This conversation is a powerful reminder of the strength found in vulnerability and the importance of community during the grieving process.

In this week's episode of the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast, Kate is joined by Alex Spencer for a deeply moving conversation regarding her experience of grief and ADHD, following the death of her beloved son, Declan, in 2023.

Alex is a holistic therapist, bereavement coach-in-training, and host of The Functioning Griefster podcast. Alex was diagnosed with ADHD later in life, after years of being labelled “ditzy,” “stupid,” or “the class clown” at school due to undiagnosed ADHD and dyslexia. Alex now uses her lived experience to speak openly about neurodiversity, grief, and resilience and has channelled her energy into creating a safe space for honest conversations about loss, mental health, and carrying on while still carrying grief.

This conversation is a powerful reminder of the strength found in vulnerability and the importance of community during the grieving process.

In this episode, we explore:

1. Alex's experience of ADHD, including misunderstanding as a child
2. How being Declan's Mum changed Alex's mindset and understanding of neurodivergence
3. Why Alex never related to her ADHD diagnosis until one TV programme changed everything
4. How being Declan's Mum supported Alex's ADHD without her even knowing it at the time
5. Alex's fierce sense of right and wrong and her love for Declan drove her to advocate for his needs
6. The impact of grief and losing Declan on Alex's day-to-day life, ADHD and career
7. How Alex is finding her place in the world again and using her voice to make Declan proud
8. The role of RSD in ADHD and the desire to help others instead of self
9. More information regarding Alex's podcast,
10. Why creative outlets like Alex's podcast, The Functioning Griefster, can be so powerful when navigating loss and ADHD

Timestamps:

1. 00:01 - Introduction to ADHD Women's Wellbeing
2. 01:46 - Navigating Grief and ADHD
3. 12:15 - The Impact of Acceptance on ADHD and Parenting
4. 18:25 - The Impact of Advocacy and Exhaustion
5. 21:59 - Personal Reflections on Navigating Grief and ADHD
6. 29:40 - Finding Purpose Again During Grief
7. 39:59 - Regaining Structure in Grief
8. 45:23 - Exploring Grief and Connection

The ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live Event Recording is here!

My first-ever ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live event sold out, and now the full experience is available to you wherever you are, whenever it feels right.

Alongside three neuro-affirming experts, we spent four hours exploring the questions that matter most to late-diagnosed women. Get lifetime access here!

Inside the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live Recording, you'll find:

1. Kate Moryoussef on post-diagnosis growth and her gentle framework for what comes next
2. Dr Hannah Cullen on the neuroscience of ADHD and why your brain works the way it does
3. Hannah Miller on reconnecting with purpose through a neurodivergent lens
4. Adele Wimsett myth-busting on hormones, HRT, progesterone and perimenopause

Understand yourself more deeply, feel less alone, and finally access the expert knowledge you deserve. Because every woman with ADHD deserves access to the knowledge, expertise and understanding that for too long simply hasn't been available to us.

To get lifetime access for £44, click here for lifetime access.

Join the More Yourself Community - the doors are now open!

More Yourself is a compassionate space for late-diagnosed ADHD women to connect, reflect, learn and come home to who they really are. Sign up here!

Inside the More Yourself Membership, you’ll be able to:

1. Connect with like-minded women who understand you
2. Learn from guest experts and practical tools
3. Receive compassionate prompts & gentle reminders
4. Enjoy voice-note encouragement from Kate
5. Join flexible meet-ups and mentoring sessions
6. Access on-demand workshops and quarterly guest expert sessions

To join for £26 a month, click here. To join for £286 for a year (a whole month free!), click here.

We’ll also be walking through The ADHD Women’s Wellbeing Toolkit together, exploring nervous system regulation, burnout recovery, RSD, joy, hormones, and self-trust, so the book comes alive in a supportive community setting.

Today's episode sponsors:

If you’re looking to deepen your understanding and create meaningful change in the ADHD community, today’s podcast sponsor is for you! The Neurodiversity Training Academy is on a mission to empower professionals working to help those clients wear their ADHD with pride.

You can download the brochure or book a call here:

https://neurodiversitytrainingacademy.com/pod/

Links and Resources:

1. Find my popular ADHD workshops and resources on my website [here].
2. Follow the podcast on Instagram: @adhd_womenswellbeing_pod
3. Listen to Alex's podcast, The Functioning Griefster, on Apple Podcasts or Youtube
4. Connect with Alex via TikTok (@decsrollingbucketlist) or Instagram (@decs_rolling_legacy and @elements_of_grief)

Kate Moryoussef is a women's ADHD lifestyle and wellbeing coach and EFT practitioner who helps overwhelmed and unfulfilled newly diagnosed ADHD women find more calm, balance, hope, health, compassion, creativity and clarity.

Welcome to the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.

I'm Kate Moore Youssef, and I'm a wellbeing and lifestyle coach, EFT practitioner, mum to four kids and passionate about helping more women to understand and accept their amazing ADHD brains.

After speaking to many women just like me and probably you, I know there is a need for more health and lifestyle support for women newly diagnosed with adhd.

In these conversations, you'll learn from insightful guests, hear new findings, and discover powerful perspectives and lifestyle tools to enable you to live your most fulfilled, calm and purposeful life wherever you are on your ADHD journey.

Here's today's episode.

Welcome back to another episode of the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.

I I'm Kate Moore Youssef, your host here, as always.

And today we're talking about grief and we're talking about the intersection of grief and adhd, and it's not something we've really touched on in a huge amount of detail.

And I'm so grateful for my guest today who's come forward and offered her really heartbreaking story about how she's been tackling grief alongside her adhd.

And we have Alex Spencer.

Now, Alex is a holistic therapist.

She's a bereavement coach in training and the host of the Functioning Griefter podcast.

And Alex was diagnosed with ADHD later on in life, as many of us have been after years of being labeled ditzy, stupid, or the class clown at school due to this undiagnosed ADHD and dyslexia.

And now Alex uses her lived experience to speak openly about neurodiversity, grief and resilience.

So I really hope that this conversation will just be helpful support.

It will be validation, and we'll really hone in on another layer of the challenges of living with undiagnosed ADHD and then being able to use this awareness and this knowledge to better help and support ourselves.

So, Alex, welcome to the podcast.

Hello.

Thank you for having me.

Well, thank you for being here and sharing your story and helping others because, you know, when we talk about this stuff, it takes away some of that, I would say sting, but also the what ifs and is it only me?

And so many people are carrying this grief about who they are and why they didn't know about themselves.

But you've got that extra layer of grief of the unimaginable and the unthinkable of losing a child.

So perhaps you can tell me a little bit about yourself, what led to your ADHD diagnosis and a little bit about your son as well, because we want to, we want to talk about Declan.

So growing up like I'm 43 now, so what I remember is struggling when especially around kind of bitchiness, I would always wonder why are you being nice to her face but horrible behind her back.

I would struggle with that and then felt like I didn't fit in.

I spent a lot of time trying to find out where did I fit in because I was loud and I was the class clown, but hanging around with the other loud people, they were the ones that were kind of doing like smoking and things which I didn't do.

So I kind of didn't really fit in with them.

And then with the, the ones that were more non smoking, you know, the ones that were more kind of, as people would call me, a goody two shoes.

I was classed as too thick because of how much I struggled academically.

So I really struggled to find kind of my place.

I always knew I wanted to be a mom.

That's one thing that I knew 100%.

I didn't think it would happen till I was in my 30s.

But again, not kind of understanding, not asking the right questions, believing stuff that other people were telling me.

I did fall pregnant at a relatively young age.

I didn't want to go conform to the stereotype of a young mum.

So it's one thing I found is the expectations I have upon myself are so high.

So, you know, I wanted my son to have the best upbringing.

I wanted him to be super proud of me.

So I went back to college.

I did a two year childcare qualification because I always wanted to be a kids entertainer because entertaining people, although I can't sing or dance, is something that I'm naturally quite good at.

Like my son used to say I was like the female Peter Pan, you know, just full of energy.

But like a toddler, I'll be full of energy and then I'll crash.

And I found normal nine to five jobs quite difficult, you know, especially any that had like a repetitiveness about them.

Whereas kids entertainment, there was different things all the time.

It worked with me better.

I just thought that was me.

My sister was diagnosed with adhd, but she's very different.

To me she is very, very messy, late for everything.

She's more that.

Whereas I don't know if it's because I'm the oldest.

I'm very neat, very tidy.

I like things just so because then it helps me find everything.

I'm always early for everything because I'm so worried about being late.

So it's.

I think maybe being the eldest, I.

And there's like nine years between us, I found strategies, whereas my sister, being the youngest, just came across as naughty.

Whereas I was overly sensitive, overly organised, which I think is why I went under the radar for so long.

Then when I was studying, they realised I had dyslexia.

Up to that point, I genuinely just thought I couldn't spell and it didn't matter how much I tried, it wasn't through, not trying.

And also, like, I loved reading, but when you had to read out loud, the words just got all jumbled and numbers.

I just thought, yep, that's.

Once I was diagnosed with dyslexia, that all makes sense.

But then having a child, you then start having quite a structured routine.

And then when my son was diagnosed with Duchenne muscular dystrophy, I then, like I now understand it as hyper focused on his condition, learn everything there was to.

To know about it, to the point I even went out there and got my sports therapy degree because I wanted to know all about the muscles.

And because it's such a practical course or can be when taught correctly to someone like me, I found, you know, because I would constantly be like, moving my body, right?

So if I do this, that means this bone, that muscle, you know, and I could understand that.

I found anatomy and physiology incredibly interesting.

So I understood within a few years that the likelihood of my.

Of there being a cure in my son's lifetime was a highly unlikely.

So I went with the facts, right, I can't do that, but what I can do is give him the best life possible.

So along with all my knowledge of how the muscles worked and everything, I was always organising like.

He met famous people, we went to beautiful places.

Even his bedroom, which I'm currently sat in, except for the ceiling track, hoist, dussen look, disabled.

I wanted De to lead the most normal life possible, which he did.

But having a child and then a child with a disability and he was on the autistic spectrum, routine was a biggie.

And it's only really since losing him, I've realised how much that benefited me.

I thought I was doing it for him, but it benefited me.

And when I was diagnosed with adhd, only Declan knew.

I didn't tell anyone because I was concerned about the stigma, so Declan knew about it, and he understood.

And he was almost like the calm to my storm.

He was very laid back, very chilled, while I was like a million miles an hour.

And if we went somewhere, it would be me that, oh, my gosh, this is so amazing.

And he'd just be like, chill down.

I'd be like, the child.

But, yeah, it was.

I'd been told I had depression and anxiety.

I'd been on antidepressants, been on the lot.

And then I watched a documentary, and it was about a footballer's wife who's got adhd.

And she's not like my sister, she's like me, super organized, super driven, no faith in herself.

Like, I was diagnosed with body dysmorphia as well.

So, you know, I don't like my appearance.

And it was like she was saying my story and my son was watching it with me and he was like, mum.

So I mentioned it to my GP and she said, you know what, Alex?

You're onto something there.

We've tried medication for depression, anxiety, and it doesn't work.

And I think you're onto something and I will refer you.

Thank you so much for sharing all of this.

I just wanted to flag up or ask you a couple of questions about how you did this all on your own.

You know, you were a single parent.

Were you a single parent the whole time?

I was married for two years.

So you literally had to do all the caring.

You had to, you know, be hypervigilant and be on it with all the medical appointments and care and physio and all of that, with undiagnosed adhd, which causes, you know, creates a huge toll on your nervous system, your stress response.

I just want to sort of validate this because it can be so, know, pulling it all apart.

And you think, how did you.

How did you do that?

You must have been running on pure adrenaline the whole time.

I was.

I had two breakdowns.

Yeah, I. I was.

I was running on pure adrenaline most of the time.

But the biggest thing that fueled me was my love for my son, and that was my driving force.

Yeah.

And so it was towards the end of his life that you got the ADHD diagnosis, and it was really interesting that you're able to talk about that with him and he was able to understand that.

Was there anything that he could do for you to help support you?

And was it just comforting to know that you could have those honest conversations?

I think the biggest thing that Declan provided me in regards to my ADHD was acceptance.

You know, he knew that I Got stupidly excited over Christmas and birthdays and any excuse for a celebration.

I cried at films that I laughed out loud.

You know, that he accepted all of that.

Where friends and people in the past have seen me as a bit weird and a bit childish.

Dad loved it.

You know, he loved that side of me.

And that acceptance was so beautiful.

I mean, that is amazing.

And I hear that a lot about people with adhd, that there's this sort of everlasting youth and excitement and passion and enthusiasm.

And, you know, you said before we were chatting that there were so many parts of your ADHD that you love and have.

Have fueled you and have helped you.

And we talked about your, you know, your justice sensitivity and this deep desire for advocacy and also where that really caused a lot of pain because you were coming across lots of services and systems and things that didn't make sense.

And you obviously wanted to fight for your son, but you.

You were hitting lots of barriers.

Barriers.

Tell me a little bit about how that impacted your adhd and I guess what parts of your ADHD helped you in the fight for your son.

I think the positives of having adhd.

I remember a social worker saying to me, you're like a dog with a bone.

This is before my diagnosis.

And she was actually saying it in a negative way.

It was when I was trying to get a downstairs bedroom for Declan.

But my moral compass of right and wrong.

So I'm very factual.

If this is needed and it, like, factually needed, then why are people trying to put barriers in the way?

I don't understand that.

And somehow I would be able to actually articulate it really well because I might not be able to write very well, but I can verbally articulate things, thankfully, quite well.

So we appeared on the news, on different TV programs, because I'm not camera shy.

I'm not shy of speaking the way I'm feeling and trying to be the voice of myself, Declan and other families that were struggling.

So I found that.

That to be a huge bonus, that aspect of my personality.

However, when I would have things said to me that made me feel, which would have made anyone feel not worth anything.

You know, when you've got these professionals saying, you're going to have to be awake for three days, that's just how it is.

We can't get the carers.

It would affect anyone.

But, like, one of the times I'd had surgery.

So to me, I have a sick note that I'm not allowed to work for six weeks because I've had abdominal surgery, yet you're expecting me to lift a 23 year old man, although I'm not allowed to work, you're expecting me to do this unpaid purely because I'm his mum.

Yet if I was a paid member of the team, I wouldn't be expected to do it because I've got a sick note.

So in my brain I'm like, that doesn't add up.

And if something doesn't add up, I will fight my corner.

Why?

Why, why, why, why, why?

But the problem is they don't like people like us that ask those questions so then they can start telling lies and being mean.

And for me, I remember sitting out in that garden, curled up in a ball, crying, just like, why are they not listening?

And I find that with my adhd I've joked and said there could be a tsunami in Asia and it's somehow my fault.

I will always think I mustn't be doing well enough and that's why the message isn't getting across.

It must be me.

So although I fought for Dec and I've had professionals that were on our side, like even the hospice have said, we have never seen anyone so dedicated or have such an incredible bond with their person.

So I feel that it helped me with that.

But behind closed doors, away from deck, I was in here a mess.

Yeah, I mean, it sounds like you were thinking that, you know, whatever you do isn't good enough or, you know, no matter how hard you try.

And that deep innate sense of wanting to advocate for what we feel so deeply for, whether it's our children, it's changing a policy, politics, like, whatever that is, it really runs so deep through our veins.

And that is why, you know, you see so many new neurodivergent change makers and people who are out there being the people that are saying the things that most people don't want to say and having to stick their head above the parapet and really make ruffle feathers.

But you must have been exhausted yourself.

And it's a very bittersweet thing now because I've slept more now and have in many ways more energy than I used to when Dec was here.

And I hate that fact.

I hate the fact that in many ways he got the worst of me because I was so exhausted, because I was so frustrated, especially in the last six months of his life.

I was documenting it for the BBC and I was a broken woman, I was so sleep deprived.

And now that I have a more normal sleep pattern because I'm not caring overnight, although obviously having grief and Trauma, I do go through phases.

I now understand that, you know, with my adhd I need nine hours sleep, so I really struggle to mentally function.

So looking back now, I don't even know how I did it.

Yeah, I was thinking that because again, I know another family with a similar condition and they have carers through the night because of the turning and the breathing.

We were meant to, but because of the.

And this is the other thing with me was when people were coming in, if I could tell, or if Dec told me that they didn't really know what they were doing.

So what I was finding was care companies would send someone who was only really used to working with little old ladies who needed their breakfast making yet.

Declan was on a ventilator.

You know, he was a 24 year old man that you were having to help toilet and everything.

And we were having a lot of people coming in that had zero experience that were hurting him, not listening to him, looking down at him, not taking into account how his ventilator was literally keeping him alive overnight.

And when I would pull it up with the care company, they were like, oh, you're being too picky, you know, and that's again why we ended up on the BBC.

But it was again just that.

I know that there's other families that might occasionally turn a blind eye because it makes their life easier in having carers that might be below par, but at least they're not having to do it.

Whereas with me, I wasn't having someone belittling my son in his own home.

I would rather have done it myself.

Yeah.

I mean, it sounds like you didn't have a moment to breathe.

It sounds like you were exhausted and burnt out and, you know, that guilt, that guilt that you're feeling.

I had him.

I would pick that over this any day of the week still.

Of course.

Of course.

And I wonder if now you're able to allow yourself to sleep and allow yourself to heal through sleep because it feels like you deserve it and you're worthy of the sleep, even though of course, you would never want to replace one with the other.

I wonder if you're able to share a little bit about what you've learned with regards to grief and managing your ADHD and how there is that intersection.

I know you mentioned at the beginning that, you know, you had that structure, it was exhausting and it was, you know, ongoing consistently, but you did have a structure and there was a routine and now that's not here and you're having to find a whole new way of Being and living and finding a way through this.

Tell me a little bit about what you think, how ADHD has maybe exacerbated this grieving process.

I think for me, and obviously I know everyone that's grieving is different, everyone with ADHD is different.

But for me personally, I have found now that I don't have a routine and I can't go back to the job I used to do as a sports therapist because it included medical stuff.

I'd been trained with England rugby and the thought of seeing a defibrillator scares the hell out of me.

Now I've gone from the person that runs towards an accident to the person that runs away crying.

It's almost like the first year I gave myself permission to not work, I gave myself permission to not go to family events.

I was very gentle on myself.

Whereas it was almost like the year went and then all of a sudden, right, I've now got to work, I've now got to do this, this, this, this, this, this, this, because that's what society thinks I should be doing.

And that's what people were actually telling me.

You know, it seems like when you lose someone, all of a sudden everyone knows what's best for you.

And ultimately, what I've found since losing Declan is I feel like I'm a 15 year old little girl trying to live in an adult world and I can't do it.

And I feel that almost being his mom.

So I was 17 when I had him, so it's almost like I only became an adult when having him.

And I feel like I've regressed back to just before I had him.

But now I'm trying to deal with the grief of losing him, being in our home bills, you know, like when you lose someone, you're sorting out death certificates, funerals, your council tax, all of these different things and letters are my, like, they're a real trigger for my nervous system because I don't understand them.

And all of a sudden they're all coming and Dec's not here to help me with them when I don't understand them properly.

You know, he's not reading them and going, no, no, no, mom, it's okay, it means this.

So I'm trying to deal with all, all of that.

So I think the practical things that happen when someone passes away, when you then have adhd, like, don't get me wrong, I have zero regrets about his funeral.

I somehow pulled it out the bag.

He had the most beautiful funeral with all the songs I know he would want because over the years, he's mentioned the odd thing, and because it was always debt was so important to me.

It stayed in here.

Like he saw a Subaru Impreza hearse on the One Show.

How I even remember it was the One Show, I don't know.

And he was like, oh, that would be amazing when you die to have one of them.

I remembered that for about eight years, I would make sure he had that car.

So his funeral and everything.

Believe it or not, three days after his burial, I got the Euro Star and went to the Eiffel Tower for his birthday.

And I was an absolute nervous wreck, and I was shaking and I was crying, but because we were meant to have been doing it for his birthday, I still did it.

But what I've noticed now is in that train station, I've gone from not really being bothered by crowds, you know, like, crikey, going to gigs and everything.

I'm.

Like I said, I'm the loud one.

Yet now, train stations, airports, supermarkets, stimulation, overload.

I hate them.

I almost feel like DEC was my ADHD medication.

Yeah.

So not only have I lost my ADHD medication, I've lost my person as well.

So combining the two is just a massive scramble.

And also, you know, with your age, not to diminish anything that you've just said, but, you know, this is where our hormones, which have been our scaffolding.

Yeah.

Many of us get through the toughest of times and think, how did we get through that?

Because we've got sort of a relatively balanced hormonal system, and then, you know,.

Come early 40s perimenopausal as well.

Yeah.

And I just hope for you that you're able to acknowledge the bravery and the courage and the strength and the resilience and the grit and the passion and the unbelievable dedication that you had for your son.

And gently, very slowly and very gently, find these little tiny ways to help yourself get through the days, the weeks.

Because there are ways to find these chapters.

And they may not be the same as, you know, before, but it's holding onto those glimmers that you said before about what your ADHD brings to your life and not having any shame around being the person that is loud or youthful or wants to have fun or wants to be silly and allow yourself to almost lean into that without any guilt, you know?

Oh, definitely.

Because I know people have said, do you feel guilty if you laugh?

And I'm like, absolutely not.

My brain isn't wired that way.

I know that that was Dex favorite side of me.

I feel guilty when I'm crying.

I feel guilty when death.

Because I do believe in the afterlife.

And I feel guilty that he has to see me in so much pain.

So, you know, like, I went to this spiritual event because I'm so trying to keep hold of him, and I did feel closer to him.

And we were all dancing at the end of the night.

These stupid dances.

I can't dance.

But, oh, my gosh, was I going for it.

And it was because I kind of felt like Dec was with me in that moment.

And I know he would have just been there, just like, mom, so embarrassed and proud of you at the same time.

So, like, I know that, like, my podcast, everything I've done on social media to raise awareness of his condition, of parents that are grieving.

The fact I'm.

Sounds ridiculous saying this.

I'm openly now an ADHD sufferer, whatever you want to call it, I'm not hiding that anymore, that he'd be so, so proud of me, and I'm okay with all of that.

It's when I'm crying uncontrollably, which does happen at some point every day, and I can't see a future for me in this world, because I suppose it's going back to the question you asked.

I think in doing my podcast, I've met a lot of parents that have lost children, and they struggle to find their purpose, their place in the world.

So I've got that.

I've got the fact that.

Who am I now?

I'm not Dex mom, and I'm 43.

Know, I'm 44 next month.

But then you've got the fact that before I was a mom, I didn't feel I fitted into the world because of having adhd, although I didn't know it at the time, because we don't live in a world that is easy for ADHD people.

So then when you combine the two, it really is like, how is there a place for me in this world as a grieving mother with adhd?

Well, I want to say, too, there is a place.

And, you know, what you're doing, you know, may just be something that you do now as part of your healing process, and as things start to feel slightly different, easier in different ways, that purpose, you know, will come.

But I think maybe your purpose right now is your own healing and looking after yourself and dedicating this time to you.

And you've been such an incredible advocate of so many people that maybe your purpose right now is doing the things that you know can get you through that day that get you through that week.

And I know you know, you're doing this podcast which may be very cathartic in lots of ways, but may also be quite triggering for you in other ways, and that might be difficult.

And then I know you're also training it to be a bereavement account, is that right?

Bereavement.

I'm fully qualified now.

Okay.

It's a holistic grief and trauma coach.

So I did it mainly to be able to help myself, you know, using somatic breathing and different things to be able to help me.

And also in doing it, I've learned so much about the nervous system and then like I've learned how to.

ADHD affects the nervous system.

So kind of combining the two, you know, is really like, I would like to actually specialize in being a holistic grief coach for those with ADHD and autism because I know firsthand how our brains work differently.

The thing with me is, is, and I don't know if this is ADHD grief or just me, but my self worth is incredibly low and always has been.

I get more joy out of helping others.

So it's almost like for me to be able to help other people is more important than I am, if that makes sense.

Yeah.

And what you're saying is highly relatable to so many people because a lot of people with adhd, due to the trauma of not being diagnosed, of not having understanding, of not having that compassion of the low self esteem from maybe academia, from the way, you know, from friendship perspectives, from rs.

I'm not aware of that.

I, you know, because I suppose, you know, I was diagnosed, kept it to myself and then Dex passed away.

You know, I've never really had that kind of discussion with someone as to what else can ADHD make you feel like.

Yeah, and there's so many layers.

And this is, you know, I speak to so many women in similar situations, maybe not alongside the grief, but they are going through this unraveling and sort of unmasking process of, well, why, why is my self worth so low despite over being overproductive, overachieving perfectionist, doing so much?

You know, there's a common denominator with so many highly ambitious, highly, you know, high achieving women who have got degrees and various careers and want to help and serve and do so much, but for themselves, they don't think they're worthy of the rest.

The compassion, the, the, the offering themselves that same love that they're offering other people.

Why, why is that a thing for us?

Because It's a, it's very much a.

It's multilayered, so everyone's very different.

But I do believe there is.

It's a trauma of not quite understanding ourselves and having to do things differently to fit in.

Like you say about the friendships and really overcompensating to live in this world.

And then you've got the different layers of maybe dysfunction, maybe addiction, maybe grief, maybe other mental health problems, maybe addiction.

And we've never had an explanation, so we've always blamed ourselves.

And if we just do things differently, we just try harder, if we just be different, then something will change.

And then when we get this revelation about ADHD and you know that there is this process of grief of all that could have been, all that I could have known, or how I could have spoken to myself, or how things could have have been different, it can feel very, very heavy.

And you are going through a double whammy of devastation.

And the fact that you have this acknowledgement and this awareness that you want to help people.

And that's not a bad thing.

You know, so many people I speak to in with ADHD or neurodivergent are in this service industry.

They're in the therapeutic industry.

They want to help it, want to advocate.

We're writers, we're podcasters, we're change makers.

We want things to be different for other people.

We care.

We use ourselves as the platform to, to instigate change.

But what I always say to people is that do all of that, that's amazing.

But practice such strict self care boundaries.

Combat yourself with self compassion, really allow yourself to rest and decompress and breathe.

And it's amazing that you've got these tools, you know, the tools, the somatic tools, the breathing.

But allow yourself, don't just learn about that for other people.

Really embody that for yourself and make yourself be the person that does it first.

And then you teach, you teach others from what you've learned.

So various sections of the day are hard, but mornings have been the hardest.

That waking up to the Groundhog Day and the acknowledgement, yes, he's still not here.

And I was waking up, panic attack, shaking, just like, I can't do this, but I would have two dogs downstairs waiting for me to let them out.

And I was at my friend's house this one day and she had a jigsaw out and me just blurting stuff out as I do.

I was like, all right, old lady, you know, she was like, no, no, come and have a look.

I was like, that was gonna bore me.

Oh, my gosh.

I was like, oh, my God, this is great.

To the point she bought me a jigsaw.

So for the last five months, I think it's been.

Now I have my little routine.

I come downstairs.

Don't get me wrong, there's times where I really don't want to, but hearing my dogs wanting me to come downstairs because if I don't, I'll come down to a mess.

So come downstairs, let them out, flick the kettle on, come into my son's room, where I am now, open the blind, kiss his pillow and say good morning.

Make my coffee, because I know the warmth of that helps my nervous system.

And then I sit and allow myself the time it takes to drink my coffee, to do some of my jigsaw.

And it's only when I'm doing that that.

Because I've tried meditation and stuff, but my.

There's too many voices.

Like, it's too loud in there.

So the jigsaw saw just creates a bit of calm.

Yeah.

And it's mindfulness.

Yeah, it's my way of mindfulness.

It's.

Yeah.

I found a way that works for me.

And that's beautiful that you've got that.

And again, that's creating your ritual and your structure.

And it might take a bit of time because, you know, you had Declan for 24 years, and that is a long time to change a routine and a structure.

But it is.

It's just finding those little routines and rituals that get you through.

And maybe this jigsaw chapter might only last a year and you might find something else, but the fact that you found that, that has helped you move from one thing to the next thing.

And, you know, I just send you so much love because your story will be very emotional for a lot of people to listen to, but also very validating.

And you were such an early stage in all of this, even though it's been.

Has it been how long?

25 Months?

25 Months that you have got through the past 25 months, you know, and for you to give yourself that huge credit and that you are wanting to help other people and it might change and evolve, and that's okay as well, that we don't have to give ourselves this strict.

Like, it has to be like this, and it's going to be like this forever, that allow yourself six month chapters, six week chapters, because that's what I found.

I can't look too far forward because that sends me into a panic.

You know, it's.

It's almost.

I Vaguely look at a month at a time, but I only really focus on a week at a time.

Yeah.

I mean, what I would love to say to you is that we'd love to maybe hear from you in a year or so and hear how you're getting on, but you're just sharing with the fact that we don't have to have the answers.

We don't need to, you know, be able to figure it all out now.

And I think that's in itself a beautiful lesson for people because, you know, grief aside, a lot of people, when they've got this ADHD diagnosis kind of want, right, I want to be fixed, I want the medication to work.

I want to know what's going to happen next.

They want a whole plan.

They want to be like, right, how do I sort this out?

And life is messy, life is hard,.

Life is challenging, and you can only control yourself.

It's outside influences that I find are most triggering to me and I can't control them.

Yeah, yeah.

And it's really dedicating that time to, like you say, calming your nervous system, finding those moments where you can be present.

And if that gets you through that morning, that day, it's incredibly inspiring.

If people wanted to get in touch with you or listen to your podcast, tell us a little bit how they can find you, because I'm sure that after this conversation, people might want to reach out to you.

Well, the podcast is called the Functioning Grief Star.

That came about purely because I was speaking to someone from the BBC and I said, I feel like I'm a functioning alcoholic, but I'm not an alcoholic, as in, like, I'm functioning to the outside world, but I'm dying inside.

Like, I just.

But that's on all the normal major podcast platforms.

I've literally designed the logo, done it all myself.

And because it's for Deck, it's Dec's legacy, even down to the fact whilst when he took his last breath, we were listening to the Beach Boys, we had their album on in the car and I just decided I was trying to think of ways to come up with a logo and I just thought, I wonder what the Beach Boys album cover is.

And it's a sun setting on a beach.

Oh, wow.

And I've used a silhouette of me and the dogs looking out at a real sunset on there.

So even the logo has got so much love and connection between Dec and I. I've done the music, I found the people to.

To come, and it's actually recorded in Dexfan, which is the place he took his last breath.

But it's the place where we lived, it's the place where we went on our journeys.

You know, it's not a place of sorrow, it's a place of safety and spirit and heart.

I took over all of Dec's social medias just to, you know, keep doing what he did, you know, being an advocate for those with disabilities and now those that are grieving as well.

So that's Dec as in D E C S, Dec's rolling bucket list and that's TikTok, Instagram and YouTube.

And there's.

I'm always putting videos up of Deck, you know, videos that Dec made as well as my own journey.

And I've just started doing the odd live on Tick Tock as well.

Just kind of sharing just the day to day.

I do it with another mom and we just kind of have a little chat.

How's your day been?

I found this hard about grieving the loss of my son today or, you know, but we also have a real laugh as well and end up saying stupid things.

So yeah, that's kind of the way people can follow my journey and through the podcast, hear stories of other parents.

I've had one other mom who's got adhd and that was a very different podcast because we were both trying to talk over each other and we both got so excited.

So, so, so yeah, that was, that was good.

And each podcast, although they're all with grieving parents, bring a slightly different feel to them.

Well, thank you so much and how lucky Dec was to have you as a mum, you know, thank you.

Really, that's literally the nicest thing anyone can say to me because that's so.

I'm looking at a picture of him down there.

That's the one thing that no one could ever take away from me is my bond with him and the pride I have in him.

You've beautifully articulated that in today's conversation.

Are you saying that is the nicest thing anyone can say?

Well, I'm glad because you really can see that a lot of people go through life and don't have mums like you.

And he was obviously clearly very blessed as you were to have him in your life.

I was so lucky, so lucky to have, have and I will still say have a sunlight Deck because I know he's keeping an eye on me and making sure I'm okay and making things happen like this today.

I know that he, he makes things align.

Yeah, absolutely.

And I believe that as well.

And I will be going to check deca on his social media because I'm now so intrigued to connect with his spirit and his who he was as a person.

And this is, this has been an amazing conversation and I really hope not only does, you know, does it help you in some way, but also helps lots of other people who are listening.

And I hope so.

Yeah.

You know, our brains might think differently, but that's okay.

And it has benefits as well.

Yeah.

Well, thank you so much, Alex, and I'll make sure all the information is in today's show notes and hopefully you'll have some lovely, lovely people reaching out to you.

I'm sure you will.

Thank you.

Thank you for being here and listening to today's episode.

I just want to remind you that if you are looking for more support on your ADHD journey, there are so many resources waiting for you over at ADHD womenswellbeing.co.uk so inside the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Workshop Library, you'll find practical and complete compassionate guidance on topics such as nervous system regulation, rejection, sensitive dysphoria, perfectionism, emotional regulation, hormones, parenting, and so much more.

All designed specifically for late diagnosed neurodivergent women.

You can also explore my new book, the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Toolkit, which was published by dk, which is also available in ebook and audiobook, which is packed full of tools to help you feel calmer, more regulated and more like yourself.

And if you do crave a bit more deeper connection and ongoing support, come and join us inside the More Yourself Community.

It's a gentle space for learning, reflection and connection with other neurodivergent women.

And you'll also find the recordings from our first ever ADHD Women's Wellbeing Live event, which brought together incredible speakers and a room full of inspiring women for a truly special day.

We have recorded it all for you and it's there to buy.

So whether you're just starting your journey or looking to go deeper, there's something there for every stage.

Just head to adhdwomenswellbeing.co.uk to explore everything.

And as always, thank you so much for being here and for being part of this community.

Sam.