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Building Self Confidence
Episode 55th January 2022 • Morning Walk with The Artist's Forge • The Artist's Forge
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Creating art is a vulnerable practice that exposes artists to judgment on a regular basis, and it can be incredibly difficult to maintain healthy self-esteem. In this episode of Morning Walk with The Artist's Forge, you'll hear how a group of artists and business people manage their own confidence and how they build their self-worth through habits, thought patterns, and mindful practice.

Transcripts

Matt Stagliano:

Hi, this is Matt Stagliano and thanks for being

Matt Stagliano:

part of the artists Forge. We're a community of creatives who

Matt Stagliano:

help each other think like an artist. By discussing creativity

Matt Stagliano:

as a process instead of a skill or a talent. We believe everyone

Matt Stagliano:

has what it takes to create something amazing. We just need

Matt Stagliano:

some encouragement and inspiration along the way. What

Matt Stagliano:

you're about to hear is a live recording of one of our daily

Matt Stagliano:

discussions on the clubhouse app. If you like what you hear,

Matt Stagliano:

I encourage you to join our private Facebook group, or visit

Matt Stagliano:

us on the web at the artist forged calm. Now on to the show.

Nicole York:

And I'm super glad to have you back with us. This

Nicole York:

brighten early Monday morning for morning walk, and photo talk

Nicole York:

with the artist Forge. As you can see, we have our lovely

Nicole York:

moderators with us this morning, the amazing and ultra talented

Nicole York:

beside Matt Becca, and the lovely cat. And now you know

Nicole York:

you're here with us. And I'm really glad you are because

Nicole York:

today we're gonna be talking about building self confidence.

Nicole York:

And I know that this is one of those conversations, I

Nicole York:

personally need to have multiple times in my life, maybe every

Nicole York:

couple months is good, just to remind me of the things that I

Nicole York:

can do. Kick me in the butt a little bit. And also take away

Nicole York:

any guilt or shame that I might feel

Nicole York:

as a result of not always being where I wish I was, and how that

Nicole York:

can have a damper on my self confidence. So that's the

Nicole York:

conversation today you're building self confidence as an

Nicole York:

artist, as a creator, as a business person as a you. So

Nicole York:

wherever you identify with needing this conversation most,

Nicole York:

or with being the most competent. That's where I'd love

Nicole York:

to hear from you. Because I have lots of thoughts on this issue.

Nicole York:

But first, I want to know, when it comes to self confidence,

Nicole York:

what do you all think is the most important thing? And how do

Nicole York:

you manage your own self confidence

Cat Ford-Coates:

so it's interesting self confidence, for

Cat Ford-Coates:

me was actually something I learned to feign pretty well, as

Cat Ford-Coates:

a kid.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I was bullied a lot for a really long time until probably like my

Cat Ford-Coates:

sophomore year in high school. And like a lot by the same group

Cat Ford-Coates:

of people and like over and over again, love a lot. And as I

Cat Ford-Coates:

might my physically grew, I realized that I was taller and

Cat Ford-Coates:

larger than most of the people my age. And if I pretended to be

Cat Ford-Coates:

strong and relatively like unapproachable, it gave me a

Cat Ford-Coates:

little more distance between the bullying and my physical person.

Cat Ford-Coates:

And that, you know, definitely grew into your intimidating,

Cat Ford-Coates:

like, I'm not intimidating, I'm just quiet and tall. But it as

Cat Ford-Coates:

an adult, like that carried through into things and I had to

Cat Ford-Coates:

sort of relearn how to be approachable and outwardly kind

Cat Ford-Coates:

and that kind of thing. But actual self confidence where I

Cat Ford-Coates:

was able to sort of step into actually feeling strong and

Cat Ford-Coates:

confident for lack of a better term. It was in accomplishment

Cat Ford-Coates:

and connection. And from a business standpoint, you know,

Cat Ford-Coates:

like I went to school for sound engineering, I didn't go to

Cat Ford-Coates:

school for photography. And in that like starting to work on

Cat Ford-Coates:

accreditation and allowing myself opportunity to, to grow

Cat Ford-Coates:

in my craft beyond the sales dollar, but actually start to

Cat Ford-Coates:

master my tools and my process and my systems has allowed me to

Cat Ford-Coates:

sort of gain some recognition there. And in that recognition

Cat Ford-Coates:

feel accomplished, whether it's through awards or hitting sales

Cat Ford-Coates:

goals or you know, insert thing here allowed me to grow my

Cat Ford-Coates:

actual confidence versus my faint confidence as a as a

Cat Ford-Coates:

shield.

Nicole York:

because often when we have this conversation around

Nicole York:

self confidence, there's there can be a lot of talk around And

Nicole York:

just, you know, saying things to yourself, right like I am this

Nicole York:

and I am this. And that's fantastic. I totally think that

Nicole York:

one of the big things we have to do is change our internal

Nicole York:

narratives. And we'll talk about that later. But the thing that

Nicole York:

you said about becoming competent, right, and having

Nicole York:

these accomplishments just increases your credibility with

Nicole York:

yourself. And that's something we don't always talk about a

Nicole York:

lot. But it's really important, because confidence means belief

Nicole York:

in the ability to do what you say. And that's what credit is,

Nicole York:

right? Like when you when you start to build your competence,

Nicole York:

and you start to do things that prove your confidence back to

Nicole York:

yourself, then you're building credibility, then you know, that

Nicole York:

you can do the things that you say you're going to do. And it's

Nicole York:

not just a kind of nebulous feeling of like, I'm, I know

Nicole York:

that I can do the thing, which is important to have. But it's

Nicole York:

the proof, you have the proof there that says, hey, you can do

Nicole York:

the thing. And that's a really, really important thing to have.

Nicole York:

And it's not. It's not always easy to build, because you have

Nicole York:

to do the entire process of gaining the skill and repeating

Nicole York:

the skill. And using that in practical ways, and then being

Nicole York:

able to see the returns come back to you. And so that whole

Nicole York:

thing is a journey. And people oftentimes will get disheartened

Nicole York:

on that path. And so they end up in this place of being the

Nicole York:

person who says, I wish I could, uh, you're so talented, I could

Nicole York:

never be that way, etc, etc, when really all that happened is

Nicole York:

they never stayed on the path long enough to build the skill,

Nicole York:

that credibility then returned to them in the form of

Nicole York:

accomplishment. And man, oftentimes, all it takes is just

Nicole York:

staying on the path long enough to start to see those returns.

Nicole York:

So what kept you going before you started to have some of

Nicole York:

those accomplishments that were like proof of concept?

Cat Ford-Coates:

My inability to give attention to anything else.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Um, I mean, that's only half joking. I've, I think I've

Cat Ford-Coates:

talked about in this room a few times, you know, when I, I

Cat Ford-Coates:

started my photo business the same time I started another

Cat Ford-Coates:

business that's like a brewery. And I was working like 90 to 100

Cat Ford-Coates:

hours a week, between the two and not executing either. Well,

Cat Ford-Coates:

the socket was great, we received a lot of accolades, but

Cat Ford-Coates:

we were severely underfunded. And there was just some there,

Cat Ford-Coates:

there were many factors. But when we close the brewery, it

Cat Ford-Coates:

was a matter of okay, now you don't have any more excuses.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Now, you can only focus on one thing. So you can go get a job

Cat Ford-Coates:

job. Which I did, I think I had four or you can go get another

Cat Ford-Coates:

job job and just stay there. And I didn't want to do that. I

Cat Ford-Coates:

didn't want to work for somebody else building somebody else's

Cat Ford-Coates:

second home and building somebody else's dreams and

Cat Ford-Coates:

building up somebody else's tuition for their their kids.

Cat Ford-Coates:

And so I said, Okay, if you're going to do it, then you have to

Cat Ford-Coates:

go all in. And it was in betting on myself and my ability to go

Cat Ford-Coates:

all in you know, even if I wasn't very good, because I

Cat Ford-Coates:

wasn't. But I figured out how to build the business somewhat

Cat Ford-Coates:

sustainably from a price point standpoint. And I just went

Cat Ford-Coates:

after it. And about three years later, my work got kind of

Cat Ford-Coates:

decent, and but I was still making money through the whole

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing. And it was my ability to do ask for that sale and be

Cat Ford-Coates:

compensated for my half great work at you know, a standard

Cat Ford-Coates:

that was probably out of reach for the quality I was producing,

Cat Ford-Coates:

but at the same time it allowed me to, to practice and do the

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing over and over and over again. To get better

Nicole York:

i i just had a lot of feelings there. When you're

Nicole York:

talking about basically the fact that you really didn't give

Nicole York:

yourself another choice, did you? I mean, I know that there

Nicole York:

was the potential of, you know, going and getting a real, quote

Nicole York:

unquote, like job job, right, where you're working for

Nicole York:

somebody else and having that steady income. But you didn't. I

Nicole York:

mean, I know from talking to you that that was, in a way, kind of

Nicole York:

not an option, you did not want to be that person, right. And so

Nicole York:

in a real way, you you kind of jumped without a safety net,

Nicole York:

didn't you? Always do? Yes. And I think that says so much.

Nicole York:

Number one, when you take that leap, you're counting on your

Nicole York:

wings to show up on the way down, and there is almost

Nicole York:

nothing that will build your confidence in your ability to do

Nicole York:

hard things, more than doing something hard without a

Nicole York:

fallback plan, because you either succeed, or you're going

Nicole York:

to learn a lot through pain. And both of those things are going

Nicole York:

to give you self confidence. And that credence in a way that you

Nicole York:

can't get through anything else. If you walk out onto a ropes

Nicole York:

course. And you are tied up, and you've got all of these, you

Nicole York:

know, ropes on you, you can still go through the course it's

Nicole York:

still scary as hell, and you're still going to earn credibility

Nicole York:

with yourself from being able to step out and do that thing. But

Nicole York:

stepping out without any safety net without a rope tied to you,

Nicole York:

teaches you things about yourself that you're never going

Nicole York:

to learn any other way. And it's not always the best first step

Nicole York:

for everybody. Like you said, like, up until that point, you

Nicole York:

had tried and failed at some things, you would had other

Nicole York:

jobs, you'd run other businesses, you knew kind of

Nicole York:

what it was like to step out. And so taking this leap kind of

Nicole York:

seems like it became a natural extension of the leaps that you

Nicole York:

had taken before.

Cat Ford-Coates:

There's a saying in the fitness community,

Cat Ford-Coates:

primary primarily in CrossFit, that but did you die? Right. You

Cat Ford-Coates:

know, like, it didn't tell me did it hurt? Yeah, shit and hurt

Cat Ford-Coates:

a lot. But I held on to that thing, right? That when I was in

Cat Ford-Coates:

college in 1997, and in a dark room for hours at a time,

Cat Ford-Coates:

thinking, Man, this would be cool to do. This would be really

Cat Ford-Coates:

cool to do for a living. I just don't know how to do it. So I'm

Cat Ford-Coates:

just gonna go about my life, right, and I got a job at Pizza

Cat Ford-Coates:

Hut and, you know, life went on. But now I'd found a way to do it

Cat Ford-Coates:

as a business and for a living. So I just had to learn to do the

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing. And, you know, here we are.

Nicole York:

Yeah, it's funny to take, you know, such an amazing

Nicole York:

life and condense it all of a sudden, and go and now, you

Nicole York:

know, here we are, like, we live our own lives, it's so easy to

Nicole York:

look back and say, you know, okay, well, here's the logic of

Nicole York:

A to B to C to D, and how I got there. But when you get to hear

Nicole York:

it from the outside perspective, you get to, you know, partake in

Nicole York:

that story and be like, You are one bad bitch.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I'm something else we'll call it that.

Nicole York:

Yes, I love that. Okay, so what, for me what I

Nicole York:

really take away, and I'm so glad that you got to tell your

Nicole York:

story, because it touches on a lot of the things that I really

Nicole York:

wanted to make sure that we covered. And two of those really

Nicole York:

big things being the fact that self confidence without

Nicole York:

credibility is a mirage, right? It is something we can say and

Nicole York:

repeat to ourselves many times, and it often may give us the

Nicole York:

courage to step out into the thing. So I think it's still

Nicole York:

can't be overstated how important it is that we control

Nicole York:

our internal narrative. But at some point, we need to see

Nicole York:

returns from those actions in order for the credibility to

Nicole York:

actually mean something you can believe it, because that's kind

Nicole York:

of you know, the heart of the term. And confidence comes from

Nicole York:

the fact that you know, you can trust yourself to do the thing,

Nicole York:

and to get the results that you need. And so as much as as much

Nicole York:

as controlling that narrative is important. And that's definitely

Nicole York:

something that we're gonna get deep into, because it's kind of

Nicole York:

the seed, right? Like it's the beginning. And it really doesn't

Nicole York:

matter so much. If the initial stages are not necessarily true,

Nicole York:

right? Like you said, you had to kind of fake your way into a

Nicole York:

semblance of confidence at first. And so many of us do so

Nicole York:

many times, we just have to talk ourselves into saying the thing

Nicole York:

to ourselves for a little bit. And soon, some of the actions

Nicole York:

and some of the feelings that are related to what we say to

Nicole York:

ourselves start to show up. But eventually, if we don't have the

Nicole York:

proof in the pudding to back up those thoughts that we have, we

Nicole York:

can't maintain telling ourselves that we can't maintain lying

Nicole York:

ourselves, or lying to ourselves is what it feels like right over

Nicole York:

and over again, if something doesn't show up to tell us hey,

Nicole York:

it's true. Look, look, look at the proof. So thank you so much

Nicole York:

for sharing that I think it's such an important thing for us

Nicole York:

to know, as artists that we need to be paying attention to when

Nicole York:

we start getting those returns, and they don't have to be big at

Nicole York:

first. It can be our first small client in our first crappy

Nicole York:

painting or photo, who loves it, and oh, my God, we aren't the

Nicole York:

only ones. And that little tiny bit of proof can sustain us

Nicole York:

through the next hard part where we struggled to earn the rest of

Nicole York:

those skills or, you know, to make that next sale or whatever

Nicole York:

it is. So it is a big deal, folks. Matt, Bassam, Bekka any

Nicole York:

thoughts on how we build our self confidence? What do you

Nicole York:

think is important about this process? Or what do you do that

Nicole York:

is successful for you? Well,

Bassam Sabbagh:

I can it's up to you. Anyways. Yeah, myself. I

Bassam Sabbagh:

mean, I'm I'm consider myself quite self confident. And most

Bassam Sabbagh:

of the things I do and I think it comes back from what you

Bassam Sabbagh:

said, it's the the continual continuous auto feedback of

Bassam Sabbagh:

accomplishments, many accomplishments, and it started

Bassam Sabbagh:

way back. I think it comes back to my academics. Where as a

Bassam Sabbagh:

young as a young kid, I It's not that I excelled in school, I

Bassam Sabbagh:

wasn't like a, you know, straight A student 9598,

Bassam Sabbagh:

average, things like that. But I always did well, and I did well

Bassam Sabbagh:

without working very hard. Right. And that means I didn't

Bassam Sabbagh:

study a lot. And as I and I would do well, and I figured out

Bassam Sabbagh:

that what what I did well is have the curiosity to understand

Bassam Sabbagh:

the subject, I listened, I absorbed I processed

Bassam Sabbagh:

information. And I understood this subject. And a lot of

Bassam Sabbagh:

people do that. But a lot of people can't do that a lot of

Bassam Sabbagh:

people would memorize things, especially when it comes to

Bassam Sabbagh:

things like mathematics and sciences, they'd memorize

Bassam Sabbagh:

formulas and and you can't, you can't win at maths by just

Bassam Sabbagh:

memorizing things, eventually, you're going to get caught. So I

Bassam Sabbagh:

would take the extra step to try to understand and I was the type

Bassam Sabbagh:

of guy that would study at night, people would be up till

Bassam Sabbagh:

three or four in the morning studying for an exam, I would

Bassam Sabbagh:

stop at 11 and say, That's it, I'll figure it out on the test

Bassam Sabbagh:

during the test. And I think it comes down to just having that

Bassam Sabbagh:

curiosity and that analytical mind to understand things

Bassam Sabbagh:

fundamentally, which put me in a position that I can stand on my

Bassam Sabbagh:

feet, I can figure things out on the spot. And I know I will

Bassam Sabbagh:

succeed. I think that's the accumulation of, of auto

Bassam Sabbagh:

feedback that I got. And I also come to think of it had have had

Bassam Sabbagh:

and probably still have a need to fit in, not to stand out.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Alright, I was I was born in Lebanon, and I came to my family

Bassam Sabbagh:

came to Canada, I was 14 years old. So that was like 45 years

Bassam Sabbagh:

ago. And, and I needed to fit in, I did not want to be the guy

Bassam Sabbagh:

that stands out that looks different. That sounds different

Bassam Sabbagh:

that so so by by just having that need to fit in, and that

Bassam Sabbagh:

was just an example of how I want to fit, I want to fit in

Bassam Sabbagh:

professionally, I want to fit in with my job I want to fit in as

Bassam Sabbagh:

a photographer. It again, it drove me to dig for those

Bassam Sabbagh:

nuances. I always talk about being able to understand the

Bassam Sabbagh:

30,000 foot level, but know exactly when to go deep down and

Bassam Sabbagh:

figure out the details that make a difference. And I think

Bassam Sabbagh:

practicing that and living that and doing that throughout my

Bassam Sabbagh:

career. And whether it's in business or photography is what

Bassam Sabbagh:

gives me the confidence that you know what, I'll figure it out.

Bassam Sabbagh:

It'll happen. It'll be more than good enough. And I'm fine with

Bassam Sabbagh:

that.

Nicole York:

You know, but some what you were just talking about

Nicole York:

there, really touched on the fact that where we placed the

Nicole York:

heart of our confidence is really important, right? So you

Nicole York:

weren't confident in the fact that you were the smartest kid

Nicole York:

in the room. You weren't confident in the fact that you

Nicole York:

could never fail or anything else you were confident in the

Nicole York:

fact that you were curious enough to learn something

Nicole York:

deeply. And it's really amazing when we think about how, where

Nicole York:

we decide to place our confidence and I say decide

Nicole York:

Because as we get older, we need to recognize that who we build

Nicole York:

for ourselves, a person we build as ourselves is something we can

Nicole York:

control. When we're younger, we don't have a whole lot of, we

Nicole York:

don't have a whole lot of practical knowledge about how we

Nicole York:

are becoming the person we're becoming, we're mostly just in

Nicole York:

the experience. But as we get a little bit older, we're able to

Nicole York:

recognize the fact that where we choose to put our confidence is

Nicole York:

going to determine how successful that competence

Nicole York:

actually becomes for us whether it actually leads to results.

Nicole York:

And if you place your confidence in the fact that you are the

Nicole York:

smartest person in the room, eventually somebody is going to

Nicole York:

show up in your life, who's going to shatter your confidence

Nicole York:

and yourself. If you put your confidence in the fact that you

Nicole York:

are the best photographer in the business, eventually, you're

Nicole York:

going to come across a photographer who shatters that

Nicole York:

vision you have of yourself in your head, and all of a sudden,

Nicole York:

your confidence is going to take a hit that it might not be able

Nicole York:

to recover from and having confidence in the fact that

Nicole York:

you're curious enough to learn something deeply. That is an

Nicole York:

almost unshakable center, right? Like, nobody can come at you for

Nicole York:

that. If you are curious, that's something you can maintain

Nicole York:

during your entire life in almost any circumstance. And

Nicole York:

saying, I'm willing to learn this thing deeply. I'm curious

Nicole York:

enough, that I can do the deep dive into these things, that is

Nicole York:

a center of confidence that really can't be shaken. So it's

Nicole York:

pretty amazing that you were able to recognize that about

Nicole York:

yourself. Because like you said, you know, you've been able to

Nicole York:

maintain that confidence in yourself for for pretty much

Nicole York:

your entire career. So that's a really kind of amazing testament

Nicole York:

to the fact that placing our confidence in a thing that is

Nicole York:

not easily broken, is a pretty big deal.

Bassam Sabbagh:

You know, it's absolutely amazing what you just

Bassam Sabbagh:

said, because I never thought of it that way. But that that is a

Bassam Sabbagh:

brilliant way of looking of looking at and trying to see

Bassam Sabbagh:

where people are coming from is where do they place their

Bassam Sabbagh:

confidence on I am going to remember that and use it and

Bassam Sabbagh:

many, many things I do especially coaching. But but the

Bassam Sabbagh:

thing that the other thing about that when you put your

Bassam Sabbagh:

confidence in something that's internal to you that you own,

Bassam Sabbagh:

and nobody else does, and nobody else can impact. It's a

Bassam Sabbagh:

transferable skill. Right? It really is, it's yours, you can

Bassam Sabbagh:

take it anywhere you want, you can take it into into you know,

Bassam Sabbagh:

basket weaving, and you can take it into photography, you can

Bassam Sabbagh:

take it into becoming a CEO of a company is the same. Same same

Bassam Sabbagh:

skill set, I guess, or same way of being. So yeah, it's

Bassam Sabbagh:

transferable, and that's why it's it, it lives, right. It's

Bassam Sabbagh:

not temporary, it can't be shattered by somebody unless you

Bassam Sabbagh:

do it yourself, unless you shatter it yourself.

Nicole York:

Oh, so true. And of course, we talked a little bit

Nicole York:

about sometimes when we have self destructive habits, we can

Nicole York:

do that to ourselves. So we do need to be aware of that, which

Nicole York:

is why that internal monologue is important. So, and we'll get

Nicole York:

to that later as well. But Matt, you were also gonna share self

Nicole York:

confidence. How do you get it? How do you keep it? What do you

Nicole York:

think is important about that process,

Matt Stagliano:

I'm still trying to figure all that out. Because

Matt Stagliano:

from a self confidence standpoint, I've always had

Matt Stagliano:

extraordinarily little, but listening to the song, and I'm

Matt Stagliano:

so glad that he was able to speak first because he said so

Matt Stagliano:

many of the things that I hadn't really formulated in my head,

Matt Stagliano:

but I absolutely agree with, I think for me, my confidence is I

Matt Stagliano:

have difficulty with confidence in the work that I produce. But

Matt Stagliano:

I have unwavering confidence in myself to produce quality work

Matt Stagliano:

over a period of time, I not one of these people that will be oh,

Matt Stagliano:

this first go is going to be perfect. And everyone's going to

Matt Stagliano:

love what I do. It takes me a while to produce work or start

Matt Stagliano:

something new or whatnot. Once I see that I'm capable of doing

Matt Stagliano:

it, then I have the utmost confidence that I'm going to get

Matt Stagliano:

infinitely better at that thing. And there's no one that can stop

Matt Stagliano:

me from getting there. But me. And I think when we start to put

Matt Stagliano:

our own power in to what other people think about what our work

Matt Stagliano:

is it takes erodes our confidence away from us

Matt Stagliano:

producing that thing. So if I'm building a table, or I'm

Matt Stagliano:

painting a painting, or I'm crocheting a blanket, if I'm

Matt Stagliano:

worried about what people think at the end of that thing, then

Matt Stagliano:

I'm already defeating myself and wondering, Am I going to be good

Matt Stagliano:

enough with this for me, I put all of that aside And I say, am

Matt Stagliano:

I can I push myself? Am I capable enough of doing this

Matt Stagliano:

thing. So when it comes to you photography for me, for example,

Matt Stagliano:

it the more I stay off social media, the more I stay away from

Matt Stagliano:

the comparison game and stop looking at other people's work,

Matt Stagliano:

the more confident I feel in my own stuff. Now, when I put

Matt Stagliano:

myself in a position where it's being viewed by others, whether

Matt Stagliano:

that's online or in a competition, or just casual

Matt Stagliano:

viewing by friends, I'm much more confident in it because I

Matt Stagliano:

haven't been doing any comparison, I've just had faith

Matt Stagliano:

in myself. So how I got there was very similar to Cat story, I

Matt Stagliano:

was bullied a lot as a kid, and just had to build up the

Matt Stagliano:

confidence in myself that I could do anything that I didn't

Matt Stagliano:

necessarily need anybody to tell me that I was good. I just

Matt Stagliano:

needed to prove it to myself. So over time, for me, it's a matter

Matt Stagliano:

of get ridding, getting rid of those external affirmations as a

Matt Stagliano:

need for justification of what I'm doing, as long as I have

Matt Stagliano:

faith that I'm capable of this thing, that I can do anything,

Matt Stagliano:

I'm not necessarily going to be a professional basketball

Matt Stagliano:

player, because of you know, genetics. However, I would put

Matt Stagliano:

myself up against anybody playing basketball, because I

Matt Stagliano:

love doing it enough confidence that I can do it, do you not? I

Matt Stagliano:

mean, it's it's it. That's where it all comes from for me.

Nicole York:

Oh, man, oh, man, there's so much good stuff

Nicole York:

there. Okay, Matt, you said something that I think is so

Nicole York:

critical, and almost never gets any airtime is that there's a

Nicole York:

difference between having confidence in our ability to get

Nicole York:

people to like what we do, and confidence in our ability to do

Nicole York:

the thing, right. And one of those is something that's within

Nicole York:

our control. If people remember, for y'all that were here, you

Nicole York:

might remember what I was talking about last week about

Nicole York:

throwing a baseball, you have, once the baseball leaves your

Nicole York:

fingertips, you have no control about where that ball goes.

Nicole York:

Because there's things outside of your control, that are going

Nicole York:

to affect how it flies from wind, to a dog running in

Nicole York:

between you in the ball, etc, etc, right? There are just too

Nicole York:

many things to account for. So thinking that you have control

Nicole York:

over the eventual outcome of the throw is foolish. But knowing

Nicole York:

that you have control over how you stand, how you hold the

Nicole York:

ball, how you breathe, how you release all of those things, you

Nicole York:

can have confidence in those things. Because those are things

Nicole York:

that you actually do. Once the ball leaves your hand. It's up

Nicole York:

to God in the universe, right. And the same thing is true about

Nicole York:

what you said, Matt, if we put our confidence in the ability to

Nicole York:

make things that people love, and then our confidence is built

Nicole York:

on the approbation we get because of what we make. We are

Nicole York:

definitely setting ourselves up for a failure because at some

Nicole York:

point, we're going to make something that people don't

Nicole York:

like, at some point, it's not going to be that good. And all

Nicole York:

of a sudden, that source of confidence, that approbation

Nicole York:

that we get is going to dry up. But if we're careful to place

Nicole York:

our confidence, and our just our ability to do the job, like I

Nicole York:

mentioned, Peggy Serota, last week, she is a photographer, a

Nicole York:

commercial portrait photographer, you've seen her

Nicole York:

work all all over the place magazine covers all over the

Nicole York:

place, she photographed some of the most famous people in the

Nicole York:

world, she is not a confident photographer in terms of

Nicole York:

technique, she will share the fact and has shared the fact

Nicole York:

that when it comes to things like you know, deciding on which

Nicole York:

settings and putting her license certain places, she really

Nicole York:

doesn't do those things that's up to her assistance, what she

Nicole York:

is confident in his her ability to connect with people. And then

Nicole York:

the outcome, the strike, the perfectly thrown ball flows from

Nicole York:

the fact that she knows where her power lies, and that's in

Nicole York:

the ability to connect. So I think, I think Man, your example

Nicole York:

is just so powerful, because it reminds us that the ultimate

Nicole York:

outcome is subjected to powers that are beyond our control.

Nicole York:

Sorry for the car guys. But our ability to do the thing to make

Nicole York:

the decisions to decide how to stand and how to connect, etc,

Nicole York:

etc. That's all on us, right?

Matt Stagliano:

Yes, absolutely. Sorry. Is a rhetorical question

Matt Stagliano:

at the end No, I think you're I think you're absolutely right.

Matt Stagliano:

So for me that's that's really how it all boils down. It's

Matt Stagliano:

looking at like you said, what you can control and what you

Matt Stagliano:

cannot I know that I can control my actions. I know that I can

Matt Stagliano:

control my output, I can control very little outside of that. So

Matt Stagliano:

once I can prove to myself that a thing can be done, then

Matt Stagliano:

there's no stopping me. However, there is also that little voice

Matt Stagliano:

inside like, Oh, am I capable of this? But what I do to combat

Matt Stagliano:

that is say, Well, I've done all these other things that I never

Matt Stagliano:

thought I could do. What would make me believe that this story

Matt Stagliano:

that's going on in my head is any different? Why would I

Matt Stagliano:

believe that I'm incapable of doing this? You know, so I think

Matt Stagliano:

as long as you can look at it, and reframe it and make sure

Matt Stagliano:

that you're not telling yourself a story or a narrative, that

Matt Stagliano:

just isn't true, because it has no basis. In fact, nothing's

Matt Stagliano:

ever been proven that you can't do it. So go ahead and try it,

Matt Stagliano:

you never know. And that's where for me, my confidence has always

Matt Stagliano:

come from expanding my skill set, whether it's language, or

Matt Stagliano:

you know, blue collar skills, or white collar skills, or tech

Matt Stagliano:

skills, whatever it is, all of those things, teach me that I

Matt Stagliano:

can pretty much do anything. So long as I believe that

Matt Stagliano:

narrative, the second that I start telling myself, well, you

Matt Stagliano:

can't do this thing, then, you know, then it's all over, then

Matt Stagliano:

it's more of a battle with myself than anything else. So

Matt Stagliano:

yeah, it's just having that belief, proving yourself wrong,

Matt Stagliano:

that No, actually I can do this. That's where it comes from. For

Matt Stagliano:

me, that's how confidence stems in in me.

Nicole York:

Heck, yeah, muscles. And yeah, there

Nicole York:

definitely seems to be a tension between being careful not to put

Nicole York:

all of our eggs in the basket of approbation and feedback, but

Nicole York:

also needing that proof as a return on investment. And being

Nicole York:

careful to see those things as proof of concept, and not the

Nicole York:

seat of confidence. So there's certainly some subtle tension, I

Nicole York:

think, that goes into that, and relies on us to be able to weigh

Nicole York:

those things. Recognizing the difference between, I can

Nicole York:

control my output, I can't control whether people like it

Nicole York:

to I can judge the fact that this output is good, meaning the

Nicole York:

process is good, as opposed to I must rely solely on the feedback

Nicole York:

of others, in order to feel good about what I've done. So there's

Nicole York:

definitely, definitely even a whole conversation in that in

Nicole York:

and of itself. So. It is your turn. Oh, how do you get it? How

Nicole York:

do you keep it? All the things?

Bekka Bjorke:

I do I do all the things I'm well, I'm interesting

Bekka Bjorke:

to think about because I, I definitely am very self

Bekka Bjorke:

confident and a lot of ways. And then of course, there's places

Bekka Bjorke:

where I absolutely freeze up and terror and I'm not confident in

Bekka Bjorke:

myself at all. But just kind of thinking about what what could

Bekka Bjorke:

sustain that. So like we were talking about goals last week,

Bekka Bjorke:

and I, I mentioned, you know, being really rooted in the small

Bekka Bjorke:

goals, in being in love with your journey, right, like

Bekka Bjorke:

focusing less on the large eventual goals and being really

Bekka Bjorke:

rooted in the here and now. And that definitely ties in a lot to

Bekka Bjorke:

confidence for me. And I don't really have like, huge,

Bekka Bjorke:

ambitious, really long term goals because life is so

Bekka Bjorke:

nebulous, you know, you never know what is going to happen.

Bekka Bjorke:

And really like holding on Super tightly and like tying my

Bekka Bjorke:

identity to any long term eventual future goal. I feel

Bekka Bjorke:

like it's setting myself up for failure. Because what if

Bekka Bjorke:

something happens that doesn't allow me to reach that goal,

Bekka Bjorke:

that doesn't mean I'm failing, and my you know, life is a utter

Bekka Bjorke:

mess, and I need to give up, it just means I need to change and

Bekka Bjorke:

I need to develop. And so being really rooted in who I am at any

Bekka Bjorke:

given moment, I think is so important because you've I guess

Bekka Bjorke:

in the words of the great literary master Dr. Seuss,

Bekka Bjorke:

there's no one alive who is youer than you, and you can't

Bekka Bjorke:

right now be the you that you want to be in five years or be

Bekka Bjorke:

the you you want to be even one year. You are who you are right

Bekka Bjorke:

now today. And you can only do the very best that you could do

Bekka Bjorke:

today. You can't do any better. And so just being very cognizant

Bekka Bjorke:

of what you are capable of, and then you know, leaning into that

Bekka Bjorke:

development of competence and focusing on continuing to learn

Bekka Bjorke:

from where you are right now. I just think is so absolutely

Bekka Bjorke:

important.

Nicole York:

Applause Applause I mean, I agree 100% And that

Nicole York:

you're what you're doing for yourself. of creating a short

Nicole York:

term feedback loop, right, which is, as many of you know, I'm

Nicole York:

going to be participating in NaNoWriMo this month, which is a

Nicole York:

National Novel Writing Month. And the goal is that by the end

Nicole York:

of the month, you will have written 50,000 words of a novel,

Nicole York:

whether that finishes the novel or gets that three quarters of

Nicole York:

the way there or whatever isn't necessarily important, but the

Nicole York:

goal is 50,000 words. And if you start from the beginning, and

Nicole York:

you're thinking to yourself 50,000 words, oh, my God, that's

Nicole York:

a lot of words. How am I going to do that? How can I fit that

Nicole York:

in? Man, it just seems like this big, overpowering impossible

Nicole York:

thing to get your hands on. But if I asked myself, can I write

Nicole York:

1600 words today? Well, yeah, I mean, I can do that. So if I can

Nicole York:

do that today, and then by this evening, I'm sitting down, and I

Nicole York:

have 1600 words on my page. Well, man, I mean, I've just

Nicole York:

proved I can do it, what makes tomorrow any different. And then

Nicole York:

if I do that, if I do that every day, by the end of the month,

Nicole York:

50,000 has happened. I haven't taken any kind of extraordinary

Nicole York:

steps, I've done the small thing that I can do today, and proved

Nicole York:

to myself that I can show up over and over again, all of a

Nicole York:

sudden, I have credibility with myself, I can believe in my

Nicole York:

ability to show up and just write 1600 words, the outcome is

Nicole York:

50,000, at the end of the month, is 100,000 at the end of two

Nicole York:

months. So all of a sudden, those goals that seem so big,

Nicole York:

those things are right within reach, if we can believe in

Nicole York:

ourselves to do the small stuff today. So that's a pretty big

Nicole York:

one. Becca?

Bekka Bjorke:

Yeah. And I mean, it's, I think it's okay to to

Bekka Bjorke:

realize, like you're not going to reach every goal you have,

Bekka Bjorke:

and that is totally okay. It's totally okay, no one does. Like,

Bekka Bjorke:

I don't think that there's a single person who hits every

Bekka Bjorke:

single goal. And that's another thing for me is like looking at,

Bekka Bjorke:

you know, people I admire, you know, people whose careers I

Bekka Bjorke:

would maybe you know, like to emulate in some way, or people's

Bekka Bjorke:

success, every single one of those people has been new at

Bekka Bjorke:

something, and has had to go through struggle to get to where

Bekka Bjorke:

they are, and recognizing that not everything has to be perfect

Bekka Bjorke:

that you are going through this own journey. And that's going to

Bekka Bjorke:

include failure and success. And, you know, again, you are

Bekka Bjorke:

doing the best that you possibly can do for yourself and looking

Bekka Bjorke:

specifically at imaginary you in the future or even at like other

Bekka Bjorke:

people, and trying to emulate their success exactly is not

Bekka Bjorke:

going to work because that's just not how life works. So

Bekka Bjorke:

everyone's gone through the process, everyone's gone through

Bekka Bjorke:

some journey and some hardship. And so whatever you're going

Bekka Bjorke:

through right now, that is part of that, and it's totally okay.

Nicole York:

Yes, yes, yes, yes. Especially because those, you're

Nicole York:

always in the process of becoming. And if you didn't

Nicole York:

reach the goal, you still showed up for yourself. And that leaves

Nicole York:

a mark on you, you know, like that leaves a mark on who you

Nicole York:

are. Which means the next time it's time to show up, you are

Nicole York:

facilitating becoming the kind of person who shows up, maybe

Nicole York:

you didn't reach the 1600. But you still showed up for

Nicole York:

yourself. And that that is a step in the direction of

Nicole York:

becoming the kind of person who, right like, when you ask

Nicole York:

yourself, am I the kind of person who, or tell yourself, I

Nicole York:

am the kind of person who, like, maybe I can't say for sure that

Nicole York:

I'll reach 1600 words a day, but I sure as hell I'm going to show

Nicole York:

up for myself and give it a go. And if I didn't make it, it's

Nicole York:

not the end of the world. I know that I can show up for myself

Nicole York:

again tomorrow. That's an internal thing that's not

Nicole York:

necessarily based on the outcome.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I think it's also important to note too, that

Cat Ford-Coates:

when you're existing through, I don't know your business, right?

Cat Ford-Coates:

If you don't have goals set for yourself, you could very easily

Cat Ford-Coates:

just go through and rinse, repeat cookie cut the whole nine

Cat Ford-Coates:

yards. But when you set goals for yourself that maybe are

Cat Ford-Coates:

outside of your comfort zone, like 1600 words a day or, you

Cat Ford-Coates:

know, reaching new sales targets or you know, insert thing here.

Cat Ford-Coates:

You're more likely to even if you fail at the goal itself, you

Cat Ford-Coates:

will get closer to that goal than you would without having it

Cat Ford-Coates:

in the first place. Like when you get something you will get

Cat Ford-Coates:

closer to that thing than you would when you were not striving

Cat Ford-Coates:

and you were just existing and in motion.

Nicole York:

Yeah, absolutely. So much of what we've talked

Nicole York:

about today relies on some level of tension right on on setting

Nicole York:

goals, but not being crushed when we don't achieve them on

Nicole York:

building that competence and our skill set, but recognizing we

Nicole York:

can't always control the outcome. I mean, there's this

Nicole York:

tension that runs through all of this conversation. And just like

Nicole York:

anything, I mean, we have to recognize the shades of gray and

Nicole York:

the areas where we have to step lightly, and ultimately

Nicole York:

becoming, in a way, unbreakable. And I don't mean that in the

Nicole York:

fact that we will never feel bad or that we will never, you know,

Nicole York:

have a hard time. Never question ourselves or any of that stuff.

Nicole York:

But what I mean is that, it never stops you from picking up

Nicole York:

all the pieces, and chugging on with them again, and having

Nicole York:

confidence, one of the things that I really want to teach my

Nicole York:

boys, and that we try to focus on is giving them opportunities

Nicole York:

to see that they can do hard things. And sometimes that means

Nicole York:

going out and doing, you know, multi day hike in camp and you

Nicole York:

got to live on what you brought with you. And sometimes that's

Nicole York:

maybe we're out climbing, and they're doing a route that's

Nicole York:

really hard, and just encouraging them to finish, even

Nicole York:

though they're scared because they need to see that they can

Nicole York:

overcome those hard things. And of course, they recognize that

Nicole York:

they've got safety gear on and please don't think that I'm out

Nicole York:

there putting my children in danger. But just giving them the

Nicole York:

ability to prove to themselves, to build that credibility that

Nicole York:

when something is hard, they're capable of pushing through, even

Nicole York:

if it only means getting up another foot, or making one more

Nicole York:

handhold, or whatever it is, to go that little step beyond where

Nicole York:

you thought you could. So you can prove to yourself the next

Nicole York:

time it comes along. You can. It's such a big thing, something

Nicole York:

that I think our systems are built to overlook. We want

Nicole York:

people to go just about as far as they're comfortable with and

Nicole York:

that's all. But in your life, you need to know that you're

Nicole York:

capable of pushing past those comfort zones. So I want to make

Nicole York:

sure that we have time to hear from our friends in the audience

Nicole York:

today. Joshua has got his hand up, I did not make my my mods

Nicole York:

mods. I'm doing that right now. Sorry for the delay, guys. I was

Nicole York:

already walking fast this morning. And I overlooked my

Nicole York:

responsibilities. Joshua, I'm I see that your hand is up for

Nicole York:

some reason. It's not showing up down there at the bottom though.

Nicole York:

So I'm going to grab it anyways. But if if you're in the audience

Nicole York:

today, and you have a thought about confidence, what it means

Nicole York:

how we build it, how we can sustain it, or if you feel that

Nicole York:

there's areas you are really comfortable with sharing about

Nicole York:

your confidence in those areas and how you got there. We'd love

Nicole York:

to hear from you this morning. So please feel free to raise

Nicole York:

your hand, we will bring you up. And you can share. Joshua, good

Nicole York:

morning. What are your thoughts on confidence this morning.

Joshua:

Good morning, I jumped a little bit late. But I really

Joshua:

liked what Becca was saying when it came to goal setting. But I

Joshua:

would argue that there are some people that do hit their goals

Joshua:

that they set, they hit all of them. But that's even more

Joshua:

dangerous than coming up short. And that's because they're

Joshua:

setting goals that are so easily attainable, they literally just

Joshua:

wake up and the goal is met. And that creates a false sense of

Joshua:

confidence in your ability to do something because you've

Joshua:

literally done nothing to stretch yourself, you've done

Joshua:

nothing to grow. All you did was meet a goal that ultimately met

Joshua:

nothing. And that's something that I learned when I used to

Joshua:

have a software company that started with a buddy of mine.

Joshua:

And we were going out trying to sell it. And you know, initially

Joshua:

we were just needed, we needed to get some schools in the

Joshua:

system to be beta testers, we needed some customers and to be

Joshua:

beta testers. And I'd go to all these meetings and I leave every

Joshua:

meeting with with everyone saying yes to everything I was

Joshua:

asking for. And eventually, you know, we were opening up and we

Joshua:

were selling and every meeting where I was leaving, I was

Joshua:

getting a sale. Everybody was saying yes. And eventually I was

Joshua:

like, you know, I'm meeting all of my goals, like I'm making all

Joshua:

these sales. But I quickly came to realization. If everyone is

Joshua:

saying yes, all the time, then I'm not stretching myself. I'm

Joshua:

not getting enough. I'm not selling enough. I'm not asking

Joshua:

big enough. And so by me getting yes all the time and building my

Joshua:

confidence. I was actually hurting us because I wasn't

Joshua:

actually getting to where we needed to be. I was just so

Joshua:

happy to be able to get that Yes. Which was my baseline goal,

Joshua:

rather than ultimately you're stepping back and looking at

Joshua:

what we need to do to grow and what was a legitimate goal. What

Joshua:

was a stretch goal? What would require some work and some

Joshua:

effort and what would ultimately what would I fail at trying to

Joshua:

do, but I'd be able to ultimately achieve?

Bekka Bjorke:

That's a great point. Thank you for calling On

Bekka Bjorke:

that I know I can be a little hyperbolic sometimes. But yeah,

Bekka Bjorke:

that's an excellent point.

Nicole York:

Yeah, I'm so glad that you brought that up,

Nicole York:

Joshua, because I think I think you're absolutely right. And

Nicole York:

maybe the initial stages of our confidence often begin with

Nicole York:

those things like those, those first sales in his first

Nicole York:

successes. But I mean, you're absolutely right that, at some

Nicole York:

point, we have to question whether or not we should stay in

Nicole York:

that place in that comfort zone. Because if our goal, our goal is

Nicole York:

to reach the heights, we're never going to get there by

Nicole York:

being comfortable, that absolutely requires the danger

Nicole York:

of failure. And it's, I think, so important for us to

Nicole York:

recognize, I've mentioned before, I know we've talked

Nicole York:

about this, the fact that the word failure is kind of a bad

Nicole York:

word in this room, but not because of the meaning of the

Nicole York:

word itself. But because of what we attach to it. This idea that

Nicole York:

failure means the end, right. And really, it's just a really,

Nicole York:

I've heard somebody say this before, it's an information rich

Nicole York:

data stream, it basically is a way for us to learn a whole lot,

Nicole York:

that we can then turn around and be like, Alright, cool, I failed

Nicole York:

on my way to something. And that means that I already made it as

Nicole York:

far as where that thing stopped. That's the springboard now that

Nicole York:

place that it ended, that's the springboard to the next place,

Nicole York:

and I have all the information I need to get me through there. So

Nicole York:

we have to be really careful that when we're looking at

Nicole York:

these, this, this information that we get back this kind of

Nicole York:

feedback loop that we have action reaction by the

Nicole York:

environment, and then us decoding what that reaction

Nicole York:

means and putting those next steps into place, we do have to

Nicole York:

be careful that when what we get back is not what we want, we

Nicole York:

don't look at that as the end, which means didn't go where I

Nicole York:

wanted to, which means I'm a failure, which means I'm never

Nicole York:

going to be good at this, which means I should just give up

Nicole York:

right? We have to be careful that that thought process does

Nicole York:

not extend from something that makes a lot of sense. I didn't

Nicole York:

push for stretch goals. The company did not get to the

Nicole York:

stretch goal. Therefore I'm a failure. That is not a plus b

Nicole York:

equals c. Right? You're jumping over information there.

Joshua:

Yeah, well, also in the startup world, there's this

Joshua:

belief that money fixes everything. And what ends up

Joshua:

happening a lot of times is young companies end up raising

Joshua:

money really early, before they stretch themselves before they

Joshua:

figure things out. And what they end up doing it they get money.

Joshua:

And and money is, you know, a catalyst, right? It's what you

Joshua:

burn it so you grow fast. And the problem is, if you don't

Joshua:

make those those errors in the beginning, if you don't learn

Joshua:

from those in the beginning, before you before you hit that

Joshua:

callus point at that point of like significant growth, then

Joshua:

you pour the money on it, which is pouring fuel on the fire, but

Joshua:

your fire is burning down your building rather than lighting a

Joshua:

rocket. And that's just as dangerous.

Nicole York:

That was the knowledge bomb there. Yes. So

Nicole York:

much. You're absolutely right. Not only is it a catalyst, and

Nicole York:

it can become a bandaid, right. And so you've got that bandaid

Nicole York:

on and the wound is festering underneath and you don't even

Nicole York:

know it. So, man, that's such a good, a good point. And

Nicole York:

something that's really important for us to keep in

Nicole York:

mind. As we as we do try to stretch ourselves and making

Nicole York:

sure, as we've mentioned before, that we are using the right

Nicole York:

metrics to measure things. And that comes back to confidence as

Nicole York:

well, if that metric that we're using is something that can be

Nicole York:

taken or broken, then obviously at some point it will be. And so

Nicole York:

we have to understand that and keep that in mind. Linus, I saw

Nicole York:

that your hand was up it was trying to grab you. I'm not sure

Nicole York:

if it's working for some reason, the hands up has not been

Nicole York:

showing for me as notifications on the bottom. So I might need

Nicole York:

to update my my club has but I see you've been able to join us.

Nicole York:

We'd love to hear your thoughts on confidence.

Linus:

Hi, Nicole. It's a morning walk in photos. All

Linus:

right. So as an artist room, I assume that we are talking in

Linus:

the context of a photograph a little bit or just as a person.

Nicole York:

Yeah, what we really believe that the people

Nicole York:

that we are also determined how well we do as photographers, so

Nicole York:

wherever you feel the most comfortable talking about this,

Nicole York:

whether that's business or personal or work itself. Would

Nicole York:

love to hear it.

Unknown:

I would just like to make sure that I'm in context,

Unknown:

you know how some people would just invade rooms and talk out

Nicole York:

Yes. That and yes, I was listening to you

Unknown:

and I was listening to you and then what USA What do

Unknown:

you just in short, basically, if you we should not let our

Unknown:

failures basically deter We should let you know, our

Unknown:

feelings is not the end of this. I have something to add to that

Unknown:

actually, I think that sometimes our feelings become our

Unknown:

greatness. Because there is the thing about photography is that,

Unknown:

you know, like, when you are learning, it is actually a

Unknown:

process of comparing a process of basically, you take your

Unknown:

pictures, and then you compare it to the works of other

Unknown:

photographers, especially when you're new, right? You You are

Unknown:

always searching for what would sell? And what would define you,

Unknown:

and how can you get better. So when when you go into this

Unknown:

process of comparing to others, you tend to have this, you

Unknown:

sometimes put yourself into a box whereby, you know, you're

Unknown:

always judging yourself, like, you know, like, sometimes you

Unknown:

may have taken a really nice picture, that you have a nice

Unknown:

picture in the sense that you have infused all the meaning

Unknown:

that, you know, you've thought about the picture, you've got

Unknown:

exposure, right? You you maybe got the right setting, or the

Unknown:

right talent or whatsoever, and you're really proud of the

Unknown:

picture. And in today's world, all it takes sometimes it's a

Unknown:

Google search. And then you find a picture that has, you know,

Unknown:

similar themes, and it's better than you and then sometimes you

Unknown:

will go like, Oh shit, you know, then suddenly, that picture that

Unknown:

you take, that was just a moment ago, so great to you. It doesn't

Unknown:

become that good, after all. So just to give you a bit of my

Unknown:

history, I'm actually a DOP, Director photography. I started

Unknown:

in 35 mm film. And now I work li I work mainly in digital, but I

Unknown:

still load my Hasselblad with film. And I still love to take

Unknown:

film, even though even though it's harder process in the sense

Unknown:

that I need to how you say, think the light meter reading

Unknown:

figure it out, before I press the tick button. I actually

Unknown:

really like the imperfection of film. I really like the grain

Unknown:

sometimes I even expose wrongly because sometimes you know, the

Unknown:

bad exposure and the slight grain. It harkens back to when

Unknown:

the time before I became a photographer, the time when I

Unknown:

was a small boy. And the time when my non father fotografo

Unknown:

would try to take picture of me on film. And he may have hit

Unknown:

that exposure wrong. So the picture comes out a little bit

Unknown:

grainy, a little bit imperfect. And that has a very sentimental

Unknown:

kind of feeling for me. So the thing is that what the point I'm

Unknown:

trying to make is why why do we let perfection defines us, you

Unknown:

know, when there is so much heart and just doing what you

Unknown:

do. And sometimes when you are just aiming for perfection. And

Unknown:

you know, when you just keep on looking and letting society be

Unknown:

the judge of what is right. You no longer do what you inherently

Unknown:

want to do and what you internally set out to do. So I

Unknown:

was very, very lucky because in my career, where everybody is

Unknown:

always trying to chase you know, what is the Chinese glossiest

Unknown:

picture. When I was actually serving my internship when I was

Unknown:

actually serving, you know, like, making my steps up. I met

Unknown:

with director in Malaysia, and she became my mentor. And she

Unknown:

was one of the more renowned director in my country and from

Unknown:

Malaysia. And the way that she does thing is now actually

Unknown:

emulated by a lot of people in the world. And the way that she

Unknown:

does things is that she wants to do it humbly. And she wants to

Unknown:

basically make pictures that are not perfect. But pictures that

Unknown:

resemble the, the society that she sees in, in the everyday,

Unknown:

you know, Watson all and for that she was very much loved.

Unknown:

And the work shines. And today I find myself often asking my

Unknown:

client, you know, what do you want to say? What do you want to

Unknown:

say in the picture? And that's it really need to be glossy?

Unknown:

Does everything in front of your eye look glossy? Or do you see

Unknown:

the imperfection and maybe we should just infuse a little bit.

Unknown:

So I hope that I've contributed to this room. And if you do like

Unknown:

my share, I would appreciate it. I have a small YouTube. It's on

Unknown:

my it's on my profile greatly to stories I would appreciate if

Unknown:

you just come by. He doesn't you don't have to subscribe if you

Unknown:

don't like it. Thank you very much. Thank you very much,

Unknown:

Nicole.

Nicole York:

Thank you for joining us today Linus and yeah,

Nicole York:

folks, go go ahead and check his YouTube out. I think you you

Nicole York:

bring up some really important and valid points. And there's

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certainly a question of whether or not we should be chasing

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perfection. You know, I've argued before that I don't think

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perfection is a real thing. I think it is an illusion. That is

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100%, you know, based off of the idea that it's possible to

Nicole York:

actually be without error or failure, which I don't believe

Nicole York:

is true. But I really love that you bring up the fact that there

Nicole York:

is real beauty in those imperfections, and the fact that

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oftentimes, more than our successes, our identity comes

Nicole York:

from our failures, which is why it's something that we should

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not be afraid of. Because the times that we do succeed in the

Nicole York:

future, are ultimately based on what failures we had, what we

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learned from those things, and how overcoming, defined us how

Nicole York:

it helps to define who we are, and how that person shows up in

Nicole York:

life. And I think that's one of the reasons that we're careful

Nicole York:

in here about using the word failure. Because oftentimes,

Nicole York:

when people have different definitions, you kind of smuggle

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your own definition into the thing, based on your experience

Nicole York:

in your life. That's the way communication works. But it's so

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important to keep in mind that we look at failure as, as a

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society, often, particularly Western society is, is such a

Nicole York:

negative thing. And really, it can become an absolute thing of

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beauty because of what it brings about in our life. And I've seen

Nicole York:

this happen. So many times, I felt it myself, gone through the

Nicole York:

struggle of recognizing that I've built my identity, and

Nicole York:

based my self confidence in a place that was breakable. And

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had to watch myself and, and have the fight of becoming that

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new person as a result of those breaks. And all of a sudden,

Nicole York:

because I know what that looks like and what that feels like,

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I'm able to see and find the beauty in it. So as we come to

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the end, or as we are at the end of our hour. Today, I want to

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just recap a little bit of what we talked about over the course

Nicole York:

of our hour this morning. And understanding first, that when

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we look at something like self confidence, as an artist as a

Nicole York:

person, the first thing that we need to understand is that the

Nicole York:

seat of our confidence is either something that is breakable, or

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it's something that is flexible. And if you choose to allow

Nicole York:

yourself to become confident in outcomes, rather than confident

Nicole York:

in an ability or a proclivity for something, there really is

Nicole York:

the chance that those things are going to fall apart. Because we

Nicole York:

cannot control the end game, we can only control how we play.

Nicole York:

Also understanding that when we talk about self confidence, what

Nicole York:

we're really talking about is our credibility with ourself,

Nicole York:

can I believe myself, when I say I'm going to do this thing? If I

Nicole York:

can, that's where the confidence comes from. And oftentimes that

Nicole York:

requires building a skill set, going through the difficulty and

Nicole York:

then having some kind of proof on the other side, that will

Nicole York:

represent what we've done, it becomes a feedback loop. And in

Nicole York:

order to do any of this stuff, the first thing we have to do is

Nicole York:

be paying attention to who we believe ourselves to be and what

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we say about ourselves to ourselves. So I mentioned

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earlier, I was going to touch on this, as Kat was talking about,

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you know, her experience as a younger person being bullied and

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then how she kind of faked her way into that initial appearance

Nicole York:

of confidence that began to grow over time. And

Nicole York:

everything starts in our head. Everything starts with what we

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say to ourselves and about ourselves. Because what you

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believe to be true will be true for you and that it will affect

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how you behave. And the results that you get back. And if I tell

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myself, I'm no good at this. I'm never going to be able to do it.

Nicole York:

I'll never sell this much. I'll never take this shot. I'll never

Nicole York:

work with this person. I'll never see myself in this life

Nicole York:

that I would have dreamed about for myself. If I tell myself

Nicole York:

those things. Often enough, my behavior will reflect those

Nicole York:

things and the outcome will reflect the behavior So we have

Nicole York:

to watch the stories that we tell ourselves. I know that

Nicole York:

anybody who's been here with us for any amount of time will

Nicole York:

recognize this as the main through line for me, because it

Nicole York:

is the most important thing we can do. The stories that we tell

Nicole York:

ourselves, are the key to everything we do and believe

Nicole York:

about who we are. If you tell yourself that the good results

Nicole York:

are chance, and fate, that's what you're going to believe you

Nicole York:

will behave like you have no control over the outcome. If you

Nicole York:

tell yourself that the results are based on, not my ability to

Nicole York:

control fate, but my ability to work hard, then working hard

Nicole York:

becomes the pathway. So the things that we tell ourselves

Nicole York:

ultimately become reality for us. And if you probably just

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heard my watch telling me that I did a good job walking this

Nicole York:

morning. Yeah. So if we want to look at self confidence as

Nicole York:

something we can build and achieve for ourselves, whether

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that is in who we are in the work that we produce in our

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ability to make an income from the work that we produce all of

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these different areas. Everything begins with what we

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tell ourselves with our internal narrative with that monologue,

Nicole York:

the stories that we tell ourselves about who we are. And

Nicole York:

then that extends out into where that confidence is placed, are

Nicole York:

we placing it in our ability to get results? are we placing it

Nicole York:

on our ability to do a thing, if I place myself confidence in my

Nicole York:

ability to work hard to be curious, and to have to know

Nicole York:

that my motivation will always be centered and love,

Nicole York:

recognizing that to do a thing for somebody else means I

Nicole York:

believe that I'm doing something that is serving their best

Nicole York:

interest. That's not something that will be easily taken from

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me by circumstance, almost no matter where I'm at, that is

Nicole York:

something I will be able to fall back in and have confidence in.

Nicole York:

Because it cannot be broken by somebody reacting to me badly

Nicole York:

not liking my work, not buying the photograph, none of those

Nicole York:

things can affect me understanding that my motivation

Nicole York:

comes out of a place of love. So the stories we tell ourselves,

Nicole York:

knowing where that self confidence is at recognizing

Nicole York:

that we as people are malleable, and if we have narratives and

Nicole York:

behaviors that don't serve us, those things can be changed. You

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don't have to be the person that you are today, tomorrow, if you

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don't want to be. But like Becca said, those things are small

Nicole York:

goals, we're always taking small steps towards something, we get

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to choose what that thing is. And

Nicole York:

giving ourselves those little wins every single day that

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reinforce our confidence that reinforce our abilities to do

Nicole York:

the things that we say we want to do. And then doing hard

Nicole York:

things and recognizing that failure will sometimes be a

Nicole York:

result. And that is not the end, it is part of the journey. And

Nicole York:

it becomes beautiful that way. Kat mentioned some of the

Nicole York:

difficulties that she had when beginning her career, and that

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she basically was taking, she was taking cell phone mortality,

Nicole York:

she was taking a leap into the void, she was jumping to her

Nicole York:

death and counting on wings to grow on the way down. And there

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is a kind of internal strength that happens when you take those

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risks. When you push yourself so far outside of your comfort

Nicole York:

zone, the only choice you have is to succeed. There's a

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strength in that. And failure is inevitable, when you jump often

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enough, but remember that that failure becomes a springboard to

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the next thing. So today was a really amazing conversation, so

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much great insight and feedback into human nature and into the

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way we think and two different things that we can do if we are

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sitting in a place where we don't have a whole lot of

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confidence in ourselves, and that encouragement to go out to

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do hard things, to build credibility with ourselves to

Nicole York:

recognize that if we just start by showing up for ourselves,

Nicole York:

that is the first step. And also recognizing that the power and

Nicole York:

the belief should come from us being able to do the thing and

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not control the outcome. I can control how I stand. I can

Nicole York:

control how I hold the baseball, I can control how I release the

Nicole York:

baseball and how I breathe. I can't control whether or not the

Nicole York:

baseball hits the glove. That part of it isn't up to me. So

Nicole York:

focus on the things that we can control. Recognize that there is

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no such thing ultimately as a wrong outcome if we can learn

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from it and integrate it. And also like Becca said, where

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you're at today is okay, where you're at today is beautiful and

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good. But it doesn't also have to be where you're going to be

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tomorrow, you get to make that decision for yourself. So I'm so

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glad you were here with us today. Thank you to everybody

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who came up and shared your experiences, your your insights,

Nicole York:

it's so, so powerful. And I really hope that you will join

Nicole York:

us again tomorrow morning, bright and early at 7am.

Nicole York:

Mountain Standard Time. That's 6am for the west coast in the

Nicole York:

US. 9am for the East Coast, usually, late afternoon for our

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friends overseas. Come hang out with us. We're always in here

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looking at how we can be the bridge between technique and

Nicole York:

art. And go make something amazing. We'll see you bright

Nicole York:

and early tomorrow morning. Have a fantastic day, everybody.

Matt Stagliano:

Thanks again for listening to this live clubhouse

Matt Stagliano:

discussion moderated by all of us at the artist Forge. We hope

Matt Stagliano:

you found the information useful and then it helps you gain a

Matt Stagliano:

little bit of insight as to how you work on your craft. For more

Matt Stagliano:

episodes, please join us each weekday on clubhouse or visit

Matt Stagliano:

the artists forge.com and go make something incredible

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