In this engaging episode of the One Small Change podcast, host Yvonne McCoy is joined by tech-savvy entrepreneur Avital Spivak, who shares her journey of developing courses for seniors and solopreneurs. Avital illustrates how a simple change in language transformed her course engagement and sales. She also offers valuable insights into selecting the right tech tools, testing them effectively, and avoiding common tech mishaps. Avital emphasizes the importance of meeting clients where they are and provides actionable steps to streamline tech infrastructure for smoother business operations.

Guest Bio: Avital Spivak is a passionate entrepreneur with a focus on empowering seniors and solopreneurs with essential tech skills. Through her workshops and courses, she enables her clients to overcome technological barriers and achieve seamless connectivity in their professional and personal lives. Avital's expertise lies in simplifying complex tech concepts and helping clients navigate the digital landscape with confidence.

Key Points Discussed:

1. [00:01:10] Avital shares her transformative small change story - renaming her course for seniors from "Zoom" to "Internet."
2. [00:06:38] Understanding client journeys and developing programs that cater to solopreneurs' business needs.
3. [00:08:48] Tips for choosing the right tech tools and avoiding mismatches that lead to tech problems.
4. [00:17:36] The importance of staying calm during tech mishaps - "sit on your hands" strategy.
5. [00:21:12] Building a simple and effective tech infrastructure and testing it from a client's perspective.

Main Quote: "When you get frantic, sit on your hands... use your eyes. A lot of times what we need is right in front of us."

Guest's Website: Avital Spivak's Website & Free Gift

https://vitalweave.thrivecart.com/navigating-google-land/?coupon=YVONNE 

Welcome to the One Small Change. I am thrilled that you're here

again this week on this journey of exploration and transformation.

I'm your host, Yvonne McCoy, and I bring almost 30 years of

entrepreneurial expertise and passion for discovering

growth through the power of seemingly small change. Thank you for

joining me on this journey. And this week, as

every week, I have an exciting guest for you and someone who's had a huge

impact on my life, Avital Spivak. And

she's gonna share some things that are gonna help you in your business and in

your life. Avital, thank you for coming. Thank you for

spending your time. So I should be I think

I should be perfectly clear. Avital has the

patience of a say because she's been working with me on

my tech. And I swear that I have a tech

gremlin that just has you know, I can't get rid of.

But she has helped me get through some of the hardest things and keep my

sanity and not throw something at my computer. So, Avital,

tell me the small change that you're gonna share with us that that had an

impact on your business. Alright. So it's

pretty early in my business. I created my first course,

and it was for seniors, and it was called,

the connected senior easy adventures on Zoom.

This was mid 2020. In my

mind, every senior that was stuck at home needed Zoom, and if they

haven't figured it out yet, they need to. And I

figured out a way of delivering it remotely, which was

not that easy. So very excitedly, I started trying

to fill up the the the course, you know, have a pilot.

And I started talking with people, and people were sending

me their mom and their neighbor and, you know, like, I had people to talk

with, about 15 people or so.

And I started talking with people and

telling them about the course, and I told

it the way I saw it. You know? You you want to be connected with

your family. You want to be connected with the world. You're stuck at home,

and this will give you a way to participate in courses, follow

your passions, talk to your family,

and we could even create a, you know, a family

event at the end or something, you know, on Zoom. People

are like, oh, okay. You know?

There was very little interest, and I was kind of

flabbergasted. But I asked them, so so what

is it that you're looking for in the computer? Because they got to me because

somebody said that they need something on the computer. And they started saying,

I need to be able to search. I want to know how to,

move those windows. I want to

I don't know what to do with passwords. And I'm thinking to myself,

wow. That's exactly what's in my course. Because to be able to do Zoom,

you have to create a Zoom account, and we were going to go about that

on over passwords and using the browser.

So all those things were in the course already.

So after speaking with about 10 people like

that, I didn't know what to do,

and then I had an idea. I called them back. I called the first

person, and I said, hey. We spoke about a week ago,

and I was telling you about a course that I have. And, you

were not very interested, but you told me that you were interested in this and

that. So I have a new course that I wanted to share with you, if

you're interested. It's called the connected senior,

easy adventures on the Internet

instead of easy adventures on Zoom.

What's in there? That's exactly what I need. I

had a pilot with 10 people that were very

happy and very excited. The change was one word.

But I didn't and I didn't change the course. I didn't change anything except

for the word and the name. And, of course, a little bit

how I told them what's in there. But here's I think here's the

here's here's the real thing. Here's the gem to that.

You're absolutely correct. You did only change one

word. But, and I think this is the mistake that

we make as entrepreneurs, is that we name

things the way we would do it, and not the

way our client would do it or see it. And, you know, the

other thing is that happens to me is I used

to sit down and do this whole course and have it all out

and, you know, stuff like that, and I was like, this is perfect. Right? And

then, you know, when you put it out there, it was crickets because something wasn't

right. And so probably, there are a lot of small

changes that can save us some time. One is talk to

people before before you, you know, invent the

course, you know, or finish it. But also, you

know, we are experts and so sometimes it's hard for

us to see it as a beginner, which is what

other people, you know, thought. So did you after

after they went through the course, did you ask them about, you

know, naming it with Zoom, or did they you

know, your feedback? No. I didn't go and ask them about

Zoom. I wanna say 2 things. First of all, when they ended the

course, I give them a choice of

project. So for the first course, the project

was going to be, hey, let's create an event for your family. But in this

case, I said, what would you like to do? And each person on the

last meeting created their own

project. 1 wanted to learn to do graphics. I sent them to Canva.

1 and etcetera, etcetera. They they had different wishes.

But so for them, it was

exciting because it was what they wanted. For me, it

was a tiny change, but

I was lucky to get that early on in my business.

And from then on, I became very clear about asking

people and telling it to them in their

words because that made a

huge difference in my ability to connect with people and for them

to understand better what it is that I do and what I can do for

them. So, you know, that that brings us kind of to,

you know, that client's journey is that you have to meet people where they

are. And so at that point, you know, people had

some really, you know, zoom Zoom may have seemed because

they didn't know. It's like, I can't even get on to do this. How am

I gonna do Zoom? They didn't know what some of the be you know,

some of the beginning things were. And you've got a lot

of courses and and and programs and stuff. And so is that kind

of the way that you develop your programs

now? I mean, by starting with Some of them. Now

my my main focus for the last few years has been solopreneurs.

So I work I work with people who are solopreneurs who didn't grow up with

computers. So you can see the relationship there.

But these are people who need the computer for work.

So it makes a big difference, and that's where my

courses come from because they're geared around

business needs for solopreneurs.

So if people need the the funnels or

the CRMs or they need to understand how to,

network and connect with people or how to do events.

Anything that the solopreneur need, I can help them

strategize and integrate and then find out which tools would

make the work, to get to their dream, to whatever their

vision is. Well, I know I know working with you, there are

a couple of things that that you've shared with me,

that have been really important. And I think, you know, you're mentioning

tools. So, you know, the process of getting

the right tool is

something that you talk about a lot. So could you talk to us about, you

know because most of us are solopreneurs or entrepreneurs,

and we're constantly being bombarded with new tools that are out there

and you know? So

can you, you know, give us some hints about how we can we can pick

tools well?

Yes. The challenge is how to do it in a short way, but let's see

what I can say here because I think the main thing

is being focused on the tool is a

mistake. We're hyper focused on

skills and tools, like our skills. Can I do it? Can I not do

it? Can I learn it? And the tools themselves. Oh, this tool sounds

good. It does this, this, this, and this, and etcetera.

That focus creates a problem.

A lot of, tech problems, we

I think it became normalized in our society

that I have tech problems. Like, you go through the day and and

a lot of that, in the

and people who didn't grow up in with computer land, who are not natives,

tend to say, it's my fault. I didn't learn it. I don't know. I don't

know what to do. Some people

say, you know, the tool is not good, etcetera. But a lot

of tool problems comes from mismatching.

When the tool you choose to work with is not the right tool for the

job, there's gonna be friction all the way through in many, many

different ways. And you won't even know that

it's not fitting. You'll just think I don't know how to use it. The tool

doesn't do the right stuff. You know, it can go in different

directions. It's a misfit. So what's not fitting here?

The thing that's not fitting is the beginning. The beginning is

you had some problem. You had some need that got you to seek a

tool. Even if the tool came to you from

the bombardment of, you know, the salespeople

and your friends saying, I have this thing, and it's great and all

that kind of still, if you didn't have any

problems, you wouldn't be listening to that, and it wouldn't matter to you

because it wouldn't match and meet a need.

So if you identify what is my need, what is the strategy I'm

trying to deploy, what do I want to get out of putting

that strategy in place in my business?

Once you're clear on that, then you say, okay. What

can I use to make this strategy happen? 1st

place to look, things you already have. You may already have

tools that do the job. You just may not be aware of it.

But if you go out and start looking for a tool,

then sometimes the

focus moves from this is my need and I need something

to make it happen to, oh,

wow. Look at that tool. It can do this and that and the other. And

suddenly, you may be buying a tool or considering a tool

that can do 10 different things. Oh, and it will take place

of this thing that I have, and it will take the place of this thing

that I and you lose focus on what was it that

you what it was that you wanted to create. So can

I just recap a little bit what I think you're saying is

that too often, somebody goes, oh, I found

this thing that'll do this thing? Right? And

you're not thinking to yourself, what are

you know, do I have this problem? And if I have this

problem, do I already have things, or is there a way

that I can take care of this already before I add something new? I mean,

is that part of what you're saying? That's part of what I'm saying, and you

can add to it. With this thing, when I add it to my other

tools, would it work with them? Would it play well together? Do they

speak the same language? That's that's that's the second part that I

was I was gonna say is that, you know,

even if you do think you're making a good decision,

part of that decision making process, which I have to be

honest I never think about,

is is this gonna play well with what I've already

got? Yeah. Right? And so that I think

is a place where we get into trouble. So, I mean, I

know I just switched platform, which was like hair

raising. And one of the things that for me

was really hard to give up from the first platform is

that it had a built in calendar thing, and I had to get a second

calendar thing. But there were so many things

in the first platform that were very expensive that I was

not using, that I didn't I couldn't learn how to use because they

weren't intuitive Yep. That the trade off

was well worth it. Yes. So I think,

you know, I you know, and I have to say, this is you probably wanna

you probably wanna smack me for this, But I never like to pick a

tool that's I don't somebody else isn't using it. So if I need I

need to ask a question, I can go, have you tried to do this or

it's not, you know That's a good policy. I you know, so

that's, you know, a big part for me is who else is using this

that I can get a fast answer from about the simple the

simple things that I need to do. So Yeah.

That's a wonderful thing to do. No smacking here. So

so the first thing that that we got from you was

a small change is it can be the wording of

a course. And, you know, it's funny because I

just changed the wording of something and it it you know,

using chat gpt, which is one type that I really love.

It was from pain to profit. And I'm

like, that's not quite right. And I made

it from pain to trust to profit.

And because that's what I want to happen. I want people, you

know, I want the client to trust me, and then they'll be willing to spend

their money. Right? And so the the wording

is a little longer than, you know, and I

and I tried it out on couple different people, and they're like, yeah, we like

this one a lot better. So I think, you know, it's hard to do it's

hard to get a clear picture by yourself. Someone said it's hard to have a

perspective, you know, if you're the picture in the frame. You need to get some

outside feedback, and that's not just for textings. You

know, it's for your business, different parts of your business as a whole.

The other thing is

knowing that tech is a tool that should make your

life easier. And I think

that mindset is is one that

I'm trying to grow into.

That there are different pieces of it. And I need one of the reasons

that I got in trouble with the first platform is I took somebody's

advice that was working with me and they're like, this is what I work with.

This is, you know, this will be great. And when I got

ready to shut it down, I had no idea where anything was or how it

worked or, you know, anything like that. And so I would

say that it's important to work with somebody

that can help you understand what your check

what your check what your tech is doing

for you so that you can see first of all, see what it does,

see what the potential is that it can do, what

you're not using so that you're not adding things that you

don't need. Very true.

Yeah. So so let me ask you this,

because this is another story that I really liked, when we

first start working together is, you know, when something

does go wrong with tech, we tend to be frantic.

And so so what was your advice to me that I still remember

to this day, that's a good thing for people to

know? You want me to tell the story?

Sure. Alright. So

I think most of us are familiar with the experience of something

goes wrong, something pops, something like, oh, no. I just

deleted this thing, and we start clicking.

Clicking things off, clicking things closed, clicking okay,

cancel, click. And

I say, this is the wrong time to click for

about anything because you just took a

a move that you want to undo. The way

to undo something is not to start stomping on it so that

you can't see anymore what happened. And

what I tell people is sit on your hands. Because

when we get frantic, it's an adrenaline rush. It's

not a choice. We

immediately it's a fight or flight,

and, you know, we fight.

We go in, and we start fighting. It's not a

conscious choice. And the only way for your hands not to

click on that button and go all over is to not let them

move, which is sit on them. And this is coming from an old hiking

story because, when I learned hiking, one

of the first thing they say is when you lose the trail, the first

minute you don't see the next blaze or the next trail marker,

drop your sack and sit on it. Just sit

down. Why? Because when

you sit down, your legs cannot take you running.

And what happens naturally when you feel lost

is starting to run around trying to look for that trail.

And if I took one step off the trail and now I'm starting to

run, my chances of finding the trail

are getting smaller fast.

If I took one step and sat down,

now I can look around.

Well, I I love that story simply because,

right after you told me that story, I actually saw a special about

somebody who got lost, and that was, you know so it really anchored it for

me. But so our time is, you

know, I wanna make sure we're making the best use of our time. So we

we got your small change. We got some really good advice. What are

three action steps that you would give entrepreneurs

and solopreneurs to help them in their tech world?

I know one that that you tell me all the time, and that is that

I need to restart my computer on a regular basis.

So I don't know if I don't know if I'm the only one that doesn't

do that. But that's

generally you know, if something goes wrong with your Internet or anything, you call

the support and they say the first thing they say is, you know, turn it

off, turn it back on. It is a good

thing. It's not specific to entrepreneur. It's very good for

anybody that has any kind of device because our

devices start getting corrupted. Things go off. When you

restart, it all gets aligned. It's a

reset, then it starts from a good position. So instead of

trying to fix something that went wrong, we just get a

good fresh start. So that makes a difference.

I would say a couple of things. One is,

think about the background,

the the what do you call it?

Missing a word. But when you're looking at your at the

product that you're trying to sell and you're getting your messaging and you

you need your infrastructure. That's the was the missing word. You need your

infrastructure. You need to make sure that you have a way to get money and

you have a way to that your links are working. You

want to have a smooth sailing for your client.

So when you create it or when somebody creates it for you,

go and test it. You will find a lot

of, things that could be costly once you deploy.

If you test have to be complicated either. Not at all.

Because testing means walk it like a client. Right. But

I'm just saying you don't need to have a whole lot of bells and whistles

necessarily to have a process that works. No. It's

actually important to start with the minimum viable, which

doesn't mean, low quality.

But minimum viable means you have a dirt

road that goes all the way through from meeting the leads

to talking to them, to,

enrolling them to delivery. You have a road that goes

with no sort of black holes in the middle.

Once you have a full road, you can start

augmenting and upgrading the parts, you know, to get a

better road and a better experience and more

automation, etcetera. In the beginning, we might do things, you

know, by hand. That's totally fine. I think your

gift is something that's gonna help us to have smooth

sailing. So if you would tell us about the freebie that you've got, and it's

amazing. So I'm gonna give

your listeners, my course, one of

them. It's called navigating Google land,

and that is for anybody who's ever felt confused

about Google Docs and Google Drive, things like that.

Because these days, this is something fundamental that most of us need in order

to collaborate. Yes. Either to collaborate with partners or if

you're doing any kind of, meeting with other people you want

to share information. If you're taking a course, the course might

use this, and we all need to use it whether we want to

or not. So, for those of us who come from

the Microsoft Word or from any other world and want to know the

basics that you need for collaboration, that's what this course is about.

It's a very short course. So the whole

thing is less than an hour if you take it all at once,

But then you get to, see it in pieces whenever

you want, which piece that you need. And it's No.

Go ahead. Actually curated to just be

what you need and nothing more. So collaboration,

sharing, creating, moving it from one folder to another, that

stuff. The other thing that I wanna say to you is

this is a paid course that Avital is giving

giving us a special code for so that we can get this.

So I I don't know anybody that doesn't need help with Google

World. And so I'm gonna really encourage

you to do that. And I can't say

enough about her help. Thank you.

We we probably wouldn't be on Zoom without her.

Alright. So alright. I got a challenge for you. When was the last time you

did something new for the first time?

It might sound funny, and maybe people will not believe me it's the

first time. But 3 weeks ago, I took a 5

day road trip. Road trip is not new,

but I disconnected. I did not look at my email.

I did not do anything. I did not meet clients.

I took 5 weeks 5 days

off. Haven't done this in years. So I I

will consider this new and first.

To do it for that long. I don't know. I think I

I don't I don't know that I could do that. Okay.

So we're out of time, believe it or not. I mean, that went really fast.

So I gotta give you kind of the commercial, and that is make

sure that you, subscribe and that you share this with

other people to engage in the podcast on social media. And

one of the reasons I'm doing this is so that you can

supercharge your business through connection. It's it's kind of my way to give

back to a vibrant community and help you fuel your

your quest for growth and impact. And so I hope that you'll

continue to join me for one small change because there are lots of interesting

people who are joining me. And, you know, the smallest

shift, the smallest thing that somebody can say, you would be

surprised in the monumental transformation that it might bring. And so,

you know, if you haven't listened to some other ones, you may wanna dive in

and see what other episodes are there so that you can look at bold

visions and innovative possibilities. So, Avital, which what are

your last words that you would say to somebody, that they can

take away?

Use your eyes. That might sound funny,

but a lot of times what we need is right in front of us, and

we're assuming it's not there or we're just skimming.

When I get in trouble, I gather more observations, and

it saves me a lot. So I hope this helps.

So you sit on your hands and use your eyes. Right? Sit on

your hands and use your eyes. My clients call me 2 3 years

later and say that that's the most important skill I drilled into them.

So well, you know, I shared with you the other day that I went through

one of those panic pushing all the buttons, and I was like, time out for

me and the computer. You know? And just, you know,

to stop that cycle. So this has been a lot of fun,

and, you know, I want everybody to remember that that change can

be simple, but it's not always easy. And it requires a

certain amount of curiosity, courage, and resilience, and a willingness

to step outside your comfort zone. So I hope that you're gonna join me

again for the one small change so that you can embark on a journey of

innovative possibilities. And so I will leave you with

my words. Until the next time, stay curious.

Thanks, Avital, so much. Thank you for

hosting me.