Artwork for podcast The Will Spencer Podcast
ISAAC BOTKIN & LOGAN RYSER | Faith, Art, and Firearms at Fight, Laugh, Feast
Episode 206 • 22nd November 2024 • The Will Spencer Podcast • Will Spencer
00:00:00 01:13:57

Share Episode

Shownotes

Isaac Botkin (TRex Arms) and Logan Reyser (Crux Art) join Will Spencer for a compelling discussion—live at the 2024 Fight Laugh Feast Conference!—that delves into the intersection of faith, creativity, and the evolving landscape of gun culture.

The conversation begins with Reyser's journey into glassblowing, where he shares the transformative power of art in glorifying God and engaging with culture. He discusses creating significant pieces like a 30-foot glass oak tree and an eight-foot cross featuring the Gospel of Mark, and explores the challenges and triumphs of being an artist in a modern world.

Then, Isaac Botkin of TRex Arms explains how the rise of Gun Culture 2.0 reflects broader societal changes, emphasizing the importance of community and collaboration among diverse groups within the movement. The conversation highlights the need for Christians to engage thoughtfully in cultural conversations around firearms, the significance of maintaining a strong foundation in faith.

Takeaways:

  • Isaac Botkin and Logan Ryser discuss the significance of creativity in faith-driven work.
  • The evolution of gun culture is highlighted, showcasing its increasing maturity and diversity.
  • The challenges of rapid growth in a business are explored, emphasizing the importance of relationships.
  • Both guests reflect on how personal experiences shape their perspectives in their respective industries.
  • They emphasize the need for community support and accountability in creative endeavors.
  • The discussion highlights the role of prayer and spiritual guidance in overcoming challenges.

CONNECT WITH THE GUESTS

Logan Ryser

Isaac Botkin

🌟 The Will Spencer Podcast was formerly known as "The Renaissance of Men."

FOLLOW US FOR MORE

Buy Me a Coffee

FREE Men's Chastity Guide

Communications Powered by PaxMail

The Will Spencer Podcast is a weekly interview show featuring extended discussions with authors, leaders, and influencers who can help us make sense of our changing world today. I release new episodes every week on Friday.

ADVERTISERS

Mentioned in this episode:

Puritan Treasures

Reformation Heritage Books offers 15 Puritan classics in modern language with new introductions for today’s readers. Use code SPENCER for 10% off.

https://heritagebooks.org/

Transcripts

Will Spencer:

Hello, my name is Will Spencer and welcome to the Will Spencer Podcast.

Will Spencer:

This is a weekly show featuring in depth conversations with authors, leaders and influencers who help us understand our changing world.

Will Spencer:

New episodes release every Friday.

Will Spencer:

I walked into the Fight Laugh Feast conference a couple weeks ago with modest expectations and found myself surprised by the depth of conversation and connections waiting to happen.

Will Spencer:

What started as a simple podcast booth to advertise the new Will Spencer Podcast became an opportunity to connect with some remarkable and unexpected individuals.

Will Spencer:

The conference brought together a mix of reformed thinkers, artists and entrepreneurs, each with a unique perspective to share.

Will Spencer:

And over the next three episodes, I'll be introducing you to the seven men I talked to.

Will Spencer:

First up, Isaac Botkin, a decentralization advocate and co owner of T Rex Arms, who offers a nuanced look at technology and systems.

Will Spencer:

Alongside him, Logan Reiser from Crux Art, a second generation glassblower who creates impressive sculptures turning glass into art that reaches up to 50ft.

Will Spencer:

Episode two, planned for next week, features none other than Pastor James White from Alpha and Omega Ministries, joined by a surprise special guest, makes a hysterical cameo.

Will Spencer:

We'll also hear from Jim Hunter of Alps Precious Metals Group, who brings insights from his background in the finance industry.

Will Spencer:

Our final episode will feature Parker Brown from the Watch well podcast, discussing the intersection of films and faith.

Will Spencer:

You'll also hear from the Borman father and son duo, Samuel, a farmer and missionary who's working with a native tribe in Mexico, and his son Andrew, who's written a children's book exploring, get this, Christianity and Transhumanism.

Will Spencer:

A very impressive young man.

Will Spencer:

I can't wait for you to hear from.

Will Spencer:

Each conversation offers a different lens on faith, creativity and human experience.

Will Spencer:

These aren't just interviews, they're windows into different perspectives and ways of thinking.

Will Spencer:

So I hope you'll join me for what promises to be an interesting series.

Will Spencer:

And thanks to Fight Laugh Feast for making it all possible.

Will Spencer:

Now look, this show isn't just another podcast.

Will Spencer:

This is a movement to rebuild the foundations of Western Christian culture and you play a critical role.

Will Spencer:

Here's how you can be part of this mission.

Will Spencer:

First, leave a five star rating on Spotify and Apple podcasts.

Will Spencer:

But don't just click stars.

Will Spencer:

Write an actual review.

Will Spencer:

Tell people why these conversations matter, and share your favorite episodes.

Will Spencer:

Not just because I want more listeners, but because these ideas can transform lives and communities.

Will Spencer:

Every episode you share is a blow against the cultural decay we're fighting.

Will Spencer:

If you want to go deeper, you can become a paid subscriber@willspencerpod.substack.com.

Will Spencer:

there you'll get ad free interviews and exclusive content that goes beyond what we put out publicly.

Will Spencer:

But here's the most important thing.

Will Spencer:

Support our advertisers.

Will Spencer:

When you buy from Christian businesses, you're not just making a purchase.

Will Spencer:

You're helping build multigenerational wealth that can restore our cultural foundations.

Will Spencer:

This isn't just consumption.

Will Spencer:

This is spiritual warfare through economics.

Will Spencer:

And please welcome this week's guests for part one of my three part Fight Laugh Feast series from Crux Glass, Logan Reiser.

Will Spencer:

And from T.

Will Spencer:

Rex Arms, Isaac Bodkin.

Logan Reiser:

So, Logan, welcome to the podcast.

Logan Reiser:

Thanks so much for sitting down to chat with me today.

Isaac Botkin:

No doubt.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, thanks for having me on.

Isaac Botkin:

This conference is legit.

Logan Reiser:

You having a good time?

Isaac Botkin:

Oh, yeah, you know it.

Logan Reiser:

So we started talking last night at the.

Logan Reiser:

I guess it's the after party, though the conference had just started.

Logan Reiser:

You can't really have an afterparty anyway.

Isaac Botkin:

Gabe likes to have the parties early and often.

Logan Reiser:

Right, exactly.

Logan Reiser:

The pre after party, for sure.

Will Spencer:

And so you were telling me about.

Logan Reiser:

All the exciting stuff that you're doing with glass blowing and glass artistic creation.

Logan Reiser:

Why don't you share some of those?

Logan Reiser:

Because that's absolutely one of the coolest things I've heard about for a while and very enthusiastic to hear about men doing, you know, taking their skills, taking artistic skills and putting them into service for the kingdom today.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So it all started 10 years ago.

Isaac Botkin:

I actually left college to start a company with my dad and fell in love with the artwork very quickly.

Isaac Botkin:

I did it a handful of times when I was growing up as a kid, but got absolutely consumed with the process.

Isaac Botkin:

So we're talking about:

Isaac Botkin:

2000° liquid glass, yes.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And we work out of a very large furnace that holds 400 pounds of glass that has to be hot 24 7.

Logan Reiser:

Oh, okay.

Isaac Botkin:

Yep.

Isaac Botkin:

So we.

Logan Reiser:

What's it heated with?

Isaac Botkin:

Natural gas.

Isaac Botkin:

So you can go either way, but we go natural gas for a number of reasons, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

So I ended up going to a number of art fairs right off the bat in the beginning and was heavily convicted of the culture behind that scene.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, I mean it was actually up in Chicago at Sofa and you know, there are a ton of amazing craftsmen up there in that sphere, but also those with an agenda that.

Isaac Botkin:

That wasn't bringing glory to Christ.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, we talked about some of those last night, but yeah.

Logan Reiser:

And graphic forms of art, let's say.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

And I actually one of the first bigger projects that I started when I was doing this full time was I was trying to make a larger oak tree.

Logan Reiser:

Define wouldn't say larger oak tree.

Isaac Botkin:

30Ft tall.

Logan Reiser:

That would be a large oak.

Logan Reiser:

Wait, you're making out of glass?

Isaac Botkin:

Yes, yes.

Isaac Botkin:

That started off.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So that started off with making parts of the trunk and making these larger green platters for the leaves and platters.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So these are spun out glass platters.

Isaac Botkin:

So if you would imagine a bowl on the end of like a larger.

Isaac Botkin:

A larger stick.

Isaac Botkin:

You have to get that hot and spin it flat with centrifugal force.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes, Yep.

Isaac Botkin:

So then you have to blow the.

Logan Reiser:

Glass, like arm to hold the weight of.

Logan Reiser:

That's not how a tree works.

Logan Reiser:

A leaf is relatively light compared to the branch.

Isaac Botkin:

You got to go with big leaves if you're doing a 30 foot tree.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes, yes, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

So crazy process with that.

Isaac Botkin:

But I got very consumed with how to make a wood grain out of glass.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

So chased that.

Isaac Botkin:

And then it kind of dawned on me.

Isaac Botkin:

I felt like the Holy Spirit was pushing me to figure out how to make a cross.

Isaac Botkin:

So I was thinking about how there was a wood grain and all these beautiful crosses that I would have admired for years and kind of took that and ran with it.

Isaac Botkin:

Within about a calendar year, I made my first cross sculpture that was completely made out of clear glass.

Isaac Botkin:

So this was eight feet tall, roughly 100 pounds.

Isaac Botkin:

But if anything, it's almost two foot glass blocks that are assembled with.

Isaac Botkin:

So the whole thing could actually stand on its own without any epoxy or adhesion and whatnot.

Isaac Botkin:

So there's gravity blocks were stacked on.

Logan Reiser:

Each other and fused together.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

Ok.

Isaac Botkin:

So it's a very specific fusing process.

Isaac Botkin:

It's a NASA grade epoxy.

Isaac Botkin:

So this is done outside of the hot process.

Isaac Botkin:

So you can either.

Logan Reiser:

So you actually, you can actually see the blocks fused together.

Logan Reiser:

It's not one seamless.

Isaac Botkin:

You try to get as close as you can.

Isaac Botkin:

Of course.

James White:

Of course.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Logan Reiser:

But you'd still be able to see the lines.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Logan Reiser:

That's when we were talking last night.

Logan Reiser:

That's what I was trying to figure out.

Logan Reiser:

Like, is it one?

Logan Reiser:

Because you explained that you did it in sections.

Logan Reiser:

I was like, how does he get that to be like, apparently one smooth piece.

Logan Reiser:

This makes more sense.

Isaac Botkin:

Yep.

Isaac Botkin:

So, and I know we were talking.

Isaac Botkin:

This is a very specific cast iron mold that was milled out.

Logan Reiser:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

And we have to use an air compressor for how big each vessel is or each block is.

Isaac Botkin:

I was getting close to passing out on the top of the stairs, trying to work with these larger molds.

Isaac Botkin:

So we went to the air compressor.

Logan Reiser:

So.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

The heat, plus the lack of oxygen, you can find yourself in sticky situations for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, no doubt.

Logan Reiser:

You don't want to die on the cross.

Isaac Botkin:

Geez, man.

Isaac Botkin:

Only one.

Logan Reiser:

That's right.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So I started creating these other sculptures, but then I really got into working with scripture and sandblasting with the glass and working with.

Isaac Botkin:

I'm doing the weave here, so I'm tying in from the glass tree.

Isaac Botkin:

Do the weave.

Isaac Botkin:

It's the best.

Isaac Botkin:

It's the best.

Isaac Botkin:

So with the leaves, these green platters that I had, if you have the right light.

Isaac Botkin:

So there's something called the magic hour.

Isaac Botkin:

Right around sunset, that beautiful soft light comes through a window, and that light can create a beautiful refraction.

Isaac Botkin:

So not a shadow, but a refraction through the glass onto a surface.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

So my goal was trying to illuminate scripture through glass.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

Yep.

Isaac Botkin:

So worked on sandblasting and a lot of really cool, groundbreaking technologies with that.

Isaac Botkin:

And then that was when I made the first cross with scripture, and that contained the entire gospel of Mark.

Isaac Botkin:

So every word.

Logan Reiser:

That's a lot.

Logan Reiser:

Your handwriting with a little tool.

Isaac Botkin:

No, it's not a dremel tool.

Isaac Botkin:

That would have took:

Logan Reiser:

I was going to say.

Logan Reiser:

How did you get the scripture out?

Isaac Botkin:

There's a very specific technology that you can apply stencils to the glass and then sandblast it past that.

Logan Reiser:

So, sorry, is it, like, pasted on or.

Logan Reiser:

It's a stencil, and you spray over it.

Isaac Botkin:

So it's.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

A very specific film that you can burn with an LED light that has an adhesion on the back of it.

Isaac Botkin:

Okay, got it.

Isaac Botkin:

It involves, like, pressure washing and really specific pressure.

Isaac Botkin:

And then sometimes the stencil doesn't stick, so you have to rip that one off, print a whole other one, print it on again, and then you get to the point that, you know, is it going to hold up during the high pressure sandblasting?

James White:

Sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Sometimes the stencil doesn't work out.

Isaac Botkin:

You have to start completely over on a totally new piece.

Logan Reiser:

Creative process.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

So that was a very ambitious first project.

Isaac Botkin:

I learned a lot.

Isaac Botkin:

I got my butt kicked, for sure.

Logan Reiser:

You sound like an ambitious guy, frankly, like the projects that you describe, it was like, this is some other level.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, I have broken a lot of glass, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Let's go with that.

Logan Reiser:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

So then I went down to Knoxville.

Isaac Botkin:

Gabe invited me down there for the Fight Laugh Beast conference, And he was extremely Generous in saying that artists could come for free, have a free booth.

Isaac Botkin:

I was even able to bring my buddy Jimmy.

Isaac Botkin:

And we were just trekking through the hills of Tennessee on the way down to Knoxville with a very full hatchback of glass.

Isaac Botkin:

So just packed to the brim.

Isaac Botkin:

It was a good drive.

Isaac Botkin:

Smoked some cigars.

Isaac Botkin:

It was good.

Isaac Botkin:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

But yeah, we went down there and it was actually listening to Toby Sumpter down there that I had this idea of trying to illuminate scripture through the glass and later made a flat glass.

Isaac Botkin:

Because if there's too many panes of glass, you're not going to get a clean refraction.

Isaac Botkin:

So it has to be somewhat flat to be able to push the light through and get definition for that look.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

So that's when I made a.

Isaac Botkin:

It's a ten foot blue cross that's inspired by the seven signs from John.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

So I went with all the references to water there, so that's why I went with blue.

Isaac Botkin:

But that was sandblasted and fire polished, so you have to do all the sandblasting, but then you have that chalky residue look.

Isaac Botkin:

You go back into the:

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

So tying that together, there was also a larger cross that had the Narsel sword from the Lord of the Rings.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

And it was the joy of the Lord.

Isaac Botkin:

He was talking about how he wields that as his weapon.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

And that was a huge talk down at Knoxville that I don't think I've ever heard a better public speaking effort in my life.

Isaac Botkin:

Completely captivated me.

Isaac Botkin:

So then created these.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, the crosses with the sandblasted scripture, but then got really convicted on how to incorporate biblical imagery.

Isaac Botkin:

So it just kind of led to where I'm at right now in this creative process of being able to take these panels and water jet cut silhouettes out of the glass and combine them with airline cable in midair.

Isaac Botkin:

So this would actually give, you know, a huge concept of modularity in depth.

Isaac Botkin:

So you can have, you know, multiple layers of this glass intersecting and overlapping to create one image.

Logan Reiser:

So if you're standing from a particular perspective, it would seem to be flat, but as you stood, perhaps underneath it, you would see that there are Multiple glasses hung 100% in multiple layers.

Logan Reiser:

That's really cool.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So either from above or you could walk around and see it from the front.

Logan Reiser:

Got it.

Isaac Botkin:

Yep.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Logan Reiser:

So you're.

Logan Reiser:

You're actually.

Logan Reiser:

So it's not like a diorama where it's all pieces connected together and suspended from one string holding them all.

Logan Reiser:

It's multiple pieces suspended from multiple strings.

Isaac Botkin:

100%.

Logan Reiser:

That's incredible.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So being able to get even more detail oriented with that has just been a crazy battle, but an awesome journey.

Isaac Botkin:

So that's kind of where we're at now and kind of figuring out where those limitations are and what can be made.

James White:

Wow.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, what you're describing, I don't think that there are a whole lot of people listening, there might be, who are familiar with glassblowing from a casual degree.

Logan Reiser:

Maybe some of them have tried it in various educational experiential settings.

Logan Reiser:

But what you're describing sounds to me like a series of very important innovations in the field.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, it's definitely a positive something.

Isaac Botkin:

And it's all cumulative.

Isaac Botkin:

Having these stacking skills of being able to do all of these things together to create something that hasn't been made.

Logan Reiser:

Yet, specifically for the glory of God.

Logan Reiser:

I guess I'm interested in.

Logan Reiser:

So you're pioneering techniques that have not been used by anyone other than yourself.

Isaac Botkin:

So far as I know.

Logan Reiser:

So far as you know.

Logan Reiser:

And so in this hyper woke, massively left leaning world.

Logan Reiser:

And I guess I'm interested in like the impact of that.

Logan Reiser:

Like hey, all you pagans.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, this is glorious.

Logan Reiser:

And I pioneered all these techniques, like, I don't know, deal with it.

Isaac Botkin:

So it's.

Isaac Botkin:

The work's done, right?

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So one of the projects that might be my favorite of the crosses that I made with sandblasting.

Isaac Botkin:

I made the cross of the crucifixion and that was fluid lacerations throughout the entire thing.

Isaac Botkin:

It was three layers of glass.

Isaac Botkin:

And this is actually one piece.

Isaac Botkin:

So this was all put together to be one piece.

Isaac Botkin:

It has the holes where his hands were, the hole where his feet were hand sculpted.

Isaac Botkin:

Crown of thorns.

Isaac Botkin:

This is supposed to be a gruesome piece of art to display the reality of how gruesome the gospel was.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, of course.

Isaac Botkin:

And down in my studio in Davenport, Iowa, I have that right in the front of the door.

Isaac Botkin:

And every single person that walks in there looks at that cross.

Logan Reiser:

Gotta deal with it.

Isaac Botkin:

But it's so amazing the way that children and any age can get captivated in that.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And it can surprise you in that.

Isaac Botkin:

So I'm in Iowa, you know, take that for what it is.

Isaac Botkin:

But I see nobody's perfect.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right, right, right.

Isaac Botkin:

Oh, come on.

Isaac Botkin:

I'm repping the Midwest.

Isaac Botkin:

I love the Midwest.

Logan Reiser:

I'm in a flyover.

Logan Reiser:

State, too.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure, for sure, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

But you see this.

Isaac Botkin:

This captivating gaze and adoration in those sculptures.

Isaac Botkin:

That is everything that I set out to accomplish, to look at.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

But you also have people that are completely turned away, but then they'll ask me later on if it's for whatever reason they're still in the gallery, what's your favorite thing to make?

Isaac Botkin:

And I can't lie.

Isaac Botkin:

And this is what I've spent all my time in.

Isaac Botkin:

So to be able to thoroughly talk about the gospel through my artwork is an amazing blessing.

Isaac Botkin:

To use that as an outlet.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

And that's one of the things that was.

Logan Reiser:

One of the many things that was so interesting about talking to you last night, is that you had taken.

Logan Reiser:

You learned these skills from your father, which I'd like to talk about, and you put 10 years of experience, full time into this.

Logan Reiser:

A lot of people know about the whole 10,000 hours thing.

Logan Reiser:

And if you work it out, that 10 years ends up being roughly that.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

But 10 years of experience doing anything, I think a lot of people underestimate the gravity of that.

Logan Reiser:

But you're putting it into such a specific direction.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, right.

Logan Reiser:

In such a focused and godly way.

Logan Reiser:

You just found that commitment to be inspiring.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

I think, you know, even Darren Doane is definitely a reference that has had an impact on me.

Isaac Botkin:

Just that the idea of repetition and the idea of anything.

Isaac Botkin:

Anything is worth making, even if it's done poorly.

Logan Reiser:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

Like, you absolutely have to learn, especially when things break for no reason.

Isaac Botkin:

In my industry.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Everything can be the same.

Isaac Botkin:

All the conditions can be right.

Isaac Botkin:

But all glass is broken.

Isaac Botkin:

It just hasn't broken yet.

Isaac Botkin:

So it's.

Logan Reiser:

There's a poetry to that.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

It's one of those things.

Isaac Botkin:

But, yeah, it's a ton of time, a ton of experimentation.

Isaac Botkin:

But that creative process is something that you're not going to get anywhere else.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Logan Reiser:

And it's the commitment to a very specific set of skills.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, right.

Logan Reiser:

And I think there's something about glassblowing because the medium in particular is subject to spontaneous destruction.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right.

Logan Reiser:

Like if you're painting, you might make a bad stroke or mess something up or perspective, but, like, the canvas isn't suddenly going to burst into flames.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Or cut or burn you to the point you need to go to the hospital.

Logan Reiser:

Yes, yes, exactly.

Logan Reiser:

The medium itself.

Logan Reiser:

And I think that that's something about various forms of creativity that I don't hear a lot of people talk about, like, understanding the Nature of the medium itself is very unique and dangerous, potentially physically harmful.

Will Spencer:

It's heavy.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right.

Logan Reiser:

And it's temperamental.

Logan Reiser:

Pun intended.

Isaac Botkin:

Tempered glass.

Isaac Botkin:

You know it, man.

Isaac Botkin:

But yeah, a ton of sweat, especially in the summertime.

Isaac Botkin:

So that is one thing I'm definitely in the situation in the Midwest.

Isaac Botkin:

We get, we get hot summers there for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

And that's trying.

Isaac Botkin:

And, but it's, you know, you just got to stay hydrated, go for the Redmond's real salt and make sure you're alive.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

But yeah, fire during that entire process, seeing what God has gifted us there.

Isaac Botkin:

And then we have torches that can go insanely hotter than any other time period that's been blowing glass.

Isaac Botkin:

So I have fire in my hand that I can direct where, you know, they say the Egyptians did this first and they used wood fired furnaces.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

That only gets so hot.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

So it's, it's just.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Being able to have those gifts and utilizing those is definitely.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, just a crazy blessing as well.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, like, and you've also, you put years of your life into it, right?

Logan Reiser:

And you know, you talk, you talk casually like, I've broken a lot of glass.

Logan Reiser:

And yes, I hear that.

Logan Reiser:

But like in your first couple, three years.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, you didn't just break a lot of glass.

Logan Reiser:

Like, you, you probably burned yourself quite a bit.

Logan Reiser:

You probably hurt yourself quite a bit.

Logan Reiser:

Like, because that's part of it, right?

Will Spencer:

That's part of learning.

Logan Reiser:

Like, you know, you start out anything that has risk, like you're going to make mistakes that you don't even know you're making, but the glass will let you know you made it.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

And yeah, it's, it's, it's totally defeating.

Isaac Botkin:

And if you, if you are doing something that is completely new, I cannot describe to you how much I've relied on the Holy Spirit and through prayer, even between attempts on making a sculpture or trying to get something done.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

You know, something breaks, something breaks, something breaks.

Isaac Botkin:

You know, what's, what's different?

Isaac Botkin:

You're a man.

Isaac Botkin:

Nothing's going to be different.

Isaac Botkin:

Grace from God is going to get you through this.

Isaac Botkin:

That's.

Isaac Botkin:

That's the only way.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So the physical and the mental time put into that is taxing.

Isaac Botkin:

And I, there's just, there's no possible way that I could have even gotten any of the works done apart from myself.

Logan Reiser:

So everyone just went on break here and you've got your booth over there, so I don't want to keep you too long.

Logan Reiser:

You probably want to get back, I think.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Completely.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, I want to.

Logan Reiser:

If you're down to keep talking, I'd love to, but, like, I want to make sure that you're supposed to be talking to me, but you're also supposed.

Isaac Botkin:

To be talking for sure.

Logan Reiser:

To them.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Isaac Botkin:

I'd say I got another five or ten minutes.

Logan Reiser:

Okay, cool.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Because it's like, these are the people.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Oh, yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Okay, fantastic.

Logan Reiser:

So, yeah, so I guess then the question would be, like, as you worked your way through that from the early stages, the Holy Spirit was driving you.

Logan Reiser:

He was building into a lot of what you're doing.

Logan Reiser:

Did you feel.

Logan Reiser:

Were you aware the Holy Spirit was pushing you down this path?

Logan Reiser:

Like, obviously it was something that your dad shepherded you in.

Logan Reiser:

He brought you into the fan, I guess, the family business in a way.

Logan Reiser:

But, like, did you.

Logan Reiser:

You must have felt something personal moving in you.

Logan Reiser:

Like, okay, this is the direction that I'm called in.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So there was.

Isaac Botkin:

There was a huge push.

Isaac Botkin:

I left college to start this company, so I left college.

Isaac Botkin:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Okay.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Praise God.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

You don't need a college degree for business either.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, yeah, you're right.

Isaac Botkin:

And glassblowing is a trade, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

But, yeah, I guess I.

Isaac Botkin:

Working with my dad and working with.

Isaac Botkin:

We actually have another combat veteran named Marvin that works with us too.

Isaac Botkin:

Shout out Marvin.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, shout out to Marvin.

Isaac Botkin:

But, yeah, just working with these guys on these projects and being able to share the gospel, you know, as we're working together, is definitely a driver too.

Isaac Botkin:

You know, that fervent prayer, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Being into that situation and representing the living king and all of that.

Logan Reiser:

So, I mean, it really is all the price for all of life.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Including all of work process as well.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

And yeah, I mean, you know, having, you know, being an artist, I can't be as, you know, thankful.

Isaac Botkin:

I tell you how thankful I am for my wife for being able to go through that process and all those failures with me, because obviously, you know, at the end of the day, completely drained from being there in the summertime, and she's there and she.

Isaac Botkin:

She supports what I'm doing.

Isaac Botkin:

So that's.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, that's a huge part of it, too.

Logan Reiser:

And I think that's an underappreciated aspect of.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, and you're an artist as well.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

And art is.

Logan Reiser:

Art is very unique in that the results can be unpredictable.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right.

Logan Reiser:

You can.

Logan Reiser:

You can pour all of your time and energy and intention into any sort of piece in any medium.

Logan Reiser:

And it can just not work out because of your own mistakes or a flaw in the vision or whatever that you couldn't even predict.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

And like, as a man and as a creative spirit, let's say that hurts.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

And you come home and like, oh, just kind of defeated, you know, and that's part of the process.

Logan Reiser:

Very different from anything else.

Logan Reiser:

And she's there help support you in that, right?

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And wouldn't be anywhere without my church.

Isaac Botkin:

And I brought the same friend to this conference that I did in Knoxville.

Isaac Botkin:

And the community that we have at Sacred City and Bettendorf is phenomenal.

Isaac Botkin:

And they've just been a huge support as well.

Isaac Botkin:

For sure.

Logan Reiser:

So you're not like, you're a man as part of a team in a community.

Isaac Botkin:

I'm in a team.

Logan Reiser:

I guess that's another gift of the Holy Spirit, in a way, because so many artists are so solitary.

Logan Reiser:

It's me and my studio and it's just me.

Logan Reiser:

And it's like the solitary genius is a.

Logan Reiser:

The romantic notion of that.

Isaac Botkin:

That's just.

Isaac Botkin:

There's a ton of pride in that.

Isaac Botkin:

I mean, you know, everyone wants to say, hey, let me walk into a cave and come out with something that is absolutely amazing.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right.

Isaac Botkin:

Or, you know, like the philosophy, like, you know, don't talk to me for two and a half years and I'm going to come back with this new idea that is going to completely blow your mind.

Isaac Botkin:

But there's preciousness in that, you know, And I guess we talked about this last night, but speak about preciousness.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

So being way too detail oriented to the point that you never complete a project.

Logan Reiser:

Sure.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

Especially if you're doing something new.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

You have to get the idea out into the stratosphere.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

And you're never going to do that by being completely just crushed by all of these smaller little details that you're probably going to get lasered in on if you're not part of a team.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

So, yeah, having that team and be able to say, like, still working on that, huh?

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And then there's the conviction of it's time to go, it's time to send it out.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, for sure.

Logan Reiser:

You gotta.

Logan Reiser:

You gotta put it out there in the public, let people look at it and be exposed.

Logan Reiser:

Be exposed in a way.

Logan Reiser:

You know what I mean?

Logan Reiser:

It's like, oh, everyone's seeing this.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Isaac Botkin:

And then.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Also referencing, you know, everyone wants to see your failures in that.

Isaac Botkin:

And we live.

Isaac Botkin:

We live in.

Isaac Botkin:

We live in this time now that everything is accessible to watch someone's story.

Isaac Botkin:

Right, right.

Isaac Botkin:

And that is, yeah, definitely something that I want to expand upon, you know, in that team aspect of being able to get my work out there more through social media and focus on that.

Isaac Botkin:

And something I wrestle with, being that artist that, you know, just wants to create the work but not create the video content to show the world.

Isaac Botkin:

Sure.

Logan Reiser:

So you want to, you want to have, you want to keep your process private, but people want to be part of the process.

Logan Reiser:

And that's been a big humbling thing for me is like recognizing that over four years of doing this, like I've failed a number of times.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

You know, like.

Logan Reiser:

And if people who have been listening for four years can think back, you can probably think of a lot of initiatives I've started that I haven't.

Logan Reiser:

That haven't borne fruit or that I haven't followed through on because it's like, you know, that's part of the process of refining who we are.

Logan Reiser:

You're trying a bunch of different stuff and it's so humbling.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

Especially I remember Gabe talking to the Cross Politic guys about we're not listening to the first season that we filmed, you know, like for X amount of time.

Isaac Botkin:

And yeah, that was, that was actually when they had Darren Doane on there and they were talking about that too.

Isaac Botkin:

So yeah, we've, we've.

Isaac Botkin:

Any type of artist is going to have that.

Isaac Botkin:

The sooner we can get past that and even put that out in the world is when we're going to be able to make an impact for sure.

Logan Reiser:

But I think even like you're at 10 years now.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

At a level where a lot of people.

Logan Reiser:

But be starting out like I'll never be able to get there.

Isaac Botkin:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

But you'll be at 20 years and you'll look back at the stuff they did at 10 years, like ah, amateur.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Well, that's just, I mean this is how we are.

Isaac Botkin:

It's just.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And that's kind of.

Isaac Botkin:

Kind of just how it has to be, I guess.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Isaac Botkin:

Sure.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Isaac Botkin:

No doubt.

Logan Reiser:

Well, it's been fantastic.

Logan Reiser:

Thank you so much for sitting down to chat with me and for your enthusiasm for what you do.

Logan Reiser:

It's an.

Logan Reiser:

It's infectious.

Isaac Botkin:

No doubt.

Logan Reiser:

It's infectious.

Logan Reiser:

And thank you for doing it in such a fallen artistic environment.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, I know that.

Logan Reiser:

The glassblowing, I mean, I can only imagine, you know, and so you're being a stand for Christ in this world.

Logan Reiser:

Maybe just speak about that for a moment.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

I I think George Grant just hit it on the head about the apocalyptic mindset that we can get into.

Isaac Botkin:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

And you know, like you.

Isaac Botkin:

Like you were saying, I've been doing this for 10 years, but, you know, tomorrow or when we get back on Monday, that's another day.

Isaac Botkin:

And it's.

Isaac Botkin:

It's ever and a right.

Isaac Botkin:

Just like we sing here, even just like songs, psalms, hymns of being able to stay grounded in Christ during this creative process, like the psalms.

Isaac Botkin:

And being able to sing has gotten me through so many creative disruptions, so much friction, that I can't even describe that in words other than singing.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

And that's.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, that's been a huge gift.

Isaac Botkin:

That really has came a lot from Fight Lab Feast, and that was singing down in Knoxville.

Isaac Botkin:

We had.

Isaac Botkin:

That was that one fly Gabe referenced in the beginning of the year.

Isaac Botkin:

He's over here now.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, it's following us for sure.

Isaac Botkin:

But yeah, singing to get through the creative process and stay rooted in scripture has been everything, everything in that for daily disciplines, and it's been amazing.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

And that's what's so necessary when on the cutting edge, when pursuing does something difficult, when doing something dangerous.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

What else keeps us going about that?

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah, you're getting suited up and going into battle, and we're going to sing.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

And you get to share the fruits with all of us, churches here, with the conference.

Logan Reiser:

And you make something.

Logan Reiser:

I know that.

Isaac Botkin:

All glass.

Logan Reiser:

You said all glass breaks.

Isaac Botkin:

It just hasn't broken.

Isaac Botkin:

All glass breaks.

Isaac Botkin:

It just hasn't broken yet.

Logan Reiser:

You know, may the things that you break, the things you make break long.

Isaac Botkin:

After you're gone for sure.

Logan Reiser:

Someone else.

Isaac Botkin:

That'd be good.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

Well, thank you so much for this.

Logan Reiser:

Where would you like to send people to find out more about you and what you do?

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So Instagram handles Crux glass art.

Isaac Botkin:

So that's cr x glass art.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Isaac Botkin:

Also crux.

Isaac Botkin:

Crux art.org crux art.org yep.

Logan Reiser:

Everyone go over there, check that out.

Logan Reiser:

And you do experiential kind of things in the Davenport, Iowa area?

Isaac Botkin:

Yes.

Isaac Botkin:

Yep, we do.

Isaac Botkin:

Yeah.

Isaac Botkin:

So, yeah, we do a ton of education.

Isaac Botkin:

We love being that.

Isaac Botkin:

That gem.

Isaac Botkin:

We're one of the only glass wing studios in that area, let alone the Midwest.

Isaac Botkin:

So, yeah, we love to contribute to that, for sure.

Logan Reiser:

Excellent.

Logan Reiser:

Everyone check it out.

Logan Reiser:

If you go that way.

Isaac Botkin:

No doubt.

Logan Reiser:

Thank you so much again.

Isaac Botkin:

Thank you, man.

Isaac Botkin:

I appreciate it.

Isaac Botkin:

You know it.

Logan Reiser:

Cheers.

Logan Reiser:

Isaac from T.

Logan Reiser:

Rex Arms, thanks so much for being here today.

James White:

Well, it is my pleasure.

James White:

I've Seen you on Twitter and I've been recommended your podcast several times.

James White:

I.

James White:

Do you listen to podcasts or do you just make podcasts?

Logan Reiser:

Sometimes I do.

Logan Reiser:

When unmissable ones I do.

James White:

I have a podcast, which means I don't really listen to podcasts anymore.

James White:

If I want to talk, if I want to hear somebody's podcast, I like to have them on my podcast so that I get some content out of it because the publishing schedule.

James White:

But no, we've had a couple of conversations now and I appreciate what you're doing on Twitter and so I'm really glad to be on the podcast.

Logan Reiser:

the sort of firearms world in:

Logan Reiser:

I lived in San Francisco.

James White:

Good company, actually.

James White:

That was a good year for people finding their way in.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

And it was a huge year for you guys as well.

Logan Reiser:

And I became aware of T.

Logan Reiser:

Rex not too long after that.

Logan Reiser:

And just from my casual observer perspective, I've just seen explosive growth in what you guys do, how you present yourselves, and you can feel it.

Logan Reiser:

And so I guess I was curious what has that been like in both from both a business perspective and also in the Christian world as well as you've seen more dawning awareness of these issues.

James White:

So the first:

James White:

I can't remember exactly what we did sales wise, but we doubled our staff.

Logan Reiser:

Amazing.

James White:

In:

James White:

So I can tell you what that's like.

James White:

Deeply unpleasant.

Logan Reiser:

Unpleasant.

James White:

It's deeply unpleasant to be buried under orders and be so busy working that you're hiring people and you would like to train them better, but there's too much work to actually do the training.

James White:

And there's.

James White:

By the grace of God, it worked out really well.

James White:

But it was a very.

James White:

It was a very.

James White:

We knew that.

James White:

We were so grateful for the sales.

Logan Reiser:

Sure.

James White:

Because not only was it income and cash flow, which is important businessy stuff, but the mission of T Rex is to equip people.

James White:

So finding all these people who want to be equipped with our stuff is also an incredible blessing.

James White:

But having to make all those holsters, having to hire people.

James White:

there's also other issues in:

James White:

There's supply chain stuff.

James White:

We had.

James White:

We had product that we are trying to redesign so that it can work with things.

James White:

We had plate carriers and chest rigs that used elastic.

James White:

And the elastic manufacturer said, oh no, we don't make that elastic anymore.

James White:

We only make mask elastic.

James White:

We only make earloop Elastic now.

James White:

So we don't make any of the stuff that you have been buying from us.

James White:

kinds of weird challenges in:

James White:

Have half of them have been in the company for less than three months is a weird.

James White:

It's a weird thing.

James White:

So that's why I say deeply unpleasant.

James White:

Yes, I get it.

James White:

But also great baptism by fire stuff.

James White:

And I'm so proud of everybody at T.

James White:

Rex because everybody put in extra time, extra effort, really, really went the extra mile to serve customers and try to really take care of all the people who were suddenly interested in body armor.

James White:

the biggest growth for us in:

James White:

A lot of people watching the George.

Logan Reiser:

Floyd Summer of love stuff.

James White:

Yes.

James White:

The Summer of love showed people that fiery but peaceful protests are a good time to wear body armor.

James White:

A lot of people who are like, I understand what body armor is for, but I don't understand why I would have it, why I would need it.

James White:

As they watched the news, a lot of people were like, oh, I get it now.

James White:

Yeah, that's worth 500 bucks.

James White:

Yeah, it is.

James White:

Yeah, it is.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

James White:

So.

James White:

tor that a change happened in:

James White:

A lot of it was people who were just like, oh, I should have a gun, Buy a gun, put it in the shelf, never think about again.

James White:

But people who bought a gun, bot holsters and bot body armor are people who are thinking about more than just some kind of magic talisman to put in the closet.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

James White:

Body armor is very unpleasant to buy or to wear.

James White:

So when you buy body armor, it's a commitment.

James White:

You are thinking about more than just an impulse buy.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, you're buying into the reality of a potential scenario.

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

A firearm is like you said, a magic towel is if you're wearing body armor.

Logan Reiser:

You are aware that firearms work both ways.

James White:

Yes.

James White:

And it's a personal sacrifice to buy body armor because it's expensive, and then it's the worst thing in the world to wear.

James White:

Like, nobody wants to wear body armor.

James White:

The only thing worse than wearing body armor is being shot without having body armor on.

James White:

So if I had to choose between the two.

James White:

Exactly.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

So I guess the interesting part for me there's a lot in here, is we're here in an environment that's full of Christian entrepreneurship.

Logan Reiser:

Like, they're like, yes.

Logan Reiser:

The sponsor booths down there are just amazing to see what businesses are doing.

Logan Reiser:

And so you guys hit a moment of explosive growth that I think every entrepreneur kind of longs for.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

But you're drilling for oil, and the gusher happens, and then you have to actually capture the oil.

Logan Reiser:

So from inside, you have a whole bunch of people.

Logan Reiser:

You double your staff.

Logan Reiser:

There's no institutional knowledge.

Logan Reiser:

You have to invent it with people like, tell me what to do.

Logan Reiser:

Like, we don't even know what you should do.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

So what was it like coming out of that?

James White:

There.

James White:

There was a stabilizing time.

James White:

So fortunately, we.

James White:

We had built a good foundation before hiring all those folks.

James White:

Oh, we.

James White:

We had.

James White:

We had just built.

James White:

At that point.

James White:

I'm trying to remember now, that was four years ago.

James White:

So we had about six years of company history at that point.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

James White:

So we had product line.

James White:

We had just bought a building, and so we had room to expand.

James White:

The Lord really prepared us for this in ways that we did not know we were being prepared for this.

James White:

So we really were ready.

James White:

So that is the first thing is we actually had all the pieces.

James White:

We had the space.

James White:

We had some of the institutional knowledge.

James White:

We had some product design.

James White:

We still had to scramble with supply chain stuff.

James White:

But our holsters, we had decided months before COVID started to happen.

James White:

In early January, my brother David said, you know, one of the things we should do this year is we should really, now that we have a bigger building, we should run really deep into raw materials.

James White:

No more just in time manufacturing.

James White:

We should have at least three months of raw materials for holsters, period, Just in case.

James White:

on to have that conviction in:

James White:

Right.

James White:

But it was a great.

James White:

There were a number of things that really set us up for success.

James White:

Some of it was stuff we'd learned in the last six years, the previous six years.

James White:

Some of it was stuff that there really isn't a good explanation.

James White:

It was just providential that that was the case.

James White:

But then coming out of that, there was a lot of stabilizing that kind of needed to be done.

James White:

We realized that we were a big enough company now that we needed to actually probably have.

James White:

I hate the term hr.

James White:

Human resources is so dehumanizing, ironically.

James White:

But we realized we need to have a person in that role, a person who is really dedicated to hiring a person that is really dedicated to compliance.

James White:

Once you get to a certain size of company, you have a whole new raft of compliance that you gotta deal with.

James White:

So there were several roles in the company that just did not exist until we hit certain thresholds.

James White:

And so there was a lot of stuff to.

James White:

as on the to do list to do in:

James White:

hat had been postponed during:

James White:

So.

James White:

And I think that speaks a lot to the maturity of the staff.

James White:

The fact that we could, we could hire people and teach them how to make holsters and tell them like, don't worry, we'll onboard you next year, or maybe the year after that.

James White:

There were people who were mature enough and capable enough that they could do that.

James White:

Like, fine, onboard me whenever, just show me how to use the machine now.

James White:

Great.

James White:

So being able to find folks like that was amazing.

James White:

And so.

James White:

six years, getting ready for:

James White:

And we had dealt with growth before.

James White:

Growth is what you want, it's what you pray for, but it also just adds to your workload.

James White:

And when you are making not exactly a custom product, but a made to order part, it's really easy to get twice as many orders and take 10 times as long to get them out.

James White:

Because there are weird bottlenecks that suddenly appear inside of your pipeline and you realize your production line doesn't fail linearly, it fails exponentially.

Logan Reiser:

Oh yeah.

Logan Reiser:

When things go wrong all at once, when it rains, of course.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Once your buffer is full, you don't just slow down, you kind of stop.

James White:

There's all kinds of things related to production constraints and QRF workflow and stuff.

James White:

We didn't really test this to its limits, but we'd already run into some of these things and started to learn about them.

James White:

So when we had a doubling of orders, we already had a rough idea of like, oh, we've started to bump into these things and this is the way that we're going to handle them in the future.

James White:

Oh, the future is now.

James White:

So that was another great providential thing that God had given us seasons of growth to let us build some of the pieces that we needed.

James White:

So it was deeply unpleasant, but we couldn't have been better prepared, honestly.

Logan Reiser:

It wasn't the Right place at the right time.

Logan Reiser:

I mean, there is an element of that, but you had prepared to be in the right place at the right time without knowing.

James White:

xperienced the same things in:

James White:

There were.

James White:

It was a.

James White:

It was a rising tide that lifted all the ships.

James White:

So SIG USA doubled their factory workflow space, their square footage, and were buying machines as fast as they could and hiring people as fast as they could.

James White:

The.

James White:

The firearm industry benefited from a lot of the layoffs.

James White:

eople that lost their jobs in:

James White:

The firearm industry tends to be more conservative, so a lot of them fought harder to keep their doors open and had jobs available for all the folks that had lost work.

James White:

So it was a really interesting thing that happened across the industry, not just with T Rex.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

You said a word earlier that I think, really encapsulates how I perceive T Rex maturity, the maturity of the staff.

Logan Reiser:

And I have an outsider's view of gun culture.

Logan Reiser:

I enjoy some of the things that I see.

Logan Reiser:

There's clearly a subculture there that I appreciate from a distance, but I know very little about.

Logan Reiser:

But T Rex manages to come across as very mature, but also have fun.

James White:

And very mature, but also have a whole bunch of really young, immature people in it at the same time and have a name like T Rex Arms, which is.

James White:

Which is a joke.

Will Spencer:

Yeah, that's right.

Logan Reiser:

Because of the little short arms.

James White:

Right, exactly.

James White:

So I appreciate that you think we're a mature company.

Logan Reiser:

There's an undercurrent of we have fun, but there's a seriousness.

Logan Reiser:

And that's what I think maturity is.

Logan Reiser:

Maturity isn't stern and stiff.

Logan Reiser:

It can be that at some points.

Logan Reiser:

But to be mature is to recognize, like, there's a youthfulness coupled with a wisdom.

Logan Reiser:

And, like, does that play out within your corporate culture?

Logan Reiser:

Cause I feel it from the outside.

James White:

It is something we strive for in our corporate culture.

James White:

I'm not sure how well we pull.

Logan Reiser:

It off, but it'd be a big challenge.

James White:

One of the things that we also struggle with is we don't know what kind of company we are at T Rex, where it is.

James White:

Like, are we.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Are we a manufacturing company?

James White:

Are we a YouTube channel?

James White:

Are we an educational company?

James White:

Are we a political lobbying company?

James White:

Are we a lifestyle brand?

James White:

According to Darren Doane and some of the folks here, we're a lifestyle brand.

James White:

We could sell.

James White:

We could sell T Rex Arms bottled water, you know, and I think you.

Logan Reiser:

Might be right about that.

James White:

So there's, there's a bunch of things where we're not 100% entirely sure exactly what we are, what bucket we fall into.

James White:

We have our fingers in enough pies, we do enough things, we have a big mission.

James White:

And there's a bunch of different pieces to that mission.

James White:

So I think that that helps a little bit.

James White:

Where we can hopefully avoid getting too precious, too territorial about stuff and we can just be like, hey, you know, we sell armor, we sell night vision, we're a YouTube company, we have political lobbyists.

James White:

Like, our identity isn't so wrapped up in one thing that we have to be too uptight about it, hopefully.

James White:

And our name remains a joke.

James White:

So that also helps.

James White:

I think that's right.

Logan Reiser:

But I think there's a blessing in that.

Logan Reiser:

Ultimately, what I try to do when I encounter decisions like that is I remember how fortunate am I to get to choose between a bunch of good options?

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

Are we a lifestyle brand?

Logan Reiser:

Are we this or that?

Logan Reiser:

Those are all pretty awesome options.

Logan Reiser:

Like what a blessing to get to choose.

Logan Reiser:

And I find that that takes a lot of the pressure off.

Logan Reiser:

Like when I need the answer, the answer will be there.

James White:

Right.

James White:

Are we an engineering company?

James White:

No.

James White:

Are we leaning heavily into being really good engineers and make really good tools?

James White:

Yes, because we believe in constant improvement.

James White:

And so I think that is a help, especially as you get to be a bigger company.

James White:

We have hired a lot of non gun people in our local community.

James White:

We're in a very small town, so not everybody that we hire to come run a CNC machine or hardware holsters is going to be a hardcore competition shooter, budding militiaman.

James White:

Like we have a bunch of regular small town folks.

Logan Reiser:

Yes.

James White:

And so if you come visit T.

James White:

Rex, you will not hang out with a whole bunch of strapping dudes wearing Cry Multicam pants all the time.

James White:

Really dry firing in between loading the Haas machines.

James White:

Yeah, we have guys like that.

James White:

It's true, we do have guys like that.

James White:

But we have a whole bunch of just regular folks and they're leaning into other aspects of the mission, other aspects of serving customers.

James White:

And so I think that helps too, that we can try to achieve excellence in some different areas.

James White:

Be a little more well rounded as a company.

Logan Reiser:

So as a Christian company, Christian owned company, how does that interface with the gun culture world, which is in many ways very pagan, in many ways very, you know.

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

Manly men.

Logan Reiser:

So how do you assert yourself in that, in that role?

James White:

This is fascinating.

James White:

So the gun, there's a Couple different things.

James White:

There's the gun industry.

James White:

Yeah, Most people think the gun industry is Ruger, Smith and Wesson.

James White:

Companies that have been around for over 100 years and have primarily sold to duck hunters and deer hunters.

James White:

And we young YouTube gun tuber whippersnappers have been trying to pull them into AR15 world and, and scary right wing extremism, for example.

James White:

So there's that idea that's out there.

James White:

And if you go to Shot show, you might get that sense.

James White:

Because there are giant hunting companies at Shot show that have the most inoffensive apolitical campaigns that you could possibly build around hunting.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

James White:

And then in the corner you have weird little companies that make niche hardware like ballistic helmets and goggles for dogs, canine units that get dropped out of helicopters.

James White:

Like, you don't need more than two or three companies making that equipment.

Logan Reiser:

Probably not.

James White:

But they are at Shot show and they're across the hall from the gigantic apolitical camouflage company.

Logan Reiser:

Interesting.

James White:

And so the whole industry is this weird mishmash of things.

James White:

And then in another corner, you're going to have some weird guys with Twitter red pill zoomer memes as their entire booth theme.

James White:

So it's a conglomeration of a bunch of different things.

James White:

But there is a strong.

James White:

In the younger gun culture 2.0, the way that we've talked about it in the past, there is a strong masculine.

James White:

And in the past it also has been heavily influenced by people with military experience.

James White:

So specific, specifically veterans that teach firearm proficiency develop products based on their time in actual combat.

James White:

Like that has been, that has been the coin of authenticity, that has been the coin of value within Gun Culture 2.0.

James White:

And that's kind of changed a little bit.

James White:

I don't know to what extent T.

James White:

Rex has been a part of that shift, but I think we have in some ways because my brother Lucas is a great shooter.

James White:

Never been in combat, I've never been in the military.

James White:

And I also don't shoot well.

James White:

But I talk about issues and I invent product.

James White:

And our company is full of people that have different levels of combat experience.

James White:

We have guys who have really incredible experiences to draw on and real world testing of product.

James White:

And then we have guys who are, you know, really, really withdrawn from all of that, but phenomenal at other aspects of thinking through what a militiaman might need or how we would recover some freedoms or how we would actually better serve customers.

James White:

So very interesting in many ways.

James White:

Lucas and I probably we have a number of people who are on the YouTube channel and have A public face.

James White:

But I think Lucas has probably helped move the needle a little bit away from black Rifle Coffee Bodybuilder, Seal Team 6 influence towards more demonstrable skills.

James White:

nostic feel back in the early:

James White:

And it doesn't matter if you can't see their skills.

James White:

It's an invisible thing that they bring to the table.

James White:

And there's absolutely an elephant.

James White:

Excuse me.

James White:

There's absolutely an element of truth to that.

James White:

There are things that if you sit at home and read books about military history, you will not consider some of the realities of living in a trench for seven days.

James White:

These sorts of things.

James White:

You will not have seen what the environment of a refugee village is like if you just read about the logistics and the troop movements.

James White:

But on the flip side of that, the guys who do the door kicking, the guys who have seen the things oftentimes aren't thinking about the logistics, and they aren't thinking about the decisions.

James White:

They aren't thinking about some of the other aspects.

James White:

So I love that there is now, In Gun Culture 2.0, not just a T.

James White:

Rex, but in Gun Culture 2.0, there is a much.

James White:

I would say there's a much broader skill set.

James White:

There's also a lot more appreciation for different gifts, different talents.

James White:

3D printing guys who are, you know, they're geeks, they're nerds oftentimes, but they're inventing new gun technology, and they're pushing the boundaries of freedom and gun laws and so forth by developing stuff that you can print at home.

James White:

Does this podcast go on YouTube, by the way?

Logan Reiser:

It can.

James White:

Well, now that I mentioned 3D printed guns, maybe it can't, but maybe.

Logan Reiser:

We'll cut that part out.

James White:

We'll cut that part out.

Logan Reiser:

Okay.

Logan Reiser:

That's okay.

James White:

It's probably.

Logan Reiser:

Jeffrey, cut this out.

James White:

It's probably okay.

James White:

But YouTube is actually fascinating.

James White:

There is an element I'll back up, you know, people who can.

James White:

I'll try.

James White:

I'm trying to figure out.

Logan Reiser:

I'm completely okay with not putting this on YouTube.

James White:

Whatever you want to do.

James White:

No, I think.

James White:

I think.

James White:

I think YouTube is.

James White:

If YouTube is where you're getting traction, like, go for it.

James White:

I'm trying to back up and remember what I was.

James White:

Find a better segue.

James White:

Right?

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

About different.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, we were talking about different.

Logan Reiser:

Different cultures within gun culture.

Logan Reiser:

Different skill sets that are finding their way.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Together so you have, you know, you have the people who are more militia minded, home trained, personally trained, like yourself and your brother.

Logan Reiser:

Then you have the special forces guys, the door kickers, and those two guys, they have stuff to teach each other.

Logan Reiser:

It can't just be like, these are the guys and the only guys with the secret knowledge.

Logan Reiser:

Like, maybe I haven't done that thing in the field that you've done, but I've achieved proficiency here that you should be able to look at and respect.

Logan Reiser:

And maybe we can.

Logan Reiser:

Maybe we can be brothers, maybe we can be collaborators and not be competitors.

James White:

Yeah, and I think there's just a maturing of the community where guys who are proficient in radio communication, guys who are proficient in ultralight camping, some airsofters, some overlanders, like there's homesteaders, there's a bunch of people who are very ideologically aligned or adjacent to some of these ideas.

James White:

And so the fact that they are a part of gun culture 2.0, or maybe it's gun culture 3.0 now are.

James White:

I think that has been a great, it's been a great improvement and a lot more maturity to the, to the wider community.

James White:

And a lot of it, I think, also mirrors what's happening just in the red pilled community on Twitter.

James White:

You're seeing that that is no longer just trolls.

James White:

There's also a variety of people with different experiences and different interests that are kind of part of that little clump or group that's appearing on X now.

Logan Reiser:

But I'm seeing this.

Logan Reiser:

We were talking about the renaissance of men before we started recording the.

Logan Reiser:

One of the ideas behind the renaissance of men when I started the podcast was that there are so many different male leaders that are taking different angles on masculinity.

Logan Reiser:

Essentially they were setting themselves up as sort of archetypes where they are the example.

Logan Reiser:

And so I just had the 30,000 foot view to look down and say like, this is the outdoor hunter guy, this is the barbarian guy.

Logan Reiser:

This is the entrepreneur.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

This is the playboy.

Logan Reiser:

And you know, I was not looking from a Christian worldview landscape.

James White:

You're talking about Dan Blazerian, right?

James White:

Oh, yeah.

Logan Reiser:

Well, yeah, he's an example.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, he was on the far, the far fringes.

Logan Reiser:

But yeah, all these guys saying, like, okay, I look at all these different guys and like, no one guy has it, but they're all pointing at the same thing, right?

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

And the attempt of the renaissance of men was trying to get these men to see, like, we all have things to learn from each other.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

We can be recognized as men.

Logan Reiser:

Among men.

Logan Reiser:

And the example that I provide to that is always the Lord of the Rings.

Logan Reiser:

There in the Fellowship you have nine totally different guys.

Logan Reiser:

Right?

Logan Reiser:

From the warrior king, hero of Aragorn to the elderly wise man of Gandalf.

Logan Reiser:

And you have Gimli Legless and then you have Frodo and Sam and like.

James White:

Something that would become a classic D and D lineup for role players to come.

Logan Reiser:

Exactly.

Logan Reiser:

But none of these guys with all these very different non overlapping skill sets looked at each other and said I don't think you're man enough, old man.

James White:

Interesting.

James White:

None of them did that.

Logan Reiser:

They understood that they were all united together in common purpose.

Logan Reiser:

And so what I hear you and that's what I was trying to get people to sort of see with the renaissance of men Ultimately because they had no solid worldview foundation.

Logan Reiser:

They were not able to come together.

Logan Reiser:

But you're describing something that I see happening in so many different ways.

Logan Reiser:

How can men have different skills and talents come to work together towards common purpose and recognize and see themselves in each other?

Logan Reiser:

Sounds like that's happening in gun culture a little bit.

James White:

I think so.

James White:

And I think that a lot of that has come from some of it is just the maturing that comes with age.

James White:

There are guys that have been in it for a while and they have grown as individuals and that has helped them in many ways.

James White:

But also I think that there has been a little bit more of a focus on the mission.

James White:

And the beauty of the Fellowship of the Ring is the mission is really what pulls all those people together, all those different groups.

James White:

So Elves, men and dwarves are no longer fighting across purposes.

James White:

They have a common enemy.

James White:

They have a common mission.

James White:

They're going to pull together.

James White:

And I think that that is something that has happened in gun culture where it's no longer just like we're going to fight to get a couple of like gun bills passed.

James White:

Maybe.

James White:

I think everyone understands now that the stakes are much bigger than the assault weapons ban not coming back.

James White:

The stakes are much bigger than that.

James White:

There's something more that we need to do as a country.

James White:

And the gun community is more than just the lobbyist arm of Ruger, Smith and Wesson, whoever.

James White:

So that I think is another major factor here that we realized like, oh, these things could go sideways.

James White:

I'm going to need homesteaders and overlanders to help me get chainsaws out to East Tennessee to help them with that.

James White:

Because the community is about more than just making sure that the NRA has enough money.

James White:

And some of the crumbling institutions have helped like, we watched the NRA fall apart and realized, like, oh, we have to.

James White:

That was our responsibility.

James White:

They're not doing our responsibility for us anymore.

James White:

Now we have to step up and do the political side.

James White:

We have to do the public relations side.

James White:

We have to do some more of this ourselves.

James White:

I think that's helped a lot.

James White:

I think that's actually been really beneficial.

James White:

And so when I watch guys on the left like dancing jigs because the NRA is gone, it's like, oh, you don't understand.

James White:

Those guys are in the way now there's some room to move.

James White:

You should not be celebrating this.

James White:

Those guys were your best ally, to be perfectly honest.

James White:

So that's been really interesting to watch, and I think it is a combination of maturity and prioritization that's helped.

Logan Reiser:

So we're here at Fight LA Feast.

Logan Reiser:

We got Gabe in the background.

James White:

Maybe everyone can hear people singing St Patrick's Breastplate, which is a perfect song for actually all parts of this conversation so far.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, perfect.

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

So as you're.

Logan Reiser:

As you're encountering more and more Christians who are waking up to a lot of these issues, what has that been like for you guys as a company, where you have people coming to you, like, help us with what we don't know?

James White:

Right?

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

I see it happening on two sides, and it's really.

James White:

It's daunting, but it's also very confirming and it's encouraging.

James White:

So we kind of get two groups of people coming to T.

James White:

Rex and saying, I really want to know.

James White:

I want more than a holster.

James White:

I really want to know what's going on.

James White:

I really know how I can help.

James White:

It is either guys from really young guys who have played video games, gotten into Airsoft, and they find us through the guns, and they say, so I love guns.

James White:

What's next?

James White:

So I love guns and what they defend.

James White:

What's next?

James White:

And it's great that those guys are looking for that.

James White:

It's not just a hobby they're wanting to turn into something more than a hobby or they're wanting to understand it more fully.

James White:

And I love that we're getting some of those guys asking us those questions.

James White:

But on the other side, I mean, the folks at this conference are my people.

James White:

I grew up in homeschool conferences.

James White:

I grew up in some of these church denominations.

James White:

So I'm finding more and more people who have focused on family, focused on church, focused on taking care of their kids, focused on business coming to me saying, like, hey, in order to take better care of my community, we need to figure out radios and maps and we need to have firearms.

James White:

I need to be able to defend my family with a firearm.

James White:

The fact that we're getting people coming to us from both directions is really, really encouraging.

James White:

And I think that that is going to help us stay calibrated a little bit, because in many ways, these two groups need each other more than they need us.

James White:

And if we can be a middleman and we can introduce people and connect people, that is a tremendous opportunity, perhaps.

Logan Reiser:

As a lifestyle brand.

James White:

As a lifestyle brand, yes.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

So, yeah.

James White:

And again, I appreciate the diversity that's there where it's very easy for me to get tunnel vision and to get focused on stuff.

James White:

If I have guys that know a ton about the equipment, that know exactly why they want a 14.5 pin and weld AR with a particular BCM bull carrier group, I can talk to that guy about that.

James White:

But if I'm also talking to a guy who has raised nine kids and built a business and is the pastor of a church and he says, hey, what gun should I buy?

James White:

I have never owned a gun in my life.

James White:

What gun should I buy?

James White:

If I am talking to both groups on a pretty regular basis, I think that keeps me from getting a little too hyper focused in a specific area.

James White:

So I think it's also just good for me.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

It sort of keeps a broader perspective on things because you interface with so many different men from so many different perspectives.

Logan Reiser:

It keeps it centered on what is this really about?

James White:

What's the mission?

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, exactly.

Logan Reiser:

As opposed to, this is my identity as a militia guy.

Logan Reiser:

This is my identity as a special forces guys.

Logan Reiser:

Well, yes.

Logan Reiser:

And there's something higher that we should all be pointed towards.

James White:

Now, I would love to use the next hour of this podcast to talk about chrome lined barrels versus some of the other nitriding technologies that exist.

James White:

But it's not mission critical, right?

James White:

For some people it might be, yes.

James White:

But it's really important, I think, that we tie it back to the mission.

James White:

What are we trying to do and why?

James White:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

So how does that mission take shape going forward?

Logan Reiser:

Say, I mean, I know that we're, what, three days out from the election?

Logan Reiser:

Four days out, That's a whole different thing.

James White:

I keep forgetting about the election.

Logan Reiser:

It's nice in this little bubble for a minute.

Logan Reiser:

But, you know, regardless of the outcome next week, what does the future look like?

Logan Reiser:

What are you guys looking?

Logan Reiser:

I mean, obviously there are a couple very different paths.

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

And both of which have degrees of unpredictability.

Logan Reiser:

Right.

Logan Reiser:

But like, as you look for the future.

Logan Reiser:

What does it look like for you?

James White:

So in some ways, I don't want to say it doesn't matter because it matters a lot.

James White:

But in some ways, I feel like there's two very different directions.

James White:

But the initial reactions are going to be the same.

James White:

My brother David, who's the CFO of the company, said whatever happens in the election, the only thing we know for sure is half of the country is going to be madder than they've ever been maybe since the Civil War.

James White:

So good take.

James White:

So there will be that aspect.

James White:

The other thing that will happen is regardless of which candidate gets into the White House, there are going to be 24 million bureaucrats that already kind of have their own systems and agenda that are still in place.

James White:

And a bunch of people will get reappointed with a new cabinet, but roughly 24 million bureaucrats are going to still have the same job.

James White:

So there's, there's that inertia and that momentum that's, that's there regardless of who gets elected.

James White:

But on the, on the, on the flip side, on the good side, the election is not just for president.

James White:

There's all the state and local level politicians.

James White:

My hope is that we can get more of a community focus as a whole, spend a little bit less time being distracted by the president.

James White:

Not that it's not important, but that compared to the size of the bureaucracy and the responsibility that the states have and the responsibility that our communities have, we should really get our focus back there.

James White:

So in many ways, regardless of who wins, the mission is the same.

James White:

And the obstacles and the hurdles, most of those are the same.

James White:

I think that we're going to have a good year financially because I think that there will be unrest, there will be people who are hurt, there are going to be people who are worried.

James White:

And I think that we will probably get orders out of that.

James White:

But also I think that we're going to continue to have some of the same battles and they'll just feel a little bit different.

James White:

If Donald Trump is elected, I think we will be hassled by the ATF a little less.

James White:

But I think that there are, you know, banks and insurance companies and we've been debanked and de platformed several times.

James White:

Like, I think, I think we actually will get more of that under a Donald Trump presidency than under a Harris presidency.

James White:

And I think we'll be hassled by different agencies a little bit less.

James White:

Like in general.

James White:

So in many ways it's just going to be what flavor of there'll Be slightly different flavors of kind of the same thing.

James White:

And that same thing is hopefully a reminder that we need to take more responsibility upon ourselves.

James White:

Our communities and the states need to take back more responsibilities from the government, regardless of who's in there.

James White:

I think that there will be constant reminders of that.

James White:

And hopefully we listen as men, as women, as communities, as states.

James White:

So we'll see the mission remains the same.

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

So just one more quick question.

Logan Reiser:

So you work with two of your brothers.

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

High level at a successful corporation.

Logan Reiser:

How does that work?

Logan Reiser:

Do you guys just go out back and settle things like you did when you were kids?

James White:

So we've joked about that.

James White:

Like we should just have foxy gloves.

James White:

Yeah, so, so we work with.

James White:

So yeah, so there's, there's four owners of the company, three brothers and one brother in law.

James White:

And then other family members are involved in the company.

James White:

Members of our church are involved in the company.

James White:

Like there's, there is every opportunity.

James White:

Yeah, there's every opportunity for messiness.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

James White:

That you can imagine.

James White:

And now the company is big enough.

James White:

We have 90 employees.

James White:

So we have let people go whose parents still work in the company.

James White:

Like any messiness you can imagine, we are in a small town and we have enough people and we have two churches and we have multiple families.

James White:

Like this is any opportunity for awkwardness that you can imagine we have the opportunity for.

James White:

So I think the tendency in corporate America is to avoid messiness by avoiding relationship.

James White:

Sure, it's so much easier, cleaner, but you, you miss all the benefits that come with relationship.

James White:

And so I would, I would encourage people to lean into relationship as opposed to out of relationship and work through the messiness because it's also inevitable people will be messy.

James White:

That is unavoidable.

James White:

Even if there's only one person in solitary confinement, he can develop schizophrenia and argue with himself like it's just going to happen.

James White:

So I won't say that we're always the best example of dealing with the messiness, but I do think that one of the big lessons is lean into relationships.

James White:

Not out of them.

James White:

Don't be afraid of the messiness, but also know that yeah, it'll be there.

Logan Reiser:

Well, there's also a standard above all of you that you're all accountable to.

Logan Reiser:

So in a secular world, you get a bunch of brothers or sisters running a company together.

Logan Reiser:

If they're not all accountable to one standard that holds them all is above them all, that can get messy in a real bad way.

James White:

Yes.

Logan Reiser:

But if you're all accountable to God's Word that's like, okay, that keeps us in line because we know we have a judge in heaven.

James White:

That is a massive.

James White:

That's a fantastic point.

James White:

I really appreciate that.

James White:

But I would say I'm reading a book.

James White:

Oxford Press has a book on family owned businesses.

James White:

Family owned businesses are not uncommon.

James White:

A huge amount of the wealth in the nation is within family owned businesses.

James White:

Obviously there's gigantic public corporations and gigantic publicly traded corporations, but there are untold millions of family owned businesses, some of which are tiny, some of which are medium sized companies that control a lot of wealth and employ a lot of people.

James White:

And so this is something that has been a strength in American companies for a very long time.

James White:

So there are benefits to this.

James White:

There are ways to make it work.

James White:

And the way that you just mentioned, being accountable to each other as brothers in Christ and seeing each other as under authority is the best way to handle it.

James White:

But having those kinds of relationships, building that kind of trust over time is something that I think, again, you miss all that if you just decide you're going to work with random people because it's cleaner somehow.

Isaac Botkin:

Right?

Logan Reiser:

Amen.

Logan Reiser:

Well, this has been fantastic.

Logan Reiser:

I appreciate the time to talk to me about your business and this has been great and gun culture and all of that.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Well, I would love to say soon.

James White:

I want to have you on my podcast because I want to ask you questions.

James White:

You've probably answered many times on other podcasts.

James White:

But I want to have you on my podcast because it's easier than listening to podcasts if we just have the conversation.

James White:

And the thing that I want to get into is some of your cultural observations and other things.

James White:

Gun culture is fascinating.

James White:

It's really interesting to watch it develop as an anthro.

James White:

It's just an interesting thing that somebody ought to be studying, like at an academic level.

James White:

But you've looked into a bunch of other fascinating cultures and other countries and done historical study into those.

James White:

And so I want to pick your brain on some of those.

James White:

So hopefully we can do that soon.

Logan Reiser:

I love that.

Logan Reiser:

And I'm happy to answer a lot of the same questions over and over again because it gives me the chance to think them through in new ways.

Logan Reiser:

So I've told the story of my testimony many times, how I was introduced to Christ at Burning man, which is a whole big thing I've gotten into.

James White:

Not many people have that testimony.

Logan Reiser:

As far as I know.

Logan Reiser:

There might be just one person who's actually followed up and become a Christian as a result of that.

James White:

Oh, wow.

Logan Reiser:

As far as I know There may be more, but as many times I've heard this story, I've heard stories of like, oh, there are people who made professions of faith at Burning man, which is not exactly the same thing.

Logan Reiser:

It's an emotional environment.

Logan Reiser:

People are tempted to get caught up in the moment and say something, and then they get back into real life and it never actually lands in their lives to the form of like joining a church, you know, getting baptized, etc.

Logan Reiser:

So as far as I know, I might be the only.

Logan Reiser:

I may not be, but as far as I know, I might be the only one.

Logan Reiser:

And it's funny that you mentioned that, because I just.

Logan Reiser:

I never had.

Logan Reiser:

Never put the pieces together.

Logan Reiser:

It's because when I met this Christian ministry group, I actually pursued them.

Logan Reiser:

So I met them at Burning Man.

Logan Reiser:

I had that experience with them.

Logan Reiser:

Then they came to Carson City, Nevada, like two months later.

Logan Reiser:

And I drove up to see them because I wanted to see them again.

Logan Reiser:

Then I went to their houses for Christmas in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho.

Logan Reiser:

I kept in touch with them while I was traveling.

Logan Reiser:

So it wasn't just something that I have that happened.

Logan Reiser:

And we kept in touch.

Logan Reiser:

And I checked in with them five years later.

Logan Reiser:

It was that I pursued relationship with them.

Logan Reiser:

And I only realized that through telling that story so many times, like, oh, wait, there are some pieces.

Logan Reiser:

So it helps me to tell, to answer the questions because I see things in new ways.

James White:

Very good.

Logan Reiser:

Because we have the narrative that we develop about our lives, which is true, but it can sometimes, just the way our minds work, leave out details like, oh, I'd never thought about that before.

Logan Reiser:

So I'm happy to talk about this stuff.

James White:

Oh, yeah.

James White:

I mean, my life is a whole bunch of weird, crazy, completely unrelated, random things.

James White:

And then in hindsight, you're like, oh, I think God was trying to teach me something there.

James White:

And only now do I realize his providential goodness that I was avoided that, but was also there to see that.

Logan Reiser:

Yes.

James White:

So you get it.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah.

Logan Reiser:

He led me to take a look at that.

Logan Reiser:

I got to see it.

Logan Reiser:

And then he slowly snatched me out of it.

Logan Reiser:

Okay, you're done.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

So.

James White:

Well, I'm looking forward to that conversation already.

Logan Reiser:

That should be a great conversation.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Anthropological examinations of other cultures and our own histories.

James White:

Sounds like it sounds like a white paper or a PhD thesis or something crazy like that.

Logan Reiser:

That does sound like.

Logan Reiser:

Well, I've had the chance to observe developed nations, developing nations and nations that will never develop.

Logan Reiser:

Right, right.

Logan Reiser:

And so that's.

Logan Reiser:

They call that the first, second, and Third World.

Logan Reiser:

But I find that developed nations are like the United States, Japan, you know, nations in Europe, et cetera, developing.

Logan Reiser:

I would probably say China, India, Peru is a great example, at least back when I was there.

Logan Reiser:

And then like, an island nation like Vanuatu in the South Pacific will never develop.

Logan Reiser:

That's just not what's going to happen there.

Logan Reiser:

So to see the world and those two perspectives backstage is a.

Logan Reiser:

It's.

Logan Reiser:

It taught me a lot.

Logan Reiser:

It helped me appreciate America thousand percent.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Another interesting conversation is undeveloping countries, countries who are losing stuff.

James White:

Yeah, that's something I want to dig into because there's so many different factors to look into.

James White:

I mean, as complicated as Gun Culture 2.0 is to try to define and map and, like, just figure out who's even in there.

James White:

National and civilizational cultural development up or development down is tricky to track.

Logan Reiser:

Yeah, there's a lot of that right now.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

Yeah, very good.

James White:

Well, thanks again, Will.

James White:

I appreciate it tremendously.

James White:

And yeah, we'll keep talking offline and then can't wait to have you on T Rex Talk.

Logan Reiser:

Sounds great.

Logan Reiser:

Where would you like to send people to find out more about you and what you do?

James White:

So the company T Rex Arms can be found@trex-arms.com and you can see all the stuff that we sell, stuff we manufacture, stuff we design, stuff that we retail.

James White:

And then we create a lot of educational materials, some of which may be helpful for people who want to learn more about shooting, more about radio, more about things that are sort of adjacent to Gun Culture 2.0.

James White:

And then we also have a podcast, T Rex Talk, and everything can be found from the main website, though it's probably the best place for people to go.

James White:

Simpler, easier.

James White:

And if the election goes one way or possibly the other, you might already be looking for someone to stuff that we sell.

Logan Reiser:

Just possible, you know, go there anyway.

James White:

There will be a Black Friday sale.

James White:

If you're already looking for it, maybe it'll be easier for you to find.

James White:

That's the other thing we want to do is not just, like, send people to our website because we want to make money, but we honestly believe that we have brought our products to a high level.

James White:

We've curated the stuff that we carry from other people really well.

James White:

The goal was to create a website where we could send people when they had questions like, I'm new to this.

James White:

How do we get started?

James White:

That's the goal.

James White:

And I still feel like we have a long ways to go, but we have a thing.

James White:

If you want the best Kydex holster within a certain criteria, we are the people.

James White:

And I truly believe that that is the case.

James White:

And if you have specific needs or looking for specific stuff, I'm confident we know who makes that too, and we will send you in that direction where our customer service guys can do that.

James White:

So we are in many ways a customer service first company.

James White:

And then we make stuff that needs to be made, and we curate stuff that people should know about, and then we make educational material around it.

James White:

So, yeah, we're always trying to figure out what kind of company we are.

James White:

So.

James White:

Yeah.

James White:

So visit the T.

James White:

Rex Drums website and let us know in the comments what kind of company we are.

Logan Reiser:

Please do that.

Logan Reiser:

Thank you so much, Isaac.

Logan Reiser:

I appreciate that.

James White:

Yeah.

Follow

Chapters

Video

More from YouTube