Merry Christmas and welcome to a special crossover episode of the Quarter Mile Podcast and Movie Wars Podcast! This episode features a delightful conversation between hosts Drew Davis and Kyle Castro, diving deep into the iconic film Point Break, which has been a significant influence on the Fast and Furious franchise. Kyle shares his personal connection to Point Break, revealing how it shaped his perspective on action films and storytelling. The discussion also touches on the evolution of action heroes, highlighting how Keanu Reeves brought a new complexity to the genre through his portrayal of Johnny Utah. Along the way, they explore the contributions of director Kathryn Bigelow and the memorable performances of the supporting cast, all while enjoying the festive spirit of the season.

In a heartfelt Christmas special, comedian Kyle Castro and Drew Davis join forces for a unique crossover episode that merges the worlds of the Movie Wars Podcast and The Quarter Mile Podcast. As they delve into the cult classic Point Break, Kyle reveals how the film resonates with his personal history, particularly his complicated relationship with his late father, a narcotics officer reminiscent of the film's characters. The duo explores the film's themes of loyalty, rebellion, and the quest for identity, while also discussing the evolution of action cinema from the muscle-bound heroes of the 80s to more nuanced characters like those portrayed by Keanu Reeves and Patrick Swayze. They highlight how Point Break's blend of adrenaline-fueled action and deep emotional connections paved the way for future cinematic masterpieces, setting a new standard for action films in the 90s and beyond.

As they unpack the film, Drew and Kyle engage in a lively dialogue about the intricacies of its production, including insights into the casting of Keanu Reeves and Patrick Swayze. They illustrate the challenges Catherine Bigelow faced as a female director in a male-dominated industry, emphasizing her innovative approach that ultimately transformed the action genre. The discussion shifts to the film's impact on pop culture, with Kyle reflecting on how Point Break shaped his childhood and drew him closer to his father through shared moments of watching and discussing the film. The episode is a tribute not only to Point Break but also to the connections that movies forge between people, underscoring the importance of storytelling in our lives.

The conversation culminates in a fun and engaging review segment where Kyle and Drew rate various aspects of the film, from its writing and cinematography to its performances and overall impact. They emphasize the film's legacy, asserting that it remains a vital part of action film history while examining how its themes continue to resonate with audiences today. This episode serves as a nostalgic journey for those familiar with the film and a thought-provoking exploration for newcomers, leaving listeners with a renewed appreciation for Point Break and its place in cinematic lore. The duo's chemistry and candid reflections ensure a festive listening experience, making this Christmas special a delightful stocking stuffer for fans of both podcasts.

Foreign.

Wars.

Merry Christmas and welcome back to the Quarter Mile Podcast.

And welcome back to the Movie Wars Podcast.

I don't know if it's possible, Kyle, to welcome two people to two podcasts at the same time, but we're gonna do it.

This is a very special Merry Christmas.

We're here, we're doing well.

You're there, and I'm here.

You're there.

I miss you in person, though.

Yeah, this.

This is.

This is a virtual, and it's on Christmas, at least when people listen to it.

So hope everyone's having a great Christmas.

Or if you don't celebrate Christmas, then Merry life.

I just hope you're having a great life.

I just hope things are going well and for what.

And maybe.

And maybe this isn't even on Christmas.

Maybe you're listening to this four years from now on a Tuesday in February, and.

And if that's the case, I hope you're having a great Tuesday.

Very special episode.

Very exciting.

We are in a combined crossover Movie wars and the Quarter Mile Podcast.

I'll tell you how we got here, people.

So Kyle Castro, who's the host of the Movies War, so many of you already know him, invited me a while back to be part of the Movie wars podcast.

So we did a few episodes.

Easily the best episode we did was the Crow, Wicked Prayer.

That was.

I think that's the highlight for everybody.

Honestly, it changed us.

Maybe not for the better, but it changed us.

Um, and in the process of getting to know each other and talking about our perspective podcast, I mentioned how Point Break was going to be our first episode for season two of the Quarter Mile podcast.

And Kyle let me know then that Point Break is one of his favorite movies.

And so I said, well, we have to interview you before we actually get into season two.

So this is a bonus context.

This is a special Christmas episode.

It's a Movie wars crossover.

It's just all the good things.

Before we do any of that, Kyle, I know all of your listeners know you, and some of your listeners may know me because I've been on a few episodes, but it's safe to say that all 10 of my listeners probably don't know you.

So tell us a little about yourself.

And in.

In the context of telling yourself, you.

Telling us about you, you have to answer the question that I ask every guest on our podcast, which is, what is your relationship with the Fast and Furious?

Yeah.

Yeah, man, it's really funny.

That's a funny question to ask today on a very.

On today specifically.

But, man, I.

I'M a Nashville based a lot of things.

I'm a stand up comedian.

That's how Drew and I met.

We've become really good friends and we've had a heck of a time on Movie wars and it's been fun to get to know each other over there and it's been fun to get to know and support your podcast and your crew and.

But yeah, I, I'm a, I'm an old guy though.

I have four kids.

I'm married.

Yeah, I have a lot of things going on.

I've been producing and hosting the Movie wars podcast for almost five years now.

Drew is part of what I call movie Wars 2.0.

You know, I did the first version with my two best friends and, you know, there was no ill will.

They just, they got busy and I never lost that passion.

So for a few months this year, I had to bash my head against the wall.

We were growing tremendously and I didn't want to give up.

And then I like thought about you and Seth and Mariana and Matthew Blevins.

I'm like, I have all these really smart comedian friends that love movies and talk so eloquently about them.

I was like, what if we just have like this crew of like in and out when, when Drew's not on the road?

Which is, you know, you're on the road all the time, but you're.

So you bless us by coming in on a Sunday and, and recording, usually driving back from.

You drive back from your gig, like in Memphis, the airport to come do a gig and.

Or come do the podcast.

So it's worked out really well.

And you know, I'm actually.

And for your crew.

I mean, this is fun to announce.

I mean, I haven't even told my crew yet, but I'm an author.

In January, I'm going to market with my book.

I just got a lit agent, so I do a lot of things.

I moved here to play music.

I'm just kind of an all around creative and I'm just obsessed with making things.

So that's kind of who I am.

And how, what is my relationship with Fast and Furious?

You know, I was never super into car based movies unless it was attached to Sylvester Stallone, Keanu Reeves or Arnold Schwarzenegger.

If it was like a tank or a vehicle, that's all I cared about.

But you know, like racing movies.

And it wasn't until we covered Fast and Furious versus Point Break because our old model on Movie wars is we actually did put movies against each other, which we don't do anymore.

Thank God.

The work.

The work.

Those were cool episodes.

I did like that.

It minus the overwork for you guys.

It was great for the listeners, I'm sure.

Yeah, it was a lot of work, but the new model's easier and more fun.

But I never really gave, I'll be honest, I didn't give Fast and Furious a lot of credit.

And I, one problem too was, is I kind of cut it off at Tokyo Drift.

That one didn't really, I couldn't really take it much more seriously after that.

But when, I mean, I've heard that many people have the same sentiment.

You're not like the only person on earth that thinks that.

Yeah.

And I think one thing that happened was when Paul Walker passed away.

And that was tragic.

And I saw people mourning.

I was like, man, people like support this franchise.

And I did like Paul Walker.

Like Varsity Blues is one of my favorite movies written by the same guy that wrote Point Break and that's, he's in that.

And I was like, wow, people really are like, there's like a community of people that I didn't know existed that were really like, like just unconscionable.

Like they couldn't believe he died.

And I was like, there's a community out there.

And so that piqued my curiosity.

And then my, my co host told was the first person.

He's a die hard car person, like obsessed with cars.

So he loves the series.

And he goes, you know that there's this kind of like misnomer that are not really a misnomer, but this idea that Point Break was ripped off by Fast and Furious and that it's kind of the same movie and that they just kind of redid it with Cars.

Years later, I was like, really?

And we ended up covering it and you know me, I'd go heads, head, headlong into research.

Like I'm reading, listening to commentaries.

If there's a book, I'm reading it.

And what ended up happening was, yeah, it's a little bit of a rip off.

But I ended up really enjoying what I learned.

And then I ended up interviewing Mick Rogers, the guy who made Fast and Furious happen with the, with the cars.

You know, he was able to, he, he created the MC rig.

This is kind of a long answer.

I'm sorry.

You were expecting this.

Yeah, I'm not, I'm not surprised, but I'm also not disappointed.

I, I, I do appreciate all of your answers.

Yeah.

But Mick Rogers, like I, and I just.

And he won like the, not like An Oscar.

You know, there's Oscars that, like, the.

The directors and writers get, but then there's like, technical awards that you don't really see.

And he was actually the second person I interviewed.

The first person I interviewed was Tim McGovern, who was one of the first person people to use a specific kind of cgi, and he used it in Total Recall.

And they both got what's like a technical award.

Mick Rogers got a technical award for inventing the thing.

Because he, he was like, you guys want to do all these amazing car stunts and chases and.

But you want to do it the old way with, with trailers and platforms and green screens.

He was like, it's gonna look.

It's not going to look innovative.

But I think when he read the pages, he.

He felt there was more.

So he went out and took apart a van and he was taking apart these vehicles, and he created the MC rig, which is.

Not only does it allow the cars to be faster and look realistic, but it's safe enough for the.

Once they're trained, the actors can actually drive them.

And so I really grew a lot of respect because I love innovation in film.

And it was one of those things that I wouldn't have known had I not gotten deep into research and met Mick Rogers.

He's also Mel Gibson stuntman, by the way, which is even.

That's crazy.

Yeah, he's incredible.

He's in all the Lethal Weapons and Braveheart.

I mean, he's.

He's in all of Mel's films.

But I really just grew a lot of respect and I, I ended up.

I actually now own all of them, actually.

Well, whatever the box set has.

The box set is missing the newest one, but I have a box.

I was gonna say it depends on when you.

Every time they get a new one, they make a new special edition box set.

So the latest one does have 10, but if you bought it before 10, then.

Yeah.

And I think lastly, I'll close with this.

Like, it.

Like I said, there was this, this kind of conversion that happened where I went from kind of thinking it was.

You know, I actually don't think negatively about Nickelback, but, you know, it was kind of the Nickelback franchise of films.

And then I end up going in and realizing, like, I kind of like Nickelback.

Like, they got a lot of great songs.

There's a lot to like there.

And I think, you know this too.

You've been around long enough to know, like, you go into a movie, you don't.

Don't expect something.

It's not.

And like, when you realize, like, what it is, it's super refreshing and delightful and it's a great summer watch.

Like, yeah, if one of the, one of the.

Those is on TV and you got an hour and a beverage and the kids aren't home, it's like, I'm gonna watch this.

You know, it's like, really refreshing.

So that's my how I kind of came into going from thinking it was not.

Not a great franchise to really, like enjoying it and watching it.

Oh, if you're listening to this and you don't know Kyle again, check out the Movie wars podcast.

I mean, if you're listening to this podcast, something tells probably enjoy movies and movie rewatch podcasts.

It'd be weird if you didn't and you're here.

But we're glad you're here either way.

So it is Christmas, so hopefully you are having a great Christmas.

Hopefully you got to eat some good food or see some family or get a really good gift or maybe your style of Christmas is being as far away from your crazy family as possible.

And hopefully you get to do that and are having a great time because you're listening to this podcast.

But now we are coming to what I'm most excited about with this interview.

Because like I said, when me and Kyle first started talking movies, I was telling him that season two, episode one we're be.

We're covering Fast and Furious adjacent movies, which means the first movie we're going to cover is Point Break, which Fast and Furious got a lot of inspiration from in Point Break.

And then he was like, that's.

He's like, point Break is my Fast and Furious is what he said.

This is the movie that, you know, I love this movie.

And I said, well, we have to interview you before.

Before we actually cover the movie.

Now, I want to be clear with all my listeners from the Quarter Mile podcast.

We are going to do an official movie review of Point Break in January.

This is more if you've.

If you heard our bonus feature episode where we interviewed R about his opinions on Fast and Furious.

This is us interviewing Kyle and getting his opinions on Point Break.

It's like an appetizer.

A Point Break appetizer.

We call this a stocking stuffer.

That's what we'll call it.

This is stocking stuff to keep the Christmas thing going.

So, Kyle, right off the bat, why is, why is Point Break such an important movie for you?

Well, I was honored when you asked me, first of all, just because I'm just honored to be asked to be on your podcast.

And, and it's one of those things where like, if we were in the middle of a war, like you and I were like in the trenches, and someone like just randomly said, you want to talk about Point Break?

I would drop my gun and take my helmet off and just, I would just, just yes, right now.

And I just, I love it, you know, not to get too emotional, you know, but I don't.

I didn't have a great.

My dad's dead.

I didn't have a great relationship with him, but he was a narcotics officer and he looked like a villain from Point Break.

You know, he looked like he had the long black hair, earrings.

You know, his job was to pretend to be a drug dealer and that was his career.

And what.

One of the things that came along with that is that he really like loved cop movies and action movies.

And, and he was also like a not, not, not like a full on bodybuilder, but what do you call him?

Like amateur.

He was an amateur bodybuilder.

And so he had these weights and he had this Arnold poster, right.

And like one of the very few ways I ever connected with him ever.

Like, we just didn't connect at all.

Right.

But one of the ways we did connect was like, I was so curious about that poster on the wall.

And so from a very young age, I was indoctrinated with Predator, Terminator, RoboCop.

Way too young.

But as you can see, RoboCop's my favorite movie of all time.

Poster in the wall.

Yeah.

And so, you know, I always had this love for action.

I was obsessed with Arnold movies.

I had seen most of them by the time I was six or seven, I had seen.

I was born in 87, so anything that came out before and then up until that point I had seen and then Sly.

I loved Rambo, Cobra, you know, that's another top 50 movie for me.

But there's also this thing.

So when you study action films, you know, like there's this arc.

Action was always like an element of films.

It wasn't a genre for a long time.

It was like in James Bond films, it was in Westerns.

But then like you get to the 70s and you start seeing like Clint Eastwood and Dirty Harry, you start to see action become more exponential and then it come becomes a full blown genre.

And then we have these actors which are, you know, they're genre defining in the way that not only did they define action like Sly and Arnold, but it wasn't necessarily.

It's like what movie do we want to make?

It was, I want to work with Arnold Schwarzenegger.

And what can we put around those guys?

Because their brand was so big.

So zoom out from that.

Then you have the arc.

Right.

Like, think about how massive those guys were.

I'm talking physically, like, muscles, oil tan, the biggest guns.

But then in the 90s, what we see, starting with Die Hard with Bruce Willis and Keanu Reeves, what do those guys have in common?

I mean, they're handsome, They're.

They're slightly jacked, but they're not, like, menacing Hulk.

Yeah, guys.

So there's this next evolution in action stars where, like, they're what you would call an everyman, even though they're still, like, extremely handsome, athletic, and, you know, Keanu Reeves knows martial arts and does stunt his own stunt work and is an incredible.

He's incredible with guns.

If you've ever watched his John Wick training footage.

Extremely dedicated actor.

But anyway, they represented this next wave.

And, you know, Arnold and Sly were always cool, but Point Break was this new.

And Die Hard was like this, too.

It was this new taste of action.

It was like surfing.

It was everything.

It was surfing.

We're robbing banks.

We're wearing president mask.

We're jumping off planes, we're chasing in cars.

We're.

We're using gas station handles to create flamethrowers.

Like, it was 11 out of 10.

Lawnmowers and dogs at people.

Yes.

We're casting the Red Hot Chili Peppers, you know, and we're getting Patrick Swayze after Ghost.

You know, he was.

He was riding that Ghost high.

I mean, that movie was huge.

And he was a romance guy, and he was one of the most, you know, sexy men ever in acting.

And then he's like, I want to do this role.

Like, because he's actually this life.

He was this life guy.

Like, he loved adrenaline in real life, and so people didn't realize it, but he was an adrenaline junkie.

And so it was perfect for him.

And so that people are like, how did they land him across from Keanu?

Like, and the studio didn't want Keanu, but Catherine Bigelow was obsessed with him, and she wanted him, and he was an unknown.

She saw.

She saw the potential there.

Yeah, especially since, like, I mean, like, we look at it in future sight.

Like, yeah, Keanu is great for this role, but, like, what was that one movie he was known for back then?

It was a comedy.

Bill and Ted.

Yep.

Yeah, Bill dead.

Like, that was kind of his big thing.

So, yeah, rightfully so the rest of the directors are like, really?

This guy?

But she saw it, man.

Yeah, she did.

And, you know, and.

And it's one of those things where, like, we had never really.

When you talk about the evolution of action filmmaking, we just, I mean, Lethal Weapon had had kind of laid the groundwork too, a little bit, but that really diverged into Buddy Copy, which I guess you could argue Gary Busey and Keanu do have a tangent of that buddy cop thing here.

But, you know, Lethal Weapon never exactly exploded into pure action, in my opinion.

It pretty much stayed in the.

In the buddy cop vein, but we had just never seen so much cool.

That's really the.

The simple way to say it was.

Imagine being a kid who had grown up watching Arnold and Sly and then seeing Point Break and being like, this has everything FBI, you know, in the funny jokes.

And it was just.

It was a.

It was on an amplifier.

It was cranked the entire time.

And, you know, and it was.

And we.

My dad would, you know, this is back in the day, we had Aardvark Video in Springdale, Arkansas, where we lived.

That's where his headquarters.

He was a state police officer, but he would go and he would record the vhs.

So he would rent it and record it and return it.

So we had.

I don't know how he did it, but this is back in the day with VHS.

And I had one tape that had RoboCop, Point Break and Cobra on it.

And every week I would just put that.

Remember that?

You were.

Three hours.

You could record like three hours.

So I had like two VHS's and I would just cycle those two VHS's.

Just point break, Cobra, Robocop, point break.

My whole childhood for five years, basically, I'm just eating those movies, eating those movies.

And so I, you know, that was a long answer, but it's, you know, it's a.

It's an emotional thing because it's one of the few things I connected with my dad on.

But, you know.

Yeah, that's interesting, and I love that about movies is the.

What people don't understand when someone talks about their favorite movie, there's always something more than the plot.

It's always something more than the, you know, they.

Something about the movie reminds them of someone or a good occasion or something like that.

I mean, my, My listeners will know that.

That's why I love Fast and Furious so much, is the idea that you have family that's not related to you that has that kind of connection.

Like, that's my friends and the people like human connection, relationships are so important to me.

And so like, that aspect of Fast and Furious was what kind of caught me onto it.

Yeah, I love that about, I love that for you with Point Break, with the kind of the connection with your relationship with your father, but also just the, you know, that was the one of the three movies you had on the vcr.

So that, that was cool.

So let me ask you this, and I should, I should clarify.

I'm almost the opposite as far as movies wise.

I saw, I have seen the first Fast and Furious easily at least 13 times.

Which, by the way, that's not a movie you should see 13 times.

It's.

It doesn't warrant that many times.

But I have and it wasn't until like a couple months ago or maybe last month that I saw Point Break for the first time.

So it is a great movie.

I loved it.

So my question is like, let's talk about.

I don't know if I've really formed this into a question yet, but I want to know your thoughts on like, Fast and Furious ripping off Point Break for their first movie.

Like, that's always been weird to me and I don't, I don't know if I fully understand why they did it or.

And then nowadays I almost would say, after seeing both, I.

If you had never told me that Fast and Furious ripped off Point Break, I wouldn't have come to that conclusion.

Now, I can't deny it because people in Fast and Furious and Point Break have both mentioned it.

So, like, it is a fact.

But like, I almost, like, I almost want to, like, disagree with them.

Sure.

Yeah.

Well, it's interesting because the director of Fast and Furious, I, when I interviewed Peter Iliff, he did say Simon called him and apologized for ripping him off.

Like, he did say that.

I don't know if Simon felt that he actually did, but when those rumors began to be so strong and Peter appreciated and also, I don't think Peter cared.

You know, Peter's a super laid back dude and he's.

I don't think he cared.

You know, I think in a lot of ways the bones are very similar.

But the bones are very similar in this genre.

Anything that's action, there's not a lot of ideas in this world of action.

And I, I think, I think it's the high adrenaline, the high speed, even though the vehicles are mostly cars in the.

And.

And there's a lot of different vehicles in the other one.

It's this idea of movement, you know, and extremism.

You Know, I think they do both lean on those very heavenly.

And.

And I think the.

The undercover cop thing, infiltrating a group and.

And then I also think one of the other similarities is that there is a duality with the leaders, you know, with Bodhi and what's.

Sorry, what is Vin Diesel's character's name?

I don't want to.

Dominic Toretto.

There are similarities there.

I wouldn't say that.

That Vin Diesel's character is a Zen, but there's definitely this ambiguity with them where, like, you know, they're not a good guy, but you love them.

You know what I mean?

That.

I think that is where I found.

Because I'm going into watching Point Break, I had heard people say that, and I think that's where I find the biggest disagreement, because I think by the end of Point Break, I did not like Bodhi at all.

Like, I was.

And I feel like.

And I feel like at least my interpretation of watching the scene, like, I feel like Keanu Reeves, he didn't like him.

He knew he was gonna die in that wave and after all the stuff he'd put him through and with his girlfriend and all that, like, a lot of people, like, it was kind of ambiguous.

Like, no, like, the dude knew he was gonna die in that way.

Like, he.

He knew.

And he was so sure that he was making the wrong but right decision.

He threw his badge away at the end because he didn't want to be a cop after having that on.

Like, I.

I mean, he.

It was a.

He.

He literally was following this guy for months at the end.

And I.

But.

But a lot of people were saying, like, Vin Diesel and, And, and.

Or.

Well, I guess Dominic Toretto and Bode are such similar characters.

I was like, no, Vin Diesel is an anti hero for sure.

He was the antagonist of the Fast and Furious and didn't become apronist until the 4th.

But, like, yeah, he was killing people.

Yeah, I agree with you.

And I.

I think the meat is similar, but the.

But they obviously had bigger plans for Dominic with the series.

Obviously, they fleshed it out and he's obviously become a very beloved.

I mean, he's one of the most.

I would say, beloved, you know.

You know, if characters in this genre, you know, and he's very beloved.

I think everyone, the reason Vin Diesel has as much fame as he does is because everyone just wishes he was Dominic Toretto.

I think.

I think.

I think, like, it's because you find.

Out in real life he's actually nothing like that.

He's a Very different dude.

But you're like Dominic Toretto is so cool.

So we have to like Vin Diesel.

Yeah.

I do think if you compare the first three quarters of both movies, they are very similar.

Yes, it is a very interesting choice because they weren't going to make another Point Break.

You know, they weren't going to make a sequel.

Yeah.

I mean they did make the really horrible remake that even Peter Iliff hated and regretted having his name on it.

But they had to because he wrote the original screenplay.

But the ejecting that from your mind.

Yeah.

I think 75 of the way there you could say, wow, these are very similar.

Yeah.

But it's very Paul Walker's character and Keanu Reeves characters very similar.

Like definitely you could, you could almost have them and maybe it was your host podcast and I'm quoting this on accidentally from what you guys said, but you could almost have Paul Walker and Keanu's Trade Places and they could do the roles almost the same.

Yes, we did say that and it's very true.

Yeah.

And they both would, they both would do very well in the opposite role.

I would actually.

That's an experiment we should run in the, in the simulation out there.

Absolutely.

AI, please God, no.

But closing out that 75 thought like I do think the first three quarter the way you could say they're very similar.

But it's an interesting writing choice and I think it's one of the complexities that is built in the Point Break that is different is that the Bodhi who is the spiritual guru esque criminal is a.

Is a major hypocrite and he ends up.

And he ends up becoming very selfish and he.

And he'll do anything to evade.

Whereas up until that point you think this guy is like about community and people and the thievery thing is like it's almost.

You would compare it more to Robin Hood than Charles Manson.

Whereas Dominic's arc and of course we have a lot more source material but his arc is that quote you mentioned earlier which is family loyalty.

He.

He sticks to that and yeah, he's not perfect and the mistakes he makes along the way is what makes the plot really interesting in that series.

But by and large you can summarize him about with loyalty to family, dedication and love.

Those are things whereas Bodhi emoted those things early on but showed who he really was at the end.

Yeah.

And I think that's the major twist.

Yeah.

And I, I agree with basically everything you're saying.

I, I think that you know, at the beginning, the Movies definitely come from similar starting points, but by the end, to me, they are completely different movies.

I mean, even the.

The themes and the plot and the main points, like the takeaways of the movies, like, they feel like completely different movies.

Which is why if.

If I didn't know already that Fast and Furious was a rip off of Point Break, I would have never come to that conclusion on my own.

I could kind of see it as I'm watching it, but especially just the overall themes of the movies and character development, to me, is different.

Well, if people.

If you're hearing this and you're like, man, they are not talking about Point Break enough, come back to the Quarter Mile Podcast in January when we drop our.

Our review, our actual episode review of Point Break, and we're gonna.

We're gonna really.

I feel like we're gonna really dig into the details of the kind of comparison with the Fast and Furious when we get into it, because I feel like there is a lot of stuff we can say about that.

If you are listening to this, then you know, this is a Movie wars and the Quarter Mile Podcast crossover episode.

And what you've been hearing a lot right now is kind of the vibes of the Quarter Mile Podcast.

And again, Kyle, thank you so much for letting us interview and you and.

And I hope your listeners have benefited from this as much as my listeners, because I, like, sometimes I know when I listen to podcasts, you know, I like to get to know the host better.

I like to kind of know what ticks, and you share a lot of good stuff about yourself, which I feel like, you know, going forward and listening to you talk about movies, your listeners now have, like, a better understanding of you, and that kind of shades just more their listening experience.

So, again, I appreciate you for doing that.

You know, honored to be here, man.

But I also know Movie wars listeners don't come here for the sentimental crap.

You guys are into the uplifting, creative stuff as, you know, a Quarter Mile Podcast, which is fine, you know.

Yeah.

We care more about family than you guys.

And I get that they're a ruthless bunch, but what they want is they want randos and they want war.

Cards come with both of it.

So here we go.

Ran, you got to get that chest.

Random.

Yeah.

You should have heard Mariana say it at, like, the first time we had her on, and she was like, what?

And I was like, you gotta say it.

She's like, oh, Rando, it was hilarious.

I did, actually.

I listened to that episode.

I really liked that episode.

Yeah, so.

And for those that don't know, that's another one of our brilliant movie loving comedian friends, one of the funniest people in Nashville, Mariana Brown, and one of.

The sweetest people in Nashville.

Everyone will talk about how funny and awesome she is on stage, but still just a delightful human being.

Just a nice faith in humanity.

Again, perfectly said.

Nice, awesome person.

All right, so Rando, so I, I got this.

If you want to hear the whole story, go check out because Peter Iliff and the way he tells it's very romantic.

It's like, it's just this beautiful.

Like he was waiting tables and he was, he was a showrunner or not a showrunner, but he was a runner which meant he was running stacks of paper because this was in the pre digital age.

And his job on Hollywood Lots is he would wait at tables but then he would like go fax things and he tells the story about how he would use the printers and stuff to print his own screenplay even though he was supposed to be running screenplays on paper between the studios and the executives.

And so he was running those stacks around.

So he was working on Point Break with, with a friend of him, I think his name is Scott King.

And Ridley Scott bought it for $6,000.

Ridley Scott is, they're trying to develop it and it is attached to Charlie Sheen who you know, at the time was one of the hottest things coming off Platoon was really hot at the time.

Johnny Depp, Val Kilmer, these were all like, these were household entity names at the time were being considered for this.

And so but they ran out of money.

They had even built sets and things like that.

So they end going bankrupt.

And again, this is a very abbreviated version of the story but.

And then so James Cameron ends up buying the property after Peter Ilif wrote it and Cat and at the time he was married to Katherine Bigelow, which, that was six or seven wives ago for James Cameron.

He basically marries one woman per movie.

He makes.

Reasonable.

Yeah, yeah.

You know, hey, when you're, when you're a great filmmaker, you can do whatever the hell you want.

And you know, and so anyway, Catherine Bigelow would eventually win, you know, Oscars for, you know, 0 dark 30 and she made Blackhawk Down.

She's an incredible, you know, and not that you want to like, you know, over index on, you know, being female, but it is a very male dominated field and I respect Catherine Bigelow so much as a, as a female director who directs powerful movies.

Pieces action.

And she, she kind of steps out of what would Be a typical, you know, female archetype in these movies and direct some real gritty, like, real gritty movies.

Like, I love what she does.

So anyway, James Cameron and then so, so, so he and James Cameron then script doctors it too.

And so he kind of writes and updates some of Ilif's things and kind of gets it up to where it is today.

And a lot of the action stuff they attribute to James Cameron because, you know, he was an innovator.

And so, yeah, and that's how we.

That's basically how we got to where we were, you know, at the.

With the end product with James Cameron.

It's funny, it's that it went from Ridley Scott to James Cameron.

That's kind of wild.

But, you know, Catherine Bigelow, she was the one that was.

She went to bat for, you know, Keanu Reeves and she was willing to put her career on the line for it, you know, And I mean, to imagine, like, if you don't remember that time, the gravitas of Charlie Sheen, Johnny Depp, Val Kilmer.

That was a stupid argument to make.

Like, yeah, Bill and Ted guy.

Like, what?

And like you said very eloquently earlier, like, wow.

Like, she.

She unearthed him in a lot of ways.

Yeah.

So incredible move for her to go to bat for him as a director too.

Right.

Like, to see something in someone that hasn't happened yet.

Like, we get it.

Like, if we went in back in time, we like, yeah, book Keanu Reeves, he'll do great.

But, like, that hadn't.

All this stuff hadn't happened yet.

And those always make the best stories.

Like, you and I talked about that when you did American Psycho on Movie wars.

And like, Christian Bale, same thing.

I mean, Mary Heron quit over.

Not over them not doing.

So sometimes these directors just see the thing that they want and they.

And they know it because they're artisans, you know, and that's the difference between.

Between being an auteur and being a hack, you know, So I love this rando.

It's a short one, but his name, Johnny Utah, is an ode to Joe Montana.

So it's a J name and a state.

So I love that.

And I.

I'm a big football fan, but I didn't pick up on it until I.

I talked to Peter Iliff, which is hilarious.

See next Rando, Patrick Swayze and Keanu.

But they actually had worked together.

Keanu in a very, very small role there.

But you can go back and watch Young Blood.

It's a Canadian hockey movie.

As if there's any other kind of Canadian or hockey movie.

Right.

This speaks to the tenacity of Swayze.

So everyone, you know, people know about Keanu being a stunt guy.

Like he does his own stunts, he's hurt himself.

He had two neck fusions when he did the Matrix.

If you've watched Speed, the scene when he's under the bus, that's Keanu doing that.

He's under the bus.

Like he's that guy.

He does all the gun food choreography.

And John Wick, he's very dedicated.

You know, he's not.

He's a little bit myopic.

Like, he's not a.

He's not a guy that's going to go, do, you know, the most Daniel Day Lewis type role, but for what he is doing, incredibly dedicated.

But Patrick Swayze, equally dedicated on this film.

They had, they had trouble keeping insurance on this film because Patrick Swayze wanted to do all the plane jumps.

And so he jumped out of the plane, I think, hundreds of times.

There's a lot of numbers.

This is one of those things where you say, oh, he jumped out 20 times, he jumped out 100 times.

Whatever it is.

The insurance company did not want to insure the film because the main star, he is the highest top bill paid cast member here.

He wanted to do all this stuff and it was a major liability to the film.

He also blew out his knee doing the football scene on the beach.

As if the, the, the bank robbing, surfing, tan and oiledness isn't enough, we're going to play shirtless football on the beach at night in the headlights of Jeeps.

Right.

It's kind of funny.

He did all this other stuff and was fine, but then like how he injured himself was playing football.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, and just I just picturing him this, this, this masculine.

Just the machismo this guy had.

I mean, what a, what a hero.

But anyway, they had.

So from then on, they had a doctor on set.

So like every day they were draining his knee.

Or every so often they had a doctor's like, hey, it's time to go drain Swayze's knee because what a gross job.

Glad they did it.

Glad it worked out.

She did great.

But Goodness.

Somewhere on ebay, is there a jar of knee fluid going for, you know, 1.2, you know, buckaroos?

That's what I want to know.

Comment on this podcast.

If you have that jar.

We'd love to interview you.

We'll.

We'll get you on the Movie wars podcast.

I'll sell my family for it.

And then.

This is really funny.

John C.

McGinley.

A lot of people love him.

I think he was on Scrubs, right?

Is that where a lot of people love him?

I don't love that show, but I love Scrubs.

I'm trying to remember which one John Z.

McGinley is, though.

Well, he plays the captain, the FBI captain.

The guy, the young, dumb, full of come.

Oh, yes.

Oh, yeah.

He's Dr.

Cox.

And I got that.

I could not.

Not see him as Dr.

Cox.

Yeah.

Well, before scrubs, and he's actually in seven, too.

He takes on these random cop FBI roles, and he's hilarious here.

And some of the best lines in the movie, the Shortage line.

But he said it was insanely difficult that.

That.

That hallway scene where they're walking in the.

He says those quotes.

The shortage.

They had to do that over 50 times because he was quoted saying it's actually really difficult to walk and talk and act at the same time.

You know, I wonder.

And I wonder, too, because this.

This happened before Scrubs, like, Point Break before Scrubs.

So I wonder if when they were casting him for that or that character, if they were like, we want you to be like the.

The police captain in Point Break, because he does a lot of that walking and talking and the.

The kind of.

The comedic banter, like, they're so similar.

And so I almost.

I almost wonder if when they were casting for that movie or the TV series, if they were like, man, he did so great in Point Break.

We want.

We want that again in this role.

Yeah.

So, yeah, good point.

Last random.

I don't know if Dr.

Cox, if you're listening, let us know.

Yeah.

In the comments.

Yeah.

Glenn Wilder was a stunt coordinator last Rando.

I love this.

So if you notice, there's a couple of Red Hot Chili Peppers in this movie.

Anthony Kiedis and Flea.

And.

And, you know, can they act?

I don't know.

I'll let the crowd decide.

Yeah.

But so, Glenn, these.

You know, and this is actually really common.

This is one thing that Fast and Furious has a lot in common is that the actresses really wanted to drive.

Like, what's the name of the actress that she didn't have A.

She didn't have a driver's license.

Well, neither Michelle Rodriguez nor Jordana Brewster had a driver's license in that.

In, in for that movie.

So.

And they ended up like really becoming legitimate stunt drivers.

So that shares.

That's actually a back end.

That's not something you would perceive watching it.

But if you do research, that's a cool commonality they do both have.

Because the actors really wanted to do their own stunts here too, like some of the extras and.

But the only person who wasn't showing up, Gene Wilder, was having these stunt things on the weekends with surfing and fighting and like in.

He was like, if you want to do your own stunts, you got to come on the weekends and we got to work on it so you don't get hurt.

Well, the only person that wasn't showing up was Anthony Kiedis from the Red Hot Chili Peppers.

But then he read in the script and found out that he was going to be the first person knocked out during that big scene with the lawnmower and the fighting and the guns.

And so when he, when he found out, he started coming on the weekends because he was like, I'm.

I'm not going to be the first to go, you know, in that scene.

So wasn't he still the first to go though?

Did it, did it.

Did they change that?

No, there's like a few people that get knocked out before him, but his foot gets shot.

Is he.

He's the one whose foot.

Yeah.

I'm gonna re.

Watch it before the next time I talk about it because I want to remember.

Yeah, like that.

But I.

That, that was a fun.

And they didn't have any.

Did they have any songs by the Red Hot Chili Peppers in the movie?

No.

But the most epic song is that ending song by Rat.

Nobody.

Nobody.

Was it For Free?

Yeah.

Yeah, that was a good song.

I just, I, I thought it was interesting.

I mean, you already have the Red Hot Chili Peppers there.

Yeah.

Get them to.

Get them to throw a track down, you know?

I don't know.

I don't know.

Give it away now.

I like, I like the band way more than.

I like their music way more than at least the acting that I've seen from them.

Yeah, this was rough.

Well, Anthony Kiedis's dad was actually an actor and so he actually did.

He's had a few roles and he, he.

That's how he got into it, was.

His dad was a Hollywood actor, so.

Yeah.

Well, that's cool.

Now he's dating a 19 year old, so.

Less cool.

Yeah.

Bless him.

Everything in me.

And I may edit this out later, but he's got more in common with Paul Walker than more commonalities between Fast and Furious and Point Break.

That's amazing.

God rest his soul.

Yeah, that's my randos, baby.

Yeah, that was good.

Those good?

Those are good randos.

Shall we break?

Let's get to the point.

Should we get to the point?

Should we.

Should we practice our stunts on the weekends?

I'm just.

All right, so I hope you like these.

These.

You know, on the Movie wars podcast, we always have a yes or no.

That's what we have.

Seven categories, and that's how we decide whether it's good, we like it, we dig it, or not.

And because there's two of us, we'll have to.

You know.

You know, we'll have to play it.

Play it by two.

But, yes, I like it.

I dig it.

Our affirmative is FBI.

That's your.

You don't have to say it like that every time, but if you did, it would mean a lot.

And.

And then the.

If it's negative.

If he didn't like the.

This category.

Shortage.

Okay.

I thought you were gonna go with a different quote, but.

Oh, which one?

Maybe we can do it dumb and full of common.

I mean, I thought about it, but then I was like, what if we had to say seven times and people start getting really.

Yeah.

I mean, maybe you're uncomfortable with Shortage.

I don't know.

I'd rather have less than people.

I don't know.

Let's.

Let's get to these.

Let's get to this war card.

Top.

Bill cast.

Patrick Swayze is the actually top.

A lot of people just instantly think Keanu, but no, Patrick Swayze was the.

The highest paid.

And then Keanu Reeves.

What do you think?

I thought they were fantastic.

Both of them did great.

I.

I mean, both of them did so good at their roles.

I.

I honestly saw this.

You could.

I felt like watching Keanu Reeves, you could tell he was, like, younger and still working to make it.

Like, I felt like he was acting more than what I'm used to with Keanu Reeves.

For better or for worse.

He had some cheesy lines there, but like.

Like that scene, you could just really see how hurt and scared he was for his woman, you know?

And then Patrick Swayze, I mean, he did.

He was.

Was.

I.

He was a great villain.

I.

I do not understand.

I listen to several podcasts where people talk about how charming and how much they liked him, and I don't get that at all.

Because by the end of the movie, I was.

I was about to get out there and throw him in the wave myself.

You know, I was.

I did not like him, but I loved that I didn't like him.

Yeah.

So that's interesting.

What was the affirm?

Oh, FBI.

FBI.

Yeah.

That's got to be the positive.

That's interesting.

You know, and, and, and that's really.

And that's actually kind of refreshing to hear because I live in Point Break land, you know, I think what it is is the, you know, for being an action film and being a movie that was early and kind of like re.

Establishing what action was going to look like from here on out, you know, for the next, you know, decade.

You know, Bodhi was this really interesting.

He was not a.

An action archetypal villain.

You know, when you look back at the Arnold movies, they typically were muscly and pretty simplistic, and they were really just target practice for grenades that Arnold had around, you know, but he was complex, you know, and yes, he did end up being a huge hypocrite.

But until that moment, you.

You're wondering, like, is he a spiritual being?

You know, does he care about these people?

It's like, I think in his own way, he did care about them.

Like, there's that scene when he reveals that he's holding her hostage, and he's like, I hate to tell you this, but.

And I really believe that.

I was like, he really doesn't like that he's doing this, but, like, he's also a psychopath that's doing it.

So, like.

Yeah, still a bad guy.

Yep, exactly.

And that's what's so interesting about his archetype.

You know, Keanu, you know, I just, you know, you can say I'm biased and you can say that it's nostalgia.

I don't care.

Like, yeah, sometimes I can shake that nostalgia.

But Keanu presented us with a new level of cool, man.

And he showed us this next evolution of what an action star was going to be like.

And as a kid, and now today, I get giddy about it.

I love it.

I get the.

I get bugs on my skin.

I love it.

So this is a huge FBI agent.

Love it.

What?

One to zero.

I'm passionate about this movie, Drew.

Good, good.

I'm passionate about it.

Supporting cast.

There's a lot of them here.

John C.

McGinley, wonderful.

Gary Busey, Lori Petty as Tyler.

Which interesting side, Rando.

They really.

That was another big question that they had with Catherine because she you know, not to be crass, but, you know, the archetypal thing for an action movie.

You know, chesty blonde, model esque.

And I mean, not that Lori Petty isn't attractive, but, you know.

Yeah, there is this archetype.

Yeah.

And they were.

That was another thing that they criticized her heavily for.

Wonderful casting.

Not to give away my cards, but Lori Petty, huge shout out.

She's a director now and a producer.

And she's so good.

I was.

I kind of.

I kind.

She's someone who I forget about.

Like.

But she's in so many good movies.

Whenever I see her in a movie, like when I saw her in Point Break, I was like, oh, yeah, Lori Petty, she's got a lot of good stuff.

And she, She's.

And she's good at the roles that she does.

Like, I enjoyed her in this movie.

Yeah, yeah.

And I'll stop it.

I'll stop at John C.

McGinley.

There were some interesting.

I mean, you could talk about Anthony Kiedis, too.

There's some interesting people, though it's worth mentioning, like Chris Peterson, who plays Bunker.

Some of these people were actual surfers and real extreme athletes.

So some of these.

These folks are those.

So some interesting casting choices to really.

To, you know, push that extreme sports thing through.

But what do you think about the supporting cast here?

I like.

Well, when I think of the supporting cast, I think of Gary Busey, I think of Dr.

Koss and I think of what.

What's her name?

Love, Lori Petty.

Laurie.

Yeah, Lori Petty.

I totally was going with all the different L names, but I.

They were the ones that jumped out to me and I thought they did great.

I honestly think Gary Busey, it was awesome in this movie.

In fact, I.

There was a point where I miss.

I thought the plot was going to be he was gonna be a corrupt cop.

I feel like they were setting it up where there's plenty of opportunities where, like, it makes sense if he's a corrupt cop.

And, like.

And he.

And he wasn't.

But his storyline, because I thought that's where they were going, had my interest.

And I think it was because he was doing a good job acting.

So.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And he's the sage, you know, he's the wisdom.

He's the old.

And.

And just because his body is old doesn't mean his mind doesn't.

Doesn't play.

And I love how.

I love the intertwining of their minds, you know?

Right.

And Busey is just such a wild man.

And just in real life, he's a wild man.

I mean, you know, so much so that like he had a traumatic brain injury.

And we still don't know if it's Gary because Gary was crazy before.

And it's like this, did he.

Is this the brain injury or was.

This pre brain injury?

Which Gary is this.

Yeah, but I give this a big FBI because, you know, it's just, just, it's just wonderful, you know, and it's, and it's above board.

You know, I think you could, you could almost mail it in and go, well, it's an action movie.

And you know, whatever this is.

But it's.

Some of these choices are, are above board in my opinion, especially, you know, compared to some of the, you know, as much as I love the Arnold movies and the Sly movies, I mean, the typecasting across the board is ridiculous in some of those movies.

So these are, these are choices.

Like Lori Petty is a choice, not just some shoes to fill.

So.

And they, and they took, and they took their jobs seriously.

Like, they delivered.

So I'm gonna go FBI as well.

FBI.

Do you love saying it?

Love it.

It's the best thing in my life.

Yeah, that's the war card, baby.

It brings the best and the worst out of you.

Yeah.

Writing.

And I say, my friend Peter Ilif.

I mean, we've talked a lot, but I don't, I don't know, they would.

Say he's probably over at your house right now for Christmas.

I think I enjoyed him.

But no, I actually emailed him because we're going to do Varsity Blues with Drew Harris this year at some point.

Oh, cool.

And because, you know, he's a bit.

Or Drew Harrison, you know, he's a big.

Yeah.

Big sports guy.

And I was going to see if I could get Peter in on that, but I don't know how he feels about Varsity Blues.

But anyway, writing.

What do you think about the writing?

I, I think it was good.

I'm gonna give it.

I think it was a captivating plot.

I think one of the things I've kind of remembered when doing the.

A lot of the movies we've reviewed together is older movies, like 90s esque movies.

Like, they just have better plots.

Like, maybe things haven't been torn up, but I just feel like people are doing better jobs at writing good stories.

Like, it's more captivating.

You don't have as much exposition.

You don't have as much like a template of a plot of a movie.

I mean, I mean, like, you know, as it's the quarter mile Podcast.

We haven't mentioned Fast and Furious enough.

Like Fast and Furious movies, especially the later ones, you know, four, I'd say five and up.

Like you don't go into those being like, man, this is a captivating plot.

You go in there for the explosions.

So when you're watching a good story, like it's a reminder like, oh, someone had to make this happen on purpose.

So I'm, I'll give it an FBI as well.

Yes, I love it.

Yeah, I dig it.

And I wish I knew exactly what the difference between, you know, James Cameron's uncredited, so the script doctoring is all, you know, that was just, you know, what Peter talks about, like he doesn't get credits.

You know, I would love to know where Cameron came in and made those changes and I would love to know like what it would have looked like under Ridley Scott.

But ultimately the choices, and you could say that some of it's a little cheesy and you know, but some of this is like cheese and like this set the cliches.

Like, like some of the stuff wasn't cliche and it became cliche because of Point Break, you know, So I think, and you know, that's another big change.

Yeah, things weren't cliche yet because it was starting it off.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And it's a big difference too because the one thing that Bruce Willis and talking about the archetypes changing with, with going from the muscle man, the super man to the more of an everyman type of, of protagonist in these movies is the dialogue had to get better because Arnold and Sly could say a three word sentence and blow somebody up and woo.

And I love it still.

But when you remove the musculature, you know, and the tan and the oil, it's, it's a little different.

And so you see a noticeable increase in how these, these main actors talk in these films.

And there's a lot of good stuff here.

And I think there's a lot of spiritual conversations that happen between Keanu and, and Patrick.

And the writing is not mailed in here.

The dialogue is fantastic.

So I go FBI all day long.

Perfect.

We're at 330 right now.

This is a good order, a good movie.

I mean, okay, dude, if I'm making you wince, man, it's all good.

I get side.

It's this microphone.

When I started doing voiceover work and I started feeling the vibrations of my own voice as a, you know, look.

If you don't, if you don't get to enjoy the vibrations of your voice are you really living like you're not, you know.

Yeah, yeah, don't do drugs.

Just talk into a microphone.

It's basically the same thing.

Same thing.

Directing Catherine Bigelow, who would go on to be a very big deal.

What do you think?

Oh, man, I'm gonna give her an FBI as well, because she took a lot of big steps, a big moves, especially with Keanu Reeves.

And I mean, it could have gone south for her at any given time.

And she pushed through.

I mean, I think any of us at work, oftentimes it is tempting to do the safe thing to do, like what everyone else is suggesting and stay out of trouble, do your thing.

Maybe it won't be as good, but at least, you know, it won't be bad.

And she could have done that in any number of ways, most especially with how she casted her lead, but she didn't.

And we are all the better because of it.

Man, I don't know if I could say it better than that.

That's beautiful.

I wanted to make sure to give her all the accolades too, because she, she is so wonderful.

Here, here's some of her accolades.

And she actually was the first woman in history to win that award.

That is wild.

2009 was the first time a woman.

It's incredible.

And then Best Picture, she also won as the producer of that movie.

She was nominated and I think Zero Dark Thirty won Best Picture.

She didn't win Best Director, but she directed that film and I think it won Best Picture that year.

So really, really accomplished.

And, you know, he talks about her.

Peter.

I have talked about her a lot and, and apparently, you know, she was a, she was a model before she was a director.

And he talked about, like, she didn't.

People kind of like, you know, you know, you can be, you know, what do they call it when you're, you know, stereotyping women or whatever?

Right?

Like they kind of like, oh, she's really gonna dig the romance.

Yeah.

Sexist.

Yeah, you could say that.

Right?

It's, it's a, it's a male dominated, you know, world film.

And.

But what was interesting is like, she, she was the most into the action.

Like, she actually couldn't wait to be done with, like, the romance scenes.

Like that stuff did not interest her.

She was into the action.

And it's one thing to say that, but then you go, say win, win awards for Hurt Locker, which was a very impactful, action packed movie based on a very real subject matter, then went you know, then Zero Dark Thirty.

Like, this is someone who understands this genre.

So, you know, I love what you did here.

Like you said, anytime I read a story about a director going to bat for an actor because they see potential and you get a Christian Bale out of it, you get a Keanu out of it.

That's wonderful.

So, man, FBI, Maybe even CIA at this point.

Something like lapd.

Lapd, like, more acronyms.

But Catherine, man, good stuff.

And I love that.

I wonder what she's working on these days.

I haven't seen her name in a while.

We are at 4 to 0 here.

We are FBI agents currently.

No shortage here.

Cinematography, production design, sound, costumes.

I thought it was all good.

I wasn't blown away by anything.

I'm gonna give it.

I'm.

But I'm still going to give it an FBI, but with less assertion.

Like, the other ones were really quick.

Like, obviously, yes, but this one was good.

I mean, I just.

I think what gets you with this movie is the action sequences and the.

The characters and the dialogue and the plot.

I don't know if you ever just, you know, I know, like, when we.

When we reviewed the Crow, the first one, we walked away saying, like, man, look at the set piece like that.

It was a character on its own.

I don't know if I.

I mean, I don't know if I felt necessarily about that, but, like, I still enjoyed it.

Didn't take away from the movie.

So we're gonna give it a.

Yeah.

FBI, I think.

I think there's two.

Two things that give this a huge FBI for me.

And.

And there is some of it that's, you know, like some of the framing is not necessarily earth shattering.

Like, especially the indoor shots, like with the office and the banks.

Like, nothing really groundbreaking there, but the fact that, you know, they're doing all these aerial shots, the, you know, the skydiving, which.

Some of that was.

Sorry, pardon me.

Some of that was done in.

In those skydiving, like, rooms, you know, but some of it was done for real, you know, So I think they're capturing a lot.

And then that ending, the ending frame with the.

When he goes out in the waves and kills himself.

That was pretty cool.

And the slow motion, that rat song comes on like that.

That song was perfect.

No one rides for free like it.

There was this orchestra of.

Of perfection.

But, yeah, there were moments where it wasn't necessarily like, oh, that's not groundbreaking.

But there was enough.

There was like, this is.

This moves the needle.

So I also went FBI, but I agree with you.

It's not like, you know, this isn't as resounding as some of the others.

All right, now we're out of our, what we call, we're out of the, the basic categories.

We're in what we call bro category.

So these are like more film specific.

So the first one is to quote one of my.

I know you're not a huge sports guy, but to quote one of my favorite running backs in NFL history, Marshawn Lynch, I'm just about that action boss.

You know, even though we're, we're doting on this movie, we, you know, there, there has been, there was critique about this movie that, that it was over the top, that the action was, was too much, that it was kind of like stimulus over ride.

You know, think about that, that arc of action I described.

What do you think?

Does this, does this serve well as a, as an action film or is this something that, you know, you look at and say, ah, it's at the genre back.

Like what do you, what do you think is.

Well, I think it's a different kind of action.

I mean, there was a lot of thrills in the skydiving and the.

I, I mean one of my favorite scenes is when they're, they're doing that raid and they, they're breaking into the house and they're throwing the dogs and dodging lawnmowers.

I mean that was a very great, that was a fantastic scene to me.

But you know, like when I think of like, you know, it's not like your Terminator type movies.

It's not like your stuff, Esther Stallone, like Demolition Men, you know, Expendables, punching and kicking and blow ups kind of things.

But I think the, I kind of dig the over the top for this movie because all like, you know, you think of Bodhi's character and he's big into all the extreme thrills and stuff like that and all of the, so much of this action was like extreme over the top.

So it kind of fit with the movie that it was going with.

So I'm gonna get, I'm gonna give it an FBI.

Love it.

Yeah.

I think, you know, and I think it's a fair argument.

I think one thing that maybe if you're a traditional action fan being, being like the very short time that traditional action lived in the 80s, you know, you weren't used to more complex characters.

A Bodhi character wouldn't work as well and like Raw deal with Arnold in it, you know.

Yeah.

So there's more Dialogue, there's more complexity, but I like it.

And it doesn't really go up from here.

You know, I think the next person that really changes action is Michael Bay.

And I would say the Rock was fantastic, but I would say that, like, eventually, like Bad Boys and some of these other movies, like, I really do think action became very contrived eventually and it lost some of its luster.

So I actually look at it in some ways as kind of a climax in action.

So I do think in some ways it never got any better, you know?

Yeah.

So I think, you know, some eventual films that would do it creative, like the Crow would be one of those, like, really amazing action films.

But again, it's similar in a way that it's more complex than your.

Your typical 80s explosions and muscles type of thing.

So I think, I think in this category, to use the word masterpiece isn't.

Yeah.

Oh, all right.

You go.

You go in big, you say it's a masterpiece.

I like that.

Yeah.

I think in this, in this genre.

Yeah, I think, I think.

Oh, it's definitely a masterpiece in this regard.

Like, it's definitely not a.

It's not like a.

It's not a marvel of film.

Like, it's not Scorsese or Coppola or anything like that.

But I think when you look at the arc of action, it does a lot that.

That, that challenges the status quo.

And I think that's awesome, man.

We're rolling.

And.

And six.

Six to zero.

So much.

FBI.

Lastly here, this category is called I can be your hero, baby, because this is.

This is the idea.

It was a big deal.

Keanu's taking the torch.

You know, he's a different type of action star.

He's a different type of protagonist.

Let's judge him as.

As what he was.

I mean, this next step, does he pass muster as an action protagonist star in the line, in the lineage of Arnold, Sly, Bruce Willis as being the next torchbearer here.

I thought he was great at what he did, but, like, this.

This role isn't what put him on an action hero route.

I mean, like, you think of him after the Matrix and all the different things that came, all the hero types that came off after the Matrix that was like, kind of related to Keanu Reeves and his portrayal of Neo.

I thought it was a.

I thought he was a great hero in this, like.

And what I liked about him in the story is that, you know, whereas you see a lot of these old 80s action heroes are larger than life, people with big muscles and they Never second guess themselves or they're always doing this.

Right.

Kind of like that Superman mentality of like always going for truth, justice, the American way and never like strain from it.

Like, what made his character so good in this movie was like he was, he was tempted by kind of the, the lifestyle that Bodhi was creating.

He was, I mean, he was a flawed character.

Don't get me wrong.

He ended up doing the right thing.

He ended up, he was very good at his job and could kick a lot of butt.

I'm going to go with no shortage of assholes on this only because I don't think he was a trend setting action hero.

I, I think he was a good hero though.

But like that's not what the question was asking.

Yeah, hey, that's a, I've really, that's a really interesting analysis.

Yeah, I like that you said he's flawed.

One thing I have thought about is like you couldn't present that kind of complexity to Arnold.

You know, like a guru villain guy who's like, kind of like thinks he's Robin Hood.

Arnold was about blowing up bad guys.

You can be a guru, you can be simple, whoever you want.

You're getting blown up.

And that's just how it is, you know, which.

Yeah.

Entertaining.

Love it.

It's fun.

Yeah.

And, and you know it going into it.

That's the kind of hero you want to see from Arnold.

I do go, I do go.

FBI here.

I think it's interesting though, one thing that you, kind of a nugget you knocked loose in my mind is that because of his, his approach and the kind of actor he is, he did end up getting some very interesting action roles like the Matrix and like John Wick.

It's kind of interesting.

He kind of almost, it's like, I guess the real question is did he impact action or did he carve out his own path?

And I feel like he's, he's impacted action by carving his own path.

But I don't know if that started with like point break.

Yeah, okay.

You know, interesting maybe, or maybe, maybe that was the, the first domino that led him to the more notable things that we think about now.

Yeah, yeah.

Because speed would come pretty soon after this.

And speed was the one where he was like, that was like set pieces galore, explosions.

And I think that's the final note I would put on my FBI vote here, is that like his tenacity to do his own stunts, I mean, he has injured himself so many times, you know, doing stunts.

He's broken ribs Neck fusions.

And he just keeps going.

I.

I love that.

And that's kind of one of the marks of an action story.

I don't think Arnold, you know, slide Sly does quite a few, but Arnold's not guy that does a lot of his own stunts.

Well, we had a clean sweep here.

I didn't.

Well, no, we didn't have a clean sweep.

We.

We'll call it Six and a Half to Half.

There's two of us, so I.

I ruined the clean sleep.

I'm so sorry.

It's all good.

It's all good.

It's not a perfect film.

I just am very biased and, you know, it's.

You know, the scorecard does things to me.

It's like an entity.

I really did enjoy this film, though.

I.

Because I know in talking to people all the time, like, wait, you haven't seen Point Break?

Like, apparently it was a big piece of culture that I had not yet experienced.

And.

And.

And after watching it, though, I was like, I can see it.

I can see why this was, like, a big deal and why people are like, you're a weirdo for not watching it.

Well, we're going to close out this amazing episode.

Few things.

First of all, Kyle, thanks for doing this, man.

This is awesome.

Glad you had fun.

We.

I enjoyed having you here.

Secondly, I do have some big news to drop for Quarter Mile Podcast fans, which is, uh, our new season, Season two will be starting in January.

I can't remember the right date right now, but, like, it's a week in January, and it's on all of our social media, which you can follow us, the Quarter Mile Podcast, on literally everything.

And we do have a season two coming up.

We'll have a new co host joining me as we deal with Fast and Furious adjacent films.

But the big news is, is we are moving it from a monthly podcast to a weekly podcast.

Now, Movie Wars.

People are like, whatever, man.

We're a weekly podcast all the time.

And that's beautiful, and I love that, and I want that for my podcast.

I was originally planning on doing one more year of a month, month by month podcast episode, and then my thought process as well.

Well, if it goes well, we'll make it a weekly podcast.

But then I was like, you know what?

Let's just assume it's gonna go well and go ahead and make it a weekly podcast.

So when we start back in season two on January, whatever the date is, again, it'll be on all the things.

We're gonna do it every week.

So if you like, like what we're doing at the Quarter Mile podcast, you're going to get a lot more of it at a greater frequency, so keep up with that.

And Movie wars people, if you like movies about Fast and Furious or related to Fast and Furious or further down, other movies will do.

You'll learn more about that and we'd love for you to come listen to the podcast there too.

Or if you're listening to the Quarter Mile podcast and you're like, wow, this cow guy is way cooler than Drew, go listen to the Movie wars podcast.

Because him and a lot of my comedy friends do amazing movies there and review them and talk about them and it's a lot of fun.

So these are both good podcasts and you should check out whichever one you normally check out.

You should go check out the other one.

Just check something out.

Just, you know, do something.

Yeah, just check it out.

Yeah.

Kyle, do you have any.

Do you have any, like, Movie wars news, any big drops to drop to people?

I'm just enjoying the new format.

Like, I loved talking to comedians in a non comedic setting.

Right.

And that's so bad when you take the comedy part out of it.

Yeah, well, yeah, and, and, and we're smart, you know, for the most part.

I find comedians to be very smart.

And so it's, it's, you know, and everybody.

What's wild is people have just come prepared like you.

And like, I don't expect anybody to do too much above and bore.

But like you, Marianna, Seth, like, you're all.

You always come.

So research.

I've just been so blessed by that.

And so it's made 2.0 a hell of a lot of fun.

So just expect more of that this year.

I love that.

That's awesome.