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Most coffee chats end with a nice conversation and nothing else, and that's a sales problem hiding as a networking problem.

Renee Hribar breaks down why casual networking calls fail to convert into clients and introduces her four-part "Before the Call Trust Builder" framework: recon, relevant questions, examples, and deciding the next step. She walks through how a little research, one thoughtful question, and a quick example sent before the call changes the entire dynamic, illustrating it with a real story about a consultant named Rachel who landed a paid project simply by preparing differently for a single conversation.

The bigger lesson: people don't buy because they understand your title, they buy because they understand their own problem more clearly after talking with you. Renee closes with a simple weekly challenge. One person, fifteen minutes of recon, one thoughtful question, to put the framework into practice right away.

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You might even know what they had for breakfast, but somehow they still don't know what you do. You definitely haven't deciphered whether they're a potential client, connector, or collaborator yet, and nobody knows what happens next. Ugh. Are you leaving the call thinking, "Well, they were really nice"? Okay.

Two thumbs down. Do not recommend, as the influencers say. Oh my goodness. So today, we are gonna talk about how to avoid what I lovingly call death by coffee chat. More importantly, I'm gonna show you how to turn a casual networking conversation into a focused, useful business conversation without becoming pushy, weird, or making the other person feel like they're under a heat lamp in an interrogation room.

I'm Renee Hribar, sales coach for B2B service providers and consultants who are sick and tired of being undervalued and disrespected. I help you package up, sell, and deliver your expertise in a way that creates more revenue and gives you your time back. Whether you found me through my book, thank you, one of my talks, like maybe the one I did for TEDx, or you're brand new here, welcome.

I'm very glad you're here. Before we get into today's episode, go to askmecoach.com. That is where you can officially get your badge as a connector because if you're listening to this episode, that is exactly what you are. All right. Let's talk about why coffee chats are not converting. Ugh. here's the first thing I want you to understand.

I swear, even though it's at the Hilton or the, whatever, the Westin, that coffee is like paint thinner. It is so harsh. Tea, please. All right. But the reality is, is no matter how you met them, you have proximity. You definitely have a reason to connect and contact each other, and that's good. But proximity is not the same as trust.

Now, I know indoctrination can sound, um, intense. I'm not asking you to start a cult. Please do not make matching robes. That would be weird. What I mean is that they understand how you think. That is indoctrination. And more importantly, what you believe. And honestly, genuinely understanding the problems that you solve.

That does not usually happen just because they saw the title underneath your name on LinkedIn. I'm a strategic business optimization consultant. Okay, what does that mean? What do you actually do? How does that help me? That's what they're thinking. How does that help me? WIIFM. What's in it for me? You ever heard that?

Favorite radio show of all time? WIIFM. Okay, I'm old because I just said FM. What would I... This is what you want them to think. Why would I tell someone else about you? Like, you want them to have that answer by the time this coffee chat is over. So this is why I say that so many sales problems are really education problems.

They need context, right? Remember like take your daughter to work days? I don't know, I remember my dad doing that. And you know, when I say, you know, "Oh, my dad's in real estate," I mean, that could mean literally 10,000 different things. When it- when I say, "Well, we went to one of the 29 rental homes, and we collected checks, and then we met someone's dog that we didn't mean to meet, and then we had to call a plumber, and then we realized..."

Your job is to make the next step clear, safe, and easy to understand. The bridge is built with questions, stories, and examples even before you ever get on the coffee chat. So it's time to change the lens, because most people look at coffee chats through this lens. "I'll get on the call, you know, ask what they do, tell them what I do, and we'll just see what happens.

What if Stay with me here. What if you could arrive already understanding their background, already understanding and having a clear picture of how they are seeing the world and their business or their career or their profession right now? and what if they could arrive with a clearer picture of you and all the things you've done?

But when I started my first sales agency, research meant finding public business information through places like Dun & Bradstreet. Seriously. Like, literally they would give us information like if they owned a home, and how much their HOA's fee, HOA fees were. It's like... the amount of information that are literally at, at our fingertips right now is amazing.

Today, you can find a person's website, podcast interviews they might have been on or hosted, YouTube videos they might have been on or hosted, professional history, old projects, articles, Amazon w- wish lists and books, social profiles from a long time ago, certifications they might have done, communi- that they're in, launches they've done, speaking topics that they love to share, and probably 17 pictures of their dog, most likely.

I'm calling it the before the call trust builder. You like that? I don't know. It's working title. All right. So here are the four parts. Recon, relevant questions, examples, and the next step. You do not need three hours doing this. I just wanna say that out loud. This is scalpel, not shovel. We are not digging into their high school yearbook.

I was like, "Oh, I like that word. I'm gonna use it." I'm a word nerd. If I find a word that I really like, I am gonna keep using it. I'm gonna find a way to weave it into conversation. And now that I'm learning Spanish also here in Barcelona, I am learning some really freaking awesome words, or remembering, relearning maybe I guess you could say.

Like my n- my new favorite word is, in Spanish, zanahoria. Well, that is a carrot. Not very exciting when you say it in English, but super sexy. Zanahoria. Anyway, sorry. Back to the story. Part one, do the recon. Start by looking them up. I mean, duh, right? Like, look at their website. Look at their LinkedIn. I mean, you probably already did that, but look at their other social platforms.

Stranger things have happened. Maybe you both lived in the same state at one point. Most likely there's some common ground. Or maybe you both completed the same certification, right? And maybe it's something that you love, like whales or dachshunds or mermaids or blue hair or lighthouses or deep sea fishing or some other wonderfully specific thing.

Common ground helps, because you're also looking for business clues. What are they promoting? Have they recently launched something? Are they speaking at an event? Do they s- you know, have a certain specific ideal client avatar that they've been speaking to? Which communities are they active in? What do they seem to care about?

We are simply getting curious. I once worked with a woman, I'll tell you this, who was doing human design work. When I researched her before our conversation, I discovered that she had previously owned a dance studio for about 15 years, and had written a book connected to that. That was not a tiny detail.

This is a big part of her history, but it wasn't anything she was talking about on social media. I only found it out by looking her up on Amazon, which is a practice I've had for years. So it affected what she had experienced, and what she believed, and what she wanted to know, and some of the scars that she was carrying into her next business, which is what she wanted to talk to me about.

And now, a side note, this is not stalking. Stalking is done in the shadows. I want you to let them see you seeing them, like like it, comment, share. I mean, if you see it, even if it's seven years old, who cares? You're looking them up. Let them say, "Wow, this person cares." And, and let's say, let's say hypothetically, you do search their name, and like three different profiles appear.

I came up with a few profiles. Are any of these you?" What does that convey? I am preparing. I care about our time. I am not going to show up cold and make you do all the work, right? This is uncommon behavior, and uncommon is memorable. I mean, even if this is all that happens, even if they don't even show up to the call because of whatever reason, right?

They get hit by a water buffalo, or their electricity went out. I don't know. Point is, even if they don't show up to the call, they think of you as a thoughtful, caring, interested person, and thoughtful preparation immediately separates you from the person who rolls into Zoom three minutes late and says, "Uh, remind me how we know each other again."

I said it before, I'ma say it again. The bridge from, "I just met you," to, "I understand how this person can help me or that I can refer them," is built on questions. That is the bridge. The building blocks of the bridge between, "Hey, I just met you. Think I'm crazy." That's such an old song. Goodness. All right.

That's a big project. Do you have a set book launch date?" Now, again, look that up. If it's not published or promoted anywhere, then that's a reasonable question, and it's something they want to talk about. So it, it does a lot of things for you. Or say something like, "Hey, I noticed you have an event coming up in Austin.

Oh, that's a cool city." It is a cool city. "What other cities did Austin beat out?" Right? Because then that launches into the thought process of why they didn't choose Dallas or Houston or LA or Vegas, I don't know. Or here's another question I love: "What is one audacious goal you're working toward in the next 12 months?"

It might be on the call, but I am gonna try to build enough of a relationship before the call to get there. If they do trust you and their barriers are down, they will tell you everything, because they definitely are thinking of something. Or here's another one: You mentioned that you're expanding into corporate consulting.

why is that important right now? Like, what, what's that shift? What has inspired that shift right now? So that last question, let me tell you something about that last question. Did you notice there was a word in there? Now, right? Why is it important now? You cannot look that answer up. AI cannot know it unless the person has shared it publicly.

Please, please, that question has been beaten like a piñata at a seven-year-old's birthday party. PS, they don't use piñatas here in Spain. I really was sad. I think it's more of a Mexican thing. I'm realizing also a lot of things in the language that I learned called Spanish in the States is not the same language in Spain.

It's Spain Spanish, and I am often corrected for pronouncing things, like someone from Latin America, and I'm like, "Oh, thank you." This is actually Puerto Rican Spanish that I learned in New York from my abuelita. but also very different from Spain Spanish. So the reality is, is you are asking about something specific that they already care about.

And I told her, uh, what I'm gonna tell you, and that is when I ran my sales agency, many of my best salespeople were introverted women. Why? Because they listen. They ask deeper questions, and they did not need to dominate the conversation. So for selling your expertise, being willing to go deep with one person can be far more valuable than being visible to 1,000 people who barely know what you do or why they should care.

Whenever I say three, I always think of the dance lessons that my husband and I took before we got married. We're like, "Let's learn how to dance," and our first dance... I mean, I guess we knew how to dance, but it wasn't like ballroom dancing. I mean, not since like fifth grade. So we took ballroom dancing, and there was this amazing, sassy instructor, and he loved my husband because my husband's a very good dancer, and I am not.

He- I was at the bottom of the class, and my husband was at the top of the class. And this dance instructor that would always be like, "One, two, three. One, two, three." He even invited us to one of those like ballroom dancing like nights out, I guess you could say. And I think this is when like ballroom dan- I mean, this is a long time ago.

Here goes. So part three, educate them with examples. Now, again, I already told you, start thinking of these early on. Here is where most experts miss a gigantic opportunity. You have done all this research on them, and they probably have not researched you at all, and we don't expect them to. People are busy, right?

Who else did baby pictures for their senior year yearbook? So embarrassing. Okay. And this is when we had like three, like three baby pictures. Now we have like 29,000 of, of pictures of our, our children from each month. Okay. Educate them. So let's say the call's booked for, Friday morning, right? And it's Monday morning, and you have...

So you have four days, basically. Let me give you an example of what I mean when I say let me give you some examples. And so let... See what I did here, uh-huh? Let me give you an example of an example. Oh, very meta. Okay. So you could send a simple confirmation email that says Before our coffee chat on Friday, I wanted to share a quick example, there it is again, if I say the word example again, I'm gonna annoy myself, of the type of work I do so you have a clearer picture.

So I am saying I recently worked with someone, but you could say there are lots of people who have this problem. So my template for me, and those of you who have had clients before in your area and haven't just pivoted, you can say, "I recently worked with a consultant who was with a blank, who was getting plenty of interest, but very few decisions.

That is my title. However, this is a little bit more clear, right? So an example gives their brain something to hold. It says, "Oh, I know someone with that problem." Or their brain says, "Hey, that sounds like me." Or, "I did not realize she helped at that stage," for example. So the same principle appears in episode 68, sell results, not processes.

You know, like dating. Because I want a backdoor if I don't wanna be there anymore, and I want them to have the same. I don't like long, hard relationships, you know what I mean? Let's make it easy for everyone. okay, sorry, I'm laughing about another song that's coming to my mind, but I won't sing it. I'm holding back right now.

This is me not singing. Thank you. You're welcome, because you don't wanna hear that. All right. So they need to see the result. That's the reality. And if you've got 'em, share a t- a short testimonial. So if you've got testimonials, share 'em. If you have a case study, yeah, share it. But don't stress about it. Or a piece of content, let's say, that you've recently written or created that reflects how you think.

So Don't let that stop you. You're allowed to send an email manually. There is no automation police. Nobody is coming to your house to confiscate your business license because you copied and pasted a thoughtful email. Write it once, use it again, improve it over time. You may eventually create a simple sequence like an appointment confirmation sequence, a short question based on the context around their business, a story or example about your work.

Okay? You wanna be better than your dentist. My dentist sends me at least 15 messages between when I book and then when I get there, and I'm like, "That feels like a lot." Okay, so you book the coffee chat. Here's what you can say to them: "Hey, just so you know, everyone who books a time on my calendar receives a few short emails before we meet.

It's part of my process so we can just make the most of our time." Now they know what to expect, right? And they're not wondering why their casual coffee chat suddenly has a corporate headquarters logo. So, but here's the reality. You've created a container, right? So a 20-minute coffee chat can truly benefit both of you, and a process builds confidence, like genuinely, right?

All right. I did talk about this, if this sounds familiar, in episode 72, called Sales Call Tips for Consultants Who Are Done Winging It. Preparation, my friends, changes the quality of the conversation. It helps you lead like an expert instead of showing up and hoping the other person figures out why this relationship could be so valuable.

Before the call, ask yourself, "What might the next logical step be?" Not, "How do I force an offer into this conversation?" Bleh. Barf, barf, barf. Do not do that. Never feel like that, you have to do that. The next step may be paid, maybe not It could be a strategy session. It could be an invitation to a group event you're attending or hosting, right?

I've got a lot of friends that are doing all kinds of cool stuff, and sometimes they're like, "Hey, you wanna bring somebody?" And maybe it's an in-person event, maybe it's virtual, whatever. Depends on who it is and what's going on. It could also be an introduction to someone in your network or them introducing you to someone in theirs.

So it doesn't just have to be a sale or nothing, and that's the part that I saw so clearly when I first came into the online space. They were only counting the sales. They were only valuing the sales, and that's why people were shrugging away and crying about sales , because they weren't looking at it the way I've always looked at it.

And this has been my hill that I would die on since I came into the online space. And so at the end of the day, it could very easily just be a second conversation. So if none of those things feel like you, just invite them to something next. Because the important thing is that you do not wait until the final 30 seconds of the meeting to invent a next step.

Would you like me to share what that could look like?" It's direct, but it's not pushy You asked permission and the recommendation is connected to the problem they self-described So again, this is very situational, but it's definitely one option. And reality is you are not suddenly pulling an offer out of a trench coat like a man selling watches on the street corner.

That's happened a lot, right? So if this framework seems to f- feel like you've been doing good and, you know, it's feeling like, "Oh, okay, I really like this," yeah, it's because I designed it for people just like us, for high-ticket B2B service providers and consultants to help us avoid the wrong relationships, the wrong clients.

More revenue is not helpful if the project makes you wanna throw your laptop in a lake. You know what I'm saying? So the goal is not to sell to everyone. The goal is clarity. Can I help? Do I want to help? Is this the right person? Is this the right problem? Is this the right time? This is selling peer-to-peer.

Because you are not hunting for a way to throw a pitch in there. You are looking for the best next step for both of you. For both of you. Okay You have all four pieces of the framework, and now, now we need to talk about the ending because this is where the otherwise lovely coffee chats go to die. "Great talking to you."

Do not say, "I'll send you my calendar," because then you send the calendar, they forget, you follow up, I hope, they mean to respond, three weeks pass, Mercury goes into retrograde, everybody loses their will to live. And instead, while you are still together on the phone, you could have just said, "I know we're at time, and there is more I would like to talk to you about.

No. No, we didn't. No. I don't care. No. Fight me. Okay, let's go. All right. Let me give you a real example here I'm just gonna call this person Rachel, my best friend from high school who I love still. Uh, that is not this person's real name that I'm gonna give you an example around, but I just like that name.

People told her she was brilliant. They said, "Oh, I love your energy." They promised to keep her in mind, but almost nothing moved forward. No calls back, no referrals, no projects. Rachel thought she needed more. "Ah, Renee, I need more. More coffee chats, more visibility, more summits, more, more." Um, she did not. She needed a process.

So Rachel sent a message before the call, "Hey, I heard you mention that you're moving toward corporate work. Uh, what is making that shift important right now?" The person replied with a thoughtful answer. Rachel then sent a short client example showing how she helped another business package scattered work into a clearer offer for a corporate buyer By the time they met, they did not need to spend 15 minutes figuring out what each person did for a living.

They started with the real issue, and during the call, the woman was like, "I didn't realize you helped with this part also." Boom. There it is, right? Education problem solved. Rachelle recommended a paid session. The woman said yes. The coffee chat did not magically close the sale. The work before the coffee chat created the conditions for a useful decision, a beneficial, a mutually beneficial decision.

They buy because they understand their problem differently after talking with you. They research. They think. They ponder. They cry. They moan. But your research helps you ask the right questions. Your questions help them see the problem. Your examples help them understand the possibility that they didn't even see in front of them.

That is selling your expertise. It is not dumping information on people, and it's definitely not proving that you are the smartest person in the room. It is helping someone see a pathway that they could not see alone, and it is not because you have some magical answers. What you have, my friend, is experience, and you recognize patterns.

You see connections between things that they're saying that they didn't even know to ask. You see two or three moves ahead of where they're at because of your background and experience, and that is valuable Okay, you have everything you need to make your next coffee chat worth the time investment, and you know that I am a woman of action.

I think my cousin works for the CIA. I don't know. He won't tell me. Maybe even ch- Here's the reality. You'll maybe even choose someone you've already met. Like, we, people are like, "Oh, Brené, where's the, where am I gonna choose the one person?" Now you're gonna stress over which person should be the one. Well, just choose, make it easy for yourself, right?

Choose someone in your network, or choose someone you've been meaning to reconnect with. Invite them to a 20-minute coffee chat, and then before the call, spend 15 minutes doing recon. Even if you've known them for 20 years but you haven't talked in two, except for saying hi on Instagram and sending each other funny memes, do recon.

Again, so many of us who've known people for years believe, falsely, that they know everything we know. They live inside our head. They know me. I know them. They know me. We know each other. Yeah, you did, and you do, but what are you up to right now? Like, I mean, my husband, we haven't been in the same room for over two hours.

So- You're gonna send a thoughtful question before the call, and you can even use this. Steal this. "Hey, I'm preparing for our conversation," or, "for our coffee chat, and I noticed you're working on X. What? That's amazing. Now, tell me, why is this the priority right now?" Or, "Tell me why this has become so important right now."

Or, "Tell me more about why this is important today." That's it, right? Like, you're asking about the urgency. You're asking about what's happening right now and why it's important right now. Like, how did this bec- how did you decide this was your priority now? And that's it, right? Like, one person, 15 minutes, one thoughtful question, and then listen.

I got good grades, but I also do get paid to talk to people, so there's that. All right. During the call, you're gonna listen, and you're gonna give them your next best step. You're not gonna decide in advance that you must sell something, obviously. You do not leave the conversation floating in outer space either, so you're gonna recommend a next step.

You're gonna book it before you hang up because sales momentum does not come from cramming more random conversations into your calendar. It comes from having better conversations with intention, right? Say it with me. My coffee chat does not need to last two hours to show that I'm friendly and good to work with.

Ask better questions. Share the examples. Give your best advice. Ah, keep the relationship moving. Okay. Now, most important of all, go to askmecoach.com for all the best ways to hang out beyond this podcast. This week, I got new stuff there, kids. I will talk to you soon. Have a great one.