Olivia Black is a Chicago-based Pro Domme. We talk about so many things, but the episode mostly focuses on the concepts of shame and stigma as it relates to kink and the BDSM community.

Olivia Black Links:

Website: themsoblack.com

Twitter: @MsOliviaBlack7

Instagram: @msoliviablack777

Things We Mention:

Patrick Califia, Trans BDSM activist

Lydia Schiller, Dominatrix of Chicago

You're Wrong About Podcast: Disco Demolition Episode

Daughter's of Darkness (Lesbian Vampire Erotica) edited by Pam Keesey

Parker

Welcome to a sex workers Guide to the Galaxy, where the answer to life the universe and everything is sex workers. I'm your host, Parker Westwood. Today we get to talk about shame and stigma mostly around kinks, but a bit around sex work. We also get to talk about the BDSM community and the difference between Pro and lifestyle BDSM. I don't know that we really reach a conclusion, but it's a really fascinating conversation. You'll notice that partway through I think pretty early on in the interview, my audio gets pretty noticeably shittier. My microphone stopped working. So forgive me that we're just working with my computer's audio, which isn't terrible, but it's the thing that happened. We're learning. So that's that. My guest on the show today is Miss Olivia Black, a pro DOM based out of Chicago. She's stunning. And her mind is just as beautiful as her physical being. And I'm excited to share this conversation with all of you. So let's just dive in. I'm going to have you I usually just let people introduce themselves, the way they prefer to be introduced so include a pronoun and let our listeners know who you are and what kind of sex work you do.

Olivia Black

Okay, hello, everybody. My name is Olivia black. My pronouns are she and her. And I am a professional dominatrix Do you like how I'm leaning into the camera? By the way? I'm like,

Parker

I do

Olivia Black

like, I'm really [garbled] hi.

Parker

It's the best way to do it. If you pretend, yes. Pretend they're there.

Olivia Black

[garbled] I'm talking to and I'm really just like staring at myself.

Parker

That's what I do

Olivia Black

Yes. Hi, I'm Olivia. I'm in Chicago. I'm a pro DOM. And that's it.

Parker

Wonderful, do you, we had an episode where someone explained what the term pro DOM meant to them. Do you want to expound on what that term means for you?

Olivia Black

Sure. I would say a professional dominatrix, to me means a practitioner who has studied under other professional dominants, I would say, to learn the skill set needed to safely take someone through a BDSM scene and kinks and fetishes without sending them to the hospital. Unintentionally, I should say.

Parker

very important.

Olivia Black

Yeah.

Parker

So how did you get started in the sex work industry?

Olivia Black

Also, I'm afraid that everybody's gonna start misunderstanding like, how much of a dork I am in this interview? which may be a good thing? I don't know, I think people are really afraid of me. And so maybe when they hear me talk in a kind of a nerdy way, they'll be okay with it.

Parker

I don't know. Yeah, people should be afraid of nerds. We we can dominate the world if we want to.

Olivia Black

That's very true. How did I get started? Well, I've always I've always been interested in BDSM. I think. I've also always been pretty familiar with the body's relationship to pain because I was a dancer. I took dance classes since I was two all the way up through professional apprenticeship when in my mid 20s. So, pain and the body and discipline were something that was something that I really understood. I was very familiar with. So there's that. And then I was just always kind of drawn to the darker side of things. I had vampire dreams when I was four. I grew up in the middle of the woods. I was an only child so it was just like scary all the time. Like it was like living in this weird, like Dracula fairy tale like surrounded by pine forests. And I would just sit up there and read weird thing. It was very isolated. So I read a lot we had TV but not really we have like two channels. This is like back in antenna times. There was no cable yet. Like satellite dishes, which we also didn't have. And so, I would just read any and all books I could get my hands on and I came upon this one book when I was about 11 that I thought was about a dancer. So, I was like oh, this is fun I was in my dad's library, it had a picture of like this woman in this tulle skirt on the cover and she was like, bent over, I think she was topless. But it didn't really register in my head what was happening. I just saw what I thought was like a dancer. And I started reading it. And it was this book called A Man and His Maid which is apparently this famous Victorian BDSM porn book.

Parker

yeah Oh,

Olivia Black

Written quite, honestly, and it's like, quite famous. Anyway, that was the first time I ever had an orgasm was to this book. So like it was a BDSM porn novel that I thought was actually about dancers, but it wasn't. So that was the beginning of everything. And then I just kind of went from there, I started experimenting with friends. I got my hands on another book, written by a BDSM activist, his name is Pat Califia. He is trans. This was written back before his transition. And it was about a dominatrix. And it was technically written. It was beautiful. I had never really read something like that A Man and His Maid was a lot of suckling and bondage and forced orgasms and things like this, but this one short story called The Vampire, because I was a very goth teenager

Parker

Same

Olivia Black

was about this DOM . Right? I know, was about this Dom named Kerry. K E. R R Y. And she wore a brown leathers instead of black, which I thought was really cool. Not my aesthetic, but I really liked that she was very rebellious.

Parker

Yes

Olivia Black

And the author Pat described her basically giving this incredible corporal punishment scene to this guy in this bar. And I it was like a lightning bolt shot through me. I was like, this is what I want to do. Like this is it was I always called it like, ironically and maybe a pun intended. I don't know like my sub dream in life.

Parker

Yes so hot

Olivia Black

I would, I had this dream to become a dancer. But I also wanted to be a professional dominatrix once and especially after I read that, and just reading like how this woman like wielded this whip and sent this man who was this dick to her being like, Oh, you're this tiny little thing. You can't hurt me like what are you gonna do with that? And she like instantly, just took over complete control. And like, brutalized him, which was

Parker

So hot

Olivia Black

I know it was amazing he was bloody at the end like and and because Pat Califia was such an activist and an active BDSM practitioner it was technically written very accurately so it wasn't like bullshit, whatever that book is that we will not name here where its just filled with non-consent and like all this other bullshit.

Parker

So problematic .

Olivia Black

Yeah, it was actually like a real, a real depiction of what happens so that, so I moved to San or moved to Chicago when I was almost 19 and found a dungeon called The Pillary, which is no longer around. It was held at this BDSM store slash club called The Leather Rose. And I apprenticed under the head DOM there, her name was Mistress Victoria. But then I also apprentice under another DOM called Lydia Schiller, who was also a very famous DOM in Chicago and around she's amazing, incredible woman. I think she's retired now. But yeah, I had the pleasure of being able to learn a lot from them. And that was it. I've been doing it ever since.

Parker

That's incredible. I relate to the origin story in that like it all it starts young like it, you just know that it's something you're into really young. And I generally on the show will ask people to kind of take us through. Like what does a day in the life of look like for you?

Olivia Black

A Day in the Life of Ms. Olivia Black? Let's see. What do I do? I'm usually woken up by my cat Fossey very aggressively trying to cuddle with me because she's trying to get me up. Which is pretty annoying

Parker

She’s the cutest cat ever.

Olivia Black

She is pretty cute. She's a pain in the butt. She's very cute. She'll like, aggressively like cuddle with me and lick my face and things And then I don't know I usually wake up I have to have at least three cups of tea before I am able to function in the world I will say on here that I usually work out and I usually do I go through phases though, but I do find that I working out is important for me and just to keep my body in motion and also my head a little calm. So, I usually I don't know half an hour of activity whether that's like strength or I got a peloton for my birthday this year.

Parker

Yes

Olivia Black

that was exciting. I know it's really good. Also, by the way, I so you can hashtag your your peloton. Name profile,

Parker

Oh

Olivia Black

so, people can find you. So, I hello, puns, hashtag masochist under my name. And I'm telling you guys, I am the only person in the peloton universe to have used or made this hashtag. I am the only one. So like, there's group to be involved in or you can like put as many hashtags as you want. And there's not another masochist out there. And I think it's crazy because I think all crazy fitness people are essentially masochists I mean, it fucking hurts and it sucks, but we do it and then feel better after very much like getting beaten in a space, right? Yeah, so I'm the only masochist so if anybody wants to come and join my little masochist group, if you have a peloton bike, I highly recommend you just hashtag a little masochist and then you can see MLB which is me Miss Olivia Black on there. And then we can all have our own little kink scene and everybody can get fit together.

Parker

I love that.

Olivia Black

So join me. Anyway, a day in the life sorry to get off on a sidetrack. I just like oh, this is a great platform to talk about it because I was talking about it with my partner and I was like, how am I the only masochist in the entire fucking peloton universe? Like that's impossible. So come on out, people come on out. Anyway so, after I get finished hurting myself, I usually check on my emails respond to subs. If I have a session I try and session. I don't know. I mean, they're usually right around now, usually early afternoon, late morning. Lunchtime. You know, it's usually the best time or evening times, you know, four to six, seven. Um, yeah, come to the space. Clean my little dungeon, have a session or two. And then I do what I want. I've designed my life to be able to do what I want. And I worked my ass off to get to that point. But yeah, basically, I do what I want. And if that means laying on the couch for 12 hours a day, that's what that means. If it means I want to session five times in one day, that's what that means. So, my day changes often, but I could say that the constants are tea and working out and the cat.

Parker

And the cat

Olivia Black

cat cuddles tea. Yeah, mornings are usually the same.

Parker

Yeah,

Olivia Black

what happens after that is anyone's guess.

Parker

I love that. It's, it's really amazing how variable this work can be. I think that's one thing people don't always understand.

Olivia Black

It's a real interesting balance between independence. And I don't really want to say we're all workaholics. But I think there's definitely like a drive there. And I think there's a tendency to do that, I know that I often have to tell myself, it's okay to not work. Or if I don't work for a day or two, I start feeling like I'm being lazy, or I'm not doing enough. So, I think there's, you know, when you work for yourself, and you have all this time to be able to have to put structure to it can be a bit of a challenge to not make it too structured. And it's a learning curve, for sure. But I can't have it any other way. I can't work for somebody else, you know,

Parker

Oh, not at this point. One of the things that I've learned is that we we need that downtime in order to allow our brains to envision where we're going.

Olivia Black

Yeah.

Parker

So, for me, I can like work hard every day, but at some point, I lose sight of what exactly I'm working for unless I have a bit of downtime to kind of allow myself to dream about where I'm headed and get creative.

Olivia Black

Absolutely. And even if it's just as simple as like planning the week out to get to whatever goal that is or to have something to look forward to, you know, huge lofty goals or even just like okay, I have to do these things. This one project on Friday or something, you know, let me clear out my inbox. So, I can have the weekend free or weekend being Tuesday or Wednesday because weekends are meaningless to me and probably you and most sex workers out there.

Parker

Yeah.

Olivia Black

You know,

Parker

Olivia Black

God I know. You guys are we all okay? Is everyone okay in here seriously? I, um, it's been rough man. It's been rough, I feel incredibly fortunate to be in the position that I'm in both professionally. And personally, I feel like my, my particular bubble this year was very fortunate and privileged. But that also allowed me to be able to do a lot of outreach to and check in with a lot of other people that weren't. So, I don't know, I'm feeling bizarrely thankful for this year. Even though it was hell.

Parker

Yeah, I feel the same. I feel the same. And it's weird because there's a bit of shame, around, like guilt or shame. It's more shame because guilt would mean, I'm actually guilty of something. And I'm not like, shame is definitely where I'm like not. I haven't done anything wrong. I just survived. It's like, it's almost like survivor's guilt, where like, nothing. It was unstable. It was really hard. But nothing terrible happened in my life. Really.

Olivia Black

Yeah, I felt. Yeah. survivor's guilt. And also, I think, just, I felt guilty for being upset. You know, I felt guilty for being nervous or uncertain, or even scared, or I didn't feel like I could. Like, own those feelings, because I wasn't in a position where I was gonna lose my house or even lose my space. I mean, I was able to keep to two places going just fine. Not because I was working all the time. I didn't, you know, I wasn't. But I have very loyal subs that were there for me. And I appreciate that. But yeah, there was a period that I went through a couple of months where I couldn't even answer an email. I didn't even want to be in my own dungeon to work on it or work in it. And I talked to my therapist about it. Yes, I am in therapy, we should all be in therapy. It's very important, I think, especially for sex workers, as well. Find a good therapist, it's very hard to do, but there are resources in which to find sex positive kink positive therapists, you know, ask your friends, ask your colleagues ask other workers. Because that's important. I am not, sorry, if any subs are listening to this, I am not always that scary, intimidating, you know, gorgeous, BDSM pain queen sex demon that you see or you hear or even that you session with. Like, I am very much a real person, and my personality is vast, vastly different almost than Olivia. You know, I definitely identify as Olivia and I do say that I am a pro Dom and I know I touched on this a little bit before I do think that the lifestyle and pro is it's very interchangeable. I guess the reason I don't say that I am lifestyle is because I do not live as Olivia Black every second of the day. And I don't want to, and I also don't think that lifestyle people do so I don't know maybe I am it's always it's always been a question and something I've struggled with personally like am I lifestyle? Do I have a personal slave cleaning my apartment right now? Not today. But I don't know. I do personal I just my personal just came over last week and put up some lights in the house while I was like walking around in sweatpants. So, I guess Yes, I am lifestyle I do in very much enjoy kink and BDSM outside of work for sure. I do engage in it on a personal level. But I still consider myself a professional dominant. right.

Parker

Right, yeah. And I think and I'm so open to be corrected about this. But to me, the difference between lifestyle and pro is something along the lines of branding like as a life as someone in life, like who's a lifestyle BDSM person. They they don't have to worry about branding, how they're coming off. Like I think ethics in BDSM community ethics is always a concern. So, I wouldn't say that like professionals have to worry about ethics, but professionals definitely have to worry about how they're being seen, which is why I also understand why like, the concern about kind of like being viewed as nerdy on this podcast is like that's not necessarily my brand as a pro DOM.

Olivia Black

Yeah,

Parker

yeah.

Olivia Black

Yeah, I think it's certainly not although I think as I've also gotten older, I've become more comfortable in my personalities blending, which is again, why this remains to be such a huge question like, am I lifestyle? Or am I pro? Is it just a matter of like a skill set and what you can do as a job or not, that might just be it because I know a lot of pro Dom's who are also like very dominant in every aspect of their life. And I am too, I would say, um, I think I'm a pretty dominant person. I'm sure there are some people out there that are laughing very hard at me right now. but um nothing to do about that, and then I don't know, I think as I've gotten more comfortable in who I am as a pro DOM and also who I am as just a person, I think I've gotten more comfortable letting more aspects of my personality come into my work. So sessioning with me, really, isn't this very, I'm not very serious. I am at times, but I laugh a lot. You know, I giggle a lot because it's funny. When you hit somebody in the balls, and they drop to their knees. Like that's cute. I like that a lot. I've allowed a lot more kindness to come into my work as well. When I was younger, especially when I was a teenager because I technically started at 19, I was brutal. Like I barely spoke to my clients. I was ice cold with heavy corporal component like people would come in I would make them strip I would beat them. And that was it. I would barely speak to them. I wouldn't look at them they weren't allowed to speak or look at me. It was very very black and white and it's changed a lot it's changed quite a bit and I like it you know so yeah, lifestyle, pro it's such a I guess the definition for me was what I was taught when I was you know coming up into this world was like lifestyle means you know, you are this 24 hours a day seven days a week and professional as you it's your job you know and then there's like all these other parts of you that don't really fit into that so it took me a while and it still is obviously taking me a minute to fully understand where I fit on that spectrum because I think that I am pretty lifestyle but at the same time you know, I don't sit around in rubber all day,

Parker

right. Yeah,

Olivia Black

but I will [garbled] the radiator and then just like watch The Office for six hours. I don't know like so. Where does that go? You know what I mean?

Parker

Yeah,

Olivia Black

it's curious.

Parker

Yeah, and I think for anyone to be there BDSM persona for 20 like 24/7 is pretty impractical because we all have to go to work and like even if you do this for work, there's like self at like self aftercare and and client aftercare where it's like you don't necessarily it's it's difficult to embody that all the time, so I wonder if just the pro part is just you get paid?

Olivia Black

Yeah, possibly. And also, I think that I had a lot of old school notions instilled when I was coming up and I'm on the older side of things so. At 502 years old, is what I like to tell people this vampire blood keeps me kind of young. Yeah, so when I was training like, things were very black and white, and that kind of gets into like, whorephobia and like whore hierarchy and all of that, like as you know, dominatrixes, or Dom's, dominants, tops just being somehow quote better than a full-service sex worker that was instilled in me at a very young age. And then also, you know, you’re a professional, this isn't lifestyle, you don't really enjoy it. That was another thing like, you wouldn't tell people in the civilian world that you were professional, but you weren't lifestyle. And so it's like not to freak other people out, you know?

Parker

yeah

Olivia Black

Yeah, that was, that was an that was not I will just be clear, because I know I said it was instilled in me at a young age that was not given to me from Lydia Schiller, or Victoria, that was just some other doms I knew in the community that I worked with, and throughout the years, so I'm not gonna say who those people were. But I just want to be clear that Lydia Schiller was not the person teaching me that, just so everybody knows. Yeah, it was, I think it was also just kind of a general vibe. Yeah. And that if it does make it more acceptable, if you're like, well, I just do this for money. I don't really like it. Like, you're somehow like, fixed or you're okay, like, you don't have problems because you don't enjoy fucking your clients, or you don't enjoy beating your clients or whatever. But like, you can't really be great if you don't love it.

Parker

Yeah. But then on the opposite side, too, if you flip that coin, and you're not getting paid for it, right, if you're not getting paid for it, and it's something you like, there's almost the same stigma on the other side of just like, you want to, like, you almost have to say you're getting paid for it in order for it to be credible.

Olivia Black

yeah

Parker

It's like a I mean, like, in any sort of non-heteronormative anything. You're kind of damned if you do damned if you don't.

Olivia Black

I know I agree. But yeah, I think that in order to connect, because I think the BDSM is pretty cerebral. I also believe it's like a sexual orientation, like masochist sadist and I think it's pretty rare. But I do have two subs. One is collared. And the other one I've known forever, 13 years probably. And they just felt that, like a I don't even know, quote, normal relationship was not for them. I mean, one of them was a virgin until they were in their 50s. And this is not a person that can't, that wasn't able to have like a sexual relationship with someone, it just wasn't something that they ever gravitated towards, they feel more satisfied with hurting for somebody or suffering for someone. And that's just what they identified with and what made them feel the most, I guess. And the same as for my other sub. They have been in a couple of like vanilla relationships or more traditional relationships, I shouldn't say normal is not, but you know, what we imagine a relationship to be, whether that be one partner, multiple partners, whatever, but something revolving around an adult relationship with sex, right. They are also, I think, oriented towards being submissive. In fact, they just came out to their family that they're submissive, I am their mistress. And this is like, their relationship, which I think is amazing. You know?

Parker

Yeah, that's incredibly empowering.

Olivia Black

Yeah, he's, he's really fantastic. He's my personal I just collared him. And I'm not saying that he hasn't had relationships before. And I'm not also not saying that he's not allowed to have relationships. In fact, in his contract, it says he's more than welcome to have you know, sexual relationships with other women because he is straight. But if anything gets serious, like he wants to really seriously date them or marry them that he has to get my approval first, which is fine.

Parker

Love that.

Olivia Black

I'm like [garbled]

Parker

also, I mean, that's a good like, accountability measure to have in place like I would want someone who's known me for that long to like, approve of a partner,

Olivia Black

absolutely

Parker

that especially with my relationship track record, I think that's really important.

Olivia Black

I mean, you know, find yourself a little dom to give yourself to girl.

Parker

Hell yeah. Maybe I will which I wanted to talk to you a little bit more about clients too, because I I have a few like fetish and kink clients that that come to me, and they come to me because they don't feel safe in their daily life or in their current relationships to expose that they're into what they're into. So, I wonder if you've had the same experience and like any conversations you've had with clients around around that.

Olivia Black

It's that's I mean, that's why I hate to say it, but it's why I'm gainfully employed because shame and stigma, you know. And I will say that a lot of that has changed pretty drastically, I would say, in the last five years, maybe three, four, five years. I really think that. I think that because of that fucking book, that at least it planted the seed in people's minds. It did start a conversation, right? I'll give it that. I mean, it's egregious. Everything about it is, I'm not gonna fucking say it, because we all know what it is. And I'm not even going to give it press like I'm not doing it. Yeah, I think it definitely opened up also I just think like, the times are changing, and like the world, and the culture and sex positivity is changing. And, yeah, so it is a little bit different. However, back to the point, yes most of my clients, especially the ones that I get, which are usually older, rich, white men, which I'm fine with definitely have a lot of shame their wives or their partners. Don't accept them for it. Some of them have asked multiple times for their partners to engage them and their partners are like what's wrong with you? Like, that's disgusting. Don't like kiss my feet or no why I don't want to hurt you. Like, that's a very popular one. I think most people hear is like, I don't want to hurt you. Yeah, I think there's just also just a lot of shame around letting go of this preconceived notion that you're this somehow alpha person, you know. So yeah, most of my clients are dealing with some level of that or another. And I like to think of it as my job to give them a safe place to do that in and also to empower them a little bit. You know, I mean, my personal my collared boy that I was just talking about who is under contract, like, he came to me, a completely different person three years ago, and now he's proud of who he is. And, you know, his friends and his family are accepting him. And I think it's, I think we do good work, important work in the kink community, to help people feel like they're okay. I mean, it's all normal to me.

Parker

I agree. I agree. There's, I was doing a little bit of research before this show, because as I stated earlier, I do love to do a little bit of research. Oh, go ahead.

Olivia Black

I was just gonna say I'm fully flying by the seat of my pants right now. So, [garbled]

Parker

Well, it's mostly I mostly was just curious about what I could find. Like, in this case, I was looking at what the definition of like kink like kinky was, and, and it was basically like, anything that's not heteronormative vanilla sex. And so, which is so [garbled] it’s giant, it's so much that would include like giving head in that case. And if that's how we see like, quote, unquote, deviant sexual behavior. And we think of like the stigma that's placed on even giving head which is like super misogynistic and homophobic to like, when we think of even the term like, that sucks or like that person sucks, like that's where that comes from that derogatory term. But we're like, forcing people into these closets as I'm currently in my own closet recording this.

Olivia Black

The irony!

Parker

Yeah, I will only go back into the closet to record a podcast. I but yeah, I just I was reading about kink. And in even in hearing you talk about your clients and subs like and thinking about my own, and how people are just, like, shamed and closeted about who they really are. And I have written on my in my notes, let's talk about how shamed and closeted closeted existences are damaging to a person's sense of self and overall societal health. Yeah, let's talk about it

Olivia Black

I mean, it's probably like a main culp one of the main culprits of why we are so fucked up in the beginning, you know, not to be able to express ourselves in the most natural way. To take something that is inherently so vulnerable, you know, I mean, Jesus Christ, it's hard enough to, for most people to be like, Hey, can you touch me there a little bit harder? Or like, you know, can you move your tongue over just a little bit like imagine you taking that vulnerability to even have a hard time asking for that. Being taught that we're not especially, you know, as cis women, we're not really supposed to be that anyway. But just imagine being like, oh, I really want to be spanked. I mean, even like, the most basic or like, I love it when you stretch my balls or stick needles in my eyelids? I don't know, you know, like, there's a lot of vulnerability. So, when you get rejected, I mean, nobody likes rejection. So even just a small thing?

Parker

Yeah.

Olivia Black

It just, you just start feeling like a gross person or that you're bad or sick. You know, a lot of people think they're sick. And repression is never a good thing, as we all know, that makes you do crazy things.

Parker

Yeah. As a society, we're shaming these perfectly natural desires. And when someone experiences shame, we, it's it's super natural to feel like you're unworthy of love, you're unworthy of respect and general human decency, and are willing to put yourself in dangerous situations. And I think, I think that's, I mean, that's where I'm getting to, like, the overall societal health bit where I'm just like, No wonder, like, we have an aggression problem. Because when you feel like cornered and repressed, like you're going to be angry, or dissociative, like, usually one or the other.

Olivia Black

Absolutely, absolutely. Yeah, it's a it's really sad. But I also feel really lucky to have been like, kind of, quote, chosen to do work like this, because I am able to help people work through their shit, you know, in a very non-judgmental environment. I haven't. It's been a long time since I've been shocked by anything and my shock was more that I didn't think the situation would go that way. A person of mine had a sweater fetish, and I just assumed that it was me running around in sweaters, which is fine, but he came with like two leaf bags filled with sweaters. And I was like, wow, I'm gonna be trying on a lot of sweaters. A lot of sweaters. Okay, um, and I left him to like, get himself together. I usually leave people to center and then I put them in a position and then I walk into the room. And I came in and he was wearing like, this teal mohair turtleneck as pants. It was huge. It was like probably like a triple XL or something. So, his, his legs were in the arm holes. And then he had like, tied the neck hole. And he had pulled the sweater up to his chest and stuffed it full of all of the other sweaters so he looked like this. Like I'm a bit like he looked like a character on Sesame Street,

Parker

wow

Olivia Black

and then had like cinched it on his chest. And then I was to go and prance around in sweater. So, my shock wasn't that he had a sweater fetish. It was like how it had manifested, and it wasn't even like, a disgust or anything. I thought it was incredible and like amazing how a fetish can like really like the places it can go, you know?

Parker

yeah

Olivia Black

So that was an interesting one. Ironically enough, that story I tell vanilla people when they ask about my job, I don't tell them that I then pissed all over the sweaters and made him rub himself with like wet wool. But, you know, we start at the beginning.

Parker

Right, right. Again, with the stigma we're easing people into the idea.

Olivia Black

Exactly, exactly.

Parker

Yes.

Olivia Black

Yeah, that's my that's my coming out party story. When I decide to tell people.

Parker

Yes.

Olivia Black

I'm like, oh, I have a cute story for you. Yeah, like that's easily digestible. It's funny. It's cute. It's relatively innocent, you know?

Parker

Yes. The acceptance of self and recognizing, recognizing that your your parameters, your desires, truly shape your experience. And at least for me, I when I stopped feeling like I had something to prove, and just like, showed up, and was like, willing to show up as myself and with with whatever was honest in my heart that day, I really started to enjoy my work more and I started to actually take pleasure in what I was doing. And I also remember a very like distinct moment from my stripping days of like, seeing how many different body types were represented at the club that I was at and just just to have this moment of being like, oh, there's literally just something for everyone and I'm not going to be for everyone. I think because I'm a Libra I just like want to be for everyone and that's just not possible.

Olivia Black

You want to be,

Parker

I want to,

Olivia Black

I'm a Scorpio I want to like be for everyone too.

Parker

Oh, yeah. 100%. But it's just like not, it's not the thing. And there's so there's just enough to go around, you know, yeah.

Olivia Black

Which turns into a really nice version of abundance and like supporting your sex working community, and like being there for your colleagues and your coworkers. Because we all need each other like,

Parker

yes,

Olivia Black

If somebody needs a reference, and you're mad that your client is going to someone else that's not on them. And that's not on your client, that is like something that you need to figure out why you are having those insecurities, you know, like, people can see you at least my subs are allowed to see whoever they want, unless they're collared by me and that's the contract. But yeah, we need to support each other because there is someone for everyone. And even if you look similar to your neighbor, it doesn't mean that you have the same personality or even the same shape of boob or whatever, you know, like there's always going to be a little different you are who you are, you are unique. And like, you're you there's enough, there's enough for you. And there's enough for me.

Parker

Yeah. And it's hard. It's a lot of times I wish we could just talk about our feelings instead of getting pointed about stuff. Because it's like, oftentimes, it just comes down to either emotional or financial insecurity and oftentimes both. It's hard when we start attacking each other. When we're already such a marginalized community as a whole. You know, we can dive into different segments of the community and like, some are more marginalized than others. But it's, as a whole we're marginalized. And we need to stick together. There's, there's a lot of division.

Olivia Black

One of my, one of my apprentices now colleague and really great friend asked a DOM for a reference and that DOM initially lied to her and said that that person was like, dangerous or something, or said that they had never seen them, but then wrote back, like a week later, and was like, I'm sorry, I really just said that, like, because I was mad that he was seeing you. I'm like, that apology is great. And I'm glad that that person was able to, like, see the error of her ways. But that's not cool. Like, yeah, it stings. If I see if I see somebody for a couple of years and then I get a reference, like a referral email from another dom like, from like about that said, person? Yeah, it stings a little bit. I'm like, oh, bummer, you know, but like, first of all, explore explore your sex workers, like you don't know what's out there. And like, it's good. You know, especially when they're new, like, especially when they're new. They're gonna go like, I always tell them I'm like, go, go, go explore, like, you're never gonna find anything better than me anyway, so I'll see you in a few months.

Parker

yes

Olivia Black

Go explore and have fun, or sometimes doesn't work and the chemistry isn't there you find it elsewhere. Or Hello, how about you're paying for a fucking service? And maybe you just like want to watch HBO that night rather than Starz or whatever? And like not

Parker

Thank you. Yes.

Olivia Black

Oh, but like, let's not take it so personally and it's hard not to because I myself have but I never like look at that provider who's take quote taking my client or you know, my clients reaching out or that the clients not even mine, you know? So, I get it I get that like insecurity, but we really need to take care of each other for the most because there's there are dangerous people out there and we need to know and we are kind of under attack right now. Like from all angles.

Parker

Yeah, the last thing we need is to bring attacking ourselves.

Olivia Black

No, I know! You guys come on!

Parker

I'm gonna bring up that other podcast again because I'm obsessed with it. And I was thinking about the whorearchy as I was listening to, "you're wrong about" the episode about the Disco Demolition, which I will link in the show notes because I love that show. And you all should listen to it. Um, but they're talking about these like private dance parties that were like the original disco, and how that they were super diverse but there was still like this gatekeeping that was happening. Like it was invitation only and so eventually it evolved into this, like, I want to say at Studio 54 Is that right? Yeah, I think Studio 54 and it where it was super exclusive and like nobody could get in and it was just like high echelon. You had to like know the right people and in which in which case, like there was like no fat people, it was like super fat phobic, super racist and all these things were happening. And I think about the whorearchy that way. I mean, I also think about like churchgoers and how like, no matter what group you belong to, as humans, it's really natural to get the whole crabs in a bucket syndrome and get competitive with one another. Over stupid shit.

Olivia Black

I know.

Parker

And it really sucks because it's like we could we could just be benefiting each other and helping all of us succeed.

Olivia Black

I know, No, I agree. I agree. And of course, it's like, easier said than done. For sure.

Parker

Right.

Olivia Black

But yeah, I mean, I try and just live by that general principle.

Parker

Same.

Olivia Black

Always. Anyway, like, if I am feeling if a person is bringing up feelings of insecurity or jealousy in me, like when I look at that person, and I'm feeling I feel bad or jealous or insecure, I don't look at them and and get mad at them for having something I think that they have that I don't have I look inward and I'm like, okay, well, I want what that person has, what can I do with my resources to further myself to get there or to have that not the exact thing, but I don't know. Like, I really like that person's ass, like, what can I do to get an ass like that, you know, like not to be mad at that person for having a gorgeous ass let's admire that ass and be like, at the same time. All right, maybe I'll do like a couple squats and see like, what my ass can do?

Parker

Yeah. It's kind of stuff like that is kind of how I realized I was interested in women, where I like had all these weird jealousy moments of being like, god, like, she's so like, she's so beautiful. Like, I wish I could look like her. Like, all all those sort of things when I was younger and then I had this like, aha moment of being like, oh, I find her attractive.

Olivia Black

You're like, oh, I want to fuck her.

Parker

Yeah. 100% Because like, I both want to fuck her and be her and that's okay. As long as I don't hate her in the process,

Olivia Black

Correct. Yeah, cause it's not her fault, man. She's just gorgeous. She's just got a great ass.

Parker

Yes. Don't hate on the great ass. Love the great ass

Olivia Black

Kiss it nice and like love your own ass too. Yeah. Give your own ass some love. Yeah, it's interesting, right? Yeah, I remember the first time I found a woman attractive. I remember so my, my father's wife gave me a Victoria's Secret catalog when I, around The Man and His Maid situation probably like 12. And I remember seeing Stephanie Seymour. It was like a two page spread. And it was Stephanie Seymour laid out in bed.

Parker

Wow

Olivia Black

I know. And like a black Merry Widow with like, over the knees stocking or thigh high stocking sheer black with like a garter belt. And I just remember like, I'm like, what? I’m feeling these weird things right now. Like, I don't, I couldn't stop staring at it like I was just like, this is the most beautiful thing I've ever seen in my life. And now as I'm saying this out loud, I'm like, oh, I'm like, totally trying to emulate that picture all the time. One, and two, realize that I was like, super attracted to women. You know, from that. I was like, oh, yeah, I like girls too.

Parker

Amazing. Those first moments, because they're so they're usually so simple and so impactful.

Olivia Black

I know they imprint which goes I think to fetishes too I often, I often ask my clients like When did this happen? Like, can you remember like, a point in time? Like I just had a session a couple hours ago, and he's very much into like, like Hanes her way underwear and like the Playtex 18 year old guy. He's like, super. Hold on a second. I'm gonna show you.

Parker

Yeah.

Olivia Black

But like this shit. Like he's into like, yeah, it's like a beige. Some like thick floral lace at the top. And it's like beige, beigey, like utilitarian satin. Like, you put your girls in and they're there all day. And I asked him today, I was like, why? Because you know if he when we started seeing each other, he said he was like, really into lingerie. I also have a lingerie fetish. But I'm like, I like the shit that you can't wear anything over it because it's just not functional. You know? It just looks really pretty. So, I was like, great. And then he started bringing me more he's like, well, I really like like whites and nudes, because it's like, I'm not supposed to see it like house underwear. You know, he likes a nice house underwear, you know? And he told me that it stems from when he was really little he grew up in a super religious household. And there was no pornography like no Playboy's anywhere but as he was coming of age, like the Sears catalog would be in the bathroom or wherever and like you would page to the, you know, the underwear section and that is the bra that you would see. So that was like first foray into like sexual imagery and it's imprinted. It's wild.

Parker

Just like you with the with the book. Yep. And I think for me, I definitely my my mind was super like active and imaginative. But I think there was definitely some quizzilla erotic literature that weren't actually quizzes they were just like chapters of someone's book that they were writing. They were like a vampire erotic novel.

Olivia Black

You should definitely look into that collection of lesbian vampire stories that I found that Dawn story and it's called Daughters of Darkness. For all of you listeners out there. It's fabulous.

Parker

I am. It's already I'm getting it. As soon as we're done with this.

Olivia Black

There's two volumes. Yeah, and it's just a collection of like, vampire lesbian erotica. It is fucking awesome. I highly recommend them.

Parker

I read out loud on my only fans, maybe that'll be my next book.

Olivia Black

Oh my god. Oh, you're gonna make so much money off of those.

Parker

I wonder if that's copyright infringement? I'll have to look into that.

Olivia Black

There's one where she's, she has like really like she's, I don't know. I think they're in India, perhaps. And one woman she has cramps and she's, you know, really bad period. So, she goes to this doctor who's actually a vampire and the doctors like, well, orgasms help you. So, she just like goes down on this girl for a very long time gives her orgasm and it's just like gushing blood. Which like, it's amazing.

Parker

So hot. I love that.

Olivia Black

Yeah, period, blood. Guys get on it.

Parker

100% If you are not eating out, people while they're on their periods, you are missing the fuck out.

Olivia Black

You really are.

Parker

Get your iron.

Olivia Black

Yes. Get your iron

Parker

Oh, so good. Um, we've covered so much material in this amount of time. It's actually really remarkable. I think I'm gonna I'm gonna foray into my like closing rapid fire questions if you're okay with that.

Olivia Black

Okay, good. I'm very bad under pressure. But go,

Parker

This is that's the best part about rapid fire. Everyone's like terrible at these and I love it. Okay, so there's we have a few easy ones to begin with just to like get a feel for it and then and then they get harder.

Olivia Black

Okay.

Parker

vanilla or chocolate.

Olivia Black

Oh, see? That's so hard. I guess vanilla though.

Parker

that one's surprisingly difficult. Okay. Pancakes or waffles?

Olivia Black

Pancakes. No waffles. What are we talking about? Pancakes. I mean, I said it. I have to go with it.

Parker

Yeah, you have to,

Olivia Black

This is why I can't travel by the way. Keep going.

Parker

books or movies.

Olivia Black

Books. Hold on a second. Am I just saying the first thing that you're saying? It's been

Parker

So far,

Olivia Black

I think that's what's happening. Keep going.

Parker

I'm just getting in your head. Favorite place you've ever been.

Olivia Black

Berlin.

Parker

Oh, fuck yeah, a book from your mandatory reading list.

Olivia Black

The Little friend by Donna Tartt

Parker

Oh, Donna Tartts’s good. Secret talent.

Olivia Black

Secret talent. I'm pretty. I mean, not really though I used to be a pretty accomplished Whistler, but I'm not that much anymore.

Parker

How was that unexpected? I love that. That's my favorite.

Olivia Black

And I was like, I should be a professional whistler. And then the person I was dating was like, That's stupid. It's not even a thing. And then I got really discouraged. But at one time, I was pretty good. Okay.

Parker

That was so much. Now I want to, I'm gonna look up professional whistling a song, a musical artist or an album that you're currently obsessed with.

Olivia Black

I mean, I'm always obsessed with Nine Inch Nails because I think they're such a I mean.

Parker

Mm hmm.

Olivia Black

such a cool journey musical journey to watch them kind of grow up and get deeper and weirder and I really think they're like the Pink Floyd of our time. At this point them and Tool, but yeah, I think they're all yeah, yeah, I'm sure. I'll stick with easy.

Parker

Yeah, that's a good one. That's a really good they have grown a lot. Okay, finish the sentence. Good. Sex is

Olivia Black

good sex is wonderful. And a bonus.

Parker

True

Olivia Black

something to work towards.

Parker

It does take work. Contrary to popular belief.

Olivia Black

I know. And that's why I said it. Because you know, it's not always going to happen, although it can.

Parker

Yeah. Magical when it does.

Olivia Black

Why am I so bad at these?

Parker

No, you're doing great. You like you're doing great. If you had one superpower, what would it be?

Olivia Black

Invisibility 100%.

Parker

And this is the last one. What is something simple? That brings you joy?

Olivia Black

Okay, I'll just say last night, I love we had our first snowstorm last night and there's something so beautiful about the color of nighttime when it's snowing in a city because of all the lights how it just kind of looks a little radioactive and everything is super quiet. Very cliche, but that's what came into my head first and it brought me a lot of joy.

Parker

I really love that. I wouldn't say that. That's cliche. That's a really beautiful answer.

Olivia Black

I turn all my lights off and I sit in the window like a creep and like watch the world

Parker

I'm getting this like this almost like graphic novel picture of what that looks like. That like

Olivia Black

That’s how it feels very like you're transport yourself into like a little sandman situation.

Parker

Absolutely. I love it. That's so good. I'm so glad that that's the like visual that we get to end this interview on.

Olivia Black

Yes, staring out of the dark window. Like walking the street and you're like, who is that mysterious woman in that window? [garbled] Like this? Very Austin Powers.

Parker

Very Austin Power. Super classic evil person. Yes. I love it. Well, this has been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much.

Olivia Black

Oh, this is my very first podcast interview. So, thank you for popping that cherry.

Parker

It's an honor for sure. All right, well enjoy your day. Thank you so much.

Olivia Black

Yeah, you're welcome.

Parker

Believe it or not, I actually cut quite a lot from that interview and I have a feeling spoilers that Miss Olivia Black will be back on the show at some point to talk about so many other things. You can support the show on Patreon. I always forget that, I'm gonna forget this part all the time. You can support the show on Patreon at patreon.com/sexy galaxy pod. You can also follow us on Twitter at sexy galaxy pod. Keep your dicks inside the spacecraft at all times. Even if they're silicone. If you're having sex with an alien, condoms are still advised. A supernova is a terrible place to have a threesome. Bye.