Welcome back to Lending Leadership: The Mortgage Pros, your go-to resource for everything mortgage professionals need to lead, grow, and elevate their business.

In this episode, we shine a spotlight on one of the most impactful growth levers in our industry: coaching. Whether you're an aspiring loan officer looking to break through the next ceiling, a manager navigating multiple teams, or a seasoned originator feeling stuck, coaching is a tool with ripple effects far beyond business output—it can transform lives, families, and organizations.

We’re thrilled to welcome Kristen Watkins as our special guest. As someone who’s shaped the trajectory of countless mortgage professionals, including our very own co-host Robert Fillyaw and other company leaders, Kristen Watkins brings decades of hands-on coaching experience both as an external and—now—internal coach within our organization. Her journey began in an unexpected place—the dental industry—and took a fortuitous turn into coaching mortgage professionals after seeing how powerful the right guidance can be for unlocking true potential.

In this episode, we discuss:

1. The unique role of coaching in the mortgage industry and why even the best in the world—athletes, executives, and loan officers alike—depend on coaches to reach new heights.
2. Kristen Watkins
3. 's personal journey from managing a mortgage office to becoming a sought-after coach, and what it means to run an internal coaching program that's fully aligned with company leadership.
4. The incredible impact of customized coaching solutions, including moving from three closings a month to 19, and how vulnerability plus accountability add up to breakthrough growth.
5. The most common hurdles that hold loan officers back, including the myth that being “busy” equals being productive (and profitable!).
6. Real-life stories of transformation, including how coaching restored balance and brought renewed joy and motivation not just to careers, but to home life, too.

Key takeaways:

1. Successful Loan Officers Don't Succeed Alone
2. Just as Tiger Woods or Super Bowl teams rely on expert coaches, top-producing mortgage professionals also need mentors to challenge them, refine their habits, and provide accountability. No one achieves lasting success in a vacuum.
3. Alignment in Internal Coaching Makes All the Difference
4. Kristen highlights the power of an internal coaching program: everyone—from leadership to originators—hears and implements the same proven strategies. This alignment eliminates conflicting messages, reinforces best practices, and accelerates results.
5. Vulnerability and Implementation Are Essential for Growth
6. Coaching only works when participants are honest about their strengths, weaknesses, and even fears—and are willing to do the work. The most dramatic business transformations come from those who open up, trust the process, and execute relentlessly.
7. Delegation and Focus on High-Payoff Activities Move the Needle
8. Many LOs stay busy with paperwork and behind-the-scenes tasks, missing opportunities for growth. The highest achievers consistently delegate non-revenue-producing activities to team members and focus their energy on what actually drives new business.
9. Coaching Impacts More Than Just Numbers
10. The ripple effect of coaching is profound: it delivers not just more closings or income, but also restores work-life balance, rekindles passion for the business, and improves personal relationships. Sometimes, the greatest measure of success is hearing “Thank you for giving me my husband back.”

If you’ve ever felt curious—or skeptical—about the value of coaching, this episode is packed with real-world stories, practical advice, and maybe even the nudge you need to elevate your career and quality of life. As Kristen Watkins reminds us: if elite athletes and championship teams wouldn’t go without a coach, why should you?

Thanks for tuning in to Lending Leadership: The Mortgage Pros. Don’t forget to subscribe, leave a five-star review, and share this episode with a peer who could use some inspiration or a fresh start. If you’re ready to dip your toe into coaching or want to learn more about our approach, we’d love to connect!

Robert, Tom, and Dave

Think about it. It's like, okay, would Tiger woods have gotten where he did if he didn't have a coach? Like, you know, he's a phenomenal individual on the golf course. And same thing, like, you think, okay, super bowl season's here. All right, well, they don't win the title and they go, you know what? I think we need to go find a really good coach. No, they needed that coach and the team of coaches to get them to the Super Bowl.

Most high producing loan officers didn't get there by accident. Somewhere along the way, someone challenged their thinking, tightened their habits, and held them accountable. Today we're talking about why coaching continues to be one of the biggest growth accelerators in this industry for lending leadership. With the mortgage pros, I'm Robert Filyaw and joined by Kristen Watkins today. Hey, Kristen, how are you?

Hey, good morning, Robert. It's great to be with you.

I'm so excited to have you on and just spend some time talking about coaching and some of the things that you're doing. What drew you to coaching, some of your experiences, the results, the, the techniques. We're gonna, we got a lot to cover and we're gonna try to keep it in, you know, 25, 30 minutes so we don't lose everybody out there. Right. But I'm just so excited, you know, because you, for, for those of you out there who may not know, Kristen play played a massive role in my career and in Dave Holland's career, you know, who's one of our other partners. So could not be more thrilled to have you on the show. Welcome. Tell us a little bit about yourself.

Well, I started in the dental industry. Plot twist there. I did not know that. Yes. I was actually going to go to the University of Florida and I had a full tuition scholarship to go to dental school. But I married an entrepreneur who ended up in the mortgage industry after being in financial services, and he wanted me to run the office. When I got in the office, I clearly learned very quickly that he needed to focus on sales and stay away from the paperwork and the files, and then the office would become profitable. So I kind of accidentally kind of got into coaching without even realizing what I was doing.

Getting into, honestly, that's hilarious. You know, it's. We talk about this a lot, actually. I've never met anyone who said, you know, when I grow up, I want to be in the mortgage industry. Everyone just kind of falls into it, right? Like, exactly. Somewhere along the way, you end up in this crazy business. And then it really is like the Mafia like once you're in, there's, there's no getting out. Like you're in.

Exactly.

So, yeah, it's crazy. You know, you've coached a lot of loan officers across the industry and external coach for most of your career through a coaching, through various coaching organizations. Right. And now we're blessed to have you as an internal coach here at hma helping our leaders and our loan officers really just grow and amplify their business. What drew you to that role? Um, and how is it different than maybe some of the roles you've had in the past?

Well, being an external coach allowed me to work with loan officers literally from Florida all the way out to the west coast, up to New England, you know, even Hawaii and Alaska. So. But it was all with different companies. So the, the tricky part with different companies is different companies have different LOS Systems and different marketing platforms. And honestly, management that is supportive and management that sometimes is not as supportive. And so the beauty of having your internal program and having the opportunity to join HMA and do coaching with you all is it's, it's all aligned with what it is that I'm coming coaching. So if, if they're talking to you or to Dave or to Tom as the partners, they're getting the same conversation as if they were talking to me as their coach. So it reinforces.

And I think having that internal platform is so unique and special in this industry.

Yeah, I agree completely. You know, it's funny that you talk about the, the various organizations out there and management styles and some supportive and some not. You know, I'm sure you remember this, but when you and I started coaching and my business really started exploding, like I'd already had a pretty good business. Right. But I was a workaholic. I was doing it. I was a one man band and working 70 hours a week with young kids. And you really helped me build the team and take my business.

You know, I think we quadrupled within the first 12 months of working together.

Yeah, it was pretty awesome.

Yeah. And that was in spite of the company I was with, because they like I was. It was roadblock after roadblock after roadblock on things that I was trying to do and implement. And it ultimately led me to leaving that company and going a different direction, which led me here. And so, you know, coaching, when I say coaching changed my life, it's not an exaggeration. It is, it is a literal, a literal thing. And you know, it's just interesting to see the people that want to invest and want to Improve their self. And then they kind of run up against it with some of their management.

Right. Some of their leadership. So we were blessed.

It's a source of frustration because they, you know, they put together a business plan, they go to their manager, they go to their regional manager and they say, this is what I would like to do. And then they hit a roadblock. And then as coaches is, we're limited as what we can do. So like in your situation, we probably spent the better part of a year trying to help the processing department get you across the finish line to get your deals closed. But if you can't get them closed on time, that's a major roadblock for you. So I think part of coaching is just figuring out what needs to be fixed and creating the plan in order to get it fixed. And we tried really hard with your company that you, that you were with. Yeah.

For a long time.

Yeah. Well, and we, we, we did. And you know, one thing that we love from a leadership standpoint on the, on the internal coaching is, you know, it gives us that sounding board back also. Right. It's very reflective for us and it just is. It's really a commitment to being the best that we can be out there in the industry. You know, a lot of people.

You mentioned something, if you don't mind, I don't mean to interrupt. You mentioned that you were working 70 hours a week and hon David Holland was also working crazy hours. So one of the things as a coach that was so rewarding is coming up with what steps you need to be doing and what steps you shouldn't be doing. So, so much of it is coming up with a job description for you, a job description for your team members, and then allowing each of you to excel in the areas that you're really gifted, and then that reduces your need to be in the files and in what I call the fulfillment side of things. And I think the biggest compliment I ever received was meeting your wife, Lacey and having her give me the biggest hug ever and saying thank you for giving me my husband back. Thank you for giving me the father of my children back. Because you were able to cut out like 20 hours a week of what you were doing work wise and be present. Like you were present in the house, but you were on the couch with your keyboard clicking away in the evening.

So you weren't really present with your family members who really wanted to interact with you. So that was a huge win. And I think that's one of the benefits of coaching is getting you to that place.

Yeah, I agree. And you know, one of the impacts that I'm sure you're aware of, but sometimes we don't have the full knowledge of is, you know, I stole this from someone we both know very well. The, the ripple in the pond analogy. Right. And, and the changes that you made for me now have been changes that I've coached other teams and originators on. Right. And it's just ripples in the pond that expound out. I know Dave has done the same thing.

So the impact of this, you know, not just changed my trajectory, but now it's changing other people and then they're coaching to it and it changes other people and it just, it gets widespread. It' cool thing. So thank, thank you. It's. It's very powerful. Yeah. And I'm so glad that we were, we've been able to bring this internal and you know, provide this level of service to the people that trust us and you know, really take that leap of faith to, to, you know, join with us in their career and their journey. It's a, a small way that we can give back.

It's pretty cool. You know, talk to us a little bit about, you know, what you've seen in coaching. A lot of times I use this phrase all the time. It's one of my favorites. I may have even stolen it from you. I just was coaching with a team yesterday and I told them this, this isn't flipping a light switch. Right. It's not instant on.

It's not going to happen overnight. This is a long term investment to problem solve, to build like we're Rome wasn't built in a day. Pick any cheesy cliche that you want. Right. And it's really applicable to coaching. So talk to us about, you know, what, what have you seen move the needle the most? Where is there if someone's out there saying I'm thinking about getting coached, but I'm not sure, is there any kind of line in the sand where you're like, okay, this is when you need to think about getting coached and then what changes have you seen when someone just surrenders and it's like, you know what? I'm all in. I'm gonna do it. And like, what are some of the awesome successes?

Well, you have lots of thoughts and questions all wrapped in.

I'm giving you a lot all at once. So you can just go in a.

Very large sentence question there. You know, I, I think, you know, so much of it boils down to I love the fact that as a coach I can customize. And I think what's awesome about the internal with your company is the fact that we have some people that are producing LOS and we have some people that are branch managers. We have some people that want to do recruiting. And the beauty of it is we can customize it for the individual. We have people that are just starting in the industry, people that have been around for 30 years. So each of them have different strengths. And honestly, with those strengths, there are weaknesses.

So trying to figure out what needs to be honed in on. And for me, I think as a coach of individuals, if the person I'm coaching is totally honest and transparent and they share what they're scared of and they share what they like to do and what they don't like to do, it is way easier to create a custom blueprint for them to build out a path. So, for example, there was a gentleman I was coaching, and he was the owner of the company, but he had very little production. He had other LOs that were working for him and he really wanted to produce. So he was only doing three to four closings a month, and he wanted to get to where he was doing, you know, 20 to 25. And that's a big jump. But he also said he, oh, it's a huge jump. And I told him, we're not going to be like this little microwave where we throw it all in and it just instantly pops out.

It's more of the crock pot. You know, we're going to do this as a slow build. So what we ended up doing, the fact that he was honest with me and, and said, no, I really don't want to have to make calls out to real estate agents and things like that. He said, I'm all about calling agents after I've met with them. I just don't want to call them on the front end to try to meet with them. So what we did was we hired a dialer and it happened to be a gentleman who was working on his master's degree in college. And so he came in, was working 20 hours a week, booked him eight appointments a week to meet in, you know, face to face with agents. So fast forward, we went from November of when we had that dialer start, to May of the next year.

He went from three to four closings a month to 19 in May of the next year. But it was because he was honest and we were. He was able to confide in me what he was scared of and what he didn't want to do, and we could come up with a solution. And you know, and it wasn't November to December that production increased. It was into the next year, but it was still relatively quick. Going from 4 units to 19 units. That's huge growth.

That's massive. Yeah, I think one of the keys to coaching, and I've scratched my head with this before, but you have to be vulnerable. You have to be willing to get raw and. And then the other key I think to coaching is you got to be willing to put in the work. I've seen so many people pay for the coaching do, right? And then, and then they don't do the stuff. And I'm like, what?

Right?

What are you doing?

Right.

And.

But you and Dave were outstanding at implementation and I think that's why with you all, you know, when we started you were doing 8 to 10 units a month and then we got you up to 30 to 40 units a month because you implemented and, and whatnot. And. But so much of that is, it's not you doing it all. There's a who factor that we have to, you know, plug in and who's going to come alongside of you on your team and help you accomplish those things.

I think, I think for originators out there, that's the bit. One of the biggest hurdles when they've been in that system for so long of kind of that one man band and I do it better than anyone else and it's got to be me. And the. I just coached this with the team yesterday and I told him, I said guys, that we were talking about team email, right? And you know, the email comes in addressed to one of them, but their team members answered. It's not them answering it like you're. They don't care. They just want the answer. Like, exactly.

Not you. They don't care. They get out of your head.

Right.

And that's a hard thing, right. Especially for loan officers who are type A, you know, kind of the alpha, very egotistical. Like that's a hard thing to get out of the way sometimes. But when you do it gives you the time back and you're not doing the stuff you don't like. You can focus on what you're good at, what you enjoy and then the business.

I think as a coach, you know, so much of the time, you know, that file, we want to hold onto it so tight because that's our paycheck. That's, you know, if that, that closing is going to feed my family. So as a coach, sometimes I have to peel one file finger back at A time it's almost like one finger a month. And then in six months it's like, oh, we have a new experience here and it's pretty awesome to see the results. So I've got one gal that I've coached for years and she calls me her. Her mortgage therapist. So, you know, sometimes it's not just what we're doing in the day to day loan business industry, it's, you know, okay, just talking through our emotions and our fears and. And then you kind of pulling us back from that cliff edge and, you know, feeling safe and secure again.

It's funny that you mentioned that because I was talking to someone else last week that you coach and they were asking me about something and I was saying something and I'm like in the middle of literally like answering what they're talking about and they go, you know what, I'm just going to talk to Kristen about it. It's good. And I'm like, okay, go talk to Kristen. Right. That's funny.

Yeah. But the good news is if they talk to you or they talk to me, they're going to get the same answer. So. Because you listened really well back in the past.

Yeah, Guilty admission. I was, I was completely against coaching. Right. Like, I thought it was like hippity dippity new wave, like in touch with my feelings. Like, I don't need that. Oh, that's funny about Dave because he is a hippie. But I can say that he's not here. He's off.

He's off hiking some mountain somewhere in his Birkenstocks looking, listening to the Grateful Dead. So, yeah, I really, you know, and then when I got into it, what I found is it wasn't that at all. It was really tactical. And that's one of the things that I really liked about it. And I think one of the things that enabled me to implement so quickly is it wasn't, you know, pie in the sky. It was actual tactical steps. It was do this. All right, now we did that.

Do this. And as you start doing, you start seeing the results, which is gratification and, you know, it just, it makes you want to keep going. So very cool stuff. I want to, I want to take it back a little bit because we talked a little bit about the internal coaching that we do here and the difference between external and internal. But I want to take revisit that and spend a little bit of time there because this is something that we did not have as part of hma and we're all big fans of coaching. And we knew that at some point we wanted this to be a cornerstone of what we bring to the table. And quite honestly, a differentiator in the industry. Right.

And then the stars kind of aligned and we were able to line up with you, and you've done a fantastic job of kind of, you know, building the groundwork and putting this together for us. So tell us what that's felt like a little bit. You know, what do you enjoy most about the. The internal coaching? And where do you see it going from here? Like what. What do you see the path forward with this looking like?

I think the fact that I had been able to coach both you and Dave in the past, and I saw how the two of you all are incredible implementers. When I heard that you all had joined forces and Tom Mills had joined forces and everything, I thought, oh, my goodness, what would it be like to create a company growth pattern that everyone's aligned on the same page as far as the same fundamental belief system? And that's just a huge opportunity because it's so rare in the industry. Like we touched on before, there are certain companies that are all about supporting their LOS and supporting them with. If they come back from a coach's call and they say, my coach says I should do this, this, and this. Well, if the manager doesn't agree with that, it's just kind of a source of frustration for everybody and it doesn't work well. And that's not the case here. The beau here is all of you are on the same page. And then, you know, if we do come across something that is kind of a question mark, we all get together and we talk about it and we come up with a plan to resolve it immediately.

So there's. There's not this long delay of trying to resolve things. So the alignment of, you know, being able to have the coaches, you know, with the partners with the sales team with, you know, you know, you all are unusual in the sense that you have a phenomenal marketing department and a phenomenal sales department that support the LOS with marketing tools and materials, and then also having, you know, Nikki and Jolie and whatnot, helping from the sales side of things and helping the LOS progress. So it's a really unique blend where everyone's working together for the common goal of the loan officer, which is rare in the industry because most of the time people get recruited, they're told that the grass is greener. And the problem is when they get over there, they find out it's really AstroTurf. It's not even grass, right?

Yeah, yeah. We live by, you know, under promise, over deliver. And so much of the mortgage industry, Dave says this all the time is over promise. You know, some people would say under deliver. He says never deliver, over promise and never deliver. You know, you said something earlier that I want to touch on that I think is a major accomplishment and something we pride ourselves a lot on. You know, you said coaching. You really get to spend the time individually, one on one and problem solve and really see where the roadblocks are for that individual.

And it may. It's different, right? It's different for an ELO versus a branch manager versus a regional manager. The stages of life, everyone's roadmap and blueprint to where they want to take their business is different. And with the coaching, you're able to really get granular and problem solve to what, where are you trying to go? What do you want to accomplish? And that's one of the things that we pride ourselves on and love, is that we're so many companies in our industry are one size fits all. You have to fit in our box, and if you fit in our box, great. If you don't, yeah, we're not that. And I think the, the internal coaching goes hand in hand with that. We want to find out what's important to you, what does your business look like, where do you want to take it and partner with you to get there.

And that's different for everybody. You know, frankly, it, it, it, you know, is a little bit more of a challenge from a coaching standpoint, from a leadership standpoint, but it's that true partnership and I think it makes a difference. Have you seen that?

Oh, absolutely. Because, you know, like I had mentioned before, we have some people that are newbies to the industry and they're just devouring any kind of content and training that they can receive because it's also fresh and new and exhilarating to them. We've got some others that are more seasoned that they've been around the block a few times. They've seen the market kind of have its peaks and valleys, and so for them, it's kind of getting them re energized and refocused and re excited about why they got into the business to begin with, because it's not an easy industry, it's a hard industry. But if we have the right tools in place, if we have the right support staff members and team members in place, if we have the right marketing materials and tools along those lines, it makes it so much easier and enjoyable and we can make differences in people's lives who might be a first time home buyer or might have lost their home in a fire or a divorce situation. And we can actually impact and improve people's lives beyond just taking, you know, an application and getting them to the closing table. It's like, who are our clients and what can we help them accomplish as well? So it's, all of it comes together in one big happy package per se. You know, there's just so many different variables.

Yeah, we, you don't know this. I'm going to share this with you. We, we shared with our originators this morning the those that, that made Scotsman's Guide. Right. They qualified for Scotsman's guy. So we sent emails out and asked them to, you know, just double check us behind us and congratulated them, obviously. And one of them is a gentleman that you coach who's been in the business a long time. You've been coaching him, I don't know, six months, eight months maybe.

And he replied back, he's had one of his best years ever in his entire career. He's been in the business 20 years. But one of the things that struck me is he said that because of the things that he's been able to engage with and accomplish this year. I know this is a testament to the coaching. He's fallen in love with this business again and he's got more zest and more go and get it today than he's had in the last 19, 18 years previous. He's, he's back in love with this business, which I thought was really, really cool. If we like, if we can light that spark back for people like that, that's really powerful. Right?

Yeah.

So we're turning the corner to wrapping up here. We always like to try to give, we've had a lot of great content here. But back to that tactical approach. Right? The, hey, here's, here's your thing. So I'm going to rapid fire some questions. Pick one or two. But as we look to wrap this up, you know what, as you've coached so many loan officers over your careers, over your career, if you said, okay, there's one habit, or what I see is move the needle the most or maybe something that you're doing that you should stop doing, you know, maybe a myth that you see out there or you know, if you were going to give one takeaway today to say, listen to me out there in the mortgage industry as a coach of X number of years, coaching thousands of students, amplifying Business, you know, hundreds of percents. This is what I would say as a takeaway.

What would that be? Oh, put you on the spot.

I know there's so many good nuggets. I think honestly the most successful loan officers show up. They show up consistently. They show up each and every day ready, prepared to do the high payoff sales activities. They need to let go of the things that don't make money. So such as dealing with paperwork and collecting docs and chasing conditions and, you know, all the things that need to happen and they're important, but we can have a team member do those on behalf of us. And when we delegate those things and allow the loan officer to just focus on the high payoff activities, which is getting them in front of agents, getting them in front of doing lunch and learn classes and maybe doing video content and posting and teaching on various social media platforms and talking with their past clients and staying engaged with them and doing special events and classes for past clients and for agents. Those are all the high payoff things that actually drive the business in the door.

And that's what LOS need to focus on. So many LOS keep themselves really, really busy by doing all the behind the scenes stuff and they feel like, oh, I was so busy today, look at all I got done. But if the phone's not ringing with incoming leads coming in the door, they kind of missed the mark.

I love that because so often we think busy equals success or I mean, honestly, let's be real busy equals money or profit. And it doesn't. Right. You got to be busy doing the right things. And if you're not exactly, then you're just busy and it's actually counterproductive to your income, which is why we all do this crazy job anyway. Well, Kristen, it's been such a pleasure. Thank you for joining me today. You, I cannot overstate, like, I, I, I can't even put it into words, the impact you've had on my life.

I know the impact that you've had on Dave's life. I love that story you shared about Lacy. It gets me emotional. I had a similar situation. We talk about the ripples, right? With an ello that I brought in and started coaching. And you, you know, you coached for a while. His son came up and said something very similar to me. Right.

And, and so those ripples and just to be able to give people that spark and help them do this business better, right. Different, and in a way that gives them that work life balance is something I'm very passionate about and I'm so thankful that you are with us and running our internal coaching program and were able to come on and spend some time today with us. So thank you very much.

Oh, thank you. This was fun. So there are people that say, I don't think coaching's for me, and they avoid it. I would say, you know, dip your toe in the water and try it. Because think about it. It's like, okay, would Tiger woods have gotten where he did if he didn't have a coach? Like, you know, he's a phenomenal individual on the golf course. And same thing. Like, you think, okay, super bowl season's here.

All right, well, they don't win the title and then go, you know what? I think we need to go find a really good coach. No, they needed that coach and the team of coaches to get them to the Super Bowl. So, you know, I think for me, I like being able to get people, whether it be to the World Series or the Super Bowl. That's what's fun for me.

Yeah, I use that analogy all the time. Similar but different, right? I say Tom Brady's the best that it's ever been. He had a coach, right? Best quarterback that's ever played. He had a coach. And then so many people have that if then mentality, right? If I get here, then I'll do it. Well, that's like, you know, I use the Bucks because they're my team and they won a Super bowl recently. What if the Bucks said, if you win the super bowl, then we'll go get Tom Brady? Well, how the hell do I win the super bowl without Tom Brady? I need him to do it. So.

Right.

Yeah. Great stuff. Hey, thanks everyone for tuning in to this episode of Lending Leadership with the Mortgage Pros. If this episode resonated with you, make sure you hit that subscribe button, share it with one of your peers or teammates, and definitely leave us that five star review. If you're interested in learning more about coaching or hey, listen, maybe you're stuck at a company that doesn't support you. The leadership is crap and you want that spark lit back. We'd love to hear from you. Give us a.

Give us a shout out. Thanks so much for joining in. See you next episode. Guys, Sa.