If you're a coach, consultant, or high-ticket seller who relies on Stripe or PayPal to collect payments — you may be one bad month away from a frozen account and held funds. In this episode, 27-year payment processing veteran Rey Pasinli joins host Chuck Anderson to explain exactly why platforms like Stripe were not built for high-ticket or high-volume coaching businesses, what triggers their automated shutdown systems, and how to protect your revenue before disaster strikes. Rey breaks down the difference between aggregated payment platforms and traditional merchant accounts, explains what chargeback ratios and refund thresholds actually mean for your account health, and outlines when and how to make the move to a more stable, scalable payment infrastructure. Whether you're searching for high-risk merchant account solutions, trying to understand how to prevent chargebacks, or wondering if your business qualifies as high risk, this episode gives you clear, actionable answers from someone who has helped thousands of merchants find safe, long-term payment processing homes.

Q&A SECTION:

Q: Why did Stripe freeze my account and hold my money?

A: Stripe's automated algorithm flags accounts that spike outside normal patterns — large transactions, sudden volume increases, or high refund and chargeback ratios. When triggered, your account is frozen and funds held while you attempt to resolve the issue, often with a chatbot rather than a real person.

Q: What is considered a high-risk merchant account in payment processing?

A: High-risk accounts typically involve large ticket sizes (over $500), continuity or subscription billing, coaching or consulting services, or businesses with revenue spikes from live events or webinars. Less than 10% of all merchants fall into this category, but they're the ones most likely to encounter Stripe or PayPal shutdowns.

Q: When should I stop using Stripe and get a traditional merchant account?

A: Consider switching when you're consistently processing over $25,000/month, selling packages above $500, running subscription billing, or experiencing revenue spikes from launches or webinars. These patterns trigger Stripe's risk algorithm and make a traditional underwritten merchant account far more stable.

Q: What is the difference between Stripe and a traditional merchant account?

A: Stripe is an aggregated platform — fast to set up but governed by automated AI risk systems with limited human support. A traditional merchant account involves manual underwriting, a real relationship with a bank, and more stability for businesses with higher volume, larger tickets, or non-standard business models.

Q: How do chargebacks affect my payment processing account?

A: Chargebacks raise your chargeback ratio, which payment processors monitor closely. If your ratio exceeds acceptable thresholds, your account can be flagged, frozen, or terminated. For high-ticket businesses, even a small number of chargebacks can push you into the danger zone quickly.

Q: Can coaches and online course creators get a high-risk merchant account?

A: Yes. Working with a payment specialist who understands your business model and has relationships with multiple banks gives you access to merchant accounts specifically structured for coaching, consulting, and online education — with far more protection and longevity than Stripe alone.

Q: Is PayPal safer than Stripe for high-ticket coaching businesses?

A: Not significantly. PayPal operates similarly to Stripe as an aggregated platform with automated risk systems. Both can freeze funds without warning. For businesses processing large-ticket or high-volume sales, a dedicated merchant account provides more reliable, long-term payment infrastructure.

QUOTES:

"Anything under twenty-five thousand dollars, especially if your transaction sizes are well below five hundred dollars — I call that the safe zone." — Rey Pasinli

"When you start dealing with continuity subscriptions and bigger ticket packages, you're really outside of what Stripe was built for. It'll be much more reliable to be structured in a traditional merchant account." — Rey Pasinli

"I see problems and I can't stop until I fix and solve them. Once you remove friction from the engine, clients typically grow ten, twenty, thirty percent." — Rey Pasinli

"Less than ten percent of clients encounter a problem with Stripe — but less than ten percent of all merchants would be considered high risk or medium risk. The overlap is almost everyone in the coaching space." — Rey Pasinli

LINKS:

Free 30 Minute Consultation and Evaluation

How do you know your business is fully optimized? I'm happy to share the mistakes made, lessons learned and secrets of success gained from interacting with 85,000 ecommerce merchants.

https://www.total-apps.com/contact-us/

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Until next time, keep moving forward!

Chuck Anderson,

Affiliate Management Expert + Investor + Mentor

https://AffiliateManagementExpert.com/

Hello, everybody.

2

Welcome back to the show.

3

This is the Collaborators Unite podcast.

4

Chuck Anderson here, your host.

5

And this is the show where we serve big impact experts.

6

And that would be you if you are not only in business to make money, but you also want to

make a big positive impact in the lives of others, possibly even the community, possibly

7

even the world.

8

Depends on how big your vision is, how big your scope is.

9

Uh, and along the way.

10

Inevitably, you have to collect money from your clients.

11

And there's lots of different solutions out there for collecting payments.

12

Uh we're gonna talk about uh collecting payments, we're gonna talk about credit cards,

we're gonna talk about fraud prevention, uh chargeback prevention, and whatever else we

13

feel like talking about here today.

14

I have a 27-year-old or 27, not 27-year-old, 27, right?

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uh

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27 year veteran of uh payment processing.

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Uh Rey Ray Pasin Lee with me today.

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Ray, second time on the show.

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Welcome back.

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Chuck, such a pleasure and really appreciate the opportunity.

21

It's all about helping the community and helping people grow and continue to be successful

so they can pass it on to the people around them.

22

Exactly.

23

And you know, I know a a couple years ago we we had a conversation about payment

processing.

24

It continues to evolve.

25

Um AI wasn't as big of a thing back then.

26

It's taking over now and it's uh the rate of change as it greatly accelerated.

27

Everyone's trying to keep up.

28

They're wondering, what should we be doing?

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Uh should I be doing the same things I've always been doing?

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Uh at what point do I consider doing something different?

31

and and maybe they some of them uh occasionally have had problems with their payment

processing and need to figure something new out.

32

So we can kind of cover all of the above and whatever else we feel like talking about,

right?

33

Um I'm not I'm not strict here, but our main thing is to serve the audience.

34

And I think you know, refresh them everyone's memory.

35

They may not have seen the other or heard the other episode.

36

Tell everybody a little bit more about you, the work that you do, and uh we will we will

start from there.

37

Yeah, I'll just keep it super brief.

38

I'm kind of this weird platypus in the payment space.

39

It's kinda hard to describe me.

40

my former career literally used to be a rocket scientist, mechanical engineer, work for

NASA, helped put the space station in orbit.

41

I see problems and I can't stop until I fix and solve the problem.

42

Uh just out of a weird, strange fluke, I ended up becoming a an e commerce engineer.

43

And so today I s I'm semi retired, but really passionate about

44

helping fix and solve e-commerce problems because once those get eliminated, typically we

see clients grow ten, twenty, thirty percent because we've removed friction from the

45

engine.

46

And so today work with a network of uh about seventeen different banks and help clients

that are non traditional find good long term homes.

47

Amazing.

48

Well, there's so much to know about e-commerce, uh, in particular processing payments

online.

49

It has changed so many times.

50

Uh I started my first online business in 1998.

51

Uh I don't even remember what the the solution was, but I remember there was a whole lot

of hoops we had to jump through.

52

Today there's a lot more choice.

53

Some things are easy, some things are not.

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and so you know I think now.

55

in a time where there's so much choice, um, is that people often ask like, well, what

should I be using?

56

Uh we've talked a lot about Stripe before.

57

I think by default, uh a lot of people do use Stripe.

58

I use Stripe with a side order of PayPal.

59

Um other and and I've I've avoided I've managed to avoid the PayPal jail and all that kind

of stuff that you know um

60

And so there's different issues that come along.

61

And of course, there's different phases of business.

62

I mean, we tend to get people here who are early six figures all the way up into their

first million or two.

63

And of course, you know, what should I be using when I'm when I'm when I'm at that um six

figure stage?

64

At what point should I consider changing?

65

So why don't we start at the beginning?

66

What is what you know what uh what are you hearing from people in terms of their questions

about

67

payment processing, what are you recommending?

68

And you know, we'll go from there.

69

Yeah, I mean kind of an engineer, you know, I I I really kind of take a crawl, walk, run,

sprint approach, right?

70

When you're first getting started and you're just getting online and you're just making

getting starting to take some revenue and payments and customers, where you get set up

71

isn't as critical as versus where you may be uh when you're, you know, consistently

processing twenty five or fifty thousand dollars a month.

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Um

73

You know, in very beginning, Stripe's a terrific opportunity.

74

They have a terrific platform.

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It's got a ton of features.

76

It's super easy to get set up.

77

They got integrations and plugins for shopping carts and all that kind of stuff, right?

78

what I generally tell people is is there's certain thresholds that you want to be kind of

cognizant of.

79

Anything under twenty-five thousand dollars, especially if your transaction sizes are well

below five hundred dollars, you know, I call that the safe zone.

80

Um

81

you know, AI and algorithms kind of rule uh how Stripe operates.

82

If you go outside of certain thresholds or or certain ranges, that's kind of when it

starts to wake up and starts to look at your business.

83

Uh it'll start looking at your refund ratios and your chargeback ratios.

84

So, you know, for a low risk business, maybe you have a twenty nine ninety five a month

newsletter, and you're just providing stock advice or or marketing tips or something like

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that.

86

I would consider that a relatively low risk business model where Stripe could last you a

lifetime.

87

you know, there are other business models which may be, for example, coaching, large

ticket, maybe there's big spikes.

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Hey, we have a big webinar coming up this weekend, we got 500 people showing up gonna sign

up.

89

you know, that's gonna create a huge spike.

90

And those are kind of numbers that the algorithm and looks for for patterns.

91

And so if you end up flagging in the Stripes automated system, you get you get locked

down.

92

All right.

93

They hold your account, they freeze your money, uh, and then you're now dealing with a

chat bot trying to explain your position and what's going on and why you should not be in

94

in stripe jail or whatever the case is.

95

And, you know, from a from the lay of the land and and the thousands of merchants that

I've dealt with in my career, you know, I would say

96

Less than ten percent of clients encounter a problem with Stripe, um, but less than ten

percent of all merchants would be considered high risk or medium risk, you know.

97

They're selling like Etsy type products and they're selling children's bible books and

makeups and and onesie twosy things.

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when you start dealing with continuity subscriptions, you're dealing with bigger ticket,

you know, thousand dollar, five thousand, twenty-five thousand dollar packages.

99

you're really outside of what Stripe was built for and you're gonna it'll be much more uh

reliable to be structured in a traditional merchant account, which is probably what you

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did way back in nineteen ninety eight.

101

You know, you spent two weeks going through underwriting and here's a integration that you

don't understand how it works and connects to your shopping cart and trying to you know,

102

uh bubblegum and band gate band aid the whole situation.

103

It's changed a lot since then.

104

But the the the process for

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traditional merchant account is lot more manual, right?

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Uh you wanna make sure you're work talking to somebody who understands your business, they

speak your language.

107

Um what are they gonna do for you?

108

Are they just gonna toss you the keys, pat you on the back and wish you good luck or are

they gonna actually contribute to the success of your business?

109

you know, so for for for general guidelines, I would say look, if you're under twenty five

thousand and under a five hundred dollar max transaction side, Stripe is a I think a very

110

solid starting point when you start growing rapidly um or maybe you have like a weekend

event which could cause a spike then you really should be looking at having uh either a

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backup or a replacement traditional merchant account that's going to be provided by one of

dozens and dozens of providers out there similar to me.

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There's lots of monkeys out there trying to sell merchant accounts.

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ah But you know having somebody who understands the business model, speaks your language

is an easy way to see if it's a good fit.

114

You know, you can go to Costco and they'll sell you a merchant account at Costco.com.

115

They just farm it out to a company called Elevon, which is owned by US Bank.

116

And you know, US Bank gets thousands of people showing up on their w uh doorstep asking

for merchant accounts.

117

But if you're a a higher risk business model, and you can just easily ask Chat GPT, hey,

here's my business model, would credit card processing be considered high risk?

118

it's r you wanna have something that's gonna be a little bit more specialized or somebody

who has uh experience and expertise in your in your vertical.

119

It just eliminates misunderstanding and miscommunication.

120

so that's kind of like a baseline and then for bigger clients, you know, I've helped

clients scale to a billion a year and you know, obviously they're not gonna get one single

121

merchant account.

122

At that point you wanna be talking about compartmentalization, um

123

you know, for clients that are a couple of million dollars a year, five hundred thousand.

124

I look at it mostly in terms of monthly volume.

125

When you start getting to about a hundred, hundred and fifty thousand a month in in gross

sales, it may make sense to have a second second merchant account added.

126

And it'll cost you an extra forty bucks, maybe fifty bucks a month, but man, that's real

cheap insurance in case something goes wrong and you're done and you can't process, right?

127

So, and you know, technically it's super easy to configure and

128

send transactions and route it.

129

So I think generally a hundred, hundred fifty thousand is where you might be wanting to

start building some redundancy.

130

And of course we've seen explosive sales guys doing millions of dollars and then you gotta

keep bolting on more and more.

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So it can get really complicated.

132

I know in the coaching industry that would be very on the high end of of of their volume

and and you know if you have a continuity program or whatnot that gets you to the hundred

133

K a month or a greater recurring, definitely and and I've we've been there where y you

know you you you inadvertently have a payment processor that goes down.

134

And uh now you're stuck um either with money held or uh or or or you can't process at all.

135

Um even at the lower volumes, I mean we had an issue once with PayPal where we had a

client pay us three thousand dollars and it was I guess what they called a non-typical

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transaction and and so they uh froze the funds and

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Ask for all this documentation and all of that kind of stuff.

138

And that's why I say we use a side order of PayPal where we we went we jumped through all

the hoops and it still works for us and we only use it um when uh Stripe won't work for

139

someone else or if they have a credit card decline or whatever they can try.

140

Some people just have a lot of money in their PayPal, so they can, you know, that's a nice

easy one to do.

141

Um let's talk about coaching for a moment because that's an interesting

142

and we get we we serve a lot of coaches and B2B service providers where look on the low

end you might be charging someone a thousand dollars for something.

143

But on the high end, you you you know, five, ten, fifteen, even twenty-five thousand

dollars for a retainer.

144

Uh, and so A, you need to be able to process that.

145

and B, you want to be able to process that without trigger.

146

Well, yes, without because cause after they've

147

you've collected the twenty five thousand and it's now triggered something and they freeze

the the funds, you know, it's not like you can reverse the transaction and go process it

148

somewhere else.

149

It's kind of locked up.

150

So um what are you ad what are you noticing with coaches?

151

What are you advising coaches to do?

152

Because again, they might be lower volume.

153

They might just, you know, be selling a a a ten thousand dollar package or two or clusters

of if they're doing events.

154

Um what's the right solution?

155

Should they be

156

getting multiple point payment processors early or is there a better option for those

price points?

157

What do you what are you seeing?

158

So like I said, like the multiple merchant account is really designed if you're doing a

larger volume, right?

159

A guy doing twenty K a month, thirty K a month, probably not an I not really it'll be

overkill.

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You can do it, but it's gonna add a layer of complexity and cost that there's not gonna be

such a huge benefit.

161

What I tell my coaching clients is consistent processing equals consistent payments.

162

Okay.

163

What I see is I get guys that are like, hey, we're

164

Promoting this big event for month after month after month after month, and then they do

the big rah-rah.

165

You know, they may have a ballroom at a hotel where everybody comes in and sits down in

front of the guy, and all of a sudden in one weekend, they're gonna do three hundred

166

thousand dollars in one day.

167

That is that means that you're not consistently processing, you're doing zero zero zero

zero zero three hundred thousand, right?

168

So consistent processing equals consistent payments.

169

So

170

In those types of situations, um I've pre negotiated before the event.

171

Okay, this is gonna be a one time situation.

172

We're gonna do this event once a year, once every six co six months, once a quarter.

173

And we may set up a special merchant account just for that big event, right?

174

And then in that situation then I'd say, Well, we're gonna we're gonna hold back twenty

five percent

175

Because we know people are gonna freak out, the wife is gonna find out about it, she's

gonna wanna get a refund.

176

The guy forgot his mortgage payment and property taxes due.

177

You know, they get cold feet.

178

You see it all the time, right?

179

So you wanna you wanna ha you you you have to earmark that money for the returns and and

and possible chargebacks, right?

180

So what I tell clients in the coaching business is look, you're the coach, you know when

the show is going on.

181

Before you go on stage, you need to let us know.

182

What is coming down?

183

What's your expectations?

184

And by being proactive and being up front saying, look, we got this big event coming up,

the volume of your projections are forecasting to do this, it takes away the surprise

185

element.

186

If you spook or you freak out your processor, they're gonna freak out and they're gonna

react.

187

And that reaction is typically, hey, we're gonna freeze the account, we're gonna hold the

money, we're gonna terminate you, we're gonna put you on the blacklist, like

188

Like if you don't surprise and shock and awe everybody, they're gonna wanna work with you

a little bit less uh with their gut with their fists up, you know, ready to fight all the

189

time.

190

So in my business where I am you know the representative for my clients, there have been

times where I'm like, okay, we got a big deal coming up, they got this influencer coming

191

on, this is gonna be a big event.

192

We expect $200,000 to happen over a three-day period.

193

Mr.

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Bank, Mr.

195

Processor, how do you want to handle it?

196

And so by being proactive, we we deflate the this the surprise bomb uh and and and allows

us to kind of glide through that process uh a little bit easier.

197

I'll give you another example.

198

We've had clients that will pre-sell tickets, right?

199

They'll the the event is gonna be, you know, in November, they're gonna everybody's gonna

go to Cancun for the big powwow, they're gonna link learn the secret to happiness, and

200

they're spending ten thousand dollars up front, right?

201

And so we will structure things with the client.

202

to either help them get cash flow on the front end 'cause they gotta pay for the resort,

they gotta pay for the people flying in for speakers, they gotta pay for the food and the

203

catering and the events and the entertainment and all this kind of stuff.

204

And then obviously if the event doesn't even happen because a hurricane comes in, I mean

there's there's all sorts of things that can go sideways.

205

So we may structure a deal with the Bank of the Processor where fifty percent is held and

fifty percent is released over time.

206

So it's

207

It's a little bit of give take, but if you're proactive and communicate with your

processing partners involved that are upstream, because they got they got their skin in

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the game too.

209

If you completely screw the pooch and blow up and don't show up for your own webinar or

whatever it is that you promised, you're gonna have a lot of ticked off customers and

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everybody's gonna charge back.

211

And that hurts you, that hurts the bank, that hurts everybody.

212

So communication I think is the number one free tool you can take advantage of.

213

to mitigate and proactively position your position yourself to not be surprised.

214

I love this message of being proactive, and I work with a lot of people who sell through

the exact type of events that you are.

215

You know, um, you know, you I think the the key takeaway for me from what you just said

is, you know, anytime you're gonna do something out of the norm, and anytime you're you're

216

doing something consistency.

217

I said it earlier with what PayPal did to us, even though it was a small dollar

transaction, it wasn't a typical transaction.

218

Meaning we weren't doing a three thousand dollar transaction every single day, or we

weren't doing multiple a month.

219

It was our first one.

220

In a while, and they're like, whoa, where did this come from?

221

Um, and so so what I'm hearing is okay, so Stripe might be great, like you you're you're

plugging along whatever your consistent stuff is, but if you're gonna do a big campaign,

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communicate with them, maybe even have a backup solution earlier.

223

And I I don't know anyone who's ever done that, to be honest.

224

uh

225

see and this is the difference between working with an automated solution like a PayPal

where you're not really you just kinda toss the keys and they pat you on the back and wish

226

you good luck.

227

You know, from my perspective that's sort of like giving a loaded handgun to a child.

228

Like there should be some adult supervision.

229

But like i in in that situation because you did not have any like real communication with

anybody at PayPal, nobody told you.

230

Like you had to learn through trial and error, you know.

231

Obviously l in hindsight, had you called PayPal before running the three thousand dollar

transaction, here's a copy of the contracted, here's a copy of our bank statement, here's

232

a DNA sample from the customer showing it's a real I mean, that would have probably

eliminated the the the bottleneck and the hold, but nobody took the time to teach you and

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you, like every single person listening on t on the podcast, they're all learning through

trial and error.

234

They're all making mistakes.

235

They're all taking two steps forward, one step back.

236

So that's that's kind of like the difference that that I try and bring.

237

I try and close that knowledge gap.

238

Hey, I've had eighty-five thousand merchants, I've seen this before, this is what you

gotta do, this is how it works, this is what we can do for you.

239

This don't cross this line because you're gonna tick off a bunch of people and like put

the training wheels on.

240

You know, and it's and it goes so much smoother for everybody from from the consumer

241

To the operator and the merchant, to the banking people, it's just communication.

242

I really like this from a risk mitigation point of view of if you know that something is

big coming up, if you're planning something big, or if you're planning something that is

243

outside of your normal processing routine, communicate in advance.

244

And again, I don't know anyone who's ever done that, and that is really good advice.

245

I'm definitely gonna take that on because we are working on some campaigns.

246

Uh and and it sounds like if you communicate ahead of time and let them know this is

coming.

247

They're much more relaxed about it.

248

And I mean, obviously, what are they worried about?

249

They're worried about chargebacks, right?

250

You know, the hey, there's this big thing, or fraud, right?

251

And so, hey, was this a fraud thing or was this uh or was this a a chargeback thing?

252

Um, so let's touch on both of those.

253

First first and foremost, how do we do this in a way where we can avoid chargebacks?

254

Because it seems like when someone wants to refund back in the day.

255

It was a bigger process, you know, you actually did have to contact the the person who

sold you the thing and try to process a a chargeback that way.

256

Now it seems like you can anyone and everyone can just process a chargeback anytime.

257

Yeah.

258

app they just click deny and boom you got a chargeback, right?

259

So I I look at it in terms of like chargebacks are sort are like an invading horde trying

to steal your treasure inside the castle.

260

Okay?

261

And so if you can va envision a a medieval castle, they had all sorts of different

262

types of countermeasures.

263

They had the moat, they had the drawbridge, they had the walls, the turrets, the archers,

the sword guy, the guy on the horseback, you know, the guy throwing the pitch and the oil

264

and the fire.

265

You know, so so there are all these types of tools that are available to help thwart

chargebacks.

266

ah I look at them in terms of like process and systems.

267

Okay?

268

Process.

269

This is just being a good merchant.

270

Communicate with the customer.

271

This is your refund policy.

272

This is your refund window.

273

this is what you you're gonna receive accurately and precisely.

274

This is how the business works, this is what you know.

275

That communication engenders trust, right?

276

But more importantly, it cultivates a relationship with you and that consumer, right?

277

You don't want them to think of you as some random guy that they don't care about, like,

my god.

278

I don't care.

279

I need my money.

280

I'm gonna charge back, right?

281

Versus like, well, Terry was really helpful with me, but I gotta I gotta pay my property

taxes or my wife found the charges.

282

Like how they interact with you is gonna determine if they're gonna interact with you if

they want to refund or charge back.

283

So I think maintaining really good communication, professional relationship with every

customer to the best of your ability.

284

I mean, in some of these campaigns, you get a thousand sign-ups.

285

You're not gonna be hand holding and talking to everybody.

286

But it that that email communication, text message, you know, positive, positive.

287

Hey, we're here, we support you, we love you, thank you for joining us.

288

Like those kinds of affirmations go a long way in terms of programming the human psyche to

call you instead of calling the bank.

289

So that's that's process.

290

systems, there are really sophisticated systems out.

291

And I've been doing this almost 30 years.

292

When the f when the internet first lit up, nobody even cared about what chargebacks were.

293

I mean, you get five percent chargeback ratio, like the guys that were doing adult

websites are like, I'm not canceling you, you agreed to pay me nineteen ninety-five a

294

month.

295

Why would I cancel you?

296

Ha ha ha.

297

And they would force the customer to charge back to can I mean it was absolute wild west.

298

Obviously, today, chargebacks are the Achilles heel of every single chargebacks and

refunds.

299

There's a new thing called a TC40.

300

I'm not gonna go into the technical weeds about all of that, but but the more your

customers complain, the more likely you're gonna get shut down.

301

It's simple, the simplest explanation for that.

302

But over the years there have been a uh evolution in transformative tools that have become

available that help to act as sort of like uh think of it as a missile defense system,

303

okay.

304

So if you've got a cruise missile, an ICBM, a a a surface to surface, an air to air, an

air to surface, depending on the threat, your missile defense system is going to fire off

305

countermeasures designed specifically to stop, block, and prevent that threat from hurting

your and and taking the treasure from your castle.

306

A chargeback.

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I look at these in terms of generations.

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Uh you know, the first generation is your basic A uh A V S, C B V type type.

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stuff you know if you can show that this wasn't a stolen credit card you can probably

fight and win a chargeback.

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Um the next evolution that came around about 15 years ago are are three technologies and

I'm going to go through a lot of these so don't don't take notes just contact me if you

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want to know more but the first branch came out is ethica verify rdr and c dr and these

four tools basically allows the merchant to say hey I've got an incoming chargeback if I

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issue a refund the chargeback

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goes away.

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So you you got the threat, you've got the countermeasure, and you got no chargeback.

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But you know what?

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Giving away a five thousand, ten thousand dollar refund sucks.

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So there are there were a next generation of tools that came along called at uh order

insight, consumer clarity and and uh compelling evidence version three, C E three.

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So these are much more sophisticated tools and they actually can prevent somebody from

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initiating a chargeback in the first place.

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The the most current generation, which is proprietary and stuff like that, um, is next

level.

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And this is the first time that I've seen merchants are actually able to go on offense

instead of just playing on defense, waiting for some chargeback to get thrown at them.

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And let me give you an example.

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The problem that we see is that a consumer can chart call their bank,

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And they can claim I don't recognize, I didn't authorize, that wasn't me, they could they

can just lie.

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On the opposite end is a low-wage customer service phone monkey.

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And they say, Well, let me let me look up that transaction.

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They only get four pieces of data date, dollar amount, descriptor, and a phone number.

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Now, if you just ran a five thousand dollar charge and it says ampub fund.

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eight hundred, it's not anything that that customer service agent is going to be able to

recognize and go, hey, that's a legitimate order.

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So what do they do?

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They give the money back to the consumer without a fight.

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They take the money out of your bank account, you pay a chargeback fee, and now you're

hoping your merchant account doesn't get closed.

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That's defenseless.

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The newest tech is able to capture a huge amount of data and instead of having those four

data points, we can inject a huge amount of data.

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So when that customer calls, the customer service agent goes, let me look it up.

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my God, I've got a ton of information.

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Sally, it looks like you ordered this on your iPhone 14.

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It was biometrically unlocked with your face.

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You were 3.2 miles away from your billing address.

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You ordered three gray t-shirts, size medium, short sleeve.

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They were UPS delivered with a tracking number.

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And we've got a picture of this package sitting on your porch.

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Does that order sound familiar?

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Wow.

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Yeah.

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Game changer.

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Now obviously in the coaching space that's not you know, we don't do shipping and product

delivery and all of that kind of stuff.

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But being able to say you logged into the system seventeen times in a row, here's a copy

of the digital contract that you signed, like that's game changer.

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Especially in the type of chargeback which is considered friendly fraud.

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When we look at chargebacks for the for the coaching industry, do we actually get stolen

credit cards?

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Zero.

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If I've got a stolen credit card, I'm gonna go try and buy an iPad.

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I'm not gonna buy Terry's magical course on on how to start a business, right?

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So the chargebacks are 80% friendly fraud.

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10% of them are operational fraud.

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Yeah, the guy called, you didn't give him the refund, he's gonna call his bank.

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Or you overpromise and you underdelivered, like operator error.

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And another ten percent is just customer stupidity.

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I did buy it, I don't remember it.

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yeah.

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Now that I you talk about it, I remember, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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That's a good order.

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I like it.

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Right?

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So the vast major

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my name as the descriptor on my products so that they re they they're not gonna recognize

my company name, but they'll recognize me.

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Yeah.

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The descriptor system was built in the nineteen seventies.

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And so the first descriptors have remained the same.

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It's locked at twenty four characters.

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You got ten characters for your phone number.

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So the lack of data and the frivolous refunds that these customers are asking for really

has hurt the bottom line of a lot of merchants.

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And so now we get to go on offense.

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And these and these products are very reasonable.

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They're, you know, twenty dollars, thirty dollars, maybe thirty-five dollars, which is

about the cost of a chargeback fee anyway.

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But if you can stop a guy from charging back a ten thousand dollar transaction, you're

printing money.

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Right?

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And so this is this is the next evolutionary step that we're seeing.

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And this is the kind of stuff that the more sophisticated marketers, the bigger the

volume.

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It's a no brainer.

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You put on a seatbelt when you go in a car, you know, you make sure the brakes work, the

turn signals you u I mean, it's just basic safety.

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Why wouldn't you put this if there's no monthly cost, no long term contract?

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It's

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Plug it and play.

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Yeah.

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We're almost out of time, but I I wanna just reiterate that what you just said about that

person who that coach who's uh got a ten thousand dollar package.

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I mean, this is the kind of thing that they're worried about.

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Am I processing this right?

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Am I protecting myself from a chargeback?

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Some people can go their whole career and never have a chargeback.

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Others they've they've had issues with it.

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Depends on a lot of different factors.

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Um, I wanna say to our audience, you know, if you

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Are not sure if you are using the right solution.

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If you are not sure if you have safeguarded yourself about some of the things that we're

talking about, I want to highly encourage you to reach out to Ray and have a conversation.

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And Ray, I know you have a a way to do that.

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You you want to talk a little bit more about uh where do we send them?

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How do they connect with you?

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How do they learn more from you?

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It's really easy.

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my main w my sole website is www.total dash apps a pps dot com.

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Advanced payment processing solutions.

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Just make sure to mention Chuck, because I get a lot of people hitting our website, uh a

lot of international people.

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We had to block all of that stuff.

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But um, you know, I'm super passionate about teaching, educating, hand holding.

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You know, everybody in the industry knows me as Uncle Ray Ray.

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Uh so if I can make a difference and help people out.

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You know, it and I'm and I'm a even if I I don't set up the merchant account, you'll at

least have somebody who genuinely wants to help fix your problem and hopefully get you on

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the down the road working better.

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Yeah, make sure you're doing the right thing.

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You might be, but maybe there's a better solution and n nobody better to talk to than Ray.

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And to make this really easy for you to connect with Ray, I have put his URL, his links

right beneath this video.

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And if you're w listening to this on a podcast, of course, just open up your phone.

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Everything is all right there uh in the player.

415

and yeah, for sure.

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If you have questions, go ahead and and you want to learn more.

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Go ahead and connect with Ray.

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Ray, I can see so you know, so many podcasts that I listen to, a lot of them are an hour,

hour and a half, two hours.

419

You and I have just barely scratched the surface.

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We could have very much so, very much so.

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But at least if we can connect the dots and point um people to a resource.

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Cause, you know, if you ask me, I'm just going to direct you to Ray.

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And uh

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interesting that you bring that up because we just completely redid our entire website and

we're currently in the process of turning it into the Wikipedia of high risk merchant

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accounts.

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So we've got an AI based FAQ, we're gonna have about a thousand topics on there.

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Why did my merchant account get declined?

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W is this transaction fraud?

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So it's we're trying to become the knowledge base for the entire industry.

430

That sounds like a great resource.

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Well, definitely let me know as that progresses.

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We have your links beneath this video so people can connect with you.

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And I highly recommend that they do.

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Um, so before I let you go, first of all, I want to say thank you, Ray.

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Um second time on the show.

436

There will probably be a third sometime uh in the future.

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And and we have lots of events and things that we're doing to serve the coaching industry,

of course.

438

So we'll we'll let you know about those.

439

I wanna ask you before we sign off, if you have a a favorite quote or piece of advice or

words of wisdom that you wanna leave our audience here with today.

440

Yeah.

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You know, one of the hardest parts about being an entrepreneur is not knowing how many

times you're gonna get knocked down.

442

I've had so many businesses fail.

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And one of my favorite quotes is you can never lose if you never quit.

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And so I've had to pick myself up and start over too many times to count.

445

But I can tell you as long as you're out there pushing, struggling you know, struggling,

getting back up and swinging.

446

You'll eventually win.

447

I love that.

448

Great words to end this episode by.

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And it aligns so well with the way I close every episode.

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And that is that the only way to fail is to quit.

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So keep moving forward.

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And so we're on the same, we're on the same page with that.

453

Well, um, so Ray, thank you.

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To our audience, thank you as well.

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If you're listen still listening to my voice, that means this resonated with you.

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And uh no better next step than connecting with Ray.

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Getting your questions answered, or maybe we had you think about something.

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Maybe you have a big campaign coming up and you didn't think, maybe I should let my credit

card processor know that this abnormal thing is happening.

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You can really prevent an issue that you really it's really hard to go backwards uh after

the fact.

460

Believe me, you've been there.

461

Ray could probably tell you lots of stories as well.

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Be proactive.

463

That's the message we want to live leave here with today.

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And if you are having an issue with your process processing,

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Look, you might just be that one collaboration away from a breakthrough.

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And perhaps Ray is that person to work with that can help you uh with whatever you need.

467

And I'll leave you with this.

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And I've already said it, but I'll say it because this is my standard sign-off.

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there's no big no problem too big to be overcome.

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Uh sometimes it's just those collaborators that have the solutions we need.

471

And remember that your big impact that you want to make is worth it.

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So

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I'll leave you with this and that is the only way to fail is to quit.

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Keep moving forward and we'll see you on the next one.

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Thank you.