So many small business owners obsess about how their ADHD struggles make things more challenging, but there is a bigger picture at play.  When you identify your ADHD strengths and use them as your competitive advantage, now you are cooking with gas.  

My friend, Iris Goldfeder is a marketing strategist and owner of Gas Stove Creative.  She joins us today to talk about how she leans into her ADHD strengths of empathy, systems thinking, strategic listening, and radical authenticity to run her successful marketing agency.  

Iris lives in Indiana with Heather, her wife of 22 years. In addition to her rather impressive collection of Star Wars memorabilia, Iris is a musician and member of the band “The Infringements,” a dog mom and fellow enthusiast of F-bombs and radical authenticity.  

Here are three key takeaways from our conversation:

👉 Systems Thinking as an ADHD Strength: Iris emphasized the importance of having team members who understand the interrelated pieces of the puzzle. This holistic approach ensures smoother operations and greater overall success.

👉 Empathy and Emotional Intelligence: Empathy is a crucial skill for understanding and addressing client needs effectively. Iris shared how truly listening enables you to envision solutions and build deeper, more meaningful client relationships.

👉 Authenticity Over People Pleasing: Being true to who you are not only attracts the right kind of clients but also allows you to bring your best, most creative self to your work.

Fun Fact from the Episode: Iris has a "fuck jar.” It's an oh-so-relatable way of managing those moments when you just run out of fucks to give. A must-have for any ADHD entrepreneur, if you ask me!  Jar of F*cks

Recommended reading/listening:

“The Let Them Theory” by Mel Robbins - how to break free from letting other people’s opinions and judgments affect you. And, in case you didn’t know,  Mel was diagnosed with ADHD at age 47.  

Want more Iris in your life?

Website - Podcast - LinkedIn - Free website audit 

Are you going to Neurodiversion 2025 in Austin, Tx March 27-29th? 

I’ll be there too, and hosting a Meetup for Neurodivergent Entrepreneurs and Business Owners.  DM me on LinkedIn or send me an email to let me know. I’d love to meet you there! 

© 2025 ADHD-ish Podcast. Intro music by Ishan Dincer / Melody Loops  / Outro music by Vladimir /  Bobi Music / All rights reserved. 

H: What we are going to talk about today, Iris, is how you use your ADHD strength to stand out in your field, to run your business, to bring your unique gifts and magic to the world, and even to select people you work with and who become team members. I'd love to start there because I think you're so intentional about bringing people into the fold who are really aligned with the kind of traits you're looking for. Can we talk about that?

G: Yeah. Absolutely. I think that, you know, the first thing for me before I bring anybody into the team is that they have to be systems thinking. And what I mean by that is seeing the interrelated pieces of the puzzle and think through how activities or lack thereof, impact each other piece of the business. So thinking beyond, you know, the now and us because there are so many people that just worry about their job and they'll do their job. But if they don't do their job, they don't realize how by not doing it, how it affects the rest of the team. Because if even one cog is out of place in a wheel, it's gonna be wobbly.

And I think that ADHD especially, I mean, we're just hyper focused on all these, like, all of these things. It's like, you know, with OCD, you're hyper focused on the one thing at the one time. So it's like you have to wash your hands 5 times or you have to turn the stove off, you know, whatever that is right? But when you have ADHD, some of us, not most of us, we're hyper focused on everything at once. So that's what I think makes us really, really strong entrepreneurs. I think that that's one of the things that one of my strengths because my clients I was assessed as a strategic listener. Meaning and if you look at all of my reviews, it's like Iris and her team really listen. It's not like we half listen. We really, really listen because if you listen to talk, you're not gonna learn shit.

H: Absolutely.

G: You're just not, if you listen to hear and learn, right? So how my brain works because nobody ever wants to be inside of it, but you know, how it works is I listen. So this part is listening and hearing and taking everything in. And behind the scenes, I already have a strategy in place. Like, I already know what you need and that's what my clients love. So I think that's one of my strengths. And being able to see all of the pieces, it's like when somebody comes to me and they need, you know, specific things, it's like putting a puzzle together. And we love puzzles right, we love interest. Like, all that stuff and I have this little, you know, like, bubble wrap thing that it's a puzzle. Like, we just love these things and to me, it's a puzzle. So I get to put it together for the client and it helps them succeed and it's a great thing. It's a great feeling.

G: I love this so much because one of my mottos is what's good for them is good for me, or what's good for me is good for them. And I say this because I have the same type ADHD brain that you do in this regard. When someone comes to me for help, I am listening to what they're saying. I'm also listening to what they're not saying. And I think about it as like listening to both the music and the words. And I can sort of hear the things that aren't being quite articulated and the things that they're connected to. And it's like, while they're talking and I'm listening, I'm already envisioning how I can help them solve that problem and where we need to start and maybe what they need what resourcing they need shored up first.

People who don't understand this think sometimes they can be creeped out by it. Most people are impressed by it, and they think it's super cool. And they love to work with people who have this ability. But it can be a little scary at times because it's like, how do you know this? Or what how do you know how to do this? And so I think that you're right, we do tend to attract people who want what we have and are not suspicious of it or overwhelmed by it. Do you ever find that your ability to sort of think through the entire problem and you're already creating the solution in your mind means that you are ever impatient for the client to see your vision?

G: No. No, because, there have been a few occasions where I knew what they needed, but they weren't on board and, you know, they got on board. But I think a lot of times when somebody owns a business, especially in the service industry, there's ego involved right. It's like I'm doing this myself, you know, for so long, blah blah blah. What makes you think you know my business better than me? And it's not that we know their business better than they do, but we know their business better than they do. And so, you know, we can't one of the things that I've found, the on one occasion, we had our meeting, and I put this email together and I said, okay based on our meeting, this is what I would suggest. And then I got an email back going, I wanna do that. I don't wanna do that, I don't wanna do that and I don't wanna do that. And then I sent an email back saying, let's have another meeting

I cannot do that job for you if you get in the way. So you need to decide, are you going to step out of the way, listen to my suggestions, and let's see what works, or are you just gonna stay in the way and then it's just not gonna work? And A he's not used to being spoken to like that, and B, he's not used to being spoken to that like that by a woman. So he said, he goes, I guess I didn't look at it that way, but I guess I have been getting in my way for the longest time. He said, so let's do this, let me ruminate on this for a little bit. And I was very grateful that he said ruminate and not marinate because when somebody says marinate, I'm like, what are you, a fucking piece of steak, it makes me nuts.

H: And ruminate is more accurate. That's what's actually happening.

G: Exactly. Right. But he knew the words sro that gave me hope that we could work together. So, and then and he said, and then, you know, let's reconvene on Friday, I said, great. And this was Wednesday. So we reconvened on Friday and he said, I'm done. He goes, I'm gonna step back and I'm gonna let you do what you need to do. He goes, but he goes, if you're wrong, he goes, I'm gonna be the first to say I told you so and I said, fine, if that makes you feel good, whatever right? Let's just do this and he got really successful. And so I think that, you know, going back to your question, I think that the people that find us, they're the ones that need us. The ones that don't find us, they don't need us or they don't want us. So I think that we attract, the right people, at least I'm hoping we do.

H: Well, I think that the I mean, you're a marketing specialist. I think that's the whole point in marketing is attracting the right people. I always say the right people for the right reason at the right time. Because sometimes, they'll be a great person for you, but they're not at the right stage of business or they're not at the right stage of their own understanding of what they need and what it costs and why it pays to hire an expert, not try to dick around with it yourself indefinitely. But the way you're talking about this conversation, it reminds me of how many, unfortunately, women have told me that, there are people pleaser, and many women with ADHD are people pleasers. Many women, period, are people pleasers.

G: Yeah, I'm over that, though. I was, I'm over it.

H: But I think it's also recognizing that people pleasing, while it can feel safe, while it's certainly we are culturally conditioned as, women to be people pleasers because of the patriarchy and all that. However, when you really know your stuff and you really want to be empowered, to have permission to bring your A game to your clients, all of your wisdom, all of your experience, all of your expertise, all of your talents, and all of your neurodivergent gifts. They kind of have to take you as you are and not put on the handcuffs and not second guess you and not try to, like, interrogate you with a bunch of fears and doubts and questions because I think where we perform at our best is with people who say, alright, let's see what you can do. And then we double down on showing them what we can do. Even the ones who will say, I don't really know. I heard you were really good. I don't know, maybe. Then sometimes I have that stubborn side, and I think you do too, where you're like, oh, you have no idea what challenge you just threw down my man.

G: Oh, yeah. It's like, bring it. Let's go. Let's go. Thank you. Thank you. You know, because I think that A we love a challenge. There's like nothing more that we love than, you know, than a challenge. And I find that it's like I laugh because before I became an entrepreneur I worked for businesses that hired me to do a job and then they told me how to do the fucking job and it's like…

H: The funniest thing ever.

G: Then why did you hire me? If, if you what, well, this is how we market my business. No, you hired me to be the marketing manager or whatever and let me, you know, no. So when I started my own business people hire and when we first started, we were just doing just websites and SEO and that was it right? And it was really inexpensive back then because it was like 10 something years ago. So not inexpensive, but way less expensive than it is now.

And so it's changed and so it's not just a brochure site anymore where somebody comes to see your services and then they leave. You have to that site has to sell them. That site has to convince them to want to go deeper into the site and learn more and then, you know, decide from an educated place. Are you a good fit for them? Or are you even you know, are you worth a phone call and that's changed. The other thing too that I find is that people they don't evolve when their ideal client changes.

So because as we evolve our ideal client changes. So my ideal client used to be a start up business who could spend $2 on a website and maybe, you know, whatever a month on SEO and then that's it. Not anymore. Now my ideal client is, you know, businesses 500,000 to 5,000,000 that hit a certain pinnacle and they're like, well, shit, where do I go from here? So and now my messaging has to change right because I've evolved.

H: You're talking to different people. What I think is interesting about this, and I'd love to know what you think, Iris, because we are like minded and like brained.

G: Which is scary, that's another story.

H: That's why the pre chat was fire okay? But it's gone into the ether now. I think I believe that as a person who's neurodivergent, it took me many years to realize this. And I used to try to suppress it, and I felt apologetic about it and almost ashamed of it because I got called out for it. But I am on, for life, what I now refer to as the path of continuous personal evolution. I grow into and grow out of identities, occupations, lifestyles. It's the ADHD hunger to learn and to be challenged and to master something. And I realized it's not mastery according to what the world thinks of as mastery.

It's when I've mastered it to the degree that I feel fulfilled and satisfied and kind of satiated, then I'm ready for my next evolution. And when I didn't really understand this about myself, the endings of things were very destructive. I literally had to, like, burn things to the ground in order to give myself permission to move to my next iteration. You know, Diann 2.0 3.0 and so forth. Now I understand, and I help my clients actually build that into their business. Like, it's kind of built to evolve because you are built to evolve. So my question is, do you feel that the evolution of your ideal client, which means the evolution of your business model and the evolution of your services and the evolution of your price point and the evolution of your target market, do you think it came from inside of you, or was it driven by market need?

G: I say both because I'm trying to think of how to articulate it. So for me, it was a price point right? So I charged x dollars for a website, and my margin was what my margin was. Now as business owners, we really have to keep our eye on the bottom line and on our margins. And when you're a solopreneur and you're not doing like, the volume that I'm doing now, it wasn't a thought. Like scaling wasn't even like a, oh, what's, you know, scaling? Well, now I'm scaling. And so it's like, oh shit, if you can't get here, right, if you stay here. If you stay here, you're just gonna stay here. But if you wanna get here, then you have to move to here and so that's what, you know, I started doing and it came from, supply and demand. People are looking for quality marketers. They're looking for quality, not just web designers, but people who really help with their online presence, and know how to get them done.

H: A system thinker about marketing.

G: System thinker.

H: At all the interconnecting pieces, not just the website and you're not compartmentalizing. You're realizing all the intersections that create your online presence and identity and your marketing.

G: Because the person that I'm working with or the company that I'm working with, right, they wanna be out there. So, yeah, your website is important and SEO is definitely important, especially a local business, if you don't have SEO, it's like you're just like shooting yourself in the foot. But guess what, video is also important. Because when you do video, people get a feel for who you are. You can write all the posts that you want. You can write all the blogs that you want, but until somebody sees this, right, they're not gonna really know who you are.

So that's why I started doing like a whole bunch of video and I encourage my clients to get out there and do video and half of them don't wanna do it. And that's what I try to explain to them then they're like, oh. And if, you know, they're still uncomfortable, we have somebody on the team that can help them help them get comfortable. But, you know, for me, it's the all around piece. It's like, what is going to put you out there and let you shine in your best light?

H: And you recognize all the different ways that that can happen. I also think because you are a person who really loves learning and loves sharing what you've learned and love helping other people become more successful, like, that's super exciting and fulfilling for you, it also pays well. But it's like being able to you walk your talk is my point. You're not gonna tell them to do something that you're not willing to do. I mean, that would be so inauthentic. You're like, okay, I that's exactly how I felt, and this is why I kept practicing until I got over it.

And that's why I put the videos out like, if you go to my LinkedIn page, you know that, you're gonna see, like, a ton of video right? And some and most of it is gonna be educational. I mean, I'm gonna try, you know, I'll sell on a couple of them, but I don't believe in putting all those videos out there and, you know, hey, buy this today that you'll never get that from me right? You will hear that we offer this service. And if it's something that you've done, great. If not, hit me up and let's talk. But, you know, for the most part, I try to educate because a lot of people they don't know what it is right? Like, you know, I just did a thing on alt text to add I am right? And I had people DM-ing me going, holy shit, I had no clue that's what that was.

I thought that you just rolled the mouse over the picture and it happens automatically. And it's like, no, you have to actually go in there and put that description in. Because otherwise, you know, somebody who is visually impaired or who has some kind of a disability isn't gonna know what that is so you have to put those descriptors in. And so to me, education is power. So the more I can educate somebody, the more power they have over their own stuff. And then if they need help in the future, I hope they think of me.

H: But they also learn I mean, you're also teaching people because you do create a lot of content. You are showing people how you think right? You're showing people who you are and how you think. A lot of people don't believe in educating people for free. They're not gonna put those videos out on LinkedIn. They're not gonna have a podcast like yours or mine, where people literally can listen or read our free stuff or watch our free videos and learn from us. There are people who are like, I'm not giving away nothing. It's like you're literally showing people what you're capable of. You're showing them how you think.

Even the fact that, you know, I'm pretty sweary. You like to drop the bombs here and there. There are people that say, oh my gosh, there's so many people I could refer to you but you just swear way too much. I said, trust me when I tell you, first of all, thank you very much for thinking of me but I know who I am, I know how I am. And the people who are meant to work with me not only don't mind my swearing, they actually like it.

G: Yes. So it's funny you say that because and I don't know when we were talking in our many conversations before this, but I had a coach tell me years ago to be less me because I am sweary right? And, and I listened to him.

H: That's the worst advice ever.

G: I know. But back then, and it was a male, it was a white male.

H: Of course. Of course. There we go, the pattern.

G: And so I was, I was like, oh, okay. Maybe right. You know, New York or in Indiana so maybe, okay, whatever. So I did pull back and I got more clients, but I'll never forget the first time I said, oh, fuck, that's not working. Like, the guy crossed himself and he was like, oh my god and I went, woah. I know, I was like, what? And he was like, yeah, I can't continue to work with you. And I was like, oh, I can't continue to work with you either and I fired my coach.

H: I’m gonna drop you first. You're not dumping me, I'm dumping you.

G: Right. But I fired the coach, I was like, you asshole. You sat there and you told me to be less me. But then what that did do was it put me on this journey of finding out this inside work, this inner work. Who really am I, like, what is the authentic me? And then I found the authentic me. And now the people that wanna work with me wanna work with me because of me. Because I say fuck, because, you know, I tell them like it is and I'm not rude about it, but…

H: You're a New Yorker. I love people that are direct because it does take a lot of time.

H: Right, but there are people that will you know, a company will be like, hey, I think I need help. And they'll come in and they'll look at their system, they'll look at what they're doing and they'll say, wow. What the hell were you thinking? Why would you do that? And I'm like, oh my god. Why would you ever say that right? So I go into a business and I see all the things that they're doing right and I say, oh, you know what? You're doing you're block you're doing a really great job here. You're doing a really great job here and this is really, really good. This here could use a little bit of help so let me help you with that piece.

And then they don't feel like idiots because if you go in with shame marketing and where you make somebody feel ashamed of what they're doing, A, that's just bad humanity. I think it's just an awful thing to do in general. But B, now they're it takes a long time for us to build our confidence and our knowing that we know our stuff. Now we just took that away from them. You don't wanna do that. I never wanna do that to somebody. So I always wanna go in and I always wanna look at the things that they're doing right and start with the things that they're doing right. And then say, okay, this isn't terrible, but we could probably use some work here. And it's all about the language that you use. It's about the intent behind the language that you use.

And I think that that's where everything kind of, you know, changes because I think there are a lot of people out there that, you know, they do fear based marketing where, oh my god. If you don't work with me, you're gonna lose all this money. And it's like, even if I don't spend any with you, I'm saving it, right? It's like good one. It's like that kind of an attitude. And, so I just think that kindness and empathy is just the best way to go. And I think that's what I incorporate in my business. And that's, you know, when I bring somebody on, it's never to shame them. It's never to do anything negative. It's to just, try to inspire them to get to that next level. And here are the tools that we can use to help you get there.

H: And I think these are ADHD gifts as well. In fact, I recently released a solo episode of the podcast about 7 ADHD Strengths that we can incorporate into our business. And one of them, and you clearly have it, Iris, is, empathy and emotional intelligence. A lot of marketing, which many people are calling bro marketing, fear based marketing, scarcity marketing, so forth, it is lacking in empathy. Any business owner, even if their website looks like it's from the nineties, their marketing is all over the place or nonexistent, whatever their current situation is, the fact that they were humble enough and aware enough to reach out for help, even to schedule a consultation with someone like you or me for that matter to say you as well.

There's some things that I think I could be doing better to honor that with empathy and start that conversation with, you know, I have this on my scheduling questionnaire when someone books a consultation with me. Tell me what's going well in your business. Because, truly, I think, most of us are just dancing as fast as we can, and we're not probably giving ourselves nearly enough credit for what we're doing well. And but it's like so many people oh, which part?

G: Tell me what's going well.

H: Oh. I like that because the thing is that I think sometimes, I like asking the question because I think, sometimes when we tell people, here's what I see you doing well, because we've all been sold to and gaslit by marketers.

G: Nobody wants to be sold to anymore.

H: No. And even when we're trying to honor what we see them as doing well, sometimes they start to, you know, tense up because they think, oh, here comes the pitch. You know, like, as if we don't genuinely mean it. So I'm just experiment with it and let me know let me know if you notice a difference. Asking them what they think is doing well and letting whatever they say and then say, you know, here's what I see in addition to that. Then it's already more collaborative. Everybody's so afraid of being taken advantage of. Everybody's so afraid of being tricked. They're afraid of, you know, bait and switch. They're I mean, I can't believe the horror stories I hear. People who've worked with previous business coaches, even ADHD coaches. And I'm like, oh my god. That's so shocking. But empathy and intuition and emotional intelligence, I don't know why they're called soft skills because…

G: Hard things.

H: Yeah. They're well, let's put it this way. I think they're very hard for people who don't have them.

G: I wanna work with the person whose value and missions align with mine. I wanna know my client's kid's name. I wanna know when their birthday is. I wanna know all the things about them because to me the more I know, the better I can serve.

H: You turn everyone, if you like them and they like you, if it's a good fit they're already getting grafted into the vine. You are already you're like, you know, you got the vineyard of your life. You're always including people and really become they're become part of your family. Because guess what? With the gifts of empathy and emotional intelligence and intuition, with your systems thinking, with your ADHD ability to take in information from every I call it, like, my brain is a satellite dish. Stuff is always streaming in and stuff is always streaming out because you have the same.

The power of that combined with, you know, the deep emotional connection that you have with the people you work for, that brings your very best gifts to the table. In a way that's magic. And I think I don't know how many other people do this. I find it absolutely necessary for me. You can't hire me without my permission. You can't say, I'm gonna throw a suitcase of money at you. You will be mine. No, I do basically an interview. It's like a first date. It's not a sales call, I'm not trying to sell anybody anything.

G: No. I do the same thing. I do a discovery call and we discover if we're right for each other.

H: Exactly. And if we are, if I like the person, if I like their business, if I like what they're about, if I like their values, I not only want to work with them. I am already thinking of ways that I can make their business even more magical and successful with a lot less effort. But I need to like, it's sort of like if you wanna call it the downside of, how our brains operate, we actually have to give a shit.

G: Oh, a 100%.

H: To bring the magic. If I don't care, there's no way I can get my best out of me. I might get a trickle, but I'm never gonna get a flow. So I need to position myself with people that are compatible in values and mindset. And I actually have to care about what they're trying to do in the world in order for me to bring my gifts, and you are exactly the same.

G: Oh, a 100%. I had a guy who we did the discovery call and he had a whole bunch of paraphernalia behind him that did not go along with my values or beliefs. And, I said as soon as I saw the screen, I said, this isn't gonna work and he said, why? He goes, oh, is it because of that, I said 100%. Now before I would see that, and I would say, you know, I'm gonna talk to my team and I'll send you, you'll hear within 48 hours if we think we're good fit and how to move forward. So this way, I didn't have to be an asshole about it. But now I'm gonna be an asshole or I'm just gonna be very direct.

H: You're in your asshole era.

G: I'm in my asshole era because, you know, look at here. Once again, the jar right?

H: You're all out of flux.

G: It just flipped its lid, so I'll have to pick that up later. But it was like, he was like, why won't you work with me? Well, because I'm very successful at what I do. I'm good at what I do. And I know that if I work with you, you'll end up making a lot of money. And I don't wanna help you make a lot of money because you're gonna take that money and turn around and give it to organizations that wanna take my rights away. And he just flabbergasted, like, I can't even believe you just said that. And he said, seriously? And I went, yeah, he goes, well my money is green. I said, yeah. But your money has hate attached to it and I can't. I said, thanks for your time, I'm gonna sign off and then I just, like, clicked off.

H: This is so powerful, Iris, for somebody listening who's thinking, well, that must be nice. I'm early in my business, and I literally have to say yes to everybody that comes my way. We've all been there.

G: Yeah. Yes and no right? Because I was there too and I remember in the very beginning, I would pretty much take anyone, but I even then I had my boundaries because you have to. You have to sleep at night. It's like, is that, you know, in this case, would have been a lot more, but, you know, is that 1,000 a month worth it? It'll help you pay that bill, but if you don't take that person, the right person is gonna come along sooner rather than later.

H: You'll leave this space. I wanna wrap with this. I think when we are able to, because I think there's a whole lot of individual skills and points of awareness that your point of view is coming from. It's that you know who you are. You know what matters to you. You know that in order for you to bring the very best of you to the work that you do so that your client's happy, so that you make great money, so that you feel proud and satisfied and fulfilled, you need to work with people that you can get excited about helping. And to the degree to which we can build that into our businesses, especially if you have ADHD, you will be on fire. You will be 10 times more successful because it you will be creating the conditions that allow you to bring your A game every single time.

G: Yep. A 100%.