In this compelling episode of the TPE Blueprint Podcast, host Joe Fier sits down with Dr. Anne Marie Fine—naturopathic doctor, educator, and leading advocate for environmental medicine. Together, they delve into the world of environmental toxins, with a deep focus on microplastics, nanoplastics, and their impact on our health. Dr. Fine breaks down why these hidden threats are not widely taught in traditional medical education, shares real-world strategies for reducing toxin exposure at home, and discusses the latest trends in testing and detoxification (including how children are particularly at risk). Whether you’re a health professional or a concerned consumer, this episode is packed with practical advice and eye-opening insights.

Topics Discussed

• Introducing Dr. Anne Marie Fine: Her unique background, partnership with Dr. Savage, and her role in environmental medicine education.
• Why Doctors Miss Toxins: Exploring gaps in conventional medical training about environmental toxins and the importance of detoxification.
• The Scale of the Toxic Burden: How industrialization has led to a massive increase in environmental chemicals—now over 100,000 new compounds.
• Training Health Professionals: Overview of Dr. Fine’s one-year postdoc program and resources for doctors to learn environmental medicine.
• Consumer Guidance: Simple steps you can take to “be the EPA director of your own home” and reducing everyday exposures.
• Major Sources of Microplastics: Surprising ways microplastics and nanoplastics invade our lives—including air quality, bottled water, coffee cups, and home materials.
• Impact on Health: Chronic illnesses potentially linked to micro- and nanoplastics, ranging from fatigue, hormone disruption, and immune system challenges to dementia and cardiovascular risk.
• Special Risks for Children: Why kids are disproportionately affected, and what parents can do to protect little ones.
• Testing & Detoxification: The latest methods in testing for micro- and nanoplastics, practical advice for consumers, and advanced detox strategies.
• Therapeutic Plasma Exchange (TPE): Exploring how TPE could become a game-changer for detoxifying the body.

Resources Mentioned

• EMEI Global: https://emeiglobal.com/ 
• How to Thrive in a Toxic World (Consumer Course): https://emei.thinkific.com/courses/how-to-thrive-in-a-toxic-world
• EMEI Global Podcast:https://emeiglobal.com/podcasts/ 
• Connect with Dr. Fine on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-anne-marie-fine-b798796/
• Follow Dr. Fine on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drannemariefine/ 

Connect with Us

• Website: TPE Blueprint
• Instagram: @tpeblueprint
• Subscribe on Apple Podcasts: TPE Blueprint on Apple Podcasts
• Subscribe on Spotify: TPE Blueprint on Spotify
• Contact: Visit our website for feedback, questions, and upcoming episode info!

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Disclaimer:

MDLifespan PlasmaXchange protocols are designed to support general health and wellness. They are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. The information provided on this podcast is for educational purposes only and should not replace medical advice. Please consult with your healthcare provider before beginning any new health program, especially if you have a medical condition or are taking prescribed medications.

Did you know that you're literally breathing in plastic?

All the time and your, your house is your biggest culprit and there's

things you can do about it, which is great, but it's also very frightening.

But today I have someone here that is in the trenches and educating

medical professionals and also.

The general public alike.

Her name is Dr. Ann Marie Fine.

And she's here to break down how nanoplastics and microplastics are

silently invading all of our bodies.

But she's gonna give us a roadmap on what to do about it and, and also just tell

you how this is affecting us right now.

So I think it's very interesting.

Let's dive into it.

Dr. Anne-Marie.

Fine.

Thank you for joining me today.

How are you doing?

I am doing great.

Thanks for having me.

Of course.

Well, we've been doing a little pre-chat and you're a fierce advocate when it

comes to all the interesting, well, a lot of toxins, but I know specifically

like the microplastics, nanoplastics and so many things that not only the general

population, it is kind of unaware, but you were saying a lot of the professionals

in the medical spaces in whole are just not totally knowledgeable about, so

I think that's what we'll dive into.

And of course you have a relationship you like, you know Dr. Savage really well.

You've worked together and he's also been on this podcast many times.

He's technically a co-host, kind of.

He comes in, in and out.

But I'm curious, how do you, how do your guys' worlds

collide and how do you sync up?

How did we come to the same conclusion?

Well, we come from, uh, different worlds and uh, Dr. Savage is an md. He

comes from the conventional MD space.

I'm a naturopathic medical doctor.

I come from the naturopathic world, but, um, we came to the

same place that environmental, uh, body burden of chemicals is very

important for total health and getting more important every day.

And in fact, I would say that we have both arrived where we

believe that detoxification.

Or decoration, or whatever you wanna call it.

Environmental medicine is the missing link in both allopathic medicine

and integrative or functional medicine because they don't really

get trained in this as, as well.

And the naturopathic, uh, medical doctors are the only ones who get environmental

medicine in their medical school.

And I know this because I'm the one who's teaching it.

To them.

And so we do have, um, you know, one school of thought that has some

background in this, but the other doctors are rapidly catching on that

the same things that they used to do to create health isn't working as well.

And they've come to the conclusion that environmental toxins and body

burden is likely the culprit, but they've never been trained in it.

They don't know how to assess, test, or treat.

And so that's why they come to our company, EMEI Global, and we teach

through a one year postdoc program.

We teach, uh, we train doctors to become experts in environmental medicine.

Why is it the fact that there's so much of this, it, it's kind of a

mystery to most doctors, this whole thing about toxins in general, but

the body burden, like you mentioned,

Why is it a mystery?

That's such a good question.

Why is it such?

Because they, if you talk to them about it, they say things like, well.

That's the liver's job to take care of that or the kidney's job.

And it's true the liver and the kidneys are organs of detoxification.

However, just with the rapid onset of industrialization over the last

75 years, we've seen the creation of over a hundred thousand new chemicals

that we didn't have to, we didn't have before in our environment.

And they are, uh, showing up inside of us and they are wreaking havoc.

On our bodies, on our physiology, on our immune system, on our endocrine system.

So many people have trouble with hormones and um, and fatigue.

People are super tired.

That's probably the top complaint.

I'm so tired.

And, um, one of the things that toxins do is they are mitochondrial poisons

and mitochondria is where you create.

Your a TP, your energy.

And so people are just guzzling coffees and um, energy drinks and uh, you

know, trying to overcome it that way.

But, um, that's why they didn't get the training, that's all it is.

They didn't get the training and basically they were trained to treat symptoms

and so they may look at, um, some of these symptoms and just try to go right

there instead of getting to the root cause, which is body burden of talk.

Yeah,

you think it's, um, I, I guess what's your take on it?

Are, are, are they receptive as a whole to the idea or the, the evidence?

I mean, I know there's a lot of evidence and, and stats

and just the sheer number of

there's always been so much evidence, but guess what,

um, doctors are not reading the literature.

They're not staying current.

They are so busy in their practices, they don't keep up.

The evidence has been there for decades.

That's how we.

Um, learned about it and, and found out what to do, but I have great hope.

I recently spoke to a conventional neurologist within the last six

months, and he said, um, when he found out what I did, he said, do you

know that pesticides are one of the top causes of Parkinson's disease?

I was like, why?

Yes, I do know that.

Why surprised?

You know, so it's, it's, it's, uh, coming over to that side.

They are.

You know, coming around to the idea that there are things in our environment

that are making us ill, some of these things like, um, Alzheimer's and,

uh, Alzheimer's has only been around for a little over a hundred years.

Uh, it, it was named by Dr. Alzheimer's in 1904.

Before then, you know, it really wasn't.

A thing.

And so we just have all this, all these toxins and

the fat loving toxins can cross the blood brain barrier, get in your brain and

they cause neuroinflammation and other, you know, undesirable things to happen.

And then we go down, then we go down the gamut.

So I do think they're more open to it now and that's why they

are, um, registering for our class so they can get training in it.

They are

Because you're doing the teaching of

Yes,

yes.

what's so interesting.

Yeah.

They are coming on board and they are flabbergasted that they

didn't get this in medical school.

Then they start applying it to their patients and they start

getting really good results.

That's really the key thing.

Um, in a clinical setting, can you get results?

What is Yeah, that's true.

I mean, that's, especially in their role, they're, they're

solving the now problem, I'm

assuming most of the time.

Right.

Where.

Mm-hmm.

And that's probably why they've been so busy not thinking about

the, the root cause, because they have all the symptoms, right.

That are popping up.

What's the, I I'm curious of like what's, where do you start with the education?

I know you educate both, both, um, medical professionals and the

public, so I don't know if you start in the same place, but how do

Yeah, we really

turned onto this?

do.

In our, um, in our professional training program for

physicians, we have 40 hours of.

Archive didactic information.

And then we have live grand rounds every month for six hours.

And when I say live, I mean live on Zoom

and, um, we, we have our doctors present case studies and then we

invite in guest experts like Dr.

Savage.

And so that's a, that's the time to integrate all of the things that we've

learned, um, in our online courses.

And then we also have weekly mentorship program on Wednesday night where in

real time doctors can show up and say, you know, I got these lab results.

I don't really know what they mean.

Um, can you, can you help?

What's my next step with my patient?

You know?

So we have, we're capturing it all.

We're getting the didactic information.

And, you know, we also offer continuing education credits, which all doctors need.

And then we're doing the, the day to day, maybe they're seeing the patient

on Thursday and Wednesday night, they can have this live time with us.

And then on the first Saturday of every month, we are introducing them

to the global experts who are doing really innovative stuff like Dr.

Savage and uh, and then also doing case studies so everybody can see.

How do you integrate?

All of this information and make it work.

Now for consumers, we have a separate program called How to Thrive in a

Toxic World, and it's different.

It really, um, is predicated on avoidance.

How do you set, you are the EPA director of your own home,

and so how do you, instead of driving defensively, how do you live defensively?

How do you set up your home so that you are avoiding a lot of these things?

Anything that you avoid, you never have to detox.

True.

Yeah.

So avoidance is really the biggest piece is, is

It's actually the number one rule in environmental medicine is avoidance.

And it's not, you know, it's not very sexy, you know,

storing your food in plastic.

It's not very sexy.

But, um, yeah, it's very, very, uh, crucial to the

whole defensive living aspect.

it comes to dangerous sources in our home, like where do you like to look?

Is it food, air, water, packaging, like you mentioned,

Oh, wow.

All of them.

All of them.

all.

But you know, surprisingly, and this is not well known, your air is maybe

the top source of microplastic.

It's both indoor and outdoor air.

And that's something that most people are, I, if you look at the

media, they're concentrating on microplastics and beer or salt and

it's like, hmm, don't worry about that.

We have bigger things to worry about, but, but they can be found in all of them.

And for the microplastics in the air, I always recommend a really good air filter,

air filtration system for the home.

It's kind of a must, you know, 25 years ago when I started practicing medicine.

I would only recommend that for people who were asthmatic or had COPD, they

had some breathing problems already.

And now because our indoor air is so much more toxic than our outdoor air,

I think everyone really needs one.

So that that would solve that.

I want to pause for that moment 'cause Yeah.

I'm a big fan of air filtration.

Do, are you saying like a, a unit in every room in like, I guess like how

does that, how do you recommend how people would go about the filtration?

I would love to see people have it in every room, but sometimes

that's not economically feasible.

So, uh, what I do recommend is at least in the bedrooms, right, and

then, um, in the, the main living area.

Is good.

And then often, or at least the one that I recommend, it comes on wheels.

And so you can wheel it into a different room.

And, um,

so you can put one on each.

If you have a two story house, you can put one on the top floor, one

on the bottom floor and just kind of wheel it as as you need it.

So, but one in every room is good.

and I knew air was a big deal, but I didn't know microplastics in air.

Like I

think that my head is just not wrapping around that

Oh yes, yes, absolutely.

And you know, we're getting, we're breathing 'em in.

They're definitely in our lungs.

And this has already been shown, and we're seeing what kind of damage it does.

And we're seeing that the macrophages, which are the pacmen of our immune

system in our lungs, they are engulfing these microplastics.

And then they can't digest them.

The lysosomes can't digest them.

And so you're creating.

At best, some inflammation, which is never good, or the macrophages are just dying.

And so yeah, lung, um, you just breathe them in and your, your

lungs are, um, kind of the first place that is going to hit them.

And then if you're getting the problem with them, nanoplastics, which are less

than one micron, is whether you're eating them, drinking them, breathing them.

They're so darn small, they can breach.

Through the alveoli in your lungs, it can breach through your gut intestinal wall.

And then they go systemically.

And microplastics have been found in every single organ in our bodies

now, including the brain, including blood, including placenta, for

the babies.

And um, and what's even more frightening is they've quantified it in the brain.

And the brain levels of microplastics have increased 50% over the last eight years,

oh my gosh,

they found more in only from 2016 to 2024, and they found more microplastics

in the brains of those with dementia.

Hmm.

Um, the number one microplastic that they're finding in their brain is

polyethylene, and it just kind of, I mean, it is the most popular plastic used.

We can't forget that,

but I do But I do wanna point out that a lot of people, 'cause they're so

tired, they're going to Starbucks or other to-go coffee places and they're

buying a coffee in a to-go paper cup, which by the way isn't paper.

If it was paper, the hot coffee would just, you know, dissolve

the paper and, and fall out.

So they're lined with plastic.

Those paper cups are lined with plastics, and guess what kind it is?

Joe?

that one, the

Polyethylene.

It's polyethylene.

And guess how

lid right on

And then the

root has BPA in it.

So you're getting BPA polyethylene, you're getting 25,000 microplastic particles with

every cup of hot drink that you drink, and you're getting BPA from the lid as well.

So

love coffee, But yeah,

I'm not gonna,

But you know, that's easily solvable.

You could still go there, just bring your own stainless steel cup and believe

me, Starbucks would be thrilled, not ha not to have to use their own cup.

Right.

They're saving money so they just pour the same amount in whatever

you give them and they don't care.

So it's good for you, good for you.

Good for the environment,

I mean, that's a common, are there any other common things that

Yep.

Bottled, uh, bottled water that comes in plastic bottles.

One bottle of plastic, uh, water has 250,000 microplastics and Nanoplastics,

250,000. And I see these people at Costco just loading up

their carts with, um, crates.

You know,

Where the single

serving?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

And it's like, you know, that they think, you know, I'm.

Paying a little extra to get the good purified water.

And you know what?

That water might have been purified.

But you know, being stored in a plastic bottle with a plastic lid negates any

benefit that you would get, that you think you would get from that purified water.

So that's a huge source right there.

So I would say drinking water out of plastic bottles is maybe, um, one of the

top sources, air, one of the top sources.

The cups at, uh, you know, Starbucks and the other, the other coffee places.

Starbucks is just, you know, really popular.

Um, those are all top, top, top.

But then, you know, another one is that luxury vinyl flooring

that, have you seen it in

everybody's homes?

They got rid of the real wood and now it's this luxury vinyl floor.

It's plastic it's off dusting phthalates.

Into your indoor air.

Another

reason to do an air filter.

Would it be, let's say if you're standing on it, you know, walking throughout

your house barefoot, like is, or is it more of an air issue more than

Yeah.

Yeah.

That you're really digging down deep there and I don't know the technical

answer to getting it through your feet because they do off dust into the air.

Your vinyl shower curtain has phthalates in it too.

It's plastic

off dust into the air too.

Especially with hot water hitting it, then

it's just, I mean, a big thing I know we did is in home is

not put any, um, plastic.

Not like we have a lot, but like kid bowls and whatnot.

Don't, don't put 'em in the hot water.

Don't, don't run 'em through the dishwasher.

Just

hand wash cold and

Mm-hmm.

we're pretty ruthless on that,

Store food and glass.

it's a lot of changes to make, but obviously we, we are the EPA directors

of our household and our family, so

No one else is gonna do it for you.

No one else is really gonna tell you what to do.

Right.

And that's why we all have, that's why, um, that's why we created the

home course for our consumers because we could see there's no good, there's

tons of information on the internet.

It's not all good though, right.

And um, and so that's why we put together a program.

We just wanted to educate and empower people to have good knowledge to make

the right kind of changes in their home.

It's needed.

And hopefully more people are talking about it.

And of course that puts pressure on the, uh, the, the companies making things

not always fast, but at least having the education out there is a start.

And

I agree,

it's hopefully what we're, that's what we're trying to do here too, but.

So let's talk about the, the, the effect that our bodies feel over time.

You know, that we're this consistent, these constant exposures.

I'm kinda curious, like, where do you see the chronic illnesses popping up?

What are the ones, you

Well, you know, the mechanisms of toxicity are that inflammatory response that I

talked about, the macrophage activation.

Uh, the generation of reactive oxygen species, oxidative

stress, immune dysregulation.

Um, you know, the other thing that we haven't touched on yet is these plastics.

It's not just bits of hard plastic or soft plastic getting into our bodies, but the

plastics have the ability to add, absorb toxins, other toxins in our environment

like polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons.

Metals, pesticides.

Um, BPA phthalates, they also have the ability to absorb other

toxins, and so when they get into your body, they canor these toxins.

So you're also not just getting plastics, you're getting a load of

other chemicals that you don't want.

And some of these are endocrine disruptors like BPA and phthalates.

They're absolutely leaching from your microplastic.

And then, uh, you're getting the immune dysregulation, microbiome alteration.

' cause when you eat the microplastics, um, some of the microplastic bits are kind

of have sharp edges and they can like nick, you know, the corner of your in

intestines and cause some damage there.

They can, um, the, the anaplastics and maybe you nick a little hole.

They can just, um.

Go right through your intestines.

And that's how they get systemic.

And of course, your microbiome is important for metabolic

health and immunity.

And then of course there's carcinogenic potential.

You know, chronic inflammation is contributory to cancer, right?

Um, and so some of the things that we're seeing are, it,

it crosses all the different.

Systems in the bodies from, um, respiratory, like asthma, chronic

bronchitis, gastrointestinal, irritable bowel, leaky gut,

inflammatory bowel disease.

They've, there's actually quite a bit of research on inflammatory

bowel disease in microplastics.

They actually do worse with the microplastics that they're exposed to.

And then cardiovascular.

There was recently a study where they.

Um, they took, they did endarterectomies and they took carotid plaque and they

divided, uh, the participants in two groups, those who had microplastics in

their carotid plaque and those who didn't.

And they followed them for like 34 months.

And at the end of that time, the ones who had microplastics in their plaque had

almost four times as many heart attacks, uh, cardiovascular events and death.

So

it's, yeah, 34 months.

So that's cardiovascular.

And then reproductive.

We've got reduced fertility, developmental impacts.

I mean, if it's in the placenta we can, we can see how that would impact the fetus

and then the immune system, autoimmunity and, and allergies.

So it's everywhere and it shows up in all sorts of ways and.

Uh, one of the things I thought about too, as you were saying that is, is

kids, you said there, it's in placenta and you know, Dr. Savage has said

this as well, and, and, uh, one of the episodes I think we'll do pretty soon

is actually about, you know, kids and, and, um, and even before kids are born.

But how, I guess, how do micro microplastics and toxins in general,

how is that especially concerning for kids And little bodies?

because they're still developing their organs and their brain

and their immune system.

The blood brain barrier doesn't really form till about six months, and so

anything that they're exposed to.

More easily can cross and get into the brain.

They eat and drink more relative to their body weight.

'cause they're growing so fast.

Um, they, the babies and the kids, they play on the floor.

So if they're on a luxury vinyl floor, they're literally sitting in

the phthalates and they have hand to mouth behavior with their toys.

And so that's, uh, another way.

But, you know, children are one of the vulnerable populations

for microplastic exposure.

Yeah, I mean, just the amount of toys too, like plastic toys that

are available and things like that.

And like you said, hand to mouth.

They put everything in their mouth.

Like I, I have a almost 2-year-old, so I, I, I see that happening.

Luckily we don't have a lot of those plastics, but are there any

suggestions for parents that you, top of mind, that you would, you

would throw out there when it comes to avoidance for, for little ones,

Yeah, I would say be very careful with the plastic toys and.

You know, all the plastic feeding wear.

And I would say if you do, um, you know, carpets have plastic

in them too, I would say.

Um, if you have carpets, I would say really thorough.

Good vacuuming with a HEPA filter is good.

I would say if you have luxury vinyl floors, I would say

wet mopping twice a week.

Think

Hmm.

be really important to keep that if you wet mop it, it can't go up

into the air so it can cuts down on what your kids or you can breathe.

Um, I also wanna point out that, um, I, I actually have never done this, but I know

there is a non-toxic sealer that you can

Of her floor?

Uh, vinyl

Yes.

Yes,

okay.

That's good.

We'll have to search that up And

yes, yes, yes, yes.

And you know, it's clear, um, probably can't do it if you're renting, but if

you own your own place, you can do it.

Um, so those are some of the ways that I would suggest it in terms of actual

babies, you know, glass, but oh my gosh, the first talk I ever did on

microplastics was at Harvard in 2022.

Yeah.

And it was a very interesting audience, and in the audience was like, um, a junior

minister of health from Denmark, let's say one of the, one of those countries.

And he was kind of young, kind of like in his thirties.

And so when I was talking about, um, you know, baby bottles are notorious

for dumping thousands and thousands per bottle of polypropylene into the babies.

And so he raised his hand and he said, well, what do you do about that?

And I said, well, you use glass bottles.

And he was like, because he was so young and hadn't seen them,

Mm-hmm.

do they, do they exist?

I said, before plastic bottles came.

That's all.

That's all any mothers had was the glass bottles and you had to sterilize

them on the stove and boiling water, you know, and, uh, he was just, his

eyes were so big, I thought they were gonna fall out of his head.

I said, yes, it used to be.

That's all you had.

And so that would be really important, the polypropylene, um, release or

leaching into, because you know.

You, you have the, you have the plastic bottle, and then do you warm up your milk?

Yes.

You do.

So even more is leaching

Yes.

And so you get even more.

So that would be a, a really big one as

That's a Yeah, we actually, and I think it would be good, it would pass your test.

It's stainless steel bottles.

Um, we, we've had those for, for our couple little ones for, and

they're reusable, which is nice.

Just like glass,

yeah.

Yes.

And then it's good for the environment

that too.

Yeah.

So stainless steel, everything is what we use for, for their little

I, I do like stainless steel too.

Well, actually, I will admit that I do love, I think I love glass the best,

but I will also admit I've broken glass bottles, you know, and they're,

and they're too, and they're too heavy to take on a hike.

They just are.

And so then, you know, then I have all of my stainless steel water bottles lined up.

So there's a couple options, you know, with no plastic baby

bottles or even just cups in

general.

Yeah.

Get rid of 'em.

So let's talk about, I I, I want to transition now to testing and

actually doing something about this.

So like, how would you recommend.

Testing for these plastics toxins in our bodies

Yeah, well there are, um, a couple of different, um, choices and I, I like the

one, I like the one from, um, Finland.

Hmm.

I like the lab from Finland.

I think they have the highest accuracy.

I do know there's one in the US that is billed as something easy that you

can do at home, but it doesn't have the same certification, it doesn't use the

same methodology, and um, I think it's subject or more prone to contamination

at home.

Um, so I like, I like the lab in Finland.

I like, uh, measure labs in Finland for

Measure Labs,

microplastic testing.

Yeah.

But, um, you know, there are limitations to those kinds.

Those, they're gonna look at microplastics, they're not

gonna look at nanoplastics.

You need Ramon spectroscopy to do that.

And that's something that I haven't seen as available in, um.

Micro microplastic testing for the consumer.

Yeah.

Um, certainly it's probably available in research labs.

That's how they found.

Okay.

I have to say this,

I mentioned earlier the plastic bottles, liter bottles with 250,000 microplastic.

Okay.

Um, before they did Ramon spectroscopy, um, they, which can measure nanoplastics,

they could only measure microplastic.

So of the 250,000 microplastics, it's about, it's maybe 90%

of that is nanoplastics.

That's why the number jumps so much because the early research

used to show maybe 10,000, maybe 8,000 instead of 250,000,

um, microplastic pieces.

But then they got this really fancy, um, you know, more, uh.

Specific testing and then they could measure the nanoplastic.

Well, the nanoplastics kind of scare me more

It was, uh,

well, because of the microplastic, if you're getting like pieces of

plastic and, um, if you're, let, let's say you're eating them.

Um, you, we've seen microplastics come out in the stool.

That's what you hope to see.

It comes in and it goes out.

That's the ideal, right.

And if it's big enough, it can't get out of the intestines.

Right.

Um, but with the nanoplastics, these are the ones that can

breach the biological barriers

and get into the bloodstream or cross the blood brain barrier.

blood brain.

Yeah,

Yeah.

So the, the nanoplastics are worrisome to me.

I could see that.

And so do you anticipate more and more talk about NANOPLASTICS

as time goes on with this better

testing and more

research?

I think this whole field is evolving because when I first started talking

about it, a lot of the research focused on, oh, did you know the

oceans are full of, um, plastics?

Yes.

Did you know the, and then it, and then it became, did you know the fish and

the shellfish were full of plastics?

Oh, that's not good.

Yes.

And then, um, finally microplastics breached the final frontier.

Now they're inside of us

Yeah.

So I guess what, um.

I mean, you, you've obviously, you, you know Dr. Savage and

you've talked to him a lot.

I'm just gonna say the ob, like therapeutic plasma exchange, because

we've brought that up a lot on episodes.

It's the title epi, uh, the, the podcast.

But like, do you see that as a viable way or I guess how do you

recommend for people to detox?

I think it's a really exciting major step.

In detoxification is the ability to just go in there and, you know, get rid of it,

filter, filter it out, not really filter it out, but just get rid of a lot of it.

And I, I am really looking forward.

I've seen Dr. Savage's published research and I'm looking forward to

seeing more of his published research.

I think this is a really, I mean, this could really change the face of.

What we do.

And you know, there are some barriers to access in terms

of financial considerations.

Does insurance cover it or not?

But, um, I think, you know, considering how incredibly ill people are and how most

people, most people including children, have a chronic disease with the adults.

Um, there's a significant portion that have two or more chronic diseases.

And, uh, the toxic body burden is just driving so many, not just microplastics,

but the whole toxic burden of, um, metals and pesticides and flame retardants and

pfas, which we didn't even talk about.

All of that pfas are so, um, their immunosuppress.

And we're starting to see people not respond appropriately to vaccines

because of the level of pfas in their body and chronic, um, infections.

They've done a study looking at chronic infections in adolescents and

adults, and they compared it to how much pfas the adolescents and adults

had, and they saw in both groups.

Um, the people who had more pfas had a higher chronic infection burden.

And this is not being really considered an infectious disease.

And of course in COVID we saw that the people with higher amounts

of a particular pfas had worse outcomes in their COVID infection

and were sent to the hospital more.

So this is, I mean, I've seen the research 'cause, you know, I look

for it and, and I look for it, but I don't think it's really, I don't

think it's really out there, but it's really becoming concerning.

yeah, we covered a lot.

I'm, I'm just thinking of, wow.

Every, every, I mean, this episode specifically, I'm like, wow,

it's just gotta take action.

Especially in the microplastics.

I'm just, I don't know.

I guess where do you see things going now with more education out there?

Hopefully the general public catches on too, and, you know, as consumers, but of

course we, chemicals are still being made, you know, it's almost like you're battling

what's out

I know, I know, I know.

That's why you have to be the EPA of your own home.

No one else.

The policies are not gonna reflect this.

You have to, you know, you have to be the boss in your own home

and say that we do not allow over the threshold of our front door.

So where do I see it going?

You know, our, um, our motto at EMEI Global.

It's pretty much changing healthcare one doctor at a time.

If we could just educate these doctors on how important this is,

like the missing key to, you know, getting their patients better.

But also, uh, we've also seen, because we have created the consumer course, I

also feel, um, the regular public, uh, is going to become more educated and start

you vote with your pocketbook, you know?

And they're just gonna stop buying these plastic things and start

really buying more stainless steel, baby bottles and whatnot.

Wooden toys, for example.

Um, and so I feel like we're gonna see it.

I hope to see a groundswell of support for this, both from the

doctors, but also from the consumers.

And I think together.

I see.

Just this incredible awareness, uh, coming to fruition where we now understand

that it's not just like germs that make us sick, it's our environment.

It's our exposome.

There's some really great articles that came out recently on, you know, the

anti-aging arena is really big right now.

Right?

And, you know, there's all this biohacking, you know, you can do.

And a couple of articles, uh, have come out.

Very recently showing that you know what's really aging you, it's your

environment, it's your exposome, it's the chemicals, you know, it's

uh, the air pollution, you know?

I don't, I don't know if I wanna say it's a great way to end it or wrap

to someone up, but we are, we are the ones in control at the end of the day.

Right.

So, I mean, at least we have that.

And there are tools, of course, the cost varies depending on what you choose.

And ideally, you know, what I hope for in the future is that the cost

for, for these things can become.

Accessible to all.

I mean,

Mm-hmm.

but at the same time, it will take time and, uh, we can all

make those micro actions to combat the other micro and nano things

we've talked about here.

Um, to wrap, uh, so to wrap this up, I guess tell people where they should

follow you, what you're putting out there.

I know you mentioned the course, you also have a podcast and,

Yes.

Our website is EMEI global.com.

And we have a variety of courses that we offer.

We, we have the one year training program for the, the healthcare professionals.

We have the consumer course called How to Thrive in a Toxic World, and

we have a podcast where we go over, we really dive deep into the research

every month on, you know, what's new.

And what we like to say for our podcast is we know doctors don't

have the time to read the research.

So we're reading the research so that you don't have to.

And then, you know, we, we, uh, we summarize it, right?

We don't read a word for word.

We summarize it and

give it to you.

That's great.

Well,

Dr. Fine, I appreciate your work and thanks for sharing not only

here, but just with everyone, the professionals, the public, keep it up.

We'll be rooting for you and yeah.

And, uh, maybe we'll have you back on, you

know, as, as time

goes on, because.

There's always new stuff,

so

Yeah.

Thanks for having me on.

You're very welcome.

Thank you.