Zoe Bouchard Kanzawa transitioned from a career in animation and CGI in Canada, traveling across the world for adventure in Oceania, to outdoor adventures in Japan. Zoe co-founded Niyodo Adventures a year ago to offer nature-based eco-tourism sustainable travel opportunities in stunning natural surroundings in Kochi. https://www.niyodoadventure.com/

Here we talk about PackRafting, Canyoning, and Sauna-Tent Rentals. Zoe also introduces some great local craft beer places, eateries and local attractions as well as and her future vision to also include Yoga and maybe even plantbased foods.

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Hi, good morning, everyone. This is seeking sustainability live. I'm JJ Walsh in Hiroshima, Japan. And today I am talking with Zoe Bouchard Kanzawa in Kochi. Thanks for joining!

Thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be here. Now, it's a really interesting background.

Can you tell me a little bit about your CGI animation background and meeting your husband in Canada and then coming over? I love that backstory.

Sure. So I'm originally from Quebec, a small town in the north east of Quebec in Canada. And I started studying 3d animation, I think it was in 2010. And then I finished the program started working in CGI. And Montreal, soon realized that it wasn't really for me, Mostly because of the being indoors, I think. And there was also a part of me who really wanted to travel as I think a lot of people, you know, can relate to that. So I bought a ticket to Australia, which for what I thought was going to be three months. And it ended up being four years, nearly five years. So I, I established myself in New Zealand, for the most part. And then I went to Australia, as well as Southeast Asia, a lot of a lot of places and a lot of beautiful people. As soon as I actually came back to Canada, when I was like, Okay, I need to go back home, it was mostly for the lack of visa, I had to go back. But I went back home. And then I found a, a job to teach yoga at a rafting resort in British Columbia. So I thought that's perfect. It's as far from my home as possible in Canada. Nothing I don't like home, but it's I wanted some adventure. So I went to that place, which was about three hours east of Vancouver. And I met my husband that so he was a rafting guide at that same resort, and I was a yoga teacher there as well as doing a work around the rafting base. And so he, he was on his working holiday visa in Canada. So it kind of made sense that we had to if we wanted to stay together, I had to move to Japan, which is not something that I had, you know, planned at all. Prior to that point, I didn't obviously I didn't know any Japanese. I didn't really, I mean, I knew a little bit about Japanese culture, but not not so much. I think I learned When I came here, which, you know, could have been a little bit of a silly way to do things. I did learn a few things before coming. But it was very much learning. As I went back then. So we we came back to Japan, we worked well he had worked previously at that company, which is actually next to where violet is in auto. So we work there. Well, I worked there for a season he had worked there for like about eight seasons before he had worked in minakami as well. And then after we I think we wanted to start our own business because because of several reasons, but the main one being that we wanted to have the freedom to choose what to do with the business. And I also had some background nonetheless, especially in in marketing, but in InDesign and visual effects. So that's also part of you know, doing the marketing, doing Instagram, Facebook, etc. So we thought we can probably win that. So we we were road tripping around the island. We found this place here. And we're like this, this is stunning. Someone should start a business here. And so we did. We started the business in January last year. And yeah, and now I've been We've been living here since so and we don't have any regrets. I think

And starting a business right before Coronavirus. And have you been able to survive on domestic customers or has I mean I would assume that a lot of international visitors would be very interested in what you do. So how has the Coronavirus time been?

Yeah, actually it has been kind of a blessing for us to start the business in January because if we were working for someone else, it would have been very difficult to have any way because obviously there was no tourism. And if there was people coming, it would have been, you know, the people who own the company would have gone for, for example rafting trips. So we didn't any we didn't have any employees yet. Right at that point. So that was also a very good thing we didn't have to worry about, about providing for, for anyone else, but the two of us. So that was, that was good. As far as the people coming to us. We have one of the only English websites in Shikoku, I believe, I don't want to speak too fast. But from what I, from what i've seen not a lot of companies have got English websites. So usually when people come from Tokyo or Osaka, obviously, that hasn't been happening so much. But some people have been coming. And then they they always said that the founders through Google, which is very interesting, because usually it takes a long time to, to be recognized on Google and to be well established. So that was something that we kind of bypassed because there was not a lot of people with, with any other language but Japanese and yes, we have been able to survive on on on domestic. For domestic customers, people coming mostly from Kochi from Shikoku instance, we were a new business, a lot of people wanted to try it out because they they've never really experienced the canyon and the river and that way that you really immersed in it, you can obviously look at it from the side, but it's not the same thing as if you're in, in the canyon and in your you really can kind of experiencing it from below, which is an amazing feeling. So we've been very lucky in that.

Just to pause there for a second, I love how you have transitioned from a life in front of a screen doing CGI, to being an outdoor guide and adventure specialist for travelers in this beautiful area. gocce Japan on Shikoku Island, I just to give the viewers outside of Japan an idea of where you guys are. Let's bring the map back a little bit. And so it looks like if I was to drive from the Hiroshima area, it would take me about four and a half hours to drive. And it's about the same coming from Osaka or Kyoto that area or even Okayama but I guess most people from Tokyo they would fly and even from Osaka it's about an hour to fly and then maybe rent a car when they're there or you guys would pick them up. Is that right?

Yeah, that's right. So a lot of people actually it was surprising to me how much of the the visit on our websites are from the Hiroshima and Osaka and Kyoto area. And a few from Tokyo as well. Sore? Yeah, people are definitely interested in Shikoku i think it's it's just very remote. It's kind of wild. So it's not really a typical, you know, destination. So I think a lot of people are interested in that. And yes to answer your question people usually drive when they come from the Kansai area. That being said, from Tokyo, it's it's very rare that someone's going to drive all that way we've done it before, but I wouldn't recommend it if it's just for a weekend. So yeah, you can you can fly to go to court, idioma airport, and then either rent a car from them. We do offer pickups from the airport. But in general, I would say if you really want to enjoy your time in Shikoku. And the goal is not only to come here renting your car would be probably the best idea because there's so many nice remote areas to go to that you wouldn't be able to access through train or tram or anything like that. So I would definitely recommend renting a car as far as someone coming on JR. Goes the process. The JR Station is about 30 minutes away from here, but we do offer free pickup. So if someone is coming through by train, that's also possible. Awesome. And yeah, so it's definitely worth getting there. It's a little bit out of your way.

But the kind of offerings that you guys have and the the fees that you're charging for the services is very reasonable. So if people can come and stay like how long would you recommend they stay at least three nights, four days you think, huh?

Yeah, I would I would say so. I think there's so many things to do around here there and there's also amazing cafes, local tea that you can you know, you can experience there's a really nice coffee shop. Well, there's many but there's a very nice coffee shop around 5 to 10 minutes drive away from us there's an onsen there is a newly open craft-brewery in the mountain about 10 minutes away from our base. And there is free campgrounds everywhere. So that's the one of the best part about the area is that you can mostly for the most part, if you see a beach, you can get your 10 for free. So that's a that's been a huge appeal for people as well who are camping enthusiasts.

Yeah, that makes a big difference. Because actually in other areas of Japan, it's not that easy to just pitch a tent on a random beach or Riverside, right. I am showing your website right now Neo to adventure great website, by the way, very easy to navigate lots of great pictures. We're gonna go through some of the great pictures soon for the adventure sports that you guys offer. But you're also talking about the local area here. So you talk about onsen, which is for people unfamiliar outside Japan onsen is a natural hot spring bath, which is such a great part of Japanese culture to soak in an onsen after an active day. I love it. And craft beer local craft beer oh my gosh, what a great asset to the area. You also talk about fishing. So the main feature that you guys are using for your services as well, is all based around the river. Is that right?

That's correct. There is three rivers that we go on. And there is the main Canyon is right in front of me right now. Like down there. And it's the Nagas Canyon. And then there's the noodle River, which is the main river. And then there's there's a few connecting to that main river.

Awesome. Let's talk about some of the adventure travel. And I would say eco tourism that you guys offer sustainable tourism because you're not using fossil fuels to run boats or anything. It's all using nature and trying to leave a very light footprint. Is that right?

That is definitely correct. Yeah, that's the thing that we want. The main thing that drove us to start this business is that we care about nature deeply. And that's not only our way to reconnect with nature, but also to invite people to do the same and when there is rubbish, which is quite rare, I must say, but we always pick it up, and we take it with us. So yes,

That's awesome and so important. We have talked to Dave Enright who is in the Hakuba area of Nagano and he's also cleaning up along the Riverside. He's doing similar rafting experiences. It's great to have another area of Japan worth seeking out. It's so different in terms of what you're going to see around the area. And looks like you have some rapids as well as canyoning, so tell me about canyoning.

So canyoning is, I would say our main activity because people are not really familiar with what the other activity is, which we can talk about in a minute, but canyoning is going in a canyon or Valley and then it can be quite different from a company to the other. So it's good to look on the website on what that involves. For some people with ABS sailing, it can be having I've got the French word in my head, a zip line, it can be jumping in the water, like Cliff jumps, things like that, it can just be enjoying yourself in the canyon. So it for us, we don't have a zip line just yet. But we're kind of working on it. That's something that I've been pushing, because I really wanted. And so that involves you being immersed in the nature and then doing some Cliff jumps, doing some app sailing, and all that in a in a safe environment. So obviously with with some guides, which is not something that you could do otherwise. And the view is just amazing. Sometimes we we post work, sometimes we post photos on our social media quite regularly, but even locals from the area who've lived here for 50 60 70 years, they they think it's another country because they have never seen it from that angle or from within the canyon. So we're really proud of that. And we're really happy that we can bring that to people and even people who thought they knew everything about their own town and then they can see other other aspects of it or other angles.

That's awesome. Um, so have you guys had training in Canada for canyoning, or is this something you've trained and learned since you started the business?

So I personally, I don't go on the canyoning tour I usually go in the background to my husband. Yeah, is is definitely heavily trained in in canyoning. So he's trained mostly in Japan and minakami. There's a lot of a lot of outdoors. There's wilderness first aid course there is canyoning courses. And then he's been a rough guide for nearly 10 years. So he's definitely very comfortable in the water. And prior to that, he was a scuba diving instructor. And he's studied marine biology. So he really likes the water, just you really, really likes it. And then so as far as I go, I definitely enjoy going on on the canyoning tour. But I it's just so much to think about that I'd rather you know, have a higher another guide to just be 100% sure that, you know, there's no problem in the canyon. As far as packrafting goes, I'm definitely more comfortable. And he has been the one training me to do to go on the background tour. So I'm never go by myself. It's always with my husband, to guide and it's mostly to translate when we have English people coming or French people coming. So I'm going to be on the river with him. But it's very important. The training is is paramount. you need you need to have training because something can you know, things happen really quick, and it can be really bad, especially with canyoning, I would say it's if you get injured in the canyon, it's way more difficult than if you get injured on the water on the on the river in terms of access and getting out of the canyon, so yeah, it's the training is definitely very important.

Yeah, I actually tried canyoning, not far from Hiroshima city. There is a young entrepreneur trying to get that started around here as well. And even though it was a rainy day, no problem to go canyoning. So that's really great when you have outdoor adventure already booked that you don't have to worry too much about the weather if it's light rain. But then he was saying, as I'm sure your your husband knows as well, you do really have to watch the weather. Because if the water suddenly rises or becomes stronger in safety is such a paramount concern, I imagine, right?

Mm hmm. Yeah, absolutely. And now we're very lucky because we moved in a house that's right next to the canyon. So we have a gauge, there's this one rock that if it's in water means we can't go canyoning and then if it's above the water, it means that it's okay to go. But we always go double check. Whereas before, we lived about 20~30 minutes away from here, so we always had to drive, double check in the morning and call everyone like, okay, it's good to go. As far as the rain goes, though, you're going to get wet anyway. So that's, that's fine. As far as you know, the rain is not torrential. And in that case, it's it's very important to watch out for flash floods. But we're also very lucky in the location because if it's, there's too much rain, we can go packrafting. And if there's too much rain for backcrossing, we can go to another River. And then if that is also out of the question, we can go rafting so on a big boat instead of individual boats. So we have quite a lot of choices. pretty rare that we can so choose altogether accepted, there's a typhoon or if the person is really just interested in canyoning and doesn't want to go, for example, rafting or packrafting. So in that case, cancellations happen. Is that how you say yeah,

But that's such a good way to do it, right. Like, you also can teach yoga, you have onsens in the area. So as long as you plan a few days or a week would be great to spend in the area, then if one day is not perfect, or even the morning is not good, but the afternoon is fine. You can be a bit flexible and get people out enjoying the outdoors during that time. But if someone just comes one night, two days, that would be really difficult. big risk of cancellation, maybe right?

Mm hmm. Yeah, it definitely especially around this time because it's the rainy season. So it can it can be quite dependent on on the weather like you just mentioned. And also there is so many other cool things to do around here. Like you drive two hours away south and you've got shimanto and there's amazing surfing there. And there's a man who's Australian who has a school as well. If you don't speak any Japanese and and you want to experience something, that's also something that's amazing. I've gone and I loved it, even though I couldn't really stand up. But that's another. That's another subject. And yeah, Kochi and Shikoku has so much to offer that you wouldn't want to just say in on the island for for one night or two nights, I would say yeah, for easily a week. Going around. There's a really cool treehouse cafe that's called ID on Instagram for people who are interested. And there's coming up soon as well, which you have mentioned several times on your podcast.

And that's a couple hours drive away. It's not too far. And even though it's on the same Shikoku Island, it does take time because you've got mountain roads. So it's not that easy. When you look on the map, make sure you take into account that there are big mountains around. So even even from coming cut through to I think I was looking one of my chips to come be cut through. I was thinking, I'll just go over to the valley. And I think it was two hours even though on the map is not far away. But you have to kind of go around the mountains, right?

Yeah, it can be 50 kilometers away, and it still takes you an hour and a half. Because Yeah, because it's mountain roads and because the the traffic is pretty slow here. Like back in Canada, you know, it's a it's 100 K away, you can do it in an hour. But here that's not at all how it works. I don't know if it's everywhere in Japan, because most of my Japanese life I've lived on Shikoku so I don't really know what's happening elsewhere. But the here yeah, it takes forever to get to get anywhere. But it's enjoyable too. You can stop, go for a swim, you know, do something go for a hike.

As long as as long as Like I said before, as long as you're not in a rush as long as you have a little time. And you know you've got craft beer there you've got onsens there you you rent out sauna tents, which we're going to talk about. So there's a lot of versatility in terms of what you guys are offering to make a well rounded trip no matter how long you stay or what you want to do. Let's talk about pack raft. I'm so excited about this. And this is your specialty, right? Yeah, I love to I love to think that

Yeah, I love PackRafting so much. I it's it's great because I've been around people who kayak for a long time, whitewater kayak and that's not really a sport that easy to I would say get into because it takes a lot of technique. And you know, you'd have to buy a boat, which is a few $1,000. So I think PackRaft is a great gateway into whitewater kayaking, if that's something that people are interested in, or just by itself is also amazing. So everyone's kind of familiar with what a raft is. And it can be quite a big boat, it can have eight, sometimes 10 people sometimes six. So these packrafts are individuals, so you control your own boat, which is super exciting. When, especially if you've gone rafting a few times, and you know, oh yeah, like now I'm ready for maybe the next step or you just you know want to see what it's like to control your own boat. And then we go through a great two rapids on the river. So the rapids go from zero being flatwater to level five or six being like the Niagara Falls, that's not really you know, that you can't unrunnable basically and then five being really, really big waterfalls and such so that's not in anything that we're doing either. We're we're staying within like a two grade. So that means that you still get a few rapids and then flips do happen so you both can flip but you just in the water and you can swim on the side. And that's also in a very safe environment. So that's that's a great part of it because there's a lot of our customers who do have their own backgrounds but they don't necessarily want to go by themselves on like a disc type of river they prefer staying on flat water just in case. So we offer that kind of level up for people who already have backgrounds and for people who've never done kayaking really in in their life which is also another amazing thing is that pipercross around one or two kg so you can easily carry them if let's say you see a rapid and you don't want to do it you like that. I don't really feel that one. You can just take your progress on your shoulder, walk around it and then keep going.

Wait one to two kilograms because I have a blow up, stand up and paddle and I think it's at least 10 kilograms. So that's amazing. The PackRaft, are they made in Japan? Where do you get them from?

So they know they're not made in Japan, the people who supply them are based in Japan. And they I, to my knowledge, there are no packrafts being manufactured in Japan, most of them are either made in China, some of them are made in Canada, and some of them are made in New Zealand, but I believe they're also manufactured in China. So it's just a matter of picking a good Chinese supplier. And they are made out of TPU, which is the same material that makes dry bags. So it's pretty, it's pretty light. It's not like PVC, the big, the big boats that are super heavy. So yeah, it's great. A lot of people do what's called a packraft, and biking tool. So bike by crafting or so you can actually kind of fold your bike on top of your packraft go down the river. And then when you you want to get out of the river, you hop on your bike, and then you put you back raft in your backpack, and you keep going. So that's also a really cool thing that we want to try actually in Shikoku in maybe the shimanto area, or maybe you know, around, we want to explore and do multi day trips like that soonish, maybe this year, maybe next year, and maybe think about offering that as well, if that's something that people might be interested in. As far as you know, the current situation goes, that's not really something that's possible, because of you know, the risks that's involved in that. So like, you know, say with someone stay with people for several days, but that's definitely something that we think about. Because it's so easy to carry. And it's Yeah, it's so easy to go around with with a backpack.

That's awesome. That really opens up versatility a lot. Oh, let's mention some of the prices. It looks like the price for packraft. Can you tell us how long it takes? Like is it a half day and about the cost? Yeah, so it is a half day it's around, depending on again, the water level, because if it's really high, it's gonna go faster. It's around two hours, sometimes three hours, the whole tool. So from the moment that you come in the base to the moment that you leave, it's around three hours ish.

Again, depending on the person's skills, if they want to stop on the side if they want to do a rapid twice. And it's 8500 yen (about $85 USD). So that's the case for all of our tours, actually. So it's pretty easy, straightforward. It's the same price except for the 10 Sona, which is another thing altogether. But the Yeah, the price is the same for canyoning as well. And canyoning is around the same time, I would say. Yeah. So our trips usually start at like nine and then by 12 ish, You can go about your day.

That's awesome. And it looks like so much fun. So you've been doing this for a year? Um, what size groups can you take? Do you keep it small? like five people?

Yeah, yeah, we do. So for the packrafting with one guide is around four people only. So if we have two guides, we can go up to like seven, eight boats. And then for canyoning is around the same. So the Max was around seven, eight people.

And then it looks like there's some rapids or certain areas of the river where the water flows faster. So in that case, of course, you're just following down the stream. But on other parts of the river, is there not so much water flow? And you can go back and forth? like different levels?

Yeah, that's a good question. So we have basically asked rapids, there's what's called an ad on the side, so the water goes in the other direction. So let's say the word is going this way. Down here, there's going to be kind of the water going the opposite direction. So let's say you do a rapid, then you can kind of step on the side. And there's often an area where you can carry your boat and go around the rapids. So if you want to do it twice, you can always just carry your boat up and then go back again, if you which happened to me if you flip and you want to like the same Japan revenge, so you want to do it. Again. That's something that's possible. And as far as the water flows, it's, it's I would say the rapids around. If they're not right next to right one after another, they're about maybe 100 meter down from each other. Like that's kind of the the further most the day gap that we have in between the rapids it's not continuous in the sense that it's every every two minutes you have a rapid but you have time to enjoy yourself you have time to jump into the water. We also have Cliff jumps on the packrafting tool. So that's also something that that's possible to do with the Lion King rock actually, we've just baptized it like last week. And and yeah, so you have time to to chill, but there's also times where you need to focus and try to go down the rapid the right way. Is that what's happening in this photo? Is he jumping off the Lion King rock? That's not the Lion King rock? No, no, no. So that photo I love it. Yeah, it was a tourist from Tokyo. I believe that wasn't maybe April last year, I believe. Prior to all the lockdown ins and emergency emergency states. So the Yeah, that one is not the Lion King rock. But they the other ones got a little perch. And it does kind of look like the Lion King broke. So that obviously that's why we named it like, that's awesome. Yeah, I grew up in Hawaii, on Oahu. And we have Waimea Bay, which is a beautiful beach. And they have a big rock next to it. And that's something that we always wanted to do is go to Waimea Bay to jump off the rock into the water. And it's such a thrilling part. And of course, in canyoning, you have some jumping off, not as big rocks, but jumping off into the water as well. So it's nice, you've put it as a part of the pack rafting tour as well. I love that. Yeah, I think one of our goals was to get people in, at least in the flow state. So we you're not just walking through being like, Oh, I have this, like, it's beautiful. I'm enjoying this, but you also have to, there's some some level of challenge. And you know, you have to focus on on what you're doing. And I think that's a big part of the why we're doing this is to get people out of their heads and into their bodies and to truly experience the nature and what they're doing and to focus. So that was something that's super important for me and and the the theme almost of my year trying to kind of challenge myself with like I said, surfing with packrafting with cliff jumping with things like that. So we're just trying to get more people out there and experiencing the same thing.

That I love that. Do you ever do, like, because you teach yoga? Do you ever do like morning yoga and then packrafting and then afternoon canyoning? Like put everything into one day? Or do you kind of spread it out with with different groups.

So the the yoga teaching I mostly do in the city, because I unfortunately can't really teach in Japanese. So I teach in English in Kochi City, that's around once a week that I do that that's something that would definitely be possible in the future once my level of Japanese gets a little bit higher, so a little bit better. But that's not something that we've done just yet. We've done some Tent-Sauna and with the package of, you know, going back rafting or canyoning, but not yoga yet, but that's a good idea. Actually, I thought about it like a year ago, and then I kind of forgot about it. So that's a good reminder.

I love that idea. I would love you know, waking up real early, having yoga like on the reverse side doing a little packrafting then have a nice breakfast, you know, and then do something else. Like I love those things set together and because you have the skills seems perfect.

So the actually now we're upright, it's not on our website, but I think that's something that you'll think is very interesting. Now we're operating from an abandoned Shogakko primary school. So we since you know, it's a it's a small town. I think as in a lot of other places in Japan, there's a lot of abandoned schools. And I mean, it's not exactly abandoned, they use it for storage, but there's also a co working space that they've created so you can rent one of the classrooms or two of the classrooms, which is what we're doing and then we've built you know, our changing rooms, everything the life jackets rack everything there and we're operating from that but in the future maybe we're going to want to build a bigger space if if needs be and that's something that I am definitely keeping in mind like a big yoga deck and then the rafting area, possibly a little Zero Waste store like I was mentioning before to you And yeah, I have a lot of ideas on that.

So I'm so excited for what you and Violet are doing for that area, because like violet was saying, as well, she introduced a place on the NHK program, which is reusing the old abandoned school. And when you lose population from these areas, that's one of the effects right? The schools become abandoned, but you can still use the building, or a lot of the houses are abandoned. So you could still remodel our old house that has a great view and make a deck for yoga and you know, a little cafe or something, there's so much potential. That's awesome.

Yeah, there's so much potential, there's so many buildings that are not in use here. And, again, like he said, the views are amazing. And there's so much good material, like it's really well done. It's just that there's not a lot of people living here anymore. And as far as our town go, I think there's a lot more new people moving in. And I think that is thanks to Ken, who started the brewery in the mountains. And he's kind of trying to get some of his American friends to move here, which is, which has been kind of cool. And then we move here, so we're kind of trying in our own way to, to, to revitalize the town and to get more new energy here. And so I just in my in my neighborhood, I'm definitely the youngest one here. So and then obviously, I'm the only person coming from overseas, so, huh, so yeah, it's, it's cool.

That's awesome. I since I have it on screen, can you explain about the sauna tent? I love that idea. Yeah, so we, we've started that last winter, because we were thinking, what could we do that could be interesting in the winter as well, obviously, going canyoning, when it's like January is not something that's very appealing because it's really cold. So we thought about this own event idea.

So it's something that you can literally again, pitch pretty much anywhere on any beach in the Ogawa or around, obviously, so we do rentals next to the Niyodo river, and also the DOI river on a beach called Miyazaki beach sometimes, so that's going to depend on what the person once slash what is what are the best conditions for each beach. So depending on the water level, the water color as well. So we, we kind of decide where it goes except that the person really requests a certain place. So we set that up for the people we provide all the witnesses airy, we provide also the hinoki essential oil that's made in near the garage. So the think it's Japanese Cypress in English. And so you mix that with your water and then you put it on the rocks and that's creating some steam, so it's a wet sauna, it's not a dry sauna, and you go and swim in the water, come back into the sauna, and then relax and we also have a kind of a little chilling area so another 10 that you can go into relax. So we kind of set that up on the spot. We never leave it for long periods of time. So if we haven't a booking then we go set it up. We leave it for maybe one or two days if we have other bookings and then we take it back with us and yeah, everything is provided you just have to bring your swimsuit and towel and that's that's it that's awesome.

So I don't imagine there's much demand in summer although people like to go in ONSEN even in summer. How about the sun attend just winter the colder time of year maybe?

Well for myself I would say so. But surprisingly enough we have bookings in July and August so Wow. Yeah, I don't know like I think it's already a sauna enough outside but that's just me like some people actually around here they even in the summer you know when it's really really hot and it's humid the like, oh, the river water is so cold. And yeah, that's the point kind of thing. So I think a lot of people are looking for that extra warmth to have the courage to go in the water. I think and also like you mentioned people in Japan they they go to the Aung San regardless of the temperature so even if it's fully 45 degrees outside they're still going to go to the onsen. I think it's kind of the same dynamic here where they they want also the experience which I definitely understand because it's it's amazing. You have this little window in the in the sauna 10 so you can see the river from inside the tent. And yeah, it's the experience itself. I can definitely understand the heat. That's something else I would definitely

Do it more during the winter. But yeah, I would love to do it in the winter and then go out and that challenge dipping in that freezing River. But I see the attraction to like even during the hot season like to really sweat it out. And then if the river is cool, then it still feels like a contrast. Uh huh. Yeah. Yeah. Lovely. Let's show your website. Let me see if I can present it from my computer here. Can you see it there? Is it showing up? Let me get rid of those. And let's see if it goes there. Yeah, I think it's, it's on. Is it on now? Okay, so yeah, so you you've got a great website and you introduce some other area. Local eating, like cafes So these are all local cafes. Is there any vegan plant based vegetarian options? I know this is a big issue for international visitors.

Yeah, it's a it's a very good question and I'm very conscious of that myself. As far as these plays go, they're mostly sweet places so you can definitely get some some monju that is vegan because it's it's beans and rice rice flour. It's really hard to explain without the Japanese words but it Yeah, for people who live in Japan you know what it is it's mochi basically with with sweet being placed inside. So that's that's an option but as far as the the meal itself goes Asunado offers really nice options, but there's always one piece of chicken on the plate you can always decide to not eat that. But as far as the rest of the set goes it is mostly for I from what i think i'm not sure about the dashi and everything but it would be for the most part vegan and then they offer also chat with them so they make UDON noodles with the tea powder inside and it's delicious It's really good. As far as ICHIGOYA cafe goes the one that's right next to us. From my understanding there's no teishoku that is vegan or vegetarian and in general in the town, there it's you know, again, it's not really pro vegan I think. If you want to go that route, you would have to cook for yourself for the most part which is I'm not 100% vegan or but I'm mostly plantbased and I have to cook for myself most days here even you know ordering stuff like qinhuai and stuff that's I have to order a lot online unfortunately. Which is very typical of most parts of Japan and us to if we want to vegan there's a few places we can go in any city Hiroshima is a few places but it's not easy. It's getting easier at least there's there seems to be an understanding now about what it is which definitely helps. Yeah, it's actually really funny because the the first time that that I mentioned it to someone, like you said there is more understanding of what it is to be plant based or vegan. But the first time that I mentioned it to someone in Japanese I said NIKU TABEREMASEN mitai na. Like I said, I can't eat meat. And the person immediately replied with NINNIKU WA? being garlic, but since the word is similar, they're like, Can you eat garlic? Because just of the niku word, anyway, so for me, I was like, okay, they like some people really don't. I don't know what it is. And now I think like he said, it's more it's more known and understood what what being vegan and vegetarian is. But yeah, there's obviously still so a road ahead

On the website, you've got a lot of great videos, are you taking the videos with a GoPro and it looks like a 360 degree camera?

Mm hmm. So we have a lot of videos and cameras. We have a drone we have. I think two we have two GoPros and one GoPro max. So that was the big, most of you know that the investment for us was really much in the the content we were going to create because we wanted to do justice to what's around us. So I take most of the job well not most all of the drone videos I take because my husband is scared of piloting a drone and most of the GoPro content he's the one who who takes Yeah, he takes the videos he's either have the has the GoPro max on his helmet or the other GoPro on on a kind of sticks of people, the customers can always hold on the GoPro and, and do that and actually the the website I made, so thank you.

That's awesome. I saw some of your customers, you've got the GoPro on the helmet as well. So you can put together some cool footage after you go down the stream or something. Is that right?

Yeah, absolutely. We always send the free videos and photos for it's included actually in the in the price. So we send it to the email that the the guests used to book. And so that's super easy. And then on the on our Instagram, we usually post kind of the best videos of either that day or the week or depends on how we feel we should get definitely more on top of posting every single day. But sometimes, you know, it's a rainy day. So we don't really have a lot of content suppose but we have, I think one terabyte of footage just from from like four months last year. So yeah, that's that that's a lot. But it's also great to have. And I want to use some of my skills that I that I have with, you know, video editing, and, and, and design. And you know what I've learned in university? With the video editing, I've made one of the promotion videos already. But it's almost I would say outdated now, because we have so much new footage. So yeah, we're quite blessed in that way that whatever we take is going to look good, because the place is so beautiful. Yeah, well, that's awesome. You just can't take a bad photo there. I imagine.

One of the things that surprised me, the violet said for her area, which is not so far from you, when we talked last week, is the WiFi that they have very strong Wi Fi as a way to incentivize new residents to come and live there. How's the Wi Fi in your area? Would you be able to live stream next to the river for example?

Yeah, the Wi Fi, I mean, in the area that we live in the Wi Fi is good. But that's something that we really thought about when we were looking for a house. So that's something that I told them about jacoba, the town council that was really important for me and for us. And so some some houses, it doesn't even have to be in the mountains, there's just areas that kind of pockets of bad Wi Fi, because it's a different place. Different postcode, I'm not too sure why, but, but that's the thing. And also, when I lived in Ontario, where violet lives in, if you cross the border to takashima in the mountain, the Wi Fi would be so much better. And it's like two minutes away. So it really depends. You have to do your research, right, let's say you're thinking about moving in the area, as far as visiting, there is absolutely no problem. You can get Wi Fi anywhere, pretty much.

That's great to know, though, I think that definitely adds more appeal, especially now as people are doing more live streaming. And now that you are on HAPPS I hope to see some live streaming from you. Yoga or packrafting or climbing, I would love to see a live stream of that on apps. Please try it.

Yeah, I'm definitely open to try. I just don't know where to focus my energies, tic-tok, Instagram, Facebook. You know, there's so many things out there. So I have to, to learn a little bit more about about live broadcast. That's actually something we've ever done. And I think it would be really cool.

It'd be really cool. Because you can engage with your audience. People can ask you questions, make comments while they see it. And I think there's that layer of transparency as well. Like, oh, this is really happening. This is not edited. Like this is live. You know, there's there's that extra connectivity there.

Mm hmm. Yeah, I think you're definitely right. And I was thinking about the, you know, the Instagram accounts that I follow that I liked the most and it's people who are like you said transparent and going on live and being vulnerable and, you know, having their face super big screen. So yeah, that's, that's the next step that we have. Well, I wouldn't say we have that we want to take. So we were definitely keeping that in mind. Yeah.

And in your case, it would be really important that you are using a phone which is also waterproof, which is an added tricky thing, right?

Yeah, actually, my phone is not waterproof, funnily enough, but we have a lot of cameras that are. Yeah, that's that's a good point I should definitely invest in, in a waterproof waterproof phone.

When I actually did canyoning and Hiroshima, I had my iPhone in a case and I kept it, I really wanted to take care of it. But I wanted to take photos. And then I looked down in the case is full of water. So the phone was full of water. And I was like, Oh, no, have I killed my phone? And people are like, is that the iPhone? 10? No, you're fine. It's waterproof. And I was like, What? That was a bonus. So I didn't kill it. So there are some phones which are made standard waterproof now, which is very useful.

Yeah, that's a great example of you know, investing in something that's not going to break. Yeah, then it happens. You know, the things that some people actually lose their GoPros on the river, they insist on taking them taking with them and then they take them out and they're like, yeah, like jumping and then it's gone. So we're gonna have to go dive and try to define them. Most of the time, we can find them because it's kind of a little pool and the water is really clear. But sometimes we don't and it's kind of unfortunate.

Yeah, well that that could be like a side business you could find loads and GoPros Yeah, at the bottom as your business expands. And I would love to hear a little bit about your woodworking You said you started woodworking is that you're remodeling an old house that you're living?

Yeah, sort of so we I mean, as far as the foundations of the house go we're not changing any of that but we actually we just finished yesterday the the outside area I can I can probably share that. So we started in the winter to do woodworking because the area we live in is so that's one of them here as you can see is that Oh yeah. Okay, it's there. And so that's all that we've just finished that yesterday and beautiful wood here Yeah, it's from the the town actually there's a lot of, of industries here who do the wood processing so they go in the mountains there's a lot of lumberjack too in the area that they actually I don't know if you can say import for people, but they import people from other areas in Japan, and they these people live in town and do the woodworking and then there's we actually build that straight from the, the, you know, the people who go in the mountain to to cut the wood down. So that's why cool I can show so the angle, I think I'm gonna stop this and then share it one more time. So that is the angle that we have from this balcony. So the down there is just the it's the canyoning, the place where we go canyoning. It's not that place. That is a kid's place.

Wow. So you're right next to the river right outside.

Mm hmm. We are. Yeah, we are. And that's the place where we go kids canyoning, which is also something that we do with it's kind of like a private tour with a family and we can go canyoning there, that's not where we go with the our main canyoning activity, it's higher up but we can still see the world level so it's easy to gauge

It must be a bit cooler there because you're next to the water and so many beautiful trees?

Yeah, it's amazing. And we we've just remade the roof. So we can go there when it's raining also, and it's it's beautiful. I'm really loving that simple counter idea. So you can work there, you can eat there. You can just sit in taken the scenery. I love it. Beautiful. Yeah, we actually found that. Well found a piece of wood. It wasn't exactly found. It wasn't the house where we live. But it was just on the side of the house. Like we're kind of as we rented the house. It was just on the side there. Like that's a beautiful piece of wood. So we just resented it, we varnished it and put it on there. And then I made these these little stools on the side and then we remade the floor the two of us but this previously was just like a huge mess. Like the The floor was rotten and actually when they're a week ago to the day with some friends and the floor collapse, so we're like, okay, we need to remake it. And so we've made it over the last week. But yeah, we're Really that's the thing that I like the most about about the house is the view that we have here.

That's gorgeous. Do you get many mosquitoes in summer? Or it's it's not so bad, huh?

As far as I'm aware, at this time of the year, it's not too bad. It's it could definitely be worse. And as far as the creepy crawlies go, I haven't seen any any mukha days watching one guy, which is a record. You know, I used to live in the mountains, and it was a daily occurrence. So for those of you doesn't know, McCurry, that's a Japanese centipede, and they're big. And they remind me of the ones I saw in Hawaii growing up there. They're the big ones. Yeah, I have a friend here actually, one of the the alts. He, he said the same thing. The he's from Hawaii. And he says that the guys got the same ones there. And yeah, they're horrible. I love all animals, but they're horrible. They want to see the world burn, they they go. They're very violent. And there's nothing good about them.

Wait, I have to say no, there IS something good about them. They're really good for growing vegetables. They're really good for the garden. They are the predator of the dirt. So if we can just keep them outside and keep them away from the house. That would be perfect.

Okay, then you You're giving me a little bit more love towards them. But still, I must say that I have to keep good distance. Actually. I've never been like I've never had a phobia or anything, but that's the closest thing to a phobia that I have. I What if I see one I think about it all day. Like I'm not even exaggerating. I hate

Yeah, with roaches. I grew up with roaches. I grew up with centipedes. I didn't grow up with snakes. So whenever you see snakes here, I'm a bit scared. Hiroshima. Oh, yeah, but they're not. They're not well, there are some dangerous ones, the MAMUSHI snake, the the one with a triangular head. You can find that on Miyajima Island sometimes when you're hiking, so it is around, you just gotta be aware. But just keep remembering even with the centipedes. They're more afraid of us than we are of them. So if you make a big noise or shoot them outside, they're not coming for you. They just happened to be and then they sting you with a defense. Right? So yeah.

I'll need a little bit more convincing on that. But yeah, sure. Yeah. Anyway, the thing is, I haven't seen a lot here, which is great. I'm really glad. Yeah.

Well, we have a few more minutes. Is there anything we haven't talked about that you'd like to mention?

About about the business? What about the area? Yeah, it's just I think a great place to go off the beaten tracks. Yeah, I think a lot of people who come and visit Japan stay within the I think they call it the Gold Line. I believe I'm not exactly sure the term but from Tokyo,

The Golden Triangle.

Yeah, that's it. That's it. So they go from Tokyo, Osaka, you know, going to maybe Kyoto and then staying within that, that area, but I think Shikoku especially if you've visited Japan before and you're looking for another you know, another area to visit I yeah, I love Shikoku so much and I think there's so much potential here and a lot of people who see this place I'm sure would eventually maybe want to move here. So that's something that I'm also trying to promote because, you know, the more the merrier. And, and it's I think that the best thing about this place is definitely being surrounded by nature and and the more the bigger the community that we have expats and and people who have new ideas. The best Yeah, I'm just I just want some friends basically, please come.

Don't you think that the whole Coronavirus work from home telecommuting, staycation work work location. All of these new terms have really been more readily adopted in Japan and around the world since Coronavirus. So in a way rural areas which are beautiful which have Wi Fi like yours are perfect. People can go and stay for a while. It doesn't cost too much to save for well it doesn't take too long to get there. So I really hope we'll start seeing more residents but also more visitors staying while that's certainly more sustainable travel when people spend longer in one area. Instead of you know, busily, hastily going around Japan on the rail pass. I hope we see less of that and more slow travel for sure.

I agree. I agree. We're here to welcome you. Please come.

That's awesome. Well, you guys are doing so much. You have so many services and great products on offer. And it sounds like you're even developing more. I look forward to seeing yoga classes on your deck and vegan eating out by the river somewhere. You know, I think there's as we welcome international tourists back next spring to next summer, I think we're going to start seeing more of these kind of sustainable options kind of develop more. So it'd be wonderful if you guys can get ahead of the curve.

Yeah, I agree with you. That's all things that are very inspiring to me. So we're hoping to, to get there and hoping to get more outbound visitors to so we can show around how beautiful it is around here.

That's awesome. Well, thank you so much for joining and sharing all your insights. I can't wait to come and visit you guys.

Thank you so much. Thank you very much for having me.

Wonderful to have you. And thank you everybody for joining today. We didn't get many comments or questions. I think people were just enjoying our conversation and your beautiful photos. So definitely check out Niyodo Adventure. Wonderful. And you guys are pretty active and very quick in responding. I engaged with you to set up this talk. So thanks for the quick response. That means a lot and I'm sure customers would be very happy as well. Thank you so much.