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₿HS005: Pro-Homeschooling Lessons from a Former Public School Supporter
Episode 5 • 19th October 2023 • Bitcoin Homeschoolers • Scott and Tali Lindberg
00:00:00 00:30:28

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SHOW TOPIC:

Some parents who decide to homeschool face resistance from their families.  Today, Tali sits down with a lifelong public school supporter turned homeschooling advocate.

IN THIS EPISODE, YOU'LL LEARN:

  • There’s been A LOT of negative changes in public schools and these changes started decades earlier
  • Average kids can be left behind in public schools
  • Initial reaction (“Oh my God”) and other concerns about homeschooling from a different generational point of view
  • Surprising exhibit of self-confidence and self-assurance with very young homeschooled kids
  • Homeschooled kids move at their own respective speeds
  • Homeschooled kids show maturity, e.g., the way they speak, the way they handle themselves in crowds, speaking in front of large audiences
  • Parents have to be involved with their children – you don’t know what they’re doing in public schools
  • Absorbing lessons is more important than passing tests
  • Deterioration of discipline in public schools
  • Deterioration of manners in public schools, e.g., respecting elders
  • The reality of “you can have it all” for mothers and fathers
  • Parents need to be aligned in homeschool mission to make it work
  • Homeschooling kids talk to their families and share personal experiences with their families even in their late teenage years
  • Public schools now have sexually explicit books in their libraries
  • Homeschooling is a major commitment but one should pursue it without hesitation

HAPPY TO HELP:

  • Tali's Twitter @OrangeHatterPod
  • Scott's Twitter @ScottLindberg93
  • Scott's nostr npub19jkuyl0wgrj8kccqzh2vnseeql9v98ptrx407ca9qjsrr4x5j9tsnxx0q6
  • Free Market Kids' Twitter @FreeMarketKids
  • Orange Pill App @FreeMarketKids
  • Free Market Kids' games including HODL UP https://www.freemarketkids.com/collections/games

WAYS TO SUPPORT:

We are essentially our own sponsors and are so grateful for all of you who support this show.  Thank you!

STANDING RESOURCE RECOMMENDATIONS:

Transcripts

Speaker:

Hi everybody.

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And welcome to another episode

of Bitcoin Homeschoolers.

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This is Scott Lindberg.

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Today is going to be a

little bit different.

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In this episode, Tali had someone

that she wanted to interview and

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just to be candid with everybody.

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Tali and I sometimes disagree.

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This is a feature, not a bug in a

relationship to work things out.

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I was not, uh, this was not my

idea and I was not for initially.

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However, I think what you're

going to hear is pretty special.

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It's a pretty impactful change

that someone is experienced and

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I'll let Tali explain the details

of what I'm talking about next.

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Enjoy.

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So the reason I wanted to do this

interview is to help people who

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may be meeting some resistance

from their families when they

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talk about homeschooling.

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When Scott and I announced that we were

going to homeschool 20 some years ago.

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We stood alone.

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On both sides of our families.

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They did not understand why we

would not put our kids in schools.

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And.

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It was a lonely decision

and a lonely journey.

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Recently my mother-in-law

said, you know, I'm so glad

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you decided to homeschool.

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And if I had to do it all over again.

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I would have considered

homeschooling myself.

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That was such affirmation for our efforts.

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And it's the reason why I wanted

to share this episode with you.

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I wanted to share with you the point

of view of someone who initially

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disagree with homeschooling who

is now a homeschooling supporter.

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So here we go.

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My conversation with my mother-in-law

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elaine

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so, oh, I think that it would be

interesting for people to hear yours

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perspective because you came in, you

were kind of forced into this thing.

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And she has to, I kind of roped you

into this thing and I think it will

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be interesting for, um, people who are

literally sitting on the fence about

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whether to go into or not going to

it, to see it from both perspectives.

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And then also with the benefit

of hindsight, looking back.

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Yeah.

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Two decades of experiences.

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And that's a lot of changes though,

because my husband and I both had

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pretty positive public school times.

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Um, Our kids did.

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So.

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When our grandkids.

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Could go into public school.

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And the bus stopping at our driveway.

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It's like, why don't they just

go on the bus and go to school?

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Actually looking back on our,

around that time is when I saw

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a lot of changes in the schools.

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And some, I wasn't ready

to accept too easily.

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I was getting kind of angry and

I was really glad that our kids

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were not in school anymore.

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And I thought that the, um, the

teachers were too politically involved.

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Not all of them, but the teachers who made

a difference were few and far between.

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And they ended up retiring.

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So you see this whole change over

and how the kids were thinking.

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And, um, I didn't like it.

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Got to a point where if I had a choice.

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Because I wasn't ready for, I

didn't think I was qualified

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to be a homeschool teacher.

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That I would put them in private school.

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Yeah, so just, just, uh, by way

of background, you worked in the

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administrative office for a high school.

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You were in the high school and you were

observing this both from the point of

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view of a parent and as an administrator.

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Uh, and you were able to see how the

teachers interacted with the principal

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and you also were involved between them.

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And in the public.

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Right.

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So that, so you worked there for over

20 years and you retire from there.

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so you're speaking from

a unique perspective.

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Got it from all ends.

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Yeah.

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And our, as I said, our kids,

of course, everyone knew us.

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So they knew our kids.

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Maybe they had some special

attention, not, not too much, but.

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When the kids were in school,

they were in top notch classes.

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I think at that time, I was impressed

with the teachers because they taught

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towards the highest intellectual students.

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They helped the ones with IEPs.

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The middle of the road, the

ones that haven't started even

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blossoming yet were ignored.

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What is IEP?

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Individual educational plan.

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Like if you're deaf or if you have

a learning disability or anything

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like that, they write it up.

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So you get special

attention in that field too.

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This was in the late 1980s IEP.

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And they go on forever.

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They're still, it's still,

their kids have a problem.

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Okay.

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It's pinpointed and they gave him an IEP.

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Right.

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So, um, Our son, not, not

Scott, but the other one had

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an IEP because of the speech.

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Okay, so, um, not unusual, but.

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Uh, if you were just an average

kid, better hang on because you

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didn't get too much attention.

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That's kind of sad because a lot

of kids don't start developing

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until a little bit older.

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So.

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So, what was your biggest concern when we

told you that we were going to homeschool?

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Oh, my God.

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I couldn't even imagine

where you would start.

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I was concerned that there wasn't

a lot of social activity for them.

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That actually probably was the first

thing that crossed off the list

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because of church groups, playgroups.

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Any type of group, you can get it in.

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I think it's still overwhelming if

you're not enthusiastic about it.

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I think that I think you need that.

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'cause there's a lot available.

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But the point is, do you have

enough energy to ask for it?

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Do you want to become vulnerable

enough to ask somebody for help.

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Um, But I was really impressed

with all the different things

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that you could do with kids.

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You know, um, I forgot the name of the

place that we went to in Cleveland,

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and it's like a little house.

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The kids were very small.

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One, one whole room was the sandbox.

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I was more excited about

staying there then.

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That's where, I mean, but

there was so much to give them.

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Um, but you, you have to

give somewhat of yourself.

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I really, I really think that

makes it obviously because the

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four of yours are, are fabulous.

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They have spun off in

all different directions.

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They're extremely comfortable

within their own skin.

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Which is wonderful.

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Hm.

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Mmm.

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Even our other two grandchildren that went

to regular high school, public schools.

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I don't find them as independent.

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Or they don't seem to come

across as self-assured.

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And I think nowadays that's

not really important.

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To feel that you're you

feel good about yourself?

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To stand up for yourself.

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And your beliefs.

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You know, and I don't think you

get that very much in high school.

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It's it's very tough.

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I think it's tough in, in today's.

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Well, maybe even, always in a school.

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I mean, you don't belong in

the right group or the right

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click life isn't too easy.

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But if you feel really good about yourself

in your own skin, It doesn't matter.

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It really doesn't.

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Yeah.

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So can you contrast what you observed in

the school system you worked in and what

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you observed our four kids were doing.

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Well, the four kids went on

to there at their own speed.

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I don't think you see that so much in

the high school, unless you're on that

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the highest track that you could be.

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Because you can take off

more or less on your own.

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But your four they're

they're all different.

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They all have their weaknesses

and their strengths.

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But they didn't have to stay

put if one person was behind.

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They could continue in anything.

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I think that's a real plus, I

don't believe in holding somebody

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back, waiting for somebody else.

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And even it could be the youngest

who's the head of the oldest.

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Because it can work out that way.

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So I think that's a big plus.

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Yeah.

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As I said, the biggest thing

I find is the maturity.

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The way they speak.

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The way they handle themselves in a crowd.

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Even though they say

they're not comfortable.

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They come across as.

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Um, I was really impressed.

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They were very young and they had to give

a short speech in front of, I think it

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was two or 300 people and they were given

something to say, They didn't flinch.

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Absolutely unbelievable.

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And I said, they must feel

so good about themselves.

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And of course we can go

also down to the beginning.

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Then their first time on, on the

stage and their ballet costumes.

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And I think.

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Nolan was a duck.

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Was he a duck?

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He was a duck.

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Um, when he was three, when his

first time on stage, he was,

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he was wearing the green vest.

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He was two.

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Okay, this is when he took

a bow to the chat, the end.

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And he gave the audience his fanny.

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And it was the hit of the whole show.

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You know, And he was not embarrassed.

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He thought this was the

way it was supposed to be.

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And, um, It's just little

things like that then.

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Yeah.

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So much fun.

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Yeah.

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And to watch them grow up and

they have fun in their shows,

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in their singing groups.

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In their athletic groups.

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And I still think it

goes back to the parents.

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As parents.

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I have to be involved.

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You have to know your children, you

just can't give it off to somebody else.

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Even more so in public school.

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Because you don't see them

for eight hours a day.

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And maybe that the other,

the other program that was

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really excellent was that.

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English program.

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That they had an Iowa.

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What was the name of that?

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I think it was classical conversation.

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And I sat in with one of

those classes for three hours.

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I was totally shocked.

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I said we would never get this and

to structure your sentences and.

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I mean, we did that and

that's 50 years ago.

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But here, these kids are doing it and

they have a basis of the English language.

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How to structure sentences and to write.

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You don't get that in school anymore.

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So it was going back to basics.

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Yeah, but you're not going

to get that in public school.

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So a lot of people when they think

socialization is interesting, I actually

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had a conversation with a young person

the other day about socialization.

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And in his definition, he said, well,

socialization means you are knowledgeable

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about what's going on in culture.

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As in, you know, all this the

slang words and you know, all the

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sexual references and, you know,

like in his mind, socialization

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equals the opposite of innocence.

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And I just never would have thought of.

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Where that way?

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No.

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Because that was my question

to him was like, do you think,

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because he has observed our family.

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And, and I said do you think that

homeschoolers need help socializing.

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I in my head, the answer I expected

was no, because like you said, They

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know how to carry themselves in

different situations, but in his

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mind he said, He said no, because he

thought my kids were too innocent.

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They didn't know about

the ways of the world.

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Maybe.

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Maybe, because I don't

know what's in their heads.

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But they certainly understand.

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They may not speak it,

accept it or whatever.

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But they certainly know what's going on.

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And they know most terminology.

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And they're also free to, to learn

all this without somebody over

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them saying, you have to read this

now and you have to do this now.

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And you have to do that.

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You have to socialize

with somebody else now.

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They don't need that.

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I don't think so.

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No.

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They pick it up, they pick it

up naturally as long as it's,

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if it's available to them.

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I mean, if you're going to put them

in a cage for eighteen years and

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say you're going to be homeschool.

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Well, they're not going

to turn out too well.

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Right.

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And the same thing.

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They go to public school and you

don't know anything about what they're

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doing or who they're doing it with.

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What's the difference.

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Right.

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So, yeah, you have to know.

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Yeah.

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Um, I just think what we have

seen and the kids that we have

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met through our grandchildren.

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They're charming.

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And they're happy.

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And they're and they're smart.

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They are really smart.

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And, um, they didn't take a crowbar

to hit them over the head to learn it.

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They also were taught different ways.

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I mean, the math that was taught them, I

wouldn't know how to I'd have to figure

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it out the old fashioned way, give

them an answer and then work backwards.

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But that's even true in public school.

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It's not taught the same way.

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But they seem to have picked up on it.

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And they didn't stay with

one chapter for a week.

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They stayed on it, as long as it

took them to understand how to do it.

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Right.

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So that's my favorite

part of homeschooling.

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You don't have to be, you don't have

to feel like you're being pushed from

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the back to catch up to the crowd.

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Right?

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If you need more time, you

just need more time in.

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In the end what matters is that you

understood it and you absorbed the lesson.

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Not that you could pass a test at.

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At the end.

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Yeah.

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You can pass a test with a score of 80.

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And the 20 points that you missed

could be critical for you to understand

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the next level, but you didn't get

it because you passed it at 80.

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Right, right, right.

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So I think that gap is what's

missing a lot in our current system.

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You, you miss whatever it, you miss to

get the required grade to move on to the

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next level, but then you get more and more

behind because you're missing pockets.

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The part you miss as a cumulative, right?

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Yeah, the.

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The other thing is the

classics that they read.

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They can't do that very much

in schools very much anymore.

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They worry about more what's in the

library shelf then what they're reading.

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Um, the more they read, the

more they learn on their own.

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Their vocabulary is good.

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They know how to use the library

system that can use the computers.

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Um, they go away from home

and they're comfortable.

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Amazing.

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Yeah.

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So what did you see in the public

school system over the last 20 years

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that made you more and more concerned?

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Um, I would, the first thing

would be the lack of discipline.

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The lack of respect for elders.

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I think it's just a horrible attitude

that a lot of these young people have.

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I don't know it's because it's one of the

first, well, not the first by the second

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now generation of coming home to nobody.

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Which I think.

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We could tell that in the school

system, This group coming up.

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It's the first group that the parents

were working and nobody was home.

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Huge huge dif difference

in their personalities.

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Um, Discipline.

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Suspensions.

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All of that.

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And that hasn't changed.

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That's gotten worse.

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So the parents again are

not part of their children.

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And I think parents have to

be there one way or the other.

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You can't hand it off to somebody else.

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I think they're two major reasons

why there's a generation of kids that

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come home with no parents at home.

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One is really the financial need,

because I think there are a lot of

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couples who would rather have one stay

at home, but they can't afford it.

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So the mom must work.

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That's one reason, but the

other reason also, I think.

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There was a really huge push when

I was growing up that a woman

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should be able to do it all.

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You should be able to have a

career that's meaningful and you

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should be a mother and you should

make sure the house is beautiful.

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It can be done.

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Because I didn't go back full time.

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Um, till, um, the kids

for, at school full time.

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But I left after they did.

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And I was home in the house 15

minutes before they got home.

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Because I always felt if you don't catch

him when they walked through the door

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that something's wrong you don't know.

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And that's, and that's where I stayed.

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Especially the boys.

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I feel like the girls might tell you.

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Around the kitchen.

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Boys are just terrible.

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Just terrible.

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And, um, and I'm glad cause I built

up a nice relationship with them.

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And I was there.

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They knew that they could count on me.

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Yeah.

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And as I said, I think, I think it's

important for a parent to be a parent.

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Yeah, it's a big job.

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It doesn't go away.

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I do think there is that lie though

that's been circulating for a few decades

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where you should be able to do all of it.

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Like you can actually not use use,

not just you shouldn't use all of it.

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That you should have all of it.

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You should have that career and you should

have your children because you have all of

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these other things that you can implement.

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Yeah.

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So that you can have children like

daycare centers and extended school

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hours and all of those things in place.

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Maybe if you don't do

all of it, like take it.

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Don't take advantage of every daycare.

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I don't take advantage of

every afterschool program.

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Don't join every club.

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Don't extend your hours and

don't extend your kids out.

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Some of these elementary kids come home

on the bus at four 30 in the afternoon.

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Um, I said their day is longer than mine.

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Yeah.

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I said, what, what are they doing after

school for that length at the time?

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They're tired.

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You know, so I think maybe

women tried to do at all.

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I don't think anybody can do it all.

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I don't think so.

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Men can do it all either.

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No, you can't be the perfect father.

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The perfect breadwinner.

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The perfect.

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No one is perfect.

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But if you can work out a niche that

you're happy and doing what you're doing.

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And you can grow and your kids

are happy doing what they're

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doing and you have a life together

that you're growing together.

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That's a good thing.

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But if you're working because

you want a million dollar home.

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And right now the kids are,

are kind of in your way because

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you have to put more hours in.

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I don't think that's fair because

they didn't ask for that either.

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I guess it depends on what

you think is really important.

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I don't know if you know those, but

I had a lot of conversations with

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the kids about me going back to work.

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Yeah.

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'cause I told them, I'm like, you

know, if mom went back to work

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our finances will be less tight.

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And we can live in a nicer house.

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Yeah.

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And you guys can go to public school or

private school and you know, we will,

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we will have a different life, right?

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Yeah.

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And I asked them all four of

them, this several times every

398

:

time there's a job change.

399

:

We had the same conversation.

400

:

And unanimously, they would say let's

just settle for less material things.

401

:

And let's just keep homeschooling.

402

:

So we finished homeschooling

because everybody was on board.

403

:

Again, you did it as a unit.

404

:

You can't do it if one person wants it,

then the other person isn't supportive.

405

:

He can't have one.

406

:

One parent saying, if you

want to do that, that's fine.

407

:

But count me out.

408

:

Can't act that does not work.

409

:

Yeah.

410

:

Now you don't have to sit there at the

desk, but maybe you could help with

411

:

driving around in the evening if they

have extra things or something like

412

:

that, but everybody has to participate.

413

:

Yeah.

414

:

Yeah.

415

:

Yeah.

416

:

So some actually participate

better than others.

417

:

But I also was very surprised

to see how homeschoolers share.

418

:

Yeah.

419

:

What do you remember?

420

:

Um, They were going to in a private

school to do their sciences.

421

:

But they have a tight group when

they were doing this theater stuff.

422

:

I remember helping out making costumes.

423

:

I mean, everything was, um A joint thing.

424

:

Hmm.

425

:

And you have to be able to change.

426

:

I

427

:

have to adjust.

428

:

Okay.

429

:

You can do this for a couple of years in.

430

:

You'll get through.

431

:

You know, we'll do that do the studying

this way, or two of you will do this

432

:

and I'll help with the other two.

433

:

I think being open as the only way you

can do it, if you want a black and white

434

:

printout once a week from somebody at St.

435

:

Homeschool of, so we'll do this this week.

436

:

That's not going to work.

437

:

Yeah.

438

:

Stay flexible, really flexible.

439

:

And it's always changing.

440

:

We never had one year that was

the same as the other, nothing.

441

:

Nothing was the same.

442

:

Yeah.

443

:

And that's what was so cool.

444

:

It's really neat.

445

:

Um, and that sh I think it showed.

446

:

Brianna.

447

:

I don't know if she realized

that's how bright she is.

448

:

I always thought she was bright

cause she's my granddaughter.

449

:

But when she went to, um,

it was in the evening and it

450

:

was, um, at a Sunday school.

451

:

And she wanted to get a badge.

452

:

There were 10 of them.

453

:

And she had to memorize

something each week.

454

:

And the second week she

walked in she she said all 10.

455

:

And then, and then she

said, I like my badge now.

456

:

And she didn't call back.

457

:

But she memorize all 10.

458

:

Yeah.

459

:

And I said, At shows that she

had the incentive to finish.

460

:

Uh, I thought that was a

wonderful incentive on her part.

461

:

And if she really didn't want to go

back, she got rid of it really fast.

462

:

And as she got extra points and she, you

could go shopping in their special store.

463

:

And to say, I am, it

brings tears to my eyes.

464

:

She bought, she bought me a Bible.

465

:

Which I still have really.

466

:

And I thought that was unbelievably sweet.

467

:

And.

468

:

How much meant to her?

469

:

And then she gave it to me.

470

:

Yeah.

471

:

So you see all these different

things, but she, when she pulled that

472

:

in that classroom, I almost died.

473

:

She said, well, all 10 verses

and I want my badge now.

474

:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

475

:

That was the end of that.

476

:

That was the cubbies.

477

:

That was the cubbies program.

478

:

That's right.

479

:

I think that's one thing

that I have noticed a lot in

480

:

the homeschooling community.

481

:

I just feel like.

482

:

most I was in most children.

483

:

Most babies are born with just the most

loving heart and is slowly the heart gets

484

:

squashed or at least walls get put up and

so you don't see the tenderness anymore.

485

:

But what I see in homeschooling

kids most of the time is that

486

:

they remain tenderhearted.

487

:

Well, they're in their twenties or

most of them and they still come here.

488

:

They're still very loving.

489

:

Um, I'm very thankful that

at least the girls share.

490

:

And working on the boys, but, um,

They're lovely to have around.

491

:

Yeah.

492

:

Yeah.

493

:

I never say, oh my God, they're coming.

494

:

We look forward to it.

495

:

You.

496

:

You know, and we enjoy that.

497

:

Yeah.

498

:

And you can enjoy them one on one

or one on 15 or how many there are.

499

:

And the biggest compliment is that they

bring their other partners home now.

500

:

Um, that says a lot.

501

:

Yeah.

502

:

Cause a lot of my friends, they said

they don't even see their grandkids.

503

:

They have no idea who

they're going out with.

504

:

They have no idea what they

want to do with their life.

505

:

That's what my kids said when they

came back from from the overseas.

506

:

Program.

507

:

They said that they're the only ones that

talk to their families most of the time.

508

:

Yeah.

509

:

And all the other friends are like,

why would you talk to your family

510

:

and tell them about stuff like that?

511

:

Well, like, why not?

512

:

Why not?

513

:

Yeah, because that,

that unit is so strong.

514

:

Yeah, that is there that's our go to unit.

515

:

It can say anything, be anyone with them.

516

:

No exception.

517

:

And no one's going to criticize you.

518

:

So that's important.

519

:

Yeah.

520

:

And it continues as you can see that

they're growing up to young adults and.

521

:

They're still acting the same way.

522

:

Yeah.

523

:

Okay.

524

:

So from the point of view of

grandparents, Who have observed

525

:

as over the last two decades.

526

:

What would you say to new parents

today who are standing on the

527

:

fence about homeschooling?

528

:

And they're not sure whether

or not they want to jump in.

529

:

I'd say, go for it.

530

:

It's always, I mean,

you can always change.

531

:

You can always tweak what you've decided.

532

:

And before they decide to, to go

to home school, that they should

533

:

evaluate their own schedules.

534

:

And do they have the time to

fully devote to homeschooling?

535

:

Because it's not a part-time thing.

536

:

That's a good point.

537

:

It.

538

:

That's true.

539

:

But you can.

540

:

Put them in what I would call

a part-time private school.

541

:

And not have to homeschool

any of the subjects.

542

:

You're just a supervisor to

make sure that kids do their

543

:

assignments and that's tweaking.

544

:

And the option or homeschooling or not.

545

:

As I said, um, I'm not for

public schools anymore.

546

:

I don't, I don't like

what's happening to them.

547

:

And they're totally political.

548

:

As far as I'm concerned and they're

teaching our children not to be children.

549

:

I just really am very fearful for.

550

:

Can you give us more examples about

what you're fearing and what you mean?

551

:

They have all these explicit

sexual books on the library shelf.

552

:

Am I a boy, am I a girl,

this type of thing.

553

:

And these children have to be children to

make decisions and you do it by maturity

554

:

step-by-step not by having somebody

hand you a book or groom you or groom.

555

:

Hmm.

556

:

So.

557

:

That's my biggest fear.

558

:

Okay.

559

:

So.

560

:

Right.

561

:

What do you think.

562

:

Well, I mean, again, homeschooling as a.

563

:

In my opinion as a major commitment

that, uh, is not to be taken lightly.

564

:

So, if one is going to step into

that arena, they really got to

565

:

research what they're going to be

involved with before they step out,

566

:

or they know that they're getting

what they're getting into and do it.

567

:

Because it's not something

they can practice on.

568

:

Without, uh, I mean, you just have

to get into it, but you have to

569

:

get some, do some research too.

570

:

It's not it's, it's not a.

571

:

Easy subject.

572

:

I mean, Your kids'

education is priority one.

573

:

Yeah, sure.

574

:

So if you guys were.

575

:

Just starting out today.

576

:

Based on everything that you have

learned, observed , experience

577

:

the last few decades, but now

assuming that you're standing.

578

:

Here.

579

:

You're 30 years old and

you've got young children.

580

:

What was you do in today's environment?

581

:

I guess my first thought would

either be private school or

582

:

homeschooling of some sort.

583

:

But I, without hesitation.

584

:

Well, the career of the family is

important too, for the financial wellbeing

585

:

and the economic success of the family.

586

:

So.

587

:

Um, As a father and a grandfather.

588

:

I feel the responsibility to.

589

:

To bring home the bacon, so to speak.

590

:

And that's important.

591

:

Um, now if homeschooling is

part of that, then so be it.

592

:

But yeah, it might not be able to be if,

if my requirement for travel is excessive.

593

:

So, and that was the case when.

594

:

We were that age.

595

:

But that's where you take everything

into consideration, a whole

596

:

family unit what's going to work.

597

:

It's a big decision.

598

:

Is it a.

599

:

And actually we were talking about

this before, just because your kids

600

:

go to public school, it doesn't mean

you're doomed for demise, right?

601

:

There are a lot of things that

you can do at home to supplement.

602

:

Yes, without any question, and you can

go to school board meetings and you can.

603

:

You know, Again, Parent

teacher association meetings

604

:

be involved and go to.

605

:

The teacher meetings.

606

:

To see what we don't know what or.

607

:

If you're, if their kids

are in public school.

608

:

To attend the public school where

you're the play, the student,

609

:

you go to different teachers.

610

:

That way you get to see what

your kid's really hearing.

611

:

Hopefully.

612

:

Yeah, they have meetings.

613

:

You can you follow the kids schedule?

614

:

But you have to be involved.

615

:

Bottom line.

616

:

Very committed.

617

:

Yeah.

618

:

No matter what you do.

619

:

Yeah.

620

:

Cool.

621

:

Anything else you want to add?

622

:

No.

623

:

That's good.

624

:

Thank you so much.

625

:

That's awesome.

626

:

Best.

627

:

Best of luck to anybody's listening.

628

:

Yeah

629

:

So that was my father-in-law

who hopped on last minute.

630

:

I hope you enjoy this episode.

631

:

See you next time Sure.

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