Today we clear the backlog on outstanding questions we have collected during our newhire onboarding.

• How do I ramp-up quickly on a new technology/topic?
• How often should I check in with my boss?
• How do I get more responsibility?

We referenced a couple of interesting resources during the discussion as well:

• Computer Scientist Explains Machine Learning in 5 Levels of Difficulty | WIRED
• The Feynman Learning Technique

Thanks for joining us today and don't forget to hit the subscribe button or reach out at hello@wannagrabcoffee.com.

Charles Knight 0:05

Alamo does it right, though? I mean, for the right movie, they will make themed food. So it complements the movie as opposed to detracts. I'm sure they're doing something for dune.

Robert Greiner 0:16

Oh, I'm sure. Also like their stance on if someone complains about you being noisy words can kick you out.

Charles Knight 0:21

Yeah, yeah.

Robert Greiner 0:23

No riffraff theater. Yeah.

Charles Knight 0:25

Speaking of side, hustle, you are that 3d printer. Then you gifted me remember that?

Igor Geyfman 0:32

Well gifted it to the girls. Yes.

Robert Greiner 0:36

Same difference.

Charles Knight 0:39

The guardians but yes.

Robert Greiner 0:40

Charles straight up told me that you gave it to him. So

Charles Knight 0:46

sorry, yes. For the girls. So they we printed out some for Halloween. On the printer, Cloe, school. I tried to do a real big one, but I can four different parts and wasted like half of the frickin filament. And the thing overnight, it fell off the adhesion plate, or the build plate. And so I woke up in the morning, I was like, Oh, dear God, so I'd scaled it way down to create a maybe a four inch tall. Chloe took one to school. And apparently all the kids are interested in it. They want one. And so I said, Okay, oh, here's the business. And so they wrote down all the people that they're going to talk to today. I'm gonna take orders. We have pricing set $2 per figurine of comparable size $3 If you want an object, I don't know why they charge more for an object versus a versus an animal.

Robert Greiner 1:42

Oh, like a soccer ball or something like that?

Charles Knight 1:44

Yeah, like that. Yeah. And we're going to make this thing a business. So thank you for that.

Robert Greiner 1:48

it's very enterprising.

Charles and daughter's print shop. Yeah,

Charles Knight 1:52

they came up with a name. They call me Dodi for some reason. So it's like Dodi's 3d creations. That's the name.

Robert Greiner 1:59

Oh, that's so good.

Charles Knight 2:02

I thought it was weird. But they're like, No, I think my friends will think Dodi is cool. Like, I feel like an idiot. But Dodi it is.

Robert Greiner 2:10

There you go get some business cards made. Yeah, that's

Charles Knight 2:13

what I said. So when you come up with a logo, they're like, Do we really have to us like No, no, right? Let's

Robert Greiner 2:17

come on dad.

Charles Knight 2:18

Let's test the market. Let's see. Let's keep track of our revenue and our expenses because that a buy new filament. And if we want to scale, then we're gonna need some of this stuff. Okay. So we'll see.

Robert Greiner 2:29

You got a connection. You can get 3d printers for free apparently.

Charles Knight 2:32

Yeah.

Igor Geyfman 2:36

Only if your an adorable child. Yeah.

Robert Greiner 2:38

Charles says have to that one. Yeah.

Igor Geyfman 2:41

So silly. Me.

Charles Knight 2:42

Yeah. When Dodi's 3d Creations needs to scale. I'll come asking my my financial backer for next round of funding to help us to

Igor Geyfman 2:52

get your series B. angel round.

Robert Greiner 2:54

Yeah, there you go. We've come a long way. It's such a great time to be alive. In junior high, I sold bubblegum, cheap candy. My mom would drop me off at the gas station right before school. I would load up a paper bag full of 25 cent gum and sell it for 50 cents.

Charles Knight 3:12

Genius. Yeah. What's interesting is that the kids are not. They're not. They have money, they get an allowance. I take them shopping, they could buy things with their own money. But they're resistant to ask their friends for money. But hey, look that you're solving a problem for them. It's like they want what you have. You're giving it to them for something in return. And you can use this to buy whatever you want. I was surprised to see them be so resistant to it. I think they'd rather just give it away, which is very generous. But it's okay that, you know that that can only get you so far. Like, what can we give it away for free? It's like, well, then if we do this a lot, then we're going to be continuing to spend money on buying raw materials and stuff like that. And I don't know, but I guess I have to do more education around around that. Anyway, we're having fun. That's important.

Igor Geyfman 3:59

Y'all were discussing pricing? Did you take into account things like cost the filament? Was that like a teaching moment or anything like that? That was like a cost plus pricing model.

Charles Knight 4:08

I didn't get super detailed. But it's like, hey, look, larger things should cost more because they take more time and attention, because you have to maybe sit and watch it and pause it and restarted if it fails, and it just requires more, more plastic. Yeah, we did talk about that. We'll start to talk about counting to like, hey, you need to take the orders. But we need to keep track of what do we build? What do we charge them? What did we what do we spend money on and start creating a book to keep track of all that stuff? Nice. We'll see. We'll see if it's,

Robert Greiner 4:42

I'm not sure there's any class they'll take up through being a senior in high school that would teach them that. Yeah, that is a very useful thing to it's practical.

Charles Knight 4:51

Yeah.

Igor Geyfman 4:52

Are they using accrual or cash based accounting?

Charles Knight 4:56

So both, it's a little bit I was gonna To say cash based, but they are perfectly fine with giving the product and then asking for the money and then getting payment later, because they're in a rush to satisfy their friends demands. So I was pushing for cash. But we're going to go with accrual for now.

Igor Geyfman 5:20

And they comply with the Uniform Commercial Code and generally accepted accounting procedures app.

Charles Knight 5:27

But I think, Robert, I do got a tax guy that from Robert, so I'll inform him of the need to create an LLC. And

Robert Greiner 5:37

there you go to get oh man without actually you might. I know we're joking. I'm not sure if there's enough profit or whatever to make this worthwhile. But I think the money they bring in, you can actually put into an IRA in their name. But it's very hard to get money in a retirement account for kids before they're adults. And there's all sorts of rules against it. If you have a business and you can't pay your kid $25,000 to come sweep the floor in an IRA, it has to be like market wages and stuff. But if they have if you incorporate and you have, which is fairly cheap, and you put whatever profit they make into an IRA, I think that would work. But we don't we do not give tax or legal or professional or personal advice on any kind of education and entertainment purposes only.

Igor Geyfman 6:25

Yeah, mostly entertainment.

Robert Greiner 6:27

But you might ask is like you could actually be on to something, even just a few $1,000 over it. Like they just start with that before they go to college. Like that can be a big deal. Next time I come into the office, too, I hope I don't see like a little gift shop stand where the excess inventory is sold at a discount?

Charles Knight 6:46

Yeah.

Robert Greiner 6:47

All right. What do you all want to talk about?

Charles Knight 6:48

Yeah, sorry for CO opting the time. Now it's great. Let me see. How do I ramp up a new tech? I like that one? How do I get more responsibility? I like that one. How often should I check with my boss? I'm neutral on that one? It's kind of I don't have an initial thought about what I would say, which is fine. But yeah, I like those Igor.

Igor Geyfman 7:09

I say we go for it. I like it.

Robert Greiner 7:12

So rapid New Hire rapid fire questions. Yeah. Yeah. So that I guess this would make our second episode. We've done a few now in answering questions that we get from new hires. So we're just coming out of New Hire season, we've done our multiple new hire onboarding, where we force feed Kool Aid and get everyone sort of indoctrinated IV into our system, which we're pretty effective at I think, which is good. And now you get hired, you get on boarded, you get your laptop, you get your phone, your setup, got all your direct deposits, things going on, and then you land on your project. So this happens everywhere, whether you're in consulting or not. And you have to actually do work and be productive. And so these questions are really around that. So maybe read the three off that we have remaining, and we'll get them rapidfire. Yeah.

Charles Knight 8:07

Yeah, sounds good.

Robert Greiner 8:08

Okay. The first one is how do I ramp up on a new technology or topic? Second is how often should I check in with my boss? And third is how do I get more responsibility? So we'll start with the first one. Yeah.

Charles Knight 8:21

Yeah.

Robert Greiner 8:21

Cool. Igor, you want to take a stab at it?

Igor Geyfman 8:24

Yeah. So this is the question to that. How do you get acclimated to a new technology fast?

Robert Greiner 8:29

Yeah, ramped up on a new technology

Ramped up on a new technology. Yeah, yeah, the best advice on how to give is usually like the advice that's worked for me in the past. And whenever I'm presented with ramping up on a new technology, and I have a pretty broad definition of technology, it could be a new tool, it could be a new, let's say, programming language, it could be a new, even, let's say, like, design style, or whatever it is, I'm like a hands on learner. And so what I like to do is I like to create a small project that I think is cool, that excites me personally, and then use that new technology to help build some piece of a solution that's like meaningful, because if I tried to follow a tutorial, or something like that, like I'll still watch some tutorials just to get a sense of like the capabilities of the tools and some tips and tricks. But trying to just recreate something else that someone just created in a tutorial is not very interesting for me and I just lose interest. I make up a small little project, about something that I'm excited, and then I use that technology to go for it. And what helps enable the speed is usually I'll read a bunch of stuff, but I'll read it as I encountered problems. Like, I won't read like a whole bunch of about it beforehand. I'll just start the solution. And as I run into a particular issue that I'm having I will go and resolve it, if it's a technical issue, maybe Stack Overflow or something like that. But there's obviously different resources for different technologies and things that you're trying. And I've now lately have found YouTube to be an invaluable tool to get up to speed. But yeah, my biggest tip for that is make up a fun project for yourself, that you enjoy doing on your free time. Something that might even be useful for your friends and family, or for yourself, and just go for it and read it read and solve things as they come up. But don't feel like you have to read about the technology for 20 hours before. Before getting started. That's probably my top tip.

So you're learning by doing but not just randomly, doing like, you're creating some meaning a productive output.

Yeah, because like, we're so busy, right? Like, we're busy with stuff during our regular course of our workday, we're busy after work. And so what I found is, if I don't create something that gets me excited as like a premise, then I end up just not doing the learning or doing it as quickly as or as efficiently as I otherwise would.

Yeah, I'm a very learned by doing kind of person to I was thinking about, specifically around technology was a big fan of the copy paste inheritance, she kind of just go to Stack Overflow, and copy and paste and try to force it into work, which is one strategy, it's not a great one, if you're really trying to learn. And so it's in that, that history with my own personal experience where this advice is coming from. And because there's so much information out there about any technology these days, you can go to Stack Overflow, you can watch YouTube videos, you can take courses, you can go through a bootcamp, there is so much information out there, what I started to find is that finding a high quality source of information is more and more important these days. And so I would say the best way to learn a new topic or technology is to find the highest quality source of information about it, that you can, and invest some time upfront there, before you jump into the first Google search result, or a book recommendation that somebody gave you, because there's just, frankly, a lot of garbage out there. And if you're really trying to do this to learn something, then it's worth investing time to identify the right source of information. If you need something just to get it working, then you're probably not really interested in the answer to this question. So I'm gearing it more towards a learning perspective and ensuring you've got a high quality source, if that makes sense.

Yeah. And sometimes we have such an aversion to paying for videos and apps and things like that now, but sometimes there is training that cost money that's very well done. And you definitely get the value pay for it. But again, there's a buyer beware component there, because there's a lot that is garbage. And it still costs money.

Yeah.

Yeah, I agree with what y'all are saying. There's a few different learning types, right? You have visual, auditory, those kind of things that only get you so far, though, I do fully believe you have to learn by doing and really completing things. And this is coming from someone who is like soup get super distracted. And I may start something and not finish it happens a lot. Getting something from 20, like from zero to 20% done or to 80% done usually is like the lowest effort, lowest growth part of the project, it's really getting to that 100% mark where the learning and magic comes in. And so I would say like the oxygen of growth here of learning a new technology, a new topic, is to create a project around it. Just what Igor says it has to be meaningful. It can't just be busy work, and actually finishing that project. Because then that final 20%, I think is a lot of core learning and growth that comes into play that you just wouldn't get if you only did to halfway or something. The only thing I could think of twos teach it to others. Can you write a blog post about what you learned create a video and email, something like that doesn't have to be high production quality. But typically, if you can teach something to others in your own words, and you're not relying on figuring out by Googling and figuring it out as you go, it could lead you to a higher level of understanding as well.

I really like that a second that one for sure. Yeah. Reminds me of the Fineman technique. Have y'all heard of this? It's a learning technique.

No,

It's from Richard Fineman. He's a was a physicist assist. Yeah, you take a sheet of paper And you're right up at the top the name of your topic, and then you proceed to try to write down how you would teach this to a five year old or an eight year old. And if you can't, then you've got more to learn. I love it, it's less of a technique and more of a gut check. Because if you can communicate it to others, then you don't really understand the material. So yeah, that's why I love your suggestion, Robert.

Yeah, that's funny. So on, wired, they have things like computer scientist explains machine learning in five levels of difficulty. And so like Hillary Mason, who's really big into AI, ml, that's that was a pretty good one. But she's explaining machine learning to a five year old kid, and then a teen, and then someone in college, and then a grad student in the field, and then an expert in the field. And it goes from the super simplistic way. And she's like, asking questions like, how would you think this would work? And then by the time you get to expert, it's just you peers having conversation. It's really interesting. And yeah, I think that boiling it down, it makes sense. So how would you explain this to a five year old, you have to really distill it there that, that shows that you can take it from where you think you're at to actually being able to explain it. I like that a lot.

I'll find a link for the show notes. Robert, for the Fineman technique. If you find that link to the video, I would love to see that. Watch that.

Oh, yeah. We'll put in the show notes. And wired. Pretty sure. Yep. Computer scientists explains machine learning. There you go. I will send that to you right now. And put in the show notes. Kids might get a kick out of it, too. Maybe one thing I'll add on this, too, you said I can't remember the term use. But it's like the way you use Google or stack overflow to, to copy and paste,

copy paste inheritance. Yeah.

So funny. Copy Paste inheritance. I like that. A lot of what we do, though, and and when we create things is worth more more assembling than creating. And so I don't think that's a bad thing. It can be used as a crutch, though. And so I definitely, I get your point there. But don't think it's a bad idea to pull ideas and concepts from that people have already solved solve problems to bring in and make your own. I think

That kind of gets to the underlying philosophy that at our firm is that technologies come and go in. So sure, you got to know enough about the specific technology to solve the problem in front of you. But most technologies follow some sort of pattern, and some sort of underlying principle. And as you learn by copying, pasting from Stack Overflow, and getting it to work, or creating a project of your own, that is meaningful, really, what we're trying to do is learn these underlying principles. And you can't learn those underlying principles without actually learning a specific technology, for example. But at some point, I remember as I ramped up on new technology after new technology, maybe the third or fourth or fifth time, it was VB dotnet at first, and then it was Java, and then it was C sharp, and then it was JavaScript. b You see it's a Yeah. Next time you pick up something new, you know what to look for you understand kind of these foundational constructs that are shared across all technologies.

There's like a language.

Yeah, there's the language. Yeah. Now computer scientists know. And they speak, but most of us don't, because we don't have to. And that's really the key to accelerated learning over time. I know that's not exactly the question that was asked. But that is at least our purpose. It's like you learn one technology. So that way, you can get better at learning new technologies in the future. If you do that three or four times, then picking up a new technology is just, it's so much easier, right than the first time.

Yeah, my background was more back end, like fit client stuff. And so use make heavy use of the debugger and breakpoints and stuff like that. And when you go to web development, even on the front end stuff, like there's a way to, like build that in, even though it might not be as natural because not compiled. Yeah. But there's still a way to run through and assess in a debugging way, because that's how people are used to fixing the stuff that they wrote poorly or incorrectly or whatever. Okay, cool. So ready for question number two? Okay, how often should I check in with my boss? So this is especially geared at new hires, but could apply to anyone starting a new job working on a new project? Or even if you've been on a team for 18 months, two years, and just don't know, what do you think about this one?

I had an initial reaction to this question. When it was posed to us. It's so dependent upon many different things. And so let me just unpack it a little bit, you know, can help me do that. There's a balance that has to be established between your boss and yourself. And so I think, the very first advice is You should ask this question of your boss. Because if you don't make it explicit like that, then your boss might perceive it as, Wow, you need a lot of help. You're being really needy, you're not able to operate independently. But if you don't reach out to them, then they may worry that you're venturing off into the unknown and wasting time and energy and be not be not sure as to what you're doing. And so there's, I think my first advice is like, figure that out with your boss. That's probably Advice number one. And then whatever that agreement is, maybe that's once a week, maybe that's three times a week, maybe that's once a month, I don't know, be open to ad hoc interactions outside of that. Because sometimes I, I get stuck into the Oh, yeah, we've got a regular one on one once a week, or once every two weeks. Let me just wait for that to come up. That's not always the right answer. And so figure out some sort of cadence, but don't get too locked into that. Because there are going to be times when you need to check in more frequently, depending upon an assignment or a situation or an escalation or whatever. And just be prepared to do that. Know, that that's okay. Those are the first reactions I had to that.

I couldn't agree more. I definitely agree. This one asking shows you care. As a leader of people, it helps to know who's bought in. And so I think there's a level of productivity there, but a behavior that will be interpreted as proactive. And I think, yeah, it's not about what you want. Here. It's about the level of communication that your boss is looking for, and your manager, whoever. And so if you get on the same page about that, then I think only good things can happen. And that's maybe a conversation that doesn't happen just once either. If someone leaves, for instance, and you're responsible for helping with the knowledge transfer, or a new, large project or initiative comes on, where you get more responsibility, which we'll talk about here in a second. It may say, Hey, should we ramp up our communication here? Would you like weekly updates? Like how could I best keep you updated on how this is going? Because I know it's important. And so it's not just a set and forget thing either. And I would also just add, you're probably not communicating with your boss enough. Most people I would say, could stand to do 20% more than they think they should. Which is probably 50% more than what they're doing right now.

Why do you think that is?

Yeah, so for me, personally, I just crave autonomy. So I actually don't like when people are in my business, even though it makes total sense. With that's a personal personal character flaw. Yeah. And you're afraid of sometimes afraid of what they're gonna say, like you could bring how many issues could be completely avoided if they're escalated and surfaced even imperfectly, earlier? Yeah, tons. But people are afraid they're in denial. If you're a boss that reacts poorly when people give you bad news. And you're just going to get less news. And so I think mostly it's just out of a desire for autonomy, fear of getting in trouble, those kinds of things.

I'll tell you one other thing that that I think pairs well with those is the thought that my boss is too busy. That's like, oh, I don't want to bother them. They've got more important things to think about or their time is more valuable spent doing other things. That is such a such a cash. I don't even know what the right word is guided? misguided. Yeah, very misguided. Don't make that decision for them. Is my advice there. It's, we're all busy. It's just your boss probably looks. your boss's busy looks different than yours. We all got the same number of hours in a day that we typically work, generally speaking, but don't let the Oh they look really busy. Be a reason why you don't talk to your boss on a regular basis. That's, uh, I see that as a common blocker for why people don't talk to the boss as much as they could or should.

Yeah, I think we stole all of Igor's thunder. Anything to add of that buddy?

Now, here comes the wisdom. Right?

That's right, Charles and I just want so we showed you where the tip of the iceberg was? Yeah,

no, yeah. Like, this is such a, what is checking in me? How much time does that take? What's the nature and content of like the check in? I think that really matters. And maybe it also differs whether you're in person or remote. I do think that generally people tend to under check in, rather than over check in. And I think for most people, they shouldn't be like afraid of annoying your boss, because if they're good manager, they want to be there for you to help you resolve whatever's getting in your way. Part of a big part of what they're there for. And like you said, Robert, there's probably things that could be resolved more effectively. If I They were communicated during it. So what are checking looks like with your boss, but you definitely can't go wrong. Having a conversation about what the expectations are, and coming to a workable solution that makes sense. I think if you're checking in with your boss less than once a week, that's probably not great. I think there's probably very few cases where there's, it's good that you're not checking in at least once a week. But I also don't see an issue where in certain contexts and certain work environments and needs that you can be checking in multiple times a day, and those check ins might the once a week check in might look like half an hour, and the multiple times a day check in might just look like five minutes. So that's that's kind of my little addition. But for the most part, I think you guys are spot on, especially with the first point about talking to your boss, but also understanding that you should be reconciling both of your needs in that conversation. It's not just Hey, boss, often should I check in with you, you should check in with me every day. Okay, sounds good. Like, I don't know if that's an effective conversation to have. It should be a two way thing. And you should fully understand why everyday matters to your boss, and maybe what the check can actually and set boundaries and expectations and create like mutual understanding between.

All right, cool. Last one, my rapid fire questions. How do I get more responsibility? I think Charles, and you might have gotten context around this. But this is typically asked of people who want to grow their career to get new experiences to get promoted, those kinds of things. How can I take on more as a proxy for if I do that, and I do well at it, then I'll be rewarded. Whatever that looks like. Cool. Igor, you want to take that first? Since you had to suffer through?

I didn't know. I mean, I enjoyed my way through that no suffering? Yeah, I think if you're, I think if your attitude taking on more responsibility begins, and is spurred by what you think just described Robert as a quid pro quo. If I take on more responsibility, I will get you know, these, let's say material rewards, right? I'll get promoted faster, I'll get a bonus, I'll get an attaboy or atta girl, whatever it is. And I think if that's where, if that's the impetus for this question, then probably like probably not a good place to start. If your emphasis is I want to grow, I want to learn, I want to experience, those are probably better starting points than like, I want to have more from some sort of compensation standpoint. And the way to do it a lot of times is a by looking for opportunities to exercise, like your creativity, and just being proactive and taking responsibility in that area. And not like waiting until somebody has a conversation with you about it. Not at all. A lot of times not even let's say asking for, like outright permission, was some of the best times that I've asked for more responsibility is I'd have, hey, I was like, here's an example of a conversation I had like, very early on in my career, I said something like, I think we would really benefit. If our distributors, which in this case, were our customer, you know, our customers, if our distributors had a higher level of quality in their communication, and use like different medium, and here's how I think that might work across print, and web. And it's a video. And I was just like really interested in doing all these things. And I come by connected my interest in doing those things with a potential benefit for our customers and our company. And then I had a rough plan in mind. But I just said, Hey, this is what I'd like to do. And yeah, like it could have gotten shot down. But I think because my boss saw, like my passion for it. And it was a decently good case, to do it. And I showed them how it can be done without adding a huge expense. Or it wouldn't really affect the quality of the work that I was doing today. I thought of like objections and constraints beforehand. He said, Yeah, that's sounds great. You know, go for it. And I just started doing it. And I did that my first six months on my job, or whatever it is out of school. And what that taught me is that if I continue to do that, I have an infinite way to like shape every job that I ever have, and I have shaped every job that I've ever had in that same way. And there's a lot of like freedom and autonomy and agency in that, which has been really good for me personally in my in my career. And so that's like, my advice is don't think of asking for more responsibility or some sort of quid pro quo. And basically just say, make an offer that they can't refuse just coming up with ways that objections that your boss might have by, oh, you're too busy for that, or we're going to have to spend a lot more money to be able to do that. You want to resolve some of those things by thinking through them a little bit ahead of time to show that this is not just like some whim that you have, and you're being blown around by the wind, but that there's an actual, you know, thoughtful proposal in place. And what I found is that the financial rewards actually just come naturally to you. They're like, a nice consequence or bonus, which is, but I think if I ever started out with, I'm going to do it, because I'll get a promotion. I think that's like, a losing starting place.

No, we're close at a time. So let me drop my one sentence answer. And Robert, so you can get a word in last word into that. Okay, love. It's not that I don't like your answer, Igor. But we are on a time crunch. My advice would be to take on more responsibility. Find and train your successor, like in whatever it is that you're currently doing. I think that's my, my advice. That's a very different dynamic. Let me just take on more and more, right, there's this more and more on my plate that that happens. But eventually you want stuff to come off your plate, so you can take on even higher level things. And to take it off your plate, it needs to go to somebody else. So that's mine.

Yeah, that's great. The other thing too, is there's a level of improvement we have if you're the first time you do a task, whatever it is, it's probably going to take you the longest, the 10th time you do it should be much shorter. And so there is an aspect of you like things don't get easier, you just get better at them. So that could also be a way to create some margin. But I would say we might recommend in certain instances, burning hotter so that you can create more space through effort to get stuff done. But that's that probably shouldn't be your default mode. I definitely agree.

Training of your replacement might just be like automation of your task, like for deleting like, yeah, yeah,

the replacement could be nobody? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, the other thing too, so if you if you're crushing your daily work, your responsibilities, and part of that will help you get more done in less time or the same done in less time, it's going to be easier to go ask and I think asking for more, is definitely the right way to go look at the things that your boss has on his or her plate and say, that report that you go and generate, what if I took a stab at that? Can I help you with that? Or is there anything that you're overburdened with that I can take off your plate? And sometimes they'll say yes. And so I think just asking makes a lot of sense. And managers don't have a full picture about what you're doing or how well you're doing it, they have a pretty good idea, but they're taking core samples, right? And not micromanaging you with you every day. And even the best ones don't have that complete picture. So it's your responsibility to make sure they know what you're doing, how well you're doing it, and what kinds of things you're looking to experience as you're looking for, to to grow your career. And that feeds into our previous answer, which is have those discussions with your boss, so you know where you stand. And so then that you've signaled that you're interested in, in taking on more and growing your career. So there we go. That's all of it.

Thanks guys,

three minutes over.

Not too bad.

Not too bad. Yeah, it was great talking to you today

Not bad at all. Yeah, thanks ya'll.

Bye

Alright. That's it for today. Thanks for joining. And don't forget to follow us on Twitter @wannagrabcoffee or drop us a line at Hello@wannagrabcoffee.com