***GIVEAWAY STILL GOING! We know you're a busy mama, so complete any of the following and we'll enter you in the drawing! Winners selected on September 17th.

*Grand Prize: A Year-Long Subscription to the Entire Entrusted with a Child's Heart video series

*2 Copies of the Entrusted with a Child's Heart book for couples and a Scripture Memory CD

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Here's how to enter:

1. Write a review of the Again podcast on your favorite listening platform. Take a screenshot. (2 points)
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***Winners will be chosen on September 10th. We can't wait to hear from you!

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The 4 D's: Defiance, Disobedience, Danger, Dishonesty

Scriptures Referenced in this Episode:

Hebrews 12:4-11

Romans 7

Romans 13:14

Deuteronomy 5:29

Proverbs 22:15

Proverbs 22:6

They're the joyful agains our children shout on the swings, the

2

exhausting agains of cooking and laundry,

and the difficult agains of discipline.

3

So much of what we do

as mothers is on repeat.

4

So what if we woke up with clarity,

knowing which agains we were called

5

to, and went to bed believing we

are faithful in what matters most?

6

We believe God's Word is

the key to untangle from the

7

confusion and overwhelm we feel.

8

Let's look up together to embrace a

motherhood full of freedom and joy.

9

Hey mama.

10

Welcome back to the again, podcast where

we wholeheartedly believe that the things

11

you do over and over matter to God.

12

I'm your host, Stephanie Hickox.

13

And this is brought to you

by entrusted ministries.

14

Today, we're beginning at three

part series on gentle parenting.

15

You can't go far and studying

parenting these days with out coming

16

across this prevalent theory.

17

And if we believe that the things

you do over and over matter to God.

18

Then there are some key topics in

parenting that we better make sure

19

that we are on the same page about.

20

And the only page we want to be

on are the pages of scripture.

21

In this series, we'll discuss the

origins of the gentle parenting movement.

22

We're also going to define our terms.

23

We hear a lot about gray spaced.

24

Fear-based.

25

Gentleness.

26

Discipline.

27

What does it all mean?

28

And what does God's word

really say about it?

29

We're going to talk about why

some books written by believers

30

on the topic of discipline are

actually not true to scripture.

31

We're also going to clarify Entrusted's

position on grace and discipline.

32

And make sure that you know

exactly where we stand.

33

I think it's really

important before we begin.

34

That I share something called

the four DS that Betsy.

35

Explains an entrusted.

36

The four DS are defiance,

disobedience, danger, and dishonesty.

37

And we are called to be biblically

faithful in those moments and

38

faithful to our children and directing

them away from those choices.

39

I'm going to say those four DS again.

40

Defiance disobedience

danger and dishonesty.

41

And I think that's so helpful to

understand as we go into this conversation

42

that you understand, when do I discipline?

43

also Betsy talks about that.

44

There is a wide spectrum of

discipline and the Bible provides

45

many tools for us as parents

46

that we can use.

47

To train our children.

48

You will hear the controversial word

spank in this series, but when we

49

say discipline, we aren't always.

50

Meaning spanking our children.

51

We could say so much more and we

probably will in the months to come.

52

. If anything's unclear to you.

53

Or you're wondering how another part of

scripture matches up with what we say.

54

As always, we would love it.

55

If you go to our website, fill out a

contact form or email the ministry.

56

Stephanie, at E w a C h.com

is your most direct line.

57

We are here to serve you and to help

these things to become clear in your mind.

58

You know, sometimes in our parenting.

59

We realized our children didn't obey and

it wasn't because they didn't want to it's

60

because our expectations were unclear.

61

And I feel like I have to

apologize to you, the listeners.

62

We really want to send these

prizes to some great mamas.

63

And we want to hear from you about

what you're wanting from the podcast.

64

I hope that I didn't make the

directions a little bit too complicated.

65

I am so grateful for those of you

that sent in entries, and you're going

66

to get double points for faithfully

following through and all the steps.

67

But for those of you that didn't

make the deadline, we're going

68

to extend it another week.

69

Even if you only sent a topic or two

that you'd like us to do going forward.

70

We're going to enter you

in that giveaway again.

71

I'm so sorry.

72

If it sounded complex, we just want

to hear from you as much as possible.

73

Thanks for giving it a shot.

74

Let's get to that interview.

75

Betsy: This is Betsy and I'm here

with Emily and Steffi and Jen,

76

and we're here to talk about a

little bit more difficult topic.

77

Maybe it's more confusing and

we just want to settle some of

78

that confusion in your mind.

79

We want to bring clarity to what the Bible

teaches about some particular issues and

80

those issues deal with gentle parenting

or what you might hear called fear based

81

parenting or grace based parenting.

82

And how do they relate to entrusted?

83

Do they agree?

84

Are they in opposition to what we teach?

85

I think that's helpful.

86

Mainly, it's not really

about what we have.

87

It's about what the Bible says.

88

So what is in a line to what

the biblical teaching says?

89

We know the verse in Acts 17.

90

11 that says Paul spoke to the people

there and the ones that were the most

91

noble minded Received the message with

great eagerness, but then they went home

92

and searched their scriptures daily to

see if these things were really accurate.

93

And so that's always our standard.

94

We compare everything we teach

to God's standard, God's word.

95

And if it's in any way

oppositional to that, then we

96

know that it's not the truth.

97

And that's really the way in Deuteronomy

that God told us to judge his prophets.

98

If they say something wrong one time

they were to actually stone that prophet.

99

Thank goodness we don't

have to deal with that.

100

But we always want to be closely

aligned to the scriptures and speaking

101

truth in everything that we teach.

102

We take it very seriously.

103

But we do realize that in the

last 20 years or so there's

104

been a lot of confusion about

what's being said out there.

105

And the wheel sometimes gets reinvented

with new buzz phrases or particular

106

semantics, and we just want to clear

the air on some of those things.

107

I would say that I also Received

my Master's in Biblical Studies at

108

the Master's University, which was

a five year course many courses of

109

really digging firmly into the Word.

110

And I really respect the men

there and the teaching and the

111

things that they instilled in my

life, which has really helped me.

112

solidify the things that

I teach in Entrusted.

113

Well, I think one of the things

I was teaching in Entrusted this

114

year, and I had a group of mamas

say what is Gentle Parenting?

115

Are we for Gentle Parenting?

116

Are we not for Gentle Parenting?

117

What is the Gentle Parenting movement?

118

Because not only is it out

there in the world, but it's

119

certainly infiltrating churches.

120

So what would we, how

would we address that?

121

What would we say about that?

122

I think, first of all, we have to,

we always have to track our sources.

123

When I was in school you could read

the bibliography of a paper and

124

you would know whether you would

be in alignment with that, that

125

professor or that writer's thinking.

126

Same thing can be true when we look at

the origin of where things come from.

127

And we want the origin of all of our

teaching, of all the things that we do

128

to be from the Bible and to be And if

we look back at the origin of gentle

129

parenting, we see that really started

from secular psychological sources,

130

not biblical sources, but they have

definitely infiltrated church circles and

131

christian circles, evangelical circles

even, until we have created what we call

132

a synchronistic society of parenting.

133

Now that's what the northern

kingdom did in the time of Israel.

134

Jeroboam took the Northern

Kingdom and he wanted to create

135

sort of a counterfeit system.

136

He made a new capital, not Jerusalem.

137

He made many places to worship

God rather than the one place that

138

God said that he was to worship.

139

And he allowed different

types of worship of idols.

140

Basically what he was doing is he

was blending the world with and

141

culture with what the Lord said.

142

And that, you just can't have it.

143

That creates an entirely

counterfeit system.

144

And so that's really what's been

happening here, and we really

145

wanted to address that today.

146

Maybe we'll even go back a

little bit further and in another

147

secular source in 1946, Dr.

148

Benjamin Spock wrote a very controversial

book at the time called the Common

149

Sense Book of Baby and Child Care

and it's been called, or at the time

150

at least, the most authoritative

And Reliable Guide for Child Care.

151

Now, it came with the authority of

a physician, and so young mothers

152

completely were taken aback by this.

153

They were taught to

discipline their children.

154

That was just the norm in society,

not just Christian families.

155

And he was saying, let's just

take a little bit more backing

156

off easier look at those things.

157

Just do what you think

is instinctually best.

158

If your child's hungry, feed them.

159

If they need to sleep, don't

be so rigid about schedules and

160

routines and things like that.

161

Just show your child love.

162

From that, there was a huge

controversy, but it has pervaded the

163

thinking of society to this point

of, is discipline really necessary?

164

We hear this all the time.

165

Is discipline necessary?

166

It's everywhere.

167

It's trying to be negated.

168

You can't go to your pediatrician or

your coach and they will say, yes,

169

we think discipline is a good idea.

170

They will all say, they will all back off.

171

And why?

172

Because of the liability of it.

173

And so we can't fear man.

174

We have to look at what the

Bible says about discipline.

175

I guess the biggest difference with

what we'd say the Gentle Parent Movement

176

does, and Entrusted, or what we would

say our true source, the Bible, it

177

clearly indicates that discipline

is important in a person's life, and

178

as parents, in our children's lives.

179

It's important in our

180

lives.

181

And that is why I wrote Lesson 11

and Entrusted the way that I did.

182

For instance Today's society is

getting the belief that obedience

183

isn't necessary or that we don't need

to expect obedience from our children.

184

And so we wouldn't discipline them.

185

A few years ago, we would have

thought, why discipline them?

186

Their reasoning was the secular world.

187

Why discipline when they're innocent?

188

They're not sinful.

189

And so we use the back in, I think

it's lesson six, we talk about

190

the inherent nature of a child.

191

We know that the child has inherited

the sinful nature from Adam and

192

therefore it must be disciplined.

193

So when we take apart those foundational

premises, we lose our way and we

194

start to synchronize Cultural ways

with what makes us feel better,

195

perhaps less attacked or confronted

or whatever it is by society because

196

we are fearful of people's reactions.

197

Going forward,

198

I think it's, it reminds me a little

bit of what was happening in Judges.

199

Judges, they had no king, so everybody was

doing what was right in their own eyes.

200

And what happened?

201

They cyclically went through, God

had to raise, when they got to the

202

end of themselves where they were

so disobedient to the Lord that He

203

chastened them and then they cried

out to the Lord for somebody to save

204

them and the Lord sent somebody and

they would repent but then they would

205

go through the whole cycle again.

206

And why?

207

Because there was no king in

Israel and everybody did what

208

was right in his own eyes.

209

The book starts out with that verse

and it actually, interestingly

210

enough, ends up with that verse.

211

So

212

we know that it is important to have

authority and to live under obedience.

213

Live under that authority and obedience.

214

It's just the way the whole

world operates Christian or not.

215

Stephanie: So

216

Betsy: that lesson 11, we start out

talking about what is obedience.

217

Are we just saying this

because we're hardcore, or or,

218

just hardheaded or whatever.

219

But because we're so stringent and

harsh with our kids, not at all.

220

We are not when we say gentle parenting,

we want to make the understanding

221

that we are gentle parents.

222

That's important.

223

And we are grace based parents.

224

But we do believe that there are

consequences of disobedience.

225

The main difference here, the main crux

of the matter besides it not being its

226

origin in the truth of God's word, is that

they don't believe in discipline and so

227

they

228

remove that part of a child's development

so that they are talking to the child

229

in a way that uses emotional strategy

230

To

231

reach their child's feelings and

how they feel about doing things.

232

Stephanie: Emily, you had a great example

that you saw on the playground one day.

233

Emily: I ever

234

parenting, what it was.

235

We were at

236

the

237

when they're sitting out fall out.

238

Grabbed the bars

239

back

240

his mom

241

His leg

242

was drop to catch the

243

slide got his slide.

244

But that was had with

245

Betsy: And

246

I think the point is we can say make

the right choice or are you making

247

the right choice but we're following

it up whether whereas this child

248

may be just still going his own way.

249

He's still in charge of the decision.

250

He's not thinking I need

to follow my mom's saying.

251

Because, really, the

mom's not saying anything.

252

She's not saying you need

to do what I'm saying.

253

She's just what are you thinking?

254

Is that a good idea or not?

255

And it backs off from sort

of the child training.

256

I would like to read this definition

that I received from a sermon from John

257

MacArthur on God's faithful discipline

on Hebrews 12 and it's so good.

258

But the word that's used

in there is paideia.

259

It's a Greek word and I'm going to give

you the definition of it in a minute.

260

But we go through this in Entrusted

because this is the thing.

261

What is God saying in his word?

262

This is what he's saying because

he's using this Greek word.

263

He's in 4 11.

264

The word paideia speaks of whatever

occurs in the life of children wrought

265

upon them by their parents to cultivate

their soul, including corrective issues,

266

including curbing their passions.

267

including hedging them against

the things that are dangerous.

268

It's

269

not just protection, it's instruction

with a view of producing virtue,

270

aiming

271

at the Increase of character.

272

So it involves correction

and it involves discipline.

273

It's not just a emotional

or spiritual exercise.

274

Sometimes people spiritualize this

and they say it's not a physical

275

discipline, but we know that it

definitely is a physical discipline.

276

A physical discipline.

277

is restated in the New Testament,

and that is the big chapter on

278

it, if we were to read Hebrews 12.

279

And we memorize Hebrews 12, 11 as

part of our curriculum, which says,

280

All discipline for the moment seems

not to be joyful but sorrowful.

281

Yet to those who have been trained

by it, afterwards it yields the

282

peaceful fruit of righteousness.

283

No mother thinks that it is joyful or

a fun time, but we enter into the pain

284

of it with our child, and there is a

certain pain of going over the line.

285

Whether it's the natural pain of

the universe that says do not step

286

over this cliff because you will

fall far and it will not be good.

287

Or even something more simple

as touching a hot burner.

288

Learning that I'm never

gonna do that again.

289

So the world is set up God has designed

it in a way that has natural consequences

290

for us and those consequences are pain The

pain that the parent enters in with the

291

child doesn't harm them doesn't hurt them.

292

It's not striking their face It's not

hitting them, it's not slapping them.

293

For a young child, it

is, it may be a spank.

294

And it's interesting because people

will say, Oh, it doesn't say the word

295

spank in the Bible, but it certainly,

it doesn't say the word abortion

296

either, but it certainly speaks to it.

297

And so we understand that and using

these words, which we, Clearly take

298

apart and define in this Lesson

11 helps us to understand their

299

exact meaning and application.

300

Stephanie: I think whenever we

cave to culture, we forfeit God's

301

intended blessings, which are so much

greater than the blessings that we

302

could have planned for ourselves.

303

You might read, Oh, there's research

coming out that says spanking is

304

detrimental to a child's mental wellbeing.

305

We're using the wrong measuring stick I

am concerned about my child's wellbeing.

306

But I want an eternal measuring stick.

307

I don't just want them to be well

adjusted and competent children.

308

I want them to be children who understand

their need for a savior and requiring

309

obedience of them and teaching them where

the line is and where boundaries are.

310

Just as Paul says, the law revealed

to us that we need a savior,

311

that we are in need of grace.

312

When we want our children to to follow

the Lord, to embrace their need for a Holy

313

Savior, who is the hero of the story, not

the child, then we need to use the Bible's

314

measuring stick on, is this fruitful?

315

Is this righteous?

316

And we can see lately with

progressive Christianity and the

317

absolute fallacies in that theology.

318

It's completely contrary to scripture.

319

And I heard a story recently about

a mom that was saying, I didn't

320

know how to teach my children

about Easter because I, they had

321

never been taught about punishment.

322

And so I taught them that I

tried to explain that some

323

people thought they had sin.

324

So Jesus died for the sin that

they thought that they had.

325

I was horrified.

326

It just, anything that robs Jesus of

his rightful place as our Redeemer

327

and our Savior is so completely

errant and contrary to scripture.

328

And we have to think are we

falling into these lies and

329

these deceptions of culture?

330

Or are we looking to God's word

and saying, yes, let's be gentle.

331

Yes.

332

Let's let the Holy Spirit guide us.

333

Yes, let's stop and be calm

and make sure that we are

334

intending their future goodness.

335

And we're saying, this might

be hard right now, but I am

336

teaching them where the line is.

337

That they can be blessed

in the future by obedience.

338

And that's going to be required

of them in so many realms of life.

339

Scripture says, make no

provision for the flesh.

340

And when we set our children up to

listen to their flesh so much, we are

341

really doing a disservice to them.

342

In Deuteronomy 5, 29, God says,

Oh, that they may fear me and obey

343

me, that it would go well for them,

that they may live long in the land.

344

And God's heart for us is to obey

him because his commandments are

345

for our good and for our blessing.

346

When we teach a little

child, what do you do?

347

You know, We're, also scripture says

folly is bound up in the heart of a child.

348

So expect a toddler to be

able to have the wise answers.

349

And if we want to go back to

medical research and brain science,

350

we can say your frontal lobe is

not fully developed until 25.

351

You cannot make a healthy

risk assessment right now.

352

So let me tell you actually

what would be the best choice.

353

And let me guide you in goodness.

354

Of course, listening to your heart.

355

Of course, caring about your personality

and doing it in love and gentleness.

356

But you need my guidance.

357

God provided me as a guide,

as a shepherd to you.

358

Betsy: And I think that the whole

idea of the brain development,

359

little children need a consistent

360

quick response that they understand.

361

And that's an understandable response.

362

I was saying a little bit earlier that

the word spank isn't in the Bible.

363

It's actually an onomatopoeic word,

which means It's the sound is the word.

364

this is what it sounds like.

365

It's just a little tap on

their little tushy that stings.

366

It's painful to them, but

it's not in any way harmful.

367

And so we understand that this just raises

the ire of so many people, because this

368

is just so controversial, but we want you

to figure this out for yourself and obey

369

the Bible according to your convictions

that you set up in understanding

370

and agreement with your husband.

371

But know these things, first of

all, discipline speaks of, this is

372

going back to the sermon that I was

listening to, it said this very well.

373

Discipline speaks of

training for a good outcome.

374

Punishment speaks of retribution

and vengeance and wrath.

375

So we are not invoking wrath

or judgment or retribution

376

or vengeance on our children.

377

Their discipline is not

in payment for their sin.

378

It's correcting their sin nature.

379

It's correcting their will

and directing it in a way.

380

Now, some people would say you can't

do this till you know they're a

381

believer, but then what do you wait till

they're 25 and start training a child?

382

the Bible says, train up a

child in the way he should go.

383

And even when he's old, Paul was trained

in so many, the, in the scriptures, and he

384

was a Pharisee of Pharisees, he would say.

385

But all that really just

prepared him for the time when

386

he really would meet the Lord.

387

And he was able to speak to so many

people because of his former training.

388

Training does come into before,

we're training them from little.

389

Even before they're necessarily

saying words or sentences.

390

But

391

going

392

on, Punishment has one purpose,

Discipline has another purpose,

393

and Punishment from God is eternal.

394

The purpose of Discipline is to

produce virtue, and Discipline

395

is only for a temporal season.

396

In Punishment, God is the judge.

397

In Discipline, God is the Father.

398

So many people, and this is true,

we want to parent our children

399

the way that God parents us.

400

We really can't fully do that.

401

But in punishment,

objects are his enemies.

402

In discipline, objects are his children.

403

In punishment, condemnation is the goal.

404

In discipline, righteousness is the goal.

405

We all need pruning,

sometimes extensive pruning.

406

But you when you look at your own life You

begin to see that god is correcting you

407

and you have an understanding that it's

not punishment to your sin in the sense of

408

final punishment That's not condemnation

In the sense of final condemnation,

409

but rather that final punishment has

been born by christ That is correction.

410

Now it is correction This

is not smiting you in wrath.

411

This is correcting you in love.

412

Now, before your children become

believers, you are, you're training

413

them, but it really takes root when

the Holy Spirit enters their hearts

414

and you are correcting them in love.

415

And that has its true lived out purpose.

416

Jen: I think one of the benefits that as

we've heard some of the things in culture

417

and read the scriptures and studied the

scriptures and then also read and then

418

taken entrusted, one of the things that

I appreciate about how entrusted handles

419

some of this is it takes some of these

things that these parenting books and

420

culture are saying that sound good.

421

They sound like they're

scripturally based.

422

They sound Like they're using

scripture, but it's a little confusing.

423

And is the theology on this the

way the Bible teaches, is this

424

psychology, is this scripture, what

is this and what does this look like?

425

And I feel like Entrusted has done a

good job of helping us to understand the

426

difference between biblical principles.

427

Convictions and the difference

between that and personal preferences.

428

And.

429

Personal convictions.

430

And it also separates and helps

us understand the difference

431

between how to parent a toddler

versus how to parent a teenager.

432

The lying in a toddler discipline is

a different than lying in a teenager.

433

And not only that, but it also

helps us to discern between

434

the will and the emotion.

435

What is a willful disobedience and

where does it fall under emotion?

436

Or just discern.

437

Ignorance, like they,

they need training here.

438

And some of these things that we hear in

culture, they put it all in one bucket

439

and say, don't ever don't ever say no,

don't ever spank, don't ever give anyone a

440

discipline in order to change their heart.

441

No, we know we can't change their heart.

442

We know that.

443

And we're not seeking

behavior modification.

444

We are trying to draw out their hearts and

turn their affections towards the Lord.

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But I feel like.

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There's needs to be so much more clarity

on what are, let's define our terms here.

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And I think that Entrusted has done a

good job of doing that where some of these

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other parenting things, the terms are not

defined and it causes so much confusion.

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Stephanie: That's a lot to process.

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We hope it brought some clarity.

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But really may do think, but most

of all, we hope it makes you dig

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into God's word to see for yourself.

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We'll see you next week for part two.

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We know you're busy, Mama, so

we are truly grateful you joined

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us for this episode of Again.

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If you're looking for more information

about building your home on the

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foundation of Jesus Christ, head to www.

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EntrustedMinistries.

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com to learn more about our study for

moms, Entrusted with a Child's Heart.

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This scripture saturated study

has blessed families around the

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world, and we want it for you, too.

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Before you go, I want to pray

this benediction over you

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from 2 Thessalonians 1, 11 12.

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We're rooting for you.

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To this end, we always pray for you,

that our God may make you worthy of His

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calling, and may fulfill every resolve

for good and every work of faith by

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His power, so that the name of our Lord

Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in

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Him, according to the grace of our God.

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And the Lord Jesus Christ.

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Amen.

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Until we meet again.