In this episode of Odejuma, Harry speaks with filmmaker Ashton Legadoé, whose path runs from a Cape Verdean family in New Bedford, Massachusetts, to telling some of the most tender Black queer stories on screen. This is a conversation about legacy. What it means to build something that outlasts you, in your work, in your community, and even in the name you carry.

Ashton talks about Nana's Boys, his feature about two Black men whose love is tested when life stops cooperating, and why he stopped waiting for permission to make it. Along the way, he reflects on his immigrant roots, the responsibility of representation, and giving the next generation of storytellers the resources he had to find on his own. It is a conversation about creating without apology, and the quiet conviction that the stories of everyday people are worth keeping.

Connect with Ashton on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ashtonsdreams/

Connect with Harry on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/harryitie/

Watch Nana's Boys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-bTK8K10Tg

For more information on Harry, visit: https://www.harryitie.com/

Get Odejuma delivered straight to your inbox, alongside personal reflections on the episode by subscribing to the Substack here: https://odejuma.substack.com/

Hi, my name is Hari Tie and welcome to Odejuma.

Odejuma is an ishakiri farewell that loosely translates to till tomorrow.

But for me, I look at it as a promise that there is so much more in life to look forward to.

And this interview driven storytelling podcast is rooted in that promise.

So as you take the time to listen, I want you to feel that as we go deeper with folks from across the Black diaspora, exploring the adventures, resilience, joy, and the ordinary moments that change their lives, that you would have a good, hearty laugh with or you find something to sit with.

Because there's power in the stories of everyday people.

And these stories are worth telling.

Hi, welcome to another episode of Odejumma.

My name is Harry.

I'm super excited about today's episode.

I got to watch this film on YouTube and I was like, I need to know who created this work, you know, And I went online and I found Ashton.

So I have Ashton with me.

Hi, Ashton, how are you doing?

Good morning.

Good afternoon.

Afternoon.

Good evening.

Thank you so much, Harry, for this opportunity to connect and share more about my background.

So, yes, thank you so much.

No problem at all.

And like I said, you know, I was.

I came across Nana, Nana, nana's Boys on YouTube and I was like, oh my God, this is such a good film.

And throughout the movie, because I was here with my friends, we were having conversations about, you know, the subject matters that kept people coming up as the film went along.

And I was like, this is like, I really, I'm happy in general that we're seeing more black queer films, but I felt like, you know, that that's a good film.

So thank you for that and congratulations on that as well.

But before we dive, get to Nana's voice.

I want to know a little bit more about you.

So, Ashton, tell us a little bit about who you are, where you're from, and how did you go from that filmmaker, of course.

So again, my name is Ashton Legato.

So within my mom's lifetime, which is amazing, I've had the opportunity to go and visit and learn more about my roots.

But I grew up as a Cape Verdean boy in a city where there's a lot of Cape Verdeans.

But When I was 13, my mom decided to move us to Florida.

New Bedford is a small city Within Massachusetts, it's probably, I think the fourth or fifth largest city within the state.

But there are a lot of challenges being that it's a small town.

Like growing up, all I knew for a career path was either a lawyer, a doctor or an engineer, or a teacher or a nurse, because that's what my mom was.

And a lot of of my family was in the medical industry.

And so when I moved to Florida, I got to kind of Orlando specifically.

Got to really open up what was capable, what capacity I had available to me.

I ended up going to high school at Dr. Phillips, which is right behind Universal Studios.

So as I'm walking to school, I could hear people screaming on roller coasters.

It ended up happening to be my first job.

I worked at Jurassic Park, River Adventure.

And so I got immersed into entertainment.

Very early on in my journey of life I still was focused on being a doctor because to me that was the pillar of success that was.

And I'm the first in my family to go to college to have dual master's degrees.

So for me it was also setting the scene for generationally of what was possible being that my family made this transition in the early 90s and here I am to be able to realize what I believe is my ancestors wildest dreams.

So I started working in, you know, all of the theme parks across Orlando, from Disney to Universal to seaworld, even to Wet N Wild RIP I then started to like understand what I wanted out of life.

And I was in college by this time.

I was studying pre med and cool school.

I liked school, but going for pre med it just felt very exhausted.

Like a lot of studying, a lot of researching.

And I'm more about like I want to be with people, I want to connect, I want to share.

And at this time I was working at a hotel and really started to wrap my head around like what did I really want to do, what was my purpose?

And it started to come up as this way of entertainment and using that as a way to bring joy to folks.

And so there was this combination of like hospitality and entertainment and this idea around, well, why don't I be like Walt Disney in a sense?

Like he kind of set the path of like this kind of mirror of you can have films, tv, radio, but then you can also create a space where people can come to revel in that magic that has been created on screen for folks to then come and experience in real life.

So that was kind of the model and I started as an actor.

So from Orlando I moved to Miami.

I started my University career at fiu and I was double majoring in acting and hospitality.

And so when I was taking my acting classes is when I started to learn about my.

My capacity to write and using my background.

And Tyler Perry started to really make a name for himself at this time.

So I seen another model of, like, somebody who was not waiting for Hollywood to give them the green light.

Especially as a black person.

Hollywood isn't so receptive to, you know, championing our stories unless it feels rewarding for them versus, like, just a desire to make sure that we all feel seen and heard.

So I started to kind of write my own stories, develop work at college web series, and all these things really started to come about.

I finished my degree in hospitality, and I was still a sophomore in my acting degree because I was advanced in one and behind in the other.

But I decided to spend a summer in New York, and in that summer, I started booking off Broadway roles and I started developing more web content.

I made a web series and did a lot of things.

So I was like, why would I go back to school for a degree when I'm already out here doing it?

So I just decided not to go back and just really to pursue being an entertainer.

And so in that time, I, you know, early 20s in New York, living what I believe is the best life.

Like, I remember the first time I walked on Broadway and literally tears came to my eyes because it just felt like this was everything that I've been waiting for.

And here I am standing at the.

At the epicenter of this.

Of this world, and it was just so magical.

I was like, this is the place I need to be.

So I spent years in New York creating, working as an actor and in trying to figure out how do I write my own projects.

So I started to kind of produce my own things.

And then I started to realize, like, making projects is actually a lot of technical aspects.

And I love school.

I love being in an academic environment.

And so I applied to the City College of New York for their MFA program.

And at that time, they were the only public school with an MFA program.

The other option was NYU, which was almost 200,000, almost 2 to $300,000.

And then Columbia, which was another expensive fee.

And I said, I don't want to go into School with more debt.

Like, that's not something that I really want to carry.

So ultimately I got into City College, where a very intimate school.

So there was 10 fiction filmmakers, 10 documentary filmmakers, and we went on this journey together over two years.

In that process, I made a web series, you might have known it, called by it stars David, who also plays Amari and Nana's Boys.

But at that time we made this web series called Bye and that's where we created our partnership called By Us.

And I also made another web series called the Outcrowd, which was a queer forward series about somebody kind of coming out, but they're a little bit more, you know, heavier and different.

So like one of the episodes was called no Fats, no Femmes and I starred in that and I directed it.

But in getting my master's started to realize, like, what kind of stories that I want to tell, what type of opportunities that I want to support, and in that realized that film school was very much focused on film school.

When this industry is also a business, and especially in America, we put the business first.

And so I went and I got an accelerated MBA program that was focused on entertainment, where I learned more about contracts and marketing plans and deal structures and all the things that ultimately when I made Nana's Boys and was able to get a distributor and went on the festival circuit and was able to do all these things, I was able to read my contract and I did have a lawyer to negotiate because I always want to be the good cop in those relationships.

But I ultimately had my lawyer and I knew exactly what I wanted to negotiate, what deal points where, you know, terms and minimum guarantees and all these other things that I had had some knowledge around from school.

But before making Nana's Boys, I worked on this great film called the 40 Year Old Version.

It's on Netflix.

It's a Sundance film.

I was Rider Blank's assistant and I was like, what she would say her left cheek.

I was there from her from the pre production all the way to getting it to Sundance to her winning best director, to getting it on Netflix.

So I watched a great creator make something, get it distributed, and then take it out into the world.

So I had a model of like, oh, this is how you do it, right?

So when I went to make my film, I had this desire.

Yes, you can make a short film, but Most people are already making short films and not really getting that.

So I was like, let me make a feature on my own.

And that will be my calling card to the industry of, like, who I am as a storyteller.

And so I was like, with my crew, I said, we're going to lock in dates.

So in the middle of the pandemic, somehow, some way, I got enough finances, I had enough grit and desire to say, let's go make something.

I didn't know exactly what it was I wanted to make, but I was like, let's lock in these dates, let's set the crew up and let's work towards something.

And I presented a script to my team and I was like, hey, y', all, here's the story, very dope story about like, this artist who gets, you know, contained in the storm.

And then a delivery person comes along and then they basically have this night together learning about each other.

And I presented to the team and they're like, okay, this is good, but I think there's something else you could do.

Like, what else is it?

And at the time I was in a relationship, a lot of people were navigating.

What does it feel to be locked in with a person in the middle of this pandemic?

And, you know, I always saw this absence of black love, black queer stories on screen.

And it's been my point, and most of my stories are, you know, black queer folks loving on black queer folks.

I wanted to continue that trend.

And so I was like, let me just write this story about, you know, turning 30 and what is it like to, like, have somebody who's kind of, you know, your sugar daddy in some way, but taking care of you and you don't have to worry, right?

Like, you could just wake up and live your life and do whatever, you know, your man got you.

But feeling the pressure of, like, what is my purpose?

Like, here I am like a 30 year old person now, like, what do I have to contribute to the world?

And trying to ground yourself and what purpose is and what does it mean?

And so that kind of idea came about and I literally wrote the script in two weeks.

And again, we already had a date for production.

So it was kind of like this fast track to like, let's go do this.

When I presented the script, they obviously had notes, but they were like, ashton, this is it.

And they kind of like pushed me to, like, really unpack some things that were on the page but weren't on the Page.

They were there kind of in subtext, but wasn't really clear.

And that's where some of more of the deeper story arcs came about.

And so that's kind of how I am.

I worked in.

I shot it in my apartment.

I got a group of like 15 of us to shoot this film.

My sister actually happened to be a filmmaker.

And so there's a documentary called the Process of.

Of Me Making the Film.

And it was made by my little sister, which I think is so amazing, but it really chronicles what we went through.

There was one night we had literally was on set for 16 hours trying to get the last of what we needed to capture.

And I'm so grateful for my.

My crew who showed up in the middle of a pandemic and, you know, this one bedroom apartment in Washington Heights and was so giving of themselves to make sure that this vision came to life and to see it now five years, six years later, more or less in the world with people engaging in it, finding it, exploring it, unpacking the themes of the film and be able to talk to people about what's happening in the film.

Which was always the intention of why I wanted to focus on two black queer men in a relationship that could essentially be unraveling is because we hadn't seen that before.

And I wanted to make sure that black folks, we had something to talk through around our own intimate relationships, whether that's with a friend or with loving.

A loving relationship.

I wanted us to have some type of pillar to say, oh, well, here's a basis of what a relationship could look like in a film and what I might want to avoid in my own relationship or what I might need to bring up and talk to my person about and what I might be avoiding.

So in a long.

A long way to get me there, that's ultimately how the story and my journey got me to creating Nana's Boys.

And being, what I like to say, the outrageous storyteller that I am.

It really comes from all of those things and some of the things that I've missed in that journey of sharing but have made me be who I am.

I'm now married to an amazing costume designer.

And when I made my film, I was Ashton Pina, which was my, quote, unquote, maiden name.

And then once I got married, my husband and I, we created our last name to really solidify the legacy that we're both creating together, which legado means legacy in Portuguese and Spanish, which both of our native languages are connected in that way.

And so then we Created it, added the little Beyonce at the end and then that was now who we are.

And really when we Look, God willing, 400 years from now, you know, there will be some legatos living, existing in the world and they'll be able to look back and say, you know, it was my grandfathers, Ashton and Fernando who started this.

And now here we are living, doing all these amazing things.

And the other intention around that was because, you know, a lot of us, most black folks in America and names in general come from slavery or white folks.

And so like, for us to like really recreate this and claim this as our own and try to break generational curses, trauma through that is really, I believe, setting us up for something very outrageous and joyful.

That is so beautiful to hear and your journey is just very inspiring and to see see, because I know like on your website, your website says we're justly producing dreams into reality.

And you know, I feel like all you shared is like a reflection of that, you know, reflection of your purpose, of your passion for the arts, but also for your community, black queer folks in general, and the need for representation for us to be seen in that regard, in that space.

And that is such, so reflective in all that you have shared coming up to where you are now.

So thank you for sharing that and congratulations on your, on your, your marriage, on your wedding.

How long has it been?

How long have you been married for?

It's been almost three years.

In August, August 8th, it will be our three year anniversary.

And so I'm very grateful because he's a creative.

He worked on moonlight was one of his films that he helped to design the Florida project.

He did season three of P Valley, which everybody's waiting for.

Um, and so I have this amazing partner who, who can push me, who I can push.

And together like my next film, he'll be a part of that.

Like when that comes to life, it's gonna be so outrageously gorgeous because my man is just that dope, so.

And then me together, it's just gonna be so wild.

But yeah, I'm very grateful for, for that and having somebody who reflects a lot of myself and them, but also pushes me to become, I believe, what, you know, the creator has put me on this planet to be.

Yeah, that is, that is really good to hear.

Gonna go back a little bit to your journey before we dive into Nana's West a little bit.

What you've described, it shows that your career has spanned different things, right?

You've done film, you've done documentary, you've done web series, you've done some, you know, branded ad campaign stuff and also academia as well.

You have a, you have a whole mfa.

How do you determine what medium fits the story?

What is, do you go into it like, okay, I want to do a feature film that I get the story or is it like a story comes to you and then you decide, okay, this is the best form or this is the best way that it will be.

Will be effective for me to tell the story?

Yeah, I mean, that's a great question.

A lot of my work started in theater.

I started studying acting.

Studying theater, that's the basis of my work.

And I think it still shows up.

So Nana's Boys takes place in one location.

It's like, you know, it's really intimate about these characters and in some ways it could feel like a play.

My next film, similar kind of approach.

And for me, I always start with character.

Who is this person?

What might they potentially going through and what is what I'm looking to share.

And so, you know, when I thought about Nana's Boys, it was really around relationships and what, what, what, what might a breakup look like in this time?

You know, being forced with somebody that you thought you would spend your rest of your life with.

Who's.

Who's tip, who's honestly perfect on paper.

But when things come up and life is lifeing, there are some, some, some, some challenges there that need honest and vulnerable conversations to be handled.

And that's really what, what Nana's Boys really came about.

And most of my films really start with this story.

When I look at in the Paint, which is a short film I made around a college basketball player who wants to scare to come out before he goes into the draft because of what that might bring, that pressure of like being the first out, you know, NBA player of sorts.

And for me, I had a basketball relationship in college and always was inspired by like all these sports players, like all these men.

Why is everyone so afraid to like truly be themselves?

And so kind of unpack that a little bit in that film.

And then, you know, I did a film with Jensen Atwood which kind of looked at what it felt like to be homeless.

I experienced, you know, a bit of unhoused situation.

It only happened to be two days where I had to sleep in my car with my best friend because we were in transition of apartments.

And so that was kind of a start of another film of like seeing in la.

Specifically the.

Just the.

It's sad, it's really sad when you drive around you go to skid row, you go to just, you know, different areas around the city, and you just see people, like, making these communities, making a way on the streets.

And so I wanted to kind of have that juxtaposed against, you know, what does it look like to actually pursue your dreams in the midst of somebody giving you an offer when you really don't have nothing to lose?

What does it look like to take that leap of faith?

And so that's another short film that I was able to make, you know, with Jensen, and his name happened to be Noah in the film, which was kind of like, it was like really wild that that happened before I even wrote it.

Right.

When I wrote the film, I didn't know I was going to cast Jensen in the role of, you know, this film and then happen to connect to him, and then he would, you know, and I was like, wow, you're playing Noah in a film with me.

And I like, I grew up watching Noah's Ark.

And that was your love interest in this, in the, in the, in the film.

So those are some of the moments that, like, life has continued to show that I am doing what I'm supposed to be doing.

I've been in rooms with Patrick, I've been, you know, in rooms with Barry Jenkins, and like, all these different people, things like, have just like, okay, this is, this is a space for me.

And it's just about finding the right stories that I want to tell.

And I believe that I'm on that path.

And any medium, it could be the screen, it could be digital, vertical, radio, theater, almost any way that I feel a story can be out.

Well, I will find a way to, to use these mediums of storytelling in my, in my own way at some point in my journey.

Okay.

Okay, let's talk about Nana's Boys.

Right?

Currently, as it speaks, I know it's on, it's on also.

It's on different platforms, not just on YouTube currently, but I, I, I gotta see it on YouTube right now.

It's almost at a hundred thousand views on YouTube.

And that's away from the other platforms that it's at currently.

How has the response been for you to Nana's Voice?

And what has been the most surprising thing about how communities receiving that film?

Yeah, what's the most surprising thing is obviously the film got acquired by a distributor who once you hand your film off to them, they literally can do almost whatever without like saying, hey, Ashton, here's what we're doing with your film.

The hope is that your distributor will have a collaborative, communicative relationship about how and what they're doing with your film.

But they're managing whatever number of films.

And sometimes some distributors can kind of lose you in the sauce.

And so I'm just having a regular day, and one of my friends text me, like, a picture of my film on YouTube, and then I'm starting to scramble.

Like, did I get a boot?

Did somebody bootleg my film?

Because I have seen the film on bootleg sites, which is almost.

For me, it was like, I made it.

If my film's enough to be on a bootleg site, then let's go.

Like, let's go.

And for me, I really just want people to experience the film, however that is through.

If that's through, you know, an illegal site.

But you got to see it.

Like, some of my friends who live in Cape Verde, that's how they got to see it.

They had to, like, find one of the sites to download it and do all the things, but they wanted to see it, and that was their form of seeing it.

And so he messaged me, like, hey, is this okay?

Like, I see your film on YouTube, like, and I was like, wait.

And then I, like, text the distributor, and I'm like, what is this?

And they're like, oh, that's our.

You know, that's our channel where we feature our black stories.

And I was like, oh, well, good to know.

I didn't know that.

And there's actually two.

There's like, one channel that's like a black one, and then there's like, another channel.

So amongst the two of them, there's almost like 130,000 views or like, one almost.

It's, like, a lot of views.

But all the comments have been like, oh, my God, I feel seen.

Like, this is the great film.

Like, I can't believe, like, I watched this film and there was like, no sex.

And there was like.

There's no, like.

Like, real violence.

It was just these, like, intimate characters.

Like, I've never seen this before.

So the comments of the people who choose to, like, leave something behind for me.

And I go probably once a week to check if there's anything new, because I think it's really important to see how people are kind of experiencing the film.

It's just so mind blowing to me that, you know, people walk away from this film like, oh, I'm seeing a reflection of myself.

Like, even straight people have reached out in screenings and stuff, like, oh, my God, like, I need to do this in my own relationship.

Or I have to talk to my partner about this.

So it's really, it's just so grateful, like to just see the film out in the world, whether that's on Tubi or YouTube or any of these sites.

Like, I think it's like dope that like people are engaging with it in whatever way they can.

But it's special to me that like black queer folks, because ultimately I believe that once, once we buy in on something and we champion it, then the world will show up.

Because we're culture shakers.

We are the ones who.

Why are people out in the world saying, what's the tea and no shade and all these things?

That's because of us, right?

Like snaps and clock it and whatever you want to do.

That's all us, right?

Like those are all things that we created because we're just that amazing.

And so like, if we set the culture in our culture content and our creative and our community support something and gets behind it, there's no reason that you cannot be successful.

That is so.

That is so true.

And I'm sure that things have shifted a little bit for a year since, you know, I, I would say that this is like your.

I don't want to assume, but you could always.

You can all obviously correct me if I'm wrong, but I would see.

Would you say that Nana's Boy is the thing that has kind of like pushed you into a much more public facing role.

Like, people now know of your work a little bit more.

Can we say this is your most popular work?

But if we can say that, how is that shift in how you approach your artistry now?

Knowing that, okay, I have this one thing that people like.

How do I get to top this?

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah, totally.

It's definitely something and kind of why I've waited five years, six years to really like make something else.

And I've made projects in between stuff and supported my husband on making stuff, but something that I'm fully behind vision.

It took me some while because there was all these things that I could have made that just didn't feel enough.

And so like, it's always like reaching that point.

And, and I do believe it's very interesting that I was talking to.

I was just actually we went to work on the Snoop Times Snoop Ball for Christmas at the Viking Stadium.

And one of the colleagues that I was working with was like talk.

We was talking about films and you know, I was just like sharing about like this film about, you know, this black gay couple that gets forced in the lockdown.

And.

And I dropped.

I was like, yeah, it's called Nana's Boys.

And he was like, wait, Nana's Boys?

Like, you made that?

Like, that's the story.

Like, it's like Amari and Q or something like that.

Like, that was your film.

And I was like, yeah.

He was like, bro, I watched that film like, four or five times.

Like, I shared it with, like, mad people because it was like, that good.

Like, I've never seen black queer love and, like, in this way.

Like.

And so it was like, you just never know who's watching and because, like, I'm in the film, I have my little cameo, but.

And that's the one thing I do enjoy about being a director, is that unless people know who you are, you don't have to deal with the actorness of life.

Right?

Like, I don't have paparazzi all in my face or, you know, Steven Spielberg.

If Steven Spielberg was probably walking, most people probably wouldn't know Steven Spielberg.

You know, we probably would know Tyler Perry walking on the street.

Like, you know, different things.

But he's also very present in his work.

He's, you know, the face of a lot of his work.

So that then comes with that.

But I do think it's very great, grateful that now there's people over, you know, probably over a few hundred thousand at this point, because who knows what other sites that the film lives on have gotten to experience this film.

And I'm excited that.

I hope that they're invested and say, who is this?

Kind of like, what you did?

Of, like, who is this filmmaker who made this film?

They'll go find the page, go to my website, go to my Instagram, follow me, and become kind of a part of my community.

And so as I continue to make and produce and support, they will be a part of that journey and been there to say, hey, no, I started, you know, when you made wc, like my first, you know, short film that kind of went to festivals.

No, I remember watching in the Paint or I remember seeing the Brothers Texas.

Like, no, I saw work at, you know, at the Bad theater.

Like, I've seen your work in all forms.

Like, those are the people that, you know, I'll look to have my own beehive, you know, sometime.

Sometime soon, I, like, we will call them the Peanuts to lean off my original maiden name, Peanut.

But yeah, I definitely.

I definitely am grateful that, like, they're starting to get a little bit more buzz of the film, which I believe will help when I make my next film.

Of people who are like, no, I have a proof that there's an audience that people want to see more of these type of content and this type of work.

And.

And that's really what I'm excited about.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think I also have a curiosity around.

I think with everything that's going on right now, people are maybe feeling like, oh, I don't want to be so on the nose about talking about blackness and queerness and everything in between.

How do you feel like we can respond to this moment, Artists in general, whether you're a filmmaker or you're a music or a musician or anything.

Anything.

Because I feel like now more than ever, there is a need for these kinds of stories, right?

Stories that just humanize the queer experience in a way that folks, you know, haven't really seen in a while.

And there might be.

They might feel like, oh, I was the time to maybe shrink back a little bit.

Now is the time to maybe, you know, not go too hard because of.

You don't want, you know, public scrutiny or whatever it is.

But how do you feel folks who are in the arts, that they're filmmakers or artists or whatever, they are trying to respond to the atmosphere right now that is trying to stifle black rare voices?

I mean, I would say it is our duty, it is literally our jobs as artists to chronicle and document society in its form and shape that is honest to us.

And so I think it's actually this time and political.

And the wars and the things, the cap, like the.

The economy, like everything.

This is actually now the most perfect time to document your experience and your point of view so that, you know, if we do have life in whatever number of years, let's at least cinema.

I'll specific.

I'll specifically speak to cinema.

It's a relatively young art form.

We've only had films for like a hundred and some odd years of this history.

Whereas painting has been around a much longer.

Sculpting has been around much longer, where we have, you know, a breadth of history of the different types of people who can create.

Whereas now, as film, you know, and television, we are at a relatively early history of its creation.

So it's so important that we chronicle and document and share and be representative of our stories, because that's going to set the trend for the next hundred years of what types of stories get made, what type of, you know, comps.

When you're comparing your film, oh, I want to make a film like this that was made.

Unless there's a comp.

Then you don't.

You can't say, I want to make a film like, you know, Noah's Ark.

I want to make a TV show like Sex and the City, but queer.

You know, like, until that gets made, then you can't have the comparison.

And so it's so important that we sit down and look at the world and say, what types of stories do I want to tell?

You know, I can't wait to have the resources to tell a story of how my family immigrated here from.

Immigrated here from Cape Verde.

And what.

What did that feel like to leave your country that is, you know, so beautiful and rich and green, to then come to this, like, gray, cold, you know, still on the coast still.

You still, you know, near the water, but this cold place in a place that's, you know, very white.

But I think it's so important for us to really unpack our own personal stuff, because I think some of the most honest and real stories come from at least a seed of who we are.

I believe Amari Q are reflections of myself in some ways and where I was for, you know, five years ago.

And it's funny, when I look at the film and I sit still to.

Today I sit and we're watching my husband, and I'm like, yo, those are some of the things that I actually wanted and manifested.

And somehow now they're.

They're living and existing in my life, too, to this day.

And so, yes, it's so important for us to, like, own and use our voice in whatever form and shape that we have.

And so, like, even when we look back at, like, when Berlin was happening earlier this year, and they were kind of pushing the creatives and the filmmakers from, like, making a statement around, like, politics and the things that were happening.

And it's like, as for me as an artist, like, no matter what, whenever I put a piece of work out, there's something that I'm saying.

There's something that I'm trying to, like, get people to think about or get people to be inspired by or empowered by.

And that is propaganda.

I mean, if you think about film festivals, the first film festival was Venice Film Festival, and it was created by Mussolini as a propaganda machine.

And so, you know, then Berlin followed and then Cannes.

And so they were all these things to, like, push ideas and push people to do things.

And ultimately, that's what we're still doing with art, whether it's painting, sculptures, film, tv.

We're ultimately really trying to get people to watch.

And the hope is for them to then be Inspired to then go do something, whether that's for them to change their perspective about queerness.

If we see more people on screen, more people might be empathetic to the experiences that people have to navigate.

We've done seen so many white people fall in love on screen that now I think sometimes our challenge is we expect our love to look like their love.

And when it doesn't show up, when we're dating each other in that way, then we feel like we're let down.

It's not.

The Cinderella story that we get to experience is very different.

But if we have more experiences and being able to see more things, then we're able to say, no.

Well, I'm.

I don't want to love, like, you know, Noah and Wade.

I want to love, like, you know, like a moonlight or whatever.

Like, you start to be able to kind of compare all the different versions of, you know, that are out there in this world.

And so it's very important that we chronicle and document our time on this planet.

And it's a very limited amount.

Like, some of us, you know, my grandma passed in October of last year, 77 years.

Like, that's nothing in the whole scope of.

Let's say that the earth was created some odd billions of years ago.

That is not like, that's nothing.

So we have these little blips of time that we have to own and chronicle and document.

And I believe all of us are artists, so when people like, oh, I'm not creative, I always push them to say, well, look what you have on.

Look what you chose to put on today.

That's creativity.

Look how you chose to decorate your apartment.

That's creativity.

Creativity is you choosing to cook something and make something.

That's creative.

Creative doesn't necessarily look like putting words on a paper or a paintbrush to a canvas.

Creativity is how you choose to show up in life as well.

Creativity is how you choose to show up to life in life as well.

I'm gonna put that on a shirt or something.

Yeah.

But, yeah, that is real.

That is real.

Thank you for sharing that.

And also, you know, you said, you know, maybe I don't want to love like Noah and Wade.

I was like, I think I don't want to love, like, Noah and Wade as well.

I feel like I want a different kind of love that they are offering.

But.

Yeah, but now we've seen their new film.

We've seen the new film that they fell back in love.

He's more open, like, and sometimes you might need to be in that and even me.

I do see there's a movie by Richard Linklater, Before Sunset, Before Sunrise, Before Midnight, and he chronicled the same relationship over three different films.

And I want to say it spanned from the first film to the last film, maybe 20 years or something.

Could be a little bit more.

Don't quote me.

But ultimately, I see Nana's Boys as my Before Sunset, Before Sunrise, Before Midnight, where in a number of years, we'll pick back up with Amari and Q and we'll see what the time has done.

And in my hope, hope is that they will somehow reconnect as friends.

And then eventually, who knows, the universe might say you deserve to be back together.

And they be back together, and then they create this, you know, beautiful life together.

Is what I've always imagined, that this Nana's Boys is kind of a seed to the next film where they potentially get closer to being men.

You know, Nana's Men.

And then, you know, maybe this.

There's Nana's Kids after that.

So I do have, like, an idea of how these films will continue to move and shape.

But I'm excited that I just jumped in.

That was literally how this film came about, is saying, I'm gonna not wait for the industry to give me approval, because, honestly, if I would have been waiting for them, I would have still been waiting to this day, and nobody, we wouldn't be having this conversation because Nana's Boys wouldn't exist.

And so I would challenge folks who are listening to watching this.

Like, if there's something that you want to do or say, the time to do it is now.

And whatever it takes, whatever it takes, like, if it's, you know, extra, losing an extra hour of sleep or getting up an extra hour or, you know, sometimes you have to let that job go, girl, you gotta let it go.

It's not.

It's not giving you what you need.

I hate to say that.

Obviously, in a time when, you know, finances, gas and in LA is almost $7, like, it's a challenging time.

But it is now the most important time for you to chase your dreams, because who knows, like, what's going to happen tomorrow?

And it's important for us to leave our mark in the form in which we have.

So if you're creative and, you know, you ever wanted to put something out, get it out, like, if it takes shooting it on your phone.

There are a number of films that we have seen that have been shot on phones that have went on to win awards, that have done all these things just make it.

Just do it.

Nike, Love the reference.

I'm here for what you're saying because I feel like that's the way I felt as well with, like, this podcast, for example.

I think in my head it was just like, I wanna.

I wanna.

I used to be a journalist before.

I'm like, oh, I wanna go back to my journalism roots of interviewing people and things like that.

And I was like, oh, I don't know how I'm gonna get back to that space.

And I was like, oh, maybe I should start a podcast.

Maybe I should go back to my podcasting roots, you know?

And that's what I did.

And I just.

What do.

What do I have in my hand and what can I use to make it work?

And that's what I did.

And now here we are.

And I think that that's the thing that folks need to learn is just whatever creative passion you have inside of you, just let it out.

You don't know.

You have no idea what that would spark in you.

And that can give you a reason to keep going.

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I have a little curiosity about.

Because I think I saw somewhere that you were also teaching as well.

Can you talk a little bit about that or did I read that wrong?

No, I do.

I have taught.

I'm not teaching currently at the moment, but it is always something that is a found of who I am.

Well, in some ways, I'm always teaching.

Let me.

Let me use my words properly.

But ultimately, I have a Youth Forward workshop that I like to teach.

I like to work with, like, community centers.

It's called the Queer Storytelling Project.

So it gives you the skills for them to make their own film.

So ultimately, the program is built around similar to, like, what I went through for film school.

They learn about all the process and then ultimately they're challenged to then go make their own short film using very like.

Like two characters, three characters, one location.

Like, really forcing them to be contained so that they have the capacity to make something and finish something.

I've taught at nyu, I've taught around.

I'm grateful for those dual master's degrees that I have that then can give me that position to share.

Because I believe a lot of what I'm supposed to be doing is giving back, and it's not always about me at the forefront.

Like, I will produce somebody's stuff.

I can be, well, way behind and just give them the resources so they can go make stories.

I'm totally comfortable.

I don't need to be the face of everything.

And it's very important for me to give back the resources to folks who are interested in this industry who don't know the.

I think what people failed or think.

To think about is how much it actually takes to make a film, how much people it takes to bring something to life.

Like, yes, you need your director, your actors, but there's sound people.

There's, you know, a person who will do your costumes, who will, you know, serve the food on set, who will, you know, make your music and mix it so it all sounds good and color it so it looks beautiful and then edit it so there's like all these different things.

And so if you're interested in something creative, there may be something for you to do in this industry that is connected to what you like.

So I have friends who are music producers.

Well, why don't you compose for a film?

Why don't you make something for stories for tv?

There's another avenue of revenue for you.

You're a stylist.

You like to, you know, put clothes together.

Why don't you try styling for TV and film?

You like to design and interior design.

Well, we need production designers and art directors to, you know, set up scenes and make houses look pretty.

So there's a lot of things in this industry that most of us, especially black folks, don't know exist as careers.

We're, again, pushed to be directors.

I mean, pushed to be in front of the camera if we are an actor, you know, in, in the.

In the.

In the entertainment industry.

But if not, we're pushed to be doctors and engineers and those type of things.

Whereas we could be pushed to be.

Be a sound designer, be a, you know, a lighting, a camera operator, a dp.

All those great roles exist out there.

So it's very important me to share and give back and be seen that, like, I can be a director.

He's, you know, a black queer director.

I can.

I'm black and queer.

I might want to be a director or.

No, I want to be, you know, just this, this.

So it's also about, like, letting people know, like, my, my job before, where I work now, I work at a resort and I do programming around events, cultural, creative.

Creative events.

Was.

I was at an advertising agency and it wasn't something that I even knew was possible to me as a creative to work within the industry of advertising and make these short films, essentially 30 seconds, sometimes 60 seconds, sometimes 15 seconds.

I didn't know that was a.

A thing that was available to me until I got in and then it was like very clear to me that there weren't other black people.

I was only the black male person on my entire team of producers.

And then in the agency, there wasn't any queer representation.

We had a black employee resource group, but we didn't have a queer employee resource group.

So I was like, let me start this queer group.

Let me do these things.

Let me make sure if I'm bringing directors to my creative director to choose for a commercial, I'm going to put forth the black directors, women directors, queer directors, diverse directors that might not necessarily be getting the chances and opportunities that they deserve, but here is the person that I'm going to champion for.

So that's always been a root of who I am, is championing the next generation.

Giving back.

I'm also working on a book right now.

It's all about learning, you know, sharing these, these things that I've learned about distribution in a practical approach.

So each chapter essentially gives you an activity that you'll then by the end of the book, have a complete marketing and distribution plan for your film.

So should you want to bring it out into the world on your own as a, you know, self distribution, which a lot of creators are doing at this moment, you have a playbook, you have a guide, you have strategy.

And then if you choose to go a more traditional route, you're armed to then say, hey, distributor, here's some of the ideas and strategies that I thought most work best for my film.

And I would love to collaborate with you to bring this to life.

And so definitely it's all about giving back, sharing so that the next generation is a little bit more prepared than I possibly was.

Wow.

You seem, first of all, that is really nice and that's really beautiful that you're doing that and that you're trying to impact the young folks.

So thank you for that.

Also, though, it feels like you do so many things, you wear so many hats.

Do you take some time off for self care?

Do you take some time out to relax?

I don't want to believe that you're just doing, you're just going, going, going, going and not stopping at any point.

Well, yes, I learned probably in my late 20s that I'm not a machine and that I deserve rest.

And that rest is important to any creative any life in general.

You need to rest.

And so I definitely take it like this.

Last weekend, me and my husband and we took the dogs, we went to Joshua Tree and just, just relaxed in the desert and just, you know, went for hikes.

And just did things.

So I do, you know, at least, you know, try to ground myself, you know, go to the gym.

I haven't eaten meat in like a little bit over a year.

I haven't drunk alcohol in a little over a year as well.

I'm like making more mindful conscious choices about how I want to consume things so that it then shows up up in my life, in my body.

So I do take time as much as I can to.

To rest.

But then when I am, you know, charged up and ready to go, I'm ready to go.

I think it's the Sagittarius in me who's just like this optimistic, like, go getter, independent kind of approach to life.

Like, I've had the opportunity to live, you know, Puerto Rico, Chicago, New York, Los Angeles, Miami.

Like, I've lived a lot of places that I think have kind of informed that rest is important.

You know, living in Puerto Rico, I would go to the beach at least once a day.

And that was just something that really grounded me to say.

It's important to like, take those moments for yourself.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's pretty cool.

That's pretty cool.

Thank you for sharing that.

We have a bunch of rapid fire questions for you to get to know you a little bit better.

So the first one is, what are the three songs that are currently on your playlist right now?

Is it a crime?

Mariah the scientist and Caillouchi what you need by Tims and probably.

Folded.

Kehlani.

Okay, okay.

We love Kehlani.

And shout out to Tams.

You know, the West African connection right there.

Hello Yet.

Where is your dream travel destination?

Brazil.

Okay, okay.

I also want to go to Brazil.

Never been as well.

Your dream collaboration with anybody living or dead?

Rihanna do both.

Arianna alive.

Prince dead.

Okay, okay, that's good.

That's good.

What is a film that you saw that changed how you see the world?

Old Ava DuVernay's third.

That's a good one.

That's a good one.

What is the thing that you see?

What is a trope you see in black queer films that you don't want to see again?

Interracial relationships.

In general.

Okay, okay, okay, okay.

Cool.

You talked about like on your.

Like I said when I referenced your website, it says richestly producing dreams into reality.

That's like the tagline.

I thought that was really beautiful.

Thank you.

So based on that cadence, I'm curious to know what does Outrageous Joy look like on your best day?

On my best day is, you know, being with my husband.

It's being with my dogs.

It's, you know, talking to my family.

It's being outside.

It's feeling the sun.

It's possibly by the beach.

Joy is creativity.

It's me, you know, having these conversations and being inspired.

It's.

It's literally opening my eyes and taking that first breath of the day and saying, I'm here for another moment.

Thank you, Creator, for the.

Another opportunity to take a step, to take a breath, to exist.

That is outrageous, Joy.

And still when I read it, it's still very much aligned to who I am and what I believe my purpose is.

That's good.

That's good.

Final rapid fire question.

What is your guilty pleasure?

Real Housewives of Beverly Hills.

Okay, okay, okay.

I haven't said.

I haven't said that.

I only watch Atlanta and Potomac and Rhode Island.

The black one, Salt Lake City.

Okay.

I watch a lot, actually, but, yeah, I haven't seen Beverly Hills.

I probably should bench that at some point, but, yeah.

Okay, cool.

Thank you for sharing that.

I really appreciate you sharing that.

Before we wrap up, I'm curious to know, what do you want the body of work that you would create to look like in the next 10 years?

Wow.

Outrageous.

Number one, I want people to, like, walk away from my films and be like, wow, that was something type of journey it took them on.

That's a personal choice.

I think that's the great thing about films is I can put forth something and 10 different people are going to walk away with something else.

So I love that no matter what, every time somebody engages with the project, they're going to walk away with something different.

And if you watch Nana's Boys again, you'll probably take something away differently.

So I love that.

Number one, they'll be able to walk away with outrageousness.

They'll be able to walk away feeling empowered to say, dang, if.

If this person did it, I can do it.

Like, whatever my dream is, if it's to, you know, build couches, like, I'm gonna go and do it, because I will just watch this amazing film, and I know that that person did a similar thing.

I want to show the breadth and depth that exists for us as people of color, as human beings.

What would the world have looked like?

Should queerness have never been criminalized or, you know, made to feel less than?

What if it was actually really honored and revered like it was in the early Roman times of, like, yo, like being queer was this kind of thing.

What would it have looked like if slavery didn't happen?

Or what does it look like for us to, you know, although slavery might have ended in America, it was still going on in other countries.

What does slavery and the effects of slavery look like in a country, let's say like Brazil or Colombia?

Like, what are the effects that, you know, we as Americans have seen, what our effect is, but what effects are experienced elsewhere in the world from this, you know, major global event of, you know, colonization and slavery and show more black love, you know, in all shapes and form.

Black, black, queer parenting.

What is like that look like?

What does it look like to be an older person dating, navigating?

What does it look like when your partner passes away?

You know, we've seen all those stories from a white straight lens, but what does it look like from our lens of like, you've been with this person for 30 years and then they pass away.

And then what happens to you and your choices as a person when you've been so involved with one person?

I want to really showcase, you know, what, what life is like in Latin America for folks.

So I want to champion a lot of Latin American stories is definitely another big part and stories from the continent too.

Like, I want Cape Verde to get the do that it deserves as, you know, a democratic, forward thinking country.

I want to show the beauty of Madagascar.

I want to show the richness of Nigeria.

I want to, you know, support with the depth of and again, a similar country to America.

What does, you know, it look like to be in South Africa and navigate blackness?

And you know, I recently went last year and had my own experience.

What does that look like on film?

So really taking some of the experiences that I have and some of the things that I love and stories of people, you know, the James Baldwins of the world and the, you know, just that so many people who deserve these stories about them to chronicle and to lead that who left a, a strong impact on our lives, really to make sure that they get memorialized in a way that is honest and authentic.

I'm thinking of the MJ movie that came out, like, haven't had a chance to see it, but like, for it to like capture him and his journey in whatever specific time that the film looks to unpack.

I'm excited to show more stories of the people, the Frederick Douglasses of the world.

Harriet Tubman's, like, what did a day in Harriet Tubman's life look like before the Underground Railroad started?

Like all those different things that, you know, we can unpack.

Or what does it look like when, you know, our food turns on us and makes us sick?

And what do we turn into into when the things that we consume might happen to turn us into zombies, for instance.

So I have a lot that I want to share and want to tell.

You know, my next film is a modern retelling of Orthello set through a black queer lens and really focused on the unrequited love and the betrayal that exists when you don't get what you want.

And so, yeah, I'm very excited to just keep sharing.

Yeah.

Is there anything you can tell us about that film?

I'm very curious about black queer reimagining of anything you can give us, anything you can tease about that project?

Yeah, it's definitely something I'm literally starting to really put forward.

It's really taking the basis of Orthello and reimagining it through a black queer lens.

The story, to me, the, you know, or origin story of Othello is, you know, about a black general who, his partner in crime ends up, you know, seducing him to believe that his.

His wife, who's a white woman, is cheating on him with, you know, another person in the ranks.

And ultimately what I always imagine is, you know, Iago's character in the original play was really in love with Orthello and every time Orthello overlooked him, forced him to take an action that ultimately led to, you know, what happens in the story.

And, you know, this isn't another, you know, happy ending.

There's a lot of tragedy.

There's rape, there's, you know, murder within this.

And I also want to show that we can be visceral beings as well.

We don't.

We're not always these, yes, queen, fabulous, you know, types of people we are.

We're fully, you know, fully realized people and depths of our character.

And somebody can trigger you so much that you kill the person that you love and then you ultimately take your life.

And so, yes, it's going to be a very experimental, very dark thriller esque kind of take on a traditional story, but reclaiming it and making it my own.

Okay.

Okay.

Well, thank you, Ashton, for coming on.

It's been really good getting to talk to you and getting to know you a little bit better.

It's also been nice getting to learn about, you know, your journey and the works that you have coming up and.

Yeah, so we really appreciate you coming on the show.

No, thank you so much for just creating a space to really honor our stories and celebrate them in a way that that really is impactful and authentic and vulnerable.

So thank you Harry for creating this space and blessings to you and your journey and your continued conversations and making sure that our stories are honored and recognized.

So thank you so much.

Of course, of course.

And if you've been watching or listening so far, thank you for staying with us.

I'm gonna share more information about Ash thing and the description.

Also a link so you can check out Nana's Boys.

It's a really good movie so you can check it out and watch it.

It could be your weekend binge so I'm going to put that in the description.

Don't forget to follow this podcast on Apple, Spotify or wherever you're listening to your podcast and if you're watching on YouTube, don't forget, don't forget to use the subscribe button as well.

Thank you so much for staying with us today.

Odejima.