[00:00:16] Jason S. Bradshaw: Hey friends, welcome back to Chats With Jason. I'm of course your host Jason S. Bradshaw, and today's the episode is going to hit close to home for many of us.

[00:00:28] Jason S. Bradshaw: Just days before his unexpected passing, I had the privilege of speaking with John Ruhlin, founder of GIFT∙OLOGY, champion of radical generosity, and someone I was proud to collaborate with on meaningful projects. John was a friend, a force, and a man who lived what he taught. He believed relationships weren't just important in business. They were the business.

[00:01:09] Jason S. Bradshaw: This conversation is more than a tribute. It's a roadmap to rehumanizing how we do business. You'll hear about the relationship snowball effect, the RICH relationship framework, and how intentional generosity can unlock word of mouth - growth that money simply can't buy. If you've ever wondered how to deepen trust, elevate referrals, or show up in a way that's unforgettable, this episode's for you.

[00:01:37] Jason S. Bradshaw: Sara, welcome to the show.

[00:01:54] Jason S. Bradshaw: And I really appreciate that you and the team have continued to forge ahead with John's work. Like I shared with you before we started recording, every single day I'm reminded of the power of the work that John forged and his message.

[00:02:11] Jason S. Bradshaw: Sara, if we were to strip away business titles and LinkedIn profiles, and just ask who was John Ruhlin to you personally, what would you say?

[00:02:51] Sara Hardwick: I think the other thing that I would be remiss in not mentioning is how important family was to him and how much he was able to still keep that as a center of his life. I hope that's something that as I actually get married this August and hope to have a family, I will always cherish those lessons that John taught, not just me, our whole team, and so many others about, the importance of relationship and those family relationships come first.

[00:03:37] Jason S. Bradshaw: So, and congratulations in advance of your upcoming wedding.

[00:03:54] Sara Hardwick: I think you mentioned it in the intro perfectly, that, we have now been told in the age of social media and the age of technology that the way to grow your business, the way to market your business is through SEO and paid Facebook ads and all the things, right? When in reality, if the idea is to build trust with a customer so that you can serve them, so that they can pay you, so that they stay with you and retention and that they refer you- that's all stuff that is built on pure relationship. And a lot of businesses, you know, spend so much time digging into the strategy of how they're gonna do SEO and Facebook ads and all these things, but they don't strategically sit down and think about referrals. They don't sit down and think about their word of mouth strategy besides I'm gonna go to this networking event and see what happens. So what Beyond Giftology really captures is giving people a system for generating word of mouth, for generating referrals and showing people that absolutely we believe relationships can take you places. Traditional marketing can't.

[00:05:17] Jason S. Bradshaw: So, can you take us back to the first time you saw the power of relationship snowball in action? Specifically what happened and how did it shift the way you see growth?

[00:05:39] Sara Hardwick: When I was looking for a full-time job, the first thing that I would do in networking sessions, in meeting people, in interviews was not go in and try to give someone my resume or my business card.

[00:06:18] Sara Hardwick: Because of those smaller gestures that you do in the beginning, and that's the whole concept of the relationship snowball. Start where you are. Start with the relationships that you have. Treat them well. Engage them. Energize them. And that's how you will get referred to more and more people. I call it the referral family tree, right?

[00:07:22] Jason S. Bradshaw: Yeah makes so much sense.

[00:07:34] Jason S. Bradshaw: What's the first demonstration of value or DOV, if you will, that they could do today that might change everything?

[00:07:52] Sara Hardwick: There's so many demonstrations of values. People hear GIFT∙OLOGY and they think, oh, I need to spend a lot of money on gifts.

[00:08:04] Sara Hardwick: Handwritten notes are a great one.

[00:08:37] Jason S. Bradshaw: Yeah, I think it's important that we emphasize that nowhere in the GIFT∙OLOGY framework does it say you need to go out and buy an expensive piece of art, or VIP tickets to a must go show. It's being intentional about building that relationship. And a handwritten note, a video message or even just a simple text message done with the right thought can make you stand out. It can in itself be exceptional because in today's busy world, most organizations are focused on how can we automate, how can we take out the human in the process so that we just get a tick in the box that we have communicated something as opposed to being thoughtful.

[00:09:30] Sara Hardwick: Absolutely.

[00:09:34] Jason S. Bradshaw: What's the most unexpected emotional response you or your team have received from a handwritten note or an intentional gift?

[00:10:00] Sara Hardwick: We were talking about this even before we started recording, but being a part of people's daily lives with gifts- that's that emotional connection that really our philosophy in gift giving in these demonstrations of value, that's where it lands. Like every time you take out the knife to cook dinner for your family, you're thinking of the person who gave it to you. And that doesn't come from your logo on it. That comes from the meaningful moment that you created. So I think just finding the ways to add value to not just that person, but to their everyday life. To make it easier. If they're going through something and you know it, recommend a book, right? Like that's another easy demonstration of value. Those are the things that's going to get that emotional response out of somebody. And then build trust in your relationship that can be transferred into something that will help your business succeed.

[00:11:09] Jason S. Bradshaw: So, a personal example from my experience was John. Of course, he loved on me. He was generous with me in so many ways, through his time and his thoughtfulness. But he also knew that behind me, or next to me, beside me, however you wanna say it, was an executive assistant that, ran my life in many respects, right? Had to deal with all my call with John, ran an hour over today, you know... had to deal with all those sorts of challenges that one does in those sorts of roles.

[00:12:13] Sara Hardwick: Absolutely. And Jason, something I just wanna point out that you said. John took the time to really know and understand and even get the name of the people that are surrounding maybe the key relationship that really you're looking to build with a client, with a referral partner, what have you. Something that I think so many service business professionals in the world of busyness, right? We're focused on a task or we're focused on serving the customer that's in front of us, which is very important. But we miss, I say asking the extra question - which is just this concept of - if you're on a Zoom meeting, which I'm on all the time, working from home, right? And someone's like, sorry, it's a little loud in here. My kids just got home from school. We usually just go, oh yeah, no worries. I can hear you fine. Asking the extra question looks like... oh, no worries. What are your kids' names? How old are they? What sports do they play? Right? Allow yourself time in conversation with customers, with key relationships, to go there relationally to ask the extra question. And I think sometimes even hopefully people hearing this, just switching your brain to realize those moments while they're happening and give yourself the space to do it.

[00:13:44] Jason S. Bradshaw: Yeah, absolutely. And I think in those moments where the kids do barge in, in the middle of a meeting or whatever, when you take the moment to just be human, to acknowledge that it's not the end of the world, what's little Johnny and Mary's name? Those sorts of things, it actually relaxes the conversation as well because the person on the other end isn't trying, oh gosh, I've gotta get this meeting back on track and, you know, I've gotta make up those lost minutes. I think it has so much value beyond just the obvious.

[00:14:35] Sara Hardwick: Well, first I think I'll reiterate our belief truly, that we do believe that relationships can take you places marketing can't. So the fact that you're saying you don't have Thumbnail of ChatsWithJason_Hor Rev.png time to build relationships, that's really saying like, I don't have time to build a key marketing lever in my business. So, I would reframe that thinking a little bit.

[00:15:49] Sara Hardwick: This is truly a time where you or your team can come back and say, Hey, I just realized that Jason posted on LinkedIn last week that his son wasn't feeling well. Right? Like whatever that is, to be able to have the space to bubble that up to your team so that things get done. What that does for our team and what that always did also in support of John is yes, maybe John didn't have time to be writing 15 or 20 handwritten notes at a time, but him bubbling up that information, that those key relational components then allows a team member to take that over, or a system to be created. And there are things that can be automated but we need to start those relational systems at some point, and I think tap meetings are a great way to do that.

[00:16:46] Jason S. Bradshaw: It reminds me, Zig Ziglar, very famous individual when it comes to sales and marketing. Well published author. His family continues his legacy as well.

[00:17:26] Jason S. Bradshaw: The reason I share that analogy with Zig, or the Zig example, is if you are watching today or listening along as you drive to work - relationships, building relationships, and making it a intentional part of your business is proven, it's tested it's generational. It will last beyond the next social media hack, the next SEO refresh that Google puts out. It's something that endures and that's really important, 'cause in business where you have so many things that don't endure. Sara, what's your take on that?

[00:19:22] Jason S. Bradshaw: Yeah, absolutely. It's a great reminder. Build the relationship because that will endure.

[00:19:35] Jason S. Bradshaw: So, you teach people to prioritize return on relationship over that initial return on investment. What's a business result that you've seen that the ROI focused leaders that are listening would find potentially unbelievable?

[00:20:05] Sara Hardwick: So when you're putting a dollar into a Facebook Ad and getting x-ed out, sure you're not able to necessarily do that with how you're investing in gifts or showing up for a relationship. But we really do believe over time that these things will compound. I think the unlocking of loyalty that happens when you are investing in relationships is something that's unmatched. The salary, contracts, I see it in my own world when it comes to being an employee of GIFT∙OLOGY. Something John has likely shared with you, Jason, and something that he shared openly a lot is like the things that we are given as a team and poured into, invested in, of having a house cleaner twice a month, having date nights covered for us and our significant others, right? Those are the relational investments that will get you returned. That will get me working harder. That will get me staying up those long nights if I need to. The health insurance and not the 401k, although, yes, those things are great. Those above and beyond moments are what's going to get you the return back.

[00:21:26] Sara Hardwick: And same with referral partners. If they're up in the air with two services, two people to refer business to, if you're investing in that relationship, you would expect that there would likely be a return there.

[00:22:11] Jason S. Bradshaw: So, if you're watching today or listening along, don't think that you have to be boxed into giving a gift or writing a note, or giving someone even a cash bonus when it comes to their employment. There are ways that you can build a relationship in different ways. So important that we're reminded of that.

[00:23:15] Sara Hardwick: And there's return on relationships can take shape in a lot of different ways. And I think just having the intentionality behind it, focusing truly on the relationship, on the person, you will have an outcome that you'll be happy with.

[00:23:33] Jason S. Bradshaw: So if a listener was to pick just one person today to love on, what's your script? What should they say, do or send to start their referral ripple?

[00:24:09] Sara Hardwick: Same in video. I think there's a similar structure where if we are really just able to speak to the relationship and not bring up the transaction, and not bring up business and the next meeting that we're supposed to have, that's what can start that true energization of someone who is a raving fan of you, and will refer your business.

[00:24:40] Jason S. Bradshaw: If you were to explain the GIFT∙OLOGY teachings, the core message of GIFT∙OLOGY to an 11-year-old, what would you say?

[00:25:03] Sara Hardwick: Jesus says it is more blessed to give than to receive. And, while, yes, that's a business principle that we hang our hat on, I think an 11-year-old could see that in their daily life with friends, with family as well. And it's something that I'm so grateful that I get to live out in my work as well.

[00:25:32] Jason S. Bradshaw: You're an ambassador of GIFT∙OLOGY, of the work of John. What responsibility do you feel carrying his voice forward and what would you hope that people take away that he himself didn't live to say?

[00:26:42] Jason S. Bradshaw: Fantastic. Sara, as it comes to the top of the show, I'll finish with this last question and I'll ask you to complete this sentence for me. If more leaders embraced radical generosity in business, then...

[00:27:06] Jason S. Bradshaw: Your business and your life will change if you embrace radical generosity.

[00:27:14] Sara Hardwick: Thank you so much, Jason.

[00:27:27] Jason S. Bradshaw: Today, it feels even more powerful than ever. John wasn't just a bestselling author, an entrepreneur, he was someone who made you feel seen. He taught us that the most impactful marketing isn't loud. It's personal.

[00:27:51] Jason S. Bradshaw: I hope this conversation has sparked something in you. Maybe it reminded you that ROI is good, but ROR - Return On Relationship is a game changer.

[00:28:17] Jason S. Bradshaw: You can learn more at www.giftologygroup.com and get your copy of Beyond Giftology, a book John wrote for all of us who believe in business with a heart.

[00:28:31] Jason S. Bradshaw: Tag them. Gift it, and subscribe to Chats With Jason for more conversations that connect. Because relationships still matter most and generosity never goes out of style.