Today we meet author Leslie Kain, who was cursed with a subtle droll wit that even her husband often doesn't "get" as a joke.
Leslie has always been writing something, even as a kindergartener. Stories, riddles, plays, poems, inventions, secret plans. Culminating in running away across country at the age of fifteen, never looking back, which launched other adventures she won't divulge. Then with degrees from Wellesley College and Boston University, she had careers in psychology, government intelligence and nonprofits for mental health, during which her writing was limited to nonfiction. Eventually though, some complicated characters found their way out of her head into short stories published in journals and anthologies. More characters began pestering her with THEIR stories, expanding into novels about messed-up people and families whose greatest barriers to happiness lie within them. Very few of her stories end in Happily Ever After.
While Leslie's first novel sits on a shelf awaiting revision, her second novel, 'Secrets In The Mirror' was published by Atmosphere Press last September. Each of the four main characters in that story had to undertake arduous emotional journeys to personal transformation. Although not all of those characters' journeys were successful, Leslie didn't think the ending warranted a sequel. But her main character had other ideas, and now she's writing a sequel. Will there be a Happy Ever After?
Meantime, Leslie has an overstuffed folder of many story ideas awaiting her. But living in San Miguel de Allende, Mexico, an international mecca for history, music and all the arts, it's not always easy to find time to tackle all those new stories begging to be told.
You can learn more about Leslie -- and stay up to date on her new writing -- on her website https://lesliekain-psychfiction.com/, and by following her Facebook Author page https://www.facebook.com/Psychological.Fiction as well as on Instagram @leslie.kain and Twitter @lesliekainauth1
A little about today's host-
Author and musical composer Kathleen Basi is mother to three boys and one chromosomally-gifted daughter. Her debut novel, A SONG FOR THE ROAD, follows a musician on an unconventional road trip. Bestselling author Kerry Anne King writes, “In a novel filled with music, heartbreak, and surprising laughter, Basi takes us on a journey that encompasses both unimaginable loss and the powerful resilience of the human heart.”
Meaty, earnest, occasionally humorous, and ultimately uplifting, Kathleen’s fiction highlights the best within ourselves and each other. She writes monthly reflections on life, writing and beauty on her newsletter. Subscribe at https://kathleenbasi.substack.com/.
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Learn more about our hosts, the guests we've had, and their books -
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[00:00:24] Kathleen: Let me tell you a little bit about today's guest.
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[00:00:41] Kathleen: The novel deals with the challenge of finding one's own personhood in the face of domestic and narcissistic abuse. Indies today has said that the novel toes the fine line between sympathetic and terrifying. While US review a book says it successfully exposes the harsh truth about physical and emotional abuse, and its psychological effects on one's self-esteem, self-worth, and growth shaped by Kain's background in psychology.
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[00:01:41] Leslie: Glad to be here.
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[00:01:52] Leslie: Well, I'm living in San Miguel de Mexico. I'm originally from the us. I'm officially an expat.
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[00:02:16] Kathleen: It sounds wonderful and a lot warmer. A lot warmer than it is where many of us are right now.
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[00:02:26] Kathleen: So tell me something about you that other people would find hard to believe.
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[00:02:42] Kathleen: Whoa.
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[00:02:49] Kathleen: Huh. That's very interesting. So did you have a family connection to the mines, or was
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[00:02:59] Kathleen: All right. So let's talk about your book. This is a weighty subject matter. Tell me what was the hardest thing about it to write.
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[00:03:42] Leslie: I mean, you're supposed to love your brother and your, your identical twin. You're supposed to love your father. And so when your father tells you're a loser and your twin brother tells you the same thing, and then narcissistic abuse is a whole nother layer. Of, of abuse, uh, that denies the victim's, reality. And I haven't experienced the narcissistic abuse. And so it was hard for me to dig down into the layers of Gavin's psyche to represent that effectively on the page. And then of course, his twin brother. Narcissistic personality disorder. And I mean, we know people who have narcissistic personality disorder, don't we? And so, um, we know what it looks and feels and sounds and tastes like from the exterior. I also had two first person point of view chapters for each of the twins. And doing the first person chapter for Devin, the one with narcissistic personality disorder. Since I've never experienced that myself. That was a challenge, but you know, it was really kind of odd. Once I got into it, I found my vision, my words in that being almost as crazy as Devin. I mean, it's, it's just, it came out that way. So I surprised myself on.
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[00:05:46] Leslie: Oh yes. And that's totally the way it happened with Devin, because otherwise I would not have been able to, project what he really was like. After I finished one chapter in his voice, I turned to my husband and said, oh my God, I can't believe I did that.
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[00:06:16] Leslie: Well, I, I majored in psychology in Wellesley and I was sort of mentored by my abnormal psych professor, who was also the head of psychology at McLean Hospital, which is Harvard's, teaching hospital for mental health. And so she fast-tracked me to a certificate and I worked for a couple of years. The inspiration for this book- I know someone whose two daughters who were otherwise very close as they were growing up. They were only about a year or two apart, , but as they matured, the older one began having behaviors that were narcissistic, I mean, and there was gas lighting on her sister.
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[00:07:26] Kathleen: And what is it that you hope readers will be able to take away from this, cuz this is a, you know, this isn't, this doesn't sound escapist, it sounds like it has a purpose behind.
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[00:08:07] Leslie: Italian mob culture to his sons which then, made the twins Father Tony behave in mob, like ways . So he decided that one was going to be the winner and at all costs. Cheating, lying, whatever to be the winner, accomplishing things. No, no. You just have to be the winner by cheating and lying and being tough. And the other one had to be the wimp, the loser, to take care of the winner. And so it was a multi-generational. and this is not the only sort of sociopathic condition that is passed down in generations. There are other kinds of neurosis and behaviors, you know, dysfunctional behaviors that are passed down from generation to generat.
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[00:09:33] Kathleen: Mm.
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[00:09:54] Kathleen: So it sounds like you hope that this will have a positive impact on the world.
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[00:10:07] Kathleen: And probably just recognizing it. What we've learned in the last few years is that we all have mental health challenges. It's just a matter of how much, and sometimes you really just have to recognize it in order to start the process.
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[00:10:35] Kathleen: That's gotta feel.
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[00:10:38] Kathleen: So tell us where is the best place for people to come find you if they want to look you up or look up your book.
[00:11:17] Leslie: You know Barbara Claypole Whites books. Do such a great job of getting inside of the psychology of the characters.
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[00:11:32] Leslie: And her, I especially loved echoes of family. Now all her books are fantastic and each one of them successfully and, uh, realistically delves down into the psyche of people who have mental health disorders. So I think that has been the most inspirational for me.
