Automation is a process that helps in achieving a goal or task without the need for human intervention. Though it has become more mainstream in recent years due to its ability to reduce costs and increase productivity, it can also have a negative impact on the business if not implemented properly. It is easy to lose the human connection and rapport needed to build a loyal client base. Join this conversation with Kay Peacey and learn how to be more human in your business automation

Kay is a Certified ActiveCampaign Consultant and the official ActiveCampaign super-user. She is also a world-leading ActiveCampaign training specialist, with 1000s of businesses who have relied on her for help with their ActiveCampaign accounts. And because Kay is a lifelong teacher, her joy comes from empowering businesses to fix these problems themselves, so they can manage their own ActiveCampaign accounts confidently and successfully without losing the human touch in the automation process. This is a conversation you do not want to miss!

Let’s jump in!

What You Will Learn:

00:00 This week’s theme song

00:24 Episode intro and a quick bio of the guest, Kay Peacey

03:39 Kay’s backstory and how she came into the active campaign 

05:27 Finding your purpose

06:09 Starting your business, whether you are 16 or 61

08:12 What is automation when it comes to business 

10:06 Examples of automation that businesses can look at

12:07 The dark side of automation

15:48 Doesn’t automation put a barrier between us and our audience? 

21:04 The differences that Kay brings in her client’s businesses

27:22 Check everything. Automation fails!

29:32 Why Kay loves active campaigns and the need to embrace it 

33:06 The best ways to reach out and connect with Kay

36:23 Ending of the show

Helpful Resources:

• Video Engagement Platform
• Text Expander and Autofill
• ActiveCampaign

Show Notes

iag.me/198

Please Subscribe!

Don’t miss an episode! You can subscribe on Apple podcasts here - or on other podcast players.

The Confident Live Marketing Show

The Confident Live Marketing Show is a weekly live video show and podcast. It’s aimed at established entrepreneurs who want to level up their impact, authority and profits through the power of live video, webinars and podcasts. We’ll focus on knocking down the 3 main barriers these entrepreneurs face when creating live content - camera confidence/mindset, tech/gear and content marketing.

It’s hosted by Ian Anderson Gray. He is the founder of the Confident Live Marketing Academy and is the host of the Confident Live Marketing Podcast. He helps entrepreneurs to level up their impact, authority and profits by using live video confidently. He’s founder of Seriously Social - a blog focused on live video and social media tools. He’s an international speaker, trainer, teacher and consultant. He has a passion for making the techno-babble of live video and social media marketing easy to understand. As well as being a geek, husband, and dad to two kids, Ian is also a professional singer and lives near Manchester in the UK.

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacy

IAN: 00:00:04

I wanna be more human

IAN: 00:00:07

With automation

IAN: 00:00:10

Automation

IAN: 00:00:12

Be more human

IAN: 00:00:14

We wanna be more human

IAN: 00:00:17

with automation

IAN: 00:00:19

Kay Peacey is coming on the show today

IAN: 00:00:22

To show us how!

IAN: 00:00:24

Welcome to episode 198 of the Confident Live Marketing Podcast.

KAY: 00:00:29

Automation is a tool that takes businesses from

KAY: 00:00:31

drowning an admin to serenity.

KAY: 00:00:34

That's its main purpose.

KAY: 00:00:36

And the bottom line is that many tools are better at getting stuff done.

KAY: 00:00:40

That's a repeating process.

KAY: 00:00:42

Tools are much better at doing that than humans, and that goes

KAY: 00:00:45

right back through history.

IAN: 00:00:47

In today's episode, we're talking about being more human with automation.

IAN: 00:00:52

I got a fabulous guest today joining me to talk about this subject, Kay Peacey.

IAN: 00:00:57

Let's get on with it right now.

Voiceover: 00:01:05

Welcome to the Confident Live Marketing Podcast with Ian Anderson Gray.

Voiceover: 00:01:10

Helping you level up your impact, authority, and profits through

Voiceover: 00:01:14

the power of confident live video.

Voiceover: 00:01:16

O-o-optimize your mindset and communication, and increase your

Voiceover: 00:01:20

confidence in front of the camera.

Voiceover: 00:01:22

Get confident with the tech and gear, and get confident

Voiceover: 00:01:25

with the content and marketing.

Voiceover: 00:01:27

Together we can go live.

IAN: 00:01:30

Well, hello.

IAN: 00:01:32

Welcome to episode 198 of The Confident Live marketing show

IAN: 00:01:36

as we march up to episode 200.

IAN: 00:01:39

In fact, we've only got one more show before that big event.

IAN: 00:01:43

And as I said last time, last week we're going to have a little bit of a holiday.

IAN: 00:01:47

So just to warn you, the idea is we'll have episode 199 next week, and then after

IAN: 00:01:53

that, what I'm going to be doing is some audio only extra episodes on the podcast.

IAN: 00:01:59

So if you haven't come across the podcast, you need to go to iag.me/podcast.

IAN: 00:02:06

You can follow and subscribe in your favorite podcasting app.

IAN: 00:02:10

So it is time to bring in my guest for today who is the fabulous Kay

IAN: 00:02:16

Peacey, who is a world leading email marketing automation expert with

IAN: 00:02:21

Ninja ActiveCampaign skills, years of email consultancy practice, and

IAN: 00:02:26

a lifetime of teaching experience.

IAN: 00:02:28

She's the founder of Slick Business and runs the ActiveCampaign Academy.

IAN: 00:02:33

Welcome to the show, Kay.

IAN: 00:02:36

There we go.

IAN: 00:02:42

As the crowds die down, calm down crowd.

IAN: 00:02:47

I know.

IAN: 00:02:47

It's exciting to have Kay here.

IAN: 00:02:49

Welcome to the show.

IAN: 00:02:50

So, you are dialing in from sunny Cornwall and we met back in November last year,

IAN: 00:02:59

and it was great to see because I've seen you around on the socials and whenever

IAN: 00:03:05

I do a little search for ActiveCampaign.

IAN: 00:03:06

ActiveCampaign is email marketing software, we can talk a little

IAN: 00:03:09

bit more about what that is.

IAN: 00:03:10

But every time I was searching for a question about it,

IAN: 00:03:14

your name popped up always.

IAN: 00:03:15

Then I joined your Facebook group.

IAN: 00:03:18

Just love what you teach there.

IAN: 00:03:20

So how did you get into all of this, Kay?

IAN: 00:03:24

Because ActiveCampaign has not been around forever.

IAN: 00:03:28

It's not been around for the whole of your life.

IAN: 00:03:31

How did you get into this?

IAN: 00:03:33

I'd love to know.

KAY: 00:03:34

Yeah, it definitely hasn't been around for the whole of my life.

KAY: 00:03:36

Like literally the internet wasn't around then.

KAY: 00:03:39

Or computers for that matter.

KAY: 00:03:40

So, how did it all happen?

KAY: 00:03:43

I started out as a teacher.

KAY: 00:03:45

So, I was a trained teacher and did that for a while.

KAY: 00:03:48

Then I had kids, and then in my mid forties, I was hanging out after school

KAY: 00:03:58

with my friend Melissa Love, who runs the marketing fix in the design space.

KAY: 00:04:02

And at this time, I hadn't seen under the hood of a website, I'd

KAY: 00:04:05

never heard of ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:04:06

Nothing.

KAY: 00:04:07

And literally Melissa looks at me over the table and says, "You seem

KAY: 00:04:11

like a smart person and I can't find anyone to come and work this bit of

KAY: 00:04:14

software for me called ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:04:16

Would you wanna run at it?"

KAY: 00:04:18

And I said, "Hmm, okay, that sounds like fun.

KAY: 00:04:20

Let's do it."

KAY: 00:04:21

And what happened was, it just turned out to be my happy place.

KAY: 00:04:27

Automation and email marketing sits in this sort of sweet spot where it's very

KAY: 00:04:30

human and it's about communication, but it's also problem solving.

KAY: 00:04:34

It's like picking away a puzzle.

KAY: 00:04:36

It's also great for people who like efficiency because if you are lazy and

KAY: 00:04:40

you want stuff to be done on autopilot, that really works in there as well.

KAY: 00:04:44

So it just really suited me like, duck to Otter.

KAY: 00:04:48

And then Melissa started hooking me up with other people who needed

KAY: 00:04:51

more help with ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:04:52

The demand was there.

KAY: 00:04:54

What can I say?

KAY: 00:04:55

I ended up teaching a lot of people how to use ActiveCampaign, and

KAY: 00:04:58

here we are five years later on.

KAY: 00:05:01

I live and breathe automation with ActiveCampaign to make email

KAY: 00:05:05

marketing work better for people.

KAY: 00:05:06

I don't honestly know what I would've been doing otherwise, so thank

KAY: 00:05:09

you after school Spanish Club for bringing that conversation to me.

IAN: 00:05:14

Isn't that amazing?

IAN: 00:05:14

I love to hear stories where people have found.

IAN: 00:05:18

Would you describe that as your purpose or it's something

IAN: 00:05:20

that definitely excites you?

IAN: 00:05:21

It's something that it is the right place for you.

IAN: 00:05:24

This is the

KAY: 00:05:25

right

IAN: 00:05:25

thing right fit.

KAY: 00:05:26

It's like a meeting of unicorn potential and the need for the unicorn.

KAY: 00:05:31

Honestly, the serendipity is astonishing to me and the privilege of having that

KAY: 00:05:37

happen in my life at a latest age in life.

KAY: 00:05:40

I'd already done raising my kids, life stuff had happened.

KAY: 00:05:43

I thought I was going to just sit around in Cornwall not doing much, and here

KAY: 00:05:47

I am, and I get to speak to people all over the world every day and work

KAY: 00:05:52

with them on their amazing businesses.

KAY: 00:05:54

It feels like a huge privilege and a huge piece of serendipity to me.

IAN: 00:05:58

I That's exciting.

IAN: 00:06:00

We're not going to talk about this today, but I've been feeling this for a while,

IAN: 00:06:04

that this is a topic that I want to bring some guests to talk about, which is

IAN: 00:06:08

there's this mistaken view that business or running your own business is for people

IAN: 00:06:12

in their twenties and thirties and if you're in your forties or your fifties,

IAN: 00:06:15

you're almost like you had your chance.

IAN: 00:06:19

But it's so wrong.

IAN: 00:06:21

You've missed the chance.

IAN: 00:06:23

I feel like now I'm starting to get somewhere.

IAN: 00:06:26

I feel like,

KAY: 00:06:27

Oh my

IAN: 00:06:27

know?

KAY: 00:06:28

Me too.

KAY: 00:06:29

For me, I was disabled.

KAY: 00:06:31

I'd had multiple bereavements in my family.

KAY: 00:06:33

I hadn't worked full-time for over 20 years, so this is not something I saw

KAY: 00:06:39

coming, but it is something you have to be open to when it presents itself.

KAY: 00:06:43

Because does require a lot of effort to push through that open

KAY: 00:06:46

door and make it happen as well.

KAY: 00:06:48

But yeah, definitely the possibility is there.

KAY: 00:06:51

And, of course, it's a lot to do with confidence as well.

KAY: 00:06:54

And it sounds like with you, that initially at least, that

KAY: 00:06:59

confidence didn't come from you.

KAY: 00:07:01

It came from an external person.

KAY: 00:07:03

And sometimes, we need to have people in our lives who believe in

KAY: 00:07:06

the potential that we have and can push us in different directions.

KAY: 00:07:09

That's certainly been the case for me and it's obviously

KAY: 00:07:11

been the case for you as well.

KAY: 00:07:13

Absolutely.

KAY: 00:07:14

And that's something I'm very interested in passing on as well.

KAY: 00:07:17

I've found myself now doing that for other people where you see the potential

KAY: 00:07:20

and you point them in the right direction and just say, "This is a possibility.

KAY: 00:07:23

Did you know about this?

KAY: 00:07:24

You can do this."

IAN: 00:07:26

Absolutely.

IAN: 00:07:26

So if you're watching or listening, if you're in your forties, fifties,

IAN: 00:07:30

sixties, or seventies, you're feeling a little bit fed up or low, you can do it.

IAN: 00:07:34

There's definitely so many people that I'm speaking to now who are starting

IAN: 00:07:39

later on in their lives and doing some really cool and exciting things.

IAN: 00:07:42

So we'll come back to that in the future.

IAN: 00:07:45

But first of all, I just wanna say, although I'm a massive ActiveCampaign fan

IAN: 00:07:50

and user, and Kay obviously is, if you don't use ActiveCampaign, don't worry.

IAN: 00:07:55

This is still going to be really useful for you.

IAN: 00:07:57

because we're going to be talking about automation in general,

IAN: 00:08:00

we might get a bit specific.

IAN: 00:08:01

So first of all, Kate, what is automation when it comes to our business?

IAN: 00:08:06

Can you give us some examples?

IAN: 00:08:07

And how can that actually help us?

KAY: 00:08:10

I started out with automation as what I think of as a generalist, which was

KAY: 00:08:15

looking at how can tech solve the everyday problems in a business in order to free

KAY: 00:08:21

up their time to enable them to give some brain space and energy to email marketing.

KAY: 00:08:27

That's where I started out.

KAY: 00:08:28

because there's this huge barrier in many businesses, which is that you

KAY: 00:08:32

are drowning in admin and daily tasks and just stuff that has to get done.

KAY: 00:08:38

And if you can't get yourself out from that, you don't have a chance really

KAY: 00:08:42

of reaching that serenity point where you are gliding along like a swan on

KAY: 00:08:46

the surface and able to spare more of your energy, your attention and

KAY: 00:08:51

effort for the strategic, interesting and human things in your business.

KAY: 00:08:56

So for me, automation is a tool that takes businesses from

KAY: 00:09:00

drowning an admin to serenity.

KAY: 00:09:04

That's its main purpose.

KAY: 00:09:05

And the bottom line is that many tools are better at getting stuff done.

KAY: 00:09:10

That's a repeating process.

KAY: 00:09:12

Tools are much better at doing that than humans, and that goes

KAY: 00:09:15

right back through history.

KAY: 00:09:17

If you wanna get a kettle boiled, you use a kettle that switches

KAY: 00:09:20

itself automatically off.

KAY: 00:09:22

You don't rely on a human to remember and go back, because if we do that, we end up

KAY: 00:09:26

with boiled dry pans and stuff like that.

KAY: 00:09:28

And it's a very trivial example, but you get my point, which is that humans have

KAY: 00:09:31

been using tools pretty much forever.

KAY: 00:09:34

Digital tools are just an extension of that, and it's because tools are

KAY: 00:09:37

better than humans at doing things repeatedly and doing things without

KAY: 00:09:42

needing a human to supervise them.

KAY: 00:09:44

For me, automation is about liberating your time so that you

KAY: 00:09:47

can give that time and human energy to other things that are much, much

KAY: 00:09:51

more interesting, fun and exciting.

IAN: 00:09:54

That's a really good way of describing automation.

IAN: 00:09:57

So for businesses who are just starting looking at automation, what

IAN: 00:10:02

are some examples that you could give that we could look at doing?

KAY: 00:10:04

That's such a great question because it starts always with the easy wins.

KAY: 00:10:09

You can't get on to doing bigger automation and more complex stuff

KAY: 00:10:12

until you free up some of your time and get away from the feeling of

KAY: 00:10:16

being deluged by these manual daily tasks that you are having to do.

KAY: 00:10:20

There are some really easy wins in automation land.

KAY: 00:10:24

One of the ones that's become really commonplace now, but I'm still

KAY: 00:10:28

seeing businesses not adopting, is using a scheduling tool to

KAY: 00:10:32

do your calendar management.

KAY: 00:10:34

For example, Calendly.

KAY: 00:10:35

It's the market leader on this.

KAY: 00:10:37

There's Acuity as well, but these are fantastic tools that allow someone

KAY: 00:10:40

else to book into your calendar, tell everyone what's going on.

KAY: 00:10:44

Anyone on either end of it can independently schedule or reschedule

KAY: 00:10:48

or cancel that appointment.

KAY: 00:10:50

You can define all sorts of boundaries around it, and then you can hook it up

KAY: 00:10:54

to your video conferencing tool, Zoom, or whatever it is you choose to use.

KAY: 00:10:58

This is a wonderfully fluent process that's very easy to access and

KAY: 00:11:03

that serves people on both ends.

KAY: 00:11:05

So it's serving the person who's making the appointment and the person who is

KAY: 00:11:09

delivering the appointment as well.

KAY: 00:11:11

So, it's a win-win all round.

KAY: 00:11:13

Everybody loves it.

KAY: 00:11:15

That's an easy place to start.

KAY: 00:11:16

So, do you have Calendly yet, Ian?

IAN: 00:11:18

Yeah.

IAN: 00:11:19

In fact, just before we started, my monthly subscriptions just come out,

IAN: 00:11:23

so I've been using Calendly for years.

IAN: 00:11:25

And it's part of my system.

IAN: 00:11:26

So, tools like Calendly, have worked really well.

IAN: 00:11:29

I've got a little bit geek and use tools like Zapier and this and that.

IAN: 00:11:35

And I love tools like that, but isn't there a dark side to automation?

IAN: 00:11:39

I'm old enough to remember the automated DMs on Twitter and I get the outreach

IAN: 00:11:46

emails asking me, I can't even remember.

IAN: 00:11:49

I lose the world to live when I see these emails.

IAN: 00:11:52

Let's talk about that a little bit because before we get onto

IAN: 00:11:55

the human side of things, I think we can maybe talk about that.

IAN: 00:11:58

There is a dark side too and what's your view on that, and does it not

IAN: 00:12:04

give automation a bit of a bad name?

KAY: 00:12:06

I think you could say that about any tool that humans can use.

KAY: 00:12:10

If you put the tool in the wrong hands, then people will do bad things with it.

KAY: 00:12:14

That's true of everything.

KAY: 00:12:15

And digital tech is no different to every other thing that humans have created

KAY: 00:12:19

and invented through their history.

KAY: 00:12:21

Bad people do bad stuff with whatever you give them.

KAY: 00:12:24

I think the benefits and advantages of automation so vastly outnumber that.

KAY: 00:12:31

There are a lot more good people in the world than there are the

KAY: 00:12:33

baddies, the skanky spammers who are sending stuff like that.

KAY: 00:12:36

I think it will be interesting to see how AI plays into this.

KAY: 00:12:41

But actually on the whole, I think that this is an even more of an

KAY: 00:12:44

opportunity to lean into your humanity.

KAY: 00:12:46

And what interests me most about automation is that it literally gives

KAY: 00:12:51

you the time and energy to do that.

KAY: 00:12:54

It's a liberation.

IAN: 00:12:56

Yeah, I think I love what you just said, that liberation.

IAN: 00:12:59

Because all of us have only got a certain amount of energy.

IAN: 00:13:02

I spoke to somebody earlier today who's got ridiculous amounts of energy and I

IAN: 00:13:06

just thought, oh, I can't do as much as that person, but then I realized actually

IAN: 00:13:11

with all the processes and the automation that I've got in my business, I am able

IAN: 00:13:15

to do a lot more than other people.

IAN: 00:13:16

And I think that is so important.

IAN: 00:13:19

And you're so right about tools can be used for good and bad, but what we must

IAN: 00:13:23

never do is just because a tool can be used badly doesn't mean that it is Yes.

IAN: 00:13:30

bad.

IAN: 00:13:31

Automation isn't necessarily a bad thing.

IAN: 00:13:35

In fact, it's a very positive thing.

IAN: 00:13:37

I can see Melis is saying, "I have separate email addresses

IAN: 00:13:40

for endless LinkedIn messages."

IAN: 00:13:42

But you can actually use automation to counteract that.

IAN: 00:13:47

That's why Filters in email are great.

IAN: 00:13:49

So, I never see any of these because I've got all the filters.

KAY: 00:13:51

Yeah, that's an automation.

KAY: 00:13:53

You're using a tool.

KAY: 00:13:55

And that's a really good example of how automation should work.

KAY: 00:13:59

How do we decide what to automate?

KAY: 00:14:02

That thing that you just said, too many LinkedIn cold call messages coming to

KAY: 00:14:06

your inbox, it starts with a pain point.

KAY: 00:14:09

The pain that you are feeling allows you to make a plan.

KAY: 00:14:13

How can I fix this pain?

KAY: 00:14:16

Then you can build a process.

KAY: 00:14:18

That will solve that pain.

KAY: 00:14:19

And you do that by looking around at what tools you have available.

KAY: 00:14:21

Maybe you've already got something like a filter in your email inbox system, so

KAY: 00:14:26

you already have the tech to do that.

KAY: 00:14:27

You just haven't used it in that particular way.

KAY: 00:14:30

You build a process, watch it do its thing, rinse and repeat, or relax

KAY: 00:14:35

and repeat because now you don't have to think about it anymore.

KAY: 00:14:38

Wow.

IAN: 00:14:39

Love that.

IAN: 00:14:41

I'm already excited.

IAN: 00:14:41

I knew I was going to be excited about this conversation.

IAN: 00:14:43

And one of the things that I've realized is I'm a geek.

IAN: 00:14:47

I love technology.

IAN: 00:14:48

I love automation.

IAN: 00:14:49

I love creating it, but sometimes I can get so into it

IAN: 00:14:53

that I forget about the human.

IAN: 00:14:55

And I will admit, I didn't necessarily think it was a great idea, but I just

IAN: 00:15:00

thought it was a really cool idea that if somebody followed me on Twitter back

IAN: 00:15:04

in the early days, we're going about 12, 13 years ago, maybe even longer.

IAN: 00:15:08

When somebody followed me, I would then get an automated message to send them and

IAN: 00:15:11

say, "Hey, thank you for following me."

IAN: 00:15:13

Like I think about that and I cringe, what a stupid idea.

IAN: 00:15:16

Because just because you can doesn't mean you should.

KAY: 00:15:20

Right.

KAY: 00:15:21

Tech should serve the human need.

IAN: 00:15:25

I want to ask you about the question that I get asked, and it got

IAN: 00:15:30

asked a few times before, when I was talking about the show coming out,

IAN: 00:15:34

which was, doesn't automation put a barrier between us and our audience?

IAN: 00:15:39

How can that make us more human?

IAN: 00:15:40

And I have to admit it, this is still something that I still hold onto.

IAN: 00:15:45

So what's your answer to that?

KAY: 00:15:47

Okay, I hear you.

KAY: 00:15:48

And I'm going to describe that as a fallacy, but I don't mean that in an

KAY: 00:15:53

insulting way because I think it's a very natural position to take in

KAY: 00:15:58

respect to automation, but I think it's completely the opposite of what

KAY: 00:16:02

actually happens in reality if automation is used to make your life easier,

KAY: 00:16:08

which is what it should be doing.

KAY: 00:16:09

So, automation can fill a number of needs.

KAY: 00:16:13

Its job is to remove some pain, and that pain could be effort.

KAY: 00:16:19

It could be errors because when humans do stuff, we get stuff wrong all the time.

KAY: 00:16:23

So automation can remove errors, it can remove cost in time and money,

KAY: 00:16:29

and it can remove frustration.

KAY: 00:16:31

Now in modern humanity right now, our culture, we are frustrated.

KAY: 00:16:38

We are time poor.

KAY: 00:16:40

We are often made to feel a bit stupid because we can't work something.

KAY: 00:16:45

Of automation, if it's doing its job, should be removing at

KAY: 00:16:49

least one of those pain points.

KAY: 00:16:51

Now, when you take frustration away, you take the time pressure away.

KAY: 00:16:56

What does that do?

KAY: 00:16:57

You are enhancing the space in which you can deliver your high

KAY: 00:17:03

value, incredible human touch.

KAY: 00:17:06

So automation used well does the exact opposite Of creating barriers.

KAY: 00:17:10

It is actually removing barriers to human connection and communication.

KAY: 00:17:18

I love it.

KAY: 00:17:19

It's not the tool that is the issue, it's how people approach and use the tool.

IAN: 00:17:25

So, I can get on board with that, but we talked about filtering email addresses.

IAN: 00:17:30

That's where automation, no-brainer as far as I'm concerned,

IAN: 00:17:33

Calendly or some scheduling tool.

IAN: 00:17:36

Again, no-brainer.

IAN: 00:17:37

Sending emails out to a segmented list.

IAN: 00:17:41

Again, no-brainer.

IAN: 00:17:43

Where it gets a little bit muddy in my mind is, for example,

IAN: 00:17:48

Facebook Messenger bots.

IAN: 00:17:49

What I'm thinking here is when the automation is human facing, if it is

IAN: 00:17:57

sending an automated message to somebody, I can see ways where that would be good.

IAN: 00:18:04

For example, I think I bought a product, but actually I didn't.

IAN: 00:18:07

I got distracted and it's still in my shopping cart and I get an automated

IAN: 00:18:10

message, an abandoned cart message.

IAN: 00:18:12

But do you see what I mean?

IAN: 00:18:14

There's a muddy area, gray area here when it comes to the human facing thing.

KAY: 00:18:19

Yeah.

KAY: 00:18:19

Now I think, again, many people consider automation to be an either or.

KAY: 00:18:24

You either automate it or you do it manually.

KAY: 00:18:27

But there's this amazing, wonderful richness in the grays in between where you

KAY: 00:18:32

do a blend, a hybrid, a mix of automating the repetitive bit and then using your

KAY: 00:18:39

human touch on the bit where it matters.

KAY: 00:18:41

So, I'm going to try and give you an example of that.

KAY: 00:18:43

So say someone lands in my messenger inbox.

KAY: 00:18:46

They don't get an automated reply, but what I do have is a whole selection

KAY: 00:18:51

of things stored that are the answers to frequently asked questions.

KAY: 00:18:55

I have them stored in a thing called text expander.

KAY: 00:18:58

And text expander allows me to type maybe maximum three or four

KAY: 00:19:02

characters on any device that I own.

KAY: 00:19:04

So I could be waiting to pick up my kid from band practice sitting in

KAY: 00:19:08

the car, or I'm at Tesco or whatever.

KAY: 00:19:10

I can type in just a few characters and it's going to unveil this paragraph of

KAY: 00:19:15

really rich information and I can then add my human touch to that, which is the bit

KAY: 00:19:21

where I communicate with the actual person who's asked me a very specific question.

KAY: 00:19:25

So, it's not either or.

KAY: 00:19:27

It's a hybrid.

KAY: 00:19:28

And that's where the real magic happens.

KAY: 00:19:32

You can use automation to just tap you on the shoulder and say,

KAY: 00:19:35

dude, you forgot to do this.

KAY: 00:19:37

Or, three weeks after an appointment, remember you were going to follow up

KAY: 00:19:40

with so-and-so, and here's the link and here's what they said in that call.

KAY: 00:19:43

It's like cloning yourself or serving future you as well.

KAY: 00:19:48

So automation can serve you, not just your customers.

IAN: 00:19:51

If it's just you or you've got a very small team, there's

IAN: 00:19:55

only so much you can do.

IAN: 00:19:56

And ultimately, we should be focusing on the stuff that we're really good at.

IAN: 00:20:01

And you might enjoy doing all those things, but it's probably

IAN: 00:20:04

not a good use of your time.

IAN: 00:20:05

And so I'm at the moment working on my processes.

IAN: 00:20:10

And I think in a sense that's partly what you're saying, but also templates.

IAN: 00:20:15

So I'm constantly sending the same emails.

IAN: 00:20:20

I do use text expander and I love text expander.

IAN: 00:20:22

The only problem I have with text expander is I forget what

IAN: 00:20:25

the shortcuts are sometimes.

KAY: 00:20:27

There's a thing you can do to bring up a list of the shortcuts.

IAN: 00:20:30

I'll have to talk to you about it.

IAN: 00:20:31

What do you do?

KAY: 00:20:33

Command backslash.

IAN: 00:20:35

Okay.

IAN: 00:20:36

I need to remember that.

IAN: 00:20:37

That's good.

IAN: 00:20:37

And I've probably got too many, but there's that, there's processes.

IAN: 00:20:41

What are your top tips and tools when it comes to automation?

IAN: 00:20:44

So, I asked you this question a little bit before, but I'd like to get maybe

IAN: 00:20:48

a bit more into the nitty gritty.

IAN: 00:20:50

We can get a little bit geeky now.

IAN: 00:20:53

What are the things that excite you or that really make a big

IAN: 00:20:56

difference in your business or maybe in some of your client's businesses?

IAN: 00:20:59

I'd love to know some of those things.

KAY: 00:21:01

Yeah.

KAY: 00:21:02

I could talk all day about this.

KAY: 00:21:04

I will try and keep it on point.

KAY: 00:21:06

I think every business has a different set of needs for automation.

KAY: 00:21:11

It's a really wide range, and one of the things that I've found the

KAY: 00:21:15

richest in running my ActiveCampaign academy is getting to have one-to-one

KAY: 00:21:18

conversations with people to really talk about what is going to solve

KAY: 00:21:22

the specific pain point that they have right now in their business.

KAY: 00:21:26

So, I think it always has to start with noticing what's causing you or your

KAY: 00:21:30

customer pain thinking, what could I do that would make this pain go away?

KAY: 00:21:35

And then creating that process and letting it do its thing.

KAY: 00:21:38

That's the biggest tip I can give you really is that's how

KAY: 00:21:41

you think about automation.

KAY: 00:21:42

And then everything else follows from that.

KAY: 00:21:45

Some of my favorite tools for automation, many of them are absolutely simple and can

KAY: 00:21:49

be done with any email marketing software, like showing someone their email address

KAY: 00:21:54

in the email when you send it to them.

KAY: 00:21:56

Because you know how we all have multiple inboxes and you go to log

KAY: 00:21:59

into something or go to buy a product, you can't remember which email

KAY: 00:22:02

address you use to log in to them.

KAY: 00:22:04

I have no idea.

KAY: 00:22:05

So just a simple thing, like being aware of that and showing them

KAY: 00:22:08

their email address is a little bit of syntax you type in there

KAY: 00:22:11

and it reveals their email address.

KAY: 00:22:12

Great.

KAY: 00:22:12

You've taken a pain point and frustration away from that person.

KAY: 00:22:16

Likewise, you can prefill things.

KAY: 00:22:18

If you are sending someone an email and you want them to go

KAY: 00:22:21

fill out a form, do not make them type their email address in again.

KAY: 00:22:24

Nobody likes that.

KAY: 00:22:26

who has time?

KAY: 00:22:27

So, you can prefill things using URL links.

KAY: 00:22:30

That bit is super clever.

KAY: 00:22:32

It's quick to learn and you can do it in any email marketing platform.

KAY: 00:22:35

What other favorites do I have?

KAY: 00:22:36

For me, the ones that really excite me are the ones that allow you to deliver

KAY: 00:22:40

that incredibly rich human touch.

KAY: 00:22:42

Bonjoro is a very exciting tool for me.

KAY: 00:22:45

It is an app that lives on your phone and you can use it to send a

KAY: 00:22:49

completely personal video to someone at any given moment that you choose.

KAY: 00:22:54

And Bonjoro has this incredible integration with ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:22:58

I'm going to give you a solid example here.

KAY: 00:23:00

I have my ActiveCampaign account watch to see if people are visiting

KAY: 00:23:04

my sales page for the academy.

KAY: 00:23:07

You can do that using site tracking in ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:23:10

It's just watching.

KAY: 00:23:11

And it's like this benign spying.

KAY: 00:23:13

Very clever.

KAY: 00:23:14

And it's in everybody's interest.

KAY: 00:23:16

There's nothing skanky going on, everyone's being nice people here.

KAY: 00:23:20

So, it watches to see how many times you visit the sales page.

KAY: 00:23:23

If you visit three times within a certain space of time, there's a little

KAY: 00:23:27

automation that fires off, that goes to Bonjoro, sends a little message to

KAY: 00:23:31

Bonjoro and says, Okay, tell Kay to send a personal video to this person.

KAY: 00:23:35

And I get a notification on my phone that not only tells me who

KAY: 00:23:38

this person is, where they live roughly, not completely stalking

KAY: 00:23:42

them, what they've been interested in before, how long they've been in my

KAY: 00:23:45

audience, what their business name is.

KAY: 00:23:47

That gives me all sorts of context right there and then on my phone so I can send

KAY: 00:23:51

them a personal video from wherever I am.

KAY: 00:23:54

Now, the sense of connection that unleashes, there's no way you could

KAY: 00:23:59

replicate that with pure automation.

KAY: 00:24:01

It's the hybrid model that makes that work.

IAN: 00:24:05

Yeah.

IAN: 00:24:05

Bonjoro is a great example of that because as you say, it's using that

IAN: 00:24:11

automation and the technology, yet it uses something that's very unscalable,

IAN: 00:24:16

which is recording a personal message.

IAN: 00:24:18

And I love that.

IAN: 00:24:21

When I think about it, I think surely, like if I send a personal message to

IAN: 00:24:24

somebody, "Oh, I see you living in Cornwall and you like cheese like me."

IAN: 00:24:30

That would freak them out.

IAN: 00:24:31

I don't know why I said cheese, I was thinking of something random,

IAN: 00:24:33

but that would freak them out.

IAN: 00:24:35

But it doesn't for me.

IAN: 00:24:36

It just makes me smile like, oh wow, that's really cool.

IAN: 00:24:40

There's something about it.

KAY: 00:24:41

You feel so special, it made so seen and heard, and that's what we are craving.

KAY: 00:24:49

I was just going to about replies to emails are similar.

KAY: 00:24:52

If you reply as a human to an email that's come into your inbox,

KAY: 00:24:55

people are just blown away by the fact that's not just an auto reply.

KAY: 00:25:00

If you can make the time to do that and text expander as a tool will

KAY: 00:25:03

help you do that because you can save some stuff, and get phrases out, but

KAY: 00:25:07

still make it completely personal.

IAN: 00:25:08

That's true.

IAN: 00:25:09

I know it's funny when I send my email newsletter, people feel almost shy.

IAN: 00:25:12

They don't want to reply because they think I'm not going to read

IAN: 00:25:15

it or I'm not going to reply.

IAN: 00:25:16

But I always try and reply.

IAN: 00:25:18

If I don't reply, it's because something's gone wrong and I've

IAN: 00:25:20

lost it or I've got distracted.

IAN: 00:25:22

But I always try and reply and people shocked almost that I have replied.

IAN: 00:25:29

"Oh my goodness!

IAN: 00:25:29

I didn't expect to reply from you.

IAN: 00:25:31

Why have you sent me an email?"

IAN: 00:25:32

But it's funny.

KAY: 00:25:34

I did have I did have someone once complain in my Facebook group that they'd

KAY: 00:25:38

received a robotic auto reply from me.

KAY: 00:25:41

And I was like, yeah, that was me for real . It was really funny, but it

KAY: 00:25:48

made me think, this is another reason we need to lean into the humanity.

KAY: 00:25:52

Because actually, if we talk about Cornwall and cheese and surfing

KAY: 00:25:56

and whatever it is we know about this person, if you feed that,

KAY: 00:26:01

you're mirroring back to them.

KAY: 00:26:02

They know for definite that you are not robo Kay.

KAY: 00:26:06

It's actually real Kay.

IAN: 00:26:09

Robo Kay.

IAN: 00:26:10

That's funny.

IAN: 00:26:10

Melis says she's lost the plot.

IAN: 00:26:12

So don't worry.

IAN: 00:26:13

I think with all of these things with automation and Kay would

IAN: 00:26:15

agree with me here, you gotta start simple and build it up over time.

IAN: 00:26:19

So, Melis says, "... Use filters, but prefer to delete

IAN: 00:26:24

as I scroll through emails."

IAN: 00:26:25

So there's no right or wrong way of doing your emails.

IAN: 00:26:28

For me personally, I get so much rubbish and clutter.

IAN: 00:26:33

It makes me stressed and a stressed Ian is not a good thing.

IAN: 00:26:38

So what I try and do is I've set up all these filters, so I only see the

IAN: 00:26:42

emails that I need to see, and that makes me feel happy most of the time.

IAN: 00:26:48

But if that works for you, Melis, going through and deleting as you scroll

IAN: 00:26:51

through, of course, the only downside with automation like filters and

IAN: 00:26:55

things is sometimes they get it wrong.

IAN: 00:26:58

And this actually happened.

IAN: 00:26:59

so when I was asked to speak for the first time at Social Media Marketing World in

IAN: 00:27:04

San Diego, the email from Mike Stelzner got filtered away, so I didn't see it.

IAN: 00:27:11

And so he had to send me a Facebook message.

IAN: 00:27:12

Thank goodness he did.

IAN: 00:27:15

So, do check your automations.

KAY: 00:27:20

That was going to be the next on my top tips list is test all the things.

KAY: 00:27:26

Automation is fantastic, but it does break sometimes.

KAY: 00:27:29

So even when something has been working steadily really, really well, some

KAY: 00:27:34

tech guy on the back end will have done something one day and it will stop

KAY: 00:27:38

working, because that's just how it rolls.

KAY: 00:27:41

So you do wanna keep an eye on any automation.

KAY: 00:27:45

Go and make yourself a Calendly appointment.

KAY: 00:27:47

Do the things and it's like you have to put a pretending customer hat on

KAY: 00:27:51

and go and pretend to be the customer.

KAY: 00:27:53

And then you see things really differently.

KAY: 00:27:55

And if you do that, that tests your automation.

KAY: 00:27:57

It is a very smart thing to do.

KAY: 00:27:59

I actually have a little army of test contacts.

KAY: 00:28:01

They're all called Horatio because there aren't that many Horatios, and

KAY: 00:28:05

I'm sorry called it Horatio and you're listening to this right now, all of my

KAY: 00:28:10

crash test dummies are called Horatio.

KAY: 00:28:11

And it means if I see one of them, I know it's just me testing something.

KAY: 00:28:15

And everyone in my world and in my academy knows if they see Horatio

KAY: 00:28:19

turn up in their system, that's me.

KAY: 00:28:21

That's Kay testing something.

KAY: 00:28:22

So it's really important to have those contacts and actually look at it from the

KAY: 00:28:26

inbox end as well with email marketing.

IAN: 00:28:29

You've given me an idea because I've done that in ActiveCampaign and I

IAN: 00:28:32

think I've called myself Ian 2 or Ian 3.

IAN: 00:28:35

And that's rubbish.

IAN: 00:28:37

I need to come up with a special name.

KAY: 00:28:40

I can't think of any of the silly ones.

KAY: 00:28:43

Every now and then, this comes up in my Facebook group and we have

KAY: 00:28:45

a discussion about what everyone's current range of test names are.

KAY: 00:28:49

They're always the most popular posts in there.

IAN: 00:28:52

That's funny.

IAN: 00:28:53

Well, if you're watching or listening, tell us what your test name is

IAN: 00:28:56

because I've never thought about that.

IAN: 00:28:58

I'm going to have to start thinking about what that's going to be.

IAN: 00:29:01

So we are almost out of time because I am trying to be good and we are

IAN: 00:29:06

trying to make these episodes a little bit shorter, more punchy, and

IAN: 00:29:09

you've definitely helped us, Kay, think a little bit more about this.

IAN: 00:29:12

Just final thing, ActiveCampaign.

IAN: 00:29:15

This is going to be a difficult question, and I didn't warn you about this,

IAN: 00:29:19

but I'm going to put you on the spot.

IAN: 00:29:21

Why do you love ActiveCampaign so much?

IAN: 00:29:24

And you can give us maybe one or two reasons, but why should

IAN: 00:29:27

we look at ActiveCampaign and why do you love it so much?

KAY: 00:29:30

ActiveCampaign is the biggest playground for automation for the

KAY: 00:29:38

price it costs on the light plan.

KAY: 00:29:40

On the lowest cost plan, you get unlimited automation, unlimited integration,

KAY: 00:29:46

unlimited custom fields, tags, and I know these are technical terms.

KAY: 00:29:50

If you actually want to know what they are, go visit my blog at slickbusiness.co.

KAY: 00:29:54

I'll tell you what they are.

KAY: 00:29:55

ActiveCampaign is a rarity in this space in that it doesn't put a fence

KAY: 00:30:00

around what you are allowed to do on the Lite plan, on the lowest cost plan.

KAY: 00:30:04

You can go for your life and you are limited only by your

KAY: 00:30:08

imagination and creativity.

KAY: 00:30:10

And don't ever let anyone tell you that email marketing and

KAY: 00:30:12

automation is not creative.

KAY: 00:30:14

It is the absolute definition of creativity.

KAY: 00:30:16

If you don't think outside the box and do that wild blue sky thinking of what could

KAY: 00:30:22

I do with this amazing tech that is at my disposal, you're not using it properly.

KAY: 00:30:27

So it's enormous fun to use.

KAY: 00:30:30

It has its flaws like any other tool.

KAY: 00:30:33

I can't see me moving away from it yet for a long time because it delivers so

KAY: 00:30:39

solid on automation and integration and just being an absolute delight for the

KAY: 00:30:44

processes that you can automate in there.

IAN: 00:30:46

That's a good answer.

IAN: 00:30:47

I'll allow that.

IAN: 00:30:50

It's great.

IAN: 00:30:51

I moved over to ActiveCampaign from MailChimp about nine

IAN: 00:30:55

years ago, maybe longer.

IAN: 00:30:56

I don't know.

IAN: 00:30:57

And there was a lot of learning.

IAN: 00:30:59

But now, it powers so much in my business.

IAN: 00:31:03

It powers all my courses, membership and everything, and it's

IAN: 00:31:08

amazing that it does all of that.

KAY: 00:31:11

Yeah, the scope of what you can do in there is incredible,

KAY: 00:31:13

but it is a learning curve.

KAY: 00:31:15

And this would probably be my final tip on anything related to tech and

KAY: 00:31:19

automation, is you really need to take the time, find the time, make some time,

KAY: 00:31:24

and know that you're going to need it to learn how to use the tech that you own.

KAY: 00:31:28

You are paying for the tech, or you bought a lifetime license, or you're

KAY: 00:31:31

paying for it monthly, that tech will be able to do stuff that you have not

KAY: 00:31:35

explored, like Ian not knowing the shortcut for the text expander thing

KAY: 00:31:39

to tell him what shortcuts there are.

KAY: 00:31:42

There will be stuff in there that you don't have on your radar and it's

KAY: 00:31:45

on you to go and learn to do that.

KAY: 00:31:48

And if you can find a great teacher, someone who's going to share tips

KAY: 00:31:51

into your inbox or on their social, so you can learn it by osmosis

KAY: 00:31:55

without too much effort, even better.

KAY: 00:31:58

But the onus is on you to go and learn how to use the tech and

KAY: 00:32:02

to figure out how can I get this thing or this collection of things.

KAY: 00:32:06

Because it's often more than one tool that you'll need.

KAY: 00:32:08

How can I put them together like a crazy jigsaw puzzle to solve

KAY: 00:32:12

this pain point that I've got?

KAY: 00:32:14

Make the time to learn.

IAN: 00:32:16

So true.

IAN: 00:32:17

Make that time.

IAN: 00:32:18

And if you're struggling or if you just really find this thing, you're

IAN: 00:32:23

not really into this but you know it's important, get some help.

IAN: 00:32:27

Depending on the type of automation that it is, get some help.

IAN: 00:32:30

And the other thing I would just add is with all of these

IAN: 00:32:33

processes and automations, record some videos of you setting it up.

IAN: 00:32:37

Get some documentation.

IAN: 00:32:39

I don't always do this, I'm starting to do that because the

IAN: 00:32:42

thing is I forget what I did.

IAN: 00:32:44

So yeah, that's another thing.

KAY: 00:32:46

Yeah, we could talk about that another time.

KAY: 00:32:48

Documentation's a whole other subject.

IAN: 00:32:49

Yeah, I know.

IAN: 00:32:50

You're going to have to come back on the show.

IAN: 00:32:53

It is so funny because when we were talking before, I was saying to

IAN: 00:32:58

you, Kay, there's so many different things that we could talk about.

IAN: 00:33:00

And so we had to pick one and that's what it was.

IAN: 00:33:02

And it's been a great subject.

IAN: 00:33:03

So I also wanted to say like, so last episode we had Phil Pallen on the show.

IAN: 00:33:09

We were talking about creating a professional personal brand, and we were

IAN: 00:33:13

talking about the best practices here.

IAN: 00:33:15

I have to say, Kay, your personal brand, your branding, your website,

IAN: 00:33:19

your photography, everything about what you do is amazing.

IAN: 00:33:22

So you need to check out Kay's website, which is at slickbusiness.co.

IAN: 00:33:29

I love the photography and the colors and everything and

IAN: 00:33:32

the font and all this stuff.

IAN: 00:33:33

I'm geeking out, Kay.

IAN: 00:33:35

And it really puts your personality and your profressionality all the way through.

IAN: 00:33:41

So, check out slickbusiness.co.

IAN: 00:33:45

It is awesome.

IAN: 00:33:46

I've also got a little button.

IAN: 00:33:49

You were tell telling me about this.

IAN: 00:33:52

So, tell us about this.

IAN: 00:33:53

This is an accelerated ActiveCampaign thing.

KAY: 00:33:56

Ah, yeah.

KAY: 00:33:57

It's a completely free course.

KAY: 00:33:59

It's a two week introduction to ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:34:03

And it's called Accelerated ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:34:05

And it does what it says on the tin.

KAY: 00:34:07

It accelerates you into ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:34:10

Because a lot of these tech platforms, it's all these words knocking around

KAY: 00:34:14

custom fields and tags and automations.

KAY: 00:34:17

You don't know what they are when you come in.

KAY: 00:34:19

ActiveCampaign onboarding will try and teach you that, but honestly,

KAY: 00:34:22

save yourself the trouble.

KAY: 00:34:23

Just do my free training.

KAY: 00:34:24

It's actually really, genuinely a lot better.

KAY: 00:34:27

Thousands and thousands of people have been through it.

KAY: 00:34:29

And here's the sweet spot, is that it sits alongside the free two

KAY: 00:34:32

week trial for ActiveCampaign.

KAY: 00:34:34

So if you wanna kick the tires of ActiveCampaign,

KAY: 00:34:36

run my course alongside it.

KAY: 00:34:38

It is designed to sit right alongside.

KAY: 00:34:40

And even if you've been using ActiveCampaign for years, Ian,

KAY: 00:34:44

I'm looking at you right now.

KAY: 00:34:45

You should go do that free training because there will be stuff in

KAY: 00:34:48

there that you have not found.

KAY: 00:34:50

You know I said make some time to go find what's in there?

KAY: 00:34:54

There is gold dust in there.

KAY: 00:34:55

There's some amazing toys to play with in ActiveCampaign that you

KAY: 00:34:58

will not know about, I promise.

KAY: 00:35:00

Go find them.

KAY: 00:35:01

I have taken everyone straight to the best cookies in the jar for

KAY: 00:35:04

free because I love and I want you to get the best of ActiveCampaign.

IAN: 00:35:09

Oh my goodness.

IAN: 00:35:10

That's all my time gone.

IAN: 00:35:12

I'm looking forward to that.

IAN: 00:35:13

It's because I love those little golden nuggets.

IAN: 00:35:15

So you're listening to the podcast, I'll give you the link to this.

IAN: 00:35:19

It's slickbusiness.co/accelerated-activecampaign.

IAN: 00:35:30

Do check that out.

IAN: 00:35:32

Well, thank you, Kay.

IAN: 00:35:33

It's been awesome to have you on the show.

IAN: 00:35:34

So if people want to follow you on the socials, where do you tend to hang out

IAN: 00:35:38

these days and how can people find you?

KAY: 00:35:40

My favorite place to hang out is LinkedIn.

KAY: 00:35:43

I'm doing more on LinkedIn.

KAY: 00:35:44

I'm learning to love LinkedIn as many people are.

KAY: 00:35:46

And that's probably where I have the wider conversations around email

KAY: 00:35:49

marketing and the bigger philosophical questions around humanness and automation.

KAY: 00:35:53

And then on Facebook, I run a free Facebook group for ActiveCampaign

KAY: 00:35:58

users called Automate Your Business With ActiveCampaign'.

KAY: 00:36:01

And I also like Twitter, so you can find me there too.

KAY: 00:36:05

Any of those places.

IAN: 00:36:06

Basically, pretty much most of the places.

IAN: 00:36:08

So that's awesome.

IAN: 00:36:09

That's great.

IAN: 00:36:10

Not necessarily dancing on TikTok, but apart from that.

KAY: 00:36:13

No.

KAY: 00:36:14

Not yet.

IAN: 00:36:16

You never know.

IAN: 00:36:17

Don't ever say no to anything.

KAY: 00:36:18

I'm not dissing it.

IAN: 00:36:20

No.

IAN: 00:36:21

Well, thank you, Kay.

IAN: 00:36:22

It's been awesome to have you on the show today.

IAN: 00:36:25

So, that is it for this week.

IAN: 00:36:28

We've got one more episode.

IAN: 00:36:30

Next week, a little bit more about that, later.

IAN: 00:36:32

But thank you so much for watching, and until next time, I encourage you to level

IAN: 00:36:36

up your impacts, authority and profits to the power of Confident Live video.

IAN: 00:36:41

See you soon.

IAN: 00:36:41

Bye.

IAN: 00:37:24

I wanna be more human

IAN: 00:37:27

With automation

IAN: 00:37:30

Automation

IAN: 00:37:32

Be more human

IAN: 00:37:34

We wanna be more human

IAN: 00:37:37

with automation

IAN: 00:37:39

Kay Peacey is coming on the show today