Today’s guest on the ADHD-ish podcast is my client, Anne Levine, a professional coach whose unique approach is centered around creating change that sticks. 

With a passion for integrating past successes into new ventures, Anne Levine specializes in guiding clients through the complexities of ADHD and personal growth challenges. 

For a number of reasons, many individuals with ADHD struggle with substance abuse, and achieving long term sobriety requires a deep understanding of not only how to change our beliefs and behaviors, but how to sustain them. With 30 years in recovery, Anne brings a profound understanding about achieving lasting change to her coaching practice. 

Because her background is so varied and her experience is rich, Anne was struggling to hone in on her specific niche and unique coaching framework.  As a former therapist with several careers under my belt,  who also has ADHD, I understood her challenge and knew exactly how to help her. 

And, I knew she was ready, when she said:

"I want to deliver something so clear so that my client can say, 'This is what I did. If you want to do this, talk to her.'"  Anne Levine 

📌 Key Insights

• Nailing the Niche:
• Anne initially faced confusion and shifts in focus. Her breakthrough? Realizing that her expertise in time and energy management—especially for those with long-term sobriety—was her true calling.
• Creating Legacy Work:
• To uncover our unique gifts and strengths, we need to avoid adopting someone else’s approach, which often lacks personal authenticity.
• Conviction in Coaching:
• Standing out long-term necessitates conviction. Establishing and understanding one’s “inner compass” leads to sustainable growth and genuine connections with clients.

To connect with Anne Levine and learn more about her work: 

Website -  Instagram - LinkedIn

Mentioned in this episode:   Dr Michelle Mazur - 3 Word Rebellion

Thinking about becoming one of my future Client Success Stories?  It starts with a free consultation to talk about our goals and challenges and to see if it makes sense to work together. 

No fee, no obligation, and you’re guaranteed to walk away with actionable insights,  whether we decide to work together or not.  No brainer, right?  Click here to find out more. 

And, don’t forget to rate and review and let us know your biggest takeaway from today's conversation!  

© 2025 ADHD-ish Podcast. Intro music by Ishan Dincer / Melody Loops  / All rights reserved. Outro music by Vladimir /  Bobi Music / All rights reserved. 

H: Today, I'm joined by one of my favorite clients, Anne Levine. And, honestly, I can only say I wished I'd hit record sooner because our pre chat has been fabulous, and I hope that we remember all the things that we have already said to include. I wanna set a little bit of a frame around this client success story because Anne and I had a very interesting time together. I will let her put it in her own words, but I think when I am working with someone who's coming out of being a therapist, and moving into coaching, or in Anne's case, had already done so. You were already a year into your business, oftentimes, we've sort of cognitively severed our connection to the identity of therapist, but we don't really realize how many of our biases and blind spots are actually still tethered to that identity. And I wanna start by unpacking this because you it's with me, I went immediately from being a therapist to being a coach. You had been a therapist many identities past, but it was still a big part of our work. So I'm gonna let you take it from here.

G: Thanks, Diann. Yeah, I didn't realize that the main language I spoke was therapist language. And so all the different, professional identities I had and career and iterations, I was able to have that language and it was okay because I was doing something very different. So whether it was like personal training, even being a triathlon coach, an executive director of a nonprofit, it didn't matter, but it wasn't such a big deal. And I knew I wasn't a therapist like, I'm one of those rule followers. I like people to have real good boundaries. I don't like therapists talking about themselves. And so it was I thought it was kind of wrapped up and it was a beautifully, uncomfortable surprise in the work that we did that there was some, unraveling to do that I didn't even realize.

H: You're you know, it's funny because I think one of the things we bonded over very early on, even, in the consultation before we decided to work together, was how both of us feel, Anne, about the therapy field and about the coaching industry. There's a lot of crappy, but well meaning therapists out there. There's a lot of slimy, but well meaning coaches out there. And I think one of the questions I have been asked most often in the 7 plus years since I made that transition myself is, why did you do that? Like, why would you do that? Why would you stop being a therapist and become a coach? And then the follow-up question is, what's the difference? And I think that is sort of like the crux of the matter because it doesn't have to be therapy to be therapeutic. I have said many times that some of the world's greatest therapists are bartenders and hair designers.

Because it's an intimate relationship, 1 on 1. You're sitting together, you have some time. You feel, you know, connected, and you just start to talk. And, of course hair designers and bartenders are not trained as therapists. And most triathlon coaches and nonprofit directors aren't either. But you're right, that understanding of human behavior and human nature and human emotions and interpersonal relationships and cognitive dissonance and all that stuff absolutely worked its way into all of your previous professions and callings and vocations and paths. But we, I have to say you were so shocked to shit, but you were also really open to the wrecking ball that I brought to our relationship in really a beautiful way because sometimes we're not ready when we ask for something. But I really felt you were, it was not easy, but you were ready.

G: Yeah, absolutely. And I've told so many people that y'all just that you brought that walk down, the like I said, big D energy. You brought it, like, in such a way that was, oh my god, so uncomfortable and so necessary. I didn't realize, you know, I've done a lot of work, been in therapy for 30 years, done my work, so I kinda wasn't expecting it. But I knew that we were I knew we were gonna connect, and it was more than just like, you have a potty mouth, I have a potty mouth, we both cuss. Like, we're kind of casual about that, but it was, this sort of straightforward approach that is in the service of the greater good, and I so appreciate that about you. And that's what I feel about myself as a coach and as a therapist.

I felt that and that it was important for me to get really clear that, what I'm able to deliver, like, really nail it. And what I can deliver on, and what is within my scope, and keep it real clean that I can deliver on and what do people want. You know, I brought a lot of skills into it, and, I had to get clear, I'm like, what am I actually delivering on? I had a real tough few weeks with you, where I went back and I read through all my old testimonies that were beautiful. They people, people liked me. It was great.

H: They loved you.

G: But what I was looking for was, what are they walking away with? You can have a really powerful experience in therapy and walk away with sort of this sort of, like, just sparkling, you know, magic. But I feel like with coaching, and that's what I like about coaching, I want to deliver something very clear so that the person can say, this is what I did. If you want to do this, talk to her and I didn't know that was gonna happen. And it was rough to see that, yeah, I was a good coach and, people appreciated the work, but that I really needed to get clear on what it is I'm delivering for my own sake and my own protection, my sort of dignity and respect, and also for the safety of clients and, not, you know, the main language I speak is therapy language, even if I'm just talking casually. And so to really get, kinda dial that in and make sure that what I am putting out there is aligned with what I'm offering, because I was doing therapy language and attracting some people that needed to go to therapy and was referring them on. Now I'm clearer in what I'm offering, and I'm getting the people who want that, who I've already done some work in therapy.

H: This is some of the hardest work any of us will ever do, and it's something that you and I have talked about and I've talked about on this podcast and elsewhere that I think when your path is one of continuous personal evolution, and I think many women with ADHD and ADHD-ish traits, it's not a choice. It's not a freaking preference. It actually makes life so much more challenging and painful. But when your path is the path of continuous personal evolution, it, I think, is so helpful to know that there are other people who have gone through that before you, who can hold space for you to go through it, who can witness you struggle and not capitulate, not backpedal, not say, well, you know what?

It's okay, why don't we just do this like, am I gonna get there? And I think because I have gone this road, and I know, your path is not identical to my path. No one's path is identical hungry for this breakthrough, and you were so committed to working clean. You even use the same language that I like to use. Like, I think about it as we're constantly cleaning our instrument because we are our tool. We are our own tool so if we're not respectful of the boundaries between therapy and coaching, if we are not focused on tangible outcomes and not just feel goods, we do our clients a disservice. We misrepresent the coaching industry like so many others.

And I think for us now at this after having done so much work and really at being at this stage of life also to do work that's sustainable, we gotta have a clean instrument. We gotta stay in our lane. We gotta know what our fucking lane is, have really good boundaries, and understand how incredibly powerful that is that we don't deviate. So, naturally, that's gonna be uncomfortable. And frankly, few people have or will do it. So one of the things that we, went through was it was like, I was getting a little bit dizzy, had a little bit of whiplash there.

Felt like it was like the infinity loop that just goes around. We circled our and I don't even love the term niche, Anne. But we'll use that because it's a term people are familiar with. Early on in our work together, it seemed to me like your niche was clear to both of us. I know you're laughing. You can laugh, it's okay. I'm not gonna cut this out of the way. This is an important part of the story. And then it's like you kinda went somewhere else, and you kinda came back and it was like, I felt like we're playing 4 shoes. Can we talk about that a little bit because I think this is so frustrating and so relatable.

G: Yeah. gosh. That was real hard. Because I came into the work with you ready to focus. I was ready, and I was gonna make some action. I was gonna impress you even, like, I was gonna get this shit done. Well, when I found myself, you know, going from one week to the next and being like, oh, I think I wanna work with zebras. No, I wanna work with orangutans. You know, it just was it was so frustrating for me. I couldn't it was like I was I've never ice climbed, but I was ice climbing. I couldn't get that accent. I couldn't get stuck. And the reason I wanted to work with you and the reason why the work with you worked was, I can kinda bullshit other people.

I can sort of do a more, like, kind of hypnotize them with my teeth or something, you know, with a big smile. And I knew I couldn't do that with you and so I knew it wasn't just gonna be like, oh, honey, that is frustrating, isn't it? But it was gonna be like, you know, there was gonna be some, compassion, but also some directness of like, make me deal with it. Like, no, we're gonna sit down, and we're gonna get this nailed down. And you had said something so beautiful at the beginning. That was, what are you uniquely qualified to deliver on? You may not have said it that way.

H: I think I did, I said that I uniquely qualified.

G: Yeah, and I probably added the to deliver on. And honestly, like, because, working with people is an area of my life where I feel great confidence and, joy, but confidence. And I'm sort of like, well, lots of things, you know, let's make a list. And that's why it was hard is because I do have the ability to work with people on different things. But it was, what do I want to do? What am I qualified to do? What is within the scope of coaching to do? What is something I'm interested in? And it was just like, we've got to sweep away the debris of just because you're good at something means you should do it. You've got to have a sense of discernment.

I don't know what the work is and that's what we did is we, we got real specific, and I would put my foot on the gas and then pull up the emergency brake, try to turn left, you know, try to do all this wiggly, wacky stuff. And, but I do feel like we've landed somewhere, and I left our work with a framework for the work I do. And it's still you know, it's gonna grow. I'm now in a year and a half now, and it's gonna grow, it's gonna develop. And I always knew that more will be revealed. I trust the process in life and in business. And so yeah, but it was painful, Diann. It was hard and, you know, it's good.

H: Here's the thing. Well, I think that's it's one of the reasons why I was eager to have you as a guest because I think it's also something we've talked about in the past that there are far too many coaches who basically say, come on in, the water's fine. And who represent both the coaching industry and the work it takes to build a successful coaching business as easy, fast, fun, lucrative AF, virtually passive, anyone can do it, almost in your sleep, the laptop lifestyle. And it's like, you know, I think there are plenty of people out there who sell that view. Largely because they are offering themselves as someone who will help you get there, and all you have to do is do what they do. But I don't want to clone myself.

I am not interested in telling people, well, this is how I made the transition from therapist to coach. So I want you to follow my 57,000 step system exactly the way I did it. Well, you're not me, so why would you wanna do that? It's like, I very deeply believe that you have the answers in you, but there's a lot of excavation. And it's I think there it's something I will I talk about some cost fallacy a lot, Anne, but it's not just that. It's that you come to a stage of your life, the stage you and I are both at. Some people call it the crone stage. I don't really like that word, but I get what they mean. The wise women stage right? You've learned so much.

You've experienced so much. You have so much wisdom to offer that you really it's really hard not to want to include that when you are shaping your legacy work, when you're shaping the work that you want to be known for, like you say, you're casting your little, you know, your Barbie net. It's like, this is the work I want to be known for. This is the work I am uniquely qualified to do. That means you're going to have to release a lot of things that you have done, a lot of experience you've acquired and it's your zone of excellence. It's not your zone of genius. The work you are uniquely qualified to do is in your future. And that process of letting I honestly don't know how people do this on their own because it's pain. It's painful to let go of things that are meaningful and helped us become who we are.

G: Absolutely. It's just like a construct of identity that I didn't know I was holding on to. I was like, I'm a therapist. I may be working this way, but I'm a therapist and it was a relief. The process was hard, and I felt like you were right there with me. I felt like you were gonna be, in the way that I wanted, kinda in my face, not in a, you know, gross, like, I won't say any name like not in but just in a really direct way that I wanted. But I knew I was gonna get through it, I knew I had to. I mean, that's the thing I think about this phase in my life and that you alluded to is like, oh, we're done jacking around. I thought I was done jacking around in my forties or what no, it was actually not. So anyways, it was painful, but it was also a relief.

Okay, finally. Because I was really aware that, I had an albatross, like, several around my neck, and it was stinky. And I wanted somebody to help me figure out, like, how to get rid of it. And so, yeah, I have felt since we wrapped up our work, I felt free. It's not like it's been, you know, I've built a palace overnight, at all. What I've had is a sense of, that inner compass that is the only way I know how to embody what I'm doing. And, you know, I've sort of gained some footholds, like those little ice climbing things to be able to figure out, okay, well, these are my people. Maybe there's only 10, there's more than that.

H: No, there's a lot more than that.

G: Yeah. Yeah. But here's what I do, how I do it, and you said something so good. I've heard it on your podcast too. You said, if you don't do this, every person you work with is going to be your boss, like, that was profound to me. If you don't get clear on what you're doing and how you're doing it, every person you work with is gonna be your boss. And at first, it didn't make sense because I'm very service oriented and very much, like, love making people's day.

I love surprising people with, you know, making them feel good. But I'm doing this because I'm done working for people, and I decide how my business is run. I decide how we do it, because this is how I can best help that person as opposed to, me coming like, each week because somebody different is coming in. Well, let me think about a program that might support them, you know, doing this thing and then the next person comes in, and it's exhausting. It's so exhausting. And so to get clear, this is what I do, this is how I do it.

And we're gonna, like, I felt like, stick it and for walk away. Like, we are going to land on this to change your mind later, but you're gonna stick it. Walk away now and do the work. And so that was all you know, that was great. I want everybody to be able to have that in their life with their business, no matter what their business is. But just say, quit, doing that roulette wheel of trying to figure this out. Just land, go. Move on, do the work now.

H: That’s such a beautiful way. I don't think I've ever heard anyone explain how I work in quite that way. And I think one of the reasons why I really enjoy working with people like you who have diverse and vast experience. Some people refer to themselves as polymaths, multipassionate, multipotentialate. It's not scary or off pointing to me that someone's had multiple careers, because they truly believe there is no through line. There's no way to simplify this. There's no way to condense this down to just one thing. I have all this experience for a reason.

I want to use it all. Why the fuck would I wanna forsake any of this juicy wisdom? It's like, well, if you intend to market yourself online, you're gonna have to. Now if you happen to live in a small town with people with a bent towards personal development and plenty of resources, and you're willing to do a lot of in person networking and constantly work on getting what you do and how you do it, and the fact that you're literally a fucking wizard. You're a genie. You're a ninja. There is you can literally you're like, Gumby. You then me, shape me how you want me.

You need it, I can do it, just watch me. I used to be so proud of being that person. I used to think whatever they need, if I don't already know how to do it, I will figure it the fuck out. In fact, people used to refer clients to me saying, I know you don't work with this kind of client, but I know you, and you will figure out how to serve them to the highest degree so here you go. And I'm like, who does that? But if you wanna market yourself on the Internet, like the pride of being that person who can literally work with all kinds of people in all kinds of different ways. Have that pride and then bless and release it. Because if you want a business that's portable, if you want a business that doesn't require you to get dressed every day and go out and pound the pavement, if you want a business that allows to manage your energy, work from home, and not constantly spend time, you know, working your referral network.

You have to stake a claim. You have to pick something and then get really serious. Someone I interviewed recently used the word conviction and I kept thinking about that afterwards. It's like, just because you can doesn't mean you should. And where I was guiding you was to a place of conviction where you were like, yes, I have done many other things. I could continue to do them, but I have conviction that this is what I meant to do now. And that crystal freaking clarity means you will be able to be found and hired. You will stand out. You will be sought after because you're deciding and declaring that you want to be known for this very specific thing. Can we talk about what that thing actually is?

G: Yeah. But I gotta say something, I thought when you got to that place where you say, this is what I do and how I do it and stuff, that it was gonna be like a spiritual moment.

H: It could be.

G: It was gonna and it could be, but I thought it was gonna be of a different variety. It was I had to get real quiet, stop talking to people all the time about what it is I'm doing, how should I do it? Because people who knew me were like, well, don't nail it down so narrow because but they're not trying to hustle a business online and, you know? So, I mean, it was like a spiritual process of the most ordinary kind. Like, not no burning bush…

H: No angels sings.

G: It was, no. Not at all. It just was like and still, I you know, it's kinda hard to get my hands around. But I thought it was like, oh, we're we have to get into, like, what if I uniquely qualified and, like, then the angels sing and then I tell you. That's not it. So what I'm doing is, helping people reshape, restructure their time, their energy so that they can make change that actually sticks. I find that people kinda get tunnel vision. Maybe they've had success in one area of their life.

They're rocking it, and then you look just a little beyond that and things are kind of a wreck. And it looks different for everybody. I think the real specialization that I have is people who have long term sobriety, people who have, done their own work. They don't necessarily have to be in recovery, but people who've done the work, they've invested in themselves, but they're like, what the fuck? Why can't I get this change to stick? I've been there, I go there. I know it, and I bring my, you know, professional training. I've been trained as a coach, as a therapist, all that life stuff, my personal experience. And, yeah and it's great work, I'm loving it. I love it.

H: I love that tagline so much and, like, change that sticks. That's, like, you know, my friend, Michelle Mazur, who's a communications coach and a former professor of communications, Doctor Michelle Mazur, she has a book and teaches, and her framework is called the 3 Word Rebellion. And when you think about, like, Black Lives Matter and there's, like, the 3 word change that sticks or make change stick. Well, you remember how enthusiastic I was about that during our work together. Like, that's probably one of my favorite fucking taglines ever. Because as neurodivergent humans, one of our biggest and most consistent pain points is that we can make a change, and it usually lasts somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 weeks.

And then we go that change goes slip sliding away. It gets hard. It gets boring. We hit our goal, and now we wanna do something else. But making the kind of changes that really move the needle, that really advance your game piece, that really fucking change your life, and then making it sustainable, that's a whole other level of change that I think is especially suited to people who have already made massive changes and sustain them like people with long term sobriety. But it's like that missing piece that not only allows you to reach your goal, but to live there on an ongoing basis. I love that for you.

G: Oh, thank you. Yeah, it is a to see people go from I'm this, you know, this thing that I've had one success in like, for me, I'm a recovering alcoholic, and look how long I've been sober, and look how great my but you know what I was doing last night? Last night, I was practically crying because social media is this beast that is, like, so much bigger than I can imagine, and I've been offline living in a cave for 30 years. And so I have, like, a faulty transmission, that's what ADHD feels like. I make some progress, I slip out of gear. And so that's what I see in my clients, same kind of process.

Like, you've got success. You could be, maybe a lawyer, doctor, a mom, a dad. You've got the success, and that's all you kinda are like, look, this is me and you're kind of a one act deal. I like helping people bring that power, that mojo that I mean, you know you're powerful when you can achieve things, and to bring that into these other little those yucky, icky little areas that are really bringing us down and really causing doubt and are a real bummer. They're not always the biggest things, but they're the things that I think are the biggest bummer. You know, the chaos, the confusion

H: The disorganization. Actually, I think every person with ADHD needs this because we often wear a mask because even the parts of us that are really presentable, the parts of our shit that we actually have together or at least appear to, and that's what we wanna lead with. And then our belief about ourself is, yeah. But if you followed me home and you saw what a disaster, you know, my money situation, or if you only knew what a shit show my relationships are or whatever.

It's like, it prevents us from not only being fully actualized, but it even prevents us from being honest with ourself and others because we're always hiding something and living in the fear of being found out. So this ability through your process and what you've learned and taught yourself and experimented with and perfected over time is like, no. You it's not enough to just have a good cover story. You wanna be able to create changes and know that it's it was worth the time and trouble and effort and expense to change because you know they're gonna last.

G: What I wanted was somebody to just take me and shake me, not in a way of like, you fool, why can't you get this? But in the way of like, you're strong, you're powerful. What are you doing you know? It was great.

H: I wanted it for you. I wanted it.

G: Thank you.

H: This is why I choose to work with the people I choose to work with. We can't do this for ourselves. And I love knowing that I can help somebody crack open and spill the best of their juicy goodness, some of which they don't even yet know exist, like, that's what I live for. We had a fantastic experience and, we will be staying in touch, my friend.

G: Wonderful. Thank you very much.