Emily Smith

Bio

Emily Smith founded Side Nerd Apps to make building a custom, accurate, integrated chatbot as simple as creating a website. Drawing on her analytics background and years of volunteer work, she helps small and midsize businesses deliver software that’s accessible and user-friendly, even for people who want nothing to do with traditional tech.

Intro

The focal point of our discussion in this episode revolves around the essential truth that the technological frameworks underpinning our society—specifically applications and websites—often alienate significant segments of the population. My esteemed guest, Emily Smith, founder of Side Nerd, elucidates her profound understanding of this issue, drawing from her extensive experience in the startup environment. Emily’s journey began with her involvement in various startups, where she honed her skills and acquired a unique perspective on the challenges faced by individuals who struggle with technology. Through her innovative venture, Side Nerd, she aims to create user-friendly solutions that simplify data entry processes, thereby making technology more accessible to all. Throughout our conversation, we delve into the complexities of entrepreneurship, the vital importance of understanding user needs, and the transformative potential of designing technology that genuinely serves its users.

Conversation

The conversation between Jothy Rosenberg and guest Emily Smith delves into the intricacies of technology and its accessibility, particularly within the context of her startup, Side Nerd. Emily elucidates that many individuals in society find the technological landscape, characterized by applications and systems, to be daunting and often exclusionary. This conversation is particularly relevant as it sheds light on the pervasive challenges that hinder user engagement with technology, which, ironically, is designed to enhance user experiences. Emily emphasizes that the discomfort associated with technology is not merely a personal failure but a widespread issue that affects numerous individuals, particularly those who feel marginalized or inadequate in their technological capabilities.

Emily recounts her journey into the world of startups, revealing her early experiences with a grocery delivery service that ultimately failed when Amazon acquired Whole Foods. This setback, however, became a catalyst for her entrepreneurial spirit, instilling in her the belief that in the startup ecosystem, one must take initiative to solve problems independently. This mentality birthed the concept of Side Nerd, a tool designed to simplify the interaction with complex systems like Salesforce, allowing users to engage in data entry through natural language via text. The goal is to transform the user experience from one of frustration to ease, thereby empowering individuals who may otherwise feel alienated by technology.

Furthermore, Emily provides an insightful reflection on the notion of grit in entrepreneurship, identifying it as a product of both her personal struggles with anxiety and her unwavering determination to solve meaningful problems. By embracing discomfort and pushing through fear, she has cultivated resilience that allows her to navigate the tumultuous landscape of startup development. This episode serves as an inspiration for aspiring entrepreneurs, illustrating the importance of perseverance, the necessity of user-centric design, and the profound impact of addressing accessibility in technology.

In summary, the dialogue encapsulates the essence of entrepreneurship: the pursuit of innovative solutions to existing problems while fostering inclusivity within the technological realm. Emily's insights not only highlight the significance of understanding user needs but also challenge us to rethink our approach to technology in a way that is fundamentally human-centered.

Takeaways

1. The inherent accessibility issues of technology hinder many individuals from utilizing essential services effectively.
2. Entrepreneurial endeavors often demand a willingness to engage in multifaceted roles and responsibilities.
3. Understanding discomfort as a catalyst for growth can empower individuals to pursue meaningful ventures despite challenges.
4. Innovative solutions must prioritize the end-users' experiences, particularly those who struggle with conventional software interfaces.
5. Building a startup involves learning from prior failures and using those insights to inform future successes in a competitive landscape.
6. A focus on simplifying complex workflows can significantly enhance user engagement and satisfaction with technology.

• Text Link Lead
• Ither: Volunteer Tracking for People Who Hate Technology
• Side Nerd Apps: The Smartest Way to Unlock the power of SMS
• LinkedIn
• Who Says You Can't Startup | Full Bundle | Incorrigible Entrepreneur - My new online course for startup founders called Who Says You Can't Startup!
• Jothy's TEDx talk - On why those with disabilities tend to overachieve
• Our YouTube channel
• Designing Successful Startups — Jothy Rosenberg | Author | Speaker | Podcaster - Site with all podcasts
• Tech Startup Toolkit book
• Please leave us a review

Hello.

Please meet today's guest, Emily Smith.

The very processes and systems that our technical world is built upon, primarily apps and websites, usernames and passwords were actually inaccessible to a really large portion of our population.

I think that's a truth that we all understand.

We all have the people in our life who.

Who hate technology.

It's not just that they're bad at it, it's that it makes them feel dumb, it makes them feel excluded, and it sometimes prevents them from being able to do other things that are really important in their lives.

What if the discomfort you feel isn't a warning sign, but proof you're exactly where you're supposed to be?

Welcome to Designing Successful Startups podcast.

I'm your host, Jathy Rosenberg.

My guest today is Emily Smith, founder of sidenerd.

She started her career doing grocery deliveries for a startup that got crushed when Amazon bought Whole Foods.

But that failure taught her something invaluable.

When you're at a startup, there's no one else to do the hard thing.

If you want to solve the problem, you just solve it.

That mindset led her to a realization that became Side Nerd.

Software is supposed to help people, but too often it gets in their way.

Salespeople hate typing into salesforce, so Emily built a tool where you just text what happened?

Met Jothi, did a podcast, follow up in a month, and side nerd handles the rest.

She bootstrapped it solo and after two and a half years, just hit her first profitable quarter.

But what really struck me was her answer to my grit question.

She's battled anxiety her whole life, and that constant practice of pushing through fear made entrepreneurship feel.

Feel almost normal.

This one's for anyone who's ever wondered if they're the type to start something.

Let's get into it.

Hello, Emily, and welcome to the podcast.

Hi, Jyothi.

Thank you for having me.

Well, that, that is my pleasure.

I always start this way, which is to ask you to tell us where you originally are from and where you live now.

I am originally from outside of the Philadelphia area town called Media and I am currently living in Charlottesville, Virginia.

Very cool.

And.

But you've ass.

I'm sure you've traveled around and seen lots of places.

I have.

I've been very fortunate.

Um, I actually was in England until I was about 7 and have gotten to travel to several of the continents.

So I'm very grateful for those experiences.

For sure.

That's great.

So.

So you basically were at the age where you were learning to speak when.

You were In England I had an adorable English accent.

And then I got moved here first grade and there was a little girl who would chase me around the playground and say, say beef burger.

Say beef burger.

And the accent went away in weeks because I just didn't want to be the center of attention.

Is, is there something about beef burger that is going to expose the accent really?

Well, well, I think just the fact you're saying beef burger instead of hamburger, mind blowing.

And then, you know, so it's a whole new word and a whole new accent.

So.

Okay, okay.

You could see the appeal.

Yeah, well, she probably didn't know that, you know, she should ask you to pronounce process or, or you know, the, the boot of the car, all, all those kind of things.

Yeah, she, but it only took the one word and the accent, you know, disappeared unfortunately.

But yeah, so we're going to talk about your current startup a lot.

But, but, but in, again a sort of, in, in the sense of setting context, what are some of the startups you, you were involved or companies.

Any companies you were involved with before you did this startup?

Sure.

Just, you know, I didn't know anything about them obviously, because I didn't know anything about most things.

But I really liked the idea of building something, of building technology, of having a product that changes the way people do a thing.

So that was exciting to me.

And the first job I had out of school was at Relay Foods, which was an online grocery store, kind of an instacart before there was Instacart, and went out of business around when Amazon bought Whole Foods, because we were like, well, that's not gonna work.

So I basically had this idea, I just wanted to work at this startup.

I was going to do whatever they wanted me to do.

And I ended up having basically every job you can have at a company.

I did operations, I started off grocery delivery, I did sales, door to door sales, I did website and marketing analytics, I did some merchandising work and I really got to, you know, get a feel for all these different parts of the business and ended up kind of settling into the marketing and website analytics and continuing to go more deeply there.

I worked for a couple of boutique consulting agencies kind of in like the 500 to a thousand person range.

And then the other startups I worked with were Amplio, that was a software product for helping dyslexic kids learn how to read.

And then I did a little bit of Time at a firm called Recast.

They're in media mix modeling.

So I put some time in media mix modeling.

It's just a type of regression analysis.

And I've worked for a couple of different firms doing media mix modeling.

So I both advise for a firm called Paramark in that space and spent some time helping build up the processes for Recast doing measurement.

But your major and what you graduated from UVA with was in a technical field?

Well, economics.

I was good at math.

I really actually didn't like statistics.

I was definitely on like the calculus side, the game theory side, but that really hasn't been something I've found opportunities to do in my career.

But I really enjoyed like process of turning kind of an abstract understanding of the world and humans and how they engage and make decisions into a mathematical understanding of that concept.

And so I think that is what got me attached or interested in economics.

And I would say I, you know, I graduated with some good math skills and people trusting that I could do math.

But beyond that, I think my career and learning on the job is really where I've built my technical skills in terms of the actual languages that I've coded in and the data work that I've done at a more advanced level.

Were there things in the previous companies, especially the startups, where you learned things that have stuck with you and have helped you in, in this new, your current startup?

For sure.

I mean that's, that's what it's all about.

I don't think that I would have had the confidence to build my own if I hadn't been in the weeds on other people's.

So I definitely, you know, that, that first startup that actually ended up going out of business and you know, getting acquired and then kind of dissolving, that is a really interesting and transformative experience to be a part of because you're so excited about building this thing like you believe in it and, and then it's, it's tragic, it's heartbreaking when it dissolves.

But of course you bring the relationships and the skills forward.

So in my case that, you know, was a lot of people who are still part of my career, especially being in Charlottesville, a relatively small community, and have provided referrals and things for other jobs.

And, but also like the, the technical and applicable skills that you learn.

So I learned tableau and SQL and to be honest, I didn't know Excel before I started at that first job.

So really like being in that setting where if something has to be done, there isn't another person to teach you how to do that or to do it for you.

There's no need to, I guess, like, expect that that's somebody else's job.

If it interests you and you want to do it and you want to solve the problem, then you kind of can.

And so I think it's like that attitude as well as like the understanding of how many things are transitory about this space, I think was really interesting to me.

And yeah, just like practicing and seeing the types of people that are running these types of companies and the way they make decisions and engage others, I think I've been trying to pick up on a lot of that and bring it into how I do my work.

So one of the things you told me at our only other meeting we've had is that, that you realize that software was getting in people's way instead of helping them.

And that is, I think, a big.

That's the big idea.

That or the problem, I should say, that led you to start side nerd.

Yeah.

So I think that's a good transition into this, like, amorphous.

Where did I come from?

What did I learn into what are we talking about today?

What are we doing now?

So I, you know, I was doing all this work in tech, learning a lot of stuff obviously, but my sense of meaning and purpose was not really fulfilled at work.

I was kind of challenged intellectually, but looking for meaning and purpose outside of work.

And that ended up being a lot of volunteer work.

So I was doing this volunteer work and finding that every place I volunteered had a different way of tracking hours and being like the efficiency focused, data mindset person.

You know, I saw the other people struggling to do what I knew was a very simple data entry task and how the very processes and systems that our technical world is built upon, primarily apps and websites, usernames and passwords, were actually inaccessible to a really large portion of our population.

I think that's a truth that we all understand.

We all have the people in our life who hate technology.

And it's not just that they're bad at it, it's that it makes them feel dumb, it makes them feel excluded, and it sometimes prevents them from being able to do other things that are really important in their lives.

So, you know, from the simple of example of volunteer work and how a volunteer who's Maybe in their 70s shouldn't really have to spend their effort and energy struggling to download an app and submit that they volunteered for three hours at the soup kitchen, I sort of saw that as a problem.

But Also as a representation of a larger problem in our society where tech really isn't accessible.

And so I had this experience and I thought, okay, what could this group, this population actually do?

While they can text, they can add a contact to their phone, they can text it like they text a friend.

And that can actually be the data entry process.

That can actually be the human part of the workflow.

And especially with kind of building an understanding of ChatGPT and the functionalities of these different AI tools, I was able to see people can just text in natural language and that can be how they manage workflows and database interaction tasks.

And so it was that thing that I wanted to build first, like, let's make it not the volunteer's problem to create a data set that lets their nonprofit do what they need to do.

Let's just do that piece as simply as possible.

And yeah, let's repeat that and eliminate all sorts of workflows.

People find difficult, time consuming, tedious or uncomfortable with simple, user friendly workflows.

And so that is the cornerstone of the company.

The volunteer tracking product was the first that I released, but my goals are much wider than that.

I really want to build a substitution or a different way of interacting with software that is easy to use for everybody.

I hope you're enjoying the show.

In addition to the podcast, you might also be interested in the online program I have created for startup founders called who says you can't start up in it?

I've tried to capture everything I've learned in the course of founding and running nine startups over 37 years with no constraints like there were with my book.

The program has four courses, each one about 15 video lessons, plus over 30 high value downloadable resources.

The QR code will take you where you can learn more.

And why did you name it Side Nerd?

So my company's name is Martech Connect llc.

Because I was like, you know, I'm trying to figure out what to do next in my career.

I'll probably do marketing, technology, implementation projects.

What should I call my company?

So that was the first company name.

And then I kind of came up with this idea.

I wanted to pivot, I wanted to do more of a software play.

And so I started to think, okay, like what am I going to call this company?

And side Nerd apps.

There's a few different, like connoisseurs limitations that it brings up for me that make me smile a little bit every time I say the company name, which is kind of a good place to start.

So first there's this concept of like texting somebody on the side, like a DM or something.

And because the interaction is via natural language, there's this like, okay, it's you know, a simple way to interact with, with somebody.

It's also not the central or the core software, it's like side software.

We're not maybe doing the whole database.

Maybe it's just a way to get into the database.

So it's kind of a side thing there.

And then, you know, there's like, I love superheroes so we've got a sidekick thing going on.

So there's a few things there.

And side Nerd just seemed to seem to fit.

And I did a little, had a bunch of interns at the time.

We did a slack emoji vote and it won like seven to six.

So I, I cast the winning vote for that, but I still find it.

Amusing and, and you created an amusing logo too.

Thanks.

Whenever we start a, a new company, we start it with the premise that there's a big problem we're solving and we're going to solve it.

Of course we wouldn't do it if we didn't believe we could.

And when we solve it, we will have made a significant change in the world.

So what will the change in the world be when side Nerd is very successful.

Amazing.

So no code.

Website builders unlocked the web for small to mid sized business.

Right.

If you have a small to mid sized business, you almost certainly have a website.

You're more likely to have a website than a storefront.

And the web really became the, you know, the marketplace or the, the main street of how people are interacting with different companies.

I think about, you know, how technology and digital has evolved.

There's been like major breakthroughs which is of course like the website and then the app.

And it starts with these big organizations with huge budgets having the ability to build and manage and maintain these things.

But then there's this whole long tail of businesses, small to mid sized businesses that, you know, maybe don't have the resources to have an enterprise quality system digitally.

So chatbots, they're getting big right now.

A lot of the big companies are having them, they're spending millions of dollars on these systems.

A lot of times they're trying to automate some sort of CS workflow, customer service or some other kind of workflow in their business.

And it's happening.

It's interesting.

A lot of them are really struggling to see value in this, but a lot of these small to mid sized businesses, you know, they want to take advantage of some of this AI functionality and end users want to interact with technology through natural language.

So my aim with Sidenerd is to build kind of a high fidelity chatbot builder that makes having and managing these AI first natural language systems as easy and low cost as it is to manage a website today with a tool like WIX or webflow.

So yeah, I think like the future is going to be more natural language as an inlet to digital product and side Nerd is really going to unlock that for SMB.

So I understand that you had like all of us, you've had some setbacks as you've gone through the process of creating side Nerd.

One that you mentioned to me was that there was something wrong with the platform and that you had to completely rebuild it.

What was wrong?

And, and, and then, and what did you learn from that process?

And I guess just tell us about rebuilding it because you weren't trained as a programmer so you're completely self taught at this.

Yeah.

So I talked initially about like how I came up with this idea for a company and what I wanted to build and it was this volunteer tracking product that worked via text.

So that is what I built and the way I built it as a minimum viable product as they say.

I, I kind of had this vision of what I wanted to do.

You text, you input something into a database and then there's a data visualization component.

And so I scoured the web like you do and found tutorials that did each piece of that Python code talk through how to provision accounts at Twilio or whatever it is to kind of execute these small tutorials.

And so I ended up like pasting together about like four or five different tutorials that each did a little different piece.

And it just so happened that I did this using Google Cloud platform because that was what my tutorials were in.

And I learned that tool and system relatively well.

But then I, I was at this point where I knew a lot of changes had to happen because what I had was a minimum viable product that tracked volunteer hours using a Google Cloud platform cloud and going into the future one this wasn't just for volunteer tracking.

This needed to be a configurable system that let the end user track anything that followed the same like data extraction, text message, data visualization, but for anything else.

So there was architecturally things that needed to change because it needed to be multi tenant and it needed to support all these different use cases.

So I kind of knew that I needed like restructure the architecture and in a pretty meaningful way and I, and then, you know, how am I going to do this with my pretty limited skills?

I ended up working with some contractors from connections I had previously.

And it really seemed like it was much easier to find people who were really confident and effective in aws.

So the first big decision I made was to move from GCP to aws, which is another big learning curve.

And I worked with, worked with one of my ex colleagues.

He really helped define the architecture.

But it just was at this point where things weren't quite working.

We were behind deadline, there were just some issues.

It seemed like I needed to bring in somebody who was even more of an AWS expert and we were just kind of struggling.

And so I had this point where I was like, okay, I either need to learn all of this and figure out how this thing goes together because it was a really uncomfortable position.

It was like, well, you know, I can't go and sell this thing to clients like I want to because I can't really trust it's going to work at a reasonable timeline.

And that's pretty scary.

Like as, as a founder, especially somebody who feels like they're playing the long game, you really have to think about, you know, what's going to happen when you don't have the tech in order and maybe you lose somebody on your, you know, they leave to another company or whatever.

And so I ended up deciding, okay, I'm going to take a few months, I'm going to take this architecture that I had this contractor friend develop for me and I'm going to get it over the finish line.

Because it wasn't over the finish line.

It was over time and over budget, but not working.

So I took some time and I, you know, broke down it into all of the pieces.

I asked a lot of questions to ChatGPT as I was really working on understanding this and getting it built and launched.

You know, it took a few months, but because I was like so committed to this problem and I really just wanted to understand this architecture that I had designed, I ended up kind of going through everything, understanding it all, making it work.

And now I'm in the position where I can work with contractors, but I can communicate with them really effectively and I can manage them really effectively because I understand the whole thing, which was definitely a good decision.

A lot of people are like, find a technical co founder.

But for me the right decision was to become the technical co founder.

And is most of it written in Python?

Yeah.

Do you like Python?

Sure.

I, I would say I, I was never Going to be like a coder.

It's not my favorite thing.

I think I lost one of my first jobs because I said I will not be a SQL monkey.

I like to solve problems.

I like to understand things and code, whether it's Python or S, or even like a no code technical tool.

It's all about like getting the thing to work.

And so for me, for this particular problem, like Python was the tool to, that would get things to work in the most easy and efficient way.

So I'm like grateful for did the job.

I wouldn't say I have like any sort of attachment to that tool or any tool.

I really like to, you know, it's all about like what it, what it does for the client, for the end user.

And so the fact it's built in Python or uses AI or uses cloud architecture is like, yeah, it's kind of cool, it's kind of fun.

But what I'm really interested in is the business side of it and the, the customer satisfaction.

Well, that's the, that's the right attitude.

It's just a matter of another geek asking you a question out of pure curiosity.

And my answer was like, I guess I'm not as geeky as I might have led on.

I don't use ChatGPT.

I just happen to choose Claude.

But it's the same thing.

Sure.

And, and I use it a lot in, in.

I use it to help me with certain aspects of doing a podcast for a whole bunch of things.

In creating an online course, I've asked it questions about this process of making an offer on a, on a house and the things that I do repetitively.

I keep a little, you know, electronic notepad that has various prompts that I, that I need to do these various things.

And they're all workflows.

Just like, you know, you, you, you, you talk about how this is, what you're doing is going to streamline and, and make much easier people's workflows.

So how will it be different if I start, if I started using side nerd and, and I've got a, a series of these prompts that I have to copy and paste into the chat window and then off.

Sometimes I'll attach a file.

So Claude can I always say he, but they, they used an androgynous name for.

Because I've known several women named Claude, so it's not necessarily he.

Anyway, I'll, I'll add a file or a couple files and, and give Claude this prompt.

How will that be so much better?

I'm Just kind of getting, trying to get into the usability, the model for this thing.

Yeah.

So this touches on, I think, the future of how I think these tools and systems are going to work.

And so when you're talking about your own use of Claude or my own use of ChatGPT.

I think exactly what you're doing, you're doing it with.

Doing with it already is just going to continue to expand.

So you're going to have integrated your calendar and your email and your LinkedIn and your Salesforce all into your own instance of your agent AI partner in life.

That's not really like the word, but you kind of know what I mean.

And ChatGPT definitely is that for me, it seems like a lot of people, you know, they meet their favorite and they have kind of a running conversation.

So I don't really think that that is something that side Nerd is going to touch, because ChatGPT is going to do amazing things.

Everybody's releasing their MCP for the integrations.

So what side Nerd is, is it's like a B2B software.

And so it's really about working to understand the data schema and the basically like, what does the data need to look like to make a business decision or trigger a workflow action?

And what we do is right now, it's really a thoughtful conversation that is informed by my significant experience building these sorts of systems so that I can help the client understand, like, kind of take the, oh, we need volunteer hours by month.

What does that look like in terms of what schema needs to be extracted to answer that question, you know, how do you want to access that data?

Does it.

Do you want it emailed to you?

So what we do at sidenerd is it's a lot about, okay, how do we translate this business problem into a data schema?

And then how do we do a lot of validation as we fill out that data schema?

So the data schema is like, what's solving the problem?

Where, you know, we're saying, okay, how many hours, what location, you know, what is that important information?

And then the conversational framework we have at side Nerd really helps collect that information accurately, allows the end user to validate.

So, and also has kind of internal validation.

So it's really about.

I don't see this as going to be like, even if you think about like calorie tracking or you're tracking your own volunteer hours, I think that the single use agent kind of partner by your side as an individual is going to be a great solution for that.

But when you're thinking about aggregating data across many users, be them volunteers or employees or customers, and you need that data structured in a very specific way, and you need it to be highly accurate, then you need a central system that really brings the data from all of these individuals together in a structured way in order to create that data set that helps the business client make a decision.

And so that's what we do at sidenerd, and that's what I see as kind of as the difference.

I think when you're thinking about things as an individual, there's sort of different challenges and different rules and different risks.

And so what we're trying to solve is really that, like, how do we make natural language an interface to an existing software platform, which of course has a backend data structure that you have to match with in a very specific way.

Does that kind of answer your question?

Yeah, I'm, and I'm, I'm trying to map it into.

I'm, I'm, I'm kind of trying to predict the future where.

Yeah, you're taking on bigger, you know, solving problems for bigger companies, big enterprises.

And like, for example, one really common workflow at every, every mid to large company has to do with the sales process.

And it involves a lot of different data and a lot of different people.

And it is, it's hard to set up.

I mean, you know, Salesforce is a huge company that has, you know, a very complicated but extremely powerful product.

And, and SAP is another example of a huge complicated product.

I mean, to put either of these systems into a very large company can cost a hundred million dollars.

Yep.

And so, you know, and individual people get sort of lost in the how this works and, and be, and it takes super, super experts and you know, an arcane sort of knowledge base to be able to, you know, get one of these things working in their company.

That's why they always have to either have the, the, the vendor themselves install it and, and integrate it with all of your different systems or you hire an, an, you know, a specialist in installing SAP or something and to eliminate those huge and long process activities.

Well, it's a, it's a daunting thing to try to, you know, sort of dump on you and say, hey, I think you could take this on eventually.

Hi.

The podcast you are listening to is a companion to my recent book Tech Startup Toolkit, how to Launch Strong and Exit Big.

This is the book I wish I'd had as I was founding and running eight startups over 35 years.

I tell the unvarnished truth about what went right and especially about what went wrong.

You could get it from all the usual booksellers.

I hope you like it.

It's a true labor of love.

Now back to the show.

Well, I'm definitely not trying to replace SAP or Salesforce, certainly not at this point in time.

Maybe with a very simple like CRM for smaller companies who are moving from no CRM, but what we're doing at Sidenerd is we allow for the sort of flexibility you need to interact with a system like Salesforce.

So we actually do have a product called Link Lead that I think is a good example of how we approach the challenge you're talking about, because these companies are putting a hundred million into setting up giant forces of Salesforce.

Yes, it's very internally structurally complex and business specific.

And they have the system that works.

But you know who, like, they've forgotten about the salespeople in the field who hate it.

Right.

They don't want to understand it.

They don't want to open Salesforce and input all of their leads and every contact point.

So we're saying, okay, you have, like a disconnect, right, between this complex system and the people who are supposed to interact with it.

So what I did was kind of identify, okay, like, what's a workflow that is really tedious and painful in relation to data collection related to customers.

Well, you're meeting a lot of people.

You're out and about.

You need to get these new contacts into your CRM with side nerd.

What you'll do is you'll just text about the people you meet.

I'll say, met Jothy Rosenberg.

We did a podcast.

We're gonna meet again in a month.

Make sure to send him a thank you note.

And so I can basically ramble things I know, to do tasks, notes, you know, roles.

And the company has actually defined what matters, right?

They've said, okay because of the particular business you're in, the region really matters, or the perspective company's client or company name really matters.

And so they've basically defined that schema which matches their Salesforce schema.

And we're basically a layer that says, okay, salesperson, you no longer have to input your sales leads to Salesforce in the traditional way.

You just text Link Lead.

You say, hey, Link Lead.

Met Jothy, blah, blah, blah.

And that data gets ported into the CRM and then you can interact with it in, like, more complex, meaningful, aggregate, aggregate ways.

So it's really about, like, identifying these workflows and the people who are doing them, who find them really tedious or time consuming or just not their favorite part of the job and replacing just that piece of the workflow, maybe like, you know, someday we'll do that.

But, but like for the time being, it's our flexibility when it comes to what data is being extracted as well as where that data needs to go that is basically putting a band aid on what is a broken user experience, but adding a lot of value to the customers that are suffering from that problem, which in this case is Salesforce in the field, are not inputting complete and accurate notes, follow ups and information about the people that they meet.

Okay, so that was a fantastic explanation.

I did not mean that this was going to replace Salesforce.

I was, I was hoping that this was going to be a simplification of, of exactly what you just described.

Okay, perfect.

Because people, yes, I've had salespeople.

We never had Salesforce at any of my startups because I'm not, I use.

HubSpot, free version, it's going great and it's integrated to a side nerd app.

I mean we use something that is, we use HubSpot, which is not like, it's not, it doesn't tout itself as a CRM, but it does have CRM capabilities.

Yeah, it touts itself, it touts itself as marketing automation.

And so those are the workflows that it's ideal for.

But you know, anyway, same thing.

It's, it's, it's, it is a CRM if you want to use it that way.

And it is, it isn't, it isn't the typing and you know, it's remembering all the things you're supposed to do and, and if you don't do it, you kind of, you get your hand slapped because somebody in the company, like maybe the, maybe even the CEO has to report to the board how you're doing on sales and if that information isn't all in there in the right way, he can't give an accurate report.

And what you just described is, I, I, I think that would be fantastic.

And really the point here is, you know, you created a startup, you had an idea, you saw a problem, you had an idea and you're not trying to boil the ocean.

You're taking a, a very measured approach to applying a platform to these specific application areas.

And I think, and by the way, are you, you know, self funding?

It is, it is, it is, it just, you know, just you.

Yeah, I, I have been working at it full Time about two and a half years and just had my first profitable quarter where I can even pay myself.

So I could see growing profitably or I could see, you know, at a good strategic time time bringing on a partner.

I have one final question, and that is that the word grit, it's a nice short word, but it has a meaning that involves concepts like resilience and fortitude and stick to itness and most of all, courage.

And every startup founder I've ever met has grit to a in large measure.

And I haven't known you very long, but I can tell you have a lot of grit.

And my question is, where do you think it comes from for you?

Well, I think that there's a stubbornness there.

There's a. I want to solve the problem.

I will solve it.

I also have grown up with a lot of anxiety, and I think that so much of my life has been doing things that are really hard for me because of this anxiety, because of like a kind of broken response to like, the fear in the world, right.

And so as I've kind of gotten older, I have developed better coping mechanisms and strategies and medication even that have helped me manage this anxiety.

And so I think, like, coming from this place where I have had like all this experience of saying, like, this is really uncomfortable, but the discomfort is not a signal that I can trust.

That means don't do it.

The I need to kind of analyze the discomfort because I've really had to.

If I stopped doing the things that were uncomfortable or scary, like, never would have left my house, right?

So I've just.

For.

For years, decades, I've had to push myself to do things that are scary for me, even though it seems like they shouldn't be.

And then as I've built these skills, it's like, okay, now I'm just kind of comfortable doing things that to other people seem to require a lot of courage, a lot of grit.

But because I think my experience has been like, this is just kind of how it feels, right?

This is how I'm.

I'm okay.

Being uncomfortable being in this space where there's risks and uncertainty.

I think, yeah, due to having, I guess, a lot of anxiety and doing, really having to find projects that, that bring me enough meaning and enough purpose and wanting it enough to power through the fear has made that kind of something central in my life where I basically really focus on what I'm trying to do and why, and the purpose and the how is secondary.

Thank you for sharing that.

That's.

That's impressive.

I mean, you could have given up and taken an easy route.

In many cases that you haven't done that you haven't.

Well, I was going to be stressed anyway, so if it was an easier route, I'd still be the same amount stressed.

There's a lot of people that have significant anxiety and I think them hearing you talk about it, about how you're dealing with it is probably great for them.

So thank you.

I would love if it was because I think that this has been really an incredible journey for me to go from, you know, following the beaten path.

Not so beaten, but into this place where I'm really building and creating and it's such a creative endeavor and I'm having so much fun with it.

So.

So if.

If I can inspire people to do that or make them believe that they are the type of people who can, even if they don't look like the type of people who do, that would mean a lot to me.

That's great.

Well, thank you so much for, for being here.

This was, was fun.

Thanks, Jathi.

Have a great rest of your day.

And here are your toolkit takeaways.

Toolkit number one At a startup, there's no that's not my job.

Emily started doing grocery deliveries and it ended up learning SQL, tableau, sales, marketing and analytics.

All because things needed to get done and she was willing to do them.

If you want to build something, stop waiting for permission and start solving problems.

Toolkit number two, build for the person who hates the software, not the one who bought it.

Salesforce is powerful, but salespeople in the field despise using it.

Emily built side nerd for them, not for the admin who set up the system.

Find the human being suffering through the workflow and fix it for them.

And toolkit number three, discomfort is not a stop sign.

Emily has dealt with anxiety her whole life.

Her insight.

She was going to feel stressed no matter what, so she might as well be stressed while building something meaningful.

If fear is going to show up anyway, don't let it choose your path.

Now go find the one workflow that's driving someone crazy and ask yourself, what if they could just text it instead?

And that is our show with Emily.

The show notes contain useful resources and links.

Please follow and rate us@podchaser.com designingsuccessful startups.

Also, please share and like us on your social media channels.

This is Jothi Rosenberg saying TTFN ta ta for now.