SHOW TOPICS:  

Dads and soon-to-be-Dads, are you trying to convince your wife to homeschool?   Our guest today, John, shares his story of how he and his wife worked this discussion.  Now, 19 years of homeschooling later, they share their lessons learned and suggestions for others in their book, “This Is Not A School.”  Take self-custody of your parenting.  In the long term, the low time preference view, it’s worth it.  The way we help other parents is by sharing.

IN THIS EPISODE, YOU'LL LEARN:

·      John’s book is “This Is Not A School: A nineteen year family education journal” 

·      Their reasons for homeschooling were not religious

·      He was inspired by his mother who emphasized how important it is to take full responsibility for the education of your children

·      Get the food right is one of the cornerstones of homeschooling

·      Limit the bad influences, e.g., what kids may be exposed to in public schools

·      John had to convince his wife to homeschool

·      You don’t need to have a lot of money to homeschool

·      They emphasized to their children that they were responsible for their own education

·      Teaching kids how to think for themselves is so important, e.g., critical thinking, mental frameworks

·      Self-custody parenting … Take control of what your kids are going to eat, going to experience, going to be exposed to

·      Parents are the ones who have the greatest incentive to take care of kids

·      When your kids fall down, don’t baby them.  Tell them to get up.

·      In many schools, administrators pummel kids with questions that really are suggestions, e.g., do you feel suicidal, do you feel like the opposite sex

·      They based their homeschooling on real world projects and situations, e.g., forming a PAC with their children called “Cannabis Consumers for Liberty”

·      Their family came under additional scrutiny and potential monitoring … John says that those who homeschool should be prepared for similar treatment

·      In the long term, the low time preference view, it’s worth it.  The way we help other parents is by sharing.

·      Talk to kids like adults about all subjects, especially money

·      They are working with Adam Curry to set up a Lightning node to process microtransactions for their audio book

·      The kids were with them when they set up their bitcoin wallet

·      Do what you need to do to be present with your family

·      If you’re feeling discouraged because it feels challenging to homeschool, don’t give up.  

·      John explains the history of National Computer Systems (NCS) and its influence over the US educational system and standards.  They were purchased by Pearson, a publishing company in London.

·      Go to the original, printed sources whenever possible … Build a book library of unabridged classics

 RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THE SHOW:

•               John Dale’s book “This Is Not A School: A nineteen year family education journal” Amazon

•               John Dale’s book in audio on Podcast Index, https://podcastindex.org/podcast/6956884

•               Their own label, Plains Tribune Press, http://growingbusinesssolutions.com

•               Adam Curry, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Curry

•               Podcast Index, https://podcastindex.org

HAPPY TO HELP:

Tali's Twitter @OrangeHatterPod

Scott's Twitter @ScottLindberg93

Scott's nostr npub19jkuyl0wgrj8kccqzh2vnseeql9v98ptrx407ca9qjsrr4x5j9tsnxx0q6

Free Market Kids' Twitter @FreeMarketKids

Orange Pill App @FreeMarketKids

Free Market Kids' games including HODL UP https://www.freemarketkids.com/collections/games

WAYS TO SUPPORT:

We are our own sponsors and are so grateful for all of you who support this show.  Thank you!

Subscribe, like and share this podcast with others

Crazy awesome 2024 Halving Collector’s Edition of HODL UP is available at https://www.freemarketkids.com/products/hodl-up-2024-halving-limited-edition

Visit our “Free Market Kids“ for products like the Bitcoin mining game, HODL UP  https://www.freemarketkids.com,

Check out Tali’s podcast by and for Bitcoin women, “Orange Hatter” https://www.orangehatter.com  

Have fun with “Proof of Work Apparel” https://www.freemarketkids.com/collections/proof-of-work-apparel

STANDING RESOURCE RECOMMENDATIONS:

Article "Homeschoolers Are Bitcoiners Who Don't Know It Yet" https://bitcoinmagazine.com/culture/parallels-between-homeschool-and-bitcoin

Tali’s “Quick Start” checklist  https://www.freemarketkids.com/blogs/i-want-to-start-homeschooling/i-want-to-start-homeschooling-quick-start-checklist

Mentioned in this episode:

Aleia Free Market Kids Full

We're still new at this, but they were sitting with us

2

as we set up our Electrum wallet

3

Everyone is going to assume that you're

guilty of something, you're trying to

4

hide something by bringing your children

into the fold of your own family.

5

When in reality, that's

what made our country great,

6

so you could literally go from scientific

STEM juggernaut to a woke, cutting

7

body parts off kind of mentality.

8

Because the schools were in charge

of delivering the education.

9

In South Dakota, we're big on,

guns, rifles, and ammunition.

10

We try to stock up on food.

11

We know how to grow and

manage our own garden

12

and that's covered in the book.

13

Scott: Welcome.

14

Welcome, John.

15

We're, Talia and I are so excited to,

to, uh, talk about your book and your

16

homeschooling adventure and definitely

get into some, Bitcoin for the audience.

17

Today we, we have John Dale the

name of the book is this is not a

18

school And it's a 19 year family

education journal and This is this is

19

fantastic because people learn from

others and It takes a lot of effort

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Tali: to

21

Scott: think through

22

sharing

23

things.

24

It's, it's, it's one thing to be talking

over a cup of coffee with somebody.

25

It's another thing to put together

a whole book and be structured

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with it and try to add value.

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So I'm excited to get

into, into a lot of this.

28

Tali: I've been thinking about this

book now for almost two decades, and

29

trying my best to plan and take notes,

and that helped me to take my role as

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a homeschool administrator and teacher

and father and husband more seriously,

31

because I always knew that we would

get to this point, and we were going

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to this year's Congressional App

Challenge, and demo in Washington, D.

33

C.

34

This spring, it was, we won three

straight here in South Dakota, the

35

congressional app challenge and was, you

know, told the team, okay, this is it.

36

We're writing the book.

37

So I hooked up a raspberry PI

and a little monitor and keyboard

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and mouse right in our Yukon.

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And so as we were driving, we're kind

of taking notes and documenting ideas,

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thinking through structure and flow

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Strategy

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for the book.

43

And then when we got back home, We just

all dedicated ourselves for about a month

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to write down the experience that we had

been through for the last 19 years or

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Scott: Yeah, great.

46

Um, we were, we were talking just before

we turned on the record and we were just

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about to hear kind of the Genesis story

for you on how you, you started down

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this, homeschooling path 19 years ago.

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So maybe, maybe for everybody,

let's, for, for Tali and I as well,

50

let's, let's go back to, to there.

51

If you can kind of give an introduction

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Tali: of how this

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Scott: whole thing started,

and then we can kind of explore

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some of these different areas.

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Tali: Sure thing.

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First and foremost, I

do have to apologize.

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We're located in Spearfish, South Dakota.

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We're on the west end of the state in

the Black Hills, about 17 miles from

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Sturgis, where they hold the nation's

largest Harley Davidson motorcycle rally.

60

And so we have about 400, 000 of those

buzzing all throughout the Black Hills

61

right now and you may actually hear

that sometimes they get really loud.

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Um, maybe we'll luck out though and, and

you won't be able to hear some or maybe

63

you want to hear those, I don't know.

64

Either way, we'll just

kind of roll with it here.

65

So, in thinking back, um, my mom

was a 7th day Adventist and we

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lost her earlier this spring.

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And so, um, I'm remembering

her in memorial even right now.

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Scott: We're sorry.

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Tali: And she always used to say things,

you know, like, you've got to keep an

70

eye on what the government is doing.

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You have to make sure that you have

a civic duty and a responsibility

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to hold them accountable.

73

Someday, all of the Seventh day

Adventists may need to run to the hills

74

because they're going to be persecuted.

75

And this was her mindset, and she did

her best to raise me as a Seventh day

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Adventist despite the fact that I Peeled

away from the church after the sixth grade

77

and really kind of found my own way, but

I always have that Fundamental foundation

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of, strict morality and adherence to diet

that comes from the Seventh day Adventist

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Church Although I'm not a Seventh day

Adventist I would like to make that very

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clear and our reasons for doing homeschool

were not religious reasons But she

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was really the one who kind of planted

that idea that, you know, how important

82

it is to take full responsibility

for the education of your children.

83

And that's, that's in every

aspect of life, including what's

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not taught in public schools.

85

And so when our first daughter was born,

I was doing my master's degree in Tucson.

86

And, um, we had, you know, five

years or so, four years, depending

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on whether you send the kids to

preschool, to really kick around the

88

idea and mull it over and test it out.

89

And Um, I have to say there was staunch

opposition from all quarters, working

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with the university down there as the

systems administrator senior, having

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family members who were firm believers

in institutional government type schools,

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who were telling us how, what a bad

decision it was going to be to homeschool

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our, oh there they go, I don't know

if you can hear that motorcycle in the

94

background, what a bad decision it was

going to be to homeschool our children.

95

You have to socialize them, you

have to socialize them, how are

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they going to get socialized?

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How are they going to learn all

the dirty tricks that their friends

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are going to pull on them was one

of the arguments that my dad made.

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And so, um, but nonetheless, I, I have

one of these brains that works in a way

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where I can think things through and I

have this really good memory and, uh,

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the ability to simulate and model things

in my mind and kind of play them out

102

in my mind how the future might unfold.

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And I was convinced that after

all of my experience in school.

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I went to something like 9 different

elementary schools, I've been in a higher

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education setting, I have an advanced

degree, after all of that experience,

106

a couple of axioms sort of surfaced as

the keystones to homeschool, and those

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were, get the food right, because I think

a lot of disease and cognitive problems

108

were caused by the nutrition options

available to the majority of people who

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are young, and limit the bad influences.

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Okay.

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Because kids are, you know, we, the

way that our mind works, and I devote a

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lot of energy to this in the book, but,

and try to make it accessible because

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it's a very complex topic, you know,

how human neurology fits together,

114

but the way the mind works is we're

products of our environment largely.

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In addition to having that genetic

predisposition, we're products

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of who and what is around us,

what information we're consuming.

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So to limit those influences of

information that could potentially

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poison them while they're so susceptible

and young and fragile and gentle

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and innocent was the big axiom.

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So those two, if I figured, and this

was the argument I must have made

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to my wife a hundred times, if we

get the food right and limit those

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bad influences, I think it will be

impossible to do worse than the bottom

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50 percent of an average public school

classroom, which I have seen many of.

124

So that's how, that was what it

was like at the beginning, as a

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young man who was fairly stubborn,

raised by a fairly stubborn woman.

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I just kind of threw a line in the sand

and defended that line against in laws and

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my own parents and people I worked with

and teachers and people homeschooling.

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So that's kind of how it started.

129

So you mentioned that you were sharing

these, uh, ideas with your wife.

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Was she not, sir, was she not,

the originator of this idea?

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It was, uh, you originated

this idea to homeschool?

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I

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think, sorry, I think that's fair

to say that it was my baby, uh, the

134

homeschool idea, and that I had to

stand up for it and really defend it.

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And she's very good at, you know,

taking a position and forcing me to

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evaluate the efficacy of my own ideas.

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And so that made the proposition stronger

because I was able to successfully

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defend it to her, my partner in

life, the person who is going to be

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seeing me gently and lovingly to my

grave and vice versa potentially.

140

And so it was a big deal that I had

her support and I had about four

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years to really convince her and

myself, nobody else necessarily.

142

My mother notwithstanding that this

was the right course of action.

143

The reason I asked that is because I've

spoken to many Bitcoiners that who are

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fathers, and they are trying to get

their wives on board with homeschooling

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and Many of them are resistant

because it is such a daunting task.

146

So can you go back to that, those early

days and share your emotions and how

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you were able to communicate with your

wife and the challenges that meet you

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may have felt and had to work through.

149

My wife was raised in a very stable

household with lots of income and her

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parents are, are very intelligent people.

151

Her dad, um, Is a retired captain, Air

Force, and her mom is, uh, one of, I

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think, four sisters raised in Ohio,

who is college educated and very savvy.

153

And so, um, uh, she was, you

know, she has to listen to them.

154

It is her obligation as their daughter

to listen to them and their arguments.

155

And so we, we got into some very

heated and intense arguments.

156

And trying to project out how the

money was going to work was the biggest

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source of, I think, our fighting.

158

Because if her parents, who were fairly

affluent, were not willing to come

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in and help support us financially,

and my parents were not able to do

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that, and my dad was, my parents are

split up, and they have been for a

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very long time, after the death of my

brother when I think I was three or

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four years old, but He was against it,

and he's fairly affluent, and he was

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in a position to help him with this.

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But there was so much uncertainty about

how, certainty about how we're going to

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pay our bills, how we're going to buy

food, how we're going to, are we going

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to be homeless to be able to do this?

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And that created a lot of anxiety

for my wife, Jess, that I think was

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driving a lot of those really staunch

and heated, intense arguments that

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we somehow, somehow made it through.

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And, um You know, now we have hindsight,

and this is why the book is so valuable,

171

because I know there are a lot of younger

homeschooling families who are going

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through that transition, and they're

finding that staunch opposition from all

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quarters, and they need to know that if

you really take this seriously, and you

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are present, not just financially, with

your family, the results are undeniable,

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even if you don't have a lot of money.

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And that's one of the

main focuses of the book.

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And one of my driving motivations was

to say, Hey, look at what we did here.

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Look at where we were successful

and how we were successful.

179

It doesn't guarantee anything in the

future for my kids, but if they fail,

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I don't think they have any excuse.

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They're extremely well socialized.

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Yeah.

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We have, um, made incredible

connections with amazing people

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and they have achieved outcomes.

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themselves that I document and

articulate in detail in the book.

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Casey is um, a middle daughter

and she went through the

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Algebra 1 Saxon book by herself.

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She has the aptitude to do that.

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And a third axiom that was very

important is that I always hammered

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in to their minds that they are

responsible for their education.

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I can teach you how to read.

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I can teach you some of the rudimentary

stuff but if you take responsibility

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You For your own education, you're

going to learn way, way more

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than the vast majority of folks.

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And in my 20s, going to

college, that's what I found.

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Is I learned so much during those 10

years that I was going to college.

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And it was me that did it.

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I saw a lot of people going to class,

getting decent grades, but they would come

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out of it and they wouldn't really learn.

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Because they weren't taking it

seriously and they weren't engaged

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in the classroom, most importantly.

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So, I don't know.

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I feel like

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I'm

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Scott: no,

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I actually, I, I have a, uh, a thought

for you, or at least a question.

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So, so what I'm envisioning is as, as

the journey continued at some point.

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Tali: your

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Scott: wife said, wow, I see the results

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Tali: of this.

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Scott: And I'm convinced

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Tali: I could, you

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Scott: know, I could see

that because I know that

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Tali: I

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Scott: know what homeschooling

was when Tali first

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said she wanted to do it.

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Tali: But there's, there's something else.

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The

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Scott: things that you said

initially motivated you.

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One of the things that I found was

there were things I had no idea.

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I had not even thought about

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Tali: that

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Scott: later on in hindsight,

I'd look back and say, okay.

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Wow.

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Thank God we, thank God we did that.

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Tali: And

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Scott: of the things that's on my

mind, you have a, you have a chapter

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on calibrating your thinking.

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And I don't know if this is exactly

related to what you were just

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talking about in, in public schools.

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I don't, I don't know

what it's like today.

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It's been a long time since I've been

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Tali: in, school.

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The idea

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Scott: of taking responsibility,

you're not a victim.

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Someone else's not to blame.

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You need to take responsibility

for your own actions.

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Tali: I

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Scott: I don't think as a society

that is where everybody's at.

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And I certainly doubt that

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Tali: it's

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Scott: consistently taught.

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Maybe some teachers do, but I don't think

it's consistently taught through school.

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So maybe we can just take this

as a, let's go into, cause you,

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you have a lot of chapters.

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There's no way we can cover all of them.

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But to me, one of the big hindsights.

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Tali: One

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Scott: the big learnings for me

is teaching our kids how to think

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the frameworks that they use,

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Tali: the idea

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Scott: of critical thinking.

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Tali: And to

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Scott: that's, that's what I was

thinking of as you were talking

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about with teaching the kids to take

responsibility for their education.

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So can you comment on that?

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When you, when you say that your chapter

calibrate, you're thinking is that

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part of it or is that a different?

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Tali: A

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Scott: different area, but, but anyway,

critical thinking and frameworks.

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I'd like to get your

point of view on that.

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Tali: So, the first thing

is garbage in, garbage out.

263

So, the seed of knowledge is the

human mind and the nervous system,

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at least that's what we think.

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That's what we as a people who are

curious about how humanity works.

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We think that if you have

better nutrition, you'll have

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a better seat for knowledge.

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So that's why we like to cut

out drugs, that's why we like to

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cut out alcohol at an early age.

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That's why we like to have organic

vegetables and that kind of

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formulaic, optimized human diet.

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We do that for our automobiles.

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We spend a lot of money to make

sure that our automobiles have

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just the right juice in there.

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And I think that the human body should,

deserves some of the same consideration.

276

So that's the number one thing, is

getting the food and the water right, in

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order to provide a seat where knowledge

can, you know, can get in there.

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And then that, you made me think about,

um, you know, what a big motivation.

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And this, this is what grew within

my own consciousness over time

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with respect to my children.

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And that is, I, I've never

been an arrogant person.

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I'm very good at things and what

I'm good at, I sometimes will get,

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have bravado and I think that gets

mistaken for arrogance sometimes, but

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truly I try to be a humble person.

285

And my mom is responsible for that when

I'm able to accomplish that mission.

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And so as I was, as there was one idea

that kept growing inside my consciousness

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as we were doing that, and that

is, you know, who I became in life.

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Would have been much different

if I was brought up in Germany,

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or if I hadn't gone to all these

schools, or if I hadn't have had that

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critical moral input at a young age.

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There's kind of this ghost

inside our bodies that represents

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us, our agency, our soul.

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There's this thing that some people

would claim happens all on its own,

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and other people claim well, okay,

there's some predisposition based

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on genetic factors and environmental

factors, but the information we get

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can largely shape who we are inside.

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I like who I am.

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I'm a very good person.

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I'm a fallible person.

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I make mistakes, but in

general, I like who I am.

301

And so I wanted my children to

have the good that was in me.

302

And so that's, that drove me

to be there and be present.

303

And the more time I spent with my

family, the more time I wanted to

304

spend with my family, because I

could project that out and envision

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myself on my deathbed and looking

back, what would I be most proud of?

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I guess.

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And what would I feel is

my most important work?

308

And that was to make sure that the best

of myself was transferred to my children.

309

And if I outsource the rearing of my

children to a big government institutional

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school with very little consciousness

that is constantly maneuvering to

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preserve its own revenue and income,

then I lose the ability to do what I

312

think is going to be most important

to me when I'm facing my own moment

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of mortality at the end of my life.

314

I don't want to have that consternation.

315

And so that drove me to be relentless

with who had access to my family and

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what information was in their sphere.

317

And I like to think that I did

pretty good with that over time,

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but it's certainly not perfect.

319

And there's the, this 19 years generated

so much information that There's a

320

thousand books that can and should

be written about our experience,

321

but I think future generations will

probably just have to refer to the

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NSA database to get the full detail.

323

Scott: Yeah, I mean,

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Tali: self

325

Scott: custodying of parenting.

326

Tali: When you

327

Scott: take control over

328

what

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Tali: your kids are going

to eat and experience

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and

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Scott: frameworks on things,

obviously with the name of the

332

podcast being Bitcoin home scores, we

focus on self custody of education.

333

But what you're describing to me is

334

Tali: it

335

Scott: highlights a fact that across

the, across the world, parents

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Tali: are

337

Scott: ones that most care about

338

Tali: their kids.

339

Scott: They have the greatest

incentive to take care of them

340

Tali: And

341

you just,

342

Scott: you can't change.

343

That's a first principle idea and

you're taking self custody of parenting.

344

Go ahead,

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Tali: Talia.

346

I interrupted you.

347

No, I just want to, um, I just want

to ask you, you know, when we talk

348

about these principles and we're

looking back, you know, over two

349

decades, we, we talk about sort of the

highlights and the, the good stuff.

350

But for the people who are in the trenches

right now, I just want to be able to

351

encourage them if they are in the middle

of fighting for their Children to be

352

homeschooled or they're literally fighting

to keep out the bad influences and they're

353

feeling discouraged Or they have a bad

day and they yell at their kids because

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of whatever combination of factors and

they're like, okay, that's it I shouldn't

355

be homeschooling because I'm gonna ruin

them with you know One blow up like what

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do you say to them the people who are

in the trenches right now and really?

357

Struggling and trying to decide

if they should go another year

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Scott: Same thing I say

to my kids toughen up

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Tali: Everything is perfect.

360

Nobody's perfect.

361

We've had blow ups at our children.

362

I've rendered one spanking that

I really regret, but toughen up.

363

This world's going to come at you

quick and it's going to be merciless.

364

And so, um, you know, when you don't

feel and women have this predisposition

365

more than men, but you know, when

your kid falls down, you don't run

366

over there and pick them up unless

there's a serious injury, in which

367

case you want to keep them down.

368

Right.

369

But You, you don't enable them, and

you say, get up, and when they do

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that, that's when the reward comes.

371

Because, um, you know, it's just,

it's not easy, and it gets harder,

372

and some, most of it's not your fault.

373

It's just not your fault, and it's

the way that this world is structured.

374

And we can build systems to ease

some of those burdens, and we have.

375

You know, from the singularity,

to production automation, to, you

376

know, information systems, medicine,

and But unfortunately, a lot of

377

those are not accessible to people

who don't have a lot of money.

378

And, um, that's definitely us, and

that can be a source of stress,

379

which is going to cause pain,

and it's going to cause fighting.

380

There's the natural cycles

that a woman goes through.

381

I mean, that's something that I

think real men have to consider.

382

You better be ready for

that because it gets nasty.

383

And there are some things that

384

Scott: Don't scare them

away, these new dads

385

out there.

386

They're going to be

387

Tali: fine.

388

Scott: Yeah.

389

So, I

390

Tali: I'm going to

391

get in the ring with Tyson and

repeat some of the fights I've had.

392

That's part

393

Scott: of the

394

parenting though, I think.

395

Um,

396

Tali: but you're,

397

Scott: but you're,

398

Tali: Again, this is

399

Scott: anti fragile

400

Mindset of,

401

of

402

Tali: homeschoolers.

403

we want our kids to recover.

404

Scott: You're not a victim versus in

school or in a lot of schools are getting

405

pummeled with administrators saying,

406

Tali: do

407

Scott: you feel picked on?

408

Do you feel like a different sex?

409

Do you feel suicidal?

410

They just, they're just

flooding them with these,

411

Tali: these questions.

412

suggestions.

413

they're

414

Scott: they're actually becoming

415

Tali: Actually, like I was I

actually had this one conversation

416

with our kids the other day.

417

I said when years ago in our generation

and the generation before if your parents

418

yell at you, you just Brush it off.

419

It's just like they had a bad day or

whatever you did something wrong or

420

something you brush it off But today

it'll be labeled possibly as child abuse

421

or verbal abuse and suddenly you look

at the situation a lot different Even

422

if it's exactly the same circumstance

423

Scott: well, I mean the state

424

Tali: you know they they're

425

Intentionally

426

Scott: a wedge between the parents and

the and the kids and I mean in some

427

Tali: cases it goes to extreme I

think was it um Is it Minnesota?

428

There are some places where,

429

Um,

430

I hope I didn't misspeak there,

but there are some places

431

where if your six year old now

432

thinks that

433

Scott: he's a girl

434

Tali: and you

435

say

436

no, that you, you can actually have the

437

Scott: child,

438

Tali: the child

439

services can come to you.

440

Like it's,

441

Scott: it's that, that

442

it's that

443

there's this, that much of a wedge of

444

Tali: Don't

445

Scott: tell your parents

446

Tali: this and,

447

and you kind

448

Scott: create

449

that wedge versus

450

Tali: what we've experienced.

451

And John,

452

Scott: maybe you can comment on this too.

453

So now your kids are older.

454

Our experience has been, yes,

you go through those hard times.

455

That's, that's part of when you

go through hard times together,

456

you can actually become closer.

457

Tali: A

458

Scott: of our children's, I don't

know what you call them, coworkers or

459

Tali: peers,

460

don't

461

Scott: understand when they

say that they talk to us all

462

the

463

Tali: time and

464

Scott: that they share

465

information.

466

You mean you share that with your mom,

you talk to your dad about that and

467

they're,

468

Tali: they, don't understand

469

Scott: that relationship.

470

have you found?

471

This, the experiences that you've

gone through, the hardships you just

472

described, those types of things.

473

What,

474

where are you

475

now

476

as you, as you look back with your

477

Tali: relationships, with your, your kids?

478

Well, first of all, let's acknowledge

that there are some family situations

479

where the child, uh, may need help, and

so, For schools to behave like they have,

480

like as you described, has diluted the

value and opportunity to actually go and

481

only focus on the truly bad situations.

482

So um, but, so, when we did the,

the, one of our, should I, I

483

guess should I talk about this?

484

Scott: So here's another thing too.

485

Let me

486

Tali: just say this

487

In our, in the book, it's in the book, so

I guess we may as well broach the topic.

488

Okay.

489

As an exercise, all of our homeschool

activities were based on real world

490

projects, and so I wanted to give the

kids access to how the legal system

491

works, and to understand the different

levels of government, and how laws get

492

created, and who participates in that.

493

And so, um, as a result of that, we, we

did the Cannabis Consumers for Liberty.

494

We formed a PAC in South Dakota

with our children, in, in tow,

495

watching how that process went.

496

And then we proposed legislation

and got it approved through the

497

Secretary of State's office and

the Legislative Research Council.

498

The girls were on all of those calls

to understand, you know, what does

499

the, what does this legal language do?

500

What's the magic about it?

501

Well, I'm sure that there were

people who saw what we were doing

502

there and immediately assumed that

we were trying to indoctrinate our

503

children into cannabis use, which

could not be farther from the truth.

504

That was not it at all.

505

Really, what I was doing was, this

was an opportunity that fell in our

506

laps because it was the big issue

of the day here in South Dakota,

507

and so we went through that process.

508

I believe that put us under

additional scrutiny, and that

509

some of our systems may have been

tapped into to monitor our family.

510

I think the Teachers Union would have an

interest in doing that, I believe that

511

Child Protective Services has an interest

in doing that, Behavioral Management,

512

Psychology, Businesses, and LLCs, etc.

513

want to have that clean, easy access to

go look at whoever they want, especially

514

homeschool families, because they're

concerned that we're raising dissidents

515

that won't be productive in our society.

516

Unfortunately, that concern tends to grow

like the monster in the closet of the

517

mind of the imagination of a child amongst

these people, and it gets inflated.

518

In our case, I think it was a

big waste of effort and money

519

to the extent it did happen.

520

I don't have the resources

to go and prove it.

521

All I know is that we got a lot of people

very interested in what we were doing.

522

And we also saw some things behind

the scenes that I, I'm not going to

523

talk about on this podcast, but I

hope to be able to write a book about.

524

Because that's one of the, one of the

things you need to be prepared for as a

525

homeschool family is additional scrutiny.

526

Everyone is going to assume that you're

guilty of something, you're trying to

527

hide something by bringing your children

into the fold of your own family.

528

When in reality, that's what made our

country great, was the farm model.

529

Families working together

to be productive, learning

530

together, working together.

531

And that bond that forms

is an unbreakable bond.

532

And that reminds me that in the early

days, I thought, when my, I couldn't wait

533

to have conversations with my children.

534

You know, I just, they weren't

talking yet and I'm like,

535

there's so much I need to share.

536

What if I get hit with a bus by a

bus, you know, and I can't share

537

these life experiences with you.

538

There was just so much that I,

that I wanted to share with them.

539

Um, at any rate, uh, did that, did

that kind of get out the question?

540

Scott: no, you, I mean, the fact that

you, it sounds like you guys have.

541

Tali: You've, you've

542

Scott: had the, the, what I

suspect is built very, very

543

Tali: strong

544

bonds because you've gone

545

through those things together.

546

Scott: And so just,

just a couple of things.

547

Number one, thank you for sharing

because I, I, I think, so for

548

example, the book you might write,

549

Tali: this

550

Scott: is how we make an impact on others.

551

When,

552

Tali: when,

553

Scott: how I say this,

554

Tali: people

555

Scott: understand things better

when they hear it in stories.

556

So if a, if a young couple right now

is thinking about homeschooling and

557

they say, Oh, it's going to be tough

558

and there's,

559

they're going to have extra scrutiny on

560

you.

561

But in the, in the longterm, the low time

preference view on this, it's worth it

562

Tali: to

563

Scott: take, to give your kids And

the only way that they can understand

564

that is if people who have gone

through it are willing to share.

565

So it's, it's just, I'm just trying

to express my gratitude that you're.

566

Tali: you're sharing.

567

Number two, we,

568

Scott: offer this to everybody.

569

We don't do a live show.

570

And if there is anything

571

that

572

we talk about, you don't want what we

can go back and, you know, take it out.

573

So you're safe to just, uh,

to, to, to be yourself here.

574

And I just want to say,

thanks for sharing.

575

I think those are the kinds of things

576

Tali: that actually

577

Scott: help our, our audience

as they are trying to navigate,

578

Tali: What should

579

they do?

580

And and

581

Scott: sometimes you focus on the hard

things and you're going to have this,

582

Tali: you're going to have that.

583

You,

584

you're doing

585

Scott: for a reason.

586

You love your kids.

587

You want the best for their success

and who wouldn't want to have that

588

kind of relationship with their kids

589

Tali: when their

590

kids are adults?

591

No,

592

Scott: I don't think any parent

looks forward and says, I can't

593

wait to not talk to my kid.

594

I just don't think that

it, that not the, not the

595

people I talk to anyway.

596

Tali: So, um, I

597

Scott: would like to, we, I know there's,

598

Tali: So many different subjects.

599

There is one that it's not directly

related to what we talked about

600

here that I wanted to ask about.

601

Are you guys okay if

602

Scott: we

603

switch gears a little bit?

604

Tali: Go ahead.

605

So, so

606

Scott: Bitcoiners, um,

607

Tali: very

608

Scott: concerned about money

609

literacy.

610

What is your point of view on that?

611

Tali: And

612

then you

613

Scott: have a whole, whole

chapter on teaching money to your,

614

Tali: your

615

Scott: kids.

616

What has your experience been trying to

help pass on to your kids how money works

617

and the things they need to be prepared

for it to be successful as adults?

618

Tali: Yeah, what a great topic.

619

And there's so much that can be said

about this, but I'll try to keep it.

620

Right in, right in the

bullseye of, I think, what your

621

audience would most appreciate.

622

We talk to our kids like adults.

623

We try to build their vocabulary

in different domains of knowledge.

624

And money, and finance, and banking.

625

That, we talk about that a lot.

626

And in fact, all of our lessons, the

ones that I got most excited about,

627

We're the real world application.

628

So it's real projects.

629

So we're actually doing our digital

currency homeschool lesson right now,

630

and we're working with Adam Curry.

631

I'm not sure if you

know who Adam Curry is.

632

He's the pod father, the guy who

invented podcasting and did the deal

633

with Apple originally, and he also

was a host of MTV's Headbangers Ball.

634

He's a, he's definitely the

one who, he's at the center

635

of what we're doing right now.

636

And so we're working with him to

set up a lightning node to allow

637

us to process microtransactions for

the audio version of our book and

638

leveraging that value for value network.

639

And one of the interesting aspects

behind this is you're trusting

640

the moral objectivity of people.

641

to donate when you do it on this model

because you quote unquote give the

642

content away and then rely on people

to say well this content was worth this

643

much value to me so i'm going to go

ahead and smash the button and give you

644

this much value and it's measured in

satoshis in the lightning network and the

645

lightning network is important because

it is fast so the transactions are fast

646

it's extremely liquid and low cost so

you don't have a lot of transaction

647

fees And once you reconcile and get,

let's say, the day's transactions and

648

fill up a certain amount, you can do,

process one transaction to another

649

Scott: to get to another Bitcoin

650

Tali: Bitcoin wallet and then

out into dollars and into assets,

651

if that's what you want to do.

652

So we're right in the middle of doing

this project right now, and we're

653

about to light it up on podcastindex.

654

org.

655

And I would, if you don't know that

already, that's the direction that I

656

think everyone who is interested in

diversifying and, um, unconsolidating

657

media so we can get more accurate

information to one another, podcastindex.

658

org is right now the battlefront and where

everyone should go to try to support.

659

And if you can, if you have the ability,

set up a wallet that does lightning

660

transactions so that you can reward

people who are taking this initial

661

risky step for so many reasons, right?

662

Because.

663

Fiat currency has no bottom,

so Bitcoin has no top.

664

And it's an incredible and possibly

temporary hedge against the abuse of

665

our financial system by people who are

not contributing to the value chain.

666

So to me, digital currency is,

there's a couple things, and I

667

advise the governor's office here

in South Dakota in the same way.

668

It's about liquidity.

669

You need to be able to

produce something of value.

670

In my opinion, it's the

book that we've written.

671

And then once you produce that thing of

value, there needs to be a reward for

672

that value that can come from Bitcoin,

which is growing against inflation.

673

And then those need to be liquid into

dollars and into some asset very quickly.

674

In our case, our preference is to put all

of our resources financially into cash

675

flowing enterprise, because a cash flowing

business is the best possible hedge

676

that I can think of against inflation

and abuses in the monetary system.

677

Beyond that, uh, here in South

Dakota, we're big on, you know,

678

guns, rifles, and ammunition.

679

We, you know, we collect those

as a source of value and possible

680

currency in the event of a

collapse of our financial system.

681

We try to stock up on food.

682

Uh, we're big on intellectual

property, so how to do things.

683

We know how to grow and manage our

own garden, if and when that's needed.

684

And that's covered in the book.

685

Just our experience with it, it's not

the be all end all manual for how to grow

686

your own food, but it demonstrates that

you, it's not that hard to get started.

687

We have, we hunt, and we actually

cover that as a chapter in the

688

book, one of my favorite chapters.

689

And so we know how to harvest wild game.

690

We're familiar with the species

of fish in our local streams and

691

waterways, so that if we had to, we

could go and catch fish, and we know

692

what birds there are, and so on.

693

So, you know, for me,

Bitcoin isn't an asset.

694

It's not even a currency.

695

It just represents liquidity.

696

And the liquidity is from people who

are forward thinking enough when it

697

started, the cypherpunks and others,

to recognize that, hey, listen, there's

698

a class of people in our society

who are cheating every single day.

699

And they're not actually

producing something of value.

700

So we're going to need a system,

That grows in value as the

701

value of the dollar depreciates.

702

Because whether it's our fault, or the

fault of BRICS, or whatever, a worthwhile

703

opponent, this thing could crash, and

we need to have a hedge against that.

704

And so that's what Bitcoin represents

to me, is the ability to tap into the

705

folks who started it, who are, have an

enormous amount of wealth now, looking

706

at the exchange rates, and to allow

them to compensate us, is used for

707

producing something of actual value.

708

In our case, we're a knowledge factory,

and we're in the business of education.

709

And we want a way to get rewarded

for that, but we don't want

710

to have to wait until the rest

of the world accepts Bitcoin.

711

So I advise the governor's office

here in South Dakota to focus on that

712

liquidity, to make sure that we have

good exchanges that have low viscosity

713

and low overhead, so we can get in

and out of digital currencies quickly.

714

As quickly as needed, and into

assets that persist, as I described.

715

The biggest one is intellectual property.

716

You've got to feed your mind,

in my opinion, as a family.

717

That's the biggest hedge you can make

against any kind of strife that you'll

718

run into, is simply knowing what

to do when the time comes to do it.

719

Um, and then beyond that, you're going to

need good food, water filtration systems

720

in your community, too, not just for

you, because if you're in a community

721

of 10, 000 like me, And we're the only

ones that are forward thinking like this.

722

That means I've got 9, 999 neighbors.

723

We're going to come and try to

eat my butt if a thing goes south.

724

So, um, so we actually focus

on disseminating that knowledge

725

in our community as well.

726

Wow.

727

Yeah.

728

There's so much there to unpack.

729

How,

730

how

731

is the family,

732

Scott: both, both your wife

733

Tali: and your children,

734

where

735

are they on the Bitcoin journey?

736

Are they, would

737

Scott: they all consider

themselves Bitcoiners?

738

Tali: I don't know.

739

I think we're pretty pretty

much super newbs right now.

740

We're we're still new at this, but

they were sitting with us as we set

741

up our Electrum wallet We all were

pair programming around the computer

742

so they know what an Electrum wallet

is I've had them watch videos and do

743

independent research on understanding

what bitcoin is and what digital

744

currency is They understand inflation

You And they have a good understanding

745

for their age of finance and, you know,

the relative value of things and that

746

currency is supposed to represent value.

747

And when it's been perverted like

it has, it stops representing value.

748

So, I'm not sure if we're Bitcoiners

yet, but I mean, I'm fully on that

749

track right now and we're going

full steam ahead on this project.

750

And we're going to test the present

state of the system because I'm

751

bringing forward a product I'm

confident has tremendous value.

752

And when we enter that product for

sale in what I hope is a free market

753

of Bitcoin, we'll see if that product

is rewarded through that channel,

754

through the liquidity that was

described, so that we can actually

755

take some of that value we created

and go pay an electric bill with it.

756

So, and if we're able to do that

and complete that loop, I would

757

say, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm all in.

758

And that will be reported to our local

representatives, our county commission,

759

District 31 representatives and Senator

here in, uh, South Dakota, it'll be

760

reported to the Governor's office.

761

Um, you know, we're going to spread the

word around about it as a test case.

762

Because, again, it all hinges, of course,

on whether or not this book is valuable.

763

And I encourage everyone to

go and make that assessment.

764

And if you find it valuable, we'll

test your objective morality.

765

Scott: Okay.

766

All right.

767

I've hit some of my topics.

768

Tell me, did you have

769

Tali: other favorites that

you wanted to to touch on?

770

Well, I was just thinking this morning

that, there were many moments during

771

our 20 year journey in homeschooling

when I felt like giving up.

772

And I, I want to ask you to send

out some encouragements to people

773

who might be in that situation

now or perhaps in the future.

774

How do you encourage a

homeschooling family to keep going?

775

Everybody's situation is different,

but I've had those moments, and with

776

homeschooling and projects I've been

working on, and I've never regretted

777

just grinding it out and finding out.

778

Sometimes I'm successful and

sometimes I'm not, but I know

779

how it would have turned out.

780

And to not continue to grind it

out and proceed, I think That

781

has some consequences because

you have an investment in this

782

if you've already started.

783

There's opportunity cost for the

future if you don't continue.

784

You're gonna do things wrong.

785

Everybody does things wrong.

786

But what is your moral character?

787

Do you take those mistakes, internalize

them and accept them, and craft a

788

solution that will remedy those mistakes?

789

Or do you continue to make the

same mistakes over and over?

790

We had the luxury somehow, and it's

been a struggle, and I've had to do

791

some things that are legal that I'm

not proud of in order to keep our

792

homeschool going, and in order that we

could be together as an atomic family.

793

And that was so valuable to me that I

swallowed my pride and my ego, and I

794

did what was necessary to be present,

because I don't have a rich uncle.

795

But I needed to be present with my

family and that doesn't pay right now.

796

And I'll leave you to fill

in some of those blanks.

797

I'm a very conservative person

and, but it was most important

798

that I be with my family.

799

So, um, as far as mistakes go,

you're going to make mistakes.

800

I've hit that wall easily 10 times,

but if you'll look at the book, you'll

801

see that we've achieved some outcomes

that are fantastic and we're worth

802

every single doubt, every fight.

803

every wall I had to

run into along the way.

804

So don't give up, and please read

the book, and study the book.

805

It's not gonna be like, um, it's not an

adventure novel, it's not entertainment,

806

it's actually an academic manuscript.

807

So there will be some struggle.

808

We audiobook to try to help,

because I know that people like to

809

multitask, so you can listen and keep

your hands busy, and listen again,

810

it's about an eight hour listen.

811

And in there I think that you'll see that

we've achieved those results, I haven't

812

had extraordinary investment, and, but

I have, I guess in our circumstance I

813

should acknowledge that my own life's

journey and educational journey gave me

814

some perspective and knowledge that I

was able to add, and I really tried my

815

best to encapsulate that in the book,

because my advantage over other homeschool

816

administrators and teachers is, I have

to say it, is part of that education.

817

And I went up through the master's level.

818

I had jobs with companies like Pearson

819

is, Pearson is a London company,

who paid a huge amount of money to

820

buy the biggest educational software

services firm in the United States

821

so they could take over our schools.

822

The British, taking over our schools

through the technology implementation

823

of a project called NCS for School.

824

So I have that insight

and that perspective.

825

It gives me a little more resolve.

826

But the book really was meant to

short circuit the learning process

827

for families, especially new families

who are entering into this space.

828

And we went from something like a million

to five million homeschoolers now in

829

the United States from 2019 to present.

830

Scott: Yeah.

831

Tali: Okay, can I, can I ask

you to elaborate on the UK

832

invasion of our education

833

system?

834

It's not one that I'm familiar with.

835

That's not one that I've

836

heard.

837

So tell us more.

838

What is that?

839

Well, I was going to school and

840

working full time with benefits at a

firm called Madden Media in Tucson.

841

When an associate slash friend

of called me up and said,

842

Hey, I'll double your salary.

843

If you'll move up to Gilbert,

Arizona and start working for

844

a company called NCS Pearson.

845

NCS stands for National Computer

Systems and it was headquartered

846

in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.

847

They had over 30 percent market

share in the back offices of K 12

848

education in the United States.

849

They originally got cut their

teeth and made their money on the

850

Scantron Machines that automatically

look at the bubbles on a test.

851

I mean it's very similar technology

to our voting machines by the way,

852

and they have a lot of intellectual,

had a lot of intellectual property.

853

So Pearson came in, bought this company

for I think over two billion dollars and

854

then um, brought in their people and we're

looking at how they could convert this

855

into an educational standards delivery

program that could change the standard.

856

So they brought me in, I'm a software

engineer and database designer, and

857

we were going to take their small C

software and turn it into a big, huge

858

enterprise Java application that would

allow teachers and administrators and

859

students and parents to collaborate

in the system around state level

860

standards, around grading, around all

of that kind of school operations.

861

And.

862

Pearson is an 8 billion

publishing company out of London.

863

So Pearson purchased National Computer

Systems, who had an inroad into U.

864

S.

865

schools.

866

The way that the system was

being designed was polymorphic.

867

So you could change out the entire set

of standards that our children were

868

being taught by changing the contents

of a database, slowly or quickly.

869

And we had people with British accents

running around and then we had, you know,

870

there's a lot of military guys, a lot of

air force guys popping in and out of the

871

building and having higher level meetings.

872

And so clearly it was understood the

risk in doing something like this.

873

If Pearson and their adjuncts and

their activist investors decided to

874

change what educational standards were

put in that database, because what's

875

put in that database gets puts in the

mind, put in the mind of children.

876

As they're learning.

877

So you could literally go from scientific

STEM juggernaut to a woke, cutting

878

body parts off kind of mentality.

879

You could literally do that with the

system because the schools were in

880

charge of delivering the education.

881

And that, that was, to me, is just

a huge, open gap in our defenses

882

as a nation was, how are we going

to protect our children from.

883

You know, speaking British, if you will.

884

Ha ha, right?

885

Or speaking German.

886

We might all be speaking German right now

if World War II had ended differently.

887

Or Japanese.

888

I mean, that's, this was a, in my

mind, it was a slow moving projectile.

889

I kind of figured it out fairly

quickly because my mom had given

890

me some key phrases that shaped

my understanding and books for

891

knowledge that I was looking for.

892

And I'm like, ooh, this is kind of bad.

893

But I was making 64, 000 a year,

and I had just graduated college.

894

And I was sitting next to people from Sun

Microsystems, from IBM, from Microsoft,

895

150 to 300 an hour consultants, and I was

learning how these systems were working,

896

becoming a world class information

systems architect and engineer myself.

897

So what eventually happened was this

crew of about 240 people who were very

898

patriotic, and they chose that software.

899

Uh, company because they wanted to feel

good when they went home at night and they

900

wanted to be able to sleep well and know

that, that they were helping education

901

and it made their hearts feel good.

902

And when they saw that acquisition

come through and when they saw people

903

instantly being made millionaires coming

to work in Ferraris, certain key people

904

on the staff, you know, or just we had a

little bit more money than others, this

905

sort of entrenched group of patriots

congealed and hardened themselves.

906

And I can't prove it, but I'm

pretty sure they started trying

907

to throw monkey wrenches in the

spokes of Pearson's project because

908

they saw the dangers involved.

909

And so there was this cat and mouse

game back and forth for a couple of

910

years before finally Pearson executives

got fed up and laid off 240 people.

911

And I was one of those.

912

And then outsourced it to India.

913

They opened up 30 positions.

914

I applied for one of those positions,

got hired back, got a raise, And

915

worked in that project for about

another seven months as I was

916

putting in my, uh, applications to

go back to the University of Arizona.

917

Because I wanted to understand from a

business level, like from an IT level,

918

I was just soaking it up like a sponge.

919

I understand everything about those types

of systems and I cut my teeth there and it

920

gave me perspective and knowledge, but I

didn't understand why these dudes thought

921

it was okay to outsource their education

like that, quite literally, to India.

922

So, so I put in my, two weeks and

actually went to work for another firm

923

for a while to just try to cleanse my

soul, it was called VistaCare Hospice

924

in Scottsdale, and uh, I worked there

for about a year and then finally got

925

my applications all straightened out, I

was accepted, and went back to school to

926

try to learn in the, one of the nation's

best business programs, what was the

927

impetus behind these decisions to do this?

928

And ultimately the value proposal I,

I discovered, uh, and there's, I have

929

inductive support for this but I don't

have like damning evidence, was that

930

labor arbitrage to India was the primary

way that 401ks were being propped up

931

because it just creates instant profit.

932

But obviously it created also a beachhead

for India now to, who's at a critical mass

933

in our country, to understand everything

that's happening from an information

934

perspective so it's reconnaissance.

935

So these systems now are installed,

they were built by people who don't

936

have constitutional sensibilities.

937

Um, eventually, I think this system kind

of morphed, and I don't know if, like,

938

where D2L came from, but that's the

Desire2Learn is a big system installed

939

at the university level now, and there's

all these kind of systems coming out.

940

I don't know what happened, I don't know

what the end of that story is after I

941

got out, but that was my experience.

942

And I just, I had to get out of there

because I learned what I, what I'd learned

943

and they brought in well I won't say

his name, but they brought in this guy

944

and they started outsourcing and all of

a sudden I, like my hours changed because

945

I had to be trying to give business

requirements documentation to the people

946

in India and they were trying to turn me

into a manager and take me away from the

947

technology when I'm a technology guy,

I'm a geek, I, I want the code, I want

948

to know what the code is doing, I get

my hands really dirty on these systems.

949

And so that was really offensive,

too, is that they seem like

950

they're trying to dumb me down.

951

But at any rate, that's in a

nutshell my experience with Pearson

952

Education Technologies and National

Computer Systems and Pearson.

953

Scott: Uh,

954

Tali: NCS Pearson in Mesa, Arizona.

955

Scott: might have, we

956

Tali: I have a separate

book going on that one.

957

Yeah, I haven't heard of that.

958

But I so when we started homeschooling

959

So I think the timeline kind

of lines up a little bit with

960

with what you just described.

961

But there was a real push in

the homeschooling community

962

to go to the original.

963

Printed source.

964

They were trying to get offline, even

though it would be much more convenient

965

to get your curriculum online.

966

There was a real push for the original

967

work.

968

I think, I mean, this has come, I, I'm not

969

Scott: first one

970

Tali: to say

971

this, but you should be building

972

Scott: a library of

973

Tali: classics.

974

Physical, physical books,

physical library of, of classics.

975

Check, check.

976

We're doing it.

977

We've got it.

978

We're, we're absolutely doing that.

979

I highly recommend it.

980

Even the audio book.

981

AI has the capability now to go in

and, uh, analyze my voice pattern

982

and literally replace things

that I'm saying in the audiobook.

983

Scott: Oh yeah, yeah, you

984

Tali: okay.

985

So printed, printed books right now,

I think, the really important ones,

986

I would definitely recommend getting

a copy and then getting together and

987

reading them with your friends to see

if things have changed between editions.

988

Yeah,

989

they definitely do

change between editions.

990

I have found that like

for the original yeah the

991

I've got i've gotten through library

sales like four or five different sets

992

of the the classics, you know, like um,

Like robbers and crusoe and those types

993

of things and I have definitely noticed

changing of words and sentences that

994

are kind of subtle But definitely there

995

Scott: in some places, I mean,

it's, I don't want to go, I mean,

996

people probably aware of this.

997

If in certain schools,

998

Tali: the teachers

999

Scott: are going to decide

00:51:15,031 --> 00:51:15,311

Tali: what

00:51:15,336 --> 00:51:19,026

Scott: books are available and they might

put things in there that intentionally

00:51:19,046 --> 00:51:21,416

are, I basically portographic.

00:51:21,426 --> 00:51:21,956

If you read some

00:51:21,956 --> 00:51:22,256

of these

00:51:22,291 --> 00:51:23,041

Tali: descriptions

00:51:23,901 --> 00:51:24,201

and then

00:51:24,206 --> 00:51:26,616

Scott: they're trying to remove

classics or even the ones

00:51:26,631 --> 00:51:26,751

Tali: are

00:51:26,928 --> 00:51:27,121

left,

00:51:27,131 --> 00:51:28,061

They altered the

00:51:28,061 --> 00:51:28,956

classic altered.

00:51:29,041 --> 00:51:29,391

So,

00:51:29,986 --> 00:51:31,896

Scott: um, I, I feel like

that could be another

00:51:32,611 --> 00:51:33,021

Tali: Really

00:51:33,021 --> 00:51:33,431

long

00:51:33,691 --> 00:51:34,431

discussion.

00:51:34,431 --> 00:51:34,831

Yeah,

00:51:34,891 --> 00:51:35,701

let's, so

00:51:35,706 --> 00:51:39,696

Scott: my recommendation is John, is

there anything else before we wrap up

00:51:40,321 --> 00:51:41,026

Tali: that we didn't cover

00:51:41,576 --> 00:51:41,916

ask

00:51:42,026 --> 00:51:44,036

Scott: about with the book that

you just wanted to highlight

00:51:44,036 --> 00:51:45,466

or other recommendations?

00:51:46,136 --> 00:51:47,286

Um, and then

00:51:47,856 --> 00:51:47,996

Tali: we

00:51:47,996 --> 00:51:52,026

Scott: can wrap up with a handoff

on where people can find you,

00:51:52,246 --> 00:51:55,076

whether they can reach out to

you, all that kind of information.

00:51:55,300 --> 00:51:59,860

Tali: Well, I think that it's, you know,

if you'd like to do a follow up podcast,

00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:04,690

uh, after people get a chance to read the

book or listen to the book and understand

00:52:04,690 --> 00:52:10,200

it, and I, I'm very interested in people

who disagree with the things that we hold

00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:14,820

as axiomatic, because I don't, I haven't,

there's a viewpoint out there I haven't

00:52:14,820 --> 00:52:16,510

considered that might shift my paradigm.

00:52:16,510 --> 00:52:21,530

I, I want to hear about that and I

invite people who disagree with the book.

00:52:22,015 --> 00:52:24,665

to read it and then push

back and send me messages.

00:52:25,095 --> 00:52:28,265

you can find the

audiobook at podcastindex.

00:52:28,305 --> 00:52:31,075

org right now by searching

thisisnotaschool.

00:52:31,555 --> 00:52:36,135

The, softcover book can be found,

the paperback can be found on amazon.

00:52:36,295 --> 00:52:39,055

com by searching

thisisnotaschool by John Dale.

00:52:39,785 --> 00:52:42,165

And then from there,

there's contact information.

00:52:42,165 --> 00:52:45,995

We're running this under our own

label called Plains Tribune Press.

00:52:46,445 --> 00:52:47,605

And plainstribune.

00:52:47,605 --> 00:52:49,555

com is a website that I do maintain.

00:52:50,030 --> 00:52:53,520

Um, and have been for a very,

very long time, well, I mean, in

00:52:53,520 --> 00:52:54,990

internet terms, for quite a while.

00:52:55,530 --> 00:52:59,260

And it's changed in its format, and I'm

not afraid to get into controversial

00:52:59,260 --> 00:53:02,670

material, again, because I think

that extends the boundaries of my

00:53:02,670 --> 00:53:06,360

own knowledge, and makes my own ideas

better, because the ones that are bad,

00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:08,150

I get an opportunity to hear about that.

00:53:08,520 --> 00:53:10,630

That's, to me, why free

speech is so important.

00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:12,400

And that would be the message, too.

00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:16,400

I think that's the message is, whether

it's my book, or a podcast, or, you

00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:19,990

know, Someone talking at a coffee

shop or a conversation in a bar

00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:22,290

or family around the dinner table.

00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:26,590

You don't have to accept somebody's

viewpoint, but we're all in this together.

00:53:27,030 --> 00:53:32,170

And humanity, I think, requires that you

don't have to tolerate a viewpoint, but

00:53:32,170 --> 00:53:36,410

you can separate a person's viewpoint

from their body and their physical

00:53:36,410 --> 00:53:40,180

body and try to encourage them to share

their viewpoint so that you have an

00:53:40,180 --> 00:53:41,920

opportunity to correct and vice versa.

00:53:42,310 --> 00:53:44,490

Because that's how we hone

in on the target about.

00:53:44,561 --> 00:53:45,880

Scott: What

00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:47,370

Tali: is our mission here on this planet?

00:53:47,750 --> 00:53:49,860

Where do we, you know, how do,

how's this all going to end,

00:53:49,990 --> 00:53:51,500

and how would we like it to end?

00:53:52,020 --> 00:53:56,290

And, um, are we going to do noble things,

or are we going to do debaucherous things?

00:53:56,670 --> 00:53:58,820

And I believe there's

an objective morality.

00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,880

And so, whether you're religious

or not, I think you can seek

00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:03,050

and find your way to that.

00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:06,800

And you'll see some things, so that

concept threaded throughout the book.

00:54:07,590 --> 00:54:10,680

I would be happy to end right there,

because I know people are very busy.

00:54:11,175 --> 00:54:15,235

And I'm always happy to do a follow up

podcast and answer questions by email.

00:54:15,695 --> 00:54:19,435

And, um, you know, my door is always

open in that regard and I type a hundred

00:54:19,435 --> 00:54:21,935

words a minute and I always get back so

00:54:22,565 --> 00:54:24,375

Scott: Well, thank you for sharing.

00:54:24,435 --> 00:54:24,965

I

00:54:25,205 --> 00:54:26,545

Tali: I'm sure there'll

be others that will

00:54:26,705 --> 00:54:29,535

Scott: that will find this this

helpful and we'll we'll take all

00:54:29,675 --> 00:54:31,815

Everything you listed we'll put

it in our show notes as well.

00:54:31,815 --> 00:54:31,985

So

00:54:32,025 --> 00:54:32,125

Tali: we'll

00:54:32,125 --> 00:54:32,875

have links for

00:54:33,965 --> 00:54:34,185

For

00:54:34,185 --> 00:54:34,815

Scott: all of that.

00:54:34,875 --> 00:54:38,565

So thank you again for sharing and

thank you for your time today and

00:54:38,565 --> 00:54:39,655

looking forward to staying in touch

00:54:40,635 --> 00:54:42,415

Tali: I appreciate the work

that you two are doing.

00:54:42,695 --> 00:54:44,175

Anything else I can do, just let me know.

00:54:44,725 --> 00:54:45,475

Thank you.

00:54:46,085 --> 00:54:46,625

Have a great day.

00:54:46,985 --> 00:54:47,855

Thank you.

00:54:47,856 --> 00:54:49,065

Bye.

00:54:49,065 --> 00:54:49,555

Bye bye.