Porter Geer kept seeing "angel investor" in the LinkedIn bios of people she admired, so she decided to learn what it meant. Almost three years later, she and her two cofounders run Girl Math Capital, a community bringing more women into alternative investing, from angel investing to real estate. On this episode of Five Seats, Dr. Kelsy Vick sits down with Porter to talk about investing beyond the stock market.

Porter explains what alternative investing actually is, and the foundations to have in place before you start: no high interest debt, an emergency fund, and retirement and public market investments already working for you. She walks through what it means to be an accredited investor and the options for people who aren't there yet. She also shares her approach to angel investing, which starts with small checks and a target of around 30 investments. Then there's the diligence framework she uses to decide whether a company deserves her money: team, market, product, financials, and traction. You'll also hear why just because you love a product doesn't mean it's a good business, and why she thinks the secret to investing is that it's far more fun than anyone lets on.

Girl Math Capital started as a group chat with a goal: each friend would put $3,000 to work in one year. Now it's welcoming its fourth cohort. Porter closes by filling the five seats at her own dinner party, with a table that includes Dolly Parton, Sara Blakely, and Alexis Ohanian.

Five Seats is a dinner party style interview series from By Maven Media, where ambitious women share how they earned their seat in the room and who they'd want at their own table. New episodes every Tuesday.

This episode is for educational purposes only and is not financial advice.

Connect with Porter and Girl Math Capital:

Girl Math Capital: https://girlmath.capital/

Girl Math Capital Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/girlmathcapital/

Girl Math Capital Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@girlmathcapital

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This week, I'm bringing

you to a different table.

2

Welcome back to Wellness Fixes the Pod.

3

I'm your host, Dr.

4

Kelsey Vick, a board-certified orthopedic

doctor of physical therapy and a

5

women's health physical therapist If

you caught the bonus episode, you know

6

I just launched a new conversation

series called Five Seats Each

7

episode, I sit down with one woman

8

Who made space for herself in a room

that wasn't necessarily built for her

9

We talk about how she got

her seat at the table.

10

And at the end, she tells me the five

people she'd want seated at her own

11

The first three episodes came out

yesterday And I wanted you to hear them

12

right here so you get a little preview

13

Today I'm sitting down with Porter of

Girl Math Capital And we talk about

14

investing and building generational

wealth beyond the stock market

15

Five Seats has its own feed with

new episodes every Tuesday So if

16

you love this one, search Five

Seats wherever you're listening

17

find the link in the show notes below

18

Porter kept seeing angel investor in the

LinkedIn bios of people she admired and

19

figured, "I need to learn what that is."

20

Almost three years later, she and

her two co-founders are helping

21

hundreds of women do the same

22

Porter is one of the co-founders of

Girl Math Capital A community bringing

23

more women into alternative investing,

from angel investing to real estate

24

It started as a group chat of friends

25

With a goal to each put a certain

amount of money to work in one year

26

The group chat's now expanded, and they're

welcoming their fourth cohort of members

27

Today she walks us through what

alternative investing actually is the

28

foundations to have in place before

you start How she decides whether

29

or not a company deserves her money

30

And the secrets behind generational

wealth building through alternative

31

investing Help me as I welcome Porter

of Girl Math Capital to the dinner party

32

Porter: what is one assumption people

make about what you do, and what question

33

do you wish they'd ask you instead?

34

I almost don't even know if it's

a, a question I wish they would

35

ask, but I think that because

36

Capital has the na- has girl

in the name, and we focus on

37

investors and education,

but also deal flow,

38

people sometimes just zoom

in on the education piece,

39

and it sort of discounts the

rest of what's going on because

40

isolation, I feel like education is just

a tool, but you can't really do anything

41

with it unless you have opportunities.

42

I was thinking about this in

the car on the way over here of

43

a good comparison?

44

And what came to mind was

45

acquisition.

46

you learn a new language, but you don't

go out and practice it or use it and

47

apply it in different contexts and,

48

do things for you,

49

it doesn't actually do much as a tool.

50

And so I think just isolating

51

to, like, educating women on investing

52

can be slightly reductive for the work

that we're doing because in reality it's

53

actual investment opportunities

to the table and giving people

54

access to things that they

55

have previously to go alongside

that, so that you can do things with

56

the knowledge that you've gained,

'cause that's really the point, is

57

more access and more opportunity.

58

So

59

that is

60

big thing for me when I

think about what people maybe

61

don't get quite right off the bat.

62

I think that's a great answer.

63

I also think, like, yeah, education

without action is just knowledge, right?

64

guys are actually creating this,

65

like you said, in parallel

and this path for, all of it

66

to be incorporated together.

67

Because if you're not applying

it, it happens with anything, any

68

motor skill that you're doing.

69

talk about doing a cartwheel all you

want- … but if you're not practicing it

70

and actually, like, talking to people

who understand it and helping them,

71

getting feedback- Totally … which is

72

what you guys are doing.

73

So I think that's a perfect sort of

assumption and then the question that

74

you wish they'd ask you instead too.

75

Yeah.

76

So talk a little bit

about Girl Math Capital.

77

What are you guys building,

and who are you setting a place

78

for with Girl Math Capital?

79

. So Girl Math Capital is focused

on alternative investing, which is

80

basically investing in private market

assets, meaning it's pretty much

81

everything outside of the public market.

82

So

83

you think beyond your classic

financial baseline of what

84

people tell you to have set up,

85

it is investment opportunities

that are actually more risky

86

but are a higher reward.

87

And so the reason that we're

oriented around alternatives

88

is because that's typically where you've

seen historically people make real

89

wealth and generate future and income.

90

So we focus on alternatives-

91

Because of that,

92

we're specifically focused on

bringing more women into alternatives.

93

And so in doing so,

94

really trying to activate more

female investors and help them

95

create generational wealth.

96

to the previous point, it

is really not just about

97

it's about the outcome of what

you can do with that knowledge.

98

And so bringing as many women to the

table who want to be in charge of their

99

personal financial portfolios, how they

allocate capital, where their funds

100

go, and what businesses and opportunity

that feeds into, and ultimately how they

101

can create and capture their own wealth

and financial security for the future.

102

I think the origin of Girl Math

Capital is really cool, too.

103

So tell us a little bit about

how you and your two other

104

co-founders got started with it.

105

. So it's myself and two of my

best friends from undergrad.

106

We all went to

107

Vanderbilt University, same year,

108

and then kind of all went our

separate ways in our career paths.

109

And about almost three years ago

now, actually, which is really

110

exciting, I think November is the

formal anniversary of, of inception,

111

we were all separately trying to

figure out what our next steps were

112

in our personal financial landscapes.

113

I had started looking into angel

investing, which we can get into,

114

myself, and had uncovered

a couple opportunities,

115

but realized in the

process like, "Hey, this is

116

how to vet these things.

117

I don't really

118

who I can talk to about this,"

and was wondering what the

119

community looked like around that.

120

And similarly, my co-founders,

121

and Emma, I think were

having similar experiences,

122

that wasn't just angel, things like

123

real estate or looking into other

types of investment opportunities, and

124

realizing that

125

women around us weren't

having these conversations.

126

It wasn't that we were

127

missing ones with our peers,

they just weren't happening.

128

And,

129

tale, I think

130

happening with some men in our lives

and in their networks and opportunities.

131

And so

132

we were

133

just oriented around making

a group chat for ourselves.

134

So

135

structure was the three of us took

10 of our friends and put everyone

136

in a group chat and said, "Hey,

we're setting, you know, a target of

137

thousand dollars for this year."

138

I think it was 3K at the time of, we

wanna try and push ourselves to allocate

139

$3,000 each into investment opportunities.

140

But at the same time, we're

gonna bring in people to

141

be…

142

who are the experts

143

process,

144

us understand what we're

doing and why we're doing it,

145

and then also, you

146

can we go out and source

these opportunities.

147

So

148

first year was really fun 'cause it

was just a s- a small group getting

149

to know some of the initial women who

150

some of our, core content for our

educational curriculum for our members,

151

and then also foundationally setting

up how do we source opportunities?

152

How do we

153

putting our money to work?

154

Um, and at the end of the day, I think,

155

the funniest things that still happens is-

156

You get to this point where

you're like, "Okay, I found this

157

company I'm really excited about.

158

I wanna invest in them."

159

And you're like, "How

do I send them money?"

160

And it's like you're literally just

sending them a wire from your bank

161

account, and that never quite feels

162

It always feels, like, a little

bit like, okay, press go.

163

but yeah,

164

that whole process together I think

165

was, really nice, and then

166

that into what it is today afterwards.

167

I love also, when we initially

were talking about it, how you said

168

had just seen on a bunch of

169

people that you admired's

profiles on LinkedIn-

170

angel investor, and you're like, "I

171

wonder what that is.

172

I wanna be- Literally … a part of

that- Yes … and I wanna bring other

173

people in with me to learn along the way.

174

And

175

love that you called it,

176

a, group chat because I think

that's also what you guys

177

have this aura around Girl Math Capital.

178

Mm-hmm.

179

It's like it's super approachable,

friendly, like a friend girl chat.

180

Like- Totally … it just

181

started out for you guys, right?

182

Yeah.

183

Yeah.

184

No, I literally was looking around and

185

saw that in people's

bios and was like Okay.

186

Well, that feels like something

I should probably learn about

187

if you are talking about it,

188

it totally is a group chat.

189

I think that,

190

we've seen women

191

things in trusted communities,

and, like, that is really how we

192

grow and share knowledge as, as women.

193

That's really what we do, is

sharing it through p- trusted

194

networks, and so I think

195

analogy to the group

chat is very appropriate.

196

Talk to me a little bit about alternative

investing and get super tactical with,

197

is

198

the umbrella category of

alternative investing?

199

Yes.

200

So

201

investing is just an kind of a catch-all

phrase for a bunch of different assets.

202

When you think about general finance,

financial literacy, and what the average

203

person needs to be participating in,

I think what most people hear about

204

is stuff that's in the public market.

205

So

206

and bonds, um, and, you know,

cash equivalents and equities.

207

And so

208

types of things are what you are

sort of first foundationally exposed

209

to when you start learning about,

210

personal finance, and so that can mean,

211

a public company stock in a

brokerage account, whether that's

212

Merrill Lynch or Robinhood.

213

And then on the other side of the

equation is alternative, so things that

214

are technically classified as, like,

private market assets most of the time.

215

But alternatives is really just

a catch-all, as I mentioned.

216

It can include

217

real estate.

218

It includes funds.

219

It includes angel investing, which

is another thing that we do a lot of.

220

But it also can include

221

things like

222

in art or in collectibles.

223

Mm-hmm.

224

Like, all of those things, like, even

the Birkin that people always say is,

225

classic investment opportunity- … for

fashion, if you will, those are

226

technically alternative assets.

227

And so all of that together- Are things

kind of, as I mentioned earlier, that

228

with a heavier risk profile, but

ideally also a higher rewards profile.

229

And so being able to allocate,

230

actually is, like, 90% should be in

public markets and only, like, 10%

231

really should be in alternatives

because of that risk profile.

232

So you really should

have your bases covered

233

in the more traditional plays.

234

if you have, you know, the time

235

or the appetite or the funds to be

entering into something a little,

236

maybe a little bit more creative,

a little bit more adventurous,

237

that's really when alternatives

kind of come into the picture.

238

So talk to us a little bit about

those foundations that people should

239

have in place before they even

think about alternative investing.

240

You

241

for sure want to make sure that

you have su- no high interest debt.

242

I think student loans are typically

fairly all right if you've got

243

that under control, because

they're typically lower interest.

244

But

245

card debt, you definitely

don't wanna have that.

246

sure that you have established

247

a cash savings, your

emergency savings account.

248

You wanna make sure that you have

paid off as much as you can, you

249

know, debt and loans, as I mentioned.

250

then also investing

251

markets, in stock market, whether that be,

252

through single stocks or if you're

buying ETFs, which is a classic

253

helpful way to get access to a

bunch of different high quality,

254

high performing stocks in one.

255

then also looking at things

like your retirement account.

256

So if you are employed and have an

employer in a more corporate setting

257

that is offering you a 401, or if you

have the ability to contribute to an

258

IRA, I think making sure that you have

259

all of your security blankets set.

260

I think there's

261

a- an offense versus defense

way that you can look at it.

262

It's like, what are my

defensive structures?

263

Have I built

264

a fallback or a cushion that I know I

can access, and that I now am able to

265

go on the offensive because I have a

266

a good setup here for

me to be able to start

267

and also

268

with some of the risk I'm taking on.

269

Because at the end of the day-

270

I do think

271

the general recommendation is to

272

prepared to potentially,

273

that money that you've put in.

274

And so

275

n- it wouldn't be smart, for

example, if you've just started

276

your first job out of school to put,

277

of your money into private markets,

because you don't know what's gonna

278

happen there, and that could be valuable

time for you to build your foundation.

279

I think beyond

280

actual, like, things you need to

be investing in, there's also,

281

the mental outlook and the

appetite for the opportunity.

282

It's not something that's super

passively done yet , from my experience.

283

It's a bit more active.

284

You wanna be spending the time to

285

learn about the asset classes,

as we do with Girl Math Capital.

286

Get involved in a

community as well that can

287

help you understand different levels

288

of the, playing field there.

289

And then

290

making sure that you really candidly

have the time to allocate to this,

291

because you don't want to cause yourself

additional stress, honestly, by trying

292

to feel like you have to fill this gap.

293

And so

294

different

295

assets and alternatives that maybe can

help appease how you're feeling if you

296

wanna start with something that's

lower risk, shorter returns,

297

time, that kind of thing.

298

So

299

there's a lot of different avenues,

but I, I do think that the,

300

piece is also important.

301

need to be honest with yourself about,

302

money, upcoming goals, and if

now is really the right time.

303

And if it is, you

304

encourage people

305

communities like ours.

306

think that's a big one, because

307

mental side of even public market

investing- Mm-hmm … deters so

308

many people, women especially.

309

Totally.

310

Because I feel like it's presented as this

311

Just a large barrier to entry or so much,

312

like you said, active management needed

313

trying to think through

certain things, where,

314

investing can be as, you

know, pretty passive, right?

315

For sure.

316

Compared to, like you said,

317

investing and, and needing to do

318

different sorts of analyses on

different companies, especially

319

when it's more high-risk,

high-reward- Yeah … situations.

320

So I love that you touched on

321

side of things.

322

Are there any other barriers for

323

someone to

324

think about alternative investing?

325

I'm thinking, like, becoming

an accredited investor.

326

Yeah.

327

Mm-hmm.

328

Are there certain,

329

guardrails

330

that might

331

prevent someone from even going into

that option if they're not ready yet?

332

Yeah, totally.

333

Um, there are,

334

regulated in- investor protections,

as you mentioned, and being an

335

accredited investor is typically the,

sort of the token standard, I would

336

say, for a lot of private markets.

337

It's not for everything, but

for angel investing, for sure,

338

real estate, for sure.

339

And an accredited investor

effectively is just,

340

it's, a bit of a qualification that

signals both to you and to the company

341

or opportunity that you're putting

capital into, that effectively you

342

have reached a certain point in your

343

foundation or acumen that - qualifies you

to be participating in that opportunity.

344

So

345

qualifications and requirements, there

are three different ways that you can

346

primarily become an accredited investor.

347

first is through Series exams, so a

lot of the financial services exams.

348

65, for example, or the Series 7.

349

Those are

350

popular exams that a lot of folks

take in their, you corporate

351

roles that technically allow

you to become accredited because

352

this regulated exam and you now have,

353

to understand the, the risk

that you are taking on and what

354

the structure is behind that

355

The second is an annual

income for the past two years

356

of $200,000 as an individual

or 300,000 as a household.

357

And so that threshold is

more oriented towards,

358

your financial standing, making

sure you're not throwing away

359

you don't have already.

360

And the third is oriented around assets

and net worth, and so it's a threshold

361

of a million dollars of net worth.

362

And so-

363

That also can be for folks who maybe

364

an inheritance or

365

have found themselves in certain

situations where they've, uh,

366

encountered a lot of assets, um,

that are worth a lot of money that

367

them to, to be an accredited investor.

368

So

369

those are the standards right now.

370

There has been some conversation

at the federal level,

371

out of the White House

as well through, uh,

372

are some other ways that maybe

we could open this up a bit more.

373

And so there has been discussion

around a different type of test that

374

folks could take that's more general

purpose, because those series exams are

375

and not necessarily tailored

to the average individual who

376

maybe is just looking to invest

in private markets on their own.

377

So that is in discussion, but that, you

know, there's a long road ahead for that.

378

beyond that, though, there are platforms

who try to make these assets accessible

379

to folks who aren't yet accredited.

380

comes to mind, which is effectively

381

allows you to invest in private

companies, basically angel investing,

382

but the companies themselves that are

on the platform have a different…

383

they've registered differently such that

they can take unaccredited investors.

384

Mm.

385

It's more of a crowdfunding approach.

386

That's a really interesting option

for folks who maybe wanna start

387

evaluating and looking at an opportunity

at whatever stage they're at now.

388

And the same goes for some

alternative real estate platforms now.

389

There's a lot of fractional

products coming to market.

390

I can't think of any specific off the

top of my head that I can recommend, but

391

, those types of platforms are increasingly

available for folks who aren't yet fully

392

accredited and are interested at least

in starting to dabble and explore and

393

build up a few reps, even if you're not

actually deploying capital, but wanna just

394

dig into what the structures are and

what the products are that they're

395

offering so you can be prepared

once you do become accredited.

396

So you are an angel investor, and

with Girl Math Capital, I know

397

there are a lot of other people

interested in angel investing.

398

So what are some of your top tips

for angel investing, and what does

399

angel investing even look like?

400

. Angel investing broadly means that

401

you as an individual, I love

that it's called an angel because

402

complimentary.

403

You as an individual are putting some

of your money into a private company.

404

I think typically,

405

the

406

most effective angel investing strategies

happen if you're able to invest in

407

the company from really early stages.

408

The classic tale

409

really is the Peter

Thiel story, for example,

410

PayPal.

411

it's kind of a niche example, but

412

a bunch of his equity from

those businesses into an IRA.

413

So

414

it was a Roth, so it was gonna be totally

tax-free on the withdrawal when he

415

was of the appropriate withdrawal age,

416

ended up with quite a lot of

money from that experience.

417

So that's just, like, one example of how

418

in those opportunities can be really

helpful, and there's some cool structures

419

to help you protect that money.

420

angel investing broadly, again,

you know, you're putting your money

421

into these companies, and then

often in return you are able to,

422

offer strategic support

423

it's needed.

424

getting started,

425

in my own journey,

426

it's not necessarily something

that you can just, like, put

427

up a sign and say, "I'm here.

428

Give me opportunities."

429

there actually are,

430

You

431

restrictions on advertising investments.

432

So you won't see companies who are, are

fundraising and looking for investors

433

posting online typically being like,

"Hey, we're open for business,"

434

it makes sense.

435

You don't wanna be soliciting.

436

But at the same time, it

does mean that you have to

437

part of networks that will give

you access to those things.

438

So

439

one of the specific value

adds , that we have, is just

440

generally the ecosystem requires

441

some access to opportunities.

442

It is a little bit, not gate kept, but

there are barriers, as you mentioned.

443

And so

444

being able

445

, Join a community, is so important because,

one, it is access to opportunities,

446

two, it is being able to bounce your

questions and ideas off of your peers,

447

it's really getting to learn in a kind

of trial by fire scenario that just

448

de-risks some of the, maybe the personal

stress you feel for getting started.

449

But beyond that, I think something that

is really important to note is, you

450

is not a,

451

at the target once and

you get the bullseye.

452

multi s- multi-investment game.

453

sort of general,

454

g- guess for what the best number

is is around 30 investments.

455

Similar to what venture capital discusses,

the power law, they say it's around 30

456

investments for where you actually are,

457

hitting your home run from that mix.

458

And so

459

30 investments, you might see

460

20 of them fail, and eight of

them do okay, and hopefully

461

two are astronomical winners.

462

And so from that, that means, okay-

463

work backwards from a budget?

464

Where am I at today?

465

Okay, if I only have,

466

say, $10,000 for this year, it's

my first year angel investing,

467

maybe I wanna write five checks

this year, 2K each, and then,

468

in the next, I guess, four to five years

469

hit that 30, 30 investment target.

470

So I think approaching it

from a systematic perspective

471

can also be helpful because

472

you can get really excited about

things that you see and wanna move

473

really quickly, and then if you don't

factor in your budget, your timeline,

474

category relevance to other things you've

invested in, you can potentially end up in

475

a situation where maybe you're allocating

something that actually doesn't fit,

476

like, your overall portfolio strategy.

477

So I feel like those are probably

some of the, the biggest things, and

478

also similar to what I said about

479

Check sizes, please start small.

480

It is

481

not something where you need

to be writing a $50,000 check.

482

You don't even need to be

writing a $10,000 check.

483

My average check size is 2K right now,

484

because that allows me to,

what I was just saying, to

485

be able to hit,

486

critical velocity of deploying

capital into the right amount of

487

opportunities that will hopefully

put me at around that 30 target

488

within the next three to four years.

489

I feel like those are

my, my top tips for that.

490

You touched on some great things, and

491

I'm a physical therapist,

so I have this, like,

492

unique, I

493

to make to something that you said.

494

Yeah.

495

You mentioned the community

aspect of it, which is a huge

496

component of Girl Math Capital, but

497

other women involved in what you're

doing and being able to bounce

498

ideas off of each other- Mm-hmm

499

just what women do.

500

Totally.

501

And

502

showing in,

503

that,

504

flight response- Mm … they're

saying men more gravitate

505

towards that fight or flight,

506

women, we have that as well, but

sometimes in stressful situations, uh,

507

we veer towards a tend and befriend,

where we want to help others- Huh

508

and we wanna bring other people in.

509

I love that.

510

I've never heard

511

that.

512

So the fact that,

513

know, applying it to this scenario-

Yeah … because like you said,

514

a learning game, and you're gonna learn

from your successes and your mistakes, but

515

your mistakes are maybe gonna hurt a lot

more, and you wanna be able to have those

516

people in that community to say,

517

listen, it's a numbers game.

518

Like, 30 investments, it's okay.

519

You're gonna have a few

that fail, and that's okay."

520

100%.

521

But having that,

522

and befriend way of going

about it, especially for women,

523

I think that's super cool.

524

I love that.

525

I've never heard that.

526

that's so great.

527

That is so true, and I think also,

too, just the way that our community

528

and business is structured, we're

taking in new members all the time and

529

refreshing who is starting from zero,

530

we'll get- we've been

getting a lot of questions.

531

We just started a, our fourth

cohort, uh, at the beginning of

532

August, and we've been getting a

lot of questions that are sort of

533

fundamental questions, but they're

really good questions, and I see them

534

and I think to myself, " Okay, I gotta,

535

text my co-founders and figure out

which one of us wants to hop in there

536

and respond," and by the time I've

done that, someone else has responded,

537

it's another member who has,

538

gone through the process

and has the expertise.

539

I'm like, wow, that is

540

so great that

541

it's actually not having to come from me.

542

They don't need the founder of the

organization to chime in to get-

543

reputable or the correct information.

544

It's just

545

everyone else that's already

lived it can also share, and

546

so you're getting this variety

547

of perspectives and different

tidbits, and it's almost better

548

that I don't respond in a way

549

because it's letting other folks

550

show what they've learned.

551

So

552

that's been really nice.

553

And I also, I, yeah, I just, I've

never heard that before and I love it.

554

10 and befriend, yeah.

555

The other thing, too, is going back to

what you said initially about education

556

action, it's like there's the phrase,

557

l- learn it, do it, teach it or something.

558

Yeah.

559

So you guys are sort of fostering that

within your own community, where that

560

member felt confident enough, like

she learned it from somewhere, and and

561

then she probably analyzed it enough,

and then she taught someone else.

562

So- 100% … it's

563

what they're learning in Girl Moth

Capital, which I think is super cool, too.

564

Totally.

565

And I also think we are very, you know,

we have the cohort, as I mentioned,

566

which is really to our original point,

how we bring people in who are ready

567

to get involved in alternatives, but

maybe are starting from square one.

568

But we also have a ton of members

who work full-time in these roles,

569

who have the expertise, frankly,

570

cases more than I do, 'cause

it's what they live and breathe

571

every day professionally.

572

that is also

573

so great to have, because

574

there's a lot of role models and

575

very experienced folks in there who

576

are also being able to give back

based on what they've learned.

577

and so that's just been super

exciting to see as well.

578

I think as far as your tips

for angel investing goes,

579

the other thing that stuck out to

me that I think I wanna highlight is

580

how you

581

have this,

582

formula for your own, where- like

you said, even in public market

583

investing, you can get so excited

about- Yeah … one company, and

584

I'm sure the same thing happens in

angel investing, where you are like,

585

gosh, I love this founder.

586

I love the idea.

587

The, the opportunity seems right.

588

I'm gonna do all of my 10K or whatever."

589

Yes.

590

But having these, your own guardrails

in place, I think that's so

591

important to highlight as far as-

592

A tip for angel investing specifically,

because if you don't have these-

593

Yeah … guardrails in place, your

emotions can go off the deep end.

594

Oh my gosh, yeah.

595

And I also feel like there's something,

there's been something really amazing

596

about a lot of the deal flow that

we have seen, or the opportunities

597

that have come our way have been

598

consumer oriented in

CPG, which is really fun.

599

But

600

it, and it's, it's great for folks,

I think, in a lot of cases when

601

you're getting started to be able

to start your diligence process with

602

something you can taste, touch, feel.

603

But at the same time, I think

something that I- we've seen

604

and have realized as well is

605

just because you like a product

doesn't mean that it's a good business.

606

I think this applies

to public markets too.

607

I was thinking about this when we

were preparing for this conversation

608

of what were some examples of

things that, like, maybe I had,

609

in in the past that

actually didn't work out?

610

And two very big ones came to

mind that were towards the end

611

of my time in college, which

were Rent the Runway and Oatly.

612

Yes.

613

they both went public,

614

I was so fired up about both of them,

and there are sort of two major red flag,

615

or, like, a major red flag for each.

616

W- no shade to Rent the Runway, 'cause

I am a customer and I love it, but

617

one, their business model is just

not sustainable in any capacity.

618

They are constantly buying new inventory,

and it's deprecating over time,

619

whereas if you're doing resale, there's,

like, a curation aspect to it that just…

620

Particularly we've invested in now a,

621

rental platform called Isle of

Monday, which we love, but being able

622

to look at the differences between

623

two companies were structured,

'cause when they were fundraising,

624

they got so many questions like,

"How are you not Rent the Runway?"

625

really amazing answers on, like, why the

business was fundamentally different.

626

So

627

Rent the Runway, unfortunately,

628

a bad one for me personally

in the public markets, and

629

Oatly was riding a major trend.

630

trends can be dangerous, and they can

do really well, but it's also just,

631

like, super important to zoom out,

look at what's going on in the world,

632

and just kinda dig in on,

633

of, like, why you think

this is successful in

634

10 years plus.

635

I just think that,

636

in terms of tips and getting started

too, to your point on being excited,

637

it's notice what you're excited and

motivated about, and then go an extra

638

layer into, you know, why you should

still be excited about it enough

639

to put this much money into it.

640

IMG_8970: you mentioned

the word diligence.

641

Yeah . And

642

you've sort of thrown around a few

concepts that I think fall under that,

643

but I want you to explain what that means

a little bit more, how to know whether a

644

company is actually worth investing in.

645

Yeah, I, I mean, it's

exactly what you said.

646

Due diligence is really the process of

647

figuring out why this company or

opportunity is backable, and why, at

648

the end of the day, you think it's

gonna grow enough to return the money,

649

you know, to the nth degree , of

what you're providing.

650

So

651

there's a couple easy frameworks I

think folks can use to get started

652

thinking about evaluating businesses.

653

And

654

candidly, you're kind of due diligencing

all of your decisions on a day-to-day

655

basis, so , it's very similar.

656

, But for example, the

way we think about it is

657

, The team, the product,

658

traction, and the market, and then

the financials around the business.

659

So, you know, who are the

folks behind this company?

660

Do they have

661

experience in this industry before?

662

Have they been previous founders?

663

What are their potential motivations

for being involved in this product?

664

Do you think that their

665

skillsets will do really well for

what problem they're trying to solve?

666

Then there's the market.

667

Is this a super crowded space?

668

, I mentioned Rent the Runway.

669

I think adjacent to that

recently, we've seen a huge number

670

of just resell products coming

up or, and things like that.

671

And so

672

you might wanna consider,

673

is there enough space for someone

else to come in , and disrupt it?

674

, Is the market

675

big enough generally?

676

You could be the only player in

677

I don't know.

678

I can't name something random

like light bulb development.

679

I'm looking at these light bulbs outside.

680

But,

681

you know, i- is there enough demand

for, for light bulbs right now?

682

And things like that to help you

understand, okay, what is actually

683

the space of opportunity here?

684

Uh, also, is there a

685

giant incumbent in the market?

686

Is there a huge player who owns,

you know, 90% of the products

687

that people use in this space?

688

Like, can this team really

come in and disrupt it?

689

Then there's the product itself.

690

You know, is it good?

691

Would you use it?

692

Do you think it's effective?

693

, And at this point in time,

I think a lot of it is

694

how much of it is proprietary versus how

much of it is like a ChatGPT wrapper.

695

What, what is there beyond

just some AI application?

696

And those are all big questions around,

you know, w- how good is, is this product?

697

And like, will consumers

want to buy or use it?

698

I think I mentioned

the financials as well.

699

So

700

what is really the

strategy of the business?

701

How much money are they raising?

702

How much does it cost

to produce that product?

703

, Where do their costs seem to be going?

704

Are they gonna have to continue

to raise a ton of money to be

705

able to sustain a development?

706

Is it gonna cost them a lot

of money to acquire customers

707

is another really big one.

708

I think that's another…

709

If you remember Flip back in the

day, if anyone remembers Flip,

710

basically it was giving away free products

for inviting people to the platform.

711

My co-founder, Serena, made like

$2,000 by referring people to Flip,

712

and then never used the product again.

713

And that's a perfect example of like,

okay, yeah, you just paid for engagement,

714

and like, it worked out great for us, but

715

that

716

business is not going to be sustainable.

717

A- and then finally, you know what?

718

It's your traction.

719

Like, where are you right

now in, in the process?

720

If you are an angel investor and

you're new to angel investing,

721

you maybe wanna start with something that

has a little bit more initial traction,

722

something that already has customers,

already has sales, already has

723

partnerships or contracts for future

engagements, rather than something that

724

is, you know, from idea or inception.

725

And so

726

being able to look at

those factors and determine

727

What matters to you, I

think is also important.

728

At the end of the day,

729

regardless of what stage you're investing

in, you know, you're, you're pre-exit,

730

you're pre that big financial moment,

and so the company's not established yet.

731

So there are going to be

things that are not perfect.

732

And I think what we have seen,

733

and I found really interesting around sort

of the investing psyche in general, is

734

when is it enough to be okay with the

trade-offs and actually lean in on

735

all the reasons that you think this

company or, or business is going to win?

736

And so

737

knowing that at a certain point in

time, you kinda just have to say, "Okay,

738

this is what I think their opportunity

for growth is, or where I have concerns,

739

but I think they will actually win

because of these things instead."

740

So

741

diligence is, is a great

thing, and it's also really

742

awesome 'cause it's free

to do for the most part.

743

So if you're an aspiring

744

angel investor or you wanna do

something tactical after listening to

745

this episode, you can, you know, pick

out any company of your choosing and

746

kind of use that framework to practice

747

getting your thoughts on paper before

you're actually having to evaluate a

748

company that you might actually invest in.

749

It's something that a lot of folks who

are moving from non-traditional investing

750

roles into investing roles will do to

help get jobs, is, like, really work

751

on your reps for, for doing diligence.

752

So encourage folks to do that if they're

looking for something actionable.

753

it's very clear that you

deserve your seat at this table.

754

Would you say it was

755

earned, given, or built?

756

I, I mean, I feel like I have to

say we built it because it was so

757

… It just kind of came out of thin air.

758

And, and I don't even think that we

were looking for it in the same way.

759

Like, it was not that

760

… You know, o- obviously we noticed a

gap in the market when we launched,

761

but at the same time, it was really

762

for personal use.

763

And I think sometimes it's, like,

better to go in blind, like when you

764

don't know what you're up against.

765

Not that it has been some

excruciatingly challenging thing,

766

'cause it's honestly been so much fun.

767

But it is, it is interesting.

768

You know,

769

there was no one to hand this to me, so

there was no, there was really no way

770

to earn it.

771

Um, so I think you just have to build it.

772

If you're, like, looking for something,

I think you just gotta go do it, and

773

that's one of the, the best things about

774

the world that we live in today is

there's so much connective tissue

775

and so much access that you can,

776

you can just do things.

777

I love it.

778

I agree that y'all built it, and I think

779

the origins of Girl Math Capital

and what you guys have done

780

is evidence of that because you

didn't have the resources before,

781

and you went out, found them- Totally

782

earned them, you know, and built

it for not only yourselves, but for

783

others, which I think is so, so cool.

784

Thank

785

you.

786

So I've heard that

787

women might make better investors.

788

What are your thoughts on that?

789

Do you think that's true, and why?

790

You know, I've … There has been

some preliminary data coming out that

791

female funds are performing better

than some of their counterparties,

792

, Which obviously is super exciting,

and I'm, I'm thrilled to see that.

793

And in no way do I think it's

a competition necessarily, but,

794

you know, there is, to the, to

the diligence and to the point

795

on, like, knowing when enough is

enough, I do think that there is a

796

level of discernment that women have

innately that is super powerful, that

797

makes them really good investors.

798

, I think particularly mothers

who are making decisions all the

799

time for the wellbeing of their

families and their children,

800

you're just constantly

operating from a maximization

801

and protection lens.

802

And so I, I do feel like there

are some innate traits in the way

803

women operate that do make them

really, really good investors.

804

And I think really beyond

anything, it's just fun.

805

And this is what we talked about on

our walk a couple days ago, is just-

806

It almost, It doesn't matter because

I think the thing, the secret is

807

that it's just way more fun than

they want you to realize that it is.

808

Yes, yes.

809

122A3673: is

810

that it is.

811

IMG_8970: This is like a great, it's

a great thing to do because the,

812

the,

813

uh, like impacts of it are not just purely

814

financial.

815

And so when it comes to women being

better investors, I think that

816

women are more likely to invest

in things that will help us all.

817

And, you know, whether that is,

you know, we have a lot of folks

818

who invest for personal reasons.

819

Like one anecdote that comes to mind is

820

we worked with a, a, an incredible team

that is working on a metastatic cancer,

821

, In-home treatment drug.

822

So it's for patients particularly starting

with metastatic breast cancer to take

823

orally in the comfort of their own homes.

824

They don't have to continue to be

825

in the hospital.

826

You know, just you're already

sort of in a very tough place.

827

It's very nice- Mm-hmm … to be

828

in the comfort of somewhere

that you already know and love

829

rather than in a hospital bed.

830

And

831

one of our members like made the

decision to invest because she

832

had lost her mom to breast cancer.

833

And there are just things that you can do

to help create realities for other people.

834

In that case, her motivation was, "I

don't want this to happen to someone else.

835

I wanna be able to contribute to

a company that's building in a

836

space that I really care about."

837

And so I think-

838

, The betterness comes

from the fact that we can

839

repair issues that we see in the

world, and a lot of that, I, I

840

don't want people to think that it's

impact-oriented and not profit-driven,

841

because these businesses make money.

842

They make so much money, and they can

continue to be incredibly impactful

843

companies to support while also driving

real returns for their investors.

844

And so that's why I think,

845

you know, the explosion

in parenting tech and

846

women's health and all of these different

847

… I …Th-

848

even like the return to education,

and I feel like ed tech is about

849

to have its moment as well, is just

850

there are so many downstream benefits from

allocating our capital into these areas.

851

, And more women are more likely

to try their hand at it when they

852

have something to care about.

853

So

854

yeah, I think that there's a lot

of different reasons, but yeah.

855

I think that also goes back

to the tend and befriend.

856

You know, you're- Yes … tending.

857

, , Choosing where you're putting your

money is a way of tending towards

858

future generations- Absolutely

859

with what these companies

are building too, so.

860

Absolutely.

861

I also think there's a stat

that, like, 80-plus percent of

862

consumer spend is female, you know?

863

Oh, yeah.

864

So it's like we have this, like,

innate sort of, like, trend data-

865

100% … already that we're looking at

at the grocery aisles, at the Sephora

866

122A3673: Sephora

867

IMG_8970: counter, anywhere, and we're

like, "Okay, you know, what, what's…"

868

And we sort of know without

869

processing- Yes … what's anew,

what to look for, what's the

870

science-backed ingredients, what…

871

Like- Yes … all of these sort of

trends, I feel like we have this,

872

this viewpoint that we see every day.

873

Yeah, and that's, I mean, that's exactly

why more women should be investing in

874

alternatives in private markets, because

you don't have to just buy the product.

875

You can dictate what gets built

and what gets adopted and what

876

their strategic approach is, and so

877

that is just the coolest thing ever.

878

And so I think that's,

like, the secret, is just

879

there's so much more to it

than what I think the 30-second

880

descriptor is telling you.

881

Totally.

882

And this is where I'll leave you for

now because next up is the reason

883

the entire series is named Five

Seats, where she tells us the five

884

people she'd seat at her own table

885

You can hear who she chose,

plus the rest of our time

886

together on the Five Seats feed

887

Search Five Seats wherever

you're listening or click the

888

link in the show notes below

889

New Five Seeds episodes every Tuesday,

but I'll also see you guys again on the

890

next episode of Wellness Big Sis the pod