In this episode of Worlds Collide, I sit down with Emma, a British expat who's navigating the thrills and challenges of life in Dubai. Emma's story takes us on a riveting ride through her decision to move during the pandemic, the complexities of pregnancy and healthcare in the UAE, and the daring leap into entrepreneurship as a new mom.

From the dizzying heights of skyscrapers to the shifting sands of the desert, Emma shares the nuances of expat life in a city known for its opulence and ambition. She discusses the unexpected twists of starting a family without a marriage certificate, and setting up a business in the bustling economic hub.

Join us as we explore the safety and social dynamics of Dubai, the pressures of the cost of living, and the vibrant community that emerges in this land of dreams.

You can find Emma's online store and Podcast nextofkin here.

If you're contemplating a move to Dubai, or if Emma's entrepreneurial spirit has sparked your curiosity, this episode is a must-listen. For more insights and stories from expats like Emma, reach out to us at worldscollide123pod@gmail.com or follow us on Instagram @worldscollidepod. Don't miss out on more content on TikTok and Threads!

Remember to support Worlds Collide by leaving a five-star review, and stay tuned for more tales from those who've dared to venture beyond their borders. Until next time, keep exploring and embracing the world, one conversation at a time.

This is the CBS News Article on Cloud Seeding here.

Keywords: British Expat, Dubai, UAE, Pandemic Move, Unmarried Pregnancy, Healthcare, Entrepreneurship, Business Owner, Nanny Culture, Cloud Seeding, Expat Life, Cultural Integration, Safety, Cost of Living, International Community, Parenting Abroad, Adventure, Opportunity, Expat Challenges, Expat Business, Family Life, Cultural Diversity, Education.

Show notes created by https://headliner.app

This podcast is about moving to Dubai and living in Dubai

>> Viktoria: Hi, guys, and welcome to a new episode of Worlds Collide with me, your host, Viktoria. And, yeah, this is the podcast where I talk to people who moved abroad. And this week's episode is another one about moving to Dubai and living in Dubai. So. But first, I just wanted to ask you for a quick favor. So, if you really enjoy listening to my podcast, then click on the follow button in the corner of your app. And if it's not too much to ask for, then why don't you give it a five star rating wherever you listen to the podcast? Because this would help me immensely to gain a bigger audience and be more recognized. And I think, like, this podcast could help people who are thinking of moving abroad, especially when there is a country they are interested in.

This episode is about moving and living in Dubai with Emma

And now to this week's episode. I said earlier it's about moving and living in Dubai. My guest today is Emma, and she is a new mom and also a business owner in Dubai, and she's originally from England. So this episode is so exciting and interesting. I think it's about pregnancy in Dubai versus in the UK, and then healthcare. And then also the big problem of not being married in the UAE. and then also the fact that she was setting up a business over there, so, which is super cool. And then later in the episode, we talk about cloud seeding. It's the thing where you. Where they make it rain, which is crazy. Anyway, so I don't want to take away too much of today's episode. Just listen to the whole thing. Here it is.

Emma came to Dubai during the middle of the pandemic

>> Viktoria: So, my guest today is Emma. hi, Emma. How are you?

>> Emma: Hi. Thank you for having me on the podcast.

>> Viktoria: Yes, I'm glad you're here. So, tell me, where are you calling from?

>> Emma: I am in Dubai, UAE, in the Middle east.

>> Viktoria: how long have you been there?

>> Emma: I've been here three years now. I was in London before.

>> Viktoria: Okay, and are you from London originally?

>> Emma: My hometown is about 100 miles from London, so a smaller place called Cheltenham, which is to the west of England. but I lived in London for most of my adult life.

>> Speaker B: Okay. All right, so you're from London? Yeah, I mean. And, so what brought you to Dubai?

>> Emma: Honestly, it was in the middle of the pandemic, so. So, in the UK, there was something called furlough, where you basically weren't working. So lots of people in the UK were put on furlough, and we were in, like, a 350 square foot flat with really scary neighbors, and we weren't really doing much. So when a recruiter called me from Dubai, I actually took the call I probably wouldn't have otherwise. And I thought, why not just go through this recruitment process? Process. I've never been to Dubai, so I told them straight up that I wasn't really that interested, but obviously there wasn't much happening in London, so why not? And then I think it ended up being about a six month process of all of these different interviews. And then on Valentine's Day, I flew out and, yeah, I've been here for three years now.

>> Speaker B: Also, like, how did you kind of change your mind? Because in the beginning you said you were not that interested. And then. So what was your decision behind this?

>> Speaker C: I think after just the boredom of being in lockdown, and then there'd be another lockdown and another lockdown, and actually, at one m point, both of our parents, mine and my partner's parents, live close by in our hometown. So we thought, why are we paying London rent? We're in this tiny place, let's move back home to our parents house for a bit. and then you're just back to square one. So the allure of Dubai compared to being. Not working and not really doing anything, just in limbo, kind of made a bit of sense. I just felt like, why not? If I don't like it, I'll come back. But it's better than being stuck at my parents house.

>> Speaker B: Absolutely. And, So what was the pandemic like in Dubai at that time?

>> Speaker C: Well, by the time I moved out, they'd had a really strict lockdown, but that was that. So people were wearing masks everywhere and I'm trying to think back. It seemed a lot less strict than the UK. They were very fast at, rolling out vaccines and things like that, and people just got on with it and they. In the UK, there was a lot of people who had feelings about the different rules and the lockdowns, and it was all felt a bit messy. Whereas here, you don't really question it. You're told, these are the guidelines, these are the rules. This is what you've got to do. And you just get on with it and you do it. You don't really spend loads of time thinking much more about it. So it felt like normal life here, really.

You flew out on Valentine's Day because UAE was on travel ban list

>> Speaker B: Okay. Because I was just thinking about the travel ban that was going on in Europe.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, well, the US. Yeah. That's why I remember that I flew out on Valentine's Day, because that day, the UK put the UAE on the ban list, on the red list. So I actually didn't see my partner for another six months. I was out here totally alone.

>> Speaker B: okay, so he didn't come with you at that time?

>> Speaker C: No, no, he flew out later. I, have a whole funny story about how we found out I was pregnant. He'd flown out and he'd spent months trying to get a job, thinking it would be easy, and nothing was happening. We'd had a chat saying we'll put off having children for a year or two. And then on his birthday, we found out that I was pregnant. And luckily, he got an interview the next day for a job that he actually got. He had his plane ticket booked and everything. So it's so funny how things turn out.

>> Speaker B: That is crazy. Yeah, because I was like, okay, but then how did he get there without a job? Or. I mean, I don't know. If you guys are not married, then.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, he was literally about to go back. He had his plane ticket booked.

>> Speaker B: Oh, my God, you were so lucky. That's crazy.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: And then he didn't end up going back then.

>> Speaker C: well, he did to tell his parents that we were having a baby and that he was moving to Dubai, and then he got stuck. But no, he didn't go back to stay.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, wow. That's crazy life, right? Sometimes.

Did the company provide everything for you once you started working for them

Did you then started working for the company and did they provide everything for you once you started?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. So actually, the company that I joined when I first moved, I only stayed for six months. It didn't really work out very well. And I hear this a lot in Dubai. I don't know why, but people get their foot in the door, that company tends not to work, and then they'll move somewhere else. I don't know if that's a thing, but I've heard it from quite a few people. So I then moved on and I had started another job by that point. So still within Dubai, still within fashion, what I was doing. And the company, in terms of what they provide, they've got the visa. Your salary here, you don't pay tax. You're probably aware of that. So salaries seem quite good within your salary. They'll break it down as well, in terms of, they'll say, this is for, like a housing allowance. This is your basic salary, and they'll break it down further. But really, it's just one salary to use as you wish. And you'll also get the health insurance as part of that.

>> Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Okay.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, but I didn't have specific housing or anything like that.

All these things just fell into place. How life works, isn't it

>> Speaker B: Okay. So then how did you, like, how did you start? How was the beginning for you?

>> Speaker C: The beginning I, when I first moved over, the first company I was with put me in a hotel for the first month whilst they sorted visas and things like that. And then I moved in to a room in a flat share with some other girls. And then just before rich came over is when I actually got an apartment. Funnily enough, the apartment that I really wanted to rent was a one bed apartment which fell through and I had to get this two bed at the last moment and I was cursing it because I was, I don't want to pay this extra money for a two bed we don't need. And then there we go. I was pregnant in the next few months.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. And so you were really lucky and you really, really happy that you had it.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. All these things just fell into place. It's weird how. How life works, isn't it?

>> Speaker B: It seems like it was meant to be.

>> Speaker C: Exactly. That's what I think, yeah.

>> Speaker B: Uh-huh.

So how long were you in Dubai when you found out that you were pregnant

So how long were you in Dubai when you found out that you were pregnant?

>> Speaker C: Just, under a year, I think. Oh, I think I'd been here for a year. Pretty spot on. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: And were you thinking, at that point, like, you want to stay there or you want to go back or.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Interesting that you asked that because most of the people when I said I was pregnant, they'd say, oh, well, you're gonna come home then, but for me.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>> Speaker C: I, ah, didn't want to do that. The healthcare hair is so good. I really wanted to have the baby hair. and I think a lot of my friends back home had assumed that the healthcare would be better in the UK. but with not being married, it really was quite stressful. it had only been legal from the month that I got pregnant and so I did have to balance up. There were lots of conversations, lots of looking into different avenues of getting married quick. But things never just really happened and there'd be a reason for why we didn't go for this or we didn't go for that, or time just went past and we didn't get married, basically. And then it was all. It felt a bit risky. We didn't know whether my medical insurance would cover me. to be honest, I think because.

>> Speaker B: Of your marital status.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. So this is a big thing here at the moment, even though it's now legal, I can only think of one health insurer that will cover you if you're unmarried. So it really is a lottery whether they'll cover you. I ended up being lucky, but we still didn't know, when I was delivering that baby, whether we were going to be footing the bill or not. Luckily it's not as expensive as in a lot of other places. so, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Being unmarried and pregnant in Dubai can be difficult, especially with insurance

>> Speaker B: And does it have any other obstacles being not married besides the insurance?

>> Speaker C: So the insurance, but also we weren't sure for a while how it would work with the births and that's probably the biggest thing, because you don't want to. How can you just not have a birth certificate? You then can't get a passport or visa. And so that for quite a while, that was a big obstacle. And being Dubai, things aren't spelled out as in it's, it's not necessarily that easy. They won't just say, do this, this and this. You have to speak to this person, go to this place. And it's a real roundabout way. In fact, you have to get a judge to approve it. And the first judge that saw our submission, then came back asking for our marriage certificate, which we didn't have. So I don't know what the judge thought. So then we had to submit it again and then we go to the place for the birth certificate and they were like, but you're not married. We're like, yes, I know, but look, the judge has signed. So in the end we got there, but it was stressful. It was a bit worrying. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: And so do you know, like what the percentage is of like now people are that are expecting a child that are not married?

>> Speaker C: Well, I think a lot of people still just go and rush off and get married or they decide to go back home. So, yeah, we definitely thought about going back home, but the thing is, you're going to have to travel when you're fairly late on in your pregnancy. But you can't travel right up till the end, can you? And then, yeah, you only get a short maternity leave here and obviously my partner wouldn't necessarily be able to come for all that time back to the UK. So for me, I didn't really feel like it was an option.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, well, it worked out, but,

>> Speaker C: Yeah. You feel my stress, don't you?

>> Speaker B: Yeah. But like now if you would get like another baby, would it be easier?

>> Speaker C: I think so. I think many more people have been through the process now and I always m advocate for anyone I hear about being like, unmarried and pregnant, not to just go and rush into marriage if it's not what they want, that it is fairly straightforward now. So I don't think. But at the same time, the insurance is still the same. Like things haven't quite.

>> Speaker B: Oh, they have not changed that?

>> Speaker C: No, not yet.

>> Speaker B: Is it because they are just so conservative or just against it or just slow and bureaucracy?

>> Speaker C: Yes, slow on bureaucracy, to be honest. So I wouldn't say they're fully against it now. Like, I wouldn't feel judged telling that to people here. But, yeah, I think it is just the bureaucracy.

>> Speaker B: I see, I see.

How do you compare the British health system to Dubai's

Well, and then also the problem was that you were one of the first.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. So I really didn't know, I really didn't know how it was going to play out.

>> Speaker B: So, I mean, obviously you didn't have a child in Britain, but how do you compare the health system?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, in Britain, I think it really depends on the hospital you live close by. the difference there would be, it would be mainly midwife led, whereas I had consultant led care the whole way through. I got to pick my doctor. I got to pick my hospital. And that's something that's quite funny about, about Dubai, is, to me anyway, is that you go and see all the different hospitals and see all the different doctors and choose which one you like. I already had a doctor that I liked, so I didn't really go through that. But as a Brit, that seems quite strange because you would just get whoever you're given in. Right?

>> Speaker B: Right.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. So also, I expect a bit of luxury. If I'm going to birth a baby, I want to be in my own room that night and I want to stay for a few days and make sure everything's okay. Whereas that in the UK, you wouldn't necessarily get. You'd be on a ward with other people and that. Yeah. That would just never appeal to me.

>> Speaker B: Yes. And the whole, pregnancy, the care for you and for the baby, I.

>> Speaker C: Felt really well cared for. For example, whenever I had a scare or I just thought the baby hadn't kicked for a while, I could go straight in and be seen straight away. Whereas I know in the UK, depending on where you live, you might go to a and e, but be sat there for hours before you actually get seen. So I always felt really well cared for, but again, it will really depend by the kind of doctor you choose and the kind of, the kind of hospital you go to. Because my doctor was great and he was really laid back and that's what I needed. Whereas you see a different doctor who might want to push cesareans or you see a different doctor who wants to do it differently.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Or it depends on the person. Right. They're all just humans.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Okay.

Dubai really attracts dreamers and people who think big

So now going back a little bit before you even, like, were in Dubai, what did you expect? Like, have you visited before or what was your expectations? Like?

>> Speaker C: I told everyone that I'd be. That I'd be here for about a year, two years, because it was real life. And a lot of people use this term that Dubai isn't real life. As if it's. Yeah, for influencers maybe. I don't know if you have that.

>> Speaker B: Perception because it feels so like one. It's far away. It's like totally different world than whatever, the western world where we are from.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: And then also like all this like artificial stuff they have with all their money, you know, the, the palm trees in the, in the water, the islands kind of thing. And then the skiing of facilities in the middle of the desert and the, crazy high buildings.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, for sure here. Like, this place really attracts dreamers and people who think big. And of course it does attract that kind of crowd as well, the people with money, the influencing set. Like, of course they're here. But what you don't realize is there's just a lot of very normal people and normal families as well. So at the start I was here, I was doing a little bit of partying and like having fun. And now I've gone right to the other side and I feel like Dubai can be anything. You make it, like, if you want to come here and be all into yoga and that kind of thing, you'll find a tribe. If you want to do something totally different, you'll find a tribe. So, yeah, it really is what you make of it here.

There are no sidewalks in Iceland so you can't just walk everywhere

>> Speaker B: okay. But was it that what you thought in the beginning or before you came?

>> Speaker C: I don't know what I really thought it would be like. I didn't have much expectations. I just read about like the skiing and the malls. What I did find strange was that, I arrived and then I wanted to go for a walk and suss the place out. Like I'd been in London, where you just can walk everywhere, especially in lockdown. That's what I was doing, loads of walking. But you can't really do that here. Like you go to a certain place. And so I found that really difficult at the start to know where I should be going and how to explore other than just going to very set, like tourist destinations, like going and seeing the penguins in the mall. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Ah. So what do you mean by you could not just walk? Do you have to take a car or.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. Like, you're not going to have a load of pavements or sidewalks.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. There are no sidewalks. Okay. Got it.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Crazy. I mean, I think they took the US as like their example. Leading example. Because there are no sidewalks either.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. I literally left the hotel and was like, okay, there's nothing to see here. And I have to like get, in a car to go somewhere. Like, I couldn't just explore, which is what I really wanted to do.

>> Speaker B: And did you have to buy a car?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, I think, I mean, taxi is totally doable here. They'll be here within minutes. It's all on your phone, like Uber and Careem and that kind of thing. So I did that for the first, I think, six months, I did that for. Then I rented a car for another six months and then in the end I bought. And it is good to have a car here, definitely. Yeah. They have a metro system, but it doesn't serve everywhere you want to go.

>> Speaker B: Right, right. It's not as. I mean, London is probably like one of the best ones, right?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. Like London, you don't need a car. A car will hinder you. You'll be quicker.

>> Speaker B: Yeah.

>> Speaker C: Public transport.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.

I was a bit worried about how safe it would be as a woman here

And but were you ever thinking of moving, to a muslim country?

>> Speaker C: Like, did you. And I guess that's, that's something that, where I think about my expectations versus reality, I was a bit worried about how safe it would be as a woman when I moved here. Straight away I realized that it's the opposite and I was way safer as a woman here. So I don't know why, people have that perception that it wouldn't be as safer.

>> Speaker B: I mean, I wouldn't think of like, safer. I just meant more like, Are you expected to wear a hijab?

>> Speaker C: No. So none of that.

>> Speaker B: None of that.

>> Speaker C: None of that at all. so at the moment it's Ramadan and I probably wouldn't go out wearing something really skimpy. But the only times that I've noticed anyone caring about what people is wearing is that you wouldn't walk from the beach in beach wear away from the beach, right?

>> Speaker C: But that's quite an extreme difference, isn't it? I mean, if you were in Europe, say you're on holiday in Spain, you could walk to your hotel from the beach in your bikini vine, but here.

>> Speaker B: You would do that. yeah, but that's only on vacation, you know, it's like, even if I would go here, like even like, let's go to a public swimming pool, I would not exactly go in a bikini to my car. You know? Yeah, I just kind of put on my clothes.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. But if I went to another emirate, I'd probably cover up slightly more. But honestly, I thought that people, I mean, I bought some maxi dresses, maxi skirts to come over here that I've never taken out of my wardrobe.

>> Speaker B: okay. Yeah, yeah. And so how international is it? Is it just full of expats?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Well, an interesting statistic is the statistic of emirati locals here. I believe it's somewhere between, I think it's 13%, but it's definitely under 20% of the whole population here is Emirati local. So there's actually more Indians, there are more Filipinos, not quite as many Brits, but yeah, there's so many expats here. it is truly, truly international.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. So the common language then is English.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, common language here is English more so than Arabic.

>> Speaker B: And also, like, at work.

>> Speaker C: Yes, yeah.

>> Speaker B: And everything.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, totally, totally English. So I was very, very lucky.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. So, and also, like, all the street signs are in English and so there's like, no problem of getting lost.

>> Speaker C: No, no. English is definitely used here more than Arabic, I would say.

>> Speaker B: But was there anything in the beginning that was really hard for you to get used to?

>> Speaker C: I think, we've touched on it slightly, but the bureaucracy.

>> Speaker B: Bureaucracy. Okay.

>> Speaker C: In the UK, everything is very, like, clear on how things are done. You could easily just, google something and it will tell you exactly how to do whatever you're trying to do. Whereas here, I wasn't even really sure how I was getting my visa. I would just be told by my hr to now go to this location, and now go here, and now go there. Drop your passport with this person. And it didn't really make sense to me. Whereas that would probably just all be done on an online form in the UK.

>> Speaker B: Okay.

>> Speaker C: Here they have things called typing centers as well, where you go and someone else seems to be filling out a form online that you wonder why you couldn't just do. Like, why do you have to go there? So I still, it still really irritates me to this day that things aren't quite straightforward.

>> Speaker B: And like, with your visa, is that normal that you first fly in and then you get the visa there?

>> Speaker C: Honestly, I still couldn't tell you because, yes, I think it is. I think it is. You come in on a tourist visa, but again, the bureaucracy. And there's not just simple answers to all of these things. There are people who are experts that you have to talk to, but I don't know why it isn't just more.

>> Speaker B: Straightforward because, like, I mean, I just know here, like, you had to get your visa sorted before you enter the country. Yeah, I was a little bit, yeah. Okay. And then was there a risk, like even though you had the job that you wouldn't get the visa?

>> Speaker C: not really. I wasn't too worried about that. I guess the risk is that for families here, you're never ever going to be a citizen, so you can set up your life here. And I see this happen a lot, that people will set up their life and the kids are in school, but then someone might lose their job and they can't get another job and then the visa is expiring and they have to leave like quite quickly. so that's more of the risk, not getting the visa to start with, but actually holding on to that. It's quite hard to retire here and. Yeah, that's always a bit of a risk.

When you left your job because you had a baby, that was difficult

>> Speaker B: Were you, when you were like switching jobs, were you worried about that?

>> Speaker C: I don't think so at the time because I didn't have much at stake here. I knew I wanted to stay, so I'd found a new job before I'd left my other job.

>> Speaker B: okay. Sure. Okay.

>> Speaker C: Whereas when I left my job because I had a baby, that was much more difficult because I couldn't just leave my job and stay indefinitely. I had to think about how I was getting a visa. If I was married, I would actually be able to get a spousal visa through my partner. But that was one of the reasons I was going to have to say up a business to be able to.

>> Speaker B: Okay, so that's what you did.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Okay. That's what you did. Okay, so you have a store, right?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, so I have my own brand. It's, called next of kin and it's baby clothes. So I sell that online and I go and do pop ups and markets. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Oh, nice. So you don't like have a storefront, but you do like. Mm Well, that's really nice. And so you had to get a business and then you got a visa through that.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

>> Speaker C: Otherwise it was going to be straight home for me or doing tourist visa runs.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, but that's not like you can do for like a short while. But not, no, but that's nice.

Is it only for babies or is it also for small children

Like, okay, so baby clothes, next of kin. I will add this in the show notes. I'll make like a link to it. So I, I'm curious too, because maybe I found something for my kids. Is it only like for, babies or is it also for small children?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, I'm going up to three years at the moment, but I think with this next collection I'm gonna go a bit older, maybe go up to four years. Mainly because my daughter's really chubby and so she needs some, she needs the bigger sizes and she's gonna grow up this too quickly. So.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, so maybe. And then you will do like till five and then.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, till. I'd love for it to just keep growing with her. And then I know what you want at each stage because at the moment I know what you want if you've got a baby. I'm learning what you want if you've got a toddler. So, yeah, I'd like it to keep growing.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Nice. yeah, I'm definitely gonna check it out later as well.

>> Speaker C: Thank you.

Was it complicated to set up the business? Yes. Yeah, it was. I mean, you need a trade licence

>> Speaker B: Was it complicated to set up the business?

>> Speaker C: Yes. Yeah, it was. I mean, you pay someone else to do it and you get the information from there, but you need to get a trade licence. And there's. I don't even know how to explain it because a mainland trade license, for example, if I was going to have a store, I would probably need a mainland trade license. But there's all of these free zones in the country, but there are about 50 to choose from to set up your trade license. So this is where you have to speak to a pro or someone who knows what they're talking about and can give you the best options based on your business needs. And yeah, for me, it felt all very complicated because again, it wasn't just straightforward list of here of all the different free zones or mainlands or. I mean, there's even an elicense. A ded license for, online. And. Yeah, I found that all quite hard to navigate.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, that sounds really complicated. And like, did you had like any regulations you had to follow just because, it's more like of an online store. Was that like a problem for the visa?

>> Speaker C: Not really. It depends. It's all linked to your trade license, basically.

>> Speaker B: Okay.

>> Speaker C: Because I knew I wasn't gonna open a, physical store. Not, not yet anyway. I knew that I could go for a freelance free zone. The physical stores, you often need to be sponsored by someone local or set up their business with them, which obviously I don't want to do. I just want to do this by myself, which is why I went for a free zone. But,

>> Speaker B: Okay.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, it really depends.

>> Speaker B: Okay. Okay. But good luck with the business. I mean, that's, that's a lot of work.

>> Speaker C: It is, yeah. You underestimate it when you have the idea, but I do, love it. I love what I'm doing, so. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Okay. That's great. I mean, that's like, all that you really want, right?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Having a job that you really love.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. And that's where my podcast came to fruition as well. Cause when I had to leave my, last job, suddenly, like, you go from being really institutionalized, working for someone else, don't you? To then being able to work for yourself. You just think I could do anything. And I love podcasts. So I was like, well, I can do my own podcast and, well, I can start my own business.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. do you have time for everything?

>> Speaker C: I don't have much time for myself or a social life.

>> Speaker B: yeah.

Let's go to your podcast. Everything's next of kin

Let's go to your podcast. What's your podcast name?

>> Speaker C: That's called next of kin as well. So next of kin, the podcast?

>> Speaker B: Oh, it's next of kin. Everything is next of kin.

>> Speaker C: Everything's next of kin. Yeah. So it all ties in.

Season two of the show about parenting will launch in April

>> Speaker B: All right. And I will also make a, note in my show notes for this one, too. And it's about parenting.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. So season one that's out already basically follows along my story of being an ex pet mum in that first year and also setting up my business. So a lot of people follow along because they enjoy the story of me leaving my job and starting a business. So season two will launch in April, and for that I'm going to speak to loads of experts when it comes to business and mums that have done it and how they've done it. And also it's all expat based because I'm here in Dubai.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. that's really interesting for me as well because I'm also an expat mom. So how do you do then? Childcare? Ah.

>> Speaker C: okay. Yeah. This is quite interesting in Dubai because there's a real nanny culture here, so it's very normal to have a nanny. We. So I felt really against it for some reason. I didn't want a nanny at all. I wanted her, to go to a nursery because that's kind of normal to me in the UK. but when I thought about it, with her still breastfeeding, she didn't want to take a bottle. This child at all definitely wouldn't take a bottle. So I kind of was forced into needing to get a nanny so that she could be with her close by. When I went back to work and bring her to me, so I could carry on breastfeeding. and also the nannies will do all the housework. It's very normal here when you're looking at somewhere to live, it might say two bed, three bed, but it will be plus maid. I actually don't have a maid's room here, but it's very normal to have a live in housekeeper or nanny.

>> Speaker B: So is it almost like an au pair, then?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, kind of. I mean, for us, that's not what we have. We have a nanny who's actually leaving. My daughter is going to nursery in the end, and then we'll get help with cleaning. But, yeah, it's very normal to have either a housekeeper or a nanny who lives in with you.

>> Speaker B: Okay. And are they local people?

>> Speaker C: I would say they would mainly be Filipinos. They might be from Africa, sri Lanka. I see a lot of. But I think they do have to be specific nationalities here to get that kind of visa.

>> Speaker B: Interesting.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. The home help kind of visa. Okay.

>> Speaker B: And then she goes to a nursery, and that is similar to one that you would have in England. Like, I don't know, do they have, like, all those different kinds, like Montessori or.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, all of that. So many different nurseries to choose from. She's just at a british curriculum one. But, I mean, the facilities here are amazing. You know, she's got, like, a sensory room, then she's got a soft play in her nursery, she's got an outdoor splash pad and all of the library. It really. She's a bougie baby.

>> Speaker B: And. But, like, correct me if I'm wrong, are they all very new, their nurseries? Yeah. Because I imagine just Dubai is such a new city, so.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. Everything feels new here. If you think about this, this country is only 50 something years old.

>> Speaker B: Yeah.

>> Speaker C: 52, 51 years old. And most of Dubai has been built, like, within my lifetime, so, I mean, her nursery opened last year, so, yeah, everything is quite new. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Yeah.

Is there anything that you miss about the UK besides friends and family

Now, a different question. is there anything that you miss? Yeah, besides friends and family?

>> Speaker C: Okay, yeah, definitely. Obviously friends and family. But what we find ourselves craving is the fresh air at the countryside to see grass.

>> Speaker B: Ah.

>> Speaker C: And sheep instead of camels and sand, because you can't go outside in the summer and it's just so hot and it's that humidity. So when I land in the UK, people will say like, oh, I'm so sorry about the rubbish weather. And I'm like, this is great. Like, I've missed this.

>> Speaker B: Yeah.

>> Speaker C: That's what I really crave about when I'm here.

>> Speaker B: Yeah.

So is there anything that you can do outside of the city of Dubai

So is there anything that you can do outside of the city of Dubai?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, and I think people forget to go out and explore the deserts because it's so cool and people often feel like there's no nature here, but it's just totally different. Before I. Bonnie. Yeah, we would go and we'd go out into the desert and we'd find somewhere to go hiking and it's so much fun. Just recently with Bonnie, I went to a desert cafe and so in the middle of all the dunes, they'd done a pop up cafe and you can sit there and watch the sunset over the dunes and they have camels there and. Yeah, it's so much fun. So we always forget to get out into the rest of the UAE and that is not just the city.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, exactly. but I mean, you have a car, so how far do you have to drive to get out of the city?

>> Speaker C: I would say only about 40 minutes. Uh-huh 40 minutes to 2 hours from Dubai, you can get to, most of the rest of the UAE.

>> Speaker B: Okay. So that is doable. Totally. To like, enjoy, like different kind of nature. That is not green.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, you can also drive into Oman and we haven't done that yet, but it's only about two to 3 hours from Dubai to drive to somewhere called masandam where they have you go on a, like a traditional boat all day and you get to see dolphins and. Yeah. like, we're really excited to do that. At some point you could do all the snorkeling or the diving. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: That's nice. Yeah.

As a parent, what do you like best about living in Dubai

What is something that you like best.

>> Speaker C: In Dubai as a parent? I like the safety here.

>> Speaker B: Uh-huh.

>> Speaker C: We don't have to lock our front door. If I was to leave my phone somewhere, I would expect for it to still be there. Here. If you are getting, if you're reserving a seat somewhere or a table in a restaurant, you would just put your phone there and walk off. Or you'll design a purse. You could just put there and walk off. I actually saw, I was in a Starbucks a few years ago and I was working and I noticed that there was, I think they were photographers or they had loads of expensive equipment and laptops and they just left it in the Starbucks and went off for a good hour. 2 hours.

>> Speaker B: Oh, wow.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Like, you could not do that in London.

>> Speaker B: Never anywhere.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. So I really value that as a parent.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. And, but is it because, I mean, because it's like fancy equipment, it's mostly because people have lots of money. This is just what I'm thinking, like, or what I'm hearing.

>> Speaker C: I mean, obviously that there is a lot of money here and people have a good disposable income, but people are really hit by the cost of living this year. Right. As a brand owner, I've noticed, and I think people think that we're immune to it here. but our rent has skyrocketed, so many people are getting priced out. So, yeah, people do have money here and they have a good way of living and a disposable income that they can really go out and enjoy things and have nannies and all of that kind of thing is very normal. But, yeah, we're not immune to, the cost of living prices either.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, no, it's, because, I mean, I, mean, it's just I haven't been there. And all I know is from my other podcast episode with this girl from Dubai and also from watching tv, because I remember it was always presented as just, like, money, lots of rich people, and you never, like, really see, like, the normal people in Dubai.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. And it's a little frustrating whenever there's a new documentary that's come out back home and they have the most ridiculous characters on there that just seem.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.

>> Speaker C: They just seem like complete airheads who only care about Chanel, like, with no taste. And then that same day, or everyone will be on the Facebook groups or the WhatsApp groups with the mums being like, oh, my goodness, have you seen this? Like, how ridiculous. But, yeah, we still like the real Housewives of Dubai. It's still fun to watch, but it's not real life. It's not what it's really like.

How do you make friends in Dubai compared to London

>> Speaker B: Okay, so, like, there are, like, normal people in Dubai, too?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: You seem also very normal.

>> Speaker C: I promise. I'm pretty normal.

>> Speaker B: Good. So how did you make friends?

>> Speaker C: So what I found, and maybe this is just as a comparison to London, but in London, you don't really get chatting to new people much. It's just not what you do there. Whereas here, anyone that I spoke to, I mean, even the girl that was showing me the room that I then rented, was like, oh, my goodness, you've just moved here. Like, you should come to this thing. You should do that. And I would be really embarrassed in the UK to put myself out there to make new friends with anyone. Drop someone a message who's a friend of a friend and be like, can we?

>> Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. totally. I get it. Yeah.

>> Speaker C: But in Dubai, like, that's totally normal. And I think it's a really nice way of living, especially now that I have a brand. I'm meeting all these small business owners and I have a podcast, so I'm meeting those different mums and guests that I have on there. And I really enjoyed that. There's, I guess the main way here that is different to the UK is that things are done on Facebook groups a lot. So you'll definitely be part of all the different mums groups here. Ah, I'm part of so many.

>> Speaker B: Okay.

>> Speaker C: And you'll go to all of those kind of events. which I didn't use Facebook in the UK did this.

>> Speaker B: so I remember, like, those mom Facebook groups when my daughter was really little. I did it only once and it was. For me, it was so awkward because also I think it was just a lot of local people who, I, don't know, at least, like, I was the only non american.

>> Speaker C: Right.

>> Speaker B: And so for me, it felt just like I was at the wrong place, so I never went back. That was like, my only experience with, like, Facebook groups. Yeah. So. But there do you have, like, they're all like, you're from everywhere.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. And there's all the different types of groups as well. So you can easily find your tribe among them and you can try all the different events and you'll be really welcome to each one, but you'll probably find your tribe and the people that you mix with. Wow. Yeah, yeah.

>> Speaker B: I saw this one also on Instagram. It's like expat ladies or something. And then they have, like, always coffee. It's in Dubai, too.

>> Speaker C: I think I've heard of that one as well. Coffee with an expat.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, coffee with an expert. Yes.

>> Speaker C: I've never been to that one, but, yeah, there's so many different events here all the time. I mean, I've just been at an event where it was all. It was like a market within a big, children's play center. and so that was done with one of the mums groups called the mum folk. And they put on this market with all the small retailers. And again, that was just something that all the mums come to. They meet their friends, the kids are playing. We'll have a bit of a shop. So, yeah, I'm part of all of these different events these days.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Nice.

So you open a business. So does that mean that you want to stay

So you. Okay, so you open a business. So does that mean that you want to stay? How long?

>> Speaker C: I said at the start that, I only expected to be here for a year or two. And I definitely thought that when I had children, I wouldn't want to stay here. And now it's the opposite. Like, I love the prospect of them going to school with people from all different nationalities and feeling like a real child of the world instead of just from the UK. Like, I really would love for her to at least do a bit of school here. If we are lucky enough to stay for as long as possible, we would absolutely love that. But it also gives us the confidence now that if a job opportunity for me or my partner came up in a different country, that we'd like to try that and would like to explore if possible. So I can't say I've got, like, a five or a ten year plan, but I don't see myself going back to the UK anytime soon.

>> Speaker B: Okay.

When I go back to London, I don't feel safe there anymore

All right. So for now, you want to stay?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. We're here for the foreseeable.

>> Speaker B: Nice. But do you call it home?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. It's funny to think of that. Where do you, like, when I think of where's my home? I don't think of London anymore. I haven't been to Cheltenham for a long time, so it definitely does feel like home now. And when I go back to London, I don't feel safe there anymore. And it used to feel safe because I was just used to it. That's how it was. But because I've been in Dubai now for quite a while, whenever I go back, I suddenly think, wow, I really don't feel safe here. So, yeah, it definitely feels like home, m now.

>> Speaker B: But, So when you talk about, like, not being safe in London, like, what do you mean? Like being mugged or.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, or just, you know, there might. I guess you don't come across, like, a lot of drunk people in the street or anything like that here. Yeah. So.

>> Speaker C: Again, like, there's just. There's just this sense that there aren't people trying to mug me. I had my phone stolen twice in London, maybe more, I think twice that I can think of, whereas nothing like that's ever happened to me here. And I don't sense that there's danger around me.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. Okay. I got it. Because I forgot the drunk people in England, how often do you go home, though?

>> Speaker C: So I'm really missing home at the moment. I haven't been back since last summer, and once a year was fine before you have a baby, but they grow so quickly, don't you? So at the moment, I really am just can't wait till summer so that I can go back and show Bonnie and how much she's grown to everyone.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Do you go in summer just to escape the heat?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. And that's going to be one of the real upsides of having my own business and being able to do that for, so long, because I don't know what I'm going to do here with a toddler. I'm really not looking forward to that. So I want to get out.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. So how do you usually spend then summers? Because you cannot go out. So you just, like, go from mall to mall?

>> Speaker C: Yeah. And there are so many malls here, so many, like, kiddie soft plays, all that kind of thing. But. Yeah.

>> Speaker B: And, like, splash pads.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, all of that in the pool. But it does get a bit, like, you do need to leave in summer because it gets a bit too much.

>> Speaker B: How long is the summer? How long is it, like, bad, bad.

>> Speaker C: I would say June, July, August are, the worst.

>> Speaker B: Uh-huh.

>> Speaker C: September's then really humid. By October, it starts to cool off. But we're just in the best time now. In March, definitely. Ah, February, march time.

>> Speaker B: And, what are the winters like?

>> Speaker C: Winters are really lovely. Something that is really interesting about the UAE is they have something called cloud seeding. Have you ever heard of this cloud seeding?

>> Speaker A: No.

>> Speaker B: What is that?

>> Speaker C: So here you would only normally get about four days of rain a year, so you really don't get much rain. Oh, wow. But they've decided, obviously, this is a place where they dream and they just make the country whatever they want it to be. So they've decided they want it to be much more green. And so what they do is they basically make it rain. So they send up airplane. They have a whole department here that is the department of rain making. And so these last few weeks, we've had a load of rain because they've decided to make it rain and, crazy storms, which is silly, really, because the schools will shut when it rains here because there's not the infrastructure, there's not the drainage. Everyone's houses are leaking when it rains. yeah. So, yeah, they have something called cloud seeding here, and that's been interesting. This, this winter. We haven't really seen as much rain as this winter.

>> Speaker B: Do you know how that works?

>> Speaker C: Oh, I know that they basically send airplanes up when they spot a cloud, when they, they send airplanes up. And I believe it's something to do with, like, electrocuting clouds or using drones and using airplanes. But no, I couldn't tell you exactly how it works.

>> Speaker B: okay. So the clouds are already bare. So they just kind of make them rain?

>> Speaker C: Yeah, I guess so. This is how I understand it, but I wouldn't take my word for it.

>> Speaker B: I kind of look this up later. Yeah, I've never heard of that. And, I think I heard of that. But, like, it's.

Do you get a lot of visitors to Dubai? Not many

To me, it's like, ah, whatever.

>> Speaker C: Yeah, well, no one believes me that there's a whole department. I've got a picture. It's in the financial district, and it's department of rain making. So there's a government department, and these people literally work on making rain.

>> Speaker B: That's crazy.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Okay. and so then when you go in summer, how long do you go?

>> Speaker C: Well, hopefully this year I can go back for a good month. I think I'll need that so that Bonnie can just have some fresh air and run around in the fields and see all family. so, yeah, I'm hoping we can go back for a, month.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. And do you get a lot of visitors?

>> Speaker C: Do you know, you would think that we would get more, but it was. I guess it was a funny time when I moved over because it was very much COVID, wasn't it? This last month, we've had my partner's family. My youngest brother's gonna come over in a few weeks, so that'll be nice. But before that, we had people come over to meet Bonnie when she was just born, and that was about it. So not as many as I expected.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Because, probably is weird times.

>> Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. And we go back so people don't see us anyway.

>> Speaker B: But I was just thinking, because it's such a, famous place and people are very curious about it, and if they have, like, friends or family there, they would take the opportunity.

>> Speaker C: Well, it's definitely on all of my friends lists, but I find it's probably just that bit too far for it to be a spur of the moment decision. I think if it was somewhere that was a, Like, Spain is a two hour plane ride.

>> Speaker B: Right.

>> Speaker C: It's probably a bit different to coming all the way over to the Middle east.

>> Speaker B: It's not like it's a seven hour flight.

>> Speaker C: Yeah.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, that's.

>> Speaker C: It's not too bad, is it? But it's still.

>> Speaker B: I mean, I'm used to those twelve hour flights. 7 hours to me. Sounds like that short haul to you. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I think I got mostly all my questions.

>> Speaker C: Amazing. It's been so nice to speak to you.

>> Speaker B: Yeah. Thank you for being on my podcast.

>> Speaker C: Thank you. I'm gonna go and listen to what the other person from Dubai said as well. See how she found it.

>> Speaker B: Yeah, she also has.

>> Speaker A: Yeah, that was Emma's story. so. And I told you all her links to next of kin to the online store and also to her podcast or in the show notes. So, yeah, check it out. I really enjoyed this conversation. I have to say, it was so nice to hear what you can do outside of Dubai. And setting up a business is always badass. Sorry for my language. And for you listener who is interested in the other Dubai episode of Worlds Collide. that was in season one, episode 16, dean with a super nice ezra from Sweden. So check that one out, too.

Scientists in the United Arab Emirates are making it rain artificially using drones

And then I, just wanted to go back to the cloud seeding, so I just reading a little bit what I found online from, a news source from cbsnews.com.

>> Speaker B: so it's just a little,

>> Speaker A: Part of the article. So it's like it says, scientists in the United Arab Emirates are making it rain artificially, using electrical charges from drones to manipulate the weather and force rainfalls across the desert. Nation meteorological meteorological officials released video footage this week showing a downpour over Ras El Khaimah, as well as several other regions. And so it goes. Okay, so that was just, like, a quick explanation.

>> Speaker B: I will also put this in the show notes for you so you can.

>> Speaker A: Read more about it if you find this really interesting.

>> Speaker B: So.

>> Speaker A: And then, as always, if you want to reach out to me, you can do so at worldscollide. One, two, three, pot mail.com or find me on Instagram, and then find me on threads or TikTok. Thanks as always. Search Quorondo for the beautiful music that I'm using on this podcast. It's called spy jazz. And yeah, don't forget to tell your friends about this podcast if you like it.

>> Speaker B: Not if you don't like it.

>> Speaker A: Okay?

>> Speaker B: Okay. See you next week.

>> Speaker A: Until then.

>> Speaker B: Bye.