aurora BIM almost two years ago and I set out originally to just help people become successful with bim.
Speaker A:That was the whole point of all of this.
Speaker A:I saw the struggles that the firm and the firms that I was working with prior to starting the company were going through, and I just really wanted to be there and to help people harness the power that Revit can bring to a project and to really learn how to create beautiful drawing sets, which most people believe isn't possible.
Speaker A:So, long story short.
Speaker B:Cool.
Speaker B:Welcome to the show, Megan.
Speaker B:Elizabeth.
Speaker B:What's up?
Speaker C:Hi.
Speaker C:Elizabeth Rickardson or Liz.
Speaker C:I have been working with Megan for a little bit more than a year, but just since January as her official partner in crime at Aurora bim.
Speaker C:It's been really fun.
Speaker C:I was an early adopter of Revit and have gone from being, you know, in the trenches doing drawing sets all the way through to high level BIM management and now back down into the trenches.
Speaker C:I'd say helping Megan to spread the love of BIM and the way of working that way and help our small to medium firms.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Embrace it and find the right way forward.
Speaker B:So you know the wonderful world of bim, you say, I hear different HALA value around there.
Speaker B:And the thing with people say a lot or are concerned about is the drawings and why are they costing so much more.
Speaker B:So your team helps with that for clients that need you to land, parachute in, help with some drawings, set up some templates, and then parachute out and then wait until they need you again.
Speaker B:But why is this so much more expensive or.
Speaker B:It seems that way.
Speaker A:I can take that first.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:So BIM is completely.
Speaker A:It's a completely different workflow than historic drawing production.
Speaker A:So historic drawing production, right, was by hand for a long time, which, you know, took many, many hours.
Speaker A:And then they streamlined that by moving it into an automated computer software, AutoCAD and others.
Speaker A:And essentially that way of working was, you know, taking the 3D world and translating it into a two dimensional line by line drawing.
Speaker A:And in doing that there, you know, there's plans and sections and elevations that all need to coordinate with each other and be put together, be put back together into a three dimensional building.
Speaker A:The problem with that, that people, you know, were experiencing all the time was the ability to change the, and modify things in those 2D drawings and get those modifications to be reflected in the whole drawing set.
Speaker A:So you move a wall in a plan, you've got to move it in every section.
Speaker A:It's visible in every elevation, it's visible in every detail that it was visible in.
Speaker A:Everything that was affected had to be manually updated.
Speaker A:So the whole point of Revit was to revise instantly, which is what the, the name of the software comes from.
Speaker A:And because of that, the way that you work in Revit is you build a 3D model.
Speaker A:So completely different than drawing line, drawing lines for your plan section elevations.
Speaker A:You're building a 3D model first and foremost, and then you are slicing it and cutting it into pieces into plans, sections, and elevations.
Speaker A:And you're not drawing lines anymore.
Speaker A:You are controlling the way that that model looks when you cut through it.
Speaker A:And the frustration people have right is, is that those lines don't look as similar to AutoCAD as they would prefer, and they don't have as much control over each individual line.
Speaker A:So you ask why it costs more in the beginning because you're building this 3D model, there's a whole other, that's like a whole workflow in addition to the workflow that you have to do up front now instead of, you know, you're just doing that in the end when you build the building.
Speaker A:And there's many, many benefits to which we'll get into later.
Speaker A:And as to why you want to.
Speaker B:Do this, Liz, you gotta.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And I would also say that the transition between drawing by hand to AutoCAD was so much simpler because it was instead of using a pencil, you used a mouse and you still drew a line and it still represented something.
Speaker C:Whereas when you transition from AutoCAD to Revit, it is a totally, as Megan said, totally different way of working.
Speaker C:And now we're working with objects.
Speaker C:If that object doesn't exist, it needs to be created first and so there's this parallelization of, like, I can't just open the program and start.
Speaker C:I need templates and I need content and I need to understand how to do it.
Speaker C:So not only does the actual project itself feel like it takes more time and energy in the beginning, but getting implementing Revit does in the start.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, very good point.
Speaker A:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker B:When you, in your, you know, professional travels between clients and projects, have you seen, like, what is the biggest difference between a successful transition and kind of the one that stalls out?
Speaker B:Maybe you can talk about linked in two perspective.
Speaker B:One, the people and two, maybe the decisions, the leadership and maybe the type of projects.
Speaker B:One is easier.
Speaker B:Kind of give us open up a little bit of a color into that space.
Speaker C:I can start with that.
Speaker C:I would say, first of all, willingness, not only from the management of the company, but from all the individual people in the company that they're open to adopting this.
Speaker C:I jokingly say it's a little bit like when you've broken up with your ex boyfriend, but that's all you talk about.
Speaker C:And we're like, yeah, but we're in a new relationship now.
Speaker C:Could we stop talking about AutoCAD and focus on Revit?
Speaker C:You know, just like letting go of the old ways and the old workflows.
Speaker C:And yeah, we can discuss how a drawing looks or the method you used to work and try to use similar things, but we're in a new relationship now, so we need to forget the past.
Speaker C:So that can be tough.
Speaker C:And then also when companies try to straddle both AutoCAD and Revit at the same time, it just causes a lot of rework and cost and frustration.
Speaker C:And so that's what I would say are the biggest factors.
Speaker C:What do you think, Megan?
Speaker A:Yeah, I agree with.
Speaker A:I agree with those.
Speaker A:I'm trying to think of the other ones that would really be a barrier to actually successfully making it through the transition.
Speaker A:I'd say content is a big one.
Speaker A:I think being willing and ready to have someone create content or create content yourself and making sure that you're giving your team the tools that they need to be efficient in creating these drawing sets and these models, because that is one of the most frustrating parts, like we mentioned when you're working in revit versus autocad is that you need to have the objects that you need to work with in 3D created prior to working, or you have to create them while you're working.
Speaker A:So it does slow you down.
Speaker A:So the more prepared and the more template setup and content creation you can do prior to starting the better.
Speaker A:So yeah, that would really slow down a transition.
Speaker A:If you're not really ready to put the time in to create all of that in the beginning, it'd be really hard to just say, here's a Revit out of the box template from Autodesk and build me a drawing set that looks similar to our old drawings.
Speaker A:That's almost an impossible task and it's often the expectation.
Speaker A:Sorry.
Speaker B:No, go ahead.
Speaker B:You know, if, if I stay quiet, maybe I get some more out of you.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:We have lots of thoughts on all things.
Speaker C:I was also going to mention training though, because I, I think that training in Revit is different than training in AutoCAD because a lot of owners will ask us like, can't you just do a training program?
Speaker C:Well, we can, but unless there's an actual project to work on, it's really hard.
Speaker C:You can.
Speaker C:We oftentimes send absolute beginners away to watch some YouTube videos or just to get the basics so you know where the buttons are and how to click around and how to navigate.
Speaker C:But then you need to have a project and that's usually the next best thing.
Speaker C:And then to understand that project is going to take longer and it's going to cost more, it's going to be a loss.
Speaker C:But it's a training project and that's okay.
Speaker C:And that's really how you learn.
Speaker B:How many losses?
Speaker B:Let's give an idea.
Speaker B:Like some of the better, better companies that have made that successful jump, how many projects would they be losing or they should budget on losing and just expected before you think the advantages will start coming.
Speaker B:Like all other things.
Speaker B:I know different firms are different, but let's say like residential, you know, you're sort of more or less normal firm.
Speaker A:I think it depends on the people in your company and where they're at.
Speaker A:You know, you might have some, some go getters that just got out of college and they're, you know, they can learn this, they know the software, they're ready to absorb the information that we can give them.
Speaker A:And you know, it's really hard to put a number on that.
Speaker A:I would say I know that like you can incrementally expect better results as you repeat this process.
Speaker A:So if you have a lot of projects that are similar, that is the ideal kind of situation where we can come in and really help you set, set yourself up for success when you were repeating these similar projects.
Speaker A:I say there's too many variables to know.
Speaker A:Like it.
Speaker A:I've seen firms take two Years.
Speaker A:I, I mean there's some firms that have been trying this for five years that are still, they say they're losing money on these projects.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:And I think it is, I think it is because they go into it kind of with that mindset that they should be able to open up, revit out of the box and recreate what they were creating in AutoCAD without any of the setup.
Speaker A:And I think that that is just, it's just, you're just setting yourself up for failure right out the gate.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, we've.
Speaker B:Go ahead.
Speaker C:I was gonna say there's two things in there.
Speaker C:The first is what Megan touched on about younger people.
Speaker C:And this is a problem for sure.
Speaker C:In architecture is the hierarchy that you have, you know, your principal architects and then it filters down and you come in and you should do five years of drawing toilet details and stair details before anyone will ever listen to what you have to say about anything.
Speaker C:And that's a problem because usually it's the younger people coming into firms or in firms who know how to use the software, but they' not really listened to by the hierarchy because they're just youngins, they don't know anything.
Speaker C:So that's something we're also trying to help change that.
Speaker C:You can still be the old super experienced gray haired architect who makes beautiful buildings, but you might need to lean on someone who's younger than, than you would expect to actually know how to use the software in the program and move around and do it in a really efficient way.
Speaker C:So that's, that's also super, super important I think, to try to discuss the people.
Speaker C:It's usually the people.
Speaker A:The people.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I like this.
Speaker B:So, so, you know, we've put together a long podcast series on archicad conversion which is a version of bim.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You guys aware you don't necessarily have to love it, but it's out there.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker A:We pretend it's not.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Well, what I was going with this is it's a 10 step process and each step like it's a 45 minute deep dive and we have to cut, cut a lot of content because it just got too long.
Speaker B:It's a serious endeavor and you know, I take my hat off of people.
Speaker B:You know, I've spent a lot of time in software in my, you know, a lot of my various businesses and gigs in the past and migrations are tough and painful, but it's like it will open up a world of opportunities and, and so let's talk about that.
Speaker B:But before we go to the world of opportunities, I do want to give you, Liz, a little nod.
Speaker B:Inside joke, Willard William Williams esque kind of analogy that you've done there with the boyfriend, girlfriend thing.
Speaker B:We're getting there.
Speaker B:So, you know, cut it off, stop talking about it.
Speaker B:You know, move forward.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Move on.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Gonna start like kind of, you know, crying and Anyway, but let's.
Speaker B:I want to kind of get back to dollars and cents for a moment because if.
Speaker B:If business owners or decision makers are watching this, at the end of the day, is the consulting fee for Revit, dollar for dollar, our hour per dollar per hour.
Speaker B:I should say same.
Speaker B:Higher, same or higher than AutoCAD consultants?
Speaker B:Sorry, it was a long winded question, but I wanted to know, like, for reals, if I autocad shop, you know, I'm hiring consultants at this rate.
Speaker B:Are you more expensive?
Speaker A:Are you?
Speaker A:I guess I want to make sure that we're differentiating between the consultants and the.
Speaker A:The technicians that are actually doing the work.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So like, we come in as consultants and advise on the templates and, and the family creation and all that.
Speaker A:But then there's also the production people that they're going to hire to actually do the drawings.
Speaker A:And I think, yes, in both cases they are higher and they should be because you are actually building a building.
Speaker A:You're not just copying lines from a markup from an architect or an engineer.
Speaker A:You are building the structure.
Speaker A:And you need to be able to cut through that structure and it looks as accurate as you can get it to look as to what the real world condition is going to be.
Speaker A:So that in itself means it's going to cost more.
Speaker A:You need almost an engineering background or an architectural background to really be successful at building a building without a lot of assistance from the architect or the engineer that you're doing it for.
Speaker C:And then I would also say that the problem, one of the reasons why it feels so expensive, and I agree with Megan, that work, if you hire one of us to build your Revit model, it is going to be an higher hourly fee.
Speaker C:It's going to be a higher hourly fee for anyone who's good at Revit.
Speaker C:But the architect then needs to explain to the owner, the one paying the bill, that, okay, but you're not just getting dumb lines like, here's a plethora of things you're getting for that price.
Speaker C:And I think that a lot of times architects and engineers are not even aware and they could be selling more or they could be explaining why this hourly price is so much Higher, because here's unlimited 3D views, whereas before, with AutoCAD, you could buy two or three and they cost, you know, a couple thousand each and they took hours and hours to do so.
Speaker C:I think that's also an education thing of educating our clients of all of the freebies they get out of the model and all the things they can offer their clients that then their clients would be more willing to pay a higher hourly rate because they actually are getting more for their money than they were in AutoCAD.
Speaker A:Yeah, I 100% agree.
Speaker B:In.
Speaker B:In previous conversations, you've mentioned to me that owners, a lot of owners starting to require that, you know, the Revit kind of, you know, 3D models versus, you know, drawings, flat drawings.
Speaker B:And have you started seeing, have you seen companies or heard of companies losing business because they're just unable to, you know, commit to a bid and specifications?
Speaker A:Yeah, 100.
Speaker A:I mean, that's usually why they come to us, because they can no longer.
Speaker A:It's kind of been a long, you know, you know, 15.
Speaker A:What is it, 15, 20 years since Revit came out.
Speaker A:And, you know, there was the early adopters and then there's the shops that were like, we're just going to keep doing it in AutoCAD until we can't.
Speaker A:And it's becoming to.
Speaker A:It's coming to the point where they can't because they aren't getting projects because of the requirements and they're not ready for it.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Or they're agreeing to a project and not understanding what they're agreeing to produce.
Speaker C:Don't really understand all this BIM nerdy stuff.
Speaker C:And then they.
Speaker C:That's when you get in real trouble.
Speaker C:Because then it's not just, oh, we lost money on a project that we're getting in trouble because of a contract breach or we're unable to deliver what needs to be delivered.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Wait, so let me understand this.
Speaker B:Sorry if I interrupt.
Speaker B:I want to clarify.
Speaker B:People who run AutoCAD bid on projects that require BIM kind of output and then they decide to do it in bim.
Speaker B:They haven't done this before.
Speaker C:Yeah, they don't realize what it is or they think, oh, but this is fine, because AutoCAD does work in 3D if you really force it.
Speaker C:AutoCAD architecture, which is a terrible program, but.
Speaker C:So they can say, yeah, but those.
Speaker C:I would also flag up another thing here, which is that oftentimes when bidding, the people who are doing the bidding are the owners of the company, are the people maybe who aren't in the trenches anymore aren't really working with the software.
Speaker C:They read this and they think, yeah, but we bought a Revit license two years ago.
Speaker C:We can totally do this.
Speaker A:Yeah, we have the software.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:And so instead of going to the people who are actually going to do the doing and say, could you read this through?
Speaker C:Can we.
Speaker C:Can we actually do this or not?
Speaker C:You know, and all of a sudden you get it in your lap that in two weeks, I need to do a solar study on a building that doesn't even exist yet in Revit, and.
Speaker C:Or I need to do a wind analysis or I need to, you know, come up with lead standards.
Speaker C:And you're like, but I don't know how to use the program.
Speaker C:So it can be that or it can be the deliverables that you need to be able to deliver a high quality 3D model at a certain level of detail.
Speaker C:And those signing the contract don't even understand what LOD means.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:I think all of that is.
Speaker A:Is right on point, Liz.
Speaker A:And I think.
Speaker A:I think it's not necessarily like engineers or architects bidding on projects when they know they, like when they know they can't meet the requirements.
Speaker A:I think it's.
Speaker A:It's most of the projects now if one of the team members is in Revit, they are kind of assuming that the rest will follow suit because that's the most effective way to then coordinate and progress through the design and set yourself up for success later.
Speaker A:So there's still sometimes the consultants that are still in AutoCAD, and you do have that coordination with those and Revit.
Speaker A:And it, I think, is.
Speaker A:It's in those situations where you do, like Liz said, you have the license for Revit and you're like, well, why don't we just try it?
Speaker A:But they don't have any of the templates set up.
Speaker A:They don't have their content, and then they get frustrated and then their project goes way over budget and it's just like this huge, like, negative experience in the beginning because they weren't prepared to take that on.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:I would also point out that it's not just firms and owners of firms who need a bit more education or need to be guided by BIM professionals through it.
Speaker C:It's also the facility owners who are creating these requirements because sometimes they just, oh, bim, that sounds awesome.
Speaker C:And I want everything.
Speaker C:And they write up a huge list of requirements and what they want delivered.
Speaker C:And when you actually sit down and go through it with them and say, okay, all of this is possible.
Speaker C:However, are you willing to pay for it?
Speaker C:Because this is extra and this is extra and this will require us to do a lot of upfront stuff.
Speaker C:But if you really need this data out in the end, then absolutely, it can happen.
Speaker C:I mean, and I've seen big hospital projects back in Sweden where they had this requirement.
Speaker C:Everyone's working in this software.
Speaker C:You have to work a certain way.
Speaker C:And then they allowed all the consultants to kind of do whatever they wanted and then it gets to the end point and everyone had to redraw it in another software.
Speaker C:So it's really, it's important that you have a BIM professional in the beginning to help all the parties sit down and discuss how are we going to do this together?
Speaker C:And also to ask hard questions to the owner who's taking this, these files and this data at the end and what are you doing with it and how can we make sure it's formatted for that use, whether it be a facilities management software or paper drawings?
Speaker C:Hopefully not.
Speaker C:But yeah, what are we doing in the beginning and what are we doing with that and how can we make that flow work for everybody involved?
Speaker A:And I'll just add one thing.
Speaker A:I think, Liz, you brought up a really good point that the oftentimes in the room in the beginning is.
Speaker A:Or historically, the BIM professionals were not there.
Speaker A:You don't bring your drafter into a meeting with the client.
Speaker A:But moving into the BIM realm, especially if you, as the architect or the project manager or the engineer, are not familiar with how much time and what, you know, saying yes to something they've just asked you to do in revit means you definitely need to have that person in the room early on, like Liz said, to make sure that those conversations happen before you're committing to a budget that just isn't realistic.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:So you ladies definitely help save somebody.
Speaker B:Somebody's someone's bacon for sure.
Speaker B:Given all that advice on sort of how not to, you know, get over your ski.
Speaker B:What is it?
Speaker B:Ski poles?
Speaker B:How to now get over your ski tips.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:You know, you're from Sweden.
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker C:I pretend to be.
Speaker B:Go over your ski tips.
Speaker B:I think that's what it is.
Speaker B:But anyway, you, you get, you get the point.
Speaker B:So let me, let's, let's.
Speaker B:This was, this was good.
Speaker B:I think it's a great, great little bit to help people understand how, why the BIM services seem more expensive, why someone should expect to lose a little bit of money initially and get a lot more effective and efficient Be able to sell more projects down the line and not too far down the line, hopefully.
Speaker B:And it's been great to understand why not to bid at on things without, you know, if you just have a revit license that don't have a real skill and.
Speaker B:Or a little bit of horsepower with that program.
Speaker B:But bim yet.
Speaker B:But I want to finish with this and I want you take it wherever you want to go with it.
Speaker B:But where do you provide most value?
Speaker B:Let's not even talk about companies like yours.
Speaker B:Let's just talk about your company.
Speaker B:If you were hiring you, what would be the scope of work that would be ideal for the best possible output?
Speaker C:You want to go first, Megan?
Speaker B:I don't ask easy questions.
Speaker A:Yeah, that was kind of like trying to think of like what that would look like.
Speaker A:I think we get brought in as firefighters a lot and I think it would be a lot easier for us to come in at the beginning and help you plan and strategize and help you through the transition versus jump into a.
Speaker A:An atmosphere of people who are frustrated.
Speaker A:And you know, we oftentimes say we're not here to sell you on this, we're here to help you.
Speaker A:And you know, we do have to say that a lot sometimes because, you know, there's still a lot of reluctance and the, the dreaming of the ex boyfriend and.
Speaker B:Nice one.
Speaker B:So people just kind of.
Speaker B:Oh, man, I wish.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, the ideal client is like excited about it.
Speaker A:They're at the beginning.
Speaker A:We've got some projects lined up that we can help them work through.
Speaker A:The best.
Speaker A:The best scenario for us is to actually do a project with the client.
Speaker A:So like, they give us markups and then we take revit from being a basic template and we evolve it.
Speaker A:As we do that project, we're looking at their standards that they used to have in AutoCAD and we are making that project look as much like the AutoCAD standards that they created back when.
Speaker A:And we are helping create this template that then can.
Speaker A:They can use on repeat the template and the families and the content, everything.
Speaker A:And that initial push takes a while.
Speaker A:So, you know, it's a project with a longer lead time that we can take our time on and we can go back and forth on like, okay, we'll very much let the clients know if.
Speaker A:If there's something that they're really trying to force.
Speaker A:That used to be the way it looked in AutoCAD, but it's going to cause extra work in Revit.
Speaker A:We will highlight those.
Speaker A:There aren't that many actually there's less than people think, but they do occur, and we definitely make sure that people are aware of those.
Speaker A:So I'd say ideal client right at the beginning.
Speaker A:Bring us on and have some projects teed up that have longer lead times.
Speaker A:And you have a culture that's ready to embrace the change or at least a team within the culture that's influential to the rest of the.
Speaker A:The team that can embrace the change and spread it throughout the company.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:And I would say piggybacking on that.
Speaker C:Why hiring.
Speaker C:Well, us specifically.
Speaker C:But what and I don't know of other companies who have a similar setup as we do is that if you were to hire a BIM manager to your office and they're 100% dedicated to setting up your office's standards and practices, they are only one person.
Speaker C:They bring whatever they have in their brain to the office.
Speaker C:And with us, we are many people.
Speaker C:It's Megan and I.
Speaker C:It's our colleagues behind us.
Speaker C:It's our whole network of nerds that we deal with.
Speaker C:It's also the fact that we're working with several different clients at the same time.
Speaker C:That I could have solved an issue with doors with client A that now client B has.
Speaker C:And I've already solved it, so I don't need to spend the time so I can bring all this knowledge between clients.
Speaker C:Clients and share it.
Speaker C:And that's actually one of the parts of our standard terms and conditions is that we are going to share content and knowledge, because that's why you're hiring us, is that you don't just get my brain.
Speaker C:You don't just get Megan's brain.
Speaker C:You get all our brains and all of our experiences through all these different companies.
Speaker C:Because there really isn't a reason to reinvent stuff over and over and over again.
Speaker C:So we add that value.
Speaker C:And the last part is just that once you are up and going, because that's what we want.
Speaker C:We don't want to be fighting fires for you always.
Speaker C:We want you to fight your own fires.
Speaker C:You to be able as a client to run your own business successfully in revit.
Speaker C:Maybe you just tag us in when things get really out of control or something complicated comes along.
Speaker C:But what we also can provide is that as a small and medium firm, I know it's hard to ramp up and down.
Speaker C:So if you have a bunch of project work coming in, you can tag us in.
Speaker C:We'll come in and help you.
Speaker C:We can be fast.
Speaker C:We've already been in your templates.
Speaker C:We understand the way you work.
Speaker C:And then it doesn't hurt our feelings if on a Monday you need help for two days and by Thursday you've restaffed and you're like, thanks guys, no more.
Speaker C:Sure, we'll go off and do other things.
Speaker C:So that's another value that we, we add to our clients, I would say.
Speaker B:Awesome.
Speaker B:Well, that was, that was pretty comprehensive.
Speaker B:I appreciate that.
Speaker B:And you know, here's the thing about that.
Speaker B:Sharing of knowledge and getting exposure to multiple brains that have already, you know, existing solution.
Speaker B:This is what our firm does too.
Speaker B:Like as arc it, we only service, we only serve, you know, architecture, design, AAC Space.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Engineering space.
Speaker B:And their problems repeat.
Speaker B:Their software fails in same way every time some other IT company would spend hours, you know, you get bills, you get big bill.
Speaker B:Big bill.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:You know, every, every hour is a bill.
Speaker B:And then, you know, then all of a sudden it's all like, why, why, why, why do that?
Speaker B:If, if you can bring somebody who's done this, you know, 40 times last year.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly the same problem.
Speaker B:So those problems repeat.
Speaker B:We bring efficiency to other organizations, to our community.
Speaker B:I'm very, very grateful for our partnership too.
Speaker B:We're going to continue this show for hopefully many more episodes.
Speaker B:A, it's a pleasure to just hang out with you and B, I think we're, you know, we're sharing some mad tips, right?
Speaker C:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker C:With lots of different IT companies in my travels.
Speaker C:And it's been really great working with you all whenever we have a shared client because I know that you're going to be responsive and you're also going to figure it out in the world of architecture and revit.
Speaker C:It's not just some random piece of software that you don't know anything about.
Speaker C:You know, you have these, this knowledge, you know, that auto, you know, the desktop connector is a bit finicky.
Speaker C:It needs to be updated quite often.
Speaker C:You know, these little bits, as you pointed out, that you don't have to relearn every time.
Speaker C:Yeah, that's been really good.
Speaker B:Absolutely wonderful.
Speaker B:Thank you very much for your time.
Speaker B:If people want to find you or if they want to find, you know, go Aurora Bim.
Speaker B:And I'm sure, you know, you can just look up in Google, you know, or, or chatgpt or whatever floats you, you know, the latest thing is Owen, depending when you're watching or if you need it for architects, we're pretty good at SEO.
Speaker B:Just type in IT for architects in Google and we'll be the first ones because know how to do SEO.
Speaker B:Anyways, it was a pleasure ladies, thank you very much.
Speaker B:We'll see you on the next.
Speaker B:It was an incredible show.
Speaker B:And have a fantastic rest of your day.
Speaker C:It's been great.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:You, too.
