Summary

Today, we're diving into what it really takes to make it to the postseason. We'll explore the five essential ingredients every team needs to secure their spot in October. Spoiler alert: mindset is a biggie! You can’t just show up and hope for the best; teams need that competitive fire to truly contend. We’ll also chat about the importance of talent, depth, and the ever-elusive consistency. So grab your favorite snack, kick back, and let’s get into some serious baseball talk that’ll have you thinking about the game in a whole new way!

Podcast Partner Bios

Ethan Dungan - Owner of Glovehound Baseball Glove Repair Shop. Ethan played for several teams during his career including Midland and Fairfield High School. He now operates Glovehound from his shop in Fairfield, OH.

Rick Finley - Founder of MD&I Academy Baseball Training Facility in Fairfield, OH. Rick has successfully coached and trained hundreds of players at the Select, Travel, and College levels in both baseball and softball.

George Foster - Major League Player with the Giants, Reds, & Mets. NL MVP 1977, 5-Time All-Star, Silver Slugger and member of the Cincinnati Reds Hall of Fame. Founder of George Foster Baseball where he offers private baseball instruction.

Timestamps:

• 00:22 - Introduction to Baseball Topics
• 00:44 - Mindset and Strategy for Postseason Success
• 16:11 - The Intensity of Postseason Play
• 24:51 - Coaching Strategies in Youth Baseball
• 37:36 - The Importance of Mental and Physical Preparation in Baseball
• 49:01 - The Importance of Coaching in Youth Development
• 57:26 - Postseason Records and MVPs
• 01:02:55 - Bob Gibson: The Dominant Pitcher

Key Takeaways:

• To make it to the postseason, teams need to cultivate a winning mindset and push through challenges, especially for lower market teams that might not be in contention.
• Consistency is key for teams aiming to reach the postseason; you can't just rely on late-season bursts of performance to secure your spot.
• Having a strong bench is crucial in the postseason, as it allows teams to rest starters and maintain performance throughout a grueling playoff schedule.
• Pitching depth is vital; injuries happen, and a solid bullpen can make or break a team's chances in tight playoff games.
• The importance of situational hitting cannot be overstated; knowing when to sacrifice or play aggressively can define a postseason game.
• Team unity is essential in the postseason; players need to be on the same page and support each other for the best chance at success.

Links:

• glovehound.com
• mdaiacademy.com
• georgefosterbaseball.com
• twocreativedigital.com

Teaser:

Next week we kick off our 3 part series called Offensive Objectives where we get deep into offensive strategy and skills for getting on base. Don't miss it.

Companies mentioned:

• Glovehound
• MDI Baseball Academy
• George Foster Baseball

Welcome to the Complete Game podcast, where we're all about baseball with Ethan Dungan, owner of Glovehound Baseball glove repair shop.

Rick Finley, founder of MDNI Baseball Academy and the creator of George Foster Baseball, the MVP himself, Reds hall of Famer George Foster.

I'm your host, Greg Dungan.

Now let's talk baseball.

All right, welcome back.

Episode 17.

And we're all.

We're all here.

And Rick is here two and three times.

Yes.

Rev it up.

Charged up.

Well, it's.

Glad to see everybody back and.

And looking forward to a good discussion.

Today we're talking about playing in the postseason, and it's something that you, you know, some guys never get to do it, and it's a.

It's a big deal.

So anyway, we're gonna start off today by talking about five things that every.

That teams must have to get to the postseason.

So, Ethan, once you kick us off, what are five things that a team must have to get to the post?

My son goes, man, the first thing.

Just, I think it has to be mindset.

It has to be the.

It has to be the goal to be there in the first place.

Sometimes you see some of these teams and it's.

Especially when you get to these lower market teams that aren't in contention and you hear guys talk about it.

I've heard a lot of guys talk about, like, the Marlins in specific, you know, pros that are done playing.

Guys are just there to be there.

They're not there to compete.

And so it's just a very different expectation that you have, you know, you know, in a big market like New York or la, where they're expecting to win every time, the whole team has to have that same mindset.

Yeah, I agree.

George, what do you think?

You know, I agree with that because when I had gone from the Reds to the Mets, I, I thought everybody during spring training or getting themselves prepared physically, mentally for a winning season, but a lot of guys are just there.

It's like in a holding pattern and hoping to get to some of them, hoping to get to another team, and some are just there to hold on, play a few more years.

But you got to have that mindset.

Like Ethan was saying, you had to have the talent.

The other part, you had to have the talent to do it and experience, go along with that talent.

Because with the Reds, you had a good nucleus there.

You had a rose, you had a bench Perez.

So now you can build around it.

And Bob Housing, to me, was the best as the general manager putting a team together.

And we had speed, power, speed.

Sometimes you can have too much power.

So back with the braves, you had three guys that hit 40 or more home runs in the lineup, but they weren't winning.

So.

And there's guys that.

Oh, yeah, I look at the ratio of home runs or home runs to RBIs.

Is that guy hitting home runs with men on base or hitting solo home runs.

So it makes a big difference.

So having that experience and having that talent, very important.

I have a question, though.

The.

So today it seems like.

Well, I mean, the Reds just did this too.

Like, you get to the.

Right before that trade deadline and people are trying to bring in the whatever talent they don't have, you know, with trades and that kind of thing, free agency, whatever, and trying to load up with that extra talent toward the end of the year.

You know, when you talk about 75, 76, 77, those guys we, we know about those of you who were there putting in the work, doing the thing, but did they make moves and bring in anybody in the middle of the year?

On those, on those teams, the ones.

We were bringing in, it's more of a pitch hitter, a pitcher.

The starting lineup, you had guys, I remember back, someone was talking about, where would Bottle be in that lineup?

He wouldn't play.

He couldn't play.

So.

But that, that starting eight, you know, they were solid.

Yeah.

So we just.

Another key to it.

Maybe Rick.

Maybe taking it from Rick.

But winning team had to have a strong bench.

Yeah.

So you have to have guys to come in, not only pinch hit, but give a guy a day of rest or so that one day make a big difference.

Yeah.

We talked about Dan Dreeson being there with Dreeson.

Yeah.

And Doug Flynn, he would like on Sundays.

Joe Morgan wouldn't play on Sunday, but Doug came in and did a quality job.

Bill Plummer behind Johnny.

So it's important to have that strong bench.

Cool.

Rick, what you got?

Well, a couple you guys went over leadership.

Manager, that's GM and manager being on the same, just having a philosophy.

But I would add pitching depth.

Gotta have some pitching depth.

Okay.

Someone that gets injured or your bullpen has to be, you know, have some good bullpen depth.

Guys that are probably only going to be one or two or your closer and stuff.

So pitching depth, um, you know, you gotta have guys that can throw strikes.

So.

Yeah.

That rubber arm like Pedro Bourbon had a rubber on, he could pitch every day.

Yeah, well, yeah.

And I think one of the things that I, I see in a.

In a team that makes it to the postseason is consistency like you've just played, you know, better than 160 games.

Were you consistent in your performance or are you expecting that people are just going to heat up in the last month or two of the, of the season?

That's rarely going to happen.

I mean, there are only so many Reggie Jackson's in the world.

I mean the idea that somebody's just going to out of nowhere start producing things that they haven't been producing all year long is, is very, very unlikely.

So you're more likely to reach that postseason if you've been steadily producing all year long.

Ethan, you were talking right before the show about how Rose didn't get quite the same recog because of his consistency of base hitting rather than his lack of slugging.

And.

But yet it was that consistency over all of his career that led him to, you know, over 4,000 hits.

So, you know, is your team consistent?

Are your pitchers consistently having good outings?

Are your batters consistently hitting and moving runners, getting on base, moving people around, doing that kind of thing?

Or have you just been lucky enough to win a certain percentage of your game with home runs and slugging?

Slugging.

And if that's the case, you're not going to slug your way into the, into the postseason.

That's just probably not going to happen.

But low scoring games is indicative of the team, is the team play because being able to manufacture runs.

You go out there say if Joe Morgan gets on bases, he's still second or then still third.

And, and yes, George Foster drives him in.

So it's one to nothing.

We went in the game well, some guys, he gets on first base and they, he doesn't try to steal.

And the guy trying to hit home runs to getting a base hit and it's like, next man up, keep going, keep going.

Because we, we would be down in the bottom of the ninth and that one base hit because the mindset of the other team is like, oh no here it's coming, it's coming.

I remember we were playing the Phillies in the playoff.

I think it was 76 or so.

They actually have four guys warming up in the bullpen.

It's like you can't pitch them all at once.

That's funny.

I do, I will say this because having pitching depth, you're going to have injuries.

So George, talking about how pitching was then to now, because before we talked.

About the biggest difference is the starters going longer.

There we go.

Because their expectation.

Back to what Ethan saying is the mindset, if I couldn't go Five.

I can go five.

But these guys, we want.

They wanted to go.

They really wanted to finish the game, but at least go on a quality seven or eight innings.

So it takes pressure off.

Off that bullpen.

So when a guy goes out there, he.

He's not saying, oh, 90 pitches or whatever, whatever it takes.

I remember, I think in the World Series, 70, 75 with the Red Sox, I think tion had over 200 pitches in the game.

Crazy.

Unheard of.

Yeah.

They'd lose their minds over a stat like that these days.

Well, my other.

My next one kind of goes hand in hand with both of those, and it's longevity or stamina, because going into the postseason, you could play 20 or more really intense games.

Yeah, that's different than, you know, an early game in the spring where maybe you don't even play the whole game and, you know, you're just trying to keep fresh.

But you have to be able to play that full 162.

Well, spring training, 162.

And then, you know, more for playoffs and.

Well, let me ask you this.

How much more does the intensity of that game drain you as a player?

Well, as far as I would bring up take.

You need more energy.

It wasn't draining, but it gives you more energy.

But you gotta get yourself, your body prepared for that.

And once in spring training, it's important to get your mind, your body ready for that long run.

Because before the playoffs start, you play close to 200 games, because in spring training is at least 30 or more games, because they're.

They're looking to make money in spring training before you just train to get yourself ready.

But these guys, sometimes I think they start too early, but they.

They want to make the money.

So it can be draining if you haven't been there before.

And because guys are not prepared for the long run and then that intensity, being able to have that intensity day in and day out.

And I said, well, we'll play well the first two or three games, and then.

Then we go out there and give it up.

Or so to speak, like back in ten.

As remember, Djokovic had was two up on Fritz.

And so now his strategy is get two up on Fritz because Fritz has a good, good serve.

But he laid off that third set because, okay, I know it's going to go five.

I mean, it has to go.

If it goes five, I gotta be prepared.

But if he would go hard, too hard on that, on that third set, he may not be ready.

Yeah, but with Pete Rose, he said, don't give a nut.

Bat up.

I see guys giving that.

Bats up.

And like you, the Reds the other day had five to nothing, and they figure we got it.

No.

Do you have teams like Toronto, they're going to come at you, they're not going to just lay down.

Yes.

Another one that I had to go in there was you got to have team unity.

Right.

To be together of one mind.

I mean, the number of times, Georgia, you've talked about how when the team is truly functioning well, it just, it functions as one organism on the field, but it also has to also the engine just purr, have that mindset off the field as well.

You got to be picking up your teammates.

You got to be looking out for each other.

You got to get your rest.

Yeah, yeah, that's a good point.

Can't have any Red Bull.

Things like that make your chest pop out.

Pop, man, you think you're.

You think you're going faster than you really are.

Well, you're in the same place, but the one, that other one that stands out is they really specialize.

So now in.

In a series.

So they're not going to pitch to a certain guy.

Right.

So now they were like, judge, you know, they'll.

You walk him.

Okay, let's go to the next guy.

But during the season, you know, they may pitch to the pitch to him.

He's going to hit the ball a mile out of Yellowstone.

But in the playoffs, you don't walk him because like Ethan was saying, most of the game's going to be low scoring.

Yeah.

So his at bat is going to be important.

So we can let him.

Let him hit or not hit.

Yeah.

So I mean, having.

Having that.

That strategy intact and knowing exactly how you're going to attack it and having your team together, you know, really.

I remember watching a thing on.

On the 90 reds that went wire to wire and the incredible unity that they had going on inside everybody pulling for everybody else.

I imagine it was much like that when you were doing it.

I don't see how you get to the postseason and survive it if you don't have that.

You can't have somebody looking out for themselves.

No, it's an individual commitment for a group effort.

And I watched not only Reds, but other teams, as far as they complain that they're not winning or not scoring runs, but like the Yankees, you know, they think they need to score eight or nine runs because they don't trust their bullpen.

But you find at the end of the game, they lose by one or two runs because they didn't situational hitting or situational play.

I see so many guys that don't know where to throw the ball.

They don't know when you're on base, when the tag up.

Their guys on second base, a ground ball's hit to the left side.

They're running at the third.

So where's this guy going exactly?

Running into an out.

Run into an out.

And then I watch and see when he go back to the dugout.

When we played, if we did something incorrectly, we have a coach at the step letting you know that's not letting you know what you didn't do and correct it.

But nowadays you just go back and put his bat and sit down.

But we're still intense watching.

Watching what what we need to do to.

To are what.

What we going to contribute to the game.

That's going to be productive.

Okay, so does anybody else have anything more for name five before we move on?

I'm pretty much out.

Okay, cool.

I'm sorry.

Go ahead.

Pete Rose made sure that we always were prepared for the.

For preparation for the pictures, the rotation.

You think that, well, what's the big difference about rotation?

But your mind is like a computer, so you start to compute, what did he throw you before?

What is his repertoire?

So you're prepared when you go up there.

And I always go on the bench and watch the opposing pitcher warm up because you're going to want to watch his release point and make sure it's the same.

Because I remember one guy, he was in the bullpen, he was.

He threw overhand majority of the time, but this time he was practicing throwing sidearm.

So when you first, you don't want to see it the first time at bat.

So I got a chance to see it in the bullpen and.

But it's also just reviewing make sure that you see in the release point, like Sutcliffe, he had that hesitation in his road, his, his, his mechanics.

So he would jump at you, but his arm is still back.

And a lot of guys jump move at that certain point.

They had that big overhead curveball, but it's like it's a dance or choreography.

You got to have that timing and you don't want to wait till the game starts for that to see it.

So you finished the season last year exhausted from all the travel in the tournaments, and you tossed your gear in a bag where it's been sitting all winter.

Now you're ready for another year.

But your favorite glove that fits just right is an error waiting to happen.

The leather is dry, the laces are brittle.

And this year you're on a new team with new colors.

And it sure would be cool if it matched well.

Wouldn't it be great if you had a glove guy who could help you out with that?

You do.

His name is Ethan and he owns Glovehound baseball glove repair shop in Fairfield, Ohio.

Just contact him@glovehound.com and upload pictures of your glove.

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You can find Glovehound on Google, Facebook, Instagram, YouTube and on the web@glovehound.com.

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Okay, so what I want to talk about now is, is how is the post, how is postseason different, the play different from regular season play?

There has to be a different feeling in the locker room ahead of time, a different satisfaction or dissatisfaction after the game than there is in a normal, you know, regular season game.

I don't know, George, orient me there.

What's it.

What's.

Well, the team that's going to win, you're going to make the fewest mistakes out there, mentally and physically.

But you.

Because they have one game, playoffs, and that's a lot of intensity that's involved.

But the manager.

So now everybody's on board.

I don't care who pitched before, everybody's on board.

And you don't know who's going.

The guy who may start the next game, if you win, may have to come into this game.

So you really got to shuffle your.

I think the pitching staff is the one that you really had to shuffle a lot.

And I remember, I think it was 72 Baltimore Orioles.

Yeah.

Against the Pirates, they had four, 20 game winners, so they had to decide on who's going to be in the rotation, who's going to go to the bullpen.

And because you're not going to, like, say, have that long series, so you're not Going to utilize all of those guys as for starters.

So deciding on that and how long are you going to have that guy out there?

Because you can't.

You got to say, okay, I'm going to limit that guy to two or three runs and I'm going to take him out.

So you got to be.

Sparky was great at that.

Having that, I guess intuition, knowing that, okay, it's time to make that change.

But I think the biggest difference is the rotation, the pitching rotation, especially when you have a one game series and, and even with, with our like say the World Series, because it's consistent from when we play into now, it's going to be 2, 3, 2.

As far as the games you play, you want to be able to play three in your, in your city, but then again you end up in their city like we did in 70, 76.

So the fact is you want to get, get started early because you.

Seven games.

Yeah.

And you got to make every game, every pitch is very important.

So put value on every at bat every game.

Because they don't assume, well, we'll win next game.

Because when we lost the game against the Red Sox six to nothing that first game, like, whoa, we had to wake up that these guys don't respect us.

We got to go out there, we assume that, you know, we're the big red machine and they're going to be intimidated.

But no.

So we came back and won the next game.

I think either three, two or two, one.

But no, five games were only settled by one run.

And so every run really was important.

Talk a little bit about.

You mentioned a minute ago about the decision of when to pull a pitcher.

Nowadays everything is about pitch count, pitch count, pitch count.

But back then they were maybe making the decision with regard to how many runs or how.

What was.

What was the more the driving statistic that made somebody say I need to, I need to maybe pull this guy or I need to leave him in.

Well, you're looking at the fact that, okay, what.

How many runs that you as a team average.

Right.

And so you don't want to get too far behind and in a short series as such and feel that you're going to catch up because everything going to be different.

You're not going to maybe pitch to a Tony Perez or Johnny Bench.

And so somebody else has to do it.

And that's the one thing that I, you have to have a guy in a RBI or clutch situation that wants to be there.

Don't force him to be there.

And De La Cruz, I Know he has like 79 or 81, nine RBIs, but still, I look back when.

How many RBIs he had in an intense pressure situation.

So.

But now I.

Cause that guy, I like him.

If he's driving 81 runs bad leading off, that is great, right?

How many runs did he leave on base batting third.

Third or four.

Yeah.

And no outs.

So it's being in the right place.

And we, we.

We knew our role.

And Sparky makes sure that you're in the right role in that lineup because you have a.

It's not.

It's important.

Not.

The most important part is how do you line up the guys?

You have a good lineup, but how you line them up.

Case in point, Griffey was batting seventh in the game one of the 75 series.

And then I don't know who had a meeting or what, but now he's batting second the second game.

So now you have more speed up in front of the lineup.

And the Reds have a tendency to have speed, speed in a power situation.

And it's like, I don't respect him.

I'll pitch around this guy.

But you, you have a bench up and you look in on deck there you have a Perez, and then you look in the hole, there's George Foster.

Like, you gotta decide on, you know, pick your poison.

Yeah.

You can't.

You can't pass on everybody.

No.

But Jim Palmer probably would.

The reason I'm saying that, this guy, he.

He brags about the fact I never did give up a grand slam.

So if, if a prez is up.

Oh, no, the bases are low.

He may walk him to get to a guy who's not a home run.

Hitter, Give up the run.

But he did give up the grand.

I did give him grass Lamb.

That's funny.

Yeah.

And I guess I can imagine if you're going to get in a game, if you're in a postseason game or even a World Series game, and you know that the average on your team is that you'll see four at bats.

You know, you just.

You just know that your team generally gets through the lineup enough that you're going to get three to four at bats.

Those three to four bats are now way more intense than they were before the postseason.

So that leads me to.

My next question is, do you change your approach?

Do you change the.

What do you change about your.

Or do you change anything about your approach to the plate when you're in a postseason game?

Good example.

My first at bat, I would take the first pitch just to make sure that I'm picking up the release point and especially nobody on base.

So what I had seen in the bullpen, I want to make sure I see on the mound.

But now, in a situation that men are on base, my first at bat, I'm not giving up that pitch.

And so, so now it's putting more value on each, each pitch.

And I say pitch compared to strike, right?

If the ball is in the hitting, in my hitting zone, I'm swinging a bat.

And that's a big difference.

Today the guys are number one, thinking too much about pitch count.

And, and I tell them that you, when you go up to bat, wear one uniform, meaning that you got to wear a uniform.

You wear the uniform of the umpire or uniform of the team.

So you want to go up there and say, I'm going to, I'm going to judge.

Okay, if it's a ball or strike.

No, if it's in your hitting zone, swing the bat.

I see too many guys going back, shaking her head, that wasn't a strike.

I said, no, it wasn't a strike.

But you can hit that ball.

The bases are loaded.

Swing the bat.

I don't want you just to walk.

Swing the bat.

Yeah, because you know, you got that.

You got three, maybe four at bats and you got to make them count, right?

There you go.

So, Rick, as a coach, let's, let's, let's equate this to, okay, you've got a youth team, you're in a, you're in a tournament situation.

You guys have played five, six games in a weekend, and you're, you're in game five or six, and you're, you know, it's, it's getting intense and you're going to head into these, these last couple of games.

How do you handle that differently than, than games earlier in the, in the.

I think a lot of it starts, is preparing your, your, your, your kids during practice.

Because I think that some guys throw too many pitches during BP, like 12 or 15 pitches and stuff.

And I always say, man, it's not a hitting marathon.

You know, you throw in BP, you.

Get.

During live BP probably 7 to 8.

And then when you get to situational hitting, you shrink it down.

Because now if you get in a whole lot of pitches during practice, when you come to a game, there's only about three to four good pitchers per at bat.

So think about that.

Three to four, you get 12 pitches.

If you get three.

So now you got to narrow it down, and that'll help a kid really narrow down to your approach.

Okay.

Everything starts.

Oh, oh.

Hunt that fastball or give them a count.

Give account.

Yes, you give them a count.

One.

Oh.

And then you give them situationals and you do that over, over again.

Those kids start gaining confidence because they've done it before.

Yes, yes.

But you got to do that during practice, especially for the youth because again they overthink.

They're not at the level to where George was at or where I coached at.

So you gotta do that over and over again.

So now when they get into a game, they just not overthinking, they being aggressive now.

Simulation.

Yeah.

Especially for young kids who don't have experience in that situ.

In that situation all the time you gotta simulate that.

So when they are in it they.

Feel a lot more prepared.

No, that makes sense.

I just had a kid that uh.

So one of the things that I do a lot during my live VP is I tell them I'm going to make it difficult for you during our practice.

So in the game you'll understand what you're looking for.

Yes, you're prepared.

So I throw change ups.

I throw stuff because I think in today everybody talks about velocity.

Velocity.

And you know you're looking for a fastball.

But if I know that you're doing that as a pitcher.

But oh man, I'll throw something off speed to you better get you off like George was saying.

Get you off on your front side a little bit.

Get you chasing.

Now I got you.

Now my fastball is going to be even better now because I do that all speed to you.

But what two things.

One is the, which stands out is the approach.

Yes.

So what is your approach?

And I teach you know the numbers starting from, from you is 3, 2, 1.

As far as your approach.

Yes.

But you're, you're bad actually going 1, 2, 3.

So.

But a lot of guys are going 1, 2, 3 on every count.

And so now a ball that's inside you may hit it, but it's going to go foul.

It's going to go foul.

But the ball that's outside you're going to miss.

So if you, you got to stay in the, in the, in the zone longer or in the account longer going 3, 2, 1.

Yeah.

And so that's, that's very important.

But the last one is they coaches is important to put a kid in a situation that he can be successful.

Yes, yes.

Well let me ask you this.

So let's talk about advanced, what I would consider advanced hitting skills.

Things like, are bunting and you know, things like that when do you find that in a postseason situation or in a last few games of the tournament situation, you're reaching for those advanced skills more than you would in another game.

And so all the more important for them to know them.

That's why you gotta do it in practice.

Don't hold it back.

It's another tool.

I was laughing early because we were.

I had my first five guys, they were bunting, and I heard somebody in the crowd said that's all you guys could do is bunt.

I wanted to say it's been successful.

Yes, yes, yes.

But bunting not only helps you to learn how to bunt, but.

But to see the ball.

Sure.

And lot.

I want a right hander to be, well bun to the off the field so you can see the ball longer in the hitting zone.

Yeah.

A lot of guys thinking that, okay, he's bunny.

Practicing bunny to bun.

No, practicing bunny to see the ball.

To see the ball is going to help you become a better hitter.

It sure do.

You let.

Because you're going to let the ball travel and.

And you see the ball a lot better.

Another thing is that I remember one of my son's coaches, we supposed to smash in his team.

So they threw slow.

Everybody hitting pop ups.

Yeah.

He says, the next guy we're going to bunt though every one through nine.

And he said, if anyone swings, you guess what?

We came back.

It worked.

He said, whatever it is, I don't care if he gave you a sacrifice or drag, bunt or push or whatever it is, you got to execute it.

We ended up coming back.

I think we went through nine.

Mark, man, he is a brilliant guy.

And so we did that for an inning or two.

I think the next two to three innings, we, we.

So he took it off, everybody started hitting line drives.

We run.

Rules the team.

Yeah, that's funny.

Adjustment.

Yes.

We made the adjustment because a lot.

Of people's mindset is, we've talked about this before, you know, a kid, or it could be any batter.

I'm sure the pros go through this.

You know, your mindset is, I'm gonna go up there and I'm gonna have the best at bat I can have.

Well, in the best at bat I could have is to knock one out of here and then less than that, you know, and really, until they start thinking, wait a minute, the best at bat I can have is what the situation calls for right now.

I like that.

So I need to put it over there, I need to put it over there.

I need to put it on the ground.

I need to take as many as I can and try and see if I can draw a walk out of this guy.

I need to do, you know, whatever.

So you know, what, what is that?

What is the best at bat you can have and when to try and get your players to start thinking about that.

Because when you get to those later games, you're in that postseason game, you're in that, that last tournament game and you need to reach for those advanced skills, man.

If we haven't done that all year, you're, you could be coming up dry, going to the well for that.

But that's the situation will dictate what you need to do.

Yes, but you got to be prepared for it early.

I mean, back in spring training.

So you're doing it.

They say, do what?

Do what you need.

What got you there?

Yeah, yeah.

So keep doing that all during the season because I, to me it's a weapon, the bunning, the stealing.

Because I said once you get on first base, the first pitch, you're going.

That really.

I said you're going.

Yeah.

I don't care if they know that you're going, you're going, or I'm going to bunt and run.

I'm a hit and run and.

But I'm going to create more strategy or excitement out there.

Well, the other thing is you can't use those advanced hitting techniques if there's nobody on base.

It doesn't gain you anything.

So, you know, also being very cognizant of whatever it takes to get on base, watching for that drop, third strike, taking off.

Anyway, when you get that single, you're not dogging it, you're hustling everything you can get to get to first base.

You'll do anything to get to the bag.

When you're on base, be prepared to advance, to advance.

She has all in the dirt.

A lot of.

Yeah, I was getting ready to comment on that.

Yes.

Stop reading my mind.

So I tell the guys, especially at third base, look down in front of home plate.

It will tell you where the direction of the ball.

If it's going to be a ground ball, it's going to be a line drive.

So at first base it's going to be in the dirt.

Be ready to advance to the next base.

Don't wait till the ball is blocked away.

You got to be there.

I see, I see McLean, I see guys who got good speed.

They're still at.

I said, what are you doing if I'm the first base coach?

I said, are you still here they.

Ain'T taking secondary leads.

Right.

They are really having that fear of getting thrown out.

Another question I had is how do managers coach a team differently in the postseason than they do in the regular season?

Like what, what kind of things you played for one of the greatest of all time.

What kind of things might Sparky have done differently in the postseason than he would have during the regular season or was there anything?

Yeah, well, the main thing is they, they letting the pitcher in his mind said, I'm only giving that guy so many innings as far as pitching and, and during the course of the season, you know, so like a Freddie Norman, you know, you know, during his outing, he's going to give up a home run.

Just hopefully there's nobody's on base like Tom Hume.

Yeah, yeah.

And so but maybe be able to get him out before that does happen.

But also the fact that, okay, we have a three or four run lead and here he is trying to pick somebody off.

I want to let him know that run's not important.

I want the guy at the plate, get him out.

But these guys trying to pick somebody off at second base, they got three run lead and two outs.

So go get the batter.

Go get the batter.

It's just making sure that you're knowing what you're doing out there and, and not creating momentum for the other ball club.

And maybe you're going to like a Morgan is he knows I'm one of the smartest guys in the game when he gets on base.

He knowing that, oh, they know I'm going, but I'm not.

I don't have any fear.

I can make it there.

I can get a good jump.

So now he's still second.

So it gives.

Now I don't have to hit a home run to drive him in.

And then he knowing that Eric Davis made the statement, said after you still second, what's, what's the next best pitch to go on everybody?

He said the next pitch.

So being able to be aggressive on the basis and I always talk about confidence help you to overcome the self doubt.

Yeah, but you got to go out there and give it a try.

If you don't give it a try, you don't know if you can do it.

But I'd say mainly with the pitching staff and, and pitch hitting spark in May in certain situations.

But with the starting eight, you know, who are you going to pitch it for?

Unless you want to fight.

But would he have had more of a, of a short leash for, you know, guys out there and he Just doesn't have it together and he's just not getting to see some air bump.

You're out, right?

Well, as you have a ground ball pitcher hitting the guy's head and fly balls, warm up.

Get everybody warm up or tell the outfielders, make sure you're way back.

Way back.

So.

Yeah, but the other one, we didn't have a DH before the 76 in the world Series.

So now who's going to pinch hit?

When will you pinch hit for the pitcher?

He may be pitching well, but we need those runs out there.

Right.

So being able to take him out even though he's doing well, but we need those runs.

Would there have been a lot more of, you know, okay, so I got to pinch it for this guy, but that means I got to move three other guys around different places and doing a lot of that.

Or it's just mainly just a swap out.

It's a swap out because you have a, the, the bullpen was relieved by committee.

So those guys, they, it's like lights out when they, when they come out there.

But knowing when, when to do it.

But, but the main thing is like you have guys bases loaded and two outs.

You want to pinch it for that picture, right?

Because you don't want to just give it, give an out up.

You give it, give, give yourself a chance.

Yeah, you've said that a couple of times today.

And that is something that I've, I, I was always taught when I was a kid that, that, that I just don't see today is, is the, the just insistence on not giving up an opportunity.

Like I am going to make the most of every single opportunity.

I am not going to sit down if I don't, if I didn't go down swinging.

You're not going to write a backwards K to my name.

It's just not going to happen.

I know it's not going to happen.

I don't know if they have an incentive in the contract how many strikeouts I can get by taking.

But, but I don't know exactly.

But I, I just guess that a manager can win or win or lose after you win or lose 10 to 11 games or 11 to 10.

Well, 10 to 11 games they say.

How?

Well, like the other night, the Reds were losing by two runs.

Man on first and second, bunt the guy over right or hit and run.

Do something different to get those runners moving.

And that put the batter hitter into a batter runner into a successful situation to succeed.

Pinch running from someone if he's on third base and he needs Some speed there.

Because a sacrifice fly, you don't want it to be.

You don't want to be so close.

Yeah.

Let me ask you this.

So the grind of a postseason where you're just like, okay, this is something that you know is kind of unique to baseball players and like, you know, you're.

Everything is a series, everything is five games of this and seven games of that.

And so you know going in that you're not going to have a champion at this level until we've played several games.

And then you're going to go to the next level, you're going to play several games.

Then you go to the World Series, you're going to play several games.

And you know, how.

Do you.

Do you have any.

Were there any secrets to surviving that as a team, to keeping everybody together so that people aren't getting worn out by the.

By the post season grind.

It starts with conditioning.

Yes.

And even during the course of the year conditioning, because I'm not lifting heavy weights, but I'm lifting maybe 30 or 30 pound dumbbells.

But your body doesn't know how much weight you're lifting, but you got it still getting on that treadmill, getting on that bike.

Keep doing those things that you were doing before.

And your mind may tell you that you're tired, but you got to work through that because you're knowing what you need to do.

But each game, focus on each game at a time.

Not looking, oh, well, we win best of five, we will be fine.

We lost the first two.

We'll be fine.

Before you know it, you're going to be at home.

So every game, we keep emphasizing every game, every at bat is very important.

Put value on that.

So when you go out there, put it all out on the field.

Don't try to say something for, for next game.

Yeah.

And I imagine it's if you see one of your, one of your teammates are struggling, they're coming apart, the grinds getting to them, they're having it.

You know that that's a especially necessary time for everybody to come around to kind of, you know, you pick them up a little bit.

Well, it's more so talking, it's like, you know, how do you feel?

Right.

And, and like say in Joe's case is all my legs are sore things as such.

So I'm not trying to hit, hit home runs but I need to drive the ball in the gap and not expecting just a base hits going to drive him in and, but by him just being on base.

But the other team doesn't know that he's sore, he's hurt by him being on base.

I'm still going to get more fastballs to hit.

So it's more of an urgency now.

And, but in my case or Tony Perez's case, we, we swing at pitches that are in our zone.

It doesn't have to be a strike zone.

And some guys, they have to have to be, there have to be a strike.

And, and I see a lot of guys walking, but it's not, it's not always a strike for an umpire.

I mean, I mean a ball to an umpire is, he's going to call you out.

So what do you do?

You can't change his mind.

So get up, go up there and get, be accountable.

Have quality at bats.

Quality at bats.

Not just swinging at strikes.

Pitchers in your strike zone or hitting zone.

And in batting practice, I said why didn't you swing at that?

Well, it wasn't what the strike.

Perfect.

Okay.

Then I started, I said I'm going to put the hit and run on, make that guy's wing at that pitch.

So like Rick, let's, let's segue back to working with, with young people now.

So you're, you got kids, they're naturally not going to be as mentally tough as professional baseball players who do this for a living.

So how do you as a coach keep them together in those high pressure situations to make sure that it doesn't get to get to them and wear them down?

Practice, that's one of the, one of the main things.

Practice and a lot of things going back to what George was saying about doing there was running poles and everything.

I used to do sprint work with our guys during practice.

You know how the infield and the outfield kind of connects with a dirt and grass around here.

So of course you don't use a track.

So we'll run those curves.

I'll run 20 and 30 yard curves.

Man, we'll do that about three or four times.

And then I tell the kids that, you know, on your own time you work on that.

So if you're, you're doing, you know, you can do, use dumbbells or you can do body weight, but I always emphasize doing sprint work and because I know that if, if you doing this then you're going to have a, you're going to be a little bit more mentally tough than the, than who we playing because we're going to be in more conditioned and you know, it's going to show the way we run the bases, the way we hit the ball, our.

Our arms and.

And all of that.

So that's where I would start off with.

And that's how you build your mentality right there with your working out.

But the mental toughness is complemented by being physically ready.

Yes.

Because you're knowing that I'm tight today.

Why are you tired?

Because you didn't loosen up.

You didn't loosen up.

You didn't stretch back to what we said earlier.

Being prepared.

Prepare yourself for that.

Yeah.

And now you're knowing that.

Okay, everything else is in order now.

I just.

The mental aspect.

I got to focus on the mental aspect.

But what's back to what Gregor's hand, the being able to be prepared for the situation.

What does this situation call for?

I don't need you to hit a home run, just hit a fly ball.

Yes, yes, yes, exactly.

Ethan, you.

You spent a lot of time as a pitcher in the later parts of your career, and you're in a tough game now.

You're looking at maybe being a coach here before too long and draw on your.

On your experience as a player and think toward being a coach.

What do you think are important things to help keep your pitchers head on and keep your pitchers together in a high pressure game like a postseason or an end?

Well, I mean, a huge thing is having confidence in the players behind you.

And I was not a. I was not a strikeout pitcher by any means, and I played on a lot of teams.

I'm sorry if you also played on those teams, but I played on a lot of teams with not surehanded fielders.

So I'll put it.

To put it nicely, I just.

I didn't have a lot of confidence.

And unfortunately, I played on a lot of teams where there really wasn't another guy to go to, so I didn't really have a choice, which was fine.

And I think I learned a lot of mental toughness through that and knowing that at the end of the day, there's something bigger and, you know, it's, you know, it's not the end of the world.

But at the same time, you know, you got to be able to, like you're saying, breathe and stay calm.

But what I'm hearing more than anything is it's preseason preparation that really determines any of this preparation.

Physically, mentally, strategically, that, all of that.

And when I look back on my playing career and how I would apply this, I played on a lot of teams that just were unprepared to be in tournaments.

And so, so I.

And it's a shame to put it like this.

I can't think of a tournament that I ever walked into with a team where we went, yeah, we could win this, which means we shouldn't have been there.

Right.

And not to say that we can never play tournaments, but why would you play in a tournament that you don't think you can win?

Right.

If you don't think you can win, then step back and prepare.

And so I played, I played a lot of games that lacked intensity and lacked confidence because we just shouldn't have been there.

We just weren't ready.

Maybe we could have been if we had prepared more.

But that's what I'm taking away from this, is the emphasis on, well, I put a star next to mindset because that matters.

But that goes hand in hand with self awareness of yourself and your team.

Yeah.

You have to be realistic of where you are to know if you can be there or not.

So, so that, that's what I go back to is, you know, if I coach in the future, there's, there's, there's so much more emphasis that needs to be put on even before the season starts in that off season.

And then you just got to be real with yourself.

And if you're not there, that's fine.

Not everyone is going to be there, you know, so quickly.

So, so figure out where you are and how to get better from there rather than just constantly banging your head against the tournament dugout thinking that that's where you're supposed to be and you're not.

Yeah, I have to.

And Ethan is spot on with that.

And as I've gotten older, I'm starting to see a lot of stuff, man, that maybe kids aren't at this level.

Okay.

Yeah.

And it's okay if they are at this level.

And for me as a coach, because I've been in real travel baseball, I played at this level.

I mean, we coached at this level.

This all I knew.

Okay.

But when I started mdni, I start to see that the kids are at this level.

There's so much pressure put on them and all levels that I think parents and as a coach, you got to really come back and circle back around and get your ego out of the way and say, hey, maybe your team, maybe they're at this level.

And that's okay.

That's okay.

But you have to.

But if you're going to what I've found out that you have to have a philosophy to develop them to get to a certain, to that level.

Okay.

And, and if those kids buy into what you're selling.

They're going to do it at home, they're going to do it on their own time, and then that's how you're going to circle back around and kids buy in and then you'll see them getting better.

Well, the other thing is, you know, getting them to a higher level may very well take more than one season.

So you have to have the ability to hold your team together.

You can't have it fall apart at the end of every season.

But one thing as a, as a coach or a manager, I would not tolerate is lack of hustle.

Because it doesn't take talent to hustle.

No.

So you may make a mental or physical error, but if you're not hustling, you're coming out of the game.

Because I said I didn't take you out, you took yourself out.

Yeah.

And so.

But it's going to let the other kids know that, that, that's not going to be tolerated.

And that's the number one thing.

You got to hustle when you're on the field.

Being on time is also important, but we gotta hustle out there.

Yeah.

And kind of along the lines of what you're saying is that players are just at different levels.

Yes.

If you were to take snippets out of any given podcast, I think you could deduce that we hate tournaments.

And that's not necessarily true.

No, it's not.

There's a difference between a well prepared team who was ready to win a tournament and a team who's just doing it because everybody else does it.

Every time I played a Flames team, they expected to win that game every single time.

That.

That is one of.

That is one of the few organizations around here that hasn't been watered down.

There's just an expectation and.

Yeah, I don't know.

I just, we just, I just played on teams that weren't ready and I think that we just need to prepare more.

Even beyond that, every time you played a Flames team, we all expected that they would win.

That's the thing.

Like, they were so successful.

Yeah.

Everybody expected they would win.

Back to that word mindset.

Yes.

But I use tournaments as a test to see how much they've grown.

Yes, exactly.

So I think there's a place for it because, I mean, you know, like three, five, seven game series, it's not really realistic at the youth level.

So there's, there is, there is a place for that, especially if you want to see how you measure up and if you're good enough to.

And you're Going to practice two and three times a week, and you're good enough to seriously compete in a tournament every weekend?

Sure, by all means, you know, whatever, but.

But that's.

I just don't see that in the majority of teams out there.

And I can 100% say that was not the case for any team I ever played.

Ethan is more than my podcast partner.

He's my son.

And like every baseball parent, my first priority was his development as a player.

Every year, we'd start out with a new coach and a new team making new promises, only to end up playing the same old tournaments with little to no practice in between.

You know what I'm talking about.

That's why I'm so thankful that we found MDNI Academy.

I first met Coach Rick over a decade ago when Ethan was just a kid.

And I'll never forget the relief I felt watching his first lesson.

I knew right then that no matter what team he played for, my son would have amazing, consistent instruction from someone who cared.

Rick has trained baseball and softball players at the select, travel, and even college levels, so I knew that Ethan could continue his excellence through training approach.

For his whole baseball career.

He learned hitting, pitching, catching, fielding, and more all in one place.

Most of all, he learned to love the greatest game in the world and how to play it with character and integrity.

So if you're wearing yourself out running all over town to multiple teachers or worse, you're counting on that new select coach to actually develop your child.

You need to check out MDNI Academy today.

Go to mdaiacademy.com and contact Coach Rick to learn how you can get all the baseball instruction you need from someone who cares about your favorite player as much as you do at MDNI Academy.

All right, so we're gonna wrap up today with just a little bit of postseason fun.

Got a little, got a little who's the hero today?

And we're gonna, we're gonna see what you guys know about postseason stuff.

We gotta put another trivia whooping on George here.

No, I was in.

That was.

See if George can catch him.

Now, a lot of this, A lot of this is stuff that, that happened when either George was young and watching baseball or George was playing baseball.

So a lot of this is before us.

Do we get a head start?

No.

Can I get like a two point head?

George might have a, have a little bit of an advantage here.

I give you zero to start.

All right, all right, all right.

So we're going to talk about postseason.

I've just picked some, several fun Facts.

And we're going to see what everybody knows.

So number one, who threw the only.

And there's only been one.

Who threw the only World Series game?

He did.

Don Larson.

Everybody knew that one.

Against whom?

Dodgers.

Okay, so I warmed you up.

Easy.

Oh, I thought that was.

I know everybody.

That was a little sprint pole to pole there, buddy.

Okay, now are we doing a who answers first?

No, I think you have to.

Otherwise George is just going to like spontaneously combust over there.

All right, I want some duct tape for.

Do you want a Red Bull first?

Yeah, give me a Red Bull.

All right, here we go.

How many postseason no hitters have been thrown in Major league baseball history?

One.

Yeah, I'll go with one.

Three.

Oh, nobody.

One was Don Larson.

Yeah.

Oh, what's the.

Was it another.

Okay, it would say Philly.

They're during Ethan's lifetime.

Oh, actually they're during when you would have been watching baseball and knowing what's going on.

That's a good one.

I don't keep stats of pictures.

2010.

2010.

Was it Reds involved?

Oh no, he's a diamondback.

Was it Madison?

Boom Gardner?

Nope.

Nah, he's.

You call you, you call out the Diamondback all the time.

Diamondback?

A Diamondback.

Who?

Arizona Diamondback.

Roy Halliday.

Yeah, that's.

Oh yeah, he's one of Ethan's favorites.

That's why the Blue Jays, Toronto.

Yeah.

And then the last One was not one person, but the Houston Astros combined for 1 in 20, 22 in the World Series.

All right.

There have been 16 World Series walk off home runs in major league history, but only two have ended the entire series.

Who hit them?

Carter?

Nope.

Yes.

Which Carter?

President Carter.

Joe.

Joe Carter.

No, I said Carter.

You didn't say name is Joe Carter.

And then probably the.

The best known walk off of all time.

Oh, I know.

It was in the 50s.

Bobby.

Bobby.

Nope, it wasn't Bobby Thompson.

Okay.

That wasn't the World Series.

Oh, oh, that.

That was a playoffs.

My fault ended the World Series.

It had to be second basin Pittsburgh Pirates.

Oh yes, Bill.

Mah.

I'm giving that to Rick.

Yes, Bill.

Mask against the Yankees.

60s against the Yankees.

There you go.

The Jankies.

Look at you.

All right, how many straight steals?

And we're talking straight steals now.

How many straight steals have there been in the world in World Series games in major league history?

I wasn't one of them.

So I don't know.

I'm gonna get straight.

Let me.

Let me ask.

Let me ask it.

This would be.

Let me ask it this way.

Let me ask it this way.

There have been five.

There have been five straight steals of home.

Oh, five guys who had a straight steal of home.

So one has got to be Jackie Robinson.

Yeah.

Can you name the Jackie Robinson?

Yeah.

Series.

Willie McGee.

Willie McGee.

No.

Coleman.

No, I mean Ricky Henderson.

At least one of them.

Nah.

Yeah.

Ricky Anderson didn't show up on this list at all.

L. Brock.

Nope.

One guy did it twice, but that was in 20.

Oh, was it R K?

Okay.

Let me give you some years.

Okay, These are all old.

That's.

These are old.

You guys are.

Oh, was it Ty Cob?

Yes.

Okay.

Oh, yeah, I remember that.

1909, man.

I seen that.

It's a Fuzzy George was.

Boy.

Yeah.

And then these other guys, I had never even heard of them.

So that's.

His name was Bob Musil.

No.

And I never heard.

I had never heard, but not.

Okay.

And then one was a Monty Irvin in 19.

Cleveland could be Monty Irving.

I don't remember.

Or dog.

Or giants.

Giants.

1.

So those are the guys who head straight now.

Le off.

Dad.

I told you.

I gave you this.

I gave you the pull to pole sprint early on.

Man, these things, this is.

There's some intense stuff.

Yeah.

All right, here's an easy.

I should have two.

They got a half from Ethan.

Here's.

Here's an easy one.

What team has scored the most postseason runs?

Yeah.

Major league.

Why'd you hesitate?

What team?

What team?

Okay, what manager has won the most postseason wins in major league history?

Joe Tory.

You got it.

Yankees.

Yeah.

Yeah.

He has 84 wins in the postseason.

Yes.

Man, that's pretty good.

All right, we only got about three more here.

Okay.

Okay, what team has lost the most postseason games in major league?

Buffalo Bill.

Oh.

Oh.

Kansas City Royals.

Nope.

Is it also the Yankees?

It is also.

Oh, my God.

They have scored the most runs, they have won the most games, and they have lost the most because they played the most.

Yeah.

They lost 184 games in the postseason.

Terrible.

Okay, here we go.

Four players are tied for the most World Series MVP awards.

Reg Jackson.

Okay.

Yeah.

That's when I. Reg Jackson's one of them.

But Let me, let me, let me.

So four players are tied for the most MVP awards.

Okay, so they all have the same.

What is that number, first of all?

Oh, got to be 7, 8, 3.

Probably each one of them got the MVP.

How many times?

Like, what are they tied at?

Oh, going with three.

I'm going to go with three.

Yeah, that's what.

I'll go with three.

Three.

Yeah, it's two.

It's two.

Okay.

Can you name them?

One is Reggie Jackson.

Reggie Jackson.

There's three more.

Mickey Mantle.

These are.

These are.

Yeah, these are primary guys.

Corey Seeger.

Corey Seeger is the second.

Oh, yeah, that's right.

With the Dodgers and with Texas.

Right.

Yeah, he's a man.

So Reggie Jackson, Corey Seeger.

There's two more.

And these guys, major legends.

Babe Ruth.

Okay, I'll give you there.

Lou Gehrig.

I was about to say Lou Gehrig.

No.

Which.

Mariano?

No, these are.

These are classic ERA guys.

These are guys who played just before George or during George.

Oh, wouldn't be Kurt?

Joe Morgan.

No.

Oh, no, that was.

They're both pitchers.

Oh, Nolan.

No, no, no, no, no.

Sandy Koufax is 13 on Jim Palmer.

It's not Jim Palmer.

Not Jim.

It's a pitcher picture.

Pitcher.

Is he ambidextrous?

He was a Cardinal.

Bob gets him.

He was.

Bob knocked you guys out.

Mama gonna knock you out.

Good job.

All right, so this one, what pitcher pitched three times and threw two shutouts in one World Series?

Danny McLean.

No, he pitched three games in the.

In the series.

Two of them were.

Were shutouts.

Thought he said shut up.

I want to say Sandy Koufax.

You would be right if you did.

But he didn't say it.

He didn't say it.

I don't remember which game it was.

I don't remember which year it was.

I didn't write it down.

It was in the 660s.

Yeah.

Minnesota.

He pitched game two, game five and game seven.

And game five and seven were shutouts.

Is that the same.

You know what college he went to?

Because he's Jewish.

You see?

Yes, you see.

You know what position he played?

Picture first base.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It was a first baseman at all.

You see?

Interesting.

Yeah, it was.

All right.

The last one who threw eight.

Eight.

Can you believe it?

Two thirds complete games, including three in one World Series.

Yeah.

81 total innings.

Yeah.

In multiple World Series.

Bob Gibson.

Yep.

The Bob.

The Bob.

The Bob.

Wow.

That single steps Blew my mind.

That's crazy.

The man, through eight complete World Series.

Games, just nobody hit when he pitched.

That's, that's the excuse.

But I mean, like, what is it?

Were they just.

Were they intimidated?

Could they not see it?

What was it?

They were intimidated.

So they didn't see it.

Okay.

Cuz they.

He would come inside on you.

Yeah, but I wonder what his fastball was back then.

I just know it.

The location.

He would put one underneath your chin, they'll slide away.

Because when we played the Astros, they had Don Wilson, Larry Durker, the guys who threw hard, and Willie Mason.

Those guys said, you can think out there, but don't go out there.

And so that means that don't look out there because the next pitch is going to be up and in.

So we had a guy.

Ah, we're not going to.

He got that defied what they said.

So he looked out there and the guy hit him right in the forehead.

Oh, my goodness.

So he looked like a unicorn.

That's great.

He never, Bob Gibson never threw less than eight innings in a World Series appearance.

That is crazy.

It goes 8, 10, 9, 9, 9, 9.

Isn't that crazy?

He was the starter and relief had.

A record of 7, 7 and 2 with an ERA of 1.89.

With that guy, 92 strikeouts.

I mean, you talk about.

Absolutely.

That's a good se.

That's a good season for a reliever just in the World Series.

So that's.

I would like to go back and.

Find out, like, okay, what was your workout regimen for.

For keeping your arms sound like that.

You know, that's the key.

Well, seriously, go back with those guys.

Yes, of course.

Gibson, all those guys who threw in those days, how did they recover?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because I always say that if you go back to the past, it could help us with our, with the future.

They don't want to rely on the past.

That's the sad part about it.

They think they know it.

Yeah.

You take a guy like Bob Gibson, like the, the other thing I'm wondering is part of his dominance, much like Nolan Ryan, you know that you can go out there and face him in the first inning and you can go out there and face him in the seventh inning or the eighth inning and he's still going to be tough.

Like you're not worried about.

Okay.

If we get him to the seventh or eighth, he's going to start coming apart and then we can hit him.

No, like he was still dominant.

You got to get it.

If you're going to get him, you got to get him early.

Yeah, well, that's, and that's the thing.

The, the, the new, the new thought process is don't let him turn the lineup over because guys have seen you.

Okay, I get that, that, that makes logical sense, but then apply that to, to the past.

It didn't matter.

So regardless of your, what you think is a better option to let them pitch or to pull them early, regardless of what you think is better, those guys were throwing all those innings in spite of the fact that they were facing the same guys three and four times in a game.

That's impressive.

But another minimum plus is that you had guys who were coaching that had played the game.

So now you, you bring in a pitching coach.

The best pitching coach is the guy who, who was catching.

Right.

Because he's on both sides been a batter, been a catcher.

So I saw the other day they were throwing McLean fastballs up and away.

Two fastballs up and away.

He didn't even touch it.

Then guess what?

He threw him a slide, a breaking ball inside, got a base hit down left field line.

So they're trying to get too smart.

Just go with what you see that he can't do.

Yeah, yeah, that's.

That.

As I was looking through these, these stats, I was just blown away.

No, I didn't.

How many times Bob Gibson's name comes up for what's crazy and just how unbelievably dominant he was, you know, for as, for as amazing a career as Nolan Ryan had.

When you start looking at World Series stats, he doesn't show up very often because he wasn't on a lot of World Series teams.

He was a guy out there, you know, holding it down, getting it done by on his own.

It's like Mario Soto.

Yeah, yeah, very much.

Yeah, very much like that.

So, you know, but Bob Gibson had the fortune to be on world class caliber teams with those, those Cardinals teams.

And yet.

So he made the most of every opportunity he had.

And my God, he shows up all the time.

I think they were in 11.

They won 11.

Could be.

I don't know.

Yeah, I was talking to.

When the Cardinals were in, how many.

Did you guys win?

7.

Said nope.

111.

Wow.

So, I mean, but we look at what the Yankees have done, then the Cardinals have done.

Well, you know, the Yankees are just, my gosh.

But the Dodgers.

But with the, with Steinbrenner and probably guys before then, is that their mindset?

We're going to win.

We got to get whatever players we need.

We're going to win.

Yes, we'll buy a team.

And they still have that mindset too.

And that's the other thing I'm thinking.

But they don't know how to go out and get the players.

Now they're, you have guys on the Yankees.

They're not, they don't, they're not intimidating like before.

Well, I'm thinking like, you know, okay, so let's go back to young, young George Foster who in LA growing up as a kid and your hometown team has Don Drysdale and Sandy Koufax and.

You know, I mean Mari Wells and more.