Today I’m sitting down with one of the practitioners, Dr. Nicole, to talk about what we’re really seeing in the clinic. Every day, we meet couples struggling to conceive, and no two cases are the same. In this episode, we’re diving into the connection between erectile dysfunction and mold toxicity, and why clearing infections before trying to conceive is critical. These are often the hidden issues that stand in the way of pregnancy. Tune in to learn what might be missing in your fertility journey.

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Takeaways

Erectile dysfunction can be linked to cardiovascular health.

Fungal infections are increasingly common in male fertility cases.

Mold exposure can manifest in various physical symptoms.

Stress and lifestyle choices significantly impact male health.

Low testosterone levels are a common issue in men with ED.

Mold can affect blood flow, contributing to erectile dysfunction.

Comprehensive health assessments are crucial for understanding underlying issues.

Emotional and energetic factors play a role in health and healing.

Adaptability is essential for both health and parenting.

The journey of healing often requires trust in oneself.

Chapters

00:00 Understanding Erectile Dysfunction and Its Connections

05:52 The Impact of Mold and Fungal Infections

11:29 The Role of Lifestyle Choices in Male Health

17:33 The Importance of Addressing Underlying Health Issues

22:57 The Evolving Landscape of Health Markers

25:52 Understanding Mold and Its Impact on Health

27:59 The Energetic Component of Infections

31:47 Navigating the Journey of Parenthood and Health

35:39 Trusting Your Intuition in Health Decisions

40:33 The Importance of Adaptability in Health and Parenting

Connect with Dr. Jane Levesque

Website - https://www.drjanelevesque.com/

Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/drjanelevesque/

Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/DrJaneLevesque/

Welcome back, Nicole. What are we going to talk about today?

So I figured we could kind of dive into some themes that we're seeing in clinic, or at least that I'm seeing with couples that are coming across my way. And one of those themes right now tends to be fungal infections, mold infections, different types showing up and how they're being expressed in symptoms in the body. But then also how that goes into affecting fertility, specifically in these cases, it's male fertility, it's their ability to have an erection, hold an erection, go to completion.

So there's been a lot of questions there that I thought you and I could kind of dive into and start answering for the couples that are listening.

Let's do it. And I love connecting. So it's like, can connect with you and Tina once a month. And it's really cool to see the growth and the progression. And then of course, we're always learning so much, whether it's from each other's cases, from each other, from Dr. Leah, wherever books podcasts. So it's very cool to see the progression and it's a big topic. It's probably an uncomfortable topic, but obviously we're here for those uncomfortable conversations. So let's dive in. Do you want to do like one person at a time or do you want to just do themes?

We can kind of just do themes because even with the different couples, they're falling pretty much under the same umbrellas. They're almost like it's like the same person sitting in front of me with a different face just from what they're experiencing. No, so we can kind of go ahead.

was just saying, does this couple know? I'll kind of guide it based on what I think would be really helpful. And then you can fill in the, you can answer my questions if you will. And then of course add in. My question to you is, so is it a male patients that are presenting with ED or presenting a couple that's presenting with infertility and are they presenting with erectile dysfunction or is this something that you're finding out as you're sitting down with a couple?

So kind of both. As we sit down and start digging through the health assessments, so really looking at their overall health, what they're experiencing, they'll end up disclosing that. And actually in both cases, they're having trouble getting erections. And so in one case, he's using a form of Viagra, in the other case, he kind of just has to figure it out for a little while until he gets one.

But then as we start digging a bit deeper into, why is this happening? What are some of the other areas in your health that you're experiencing struggles? We start seeing a connection and almost the same picture painted for both of them. So they're not necessarily coming to me saying, I have this right off the bat. But as we start peeling back the layers, that is a big thing that comes up to surface for these couples. And both of them are having difficulty with getting pregnant or holding a pregnancy.

Yeah, the reason that I asked that is because I don't think in the cases that I've had when men present with ED, it's not the first thing that they mentioned. And then, you know, when we get them to fill out a form, they might say, like, sometimes I'll have difficulties maintaining an erection. We just give them like a scale of zero to four. So like four, yes, it's a big problem versus zero, it's not. And I find that a lot of men will underestimate that and they'll just be like one or two or, you sometimes.

And then you dig in and it's like, well, we only have sex once a month because the other times it's too strut and like, it's only around ovulation. And then sometimes that ED even happened because of the infertility journey because of this like performance anxiety, if you will. And then of course there's other pieces to it. So I'm glad you say that, cause I think that for most people, it's not a thing that we admit right away.

But I think from like a fertility standpoint, if you can't do the thing that makes the baby, then there's probably issues that are going to happen to like to have the baby, you know, and to do it well.

Absolutely. And I think two big pillars that I'm seeing is one is very stress related or stress induced ED. And then on the other end, it's the infection, the mold, the dysbiosis of the gut microbiome being affected in some of the cases. And one of them, it's both of those, right? They're both coming into play. And then like you said, performance anxiety. So it's also looking at, when did this start?

Did it start when you guys started this fertility journey or is this something that happened before you were with this current partner? Was it always there? So just understanding these questions helped to pinpoint exactly where and what might be causing the issue or the concern.

Yeah. And I think some, what has been coming up and this is feedback from our fertility strategist. What's been coming up is that most, like, I don't want to say all conventional doctors, but you just, like, you have a 10 minute appointment and they diagnose you with whatever unexplained infertility or it's endometriosis or it's male factor. And then there's zero explanation. And then there's zero room for you to share really what's going on.

Whereas like our first appointment when we meet people is like an hour just to like lay out the plan. And then our next appointment is like two and a half hours where we get to know the couple. And I just think that if we don't give the couple an opportunity to actually speak about everything that's going on for them, like then how can we make those connections? And I want to dive into how you are making the connections with the mold and cardiovascular, like how is this showing up for the person? But I think that's a really important point too.

outline that like we're spending time with people and that's how we're getting to these connections. Because it's just, you know, keep digging. But why this? Why that? Stay curious, you know?

Yeah, exactly.

So how is mold showing up? We hear mold a lot. How is it showing up in the person? What are you seeing in terms of actual symptoms? And give me like really common things that, yep, that makes sense to like, I had no idea this was connected to mold.

Yeah, so some of the common and are I think easy to detect is looking at nails. So understanding if you have nails that are very brittle, there's lines in your nails, they're really thick nails, they're chipping, they're yellow discoloration. That can be just a big telltale. Same thing, whether we're looking at fingernails or we're looking at toenails. Same thing when you look at the skin around the hands and the feet, if it's consistently dry, it's flaky, it has a red irritant look to it.

Those are also signs that you might have mold that's kind of circulating. So those are some of the visible ones that I think can be easy to target. And then other ones that may not be as easy is like consistent brain fog or fatigue, being exhausted. If you have, you know, maybe you're exercising, you're eating all the right food, but you have a gut that you just can't get to go away, that could be an indicator that there's an underlying fungal infection of the gut.

you could have, you know, we were talking about going upstairs and being winded and having a hard time breathing, just going up one or two flights of stairs. That can also be an indicator that there's a hidden infection underneath. So looking at all these different pieces and then how your body responds to when you eat certain foods. So if you're eating certain foods like carbs and sugars, and then you have an exacerbation and some of these symptoms that you're seeing,

well, that's gonna feed off of it. It's gonna create a favorable environment for it to grow. So that would be another sign that, we're having this fluctuation. And then same thing too with your stress. If you're going through really stressful periods and you're seeing these symptoms exacerbate, then what is that cycle that's happening and how is it triggering this overgrowth?

Yeah, give me some foods that are high in mold. Cause I think a lot of people don't actually know what those are. And now that I'm like, quote unquote aware, I know the moment that I eat something that is even like a little bit histamine-y and I'm like, there's my runny nose. Like that, that's a high histamine food, you know, and then high mold, whatever.

Absolutely. And I think in a sense it varies too. Like you might have sensitivities to different things. Dairies can be one that can be both high histamine, but also can be kind of moldy. So being mindful there. Same thing with pastas, being careful with pastas. actually just had someone give my kiddo some mac and cheese and I went to go like put it away. And as I put it away, I saw there was mold all over the bottom of it. So now I know that my two-year-old had moldy mac and cheese.

So we'll have to take care of that. But just being mindful, too, of how long has something been in your fridge? Certain meats can get moldy pretty easily. Certain vegetables, if the vegetables are just sitting there and they start to look wet, or the lettuce of a salad starts to have a little bit of a wet look, probably not worth eating, even though it might not necessarily be bad. But it's on its way there, and it's on its way of having that mold.

sweeter fruits like pineapples, cantaloupe, if you're starting to see little white spots, they're almost like very, very hard to detect. But if you do see them, that's the beginning of mold being on that food. essentially, we kind of know like, mold likes to grow in like dark, moist, warm places. So if you think about that, you can kind of categorize does this piece of food stay somewhere like that? Does my bread stay in a drawer that's dark and could be getting kind of moist and moldy to I live?

in a very like humid environment where my food is more inclined to get mold than if I lived somewhere that was a little bit colder of a climate.

Yeah, I think fresh is like the, and it's the hardest from like histamine perspective, and I don't want to talk too much, but like about histamine just because the two are related though, because mold is going to have a response and immune response and histamine is connected to that immune response and then estrogen cascade, like all of that. But essentially like we're so used to it, the food should be fresh. We didn't used to have all the

containers and all the things of how we store food or prep food for the week. It's best to have food prep for a couple of days, but not for the entire week, just because it's like, it's not really meant to sit for that long. And then one of the aha moments for me was spices. I remember like I've had these spices for like seven years and it's like, you can't have spices for seven years. You can have it for one year, but you should, and it should be in a glass container or stainless steel, but in those like little plastic bags and

God knows how long they've been there for. It's like all that stuff or any grains, like they will just continue to accumulate mold. That was a big like, I didn't know. And I need to make sure I, you know, replace my spices on a regular basis, keep things in a seal tight container. So it doesn't allow for that air to come in and that moisture to come in and sit. Because yeah, it's, I it's like we're always just telling people what not to do.

We're basically like, stop doing all these things. That's why nobody invites us to brunch. I don't talk about these things on brunch. Well, it's just like not brunch topics, the reality is that most people, and dust, like dust is a big mold thing. had a couple who I was like, do you guys have a dusty house? Like what's going on? Your mold is through the roof. And as they got like a Jasper and start like literally just did a spring clean, they felt better. All her sinuses.

stuff went away. Yeah,

It's not always exactly, and it's not always the big things that you would think either. Like you can have mold in a house without realizing it's on the walls without having that smell or that discoloration. Granted, if you go into a home and it smells very, very stale, then you're probably looking at some mold or if you're seeing it, same thing with like in the South, like I live in North Carolina and it can be tough there because a lot of times mold will grow in the showers just from...

the humidity and then you have the steam in that bathroom so you can see it in the lining. But then you start to wonder, okay, well, if it's in the lining there, where is it deep rooted in the walls behind the shower? But sometimes it's obvious, sometimes it's not. If you're someone who doesn't regularly clean your water areas and you start seeing that rim of pink of where the water has been sitting, then I highly recommend you go scrub that right now before it becomes really moldy.

But that can be a good starter sign to kind of, okay, we need to do some work in our shower and our bathroom and start cleaning things up.

Yeah, because it's not overnight that things are accumulating.

Yeah, no, it's progressive just like everything else, but it is important. The other thing that I didn't mention as a symptom that I also think is a really good indicator is a consistent acne. So if you're consistently having acne breakouts, you feel like you've tried everything, it's not going away. Maybe you've even gone as far as like Accutane and then it came back a little bit later. You did a round of doxycycline and then it came back a little bit later. There's a good chance that there is that hidden infection. And then doing something like doxycycline is an antibiotic, it's not an antifungal.

So it's not really gonna help you. It might put it at bay for a while, but then once your body kind of comes off of that, it's gonna come right back if it's not taken care of. And then also with doxycycline and an antibiotic, you're creating a more favorable environment for a fungus or a mold in the gut to continue to grow.

Yeah. So how is it connected? How is this mold connected to ED? So ED is one of the symptoms you said, toes or like nails in general, the bloating, acne, fatigue, weight gain, I think the stubborn weight is probably one of the most common things because it's just like your mitochondria is tanked. How is it connected to ED? Mood. Mood. Yeah.

Yeah, so with ED, there's a couple different ways, but I would say the biggest would be that when you have mold in the body or you have a fungal overgrowth, especially in the gut, so not only is it gonna affect your hormones, but it's also gonna play a role in what's happening with your cardiovascular health. So what's happening with your heart, what's happening with where blood flows going. So we always talk about like the sperm or the testicles almost peeing, and I don't like this term, but I've yet to decide a better term to use.

but it's like the dumping ground of everything else that's happening in the body, right? So it's also gonna be the last place to get the love from something like your cardiovascular system. So if you're having this systemic overgrowth of mold or fungus, it's essentially going to affect what's happening and where the blood flow is going. And that's gonna be the area that suffers the most. So that can be coming into play as to why someone's having a hard time getting an erection is because of that lack of blood flow in that area.

And so with these cases, the ones that I have are like, they're having trouble getting it. Once they have it, they can kind of sustain it. But it's that part. So that tells me that, okay, there's some disconnect between what's happening. Yet both of them have this infection that's showing up. One of them definitely, you know, we have some weight that needs to be lost. We have some improvement. We also had...

stimulants. So this is where I know that the cardiovascular aspect is a very big part for this particular client, because in his history, there's been use of Adderall and there's been use of cocaine and there's been use of marijuana. And all of these are going to create that change and that effect and that lingers. And so when I asked him the question of, did this recently start or has it been going on? And as we dug in, he was like, yeah.

this started around the time that I started using cocaine. And then after that, I jumped into Adderall. And it's like, okay, so we were overstimulating the body and we're taking circulation. Cause when your body's thinking about being in this constant fight or flight, it has to be active. The blood flow with these stimulants is going away from digestion and reproduction and it's going to other areas. Well, it's no wonder that it's so hard for you to get an erection because your body's not thinking about what it needs to do for reproduction. Cause you keep pumping it to think.

elsewhere.

Yeah, it's it's fight or flight, arrest and digest. And I do think it's a big theme. I've never had so many patients that are addicted to nicotine that are, you know, and they're using nicotine in such a high amount that like, you would be smoking like three or four packs a day to get that amount of nicotine, but because it's a tab and then you can, or, you know, gum or it's not even patches, it's usually tub.

because patches are way more controlled. It's like you're consuming an insane amount of nicotine and even though there's benefits to nicotine and all that, yeah, it's like seven milligrams a day, not 90 or 100 or whatever that some of these people are doing. And I wonder if that's just like the go-go-go culture or if we're just tired and we're trying to find more ways to find energy.

probably a combination of the two, but there's always like, there's always.

There's, there's always a repercussion, right? Is it, do you know what the consequences to the action? Because a lot of the times it's people don't zoom out enough, I find, and don't look at, I'm just doing this now. I'm just not exercising or I'm eating this or I'm drinking because it's whatever. Like I don't have a heart attack yet. I'll deal with it when I'm older. And I find like, can we zoom out and really understand the behavior and what it leads to?

and then how hard it is to stop sometimes because you've created, you know, an addiction essentially.

Yeah. And I think there's a couple of things there, right? So I do think it's both, like you said, I also think if we are in this go, go, go, and then we're taking stimulants, we then have to participate or not have to, but choose to participate in other factors like drinking to try to come down from it. So that's going to have an effect too. when we, it's like all of these things that you're choosing to do, whether it be the alcohol, the nicotine, the Adderall, the cocaine, you name it, it's going to affect

what's happening in the body. like your adrenals are gonna be super important for your energy and how things are happening. you're essentially, if we're participating in these things, we're gonna affect our DHEAS, right? So that is a precursor hormone to testosterone estrogen. So if we're having that, and if we're having really low testosterone, I wanna say they said like, I wanna say it's 40 % of men age 40,

have erectile dysfunction and low testosterone. And then 70 % of men, 70 or above have it as well. But then they're finding that men under the age of 40, that one in four of them are struggling with erectile dysfunction. And these stats might be a little bit outdated, but they're still gonna be relatively similar to what they might be now. But what happens is if we're having that low testosterone, then of course we're gonna have trouble with erectile dysfunction, right?

But then on the other hand, having low testosterone or having really high estrogen, especially in a male, it can also contribute to that, that overgrowth of any hidden infection that might be there. So let's say you were a college.

If people don't know that bugs love estrogen and sometimes there's mold that produce estrogen too.

Get off it.

Mm hmm. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like you may have been okay, your mold infection came from exposure playing sports when you were young. But then all these other factors are only contributing to it. You're just consistently feeding into it. And that's where you know, we come into play of being able to help you kind of pull back those layers and uncover what it is that you're doing that might be contributing. Because maybe you eat well, maybe you work out well. you know, you

you think you're healthy, but then when we start looking at the tests and the data and start looking at journals of what you're actually doing on a day to day, we can start peeling apart those pieces and picking out what it is that's just continuing the cycle. And then if you're on this fertility journey, that's a big piece of the puzzle that needs to be addressed and tackled right away, or it's just going to keep contributing.

Well, and then you're passing it on, right? The way that you, the inflammatory, the state that you are in. So if you're highly inflamed, that is going to cause methylation issues, which is essentially how your body does everything. But from like a fertility perspective, how it repairs DNA, how it makes hormones, how it detoxifies, how it makes energy. And so when that methylation is glitchy, that is essentially what you're passing down to that next generation. And so if

all the genes are out of whack and all the nutrients are in there, then for some, recurrent pregnancy loss, for sure. For others, complications during pregnancies. For others, it's once the baby is out, the baby has lots of issues with mitochondria and repair and brain fog and neurological issues. I talk about it because it's like now being long enough and seeing how things play out, I do think that there's a lot of

It's less now that people are like, infertility is so unfair and like, why do I have to go through X? I think less of it is happening because more people are unfortunately struggling, but I just genuinely don't think it's easy for anybody. You know, like it is really important to address your mold. It is really important to address whatever infection you have to set yourself up for success, not just in the fertility journey, but through pregnancy and through postpartum and for the health of that future baby.

because you're just passing that genetic makeup or the microbiome that the baby then grows in becomes part of who they are, which then makes it very tricky to get out of their system.

Yeah, absolutely. And even just for yourself and your partner, right? Baby or no baby, your partner wants you to live a long, healthy, prosperous life. I think we all want that for our partners. Yeah, right? So being able to check in on that and tap into it. I did hear a provider once. I don't remember exactly what he said, but it was along the lines of if you're having these symptoms, right, and you're having, they've gotten to a point where they're affecting, as a male,

You

your ability or your sexual health, right? Then you need to look at that and realize like you've hit male menopause, like you're tapping into those changes. So it's like, you know, menopause in a sense isn't just something for women. It does happen. You do have those changes with age and then, you know, what is contributing to it? What's coming into play? But I love the mindset around it because it's like, I've heard people say, I'm totally healthy. just, you know, I have a hard time with

sex or I have a hard time with an erection, it's like, okay, that if it's gotten that far, that's a concern. Yep.

And I think the reason people say that is because they've gone to the doctor so many years and the doctor has told them they're totally healthy, even though you have gained weight over the years, you have gotten more tired, you get bags under your eyes, your skin is pale and they're like, you're still healthy, you're still healthy. And like what I've seen over the years, and like, I don't even go to the regular doctor because I'm just like, you're not gonna run anything that I want you to run. But when my parents go,

I've noticed over the last five years that the number of markers they run just continues to get lower and lower and lower. And so before it used to be 20 markers and then it was 15 and then it's 12 and then it's 11 and then it's 10. And so it's like, are those five other markers just not important anymore? Or is it that the system is like, we don't really need to run it. And it's not the doctor saying it, it's, you know, somebody else telling them that it's like, listen, we don't have the budget for this. So you're just going to run these 10 markers, but

The other 10 markers are still important to look at. You just don't see them and so you're totally healthy. It's like, well, you're not totally healthy. These 10 came up fine, but the other 10 that they stopped testing are probably not. And we run hundreds of markers where I'm going to find what's wrong with you because I know that there's stuff.

Absolutely. I feel like my dad is kind of a perfect case in point with that of like, he recently brought some blood work to me and I took a look at it and I'm like, there's barely a picture painted here. Like there's not, there's signs, there's clues on the table, but they didn't dig any deeper. And then it was like, his PSA was really high and they're like, it's fine. It's borderline. I'm like, okay, it's borderline right now, but what's it going to be in six months when you test again? Why would we just leave borderline alone?

Same thing with like any cholesterol levels. And it's like, it's well, it's high because I went on vacation. It's like, okay, well, it should be better because you went on vacation. So let's tackle that now. Well, we know. But I did, I gave him a list of markers, you know, to take back and see if they'll run for him because of insurance aspect. But otherwise, I'm like, we're running these markers for you. They need to be seen. We need the whole picture of what's happening here.

Yeah, and I do think men are very data driven when they see the numbers. You'd like, when you see a PSA that's elevated, you know, that's not associated with good things. Insulin, right away, you're more driven to say, okay, I'm going to do something about it. I do need to eat more fiber or I do need to go to bed early or I do need to start sweating more or whatever it is, you know.

Absolutely. Yeah.

How are you? So we have the ED that's showing up that I think, you know, like kudos for getting, creating a space where the men could share this vulnerable information, excuse me, cause it is vulnerable. And then you're testing and you're seeing that there's mold, there's cardio, like what's the approach to actual treatment here to resolve the issue.

Yeah, I mean, it's gonna vary between person, right? So everyone's gonna be a little different, need different things. For the client that has a lot going on with the nails, we're doing both topical and internal. So doing some supplementation, but then also putting things on the nails that are gonna help tackle that as well. So for instance, doing like tea tree and oregano oil and berberine, things that are gonna help kind of kill off some of it are gonna be really important. So, and then again,

you know, looking at is this the number one thing that we need to address? Because also with some clients, it's, you know, there might be a bigger issue at play. And if we're on a timeline for fertility, then we need to tackle other things first. But once we kind of prioritize what needs to be done when, and if this is the big thing, then we're going to go at it pretty heavily.

Yep. What's the expectation timeline in terms of clearing mold out? Because I want to talk about that because there's a lot out there and I meet couples who have been clearing mold out for two years and they still can't get pregnant and it's like mold is still showing up, but not really high. And so I just want to talk about expectations, especially when it comes to the space of fertility versus when you're just looking at detox and optimal health.

Yeah, that is a hard one. Honestly, I would say it probably takes at least three months just to have significant change. Even doing the topicals on the nail beds, it's like, okay, in three months, three to four months, let's see what's changed, let's see how it's improved. However, it's not gonna be gone in three to four months. It's, again, something that's kind of progressed over time. It's accumulated how intense is the infection. I do think...

It is common for people to have been trying to clear it for a year or two years and still having it show up. I don't know. And then you can do things where it's pretty much clear, but certain things might elicit an overgrowth again. So it's one of those that just kind of lingers and you have to keep an eye on it and keep track of it. I don't know if your experience, Dr. Jane has been a little bit different, but mold is definitely one of those stubborn infections to have.

Well, what I will say is there's no infection that comes alone. And I always look at the energetic component of the infection. I think there's a lot of people who sit in front of us who don't know what it's like to be without the mold because let's say your mom had a Candida infection when she was pregnant or she had underlying mold or dad had underlying mold that he didn't know about. And so now your ability to metabolize that mold is skewed. And this is, you know, talking about methylation, what we did.

And so you come out and you already predisposed to essentially not being able to handle that mold. And now if you're not breastfed or let's say you had formula that had mold or you started to like, they talked about introducing grains first and it's an all that kind of stuff that we just talked about that could be really high mold for someone.

and cradle cap is something that's been really normalized. then asthma is something that has been really normalized. Eczema, all these things that are actually a sign of this infection being part of you for a really long time. And so my husband is one of those people who has had this mold. Like when I met him, he was a fun guy. I pun intended because it's like, he was just made of fungus. Like there was so much fungus in his body and that was not something that he was aware of.

He didn't realize how that changed his personality. He didn't realize how that changed who he is or anything. And so as you start to work with the initial, like, I'm not gonna go in for more than three months of like intense killing because essentially it's just too much for the person I find. And so when you do like three months of really good, cause you're gonna start to see the person, whether they're energy tanks or their digestion starts. So there's like improvement, improvement. And then all of a sudden they start to tank. And that usually tells me that now we're like harming the

good microbes instead of the mold. And I'll use weight loss as an example. Let's say someone was trying to lose a hundred pounds. You're never going to lose a hundred pounds in one go. The body will kind of hit 20 pound loss and then it needs to settle. And then you can go again because you need to do something different, but you need that settling period where the nervous system gets used to it, where the like you get to rest a little bit because usually when you're going it's hard, you know, and there's

adrenals and mitochondria and all of this stuff. And I find this the same with infections, where you have to make some shifts and then you got to let the body settle, stabilize the microbiome and then see what else is coming up. And I do find the energetic component of for mold, for example, it's suppression. If you think about how mold grows and how it literally just engulfs the cell and makes it very difficult for the cell to do what it's supposed to do. It kind of like

That's what it does to people. And if I think about a man who's really overgrown with mold and I can just speak from experience, that's a suppressed male. They don't express themselves. They might not know who they are. They might hold their tongue a lot. They might just be, you know, quiet. Maybe they haven't processed some traumas, whatever it is, but it's a suppressed male. And of course there's females struggle with mold as well.

But genetics are gonna play a role for each individual in terms of their ability to break it down and do they have the capacity to completely let it go? What does it mean to completely let it go? How long, is, you know, there's just so many different aspects to it, but the general is like three months at a time, you settle and then you see what comes up and then sometimes you need to go again. And then other times, you know,

I think it's a gauge on the person. are they ready to go again? What's the transformation they're making? Have they been able to learn to express themselves? All that stuff.

Absolutely. Yeah, no, I love that. think that was perfect and really important to a compass. So I'm glad you brought that up.

Yeah, it's something like Dr. Leah's when I started understanding the energetics. I think when people are detoxing something for a long time, it's something is missing. And that was for me as well. Like I spent so much time doing parasites being like, I still need to go longer and deeper. And, and then it was like, no, I don't, you know, I was, I was addressing the wrong thing. I needed to move deeper into something else. And it was a professional that had to come in and help me understand that.

Because when you're in it, it's really hard for you to see, like even for myself, it's really hard for me to see where I'm stuck. Obviously I get better with years to trust my intuition and all that kind of stuff. But when someone can come in and go, yeah, stop hammering the mold. The mold is there because the bacteria, now you have this bacterial infection that's showing up. And if you don't get rid of this bacterial infection, the mold will continue to come back. Or if you don't get rid of this parasite, you know, do this.

So it's not a simple, you know, and then you have to support drainage and mitochondria and all this stuff, but like, I don't think it's as simple as just take this protocol and then you don't have mold anymore. So that's what I did with my husband for years. And it got it down a little bit, but you know, not in the same way that I can pinpoint it now and say, this is exactly what needs to go and here's how we need to shift.

this thing is also not helping or there's a heavy metal or whatever, you know? There's never just one thing.

Absolutely. And I like how you brought in that energetic and also emotional component to it too. And that goes with anything really. I know even for myself, just to get from where I am to where I want to be with different things with my health and, you know, just my life in general, it took sitting at a table with you and Tina, just chit chatting to then have that lens of this is the thing that needs to change. And for me, it's like,

Yeah, that is the thing, but I was living in it every single day. So it was hard to see that, okay, this is the actual thing that needs to change until you have, like you said, a professional comes in or that outsider perspective comes in and looks at it. And that goes very much with our health, especially if it's something you've had, like you were saying, since you were a kid, right? Maybe it started when you were born. So then you don't realize that it's a problem and you don't realize that it's something that needs to be removed or be handled.

until somebody else comes in with a very objective lens. And typically it's someone who is that third party person who doesn't have the personal connection to you that can see it and tell you. And that's when that realization hits. And I think that happens a lot with men and that's why the data is so great for them because they can see those numbers. But it's like, yeah, my mom's been telling me that I need to do this since I was little. And now my wife's telling me I need to do it.

But then here comes us, a completely objective third party with no personal attachment saying, this is what we see. And then the men tend to have that aha moment. I do have an infection. My mom wasn't just being a nag about me taking my sweaty socks off and putting them away. Like these are things that were actually brewing within my system. I just neglected to pay attention to it because I've had it for so long.

Yeah, and I think, you know, sometimes I'll have feedback where people are like, well, how can I fix it? You know, because if it goes back so far, and even I just I think that my lens continues to deepen from a perspective of like, I see what I passed on to my daughters. And then I see what their bodies are trying to develop. And now, instead of blame, I can go

how beautiful, like they have something to learn from the thing that I passed on because it's never perfect. And so we don't in the fertility space, like a couple sitting in front of me, I'll never tell them that it's gonna take two years to clear this because it shouldn't, you know, like when we have fertility as the goal, especially if you're over the age of 35, it's not gonna be perfect. It is gonna be a little bit messy, but we're not looking for perfection. We're looking to

help the body overcome what it needs to overcome so it can bring a baby into this world and a healthy baby. But like what does a healthy baby mean? Well, healthy means they have energy, vitality, and they have, you know, all the things working. But every day that they live, your job and your responsibility as a parent is to essentially protect that and to help them maintain that.

That's how I see it anyways. You know, when my daughter was born and I was like, she's so pure. That's when I started being like, I should buy all organic. Because before that I didn't, it was eight years ago. And so organic wasn't as popular as it is now. And it was like, I am going to get a water filter. I do want to put an air filter in because I just wanted to keep that purity. And of course you can't for forever because you're going to accumulate things. But then it's how can I help her process this? And when you don't have that awareness, we now have children who have asthma all the time. And it's like,

and allergies. And we just say, yeah, but that's normal for kids. They have eczema, they have allergies, they have asthma. And I just want to step back and say, no, it's not normal. It's actually their little bodies cry for help that they're not managing this microbial load. And their immune system is overwhelmed. So if we teach and give the immune system what it needs now, that bug doesn't have to become part of them for as long.

You know, but the body is amazing. Like it's amazing what it can do and shift and get rid of, you know, some, some things that have been there literally since you were born or before it since conception. Yeah.

it just needs to be fueled the right way. And I kind of liked, I liked the way that you worded it, but I think about it, if you were to sum it up into one word, it's adaptability, right? You need to work on your ability to be adaptable. And then when you do have that child, it's protecting their ability to be adaptable. And whether that means, you know, their immune system's adaptable, their emotions are adaptable, the way that they handle things, their nervous system is adaptable. That is the big part of it.

you know, and like simple examples with kids is right now, at least with me and my toddler, I'm trying to work on instead of when he does something being like, you're so smart, but ask, saying to him like, you've worked hard. How do you feel? Do you feel proud? And so teaching him that, you know, how he feels about himself isn't about what I think of him. It's about what he thinks. And then it's the same thing with his health. And I know it's kind of like a weird connection, but in my head, it makes sense.

But as far as his health goes is also all the choices I'm making right now. Like he is a sponge. He's like a little parrot that repeats everything I say every five minutes. So every choice that I'm making for what he eats and what he does with his body is teaching him what, one, what he'll probably do when he's older, but then two, it's investing in that adaptability with his immune system and his health. And like you mentioned cradle cap.

I swear I have been doing that since he was born. since he was born, it's been cradle crap. It is crap. But I always have like, that's something he had and that's something that we worked through. And it's so much so he had baby acne, super intense baby acne. And they're like, oh, it's fine. He'll grow out of it. But it was gluten. And right. so eating gluten can be a moldy food.

It's cradle, yeah.

And so then I start seeing things in myself where it's like, okay, maybe I had this underlying infection and I had it during pregnancy and I had it during his birth. And now I'm seeing that go into him. So instead, you know, I kind of missed the mark on healing myself with that and my adaptability for him, so to speak. But now I have to do the control on the other side and work on protecting his body and his ability to fight it and overcome it.

Yeah, and I think like this is something I one of Dr. Leah's emails where she was, she had like a crazy pregnancy, like one that almost killed her. She was just like bedridden. And there were so many things she's like, what the hell kind of practitioner am I if I can't? And I think that like, it's naive even for us as practitioners to say like, I want to get to a place where it's perfect. It's like,

There's just no such thing. I think where I try to get my couples to is to be ready to learn what they need to learn as they're going to go through the process of pregnancy and postpartum and being a parent, because it is the most challenging thing that you will ever do. It is the most reflective. I know that you have done a lot of work for you to be able to speak and say that, I know I have passed on this stuff and now I'm supporting him in his journey.

because it's like, that's what I had to do with my daughter. There was a lot of forgiveness and grace and to know that it's like, I wouldn't change anything about her. Do I feel guilty? It's like, sure, but that guilt is, I think that's just part of being a mother, you know? And so instead of putting the guilt on the mother, it's like, that's okay. Here are the tools that you can have to support your child, not be upset about the things that you coulda, shoulda, woulda done.

Because if you would have done better, if you would have known better, you would have done better. And women are selfless, especially when it comes to this journey. So I don't want to put any more guilt on people, but that awareness of like, how can I support that we need to listen to? Cause you know, I'll have mom sit in front of me and say, she's just sick and I wish I could help her, but the doctor keeps saying she's fine. And I'm like, is she fine or something telling you something is missing? Something is missing. Great. So let's listen to that.

because that's the voice that's telling you something is missing. And that's true in the fertility journey. Like that's something that we try to teach our clients. So you got to get into that inner intuition. When the doctor sits and tells you, that's fine, just need IVF. And you go, I think something else is going on. It's because there is, you know? So follow that. And find people who are gonna, you know, listen to you and help you figure out what that is.

not to find random rabbit holes. Because I've had a patient's like, well, should I worry about this? And like, do you want to worry about that? Yeah, like how many rabbit holes do you want to go down? We go down all of them. But do I take my patients down all of them? No, because you don't need to. It takes away from the goal, you know?

It does. And I think it's important to have that reflection also of, you know, what you're going through right now, it might be equipping you for something that your future child is going to go through and you don't even know it yet. So for instance, if you're going through this fertility journey, and let's say there's a genetic component coming into play, right? And if that genetic component gets passed down to your child, and then your child starts to struggle with fertility,

you will be in this different position to say, don't worry, I experienced it too. This is what we did. Here are some tools, here are some things to consider, right? So it's like, you don't know, like the journey right now sucks. It's not fun. And especially even like as a male, you're going through all these things, there's gonna come a point where your son might be thinking, hey, I wanna smoke weed or I wanna do cocaine or I wanna take Adderall. And you're gonna have this reflection of, I don't recommend it.

Cause here are some of the things that could happen and hearing that could go a lot further for that child than you may even realize. So remembering not to be so hard on yourself for the stuff that you're experiencing because it's teaching you something about you. It's teaching you something about your partner, but it's also teaching you something that you're gonna utilize, know, one to five, 10 years from now, and you just don't know it yet.

Yep. Yeah, it's the biggest reflection. And I do, the like forever grateful to the journey always, you know, cause like my miscarriage, for example, taught me more than my first pregnancy did, which is crazy, you know, cause it was like, how is that possible? But I think just learning and being curious and finding that right support to help you on this journey, but like, nobody knows better than you. And I have this guy and it's like,

If you don't know what that's like yet to trust yourself, just know that's the goal is to get there. Because if you don't know that yet, that is the problem. And you have to learn how to trust yourself throughout the whole pregnancy and postpartum. And when your baby is out to know what's right for them and what's not, nobody's going to know that except you. And so if you're in a place where you don't know how to trust yourself, then that's where the work begins.

bring the infections back in, it's very hard to trust yourself when your body's a mess because you don't have a good relationship with it. You can't trust it. And that was a big piece for me when I had IBS and anxiety. so it's like, I had to heal that so then I could say, I can trust myself. I can trust my feelings. I know I'm doing the right thing with the information that I have right now. And then that can change.

when I'm presented with different information or an event happens, but that is the journey, you know? And so if you feel like your partner's missing something, that's your gut telling you something is missing, because men are for the most part not as intuitive and they're going to kind of suck it up.

And I don't let them.

Yeah. And don't compare. Most people, mean, even practitioners, you know, some of the best practitioners, it's because they went through some hard stuff. And that's what made them a great practitioner. So even like some of the people used to see online with like the perfect family and the perfect this and the perfect that, if you don't know their full story, you might not know the hard stuff that they went through to get to that point. So, comparison.

Comparison, yeah.

Yeah, I don't know anybody who's having a good time all the time. Like I just don't, you know? So I tell my clients are like, but I see this person as like, I don't believe them, like put them in front of me, let me get to know them, let me hear their story. And I bet, you know, you're going to find out things that you weren't expecting. So I think that's a good note to finish on. We went all over the place today.

dealer.

We did, but I kind of liked it.

It's that's the goal is to just really hope you guys the listeners just find out what we're working on and what we're seeing. Because essentially, that's where you're stuck. And so if we can give you some insight of what couples are going through and how they're making shifts in the right direction and getting closer to their family goals, then that's that's what we're here for.

100%.

Thanks Nicole, we'll chat soon again.

Thank you.