EPISODE SUMMARY:

In this episode, I sit down with my patients, David and Melody, a couple whose story spans recurrent pregnancy loss, the stillbirth of their son at 37 weeks, and the long road back to hope. We talk candidly about what it took to keep moving forward through grief, why “simple fixes” and generic timelines weren’t enough, and how individualized care and real-time data helped us uncover what had been missed. We also discuss how they navigated adoption alongside their fertility journey, what shifted in their bodies and mindset before their healthy pregnancy, and why they chose to write their book, The Process of the Suddenly, while still in the middle of their story. It is a profound honor to walk this journey with my patients, to problem-solve through the setbacks, to celebrate the breakthroughs, and ultimately to witness the moment they hold their baby in their arms. Hearing Melody’s birth story and seeing their daughter was nothing short of magical. If you are in the middle of your own uphill climb, I hope their story reminds you that healing is possible and that your body is capable of more than you’ve been led to believe.

ABOUT DR. JANE’S PRACTICE:

Dr. Jane is a Naturopathic Doctor and a Natural Fertility Expert. She and her team of expert practitioners help couples navigate infertility for 1+ years, get to the root cause of their struggles, heal, and bring healthy babies home.

After having a family member struggle with infertility and experiencing a miscarriage herself, Dr. Jane realized how little support and education women receive. She is on a mission to change that. Since 2020, she has dedicated her practice to fertility, where she and her practitioners work with couples 1:1, running functional lab work, customizing treatment plans and providing her couples with the support they need to get pregnant, have a stress free pregnancy and a healthy baby.

Learn more about Dr. Jane’s practice: www.drjanelevesque.com/practice

Apply to work with Dr. Jane & her team: www.drjanelevesque.com/application

Join to receive Dr. Jane's weekly Fertility Files: https://link.getcmm.com/widget/form/JStvkHpRAamc7VwPMEQE

CHAPTERS:

00:00 Introduction to David and Melody's Journey

02:38 Facing Loss and Seeking Hope

06:47 The Importance of Faith and Community

09:38 Navigating Adoption and Fertility Challenges

12:20 Real-Time Adjustments in the Fertility Journey

15:42 The Power of Partnership in Healing

18:14 Overcoming Impatience in the Process

20:34 The Journey to a Healthy Pregnancy

27:09 Navigating Pregnancy Changes

28:59 The Emotional Journey of Pregnancy

31:08 Finding the Right Support

32:47 The Birth Experience

35:17 Postpartum Reflections

38:07 Feeding and Nurturing Differences

40:05 Generational Health and Parenting

41:20 The Journey of Writing a Book

TAKEAWAYS:

David and Melody faced multiple miscarriages before seeking help.

They emphasized the importance of community and faith during tough times.

Adoption is a beautiful journey, not a fallback option.

Real-time data tracking helped them make informed decisions.

Partnership and accountability were crucial in their journey.

Pregnancy after loss brought both hope and anxiety.

The birth experience was a healing moment for Melody.

Generational health is a key focus for their family.

They wrote their book during their fertility journey.

The process of healing is ongoing and requires patience.

About My Guests:

If you would like to connect with David and Melody please head over to their website - https://www.edenwellnesshealth.com/

If you would like to read the book they wrote about their fertility journey check out this link - https://a.co/d/01WiDLKE

ABOUT NATURAL FERTILITY:

Pregnancy is a natural process, so if it’s not happening or it’s not sticking, something is missing. Join Dr. Jane, a naturopathic doctor and a natural fertility expert, every Tuesday at 9am for insightful case studies, expert interviews and practical tips on optimizing your fertility naturally.

If you’ve struggling with infertility, pregnancy loss, women’s health issues or just want to be proactive and prepare yourself for the next big chapter in your life… this show is for you.

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Individualized care is essential for effective treatment of chronic fertility issues.

Hi guys, welcome to another episode of Natural Fertility with Dr. Jane. I of course am Dr. Jane and today I have David and Melody joining me. And David and Melody, we met a couple of years ago and I'm really excited to share your journey because you are one of those couples that unfortunately or maybe fortunately because we met, your story broke my heart. And I am so glad to have you on the other side to share it with everybody of what's possible.

Yeah, thanks for having us. We're always honored and excited to share our story and hopefully with that bring a little bit of hope to others. Yeah, thank you this opportunity.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Of course. And you guys wrote a book about it. So we'll talk about the book and really the journey. But do you want to tell people where you were before we met?

Sure.

Yeah, so essentially before we met we had and this is in our book too, but I'll just kind of briefly give everyone an overview. But we had after two and a half years into our marriage, we decided, all right, we'd love to have a family, start having some kids. And so that's kind of where our journey started and just building our family. And through that, we ended up having two miscarriages in a year. And then we eventually took a little bit of time, did some

really basic testing just to see all was my progesterone off or you know something simple like that we were looking for a simple fix essentially at that time in our lives which now we know

I love the quotations because it's true. Like we're always just hoping for a simple fix.

Yes, and it doesn't really work that way. But essentially, we kind of did that. We took a couple years off. We ended up getting pregnant with our son, Kanan, who actually ended up being stillborn on September 7th, 2021, all the COVID crazy stuff. And so really, that was kind of our journey, our start to our family. And it really wasn't going.

That's not where we had hoped to be at that age in our lives. And so that's really kind of what led us to working with you and really seeking out, we need to find something different. Like there's somebody out there that can help us search for the deeper root causes and not just one root cause, but various ones that we ended up finding out with your help. But that's essentially, yeah, kind of where that started.

kind of tried everything up to this point naturally and medically and all the things and just obviously the results just weren't happening the way that we were hoping and so yeah I think you know just finding I think Melody you found her on Instagram or something. did I actually

Thanks, algorithm!

Yes, too funny. So it works, but I was kind of just like desperate and for us, like our faith is a really big deal in our lives. And so I was just like talking to Lord and I was like, I got to find like the right person to work with. didn't want to got number one. I did not want to give up. I just we both had that in us. Like we still had hope we didn't want to give up. We knew that this was possible, that like my body was not broken and it could be fixed.

But number two, I just knew there was someone out there that was willing to dig deeper, was willing to ask different questions, think outside the box, maybe do different testing or whatever needed to happen. And I ended up coming across your page and just looking at some of the things you had posted, some different health issues like PCOS and other things that I had dealt with. And I really felt like I aligned with just how you talked about things and thought through

things and so I ended up reaching out and that's when we decided as a couple, okay if we're gonna do this it's not just gonna be me, it's gonna be both of us like we're gonna be all in there's no halfway in we're going in deep and I am so thankful that we did that. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

What do you think kept your hope? think this is really important. Having a loss at, you know, I mean any loss is heartbreaking, but at 37 weeks, it is just, and I like, I remember crying with you guys on calls. I remember reading your story and just being like, my God, you know, it's, it's unimaginable, but hearing you say that you still had hope that you believed that your body wasn't broken.

Do you think this is just your faith or do you think that this is something from upbringing as well or like combination? Because I see a lot of women not being able to have any hope and give up and go into a really dark place. And, you know, not to say that you didn't go to a dark place, but you still had that light.

Thank

Yeah, think honestly it's important to actually walk through that dark place. There's a scripture verse that says, even though I through the shadow, the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil.

I think it's the walking through part. That's the important part. Sometimes it's to maybe set up a tent and camp there. run away. so I think- Fight or fight. Yeah, just with-

each other, our faith in God and obviously family, friends, people like yourself, community too. It's all important to just kind of keep you just moving forward, just taking the next step because that's really what it boils down to is can I wake up the next day and win this day, win the next day, win the next day and kind of stack those things.

I remember there's a phrase if we end up reading our book for those out there that are interested, actually I think it's a phrase you mentioned in there, but we just needed to know what to do next. That's what we felt like with our faith. were hearing from God like, okay, what do we need to do next? Like we wanted to keep moving forward and it was just asking that question.

We had asked all the why questions of course going through that group and process if you need to. Like there is a point you absolutely need to do that because that is part of dealing and processing it. But then we finally got to the spot of okay what's next? What are our next steps? Which was really important to get to that part.

Yep. Yeah, I mean, just so listeners, it's like IVF was never really on the table for you. that's, think that did the conventional system, that's all they recommended. Did the...

So yeah, so when we actually had done like some of the basic, more basic medical testing, they told us because even though we had the lawsuits that we had, they said because we were able to get pregnant, they didn't necessarily recommend that we had to do IVF right away, but they're like, you know, if it's not happening after a while and you want to, obviously we'll help you with that. So I'm thankful that for us, because I know many, many people.

to do that straight away. And for us, didn't necessarily have to, although it didn't come super easy for us after losing our son, so.

Yeah. Yeah, it's, you know, and then the favorite is like, well, then you can just adopt. And you went through that process as well. And you, mean, firsthand can probably tell people that it's not that simple and it's not that easy. And you were definitely blessed with have love, right? As when we started working together. But before that, it was another compounding effect of, you know, it's so frustrating because you just get, oh, you can just adopt. And it's like, I don't think people really understand what that means.

the process that it actually is.

Yeah, I think that's a complicated question because like first off.

I always want to say, and I know this is a fertility podcast, but adoption is not a plan B. Adoption is an amazing redeeming thing. And we are so blessed to have our daughter, our first daughter via adoption. she's amazing. She's incredible. She's had her own journey and just continues to overcome every single day, which is, which is super fun. But yeah, it did feel like.

almost like people would write off the fact that we could have kids biologically and like, okay, well, people like you just have to adopt. And it was like, it was like this JV opportunity, like, and it just, it's not the way we see it. so it was hard. You have to have grace for people because they don't really know what they're saying sometimes, but challenging.

Yep.

100%. Yeah, I always say it's like they don't mean it. But it's also or like, you know, now I think we're in a place where you're like, I don't even know what to have a conversation about because I'm so scared to offend everybody. And, you know, it's the more that you learn and the more I mean, before I was in the fertility space, I used to ask people all the time when they're having kids. And now it's like, that's not a thing you ask. Like you just don't.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Let's talk about the process, because the process with me was also not easy. And I think that's really important to outline because there isn't a magic pill and you guys were all in and even for couples who are all in. It was still a rigorous process, but I'd love to kind of from your perspective and I can share my perspective where I think were some of the really big turning points. But from your perspective, what were the turning points that you were like, OK.

this is it and this is how I feel different or this was the most helpful in the journey.

yeah, I mean, would say I think a meeting with you kind of that first time in.

kind of just when you kind of go over the brief overview of like essentially the end goals and like, okay, yes, we want to hopefully have a baby but also like we want you to actually both be healthy and gain like real health, all those different things that you talk about. And just kind of really putting our shifting our perspective, I would say like going about it like because sometimes like when you have those losses, and it's obviously extremely hard

You almost have like an empty hole in your heart and you just immediately you're like, I don't care. However it'll happen, however it'll work, I just want to be right. Like, and there's so many.

Yep.

people probably listening to this that can relate to that feeling at some point in their journey. And we had to get to the spot of like, okay, once we are parents, like we actually want to be healthy so we can run around with our kids. We're not always sick. So we're not, you know, the list goes on. So it was also like that generational health that you talk about. love that phrase, essentially just kind of going into that. And for us, you know, we were parenting

adopted child that we now have had and working with you. So for us, we were kind of in a spot like, we're like, all right, we're gonna do both. Like, we still have faith that we're gonna also have a biological child while we're raising this child. And then it was obviously a beautiful journey. But I would say you would just honing in like every month, like, you always asked about the symptoms, your experience, how has has they changed, you know, switching up supplement, regimens and that kind

of thing was really helpful because we were used to the typical okay let's wait three months let's wait six months and then we'll check stuff you are very much correct of of like we're gonna keep moving forward but we're also gonna change things when we need to because we you might know

Yeah.

need more, whatever it would be. And so I really appreciated someone being able to do that because I felt like more progress was happening faster, even though I knew it was going to be a problem.

Mm-hmm.

It still feels slow, but it does faster when I hear people like, come back in three months, come back in six months. I'm like, in the fertility space, you can't do that. It's too long.

Yeah.

Yeah, because then you're just, hope something changes versus like, know stuff is changing. I would say for me, one thing that was really helpful was the aura ring actually, which I'm not sure if you're in yours, but I just put mine back on post-partum here, just checking things, but that was really helpful. you kind of teaching us about that a little bit and like, okay, these are, this is, you know, stuff tracking stuff in real time and every single day there's so much information.

that was very usable to switch up stuff when we needed to. Tracking like basal body temperature, that was super, super useful. Tracking like with my cycles. So that's kind of a practical thing, but that was super helpful I would say. And doing more in-depth testing that we maybe weren't familiar with. That was also extremely.

Yep.

Yeah. Yeah. Just to kind of reiterate that is I think the biggest help for us was the real time tweaking, if you will, the real time adjustments that just kind of helped us stay on the right path. Like we kind of alluded to this earlier, but we had tried a lot of other things, a lot of other natural doctors, a lot of other, you know, blood testing, stool testing, mold testing. had honestly.

Heavy metals, you did a lot of heavy metals, right? Clangy chelation and stuff. Yeah, there's lots.

We had honestly done a lot of it and so we're pretty familiar with it, but like Melody said, was okay, blood test, and then we do a few things and we test again in three to six months and it just never felt like you could really move the needle. And so I feel like that real time data drip approach.

actually helped us keep hope alive because we could kind of see like, okay, this is working, this is helping, or wait, we need to adjust this a little bit and kind of changing those things in real time helped it kind of keep it interesting too and keep us moving forward. Yeah. Yep.

What was it like for you to have Dave on board this time? Because it's not like he wasn't on board. He was always supportive. But I think there was a shift in like, Dave's got some things that he has to work on and you have some things and then you guys are working together through some things.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yes, I think it was really helpful in that accountability piece because he was really good at doing things before. Yes. Yes. And I, you know, I finally got to the spot where I'm like, yes, you're right. Like, this is not a negotiable thing. Like I need to grow up and do this. But also, I would say like, yeah, just obviously the emotional.

Yep.

You just have to do it lovingly, You don't know taking your supplements again.

piece too because there was times that I felt like quitting and I was like I don't know if this is gonna work you know and he's like no we gotta just give it a chance you gotta keep going like don't give up just like that endurance with it which that is part of just new personality too but that was super helpful

Because then you're not alone. You're not like, okay, I'm the one that has to do all this stuff and it's just me. Like, it's like, no, it's also you together, right? Because obviously the child that you hopefully will have is going to have a piece of each of you. So that was super helpful for me to know that.

A couple of things for me as a clinician that shifted because I remember when I met and it was like, okay, they've done a lot of heavy mold. They've done heavy metals mold detox and you didn't have a PCOS diagnosis. And, but you're like, kind of suspect that I have it. And I remember the shift for me was like, I just need to start treating her like she does have it because even though there wasn't like the cysts on the ovaries or like the

blood sugar wasn't super dysregulated. It was when we put that CGM on you, that continuous glucose monitor, and we actually saw that you weren't, you were dropping below so often that made me realize that like, oh my God, she does have blood sugar dysregulation. It's just the other way. But when I tested just the HB1C, you always passed with flying colors. You had like a 4.8 or maybe a 5.0 at most.

Yeah.

But it was that I'm glad that you guys found that data tracking helpful as well, because that's what kind of keeps me going. Something is missing here. Something is missing here. And when we put the blood sugar monitor on you, Mel, I found that was like a big aha moment for me as a clinician. And then it was like, OK, we're treating PCOS. And even now, I'm like, oh, I would have done this and I would have done that. And that's just part of working with different couples that.

The gift that you guys give to other couples that you don't even realize is the experience that I get working with you. I can then apply it, you know, and help faster if that's possible, you know, cause you're troubleshooting a little bit faster where I'm like, nope, you're gonna put the CGM on now. I'm not gonna wait six months anymore. You're just gonna put that on cause something isn't right here, you know. And ordering, I love it. Like, cause then I just look at the sleep and then I know.

up.

And you guys with have led the first little bit, there was quite a bit of sleep training and trying to manage hormones and all of that stuff.

Yeah, especially for those listening that maybe do have a child already or are experiencing secondary infertility. It is a whole other level as well, working towards this at the same time. self-care is important.

Yeah, mean, what would you say kept you going? Because there was a component of like, and I mean, every couple goes through this and I almost wait for it where you're like, I am just working so hard on all of these things. When is it going to happen? What is the kind of advice that you can give based on what you guys went through and the kind of impatience that starts to happen as you're putting lots of effort into something but you don't quite see the fruits of the labor yet?

Yeah, I guess the biggest thing I can say is it's gonna be worth it. It's gonna pay off. And it's so easy, and I can attest to this, it's so easy to really want the end result. And when you're not seeing that, get discouraged and wanna give up, or it's getting too expensive, or it's getting...

heart on your body, all the things, it's all intertwined in it. And I think just realizing like, you you're doing these things to.

all of it.

impact the next generation, your kids, their kids, and really to invest in that and to kind of take that approach of pulling yourself out of the day-to-day grind a little bit and saying, okay, these things, I know I'm on the right track. I know I'm making the right adjustments. I have the right guidance. I just seem to keep doing the things and get so caught up in the end result. And, you know, the title of our book is called

you

process of suddenly and so so many times in our culture especially we were fixated on the suddenly we're fixated on the now but there's such a process behind that.

by the moment they...

you

And then sometimes when you fail, because we all will, to realize that you can brush that off too and then start making the right decisions again.

Did you come up with the title of the book first? Or was that after writing it, the book, then you were like, what do we name it?

No,

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, that's very insightful title. And I mean, I understood it, I believed. So it's very nice for you to talk about it in that way where it's like there is still a process to then suddenly something happening in your favor. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yep.

Do you want to talk about the pregnancy? What was different this time?

Yeah, I would say for us, I was very surprised after...

Laughter I'll just give a little brief leading up to an actual pregnancy, but once we got kind of close to Almost a year. I think working with you. I think that's when I was and you probably remember I was really close to my breaking point because I was like Okay, this has been like a year and I'm like red so red

Yeah, I just won the baby, yeah.

And everyone, feel like, you know, gets to that point, which, which still trying to be patient. But I think we had some really good conversations like through that of just, you know, being open to different things and trying other things and you can hold in, okay, let's, let's try these specific things and then go for it kind of a thing. And it works essentially like that's not what happened. We tried, we got pregnant and I think we were both, I'm trying to even remember like how you react.

but it was like the faintest of the faintest lines on the desk and I think he was getting ready for work.

One day when it happened, I took the test, I was waiting for it however many minutes you have to wait. And he must have peaked before I went back to check it. And I'll let you kind of say your point here. How do you felt about that? I don't want you to interrupt. Yeah. Well, many of you listening will identify with this, but you kind of get used to in a bad way, like negative tests after negative tests after negative tests after negative tests.

It was, I thought it was just another one of those. I, yeah, it snuck a peak. It was in the bathroom. It was negative or so I thought. Like I didn't see the line or it wasn't like prominent enough. So I just thought, okay, well, it's just the hundredth time this has happened. So I just kind of started going about my day showering and getting ready for work. And then, and then, yeah, I think.

I came back, yep, after my little timer went off, went in there and I was like, hey, did you look at this? And he kind of reacted like, what do mean? You know? And I was like, no, like there's, there's a faint line here. Like, and I took I think two or three paths because I was like, I'm going to make sure before I send Dr.

yeah, I know. The Costco size, right?

Yes. And so yeah, it was, it happened and it was awesome. Obviously there was a little bit of anxiety there like, okay, you know, it took all that time to get to this spot. Now we're at this spot and we want the ending to be good, right? We want a full term healthy baby here in our arms. So there was a little bit of that in the beginning of my pregnancy I would say. But for me, I'm very

Mm-hmm.

thankful that I had the support that I did around around us. Our faith obviously was a big piece of that. And then I was still connected with some pregnancy loss support groups that actually had really helpful resources like in that as well. And I mentioned that in our book too. That also helps like okay once you get pregnant after a loss you know going through that and just having helpful things. And making sure that I you know we had decided to do more check-ins

with the OB, just being more, a little bit more all eyes on it, would say, like at this point, just making sure that we noticed anything in the very beginning that we needed to be aware of. And we just had peace about that and that was okay.

And so for me, I did have like some a little bit of morning sickness. It wasn't like severe, but I did have that. Whereas with my son that was stillborn, I didn't have any morning sickness at all. And I remember actually praying at one point before I got pregnant that I would notice something different, that I actually, you know, would be able to tell, OK, this is definitely different. didn't experience this last time. And that was one of the things. Not that that's fun to experience.

but I just felt like, okay, I feel like this is a healthy pregnancy. I don't have too much of it, but there's a little bit. And so, yeah.

You sent him out for runs for food and that's how I know it's also different.

Yes, I did. And that really, yeah. That was a very abnormal thing.

Yeah, yeah. My husband was like, do you remember you made me tour the Greek restaurants all over our city town? I was like, yeah, but I remember. He was like, I don't like this Greek food, try this restaurant. And he would literally just be showing up every day when I was pregnant with my last. It was like so funny.

That is funny. It's like in your Caribbean stream. Yeah.

Yep.

And I mean, that's partially, you know, what is supposed to happen to you. And so yeah, kind of going through that once we got to our 20 week ultrasound, that was a big, a big step for us because we actually hadn't done that with our other son. And that's typically, if you guys are familiar with where they do measurements, they check, okay, are all the organs, are the body parts there, are they relative to the correct size? They should be at the gestation.

the different things and so I remember being really anxious for that like okay.

We're going to find out are things good or are they not potentially. And so once it was finished and she was like, everything looks amazing, completely normal. Like to hear the words normal was such a relief for me. I'm sure it was for you too. It was just like, okay, like I can breathe now. Finally, it felt like. And so, yeah, as we continued on, we did do other ultrasounds that previously

Yeah.

Just being more natural minded, we didn't want to have to do all these, but because of this pregnancy, wanted to make sure everything was good and okay. We decided to do that. And she is doing a wonderful, and I'm so glad that we did that for peace of mind. Because sometimes you need to have that peace of mind emotionally and mentally.

Mm-hmm. Yep.

through the process. So yeah, I we did things. I'm trying to think we went on some trips during the pregnancy.

Yeah, I didn't feel like this time around like, I had to like stop doing like certain things and I wasn't doing like any like, I would say for example, like I wasn't doing a bunch of crossfit like previously to, you know, I didn't like start new things like all of sudden, but I did, I just kept doing the things that I did previously and just kind of stayed steady through it so that my body didn't have those abrupt like changes. So.

And you definitely gained more weight with this pregnancy in terms of like actual pregnancy itself you felt like everything just felt a little bit different.

Yeah.

Yes, and yes, that was a good point because that was something I was nervous about like because with my son, that was someone I didn't gain much weight at all. And so yeah, this time around is very healthy, like weight gain, everything, appetite, all the things. So yeah, yeah, I was thankful for that.

Yeah and then I don't know, Dave do you have anything to add before we go into the bringing it home?

No, you guys have kind of already touched on all the major differences.

Mm-hmm. Yep. Yeah, it's hard because you don't know... It's like you don't know what a healthy pregnancy should feel like when it's your first time. And then you're gonna second guess a lot of things and you're not. But I think retrospectively, and so when I had my miscarriage in between my two girls, I just remember thinking during my miscarriage, was like, I'm lucky I'm not getting sick at all.

And then it was like, my hormones didn't go up.

That's why. And I think in retrospect, like you said, there's this anxiety that starts to happen naturally, because obviously you don't want to have another loss and you don't know if you've done enough and if this is it. And there a lot of it is still in God's hands. Right. And so like you, if anything, at that point, it's like, hey, we've done the work now. We just have to quote unquote, see if that is going to take us to our destination. But retrospectively, you can look back and go,

Yeah, this was different, you know, and whether that's I was a bit more tired. I did. remember you also started all of sudden sleeping for nine hours before I was like, we got to get you over seven. We got to get you over seven. And then it was like, yep, I'm going to bed at eight. It's like, OK, good. And then, you know, I'm getting snacky or I'm eating a lot more or I'm picky or whatever. Or I have gained more weight, which.

like you're very petite, that that is a really great sign, you know, because you're not going to have a lot, like the baby's going to take up room. So it was good signs for me and I think, you know, for people listening to know. Go ahead.

Yep. I was...

If there's one thing I could add in there, think as I was working with you at the same time, like through the pregnancy and I was working with the OBE, the OBE that I had picked to work with was very like respectful and okay with me working with you at the same time. Like, and I feel like that is very important to find the right person to work with that is going to respect because I would always have to ask them, I need you to draw these labs and she would always be

like, yep, no problem at all. Whereas if it was like a different nurse practitioner that day, they'd like to question and whatever. But if it was her, it was like, yep, no problem, I understand. And that also gave me comfort too, like, okay, I don't have someone asking a bunch of questions or worrying me or anything like that. So that was a requirement too.

Yes.

huge.

Yeah, I 100 % I think I and I made this mistake with one of my clients and she still ended up having a you know a healthy pregnancy and healthy baby but at the beginning and she had two miscarriages before we met and at the beginning she didn't have an OB set up so when she got pregnant she essentially I just she had issues with thyroid and I wanted to test thyroid and progesterone and the HCG and no one would test her numbers so she was now pregnant

at seven weeks, freaking out, trying to get like constantly just going to a beer after and it's like there's so much stress there that was unnecessary. So I basically was like, okay.

Everybody, if you want to get pregnant, you need to work with people who are going to support you because it's basic tests and like she needed thyroid medication. So there was finally a doctor that said like, yes, I'll run it. And her TSH was at like five point. we want, you know, and I was like, why don't you just do this? Like she's pregnant. Just help her out. You know, these are not expensive tests. So I would agree that that is really important to have. And we did run quite a bit of stuff just to check on cholesterol and blood sugar and, you know, all those things that I think get really overlooked.

once somebody is pregnant and it's like, pregnancy is the hardest thing your body will ever do and you already have a baby and you have a history of miscarriages. It's like, we just need to do our due diligence, you know?

Yep.

Yes, exactly. Yep, I agree.

Yeah. I didn't obviously get to be there for this part, but I ended up crying when you guys send me a message because I was also anxious waiting to meet her. What was it like for you, Mel?

Yeah.

Hmm, it was, but it still feels a little bit surreal to this day, which is probably kind of crazy because it's been over three months now as we're talking today, but I got to have the natural birth that I want to now. Yes, everything didn't go exactly how I wanted it

especially the end but that's okay because she's healthy there was no crazy interventions and I I think part of that too like I had a birth plan and everything but I had kind of developed that relationship there at the hospital and her know these are the things I wanted

It rarely does.

and how I wanted my birth to go and they're very honoring of that, you know, and of course they would suggest, know, usually recommend this, we usually have moms do this and that was like totally fine. But having like that voice to be able to speak up and like actually this is what feels right for my body right now, especially during the labor and breathing process. And I had to do a lot there with me just to have an extra piece of support for myself and for David Tootie.

Thank

Yep.

even show him different things that could be helpful. But yeah, everything went fairly well. She was safely birthed, which was the most important to us, obviously, going through that process. It was definitely a redeeming moment for me versus having my son and going through that horrible experience. But just like, OK, actually hearing her cry right away, know, them putting her right up

on my chest immediately after was just like, it's so hard to describe when it happens to you, like you'll understand, but it's just, yeah, amazing feeling like, okay, wow, here she is, like all that hard work.

Thank you.

Mm-hmm.

perfect and beautiful and then more work starts again in a good way, right? Because now my body has to nourish this baby and make sure everything is going good and that she's growing. And so I'm really thankful for the support I've had around for that. And at the hospital, they were really great with that. Even though I would have loved to have a home birth, this time around, I think for me, it was more the emotional piece and of past trauma.

Yeah.

you

that I had, just wanted to make sure I had just that, I don't know, like a safety net almost kind of, having the birth later and in the future, who knows, like maybe it'll be different. But I'm super thankful for the experience, so. Change our lives forever. Yeah.

Yep.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Did anybody comment at the hospital how healthy she looked and how plump she was?

She was big. I remember when they were like 8 pounds 14 ounces I was like shocked. And also so thankful that you know she didn't wait longer to come out either because I am this I'm a little bit more like petite, a little bit smaller person. And so I was like wow just to like kind of be amazed I think with my body that I was able to do that.

Mm-hmm.

I know, isn't it amazing? It's amazing.

I'm not gonna comment it on my placenta Apparently my placenta was huge in their opinion My doula encapsulated for me and she I will not forget the next morning She walked in with although placenta caps of placenta caps was the gimme And was like wow You have like I think she said 30 % bigger. Yes 130 pills and most of my clients it's like a hundred. So she's like you have like an actual

Listen down like, okay, wow, I, you know, wouldn't have expected any of that. So, yep, definitely. Yes. And then remember in.

Yep. You made that from scratch, isn't that nuts? The baby too, but also the placenta.

Right. Yep. And it being very healthy versus like obviously with my son in that situation it was small, it wasn't like formed correctly, it wasn't bringing the right nutrients. So just really cool seeing all even just the detailed parts of it be different. Yeah.

Yep. Yeah. It's like, good job, mama. You know, you did it. It's a, it's such a healing.

I mean, I can't imagine how healing it was for you. I know that my second birth was very healing for me because of my first birth. it's essentially you go from like doubting your body to like, my God, I did this. And I remember I like snapped a photo of myself right after labor and I was glowing because I was just so proud of myself. know, like honestly, it was just like, my God, I can't believe I did that.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. It is.

It's a really empowering moment. And it doesn't happen every birth, you know, like we hope that it does, but it definitely didn't happen for me the first time around. What are the differences? I'm just curious. This is more for me, because you guys.

Mm-hmm.

when you adopted there was a lot of like sleep and because she was born remind me 26 weeks 27 weeks she was born really prematurely 29 how is what did you notice in terms of the difference from like the sleep training to the feeding to everything did you notice a difference

29 weeks premature.

The feeding is like obviously totally different because she's exclusively breastfeeding so that's awesome. Cavala, you know, couldn't even eat through a bottle for her first... a little while. We were tube feeding and...

We had to go to the hospital in Minneapolis, Children's Hospital here. so they actually, they were one of the only places I think in the country that sent us home with the equipment to tube feed. Otherwise we would have had to stay there. So that was kind of nice. But obviously we were up every couple hours and try to fit formula through a tube and figure it all

Yep.

trying to get her to eat, she had bottle aversions and all kinds of stuff. I mean, this is completely different. Yeah, there's still, yeah, I would say, yeah, this journey has been very different and even learning even when you say, you know, quote unquote, natural, like being my baby.

nursing, which is a natural thing, right? But there's also a learning curve to that as well that was bringing to me. And so we went through a whole process of that and finding out our daughter, Julie, now had ties that we had to revise and all a whole slew of things that affected her eating. And now we're at an awesome place. But they both had very different and unique journeys to where we are today.

He

Yeah.

Yep, in three months already. Mm-hmm, yeah.

Yes. That's crazy.

I just think it's such a big difference in where we're talking about the generational health component. It's cool to see what you have put in and you guys have put in so much.

I mean, obviously you put so much energy and love and time into Havla and into Jubilee now and all of those things, but it's very interesting to me to see the difference between the babies, depending on the history and what, because it's this palpable of like, when I do this, they respond like this. You know, like literally the food that I eat becomes my baby. The supplements that I take becomes my baby. And so like, I'm not surprised when I see that, you know,

Yeah.

even for some, like, and I make big baby stew. It's just like you want them to be plump, because they're going to sleep better and they're going to be calmer and they tend to be, you know, a better immune system because they have the excess stores, if you will. So I was very excited to see that. I'm very proud of you.

Yeah.

you

Yeah, yeah, I'm thinking about that.

Yeah, any closing words? guys want to talk about your book a little bit more or anything else that you think would be really helpful for people to hear?

Yeah, we could do that. I'll grab Jubilee. Should we show off the bait? Yes, we'll show it. I'll let you. Do you want to bring Javi up here too? Yeah, might as well. She's fun. She's awesome. She's just so fun.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

She is. It's funny, she looks so much like you. Whatever it is, she just picked it up from you.

I get that a lot, which is funny, but super fun. Yeah, this is our book that we wrote together, The Process of the Sudden Lee, like I said. It really is pretty much just our story and then kind of some of the things we learned along the way. It's definitely you'll see our faith in God come through it, very much so, because that's central to our lives. But it goes through in detail.

Mm-hmm.

our losses, how that felt.

all the different things that we did, all the way through our adoption journey, through our journey with you. And it actually, we were writing this entire book. The coolest thing about this book, in my opinion, is we wrote this entire book in the middle of our journey. And we felt like God told us to write this book and we didn't have this promised child yet. And we finished the whole thing before we got pregnant.

Mmm.

Ugh.

And so yeah, this is Gabby.

she's so precious, you guys. Do you like having a sister? Do you like having a sister?

Yeah, we nuts

And she does. you guys, congrats.

Jubilee also looks like you, David. I don't know if you won the Gene lottery or what. I can of course see Melody in, but.

Yeah, to finish that, we actually turned the book into the editor, into the publisher, before we got pregnant with her. And we told her, one of the reasons we picked her was because...

We said, Hey, we really kind of think that there's going to need to be another chapter. And some publishers, editors aren't okay with you adding. said, we really want to make sure that if this happens, that you'll be okay with us adding another chapter. And so she said yes. And of course, you know, as soon as we started going through that process, we found out about you. Yeah.

Go.

She's in the last chapter of the book. Yeah. Right?

I love that because I think that makes the book a little bit more raw and fresh as you're going through all of it to capture the emotion and the depth of it. it's, you know, it's really inspiring. And I always thank you guys for coming on and sharing the journey because it is like I said, I remember meeting you and I was in heartbreak and it was just like, man, I hope I can help them.

Mm-hmm. Yep.

And now seeing this tiny little thing, it's like, that's why we do it. I know. She looks great.

Yeah, she's like almost as handsome as her sister. Yeah. Can you say thank you? Yeah. Say thank you. Can you say love you? Love you.

Hi, my god. Like the queen, it's like the queen. my goodness, you guys.

Yes, it's amazing. We're so thankful, blessed, thankful that, you know, I feel like the Lord led us to you too. It's like to have someone guide us through the whole process. Okay, go see them.

You know, thank you guys. It's a pleasure and honestly, it's like, you know, she's great. like that. I always think about my babies that I help make. They're my reflection in the world. And it's beautiful to see because like, I mean, she's just perfect.

down.

You are young. yeah.

She is, look at her. Three months, she's looking around. She's busy, she's got a great head of hair, she's plump. Which is good, you want them plump. You want them plump at this stage, so.

She is. She is. yeah.

Yep, she's catching up to her sister.

Yeah, for sure. Well, thank you guys. I really appreciate you coming on and I'm so glad that I was able to help you and you know that's...

Yeah.

My faith is it's I gotta try to figure out how to help these people. Show me what I need to do. Show me what I need to tell them. Where do I need to go? And find the right mentors for myself as well, because it's a lot. There you go. There's all the babies.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

All right, of course, thank you guys. Thanks guys for tuning in. We'll see you next week.