Lilies (1996): A Hidden Gem of the Toronto New Wave

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In the dying embers of human existence, as the asteroid, a behemoth the size of

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Texas, hurdles relentlessly toward Earth, the world braces for an apocalyptic end.

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Deep beneath the bunker, a refuge plunges into the bowels of the Earth.

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Hear the chosen gather.

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Their purpose clear to preserve the very soul of our civilization, the 35 and 70

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millimeter prints that encapsulate the magic, the emotion, and the dreams of

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generations past these masterpieces, each frame, a testament to the human spirit,

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are Carefully cataloged and cradled in the cavernous confines of the bunker.

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Perhaps there was room for more for friends and the family yearning for

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salvation, but sacrifices must be made.

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The movie nerds stand united.

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The keepers of a flame promising a future where the art of storytelling

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endures transcending the boundaries of time and space, God help us all.

Nathan: 00:01:06

Welcome to back to the framerate part of the Western media podcast network.

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Join us as we watch and discuss films on VOD and streaming platforms, deliberating

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on whether each one is worthy of salvation or destined for destruction in the face

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of the impending asteroid apocalypse.

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You can find more episodes of this podcast on backtotheframerate.

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com where you can subscribe and share our shows and find us on

Nathan: 00:01:31

our socials at backtotheframerate.

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I am Nathan Shure and accompanying me is the extraordinary movie

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maven, Brianna Budworth.

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Sam is out on assignment this week, I guess we'll say.

Nathan: 00:01:42

Boo, I know.

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So he will not be joining us, but we have a very special guest.

Nathan: 00:01:47

Joining us is screenwriter and playwright Duncan Flaster.

Nathan: 00:01:52

How are you?

Duncan: 00:01:53

Good.

Duncan: 00:01:54

I'm happy to be here.

Nathan: 00:01:55

Let me say your last name, right?

Duncan: 00:01:57

Yes, it's Flaster.

Duncan: 00:01:58

Okay.

Nathan: 00:01:59

I, it's, it's funny thing is I've known you.

Nathan: 00:02:01

We've been like Facebook friends for ages, but I don't think I've

Nathan: 00:02:04

ever had to say your name out loud.

Nathan: 00:02:08

. Duncan: Yeah.

Nathan: 00:02:09

We've only met in person like once or twice.

Nathan: 00:02:10

Once or twice.

Nathan: 00:02:11

I was in a play, a small part in a play in Lenny Schwartz's Play Me Three.

Nathan: 00:02:16

And I remember you were, we met down in New York at what theater was it?

Nathan: 00:02:21

And I forget.

Bee: 00:02:22

Oh, Lenny's the Great connector.

Nathan: 00:02:24

I mean, when you have like 5, 000 Facebook friends

Nathan: 00:02:28

and just, yeah, he's great.

Nathan: 00:02:30

I mean, he brings us, he brings us all together.

Nathan: 00:02:33

But yeah, he was he was on the show a couple of weeks ago.

Nathan: 00:02:35

We did our Furiosa review and he was on for that.

Nathan: 00:02:41

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:02:41

Thank you for joining us, Duncan.

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And.

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I, I have a couple of questions for you, but first I just want

Nathan: 00:02:46

you to introduce yourself.

Nathan: 00:02:46

Tell us who you are, what you do, what are you about?

Duncan: 00:02:50

I'm, my name is Duncan Flaster with P F L A S T E

Duncan: 00:02:54

R I'm mainly a playwright.

Duncan: 00:02:56

I've written 40 plays, mainly indie in, I live in New York I've had a

Duncan: 00:03:01

couple movies out there, Strapped for Danger and Strapped for Danger 2 and

Duncan: 00:03:04

I've written on a couple of others.

Duncan: 00:03:05

And yeah, that's about it.

Nathan: 00:03:06

I've seen those.

Nathan: 00:03:07

They, they, they are a riot.

Nathan: 00:03:08

They are, they are a lot of fun.

Nathan: 00:03:11

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:03:12

Again, for a common mutual friend of ours, Richard Griffin, who I have

Nathan: 00:03:16

worked with as well those movies.

Nathan: 00:03:18

So yes.

Nathan: 00:03:19

Fantastic.

Nathan: 00:03:20

And anything that you are.

Nathan: 00:03:22

What are you working on right now that you want to, you mentioned?

Duncan: 00:03:25

Well the aforementioned Richard Griffin has put together

Duncan: 00:03:28

ongoing series called Pansy Vision.

Duncan: 00:03:30

Yes.

Duncan: 00:03:31

It's a fake history of gay movies throughout the world.

Duncan: 00:03:35

Oh, that sounds

Bee: 00:03:36

fun.

Duncan: 00:03:37

He got a bunch of his favorite writers together to write vignettes

Duncan: 00:03:40

from different decades, imagining what it would be like if there were

Duncan: 00:03:44

gay characters allowed to exist.

Duncan: 00:03:45

And so the, I have written a couple of them, but they're

Duncan: 00:03:48

dropping them every Saturday.

Duncan: 00:03:50

And so the only one of mine that's out there now is the 1950s biblical

Duncan: 00:03:53

epic about David and Jonathan.

Duncan: 00:03:55

And you can check that on, on YouTube, check out the Pansy Vision thing.

Duncan: 00:04:00

They're all very short and fun and they have a host and it's great.

Nathan: 00:04:03

Yeah.

Bee: 00:04:03

Oh, that's really fun.

Nathan: 00:04:05

It, it is on, I have not had a chance, I'll admit, I have not had

Nathan: 00:04:09

a chance to watch them, but like.

Nathan: 00:04:11

He's been pushing them really hard and I just need to put aside, you know, an

Nathan: 00:04:16

evening where I just marathon through these because I can't wait to watch

Nathan: 00:04:19

these and they look like a lot of fun.

Nathan: 00:04:23

And there's so many actors and performers, I mean, like it's such a small community.

Nathan: 00:04:27

A lot of these are local actors from the Rhode Island, Massachusetts area.

Nathan: 00:04:30

And I know so many of them, so I can't wait to watch these.

Nathan: 00:04:33

So yeah.

Nathan: 00:04:34

And we share, we share a lot of the same, same talent, you know

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all the community of actors.

Nathan: 00:04:38

So it's, it's great.

Nathan: 00:04:39

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:04:40

Anyways.

Nathan: 00:04:41

So that's great.

Nathan: 00:04:42

You know, definitely have, I would love for you to plug where people

Nathan: 00:04:46

can find you and your work, Duncan, I mean, we'll put it at the end of the

Nathan: 00:04:49

show as well, but where, where can, where's the best place for people to.

Nathan: 00:04:52

Find what you're working on and what you're doing.

Duncan: 00:04:55

The best place is my website, which is duncanflaster.

Duncan: 00:04:57

com.

Duncan: 00:04:58

D U N C A N D F L A N T E R dot com.

Duncan: 00:05:02

Excellent.

Duncan: 00:05:02

I have everything there, and you can sign up for my whenever I feel like it email

Duncan: 00:05:07

blast that goes out usually monthly, sometimes more if I'm working on something

Duncan: 00:05:12

pending, but that's the best place to go.

Bee: 00:05:15

That's pretty good.

Bee: 00:05:16

Yeah.

Bee: 00:05:16

Usually monthly.

Bee: 00:05:17

It's pretty good.

Bee: 00:05:18

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:05:18

And that usually gets hooked up to my Facebook page for Duncan Flester,

Duncan: 00:05:22

the playwright and my Twitter or whatever.

Nathan: 00:05:26

Awesome.

Nathan: 00:05:26

All right.

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Well, we'll be sure to put your website handles, all that

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in the show notes as well.

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So Duncan, before we continue I want to ask you something that I ask all of our

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guests on the podcast, and this kind of helps us get to know you a little

Nathan: 00:05:40

bit more about your filmmaking taste.

Nathan: 00:05:41

This is the most important part of the show.

Nathan: 00:05:44

Are you ready?

Nathan: 00:05:46

This is key.

Nathan: 00:05:47

This is key.

Nathan: 00:05:48

What is the first movie you remember seeing in the theater?

Duncan: 00:05:53

Raiders of the Lost Ark.

Nathan: 00:05:55

Mm hmm.

Duncan: 00:05:56

I remember being there with my family and covering my

Duncan: 00:05:58

eyes from the But don't speak

Nathan: 00:05:59

too much more about it, because somebody here has never seen

Nathan: 00:06:03

it, and it's actually going to be a retrospective next month, and it's not me.

Bee: 00:06:08

I was going to say, and that someone is, Nathan.

Duncan: 00:06:10

Well, there is a moment that I think is kind of

Duncan: 00:06:12

mimetic, That has snakes in it.

Duncan: 00:06:14

And from that point on, I was covering my eyes because I was

Duncan: 00:06:16

kind of too young to watch it.

Duncan: 00:06:20

But it was really thrilling.

Duncan: 00:06:22

But

Nathan: 00:06:24

it's great.

Nathan: 00:06:25

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:06:26

All right, Duncan, what is the last movie you watched outside of this?

Nathan: 00:06:30

In case this is the last one you saw?

Duncan: 00:06:32

It was Anyone But You.

Duncan: 00:06:34

The recent romantic comedy that's loosely inspired by Much Ado About Nothing.

Duncan: 00:06:40

Mm hmm.

Duncan: 00:06:42

It's cute.

Duncan: 00:06:44

It's fine.

Bee: 00:06:45

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:06:46

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:06:47

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:06:48

I like how they kind of subvert a lot of romantic comedy tropes.

Duncan: 00:06:53

Like even the ones from Much Ado About Nothing, which is like

Duncan: 00:06:55

stealing the Beatrice Benedict

Bee: 00:06:58

thing.

Bee: 00:06:58

They

Duncan: 00:06:58

like they just joke about how stupid some of the plot

Duncan: 00:07:02

contrivances are within that.

Duncan: 00:07:04

And it's cute.

Duncan: 00:07:05

It's nice.

Bee: 00:07:06

I'm fine with Glenn Powell vehicles right now, too.

Duncan: 00:07:09

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:07:09

He's on the, I just yeah, he's doing good.

Nathan: 00:07:14

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:07:15

Alright.

Nathan: 00:07:16

Alright.

Nathan: 00:07:16

This is a big one here.

Bee: 00:07:17

Mm-Hmm.

Bee: 00:07:18

. Nathan: What is your favorite movie?

Bee: 00:07:20

Queen's Logic right now.

Bee: 00:07:22

What is

Duncan: 00:07:22

it?

Duncan: 00:07:23

Queen's Logic.

Duncan: 00:07:24

Logic.

Duncan: 00:07:24

Nobody has heard of it.

Duncan: 00:07:26

It's got Kevin Bacon and Linda Fiorentino and, uh, John Malkovich and Chloe Webb

Duncan: 00:07:35

and Joe Mantegna, and there you are a whole bunch of fantastic people.

Duncan: 00:07:40

Ken Olin.

Duncan: 00:07:41

Um, it's just, it's great.

Duncan: 00:07:43

It's been my favorite since I came out in the early nineties.

Nathan: 00:07:46

So this is like a, a movie cover I've seen many, many times.

Nathan: 00:07:51

I just didn't ever notice it before, but yes.

Nathan: 00:07:54

Okay.

Duncan: 00:07:55

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:07:55

And I think it's very underrated.

Duncan: 00:07:58

And It's usually, I think you can find it on Tubi if you're looking for it.

Bee: 00:08:02

Oh, I love Tubi.

Duncan: 00:08:03

Tubi's great.

Nathan: 00:08:05

Oh wow, okay.

Nathan: 00:08:06

I, this is something that's really off my radar, so this is good to know.

Nathan: 00:08:09

All right.

Bee: 00:08:10

And to watch list.

Nathan: 00:08:13

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:08:13

So, and this is, this is a big one.

Nathan: 00:08:15

What's a movie that you credit for turning you into a cinephile?

Nathan: 00:08:21

The creepiest word in existence.

Duncan: 00:08:24

Probably Labyrinth.

Duncan: 00:08:26

Oh, yes!

Duncan: 00:08:27

Like, I saw a commercial for that at my grandma's house.

Duncan: 00:08:31

I remember to Stigliet coming on TV, and I was like, I know what George Lucas is.

Duncan: 00:08:37

I know what the Muppets are.

Duncan: 00:08:38

I'm not sure about a David Bowie, but sounds cool.

Duncan: 00:08:41

And, like, the original commercial just, like, blew my mind.

Duncan: 00:08:45

I was like, I need to go to that.

Duncan: 00:08:46

Take me to that right now.

Duncan: 00:08:47

And I saw it, and it's my dad.

Nathan: 00:08:49

Okay.

Bee: 00:08:50

I always credit Labyrinth with My Bisexual Awakening as a young

Bee: 00:08:55

child just seeing David Bowie and Jennifer Connelly as a growing girl.

Bee: 00:08:59

Yeah, it's a confusing movie.

Nathan: 00:09:02

I'm gonna test out a fifth question here.

Nathan: 00:09:05

And only because I might replace it at some point.

Nathan: 00:09:08

What's a movie that scares you?

Bee: 00:09:16

And why is it Labyrinth?

Bee: 00:09:17

No.

Duncan: 00:09:17

I don't know if I really get scared by movies.

Nathan: 00:09:24

I don't

Duncan: 00:09:24

watch a lot of horror films.

Duncan: 00:09:25

It

Nathan: 00:09:26

doesn't have to be horror, but what's it, but

Duncan: 00:09:29

I mean, the scariest moment for me is in Steel Magnolias when

Duncan: 00:09:33

Julia Roberts is like passed out and like her daughter is screaming.

Duncan: 00:09:36

Left alone in the house.

Duncan: 00:09:38

That always freaks me out for somebody who's like chill

Duncan: 00:09:43

Okay,

Nathan: 00:09:44

all right So before we proceed with this, I I have an important question

Nathan: 00:09:50

for both of you and I spring this on On whoever is opposite me on my screen here.

Nathan: 00:09:56

It could be my co host could be the guests here so These

Nathan: 00:10:00

are always terrible, all right?

Nathan: 00:10:02

I don't know if you've listened to our show.

Nathan: 00:10:04

They, they go off the rails in a horrible way all the time.

Nathan: 00:10:07

But my question for both of you today, and so a production of a play about the story.

Nathan: 00:10:16

Of your life is being produced

Nathan: 00:10:19

and

Nathan: 00:10:20

simple questions here, two of them, basically, who do

Nathan: 00:10:23

you want portraying you in the lead role in the stage adaptation?

Nathan: 00:10:28

And more importantly, you can only choose between the following three types of

Nathan: 00:10:33

audiences to attend this production.

Nathan: 00:10:36

One, is the members of the Flat Earth Society.

Nathan: 00:10:40

Two, disgraced former members of Doctors Without Borders.

Nathan: 00:10:45

Or three, members of the Droogs, the fictional gang from Clockwork

Nathan: 00:10:51

Orange, who have now been imprisoned.

Nathan: 00:10:53

But if you choose this group, you must incorporate the number Cellblock Tango

Nathan: 00:10:57

from Chicago into your production.

Nathan: 00:11:00

Who's going first?

Nathan: 00:11:00

That's honestly

Bee: 00:11:01

a banger number.

Bee: 00:11:02

Duncan, do you, do you have any immediate thoughts here, Duncan?

Duncan: 00:11:05

I always say Sean Astin would probably be best to portray me.

Duncan: 00:11:09

Okay.

Duncan: 00:11:10

We're kind of simpatico that way.

Duncan: 00:11:12

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:11:14

And I think the Droogs, Droogs.

Duncan: 00:11:16

And I love Cellblock Tango.

Duncan: 00:11:17

I'm all, I'm all

Bee: 00:11:21

Sure.

Bee: 00:11:22

Yeah.

Bee: 00:11:23

It's just good to get a sense of who you are before we dive into this.

Bee: 00:11:26

All right.

Bee: 00:11:27

All right.

Bee: 00:11:28

For sure, my audience is disgraced members of Doctors Without Borders, like 100%.

Bee: 00:11:33

That's not even a question.

Bee: 00:11:34

They, are so smart still.

Bee: 00:11:36

Okay, they're doctors, so let's calm down.

Bee: 00:11:39

I always struggle with, yeah, they're borderless, they're

Bee: 00:11:44

doctors, what do you want?

Bee: 00:11:45

I always struggle with who I think should play me.

Bee: 00:11:49

That's always really hard, so I'm just, going to lean into

Bee: 00:11:52

Nicolas Cage as the option here.

Nathan: 00:11:56

Well, he's, nothing he can't do.

Nathan: 00:11:58

No, it's great.

Nathan: 00:11:58

He's,

Bee: 00:11:59

the dude's got range and I feel like the disgraced doctors would be on

Bee: 00:12:03

board for any like meta kind of irony.

Bee: 00:12:06

I'm picturing, you know, late stage Nick Cage.

Duncan: 00:12:09

Okay.

Duncan: 00:12:09

Maybe one of them could take his face.

Duncan: 00:12:11

Oh.

Bee: 00:12:13

Ooh.

Bee: 00:12:14

I

Duncan: 00:12:15

see what you did there.

Bee: 00:12:16

All right.

Bee: 00:12:17

Yeah.

Bee: 00:12:18

More of that.

Bee: 00:12:18

That's good.

Duncan: 00:12:22

Okay.

Duncan: 00:12:22

Well,

Nathan: 00:12:27

the film that we watched and if you couldn't tell,

Nathan: 00:12:33

because there was really no connective tissue at all.

Nathan: 00:12:36

And that question is, we watched a 1990s film, Lillies.

Nathan: 00:12:43

From, you know, all my notes are missing here, but from John

Nathan: 00:12:46

Grayson, director John Grayson.

Nathan: 00:12:49

And

Nathan: 00:12:49

this is what we watched this week.

Nathan: 00:12:51

And I'm looking forward to hearing everyone's opinion on this.

Nathan: 00:12:54

But before I do, I have a trailer and a plot synopsis.

Nathan: 00:12:58

You know, let me do the plot synopsis first.

Nathan: 00:13:00

All right.

Nathan: 00:13:01

When a bishop comes to a prison to hear the confessions of an old friend, he is

Nathan: 00:13:06

forced to watch a play performed by the inmates about their youth together, love.

Nathan: 00:13:12

and betrayal.

Nathan: 00:13:13

This is right off the internet.

Nathan: 00:13:15

I didn't do any interpretation at all, but I mean, so far so good.

Nathan: 00:13:19

I want to hear interpretation of this plot.

Nathan: 00:13:22

I like to ask my 12 year old daughter, what she thinks of a movie's title,

Nathan: 00:13:31

Not knowing anything about the movie.

Nathan: 00:13:32

Problem is, she knows that we're in the middle of Pride Month, so

Nathan: 00:13:35

she's kind of trying to force it.

Nathan: 00:13:38

Oh, clocked in.

Bee: 00:13:39

Clocked

Nathan: 00:13:40

in.

Nathan: 00:13:40

I wish she didn't know this because it's, it's, it's being forced.

Nathan: 00:13:43

But here we go.

Nathan: 00:13:44

Anyways, this is what my daughter Chloe thinks the movie Lilies is about.

Nathan: 00:13:49

Nathan's Daughter: I think that the movie Lilies, it's about these three lilies

Nathan: 00:13:56

that are like, Triplets, and one of them figuring out everything in her life, and

Nathan: 00:14:06

the other two are trying to help her, and, and then, towards the end, they're

Nathan: 00:14:11

like all different sexualities, and they go through like, different, like,

Nathan: 00:14:18

romantic relationships, and they each try to help each other get through it

Nathan: 00:14:25

all, and in the end, They all are happy.

Nathan: 00:14:31

Spot on.

Bee: 00:14:32

I mean, it is about three lilies who are in different relationships.

Bee: 00:14:37

It's just a real optimistic take.

Bee: 00:14:39

Yeah.

Bee: 00:14:41

So optimistic.

Nathan: 00:14:44

And like I said, I have a It's part of the trailer for this.

Nathan: 00:14:47

I'll drop this.

Nathan: 00:14:48

I am very intrigued.

Bee: 00:14:49

I haven't done any trailer watching for this.

Nathan: 00:14:53

I've actually stopped watching trailers almost all together.

Nathan: 00:14:57

At least for this podcast.

Nathan: 00:14:58

Cause I like to go with completely blind for a lot of these movies these days.

Nathan: 00:15:02

But the

Bee: 00:15:02

nineties were a golden era.

Nathan: 00:15:04

Oh yeah.

Nathan: 00:15:05

You

Bee: 00:15:05

know, see what happened.

Trailer: 00:15:07

It was very brave of you to come here today.

Trailer: 00:15:10

I'm about to get the sin of revenge.

Trailer: 00:15:15

Gloria in excelsis, Gloria in excelsis Deo, Et in terra pax honoris.

Trailer: 00:15:24

Those are memories long forgotten.

Trailer: 00:15:28

Gloria in excelsis Deo, Gloria in excelsis Deo.

Trailer: 00:15:34

There's gonna be sacrilege,

Trailer: 00:15:41

remorse, What's the point of praying?

Trailer: 00:15:46

What's the point of suffering if you don't even listen to it?

Trailer: 00:15:51

There's going to be lots of forbidden memories.

Trailer: 00:15:54

For

Trailer: 00:16:01

the person I loved most in this world.

Nathan: 00:16:07

All right.

Nathan: 00:16:07

That was a the trailer for Lily's.

Nathan: 00:16:12

All right.

Nathan: 00:16:12

So let's get to our discussion of lilies and because we don't have sand

Nathan: 00:16:19

this week, I don't really think we have much to say, but we don't have the,

Nathan: 00:16:22

our, our connoisseur of movie facts.

Nathan: 00:16:25

I don't know if.

Nathan: 00:16:26

Be you, I mean, a couple of things I can bring up.

Nathan: 00:16:30

I did look on the wiki page and, and box office mojo.

Nathan: 00:16:34

I did see that the budget for this was 2.

Nathan: 00:16:37

2 million Canadian box office looked like it was really almost nothing like 300, 000

Nathan: 00:16:43

at most, it came out at debuted at TIF on September 7th, 1996, and I guess it had a

Nathan: 00:16:50

An American debut on October 10th, 1997.

Nathan: 00:16:54

At that time it was number 22 at the box office breaking in 28, 000 approximately.

Duncan: 00:17:01

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:17:02

I should say there's a new 4k restoration of this that just came out and is on the

Duncan: 00:17:06

Criterion channel and they have a Blu ray DVD coming out next month in July.

Duncan: 00:17:11

Which is

Nathan: 00:17:14

Okay, cool.

Nathan: 00:17:14

I was wondering what made

Bee: 00:17:15

this your, your pick.

Nathan: 00:17:18

Also debuting on this date on the U.

Nathan: 00:17:21

S.

Nathan: 00:17:21

box office was Seven Years in Tibet and Rocketman, not the Etlin John

Nathan: 00:17:27

biopic, but some other film that honestly I have no recollection of.

Duncan: 00:17:31

Was Harlan Williams the comedy where he's like an astronaut?

Duncan: 00:17:34

Maybe.

Nathan: 00:17:36

I don't know.

Nathan: 00:17:36

I just, maybe, I don't know.

Nathan: 00:17:38

But number one at the box office at this time At the time of this release

Nathan: 00:17:41

was Kissed the Girls, the first film to be adapted from the Alex Cross

Nathan: 00:17:45

book series with Morgan Freeman.

Nathan: 00:17:46

I was checking on that.

Nathan: 00:17:48

So yeah, a little bit of trivia.

Nathan: 00:17:50

I think I did find that John Grayson was part of a group of filmmakers

Nathan: 00:17:55

who emerged in the 80s known as the Toronto New Wave, which I didn't know.

Nathan: 00:18:00

Grayson was, is also a professor at, at York University Film School.

Nathan: 00:18:05

By the way, this, this Toronto New Wave, going back to the box office,

Nathan: 00:18:10

this debuted one slot behind a movie called The Suite Hereafter,

Nathan: 00:18:16

which was directed by Adam, is it?

Nathan: 00:18:19

It go in, who was also part of the Toronto new wave as well.

Nathan: 00:18:23

So both these filmmakers from this group had a movie debut at the

Nathan: 00:18:27

same time, one slot apart from each other on the, on the box office.

Nathan: 00:18:32

It was adapted from from a play of a Canadian playwright.

Nathan: 00:18:38

Is it Michael or Michelle?

Nathan: 00:18:39

Michael Mark Bouchard.

Nathan: 00:18:42

Okay.

Nathan: 00:18:43

Title.

Nathan: 00:18:43

I can't, I don't speak French, Oh, oh, drama, a romantic, something like that.

Nathan: 00:18:52

And it was also adapted as an opera and premiered in British Columbia in 2017.

Nathan: 00:18:59

So that's all I got for movie facts.

Nathan: 00:19:02

Come back, Sam.

Duncan: 00:19:04

Michel Marc Bouchard is actually in the film.

Duncan: 00:19:06

It's a cameo.

Duncan: 00:19:07

He's the one, he's the photographer in any scene where you see

Duncan: 00:19:10

somebody taking a picture.

Duncan: 00:19:11

That's him.

Nathan: 00:19:11

Oh,

Nathan: 00:19:14

all right.

Nathan: 00:19:15

So.

Nathan: 00:19:15

Let's get to it.

Nathan: 00:19:17

You are a guest of honor, Duncan.

Nathan: 00:19:19

Please give us your thoughts, your opinions on Willys.

Duncan: 00:19:23

Well, I love this movie.

Duncan: 00:19:24

I think it's beautiful to look at and very desperately romantic and beautiful.

Duncan: 00:19:31

I found out about it because my friend Tessa Fox, who is another playwright,

Duncan: 00:19:34

and she was obsessed with Brent Carver, who plays the Countess in it.

Bee: 00:19:40

One of my favorite characters.

Duncan: 00:19:43

Yeah, incredible work.

Duncan: 00:19:45

He of course was in on Broadway in Kiss of the Spider Woman, and Gandalf

Duncan: 00:19:49

in the Lord of the Rings musical.

Duncan: 00:19:51

He's dead now, but, and the last time I watched this movie was after he died.

Duncan: 00:19:54

I found it on some of the secure channel and watched it then.

Duncan: 00:19:57

But yeah, it's a beautiful film.

Duncan: 00:20:00

I've seen the play as well.

Duncan: 00:20:01

Somebody was doing it in New York.

Duncan: 00:20:03

It was the first thing I saw coming back from the pandemic.

Duncan: 00:20:06

Like there were still seats between people and

Bee: 00:20:09

right.

Duncan: 00:20:09

Yeah, we, I saw it in Times Square, . And yeah, it's a very

Duncan: 00:20:15

peaceful adaptation of the play, although the movie gives it a, a much

Duncan: 00:20:20

more meta textual visual aspect to it.

Duncan: 00:20:23

So.

Duncan: 00:20:26

done as real life rather than, I should say the play is about prisoners

Duncan: 00:20:31

putting on a play and all of the prisoners are male and they play

Duncan: 00:20:34

all the roles, both male and female.

Duncan: 00:20:36

And in the film, they shoot.

Duncan: 00:20:39

It partly as like a real movie with still the male actors playing the female roles

Duncan: 00:20:46

and switching back and forth between them as prisoners and as the characters

Duncan: 00:20:50

they're portraying in flashback.

Nathan: 00:20:53

Okay.

Nathan: 00:20:54

If you were to give this a rating from 1 to 5, Duncan, what would you do?

Nathan: 00:20:59

I mean,

Duncan: 00:21:00

4.

Duncan: 00:21:01

5 at the least.

Duncan: 00:21:03

Possibly a 5.

Duncan: 00:21:04

I gave it a 5 on Letterboxd last night.

Bee: 00:21:07

Hey.

Nathan: 00:21:08

So it's a five.

Nathan: 00:21:08

You can give it a five.

Nathan: 00:21:09

Letterboxd's Law for us.

Bee: 00:21:12

Yeah.

Bee: 00:21:13

Yeah.

Bee: 00:21:14

All right.

Bee: 00:21:14

That's terrifying.

Duncan: 00:21:19

Letterboxd's Law.

Bee: 00:21:20

Letterboxd's Law.

Duncan: 00:21:22

B.

Bee: 00:21:23

Yeah.

Bee: 00:21:24

So I, first of all, thank you Duncan, because I had never even

Bee: 00:21:28

heard of this movie Yeah, and then Nathan said we were doing it for

Bee: 00:21:31

the pod and I was like, absolutely.

Bee: 00:21:33

I am very happy to watch some obscure cinema, especially for this.

Bee: 00:21:37

I think it's important.

Bee: 00:21:38

I thought this was really beautiful.

Bee: 00:21:41

I started watching it and was just not in the headspace to focus on it.

Bee: 00:21:48

And my viewing experience for the first, like 40 minutes, the first time

Bee: 00:21:52

I tried to watch it was not great.

Bee: 00:21:54

And I was like, it's.

Bee: 00:21:56

I gotta give this another shot and I just ended up restarting it and was like I

Bee: 00:22:00

have to restart it when I can give this my undivided attention and it totally

Bee: 00:22:06

changed my experience of the film.

Bee: 00:22:08

It's a movie that demands attention.

Bee: 00:22:10

You have to focus on it, but it, I think, rewards you for that.

Bee: 00:22:15

The world, like you were saying, Duncan, it is just beautiful in this very,

Bee: 00:22:19

like, very specifically 90s kind of way.

Bee: 00:22:23

It, it's, it's a little bit ethereal.

Bee: 00:22:26

It has that really soft lighting that.

Bee: 00:22:28

works for the play within the play within the play that they're putting

Bee: 00:22:33

on for their Catholic school, right?

Bee: 00:22:35

And it's you know, watching it, I was like, there's a little bit of everything.

Bee: 00:22:38

It's a little bit Shakespeare.

Bee: 00:22:39

It's a little bit dead poet society.

Bee: 00:22:40

It's a little bit Greg Akari.

Bee: 00:22:42

It's a little bit, you know, it's pulling from all kinds

Bee: 00:22:46

of really interesting places.

Bee: 00:22:48

But the performances, you know, you mentioned Carver, that's

Bee: 00:22:51

just a stunning performance.

Bee: 00:22:53

He's incredible in this.

Bee: 00:22:53

Scene stealer, so great.

Bee: 00:22:58

I think there's, you know, it's a big conceit.

Bee: 00:23:02

I don't think it always works.

Bee: 00:23:03

That switch back between when it looks like a flashback and when it

Bee: 00:23:07

looks like, you know, back in the prison, that works most of the time.

Bee: 00:23:11

I think some of the time it takes you out of the storytelling a little bit.

Bee: 00:23:15

Some pacing stuff.

Bee: 00:23:16

It's pretty minor.

Bee: 00:23:17

The movie moves pretty well.

Bee: 00:23:18

But sometimes it's almost so languid I wish it stayed there.

Bee: 00:23:22

And slowed down a little and would have benefited the story

Bee: 00:23:24

and let it breathe a little more.

Bee: 00:23:26

Especially towards the end.

Bee: 00:23:27

But I thought the characters were so Just So great at playing like not

Bee: 00:23:35

professional actors and then being really good actors, you know So you

Bee: 00:23:40

for that sort of mix of metatextual?

Bee: 00:23:43

context and just the story that Revenge story was powerful And that

Bee: 00:23:52

other side of revenge the flip side of the coin that redemption arc of

Bee: 00:23:56

a man saying like, look, I've been waiting my whole life to talk about

Bee: 00:24:01

my true love and what really happened.

Bee: 00:24:03

I mean, wow, that it's just a gut punch right at the end.

Bee: 00:24:07

So I, I really enjoyed it.

Bee: 00:24:09

I'm glad I restarted it and try it again.

Bee: 00:24:13

Didn't second screen it for me.

Bee: 00:24:14

It's a four.

Bee: 00:24:15

Super solid.

Bee: 00:24:17

Yeah.

Bee: 00:24:20

Okay.

Bee: 00:24:21

I,

Nathan: 00:24:22

I had, me and B were talking offline before you came on Duncan about

Nathan: 00:24:28

how I think we both had a very similar experience where we, we were having

Nathan: 00:24:32

a hard time at first watching this.

Nathan: 00:24:34

One of the, one of the things I, I'm, I am grateful for with this

Nathan: 00:24:37

podcast is that, you know, they have the opportunities to become exposed.

Nathan: 00:24:43

To new films, new filmmakers, different genres that I never

Nathan: 00:24:47

would have sought out otherwise.

Nathan: 00:24:50

And whether I love or hate a movie, I still find it fascinating to

Nathan: 00:24:54

explore as much as I can about a movie that we're talking about.

Nathan: 00:24:59

But damn all of the films we've watched for this podcast, which is probably

Nathan: 00:25:02

now over like 60 or so, this one takes the cake for being the most obscure.

Nathan: 00:25:08

And I was so frustrated because.

Nathan: 00:25:11

Outside of the wiki page, I could not find anything online about this film.

Nathan: 00:25:17

No interviews with the director or the cast, not even as much as a commentary

Nathan: 00:25:22

on the movie, other than a few reviews.

Nathan: 00:25:24

And I don't count like, you know, people, random people's opinions or letterbox

Nathan: 00:25:28

reviews as, as content for this.

Nathan: 00:25:29

But I was really frustrated because I really do put in time to research.

Nathan: 00:25:35

you know, interviews and behind the scenes stuff.

Nathan: 00:25:38

And I was like, I felt so naked going into this.

Nathan: 00:25:41

And I watched this movie six days ago at first.

Nathan: 00:25:45

And I, and I felt empty.

Nathan: 00:25:48

Like I was, I, I'll be honest, my original review of this was a really

Nathan: 00:25:52

low score because I could not.

Nathan: 00:25:56

I was not engaged in this, and I think it's because of the framing device, the

Nathan: 00:26:01

way the story was told, I was having such a hard time wrapping my head

Nathan: 00:26:05

around it, and what's going on here, we got a film, within a play, within a

Nathan: 00:26:10

film, also Based on play, by the way.

Nathan: 00:26:14

So it's, it's, it's too many like windows that we're looking through here.

Nathan: 00:26:20

Literally.

Nathan: 00:26:20

And some of the, the, actually the Bishop and, and I feel like we're constantly

Nathan: 00:26:28

like looking through this, these eyepieces here and I had a hard time,

Nathan: 00:26:32

but where are we as the audience member?

Nathan: 00:26:35

I had a hard time.

Nathan: 00:26:37

Where am I sitting and looking at this performance from?

Nathan: 00:26:40

Where is my perspective?

Nathan: 00:26:41

And I felt like my perspective kept changing.

Nathan: 00:26:44

They kept pulling out the rug from under me and I didn't know

Nathan: 00:26:49

what was going on half the time.

Nathan: 00:26:51

And I felt like I was just catching up to just, The storytelling framing device.

Nathan: 00:26:58

And I couldn't even find like myself finding my place in the story.

Nathan: 00:27:04

Now that was the beginning of my experience.

Nathan: 00:27:07

I watched this again last night and after time where I had time to digest

Nathan: 00:27:13

this, I had, I took a one 80 degree.

Nathan: 00:27:16

Look at this.

Nathan: 00:27:16

And I had a much more enjoyable time watching it.

Nathan: 00:27:20

Now realizing that what the, what the filmmaker is trying to do here.

Nathan: 00:27:25

So I, I had a much better time.

Nathan: 00:27:27

I haven't really said much about the movie because I think there is a

Nathan: 00:27:30

lot of really good things happening.

Nathan: 00:27:32

I thought this movie is held together by some outstanding

Nathan: 00:27:36

performances, especially the three young leads in this Sloane Valliere.

Nathan: 00:27:41

Bilodeau, I think is his name, but those three are really, really good.

Nathan: 00:27:46

And this, I did not love the, the two older actors as much.

Nathan: 00:27:52

I thought the, the, the older Simone, I wasn't, I don't know.

Nathan: 00:27:56

I forget who the actor's name was in that.

Nathan: 00:27:58

I, and, but we

Bee: 00:28:00

don't spend a lot of time with them.

Nathan: 00:28:01

We don't, but I could have watched the whole movie in this.

Nathan: 00:28:07

Reality of, of the film that we're watching, not in the prison.

Nathan: 00:28:11

I did not like coming back to the prison.

Nathan: 00:28:13

I

Nathan: 00:28:13

would have liked the whole movie to show me the

Nathan: 00:28:15

flashback or show me that world.

Nathan: 00:28:18

So, and every time we kept coming back, it was so seamless, which was

Nathan: 00:28:22

kind of a cool thing, but at the same time, I needed a better transition

Nathan: 00:28:28

to bring me back or something.

Nathan: 00:28:30

I don't know.

Nathan: 00:28:32

Also, and again, I, I'm kind of going off here a little bit.

Nathan: 00:28:36

There, the cinematography in this, I have a very mixed feelings about, it has that

Nathan: 00:28:41

very soft nineties feel to it, but it also is teetering the line on, I felt like I

Nathan: 00:28:46

was watching a TV movie or a soap opera.

Nathan: 00:28:49

There's

Bee: 00:28:49

so much

Nathan: 00:28:53

of, I don't know, it just had, there's so many

Nathan: 00:28:58

arbitrary camera moves in this.

Nathan: 00:29:00

It's like, I don't know.

Nathan: 00:29:03

Unmotivated things that I felt like were happening with this

Nathan: 00:29:06

or that just felt random to me.

Nathan: 00:29:08

Some of them are really beautiful.

Nathan: 00:29:10

I love just this flexible reality.

Nathan: 00:29:12

Like there's a time where the Bishop is in the, is, is in the

Nathan: 00:29:18

confessional and there's the moment where the balloon is floating.

Nathan: 00:29:22

All of a sudden they open up above the confessional and

Nathan: 00:29:26

there's the blue sky above them.

Nathan: 00:29:28

Moments like that are really cool.

Nathan: 00:29:30

And it's a, it's a great use it's a great creative moment.

Nathan: 00:29:36

And I, and if the movie probably did that more, I would, I like that.

Nathan: 00:29:41

But there was just times where it just.

Nathan: 00:29:44

There were so many clunky, bad TV moments.

Nathan: 00:29:49

I felt like I was witnessing anyways.

Nathan: 00:29:52

I talked about the, the performances we've already mentioned it before.

Nathan: 00:29:56

The, the, the young actors were great, but.

Nathan: 00:29:59

Brent Carver stole this movie as, as the countess, he brought a sensitivity

Nathan: 00:30:05

and vulnerability to his role.

Nathan: 00:30:08

Every moment he's on screen, I found myself perking up leaning in because there

Nathan: 00:30:12

was so much heart with that character.

Nathan: 00:30:16

And I want to talk more about all the performances here.

Nathan: 00:30:18

I've gone on way too long, but I liked this movie on second viewing.

Nathan: 00:30:23

I still don't love it.

Nathan: 00:30:24

Cause there's so much that I'm confused about.

Nathan: 00:30:26

Still.

Nathan: 00:30:27

I don't know why characters did some things.

Nathan: 00:30:30

And I'm not fully, it wasn't a hundred percent engaged with it.

Nathan: 00:30:34

I I'm, I'm still at a three with this.

Nathan: 00:30:37

So I liked it.

Nathan: 00:30:38

I, I don't love it.

Bee: 00:30:41

Tunk in your face.

Bee: 00:30:43

You're like,

Duncan: 00:30:43

what?

Duncan: 00:30:43

It can be confusing.

Duncan: 00:30:45

I think the first time I saw it, I didn't understand a lot of what was going on.

Duncan: 00:30:49

I think it's deliberately a leak in a lot of ways.

Nathan: 00:30:52

And I might love this even more on a third watch, and I'm

Nathan: 00:30:55

not against not seeing this again.

Nathan: 00:30:58

I'm telling you, I, I, this movie was a one and a half

Nathan: 00:31:01

the first time I watched this.

Nathan: 00:31:02

I went from a one and a half to a three.

Nathan: 00:31:04

So by that logic, this might be a six next time.

Nathan: 00:31:08

Who knows if it keeps doubling, but that's where I'm at.

Nathan: 00:31:12

It definitely is not a bad movie at all.

Nathan: 00:31:14

And there's a lot of good things in this film.

Nathan: 00:31:17

It's very unique, very unusual and Some, some, some solid things in it.

Nathan: 00:31:21

I'm sorry.

Nathan: 00:31:21

I I've gone on way too long, but there you go.

Nathan: 00:31:24

Where can we go?

Nathan: 00:31:25

Where, where should we go from here with this?

Nathan: 00:31:26

There's, there's, there's definitely a lot of, a lot of directions.

Bee: 00:31:31

Yeah.

Bee: 00:31:32

So, you know, talk about the, the great thing about this movie and

Bee: 00:31:37

the sort of I don't want to say TV quality, but kind of TV quality stuff

Bee: 00:31:41

sort of bumping up against each other right away, which I also think is so

Bee: 00:31:44

wonderfully of the time that opening shot of the priest eating the orange.

Bee: 00:31:50

I immediately, I was like, Ooh, what are we, what's going to happen?

Bee: 00:31:53

You know, like, is this a, a sort of pseudo artistic shot or is this like a

Bee: 00:32:00

predicating something that's about both?

Bee: 00:32:02

And then you're immediately thrust into the play, which is the subject

Bee: 00:32:07

of the flashback within the movie.

Bee: 00:32:09

And this, like, it sort of tells you right, right away.

Bee: 00:32:13

I mean, I guess you, you see the prison first, but it sort of tells you right

Bee: 00:32:16

away, which is why I think if you don't catch this movie immediately in a

Bee: 00:32:22

focused mindset, and you're not second streaming right away, there's not a

Bee: 00:32:26

lot of opportunities for engagement subsequently, like a lot of modern

Bee: 00:32:30

movies, there's an action sequence, or there's something later on that

Bee: 00:32:32

you can get back into the movie that way, if you sort of lose your way.

Bee: 00:32:37

Okay.

Bee: 00:32:37

The access point is only in the beginning here and you get the two

Bee: 00:32:41

setup shots of Inside the prison the priest is called in they're in a

Bee: 00:32:46

confessional And it's you look different.

Bee: 00:32:49

Yeah, you don't look like and immediately they're like, you know each other and

Bee: 00:32:53

then bam They're on the stage and they're back as young boys again, which I just

Bee: 00:32:56

thought was Really great storytelling.

Duncan: 00:32:59

Yeah,

Bee: 00:33:00

once I tried again,

Duncan: 00:33:02

and I did realize this time that at the very very very beginning There's a

Duncan: 00:33:06

quick shot, from later You In the film of the two guys when they're in the bathtub,

Duncan: 00:33:11

their faces reflected in the water.

Duncan: 00:33:13

Very, very believably.

Duncan: 00:33:14

I've never noticed it before.

Duncan: 00:33:17

Oh!

Duncan: 00:33:18

I was just like, that's so cool!

Bee: 00:33:20

See, that makes me want the Blu ray you were talking about.

Bee: 00:33:24

Yeah!

Bee: 00:33:26

That's awesome.

Bee: 00:33:28

Yeah, the storytelling just happens right at the beginning of this movie.

Bee: 00:33:32

You know the entire conceit and then you just watch it.

Bee: 00:33:34

sort of watch how it happened to get you up to that point for an hour and a half.

Bee: 00:33:39

And then the last 10 minutes of the conclusion, but you know, everything that

Bee: 00:33:43

you're supposed to know with, I would say the only notable exception being the Brent

Bee: 00:33:47

Carver character, the Countess right away, really, you're introduced to the three

Bee: 00:33:54

young boys and you kind of immediately get that dynamic of two of them.

Bee: 00:34:01

You know, being in Young Love and being playful and there being some

Bee: 00:34:04

hesitancy maybe, and then this jealous third character that comes in.

Bee: 00:34:08

It does feel very Shakespearean to

Nathan: 00:34:11

me.

Nathan: 00:34:12

I want to say something about the opening because, you know, knowing absolutely

Nathan: 00:34:16

nothing about this movie headed into it, I mean I didn't even read a plot synopsis.

Nathan: 00:34:21

Yes, same.

Nathan: 00:34:21

I

Nathan: 00:34:21

just went in blind.

Nathan: 00:34:22

Sim.

Nathan: 00:34:23

And I'm watching the opening of this and I've, I've seen probably way too

Nathan: 00:34:26

many horror movies, but when they lock the priest in there, I'm like,

Nathan: 00:34:31

I'm thinking something terrible is going to happen to this priest.

Nathan: 00:34:34

Like they're going to off this guy.

Duncan: 00:34:36

I mean something terrible does happen, they don't

Nathan: 00:34:38

care.

Nathan: 00:34:39

No, no, it does happen.

Nathan: 00:34:40

But I'm thinking like, he's like, the door's locked.

Nathan: 00:34:43

The door is stuck.

Nathan: 00:34:44

The door is not stuck.

Nathan: 00:34:46

Like, oh, he's dead.

Nathan: 00:34:48

He's dead.

Nathan: 00:34:48

This guy's dead.

Nathan: 00:34:49

And the way that they're like locking him in there, and there's like this big setup.

Nathan: 00:34:54

And in the way, in the way that the oldest amongst speaking, you're,

Nathan: 00:34:58

you're, there's going to be like sin and there's going to be like, this guy is so

Bee: 00:35:04

screwed.

Bee: 00:35:06

But then you're introduced to just this merry band of queer

Bee: 00:35:09

prisoners who are putting on a play.

Bee: 00:35:11

And it does really strike that balance of black comedy so well and again,

Bee: 00:35:18

I think you have to be keyed into it to, to see it and to find it.

Bee: 00:35:24

But once you get in the groove with this movie, you're

Bee: 00:35:29

sitting down, you're into it.

Bee: 00:35:31

It's pretty funny.

Bee: 00:35:32

It has some really funny moments and I think the cast of this play is part

Bee: 00:35:37

of it and they get to show up again as themselves a few times later in the

Bee: 00:35:41

film and just really defend their own and defend this love story in a way

Bee: 00:35:47

that is brassy and ballsy and funny.

Bee: 00:35:50

It's.

Bee: 00:35:51

Huge fan.

Bee: 00:35:52

Huge fan.

Duncan: 00:35:53

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:35:53

Especially the actor who plays Lyanne, who's,

Bee: 00:35:56

I was just thinking of him.

Bee: 00:35:57

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:35:58

In, in, in the, the flashback scene.

Duncan: 00:36:00

She's such a sweet romantic.

Duncan: 00:36:02

And then in the in the scenes where like whatever, like chew,

Duncan: 00:36:07

like a complete 180 character.

Nathan: 00:36:10

So, well, something that I thought was very interesting and, and

Nathan: 00:36:13

clever, and maybe this is something that you were mentioning is that, and,

Nathan: 00:36:17

and, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna trip.

Nathan: 00:36:19

Over myself as I explain this, because I really don't know how to, because

Nathan: 00:36:22

I've never seen this done in a movie is that in all the scenes, I guess

Nathan: 00:36:27

we can call it a flashback scene.

Nathan: 00:36:28

Cause it's not, it's not even really a flashback.

Nathan: 00:36:30

It's just, it's something that I've never seen done.

Nathan: 00:36:32

Something else.

Nathan: 00:36:33

Yeah, it is something else.

Nathan: 00:36:35

But in all those scenes, you have like these Three.

Nathan: 00:36:38

It's more, it's like, it's like four or five actors that are really

Nathan: 00:36:41

featured in this, between Lydian and the Countess and the three young men.

Nathan: 00:36:46

Mm-Hmm.

Nathan: 00:36:47

. Nathan: But, and you, but you see all these other prisoners that

Nathan: 00:36:50

are acting in this film later on.

Nathan: 00:36:54

Mm-Hmm.

Nathan: 00:36:55

. And what's fascinating is they're putting on these roles taking place in

Nathan: 00:37:01

like 1912, but when we're in the prison setting, they're nothing more than just.

Nathan: 00:37:09

Almost like background for, for the Bishop and older Simone.

Nathan: 00:37:15

And I found that so interesting.

Nathan: 00:37:16

It says, cause we never.

Nathan: 00:37:19

Ever get to know who these people are as like, who is the actor

Nathan: 00:37:28

that is playing these people?

Nathan: 00:37:30

They, they, they don't have any identity other than the roles they

Nathan: 00:37:33

are putting on, which is, which is, they're just like, Yeah, just like day

Nathan: 00:37:38

player extras in this whole, in, in the background of this prison chapel thing.

Nathan: 00:37:42

And I found that really interesting.

Nathan: 00:37:44

I didn't really think about it much until on second watch that you're so

Nathan: 00:37:48

invested in these characters like the Valier and, and even the Countess,

Nathan: 00:37:54

but, but when we get into the prison, they're just there in the background.

Nathan: 00:37:58

Almost out of focus on the fringes of the scene, having no role at all in

Nathan: 00:38:03

what's playing out between The two older actors, the two older characters, and I

Nathan: 00:38:08

found this so interesting that They have nothing to say, they have nothing to

Nathan: 00:38:12

add to that, and that's not a bad thing.

Nathan: 00:38:14

It's just so Fascinating that that's what their role is, is is I don't know.

Nathan: 00:38:21

What do you guys think of that?

Nathan: 00:38:22

I don't know.

Duncan: 00:38:23

No, I think it's really interesting.

Duncan: 00:38:24

I think some of the actors, like, say a lot with their eyes

Duncan: 00:38:27

when they're in the scenes.

Duncan: 00:38:28

Like, Brent Carver is, like, in the background of a lot of stuff.

Duncan: 00:38:31

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:38:31

Oh, he's, he's working the whole time.

Duncan: 00:38:33

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:38:33

He's, slightly

Bee: 00:38:34

teary, 90 percent of the time.

Duncan: 00:38:36

Yeah, pretty much.

Duncan: 00:38:36

But yeah, I think I think they're all just, like, pawns in older Simone's

Duncan: 00:38:42

plan, and it doesn't really matter.

Duncan: 00:38:44

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:38:44

Where they come from.

Duncan: 00:38:45

It's just like they're queer prisoners and they're there

Duncan: 00:38:48

to,

Duncan: 00:38:49

like, tell the story.

Duncan: 00:38:52

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:38:53

Which is very theatrical convention.

Duncan: 00:38:54

So many plays are people putting on plays within plays.

Duncan: 00:38:58

Like Man of La Mancha is prisoners putting on

Bee: 00:39:01

the

Duncan: 00:39:01

story and being affected by it in the end.

Bee: 00:39:04

Yeah.

Bee: 00:39:07

It's interesting.

Bee: 00:39:07

One thing I noticed was, and it kind of relates to this, maybe it did to me.

Bee: 00:39:13

Nathan, you said earlier in your movie facts that this was kind

Bee: 00:39:17

of Canadian new wave, right?

Bee: 00:39:19

There was some.

Nathan: 00:39:20

It was part of the, the director's part of a Toronto or Canadian it was a

Nathan: 00:39:25

group of known as the Toronto new wave, which was a group that started like in the

Nathan: 00:39:30

early, mid eighties through the nineties.

Bee: 00:39:33

It's when I was watching this, it really sang to me of like, okay.

Bee: 00:39:38

Some French New Wave, it reminded me a little bit of the way that, and, and

Bee: 00:39:44

some, like Wonka White, the way that memory is played with time and, and the

Bee: 00:39:50

constructs of that is, is like a very typical, you know, new wave, wherever

Bee: 00:39:56

you are in the world, kind of thing.

Bee: 00:39:59

And you could see this a lot in the costuming.

Bee: 00:40:02

Sometimes in the background of a flashback scene, you would see someone in the prison

Bee: 00:40:06

garb and you would notice their numbers.

Bee: 00:40:09

Or it would be kind of the flashback scene, but you would see

Bee: 00:40:11

the chain link fence behind them.

Bee: 00:40:13

So this fabrication of, you know, memory and.

Bee: 00:40:19

As reality, but also as you know, time slips away from us and just playing with

Bee: 00:40:25

time, not really knowing where in time we are and how that relates to our memory of

Bee: 00:40:31

something, you know, as more time passes, our memories might fade and slip a little

Bee: 00:40:34

bit and they mix with our current reality.

Bee: 00:40:38

And just commentary.

Bee: 00:40:39

That feels very much like Last Year at Marimba.

Bee: 00:40:41

It feels like Hiroshima Monomore.

Bee: 00:40:43

It feels like In the Mood for Love, you know, all these movies that play with

Bee: 00:40:48

big, dramatic, romantic conceits, but where there's an erosion of Time and

Bee: 00:40:55

memory, but it's trying to put some geometry around that to tell a story and

Bee: 00:41:01

those lines are just so blurred that I think that could be seen as a fault of

Bee: 00:41:09

the film, or it could be seen as, as a brilliant way to actually tell what

Bee: 00:41:14

it's like to try and remember something.

Nathan: 00:41:16

No, I think nothing is by accident in this movie here.

Nathan: 00:41:18

Cause there's, we talk about geometry, like there's even a moment.

Nathan: 00:41:22

Where the two older actors, older Simone and, and older Bilodeau or the Bishop,

Nathan: 00:41:28

they're actually in the play in the flashback sitting at a dinner table

Nathan: 00:41:32

and yelling Bilodeau serves you wine.

Bee: 00:41:34

And that's the thing is you get further into the more emotional parts

Bee: 00:41:39

of these memories, the more those lines sort of erode and you're, they're

Bee: 00:41:44

trying to put the structure over it.

Bee: 00:41:46

And it's just, I think that's where this movie really.

Bee: 00:41:50

Shines.

Bee: 00:41:50

I can also see where that's where this movie loses its audience

Bee: 00:41:54

if they're not fully engaged.

Bee: 00:41:56

But if you're on board, I was on board.

Bee: 00:41:58

I was like, that's fucking cool.

Bee: 00:42:01

This is where, and this is where

Nathan: 00:42:02

on the first watch, it was like, I was like completely like, what

Nathan: 00:42:05

the hell is, you gotta restart it.

Nathan: 00:42:07

Yeah, yeah.

Nathan: 00:42:08

But here's the problem, and this is why I'm, you know, I don't know.

Nathan: 00:42:12

I'll be honest.

Nathan: 00:42:13

This episode, people, I don't know how many people are going to listen to

Nathan: 00:42:16

our episode on Little East, all right?

Nathan: 00:42:17

Okay, I'm glad we're

Bee: 00:42:18

talking about it just so I can process this stuff because I think I'm

Bee: 00:42:21

talking it into being a vibe for me.

Bee: 00:42:22

But I want to tell

Nathan: 00:42:23

people, if people are listening to this, this movie, we

Nathan: 00:42:27

can't emphasize enough, it has to be watched more than once, this movie.

Bee: 00:42:30

Okay.

Bee: 00:42:30

I think so.

Bee: 00:42:31

Because I don't think

Nathan: 00:42:31

it's possible to, to fully understand and be engaged

Nathan: 00:42:37

in this movie with one watch.

Nathan: 00:42:39

I think we've already proven that.

Nathan: 00:42:40

Duncan, how many times

Bee: 00:42:40

have you seen this?

Duncan: 00:42:42

Maybe four?

Bee: 00:42:44

Yeah.

Bee: 00:42:44

Okay.

Bee: 00:42:45

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:42:45

Yeah.

Bee: 00:42:46

I think

Nathan: 00:42:46

that sounds about right.

Nathan: 00:42:47

I think

Duncan: 00:42:47

that, I, understanding things that I, I didn't get,

Duncan: 00:42:50

like, the first time I watched it.

Bee: 00:42:52

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:42:53

Like, there's a lot of stuff that's very clear, but then, like, some

Duncan: 00:42:55

stuff that you only find out later on.

Duncan: 00:42:58

And I love that moment where, where the actor playing young Bilodeau

Duncan: 00:43:02

serves wine to the actual Bilodeau.

Duncan: 00:43:05

Yes.

Duncan: 00:43:05

Yes.

Duncan: 00:43:06

He just, they have this little look between, that goes between

Duncan: 00:43:09

them that's such a weird little.

Duncan: 00:43:11

I got your number

Bee: 00:43:13

baby.

Duncan: 00:43:13

So cool.

Bee: 00:43:16

I would love if we, oh sorry Nathan do you have anything?

Nathan: 00:43:19

I was going to ask Duncan a question since

Nathan: 00:43:20

you've seen this more than us.

Nathan: 00:43:22

Maybe Bea, you might be able to answer this as well.

Nathan: 00:43:23

There's a plot hole for me personally which I just need

Nathan: 00:43:27

someone to explain to me.

Nathan: 00:43:29

Something.

Nathan: 00:43:30

Why does the Countess sacrifice her son?

Nathan: 00:43:35

Herself.

Nathan: 00:43:36

Mm hmm.

Duncan: 00:43:37

They don't really explain it, it's just she's tired of

Duncan: 00:43:40

living and I think she wants to let her son go be free with Simone.

Duncan: 00:43:45

Mm.

Duncan: 00:43:46

Like she wants to like cut herself out of it.

Duncan: 00:43:49

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:43:50

And let their romantic thing, because she takes the two of them with

Duncan: 00:43:54

her to like help them escape together and like if she was left behind then Valier

Duncan: 00:43:59

would be, you know, Stuck there still.

Nathan: 00:44:02

I mean, I was listening to that conversation very closely and everything

Nathan: 00:44:06

that happened before, right before that is when she discovers, I think her

Nathan: 00:44:09

husband is fooling around too, right?

Nathan: 00:44:11

Not happened.

Duncan: 00:44:13

Her husband has left her and vi Penn they used to be.

Duncan: 00:44:18

And so she's gone crazy.

Duncan: 00:44:20

And the, uh, who is from Paris where they were from, but now they're in Quebec.

Duncan: 00:44:27

Initially lies to the Countess and tells her, Oh yeah, I saw your husband

Duncan: 00:44:32

in Paris, and oh, he was talking about you and he's coming for you soon.

Duncan: 00:44:35

And feeds into the Countess's delusions.

Duncan: 00:44:38

But then after she's hurt so much.

Duncan: 00:44:40

Hurt people,

Bee: 00:44:41

hurt people.

Duncan: 00:44:42

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:44:42

When Simone goes off of Valier and makes the Lydianne cry Lydianne strikes out at

Duncan: 00:44:51

the, the Countess and says, Look I saw your husband with his new wife and their

Duncan: 00:44:56

beautiful young daughter and fuck you.

Bee: 00:45:00

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:45:01

And it's yeah, the, the Lydianne has, I was really struck

Duncan: 00:45:04

by Lydianne's lines about how people laugh at the, the betrayed woman.

Duncan: 00:45:10

On stage while she's coming to just crying and I find myself in this and now i'm

Duncan: 00:45:16

gonna make you that too and like, destroys the Countess's illusions about her

Duncan: 00:45:22

husband and I think that's partly why the countess is ready to give it all up Then

Duncan: 00:45:25

her dreams are just shattered By Lydia.

Duncan: 00:45:28

Okay.

Bee: 00:45:29

Okay.

Bee: 00:45:30

Yeah.

Bee: 00:45:30

I also think there's maybe something about I mean, there's a lot of

Bee: 00:45:33

religious imagery in this movie, right?

Bee: 00:45:36

Obviously.

Bee: 00:45:37

And what is that?

Bee: 00:45:38

I'm trying to, excuse me, the, the play that her, that The two, Simone

Bee: 00:45:44

and Valier and everyone are in that's sort of the catalyst for this, the,

Bee: 00:45:48

it's about the martyrdom of St.

Bee: 00:45:50

Sebastian.

Bee: 00:45:51

Right.

Bee: 00:45:52

And I do think, and we know the Countess is like obsessed with this play.

Bee: 00:45:58

Right?

Bee: 00:45:58

Because she sees her son sort of blossom in it and it's love and, you know, we can

Bee: 00:46:04

project whatever we want to project onto her for what we think her desires are.

Bee: 00:46:08

Why she's so enamored with this particular production, but she is.

Bee: 00:46:14

And I think there's a little martyrdom.

Bee: 00:46:18

Act.

Bee: 00:46:18

Oh, absolutely.

Bee: 00:46:19

Yeah.

Bee: 00:46:19

You know, she, she gets her son, the, the romantic ending hell or high water.

Bee: 00:46:26

There's an enemy involved.

Bee: 00:46:27

And then, you know, just like on the stage, there's, there's a death.

Bee: 00:46:33

There's a murder.

Bee: 00:46:34

So I don't, I don't know how overt it is, but I think there's

Bee: 00:46:39

something, and she's a sick woman.

Bee: 00:46:40

Yeah, and

Duncan: 00:46:44

it should be said, it was like a a queer imagery throughout

Duncan: 00:46:48

most of art throughout the years.

Duncan: 00:46:51

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:46:52

Cause he's like stripped naked and then stabbed by arrows.

Duncan: 00:46:54

So people who want to paint a naked guy and make it seem like something

Duncan: 00:46:58

you can make for the church.

Bee: 00:47:00

That's the

Duncan: 00:47:01

way to go.

Bee: 00:47:02

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Bee: 00:47:05

I did, I did want to hit a little bit on some of the high points,

Bee: 00:47:08

which this kind of did, which for me.

Bee: 00:47:11

The first one was that moment between the countess and the lady when they

Bee: 00:47:15

first meet and she lies and says, Oh yeah, your husband talks about you.

Bee: 00:47:21

I saw him in Paris.

Bee: 00:47:22

He said, all these highfalutin clubs.

Bee: 00:47:23

To me, that is such a,

Bee: 00:47:29

a protective, like communal society moment where two people who are

Bee: 00:47:35

part of the same culture, like, they're just like, you know what?

Bee: 00:47:39

I know what this person needs right now.

Bee: 00:47:41

And it's maybe not what everybody would give them, but this is, it

Bee: 00:47:45

was just so warm and protective.

Bee: 00:47:48

And so the erosion of that at the end of the movie was

Bee: 00:47:51

just so shocking and stunning.

Bee: 00:47:53

But yeah.

Duncan: 00:47:54

She tells Verguet that she has lied.

Duncan: 00:47:57

To his mother, not knowing that it's her son, and it's just.

Duncan: 00:48:03

But

Bee: 00:48:03

she, she says it, I can't remember the line, but she says

Bee: 00:48:06

it in a way that's like knowing.

Bee: 00:48:09

Yeah.

Bee: 00:48:10

In a way that's like, you know, she, when you, when you have a relative

Bee: 00:48:14

who's old and maybe has memory issues and you just sort of help them along.

Bee: 00:48:20

I think it was kind of a touching moment between the two of them.

Duncan: 00:48:25

Absolutely.

Bee: 00:48:26

Yeah.

Bee: 00:48:27

Supportive.

Nathan: 00:48:29

I want to bring up one other thing before we, we take a break.

Nathan: 00:48:33

I, I feel like I got mentioned the, the, the sex scene or the, the, the tub scene.

Nathan: 00:48:38

Cause I felt that was, you know, I found this to be, you know, very tender.

Nathan: 00:48:45

I think it's important to remember that this is 1996, a

Nathan: 00:48:49

time when the erotic thriller.

Nathan: 00:48:53

Was at the peak, we had basic instinct and like sliver proposal,

Nathan: 00:49:00

showgirls, disclosure, color of night.

Nathan: 00:49:04

What else?

Nathan: 00:49:05

I don't know.

Nathan: 00:49:05

But anyways and when you compare lilies to these movies, obviously

Nathan: 00:49:09

these are mainstream movies with mainstream sex scenes, but you know,

Nathan: 00:49:13

homosexual sex scenes often lacked.

Nathan: 00:49:16

I feel like even at this time, like Affectionate in tenderness,

Nathan: 00:49:19

but in contrast, I felt this scene in Lily's was quite beautiful.

Nathan: 00:49:25

It wasn't rushed and it was very artful and it's, it's, it's a

Nathan: 00:49:28

rarity in cinema, especially this time for, for something like this.

Nathan: 00:49:33

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:49:34

So

Duncan: 00:49:34

like coming on the heels of the new queer cinema movement and

Duncan: 00:49:38

like the early nineties where like a lot of independent film became

Duncan: 00:49:43

accessible to people and specifically queer people that they were making.

Duncan: 00:49:47

Gay movies for gay people and not just letting the gay characters

Duncan: 00:49:52

be funny stereotypes in like 80s

Bee: 00:49:56

films.

Duncan: 00:49:56

And so yeah, I think this was really an important film for that,

Duncan: 00:50:00

that this kind of swoony romanticism could be allowed in a gay context.

Bee: 00:50:07

And you get a lot of and again, it's a play within a play, so there's

Bee: 00:50:10

a lot of, context here and nuance and projection that we as an audience are

Bee: 00:50:16

putting onto it, but you see a real diversity of reaction to the homosexuality

Bee: 00:50:22

in this film because, you know, I don't want our review and I'm kind of jumping

Bee: 00:50:27

back and forth in the timeline here, but I don't want to paint it as everyone

Bee: 00:50:30

was so supportive of this relationship.

Bee: 00:50:31

It's no one blinked at it.

Bee: 00:50:33

There's a reason.

Bee: 00:50:34

That's right.

Bee: 00:50:36

There's a reason that Simone was going with, with lady and that.

Bee: 00:50:40

There was some tension in, in the relationship with Valet at all,

Bee: 00:50:43

even at their tender young ages.

Bee: 00:50:45

It was really really hard for them to be together.

Bee: 00:50:49

It was really only one relative that was so supportive.

Bee: 00:50:52

And even Bilodeau, you know, who had these feelings himself suppressed them and went

Bee: 00:50:58

into the church and tried to follow a more traditional path and even tried to woo

Bee: 00:51:01

Simone, who he Loved him afar, who it was not reciprocated to, to come with him.

Duncan: 00:51:07

Yeah, he keeps telling someone that he needs him to, like,

Duncan: 00:51:09

come join the priesthood with him.

Bee: 00:51:11

Right.

Duncan: 00:51:12

Yeah.

Duncan: 00:51:12

But he's clearly in love.

Bee: 00:51:14

Right.

Bee: 00:51:15

But it's, yeah, I mean, his father just, he has to see a medical professional,

Bee: 00:51:21

like, and what seems like that day, I mean, it's, it's brutal and that's when

Bee: 00:51:25

the decision is made that it's like these, this is now a forbidden love.

Bee: 00:51:28

It's gone from a play and something tender and something playful and something that

Bee: 00:51:33

adults on the fringe are comfortable with and supportive of, but now it's real.

Bee: 00:51:40

Yeah.

Bee: 00:51:40

And when it, when it ever gets into, whenever teases into reality, into

Bee: 00:51:47

their daily lives, into a way they could actually affect the adults that are closer

Bee: 00:51:51

to them, it's, it's real danger and the stakes feel really high in this movie.

Bee: 00:51:56

And it's similar.

Bee: 00:51:57

We did Portrait of a Lady on Fire last week, Duncan, and it's similar

Bee: 00:52:01

to that where, you know, it's.

Bee: 00:52:04

You kind of can, you kind of can feel it when they get too close to it,

Bee: 00:52:07

when they get too close to society.

Bee: 00:52:09

Suddenly the stakes get really high, but otherwise it seems like

Bee: 00:52:11

this idyllic kind of romance.

Bee: 00:52:13

Certainly the photography in the film takes a painterly

Bee: 00:52:17

view of what's happening.

Nathan: 00:52:23

You know what?

Nathan: 00:52:24

Upgrading my rating to three and a half.

Bee: 00:52:27

Hell yeah!

Nathan: 00:52:30

There's a lot.

Nathan: 00:52:31

There's a lot.

Nathan: 00:52:31

One

Bee: 00:52:31

of us.

Nathan: 00:52:33

That's as far as I'm going, but it's alright.

Nathan: 00:52:35

I'll take it.

Nathan: 00:52:36

All right.

Nathan: 00:52:36

Let's, let's take a break here.

Nathan: 00:52:38

All right.

Nathan: 00:52:38

If you agree or disagree with our views, don't keep it to yourselves.

Nathan: 00:52:42

Let us know your thoughts.

Nathan: 00:52:43

Sharing your feedback is essential to building a community around

Nathan: 00:52:46

all of our love of movies.

Nathan: 00:52:47

You can do so by sending us an email at back to the frame rate at gmail.

Nathan: 00:52:51

com or finding us on Facebook, Instagram threads, Twitter.

Nathan: 00:52:54

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Nathan: 00:52:55

Yep.

Nathan: 00:52:56

Or YouTube.

Nathan: 00:52:58

Never will.

Nathan: 00:52:58

We also love it.

Nathan: 00:52:59

If you could just take a moment and please leave a solid rating and

Nathan: 00:53:03

review on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to our show.

Nathan: 00:53:08

We thank you all in advance.

Nathan: 00:53:10

Okay.

Nathan: 00:53:10

So next we have our decisions on whether Lily's is going to be.

Nathan: 00:53:19

Saved or purged into the fiery abyss, never to be seen or heard

Nathan: 00:53:25

from again, big stakes here.

Nathan: 00:53:28

High stakes.

Nathan: 00:53:28

Dun, dun, dun.

Nathan: 00:53:30

All right.

Nathan: 00:53:31

So, Duncan, what is your decision and why?

Duncan: 00:53:35

I'm keeping it because it's an important part of queer

Duncan: 00:53:38

history and absolutely beautiful.

Nathan: 00:53:44

B, you're, you're, you're next up.

Nathan: 00:53:46

I'm

Bee: 00:53:47

keeping all these movies, baby.

Bee: 00:53:49

They're good.

Nathan: 00:53:51

Wow, you're making me look like the, like obviously no, but honestly, I, I

Nathan: 00:53:56

am as much as I like a lot of this, I am, I'm still kind of on the fence on this.

Nathan: 00:54:02

I think this is a no, I'm okay.

Nathan: 00:54:08

No offense to anyone here for picking this movie, but it, no, it, I don't

Nathan: 00:54:12

need to, I don't need to save it.

Nathan: 00:54:13

I, I, I will risk the, the, the scorn.

Nathan: 00:54:17

For my friend Duncan here for, for not saying yes, there'll be, there'll be,

Nathan: 00:54:21

there'll be other movies, you know, we

Duncan: 00:54:24

need to see it again before really making a decision.

Bee: 00:54:28

Third time's the charm.

Nathan: 00:54:32

But you know what?

Nathan: 00:54:33

It doesn't matter because on our podcast, majority rules, and

Nathan: 00:54:36

because two out of three say that it is saved, it is going to be.

Nathan: 00:54:40

Put into our vault to be saved for the next generation after the

Nathan: 00:54:46

apocalypse when we emerge and we can show it to everybody again.

Nathan: 00:54:50

So here we go.

Nathan: 00:54:51

Walked away.

Nathan: 00:55:04

All right.

Nathan: 00:55:05

So next up.

Nathan: 00:55:06

Just for Carver's

Bee: 00:55:07

performance, sorry.

Nathan: 00:55:09

Yeah, you know what, this movie actually made me want to

Nathan: 00:55:11

seek out more films that he is in.

Bee: 00:55:14

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:55:15

That, if any, that's my biggest take from this, I, I

Nathan: 00:55:18

want to see more that he's done.

Duncan: 00:55:21

He was mostly a stage actor, but there's a couple films out there.

Nathan: 00:55:24

I don't care, I need to seek out other things, whatever he's done.

Nathan: 00:55:28

He, he, he, he stole every scene he was in for me.

Nathan: 00:55:31

There was a recording of

Duncan: 00:55:32

the Stratford Canadian company doing Pirates of Penzance

Duncan: 00:55:36

where he plays the Pirate King.

Duncan: 00:55:37

Wanna look that shit up?

Duncan: 00:55:39

I

Bee: 00:55:40

do!

Duncan: 00:55:41

Jeff, are

Bee: 00:55:42

you

Duncan: 00:55:42

as special as Frederick?

Bee: 00:55:45

I live in Boston, that means I inject Gilbert and Sullivan

Bee: 00:55:49

into my veins like a fucking dick.

Bee: 00:55:52

Yeah, I don't wanna see that.

Nathan: 00:55:58

Alright guys, let's do our, let's do our movie pairings this week.

Bumper: 00:56:05

Excuse me.

Bumper: 00:56:05

Can you help me?

Bumper: 00:56:06

I'm at an absolute loss.

Bumper: 00:56:07

I've been looking for over an hour and I'm losing my mind.

Bumper: 00:56:10

What I'm in the mood for is sort of a A Catherine Hepburn

Bumper: 00:56:13

y, Cary Grant y kind of thing.

Bumper: 00:56:14

Nothing heavy.

Bumper: 00:56:15

I couldn't take heavy.

Bumper: 00:56:17

No, something zany.

Bumper: 00:56:17

I'm looking for something zany.

Bumper: 00:56:19

Or something modern would be fine, too, like a Goldie Hawn

Bumper: 00:56:23

y, Chevy Chase y kind of thing.

Bumper: 00:56:24

You know, funny.

Bumper: 00:56:25

I want to laugh.

Bumper: 00:56:26

I have to laugh tonight, really.

Bumper: 00:56:28

Oh, oh, oh.

Bumper: 00:56:28

Do you have anything with that comedian?

Bumper: 00:56:30

He's on that show.

Bumper: 00:56:31

It's on the radio.

Bumper: 00:56:33

You know the guy?

Bumper: 00:56:34

He says, Hey, forgive me . I get such a kick outta the way he says that.

Bumper: 00:56:39

He's so god damn adorable.

Bumper: 00:56:41

That would be perfect.

Bumper: 00:56:42

Didn't he make a movie?

Bumper: 00:56:45

Ordinary Pee Polls.

Duncan: 00:56:49

Kind of a big city spread cheeky kind of thing.

Nathan: 00:56:52

Yeah.

Nathan: 00:56:54

I cut it off before that.

Nathan: 00:56:55

I don't know why, but I do.

Nathan: 00:57:00

You know, that's the movie we're supposed to get to.

Nathan: 00:57:02

Cause I I won our Oscar bet and we just haven't gotten to it yet.

Nathan: 00:57:06

We gotta do the Fisher King.

Nathan: 00:57:08

We gotta do a rewatch of that.

Nathan: 00:57:10

I actually bought the 4k, Criterion 4k, like two months ago, cause

Nathan: 00:57:16

we were going to watch it in a week and it's just sitting there.

Nathan: 00:57:18

It's still in its wrapper.

Nathan: 00:57:20

Like I got to get in my damn.

Nathan: 00:57:23

All right.

Nathan: 00:57:24

Well, Duncan, do you have a pick for us this week?

Nathan: 00:57:27

Yes.

Duncan: 00:57:28

The previous movie by the same director, John Grayson.

Duncan: 00:57:32

from 1993, Zero Patients.

Duncan: 00:57:34

I

Bee: 00:57:34

was looking into that.

Duncan: 00:57:36

Yeah, it is sort of trying to refute the concept of patient zero

Duncan: 00:57:41

in starting AIDS and spreading AIDS.

Duncan: 00:57:44

And it's very Canadian as well because the alleged patient zero

Duncan: 00:57:49

was a Canadian flight attendant.

Duncan: 00:57:51

And it's him teaming up with Sir Richard Francis Burton, who has

Duncan: 00:57:56

gone through How do you say that?

Duncan: 00:57:58

The Fountain of Youth, and is like a hundred something years old, and

Duncan: 00:58:01

working in a museum, and making a thing about plagues throughout the years.

Duncan: 00:58:05

And so the two of them, he wants to get Patient Zero to be his his

Duncan: 00:58:10

AIDS exhibit in, in the museum.

Duncan: 00:58:13

Sounds cool as hell.

Duncan: 00:58:14

And it's also a musical.

Duncan: 00:58:17

Wow.

Duncan: 00:58:17

And it's singing buttholes.

Duncan: 00:58:20

It's, it's absolutely crazy and really, really amazing.

Duncan: 00:58:25

Okay.

Bee: 00:58:26

After this pod, I have a movie for you.

Bee: 00:58:28

We'll talk.

Bee: 00:58:30

You had me at singing butthole.

Nathan: 00:58:34

And it looks like it's it's, it's on VOD is where you can find it now.

Nathan: 00:58:39

It

Duncan: 00:58:39

shows up on the Criterion channel from time to time, but

Duncan: 00:58:41

I don't think it's regular.

Duncan: 00:58:43

I've seen a different way.

Bee: 00:58:44

Okay, cool.

Duncan: 00:58:45

Keep an eye out for it.

Nathan: 00:58:46

Alright, thank you.

Nathan: 00:58:47

Alright.

Nathan: 00:58:49

B, you're next

Bee: 00:58:50

man.

Bee: 00:58:50

I feel like I have name dropped a gajillion movies in this particular

Bee: 00:58:54

podcast, just 'cause this does feel so, although it is super unique and,

Bee: 00:58:59

and niche and special, it does feel like it comes from somewhere, you know?

Bee: 00:59:05

And, and I think you can.

Bee: 00:59:07

feel that in the whole movie.

Bee: 00:59:10

I struggled with a pairing because there's a lot, actually,

Bee: 00:59:14

that I think would be great.

Bee: 00:59:15

And there's some movies that we've recommended before.

Bee: 00:59:18

I mentioned Dead Poets Society for that gentle, tender, queer,

Bee: 00:59:22

soft lighting 90s kind of thing.

Bee: 00:59:24

I think that would work.

Bee: 00:59:26

I, I ended up with Lawrence Olivier's Henry V for that stage and cinema

Bee: 00:59:35

kind of contrasting experience.

Bee: 00:59:37

I also think Hamlet, Olivier's Hamlet kind of works for this.

Bee: 00:59:41

Again, it just does feel like that tragic young romance, but Olivier's adaptation

Bee: 00:59:47

specifically really seemed to work for it.

Bee: 00:59:49

Although Alexander Chapman's lady performance Lillianne did remind me of

Bee: 00:59:54

Mercutio in Bas's Romeo and Juliet, which was a very special performance as well.

Bee: 01:00:00

So, and a movie that is A favorite of mine.

Bee: 01:00:03

So, but yeah, I think there's a lot of directions that you could,

Bee: 01:00:07

you could take this movie and have a great double feature day with.

Bee: 01:00:09

All

Nathan: 01:00:12

right.

Nathan: 01:00:13

That's looks like it's on prime video and yeah.

Nathan: 01:00:17

And Criterion to be it's everywhere as it should be.

Nathan: 01:00:24

All right.

Nathan: 01:00:25

So my turn, my movie pairing this week might be a little bit of a stretch

Nathan: 01:00:32

because as you just heard, I had some difficulties finding my Avenue with

Nathan: 01:00:38

lilies, but I do applaud, you know, anytime a director is telling me a

Nathan: 01:00:44

story through non conventional ways.

Nathan: 01:00:46

And as much as I found the thin veil that separated the play within the movie and

Nathan: 01:00:53

the inmates performing in the prison, a little dizzying, it was a striking

Nathan: 01:00:58

choice and I can appreciate the effort.

Nathan: 01:01:01

I love,

Bee: 01:01:01

I love.

Bee: 01:01:02

Didn't you tell me that was once the worst insult you could give a film?

Duncan: 01:01:06

Yep.

Bee: 01:01:09

I, I

Duncan: 01:01:09

love

Nathan: 01:01:12

I love movies about the art of performance, stories about characters

Nathan: 01:01:17

who put on a show for an audience, because as we all know, I, and I know

Nathan: 01:01:22

you know this Duncan, the backstage of these plays, the human dramas that

Nathan: 01:01:26

are going on behind the curtain can be just as riveting as what's on stage.

Bee: 01:01:30

Absolutely.

Nathan: 01:01:31

Hence the movie pairing for a perfect double feature.

Nathan: 01:01:36

That I'm picking is Opening Night from John Cassavetes.

Nathan: 01:01:39

Oh, word.

Nathan: 01:01:41

Okay.

Nathan: 01:01:42

I haven't seen this in a while, but I do believe that this is one of his best.

Nathan: 01:01:47

Yeah.

Nathan: 01:01:47

It has an electric performance from Gina Rollins, who plays, Aging

Nathan: 01:01:53

actress, Ben Gazzara is the director.

Nathan: 01:01:56

The film is like this exploration of a lot of emotional baggage,

Nathan: 01:02:01

aging, identity, guilt.

Nathan: 01:02:04

There's

Nathan: 01:02:04

a horrific thing that happens in the beginning that

Nathan: 01:02:07

sort of sets everything in motion.

Nathan: 01:02:09

Yeah.

Nathan: 01:02:09

Good movie.

Nathan: 01:02:10

Watch it everyone.

Nathan: 01:02:12

It's on Macs, Criterion, and VOD.

Bee: 01:02:15

Nathan, have you seen The Headless Woman, Lucretia Martel?

Bee: 01:02:18

She did La Cienega.

Bee: 01:02:21

It's sort of like a South American remake of opening night.

Bee: 01:02:24

It's good.

Bee: 01:02:25

Oh, I didn't know it.

Bee: 01:02:28

I may or may not have it on Blu ray.

Bee: 01:02:29

I can pass them along.

Nathan: 01:02:30

Those are our picks.

Nathan: 01:02:34

You know what?

Nathan: 01:02:35

If you listen to this, let us know.

Nathan: 01:02:37

If you like these pics, if you got other ones that you would suggest as

Nathan: 01:02:40

double feature, we would love to know.

Nathan: 01:02:43

So yeah.

Nathan: 01:02:45

All right.

Nathan: 01:02:45

One last segment before we're out of here and new segment called weekly

Nathan: 01:02:50

highlight again, voluntary for everyone here, but it's just, Anyone here wants

Nathan: 01:02:54

to just mention something that a piece of media that they watch this week could

Nathan: 01:02:58

be movie, TV show, theater, anything, doesn't that matter that they took

Nathan: 01:03:03

in this week that they want to share?

Duncan: 01:03:04

There's a really cool cartoon on Disney plus called Kiss.

Duncan: 01:03:10

It's about a squirrel and her best friend who's a rabbit and

Duncan: 01:03:14

it's made by these South African.

Duncan: 01:03:17

People and it's really funny and really cute and clearly made for kids, but

Duncan: 01:03:22

with such surreal weird humor It's set in this place called table town where

Duncan: 01:03:28

it's talking animals, but also there are witches and centaurs and all kinds of

Duncan: 01:03:34

weird magical creatures and It's so funny.

Duncan: 01:03:38

I have laughed so hard at this show and it's very sweet and very

Duncan: 01:03:41

good But like the humor is just off the charts highly recommend it K

Bee: 01:03:44

I F F?

Bee: 01:03:45

K I F F.

Nathan: 01:03:47

Two F's.

Nathan: 01:03:47

I just saw that.

Nathan: 01:03:48

Okay.

Nathan: 01:03:49

TV show on Disney Plus.

Nathan: 01:03:50

Well, that is not what I expected, Duncan, but that's so cool.

Nathan: 01:03:54

All right.

Nathan: 01:03:55

What age group would you say this is targeted for?

Nathan: 01:03:58

I know you're saying you're enjoying it, but what demographic, what age

Nathan: 01:04:01

group are you saying this is for?

Nathan: 01:04:03

Would my kids like this?

Nathan: 01:04:04

I got 12 and a seven year old.

Nathan: 01:04:06

Oh yeah.

Duncan: 01:04:06

I think it's like, yeah, like seven or eight.

Nathan: 01:04:08

Okay.

Duncan: 01:04:09

And 32.

Duncan: 01:04:11

Like, like, adults will enjoy it as well.

Duncan: 01:04:13

Like, there's some really great, really funny stuff.

Nathan: 01:04:17

Oh, awesome.

Nathan: 01:04:18

That's awesome.

Nathan: 01:04:18

Alright, I'll have to check that out.

Bee: 01:04:19

Yeah.

Bee: 01:04:20

Let me ask you something.

Bee: 01:04:21

You guys up on Hundreds of Beavers?

Bee: 01:04:23

Yes.

Bee: 01:04:23

Yes.

Bee: 01:04:24

Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Bee: 01:04:28

I I, I caught up on Hundreds of Beavers this week.

Bee: 01:04:30

That was weird.

Bee: 01:04:31

I liked it.

Bee: 01:04:32

I liked it.

Bee: 01:04:33

I think that was a movie that could have been a TV show.

Bee: 01:04:37

But it was, it was real goofy and real weird.

Bee: 01:04:40

And I liked it.

Bee: 01:04:41

It kind of felt like a little, like Guy Madden meets Buster Keaton.

Bee: 01:04:44

Like I was into it.

Bee: 01:04:46

It was, It's awesome.

Bee: 01:04:47

Nathan, if you're not up on hundreds of beavers hop on, I

Bee: 01:04:50

think Netflix, check it out.

Duncan: 01:04:51

Yeah,

Bee: 01:04:56

that's probably right.

Bee: 01:04:57

Yeah.

Bee: 01:04:58

And a TV show that could have been a movie baby reindeer, mini series, really

Bee: 01:05:04

good, really fucked up, which I was into, but I do think also would've made a good

Nathan: 01:05:10

I guess the main thing I'll mention this week, I, I've shared

Nathan: 01:05:14

this on the podcast that I've been slowly going through my own personal

Nathan: 01:05:19

journey with the Robert Altman show.

Nathan: 01:05:22

Yes.

Nathan: 01:05:24

Did you make it through the 80s?

Nathan: 01:05:26

I made it through the 80s, which is a rough period.

Nathan: 01:05:29

But the the nineties there's a resurgence and it started with the

Nathan: 01:05:33

player, which came out in 92 and I, and this was actually, actually, this is

Nathan: 01:05:38

the first Altman film I ever watched.

Nathan: 01:05:41

And it is, it is, I have to put this funny and the pantheon of films that I

Nathan: 01:05:47

credit for, for being probably a major influence on my career of getting into

Nathan: 01:05:52

filmmaking and in that, in that world.

Nathan: 01:05:55

This is stars Tim Robbins as a studio producer who gets caught

Nathan: 01:05:59

up in covering up a murder, you know, of a murder of a writer.

Nathan: 01:06:04

This movie is so many things that's steeped in, you know, Hollywood culture

Nathan: 01:06:08

and the history with more references than it's possible to keep track of there.

Nathan: 01:06:12

I think there are 65 cameos from known actors playing themselves in this film.

Nathan: 01:06:17

But the cast also is awesome, like Fred Ward and Whoopi Goldberg.

Nathan: 01:06:20

Brian James, Peter Gallagher, rep Replicant, you know and Peter Gallagher.

Nathan: 01:06:27

Is Cynthia Stevenson.

Nathan: 01:06:29

Yeah.

Nathan: 01:06:29

Vincent Donofrio.

Nathan: 01:06:31

Richard E.

Nathan: 01:06:31

Grant also.

Nathan: 01:06:32

Oh no.

Nathan: 01:06:32

Richard Grant and Dean Richard E.

Nathan: 01:06:34

Grant and Dean Stockwell played this tandem who are pitching this movie idea

Nathan: 01:06:38

to Tim Robbins and they're so good.

Nathan: 01:06:40

You know, Mm-Hmm.

Nathan: 01:06:40

Just trying to get him to, to make this movie.

Nathan: 01:06:43

And it's just, you know, it's really just about the, the commentary in the

Nathan: 01:06:47

Hollywood system, the power dynamics and the struggle of art versus commerce,

Nathan: 01:06:52

celebrity culture basically in all, in the superficiality of it all too.

Nathan: 01:06:57

So highly entertaining.

Nathan: 01:06:59

I haven't seen it probably like 15, 18 years.

Nathan: 01:07:02

And it's probably, I think still Altman's most accessible film.

Nathan: 01:07:07

You know, I mean, I don't know which is best.

Nathan: 01:07:11

You can just put it on and it's so easy to follow because

Nathan: 01:07:14

it's, it's just, it's popcorn.

Nathan: 01:07:16

The movie's popcorn.

Nathan: 01:07:17

So yeah.

Nathan: 01:07:18

That's a lot of fun.

Nathan: 01:07:18

That's a

Bee: 01:07:19

cool, yeah.

Bee: 01:07:21

It's a big deal, Nathan.

Nathan: 01:07:22

Yeah.

Nathan: 01:07:22

So I'm, I'm about to go on to the next movie is, is Short Cuts, which I have

Bee: 01:07:27

never seen.

Bee: 01:07:28

I've never

Duncan: 01:07:29

seen.

Bee: 01:07:30

Have you seen, Duncan?

Duncan: 01:07:32

No, I'm not actually,

Bee: 01:07:33

which

Duncan: 01:07:36

is the one after that,

Nathan: 01:07:38

which is ready to wear, which I don't the American translation.

Nathan: 01:07:41

I, I saw that a long time ago.

Nathan: 01:07:43

I don't remember anything, but this is now the 26th out of 35 or 36

Nathan: 01:07:48

features I'm in the home stretch.

Bee: 01:07:51

Yeah.

Nathan: 01:07:51

My goal is to finish these before the end of the summer,

Nathan: 01:07:54

because I think I finished a whole filmography like once a year.

Nathan: 01:07:57

I mean you

Bee: 01:07:58

got Gosford Park coming up.

Bee: 01:07:59

I

Nathan: 01:08:01

love Gosford Park.

Nathan: 01:08:01

I like this last two a lot.

Nathan: 01:08:02

I like Prairie Home Companion and Gosford Park a lot.

Nathan: 01:08:05

So, those will be easy.

Nathan: 01:08:07

But there's a whole bunch in the late 90s I have not seen.

Nathan: 01:08:09

I have not seen the Gingerbread Man.

Nathan: 01:08:11

I have not seen Kansas City.

Nathan: 01:08:14

I have not, like I said, I haven't seen Short Cuts.

Nathan: 01:08:16

There's one other in there.

Nathan: 01:08:18

I haven't seen so it'll be, there'll be a fun, um, fourth Prada

Bee: 01:08:23

Porter's good though, too, though.

Bee: 01:08:24

You do have that Forest Whitaker, right?

Duncan: 01:08:27

Yeah.

Duncan: 01:08:27

He's in that.

Duncan: 01:08:28

Yeah.

Bee: 01:08:28

Yeah.

Duncan: 01:08:29

Yeah.

Duncan: 01:08:29

That's, that's, that's when there's a whole bunch of different cameos.

Nathan: 01:08:31

The last thing I'll just say, and I'm going to save this

Nathan: 01:08:37

for maybe a more featured review.

Nathan: 01:08:39

Cause you know, on our YouTube channel, I do release reviews on my own.

Nathan: 01:08:46

I saw inside Out too yesterday.

Nathan: 01:08:48

I'm seeing that this week.

Nathan: 01:08:50

I won't say much about it, but big thumbs up.

Nathan: 01:08:53

I'll say thumbs up on it.

Nathan: 01:08:53

Yeah.

Bee: 01:08:54

Yeah, I'm excited.

Nathan: 01:08:55

I, I, I did like it a lot and I, the, the wait was worth it.

Bee: 01:08:59

Nice.

Duncan: 01:09:01

Oh, I should say, I'm actually seeing Zero Patience on

Duncan: 01:09:04

the big screen, Alamo is showing it and I'm seeing it on Wednesday.

Duncan: 01:09:08

In New York?

Duncan: 01:09:09

In the Sony

Nathan: 01:09:10

Theater?

Nathan: 01:09:13

The Sony Japanese?

Nathan: 01:09:15

I will,

Bee: 01:09:16

if there's a movie I love, I will drive to New York to go and see it.

Bee: 01:09:19

So that is tempting.

Bee: 01:09:20

I drove to Metrograph for The Great Silence, the Spaghetti Western,

Bee: 01:09:26

Corbucci is one of my favorite films.

Bee: 01:09:28

And then The Angelica, which I don't love The Angelica.

Bee: 01:09:31

But The Angelica was doing Asteroid City, which I want to go see.

Nathan: 01:09:35

That was fun.

Nathan: 01:09:36

Four years ago, I was in New York City for the, The film week.

Nathan: 01:09:41

So it was like the independent, like film conference and I stayed an extra

Nathan: 01:09:45

day and I just spent the entire day in, in Brooklyn and I saw five movies

Nathan: 01:09:52

at the Alamo draft house there.

Bee: 01:09:53

Hell yeah.

Bee: 01:09:55

Hell yeah.

Nathan: 01:09:56

One of, one of which I think was Miles Davis the, the cool, what was it?

Nathan: 01:10:01

His, the biopic about Miles Davis from like five years ago.

Nathan: 01:10:04

Oh yeah.

Nathan: 01:10:05

The one with

Bee: 01:10:05

Denzel.

Nathan: 01:10:07

No, no, it wasn't a biopic.

Nathan: 01:10:08

Sorry, it was a documentary.

Nathan: 01:10:09

No.

Nathan: 01:10:09

Oh man, I'm blanking on it.

Nathan: 01:10:11

Hang on, I'm gonna know.

Nathan: 01:10:14

And as you pull that up, it's one of the best documentaries

Nathan: 01:10:17

I've ever seen in my life.

Nathan: 01:10:18

There's Miles Ahead, or?

Nathan: 01:10:21

Miles Davis great podcasting going on here.

Nathan: 01:10:26

It's called Birth of the Cool.

Nathan: 01:10:28

Birth of the Cool?

Nathan: 01:10:29

It is, Birth of the Cool.

Nathan: 01:10:30

It is amazing.

Nathan: 01:10:31

And, I saw Quadrophenia.

Nathan: 01:10:33

Oh, nice, which is really good.

Nathan: 01:10:38

Actually, I, I, it's not my favorite who album, but seeing

Nathan: 01:10:42

it actually had a great time.

Nathan: 01:10:43

It was a midnight screening of quadrophenia at the draft house, which

Nathan: 01:10:48

was, which was, which was a midnight

Bee: 01:10:50

screening of anything can really bring out the best.

Bee: 01:10:53

I saw, um, who is it?

Bee: 01:10:55

The star man.

Bee: 01:10:57

And that was really good at Coolidge Corner Theater.

Bee: 01:10:59

That was a fun one.

Nathan: 01:11:00

Starman is my second favorite Carpenter.

Bee: 01:11:02

Really?

Bee: 01:11:04

Okay, I really love In the Mouth of Madness.

Duncan: 01:11:09

That's the first carpet movie I ever saw.

Bee: 01:11:11

It's good.

Bee: 01:11:12

It's really fucking scary.

Bee: 01:11:15

Yeah.

Duncan: 01:11:17

I saw Clue and that was fucking amazing.

Bee: 01:11:20

Oh, that sounds fun.

Bee: 01:11:22

Yeah.

Bee: 01:11:23

I would rather go to that than a Rocky Horror Screening, I think.

Nathan: 01:11:28

Duncan, before we go, please, just one last time.

Nathan: 01:11:31

First of all, I want to thank you again for, for joining us this

Nathan: 01:11:34

evening for our discussion of lilies.

Nathan: 01:11:37

I hope you had a good time.

Nathan: 01:11:41

Will you join us again sometime if we call

Duncan: 01:11:43

upon you?

Duncan: 01:11:45

Passing future guests.

Duncan: 01:11:46

Do you want to do zero patients for next year's pride?

Duncan: 01:11:49

Let me know.

Duncan: 01:11:49

Not saying

Bee: 01:11:50

no.

Bee: 01:11:52

We could also, we've done apocalyptic themes before.

Bee: 01:11:55

We could do like, You know plague breakout movies.

Bee: 01:11:59

Oh, that'd be a fun march.

Bee: 01:12:01

Memory

Nathan: 01:12:05

Alright Duncan, one last time, please share where the audience where best

Nathan: 01:12:09

people to the best way of finding you.

Duncan: 01:12:11

Yep.

Duncan: 01:12:11

Besides your

Nathan: 01:12:11

home.

Duncan: 01:12:12

Best place is duncan plaster com N cn P-A-S-T-E com.

Duncan: 01:12:18

Or you can find me pretty much I'm on most of the socials.

Duncan: 01:12:22

I'm on blue if anybody still using.

Duncan: 01:12:27

Yeah, it was a Twitter alternative that some people started using.

Duncan: 01:12:30

With the one that Donald Trump uses?

Duncan: 01:12:32

Oh, no, I don't think so.

Nathan: 01:12:33

Okay, good.

Nathan: 01:12:35

Great.

Nathan: 01:12:35

And, and everyone out there, please check out pansy vision, which is

Nathan: 01:12:38

coming out, comes out once a week.

Nathan: 01:12:41

Is your episode out already?

Duncan: 01:12:42

Yeah, the first episode I wrote is out, it's the biblical epic

Duncan: 01:12:46

I think it came out two weeks ago.

Nathan: 01:12:48

Great.

Nathan: 01:12:49

So I encourage everyone to check that out.

Nathan: 01:12:51

I'm going to watch it as soon as I can.

Nathan: 01:12:52

And yeah, good stuff.

Nathan: 01:12:55

I look forward to seeing more of what you do.

Nathan: 01:12:57

Hopefully I'll get down to New York sometime.

Nathan: 01:13:00

I'll get to hang with you and see, see, see one of your productions.

Nathan: 01:13:05

Live in the flesh sometime.

Nathan: 01:13:06

We'll see.

Nathan: 01:13:07

All right.

Nathan: 01:13:08

Very good.

Nathan: 01:13:10

Okay.

Nathan: 01:13:11

Well, thank you for dialing into our transmission.

Nathan: 01:13:15

If that, my God, that is the wrong thing here.

Nathan: 01:13:18

That is our show this week.

Nathan: 01:13:20

Back to the framerate is part of the Western media podcast network.

Nathan: 01:13:23

We also wish to thank Brian Ellsworth for our show.

Nathan: 01:13:26

Opening on behalf of all of us.

Nathan: 01:13:28

We bid you farewell from the fallout shelter.

Nathan: 01:13:31

Your presence in our underground sanctuary is truly appreciated.

Nathan: 01:13:34

We are truly sorry.

Nathan: 01:13:35

You cannot join us, but we want to express our gratitude for your company.

Nathan: 01:13:39

If you're finding solace in our discussions, we kindly

Nathan: 01:13:42

ask that you please subscribe.

Nathan: 01:13:44

Leave a rating and review.

Nathan: 01:13:45

You can find more episodes of this podcast on back to the frame rate.

Nathan: 01:13:49

Dot com in our handle on our socials is back frame rate.

Nathan: 01:13:54

Your support is the beacon of light that brightens our confined space.

Nathan: 01:13:58

Head on over to Apple podcasts, spatter Spotify, Spotify, whatever music or

Nathan: 01:14:06

whichever portal connects you to our broadcast and share your thoughts

Nathan: 01:14:10

until we emerge from the fallout.

Nathan: 01:14:12

Stay with us, keep hope alive, and keep those reviews coming.

Nathan: 01:14:17

Back to the framerate, signing off.

Nathan: 01:14:37

I want you to know it's over.

Nathan: 01:14:41

Will.

Nathan: 01:14:42

No.

Nathan: 01:14:45

Bye.

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