Hosts Mike Guidone and Chris Caputo welcome Ryan Leary, a star athlete from Carle Place High School, alongside his father, Pat, to discuss a significant and challenging situation regarding his participation in both football and soccer. Despite his evident talent, Ryan faces restrictions imposed by the school, which have prevented him from playing soccer this season, citing safety concerns as the primary rationale. Ryan details his athletic journey, including his prior success as a kicker on the football team and his pivotal role in the soccer team's state championship victory. The discussion also reveals the familial and community support that Ryan has garnered, as well as the complexities of navigating the expectations set forth by school authorities. Ultimately, the conversation explores the broader implications of these restrictions on young athletes and the importance of developing an environment that encourages their various interests and talents.

Takeaways:

• The communication breakdown between the soccer and football coaches at Carle Place High School raises significant concerns about student-athlete support and school policies.
• Pat Leary, Ryan's father, emphasizes the importance of allowing student-athletes to pursue their passions without unnecessary restrictions imposed by school administrators.
• The discussion highlights the broader implications of prioritizing safety over opportunity in high school sports and the need for more collaborative dialogue among coaches.

The views expressed in the following program do not necessarily represent those of the staff, management or owners of wgbb.

Got a very interesting show tonight.

We're going to be talking about some professional sports, but we're going to start out with a very interesting story that's been in the news here on Long Island.

A young man from Carl Place High School who tremendous athlete, tremendous person, great family, sports background, young, you name it.

Really interesting story.

Chris is going to kind of take you through it a little bit.

But no matter what you want to say, there's always two sides to a story.

But in this one I'll tell you, it's kind of hard to find the other side.

But Cap, I know that you have your thoughts on it as well and we'll try to stay as down the middle as possible.

It's kind of hard in this one.

Yeah, we'll see what happens, Mike.

But good.

Kind of a local story.

We'll see what happens with it and then we'll talk some sports as far as professional is concerned, baseball, football.

We'll take your calls later, too.

Can we hope that the Giant game's not decided by the time we get off the air at 9:00'?

Clock?

Yeah, I would think that it probably won't be.

But you know, if you're having a beverage at home, maybe you'll be enjoying it a little bit more by the time 9 o' clock comes.

Absolutely.

So right now we'd like to welcome in from Karl Place Ryan Leary and his dad Pat to talk a little bit.

And Cap, I know that you know the family pretty well if you want to kind of give a little bit of the background.

Sure.

So we're joined right now by Ryan Leary and his father, Pat.

At this point, Ryan is playing football at Carl Place High School.

Last year he won the state championship in soccer with Carl Place and was also a kicker on the team last year.

And this year things are a little bit different.

So thanks for joining us, guys.

Thanks for having us.

Thanks for sharing.

Okay, so let's just start there.

Last year, Ryan, you were kicking on the football team.

And you also won a state championship for soccer.

Very exciting.

Were there any issues last year with the way that that went?

No, not at all.

I mean, I missed, like, four football games because I had soccer games, which wasn't an issue.

They had a backup kicker, so no issues at all.

Okay, so then it kind of was brought up to you that you wanted to do a little bit more, maybe catch some passes, tight end.

Who did you talk to, and what did each coach or athletic director say to you?

I saw one play a little bit receiver, and I talked to the football coach.

Well, I talked to my football coach, soccer coach, and the athletic director.

The football coach said, we'd love to have you.

The kids love to have you.

Like, you're a great athlete.

So if you want to play, if you get approval, like I said.

Okay.

So then I went to the athletic director, and he talked to my dad, and he said, whatever Ryan wants, I support him 100%.

Don't let a coach influence your decision.

So if the soccer coach isn't happy, don't let that influence your decision.

Do what you want to do.

You're a special athlete.

You're a special kid.

And then I want to talk to the soccer coach.

He wasn't too happy about it.

I mean, he threatened to take away my captaincy and told me I'd sit a few games, which I said, I guess that'll be fine by me.

So that's basically what happened.

Okay.

So it kind of came to the point where when we get to August, you have to make a decision.

What decision did you make, and what kind of communication did you have with the school as far as what you were going to do?

I decided I was going to play football because football started a week earlier than soccer.

So I decided I'm just going to play, and then hopefully I'll be able to play soccer.

But at that time, the school.

I had no communication at all.

I mean, I had to make an appointment with the superintendent, talk to him, figure out what's going on.

But other than that, no one.

Other than my last meeting with the athletic director in June, I haven't really talked to anyone until I made a meeting with the superintendent after soccer had already started.

Gotcha.

So at this point, for those of you just tuning in, if you don't really know some of the backstory that's been on the news, Ryan has been told that he won't be able to play on the soccer team, but he had to choose between soccer and football.

He's playing Football.

And mainly they called it a safety issue that, you know, playing as not just a kicker but also a wide receiver would make it a little more unsafe if he's also playing soccer.

Is that kind of the right situation, Ryan?

Yeah.

Safety.

Yeah.

Okay.

Mike, did you want to jump in?

Yeah.

Ryan, I just wanted to ask you with the situation as it is, and you were, you know, you had been on the football team last year as a kicker and you wanted to just kind of expand your role a little bit this year.

What was the reasoning that your soccer coach kind of gave in terms of wanting to strip you of your captaincy?

You were still going to make a solid commitment to soccer.

I'm just curious, did he give you any reasoning or was it just as kind of clear cut as if you're going to do that, then you're on the outskirts?

Well, the first, I would not have.

Missed a single soccer practice.

Soccer game.

I was in the basketball things.

Exactly.

So I was 100% a soccer player.

And he basically just told me, do.

You think you're being a good captain by doing this?

Like you're gonna open up a can of worms for my program.

You're gonna let other people do the same thing?

And he said, this isn't a good look for the program, and it's not.

You're gonna.

Other kids didn't want to do it and basically said, I'm concerned with you getting hurt and that I will be targeted on the football field.

So, Pat, I'm going to ask a question to you before we go back to Ryan.

I know last year you had switched over to, you know, you're a teacher as well, as well as your wife as a teacher.

You switched over and helped out the program at Carl Place to win that state championship in soccer.

You know, going through this whole process, what has it been like for you as a parent and also, I guess, you know, as a coach as well, too?

It's just been a little funky, quite honestly.

When I initially talked to the soccer coach, I told him, listen, I'm looking at this through two lenses.

Nobody wants to win more than I do.

This may be my last go around as a soccer coach, and I'm obviously vested because my son's playing and we're coming off the state championship.

So I have soccer's best interest at Horse and through the Dadlands.

I don't mess with Happy.

When Ryan's happy and he wants to do something, he's never let me down.

So Ryan wanted this challenge.

He's prepared for this challenge.

So I told the coach, listen, I think we need to allow this.

It'll make Ryan happy.

And let's set up some parameters with the football coach where he can only run a certain number of patterns or run a certain number of plays, and let's put that in place.

So if you're worried about him being in harm's way, which I'm not, I mean, understand.

I know the work Ryan does behind the scenes, and he's 6, 4, 200 pounds.

I mean, he's a big boy who can protect himself.

But I said, hey, let's set up parameters with football.

Let's figure something out that everyone can get comfortable with, and we'll just move forward with the understanding that he wouldn't miss a single soccer practice, a single soccer game, single soccer meeting in his free time to run over to the football field and help out that program and his buddies.

So that was the thought.

How it got to where it is, I don't really understand.

And part of why I know it got to where it is is no one ever communicated.

The football coach and the soccer coach and the athletic director never got together.

The athletic director ran to the superintendent and said, we can't have this.

And that was it.

It was forbidden without a conversation.

So that's where we're at as parents.

My wife and I are just confused as to why his athleticism and his want to do more and his want to help in a small school is not celebrated.

Instead, it was just prohibited without any type of discussion.

So frustrating.

And I don't understand it.

Yeah, Mr. Leary, I'm right there with you.

I can't understand how in this situation, I mean, you basically, with your son, offered to do everything right, everything you possibly could have done, and everybody seemed on board with it earlier.

And then for there to be to no con have no conversation with all three parties, really four, if you include the superintendent.

It just.

It doesn't make any sense.

I mean, I think if you were going to write out a scenario for a student athlete as talented as your son to do both things and to do it correctly, I don't think he could have done anything better.

I couldn't have put it much better.

I don't.

Like I said, I don't understand it.

And he's a kid who's.

I don't like bragging about my kids, but if I did, I couldn't because he's an high honor roll student.

He's done all of the right things.

He's a role model, and he's Asking to do more and it's being discouraged.

And I don't think you should ever do that to a student athlete or a student in that matter.

And one of the things I mention to them is in music and the arts, they share talent.

You know, the best singer in school is in chorus, in band, in orchestra, in the plays.

They work it out.

They find a way to work it out because there's value in the talent and you want to encourage and have the talent shine.

They haven't done that.

Do you buy the argument that he would have been, quote, targeted on the football field?

I think it's insulting in a lot of ways.

It's insulting to teammates.

I mean, the superintendent suggested that Colson Mc harbor and then the coach, soccer coach, both suggested that Colson harbor would target him on the football field so he'd be heard in the soccer match.

And that's just not the way things are done in high school athletics, not in my world.

And I think it's insulting to other football teams and such that something like that would happen.

It's just.

No, I don't believe that.

But I think it's a fine excuse to make if you're concerned about a safety.

And for reasons I don't understand, you're trying to discourage this from happening.

I can understand why they might say that, but I don't believe that would.

That's a tough explanation to swallow.

Yep.

Once again, we're talking with Ryan Leary and his father Pat.

And Ryan was told this year that he could not play both football and soccer.

So at this point, Ryan's just playing football.

So, Ryan, I'm kind of looking at some numbers, you know, based online.

Looks like about 11 carries, over 100 yards, 14 catches, 294 yards, three touchdowns, bunch of field goals and extra points here or there.

So you're playing football this kind of a.

Almost like a two way player.

Are you enjoying it?

Oh, I'm loving it.

Yeah.

Every moment.

I'm loving practice, I'm loving the games and more.

And I'm basically me and my friends.

Just hanging out and playing football.

So I mean, I'm every.

I'm loving every second of it.

So let me just get to the point here.

What.

And I'll ask this to both of you.

I'll start with your father first.

What are you guys hoping for?

And also, what are you expecting might happen in this situation now that you've basically gotten a letter from the school?

I'm hoping they allow him to play.

I'm hoping common sense prevails and they let him, I think for the betterment of both programs, they let him out on the field.

Ryan was the first team news.

They all Long island soccer player and a two time all state soccer player and a captain of a state championship team.

He's a talented kid.

And to see him, him sit on the sidelines, to me is an absolute shame when he could be shining on two different fields.

So I'd like to see him get back on the field and do his thing.

And it could happen fairly quickly if they just decided, hey, you know what, maybe they swallow a little bit of pride and say, we see where you're coming from and let's, let's give this a go with certain restrictions or hey, let's try this.

You know, it just never happened.

It's just been forbidden.

So I, I'd like to see him play and watch him, watch him thrive and succeed and score some goals on the soccer pitch.

And Ryan, what about from you?

Anything different?

I just want to play soccer.

I mean, it's the sport I've played.

Since I was 4 years old.

I've played with the kids I've been playing with my whole life.

I mean, I love soccer.

I just want to play.

Yeah.

And can you talk a little bit, Ryan, about the support that you've gotten from people in general, whether it be family or otherwise, throughout this, this situation?

Oh, everyone's supposed to agree.

I mean, from my family to the kids on the football team, even the kids on the soccer team.

I mean, the kids on the soccer team, they're not the happiest with me right now, but they understand where I'm coming from and they understand that basically the school is not doing the right thing here.

And.

But the football team's been so supportive.

I mean, they were supportive of me just playing football and soccer and they knew I'd miss three football games.

And they said, whatever you do, like, oh, whatever makes you happy, like if you're going to help us win, you're.

Going to help us win too.

But whatever you want to do, if you want to play football at all, that's fine.

Just do what makes you happy, especially from the coaches.

So I've had everyone's support and then my family, they've always been there for me and they've been just helping me out with everything, whether it's what I have to say to a coach, what should I be doing here, like, what decisions should I make.

So everyone around the school has basically been helping me out.

So, Ryan, first of all, let Me just say, I admire how you're handling the situation as a young person because the emotions are tough.

I know.

And along with your family, you guys are just doing a fantastic job.

If the school came back to you at this point and said, hey, okay, we're willing to have you do both, but as your dad mentioned, maybe with some restrictions in terms of how many plays in football or whatever else, would you be willing to revisit that right now?

Or is it a matter of you just want to play football your way and then hopefully do soccer as well?

Are you willing to have those discussions?

How do you.

How do you feel at this point?

You know, the crazy thing about it is if you.

If they had.

If he had played soccer, he would have missed the first two.

Two of the three football games.

Yeah.

Due to soccer obligations.

So, yeah, you wouldn't have the opportunity to get really, the taste of the football, which.

Yeah.

Which he loves.

And quite honestly, he's.

He's pretty good at it.

Yeah.

So he wouldn't have even got that taste.

He would have.

They were two direct conflicts, and he had to let it be known that he would have chosen to play soccer.

He would have only participated in one football game so far.

So.

That'S kind of weird.

Ryan answered the other part.

No, I would love.

I would love for the school to say, yeah, you're good.

I mean, I was originally going to have restrictions playing football.

Right.

So I'm still.

I'm still for the idea, and I just want to play soccer.

Right.

And so far, no injuries in football, correct?

No.

You wake up on a Saturday morning probably after a Friday night game, ready to go, you know, get 500 shots on a basketball court, probably, right?

Oh, 100%.

I mean, there have been days, two.

Of the games on Friday night.

There's been a soccer game on Saturday morning.

And I woke up, I told my parents, I said, I can 100% play.

Soccer game right now.

Like, I'm ready to go.

And I did 100% play.

Can you go to those games and watch them, or is it just for you too many different things in the way for you to watch a soccer game right now?

No, I still don't.

I mean, if I'm not doing anything, I still stop by and show my support because, I mean, I still know all the kids.

They still all know me.

I feel like I still want the team to win.

I still want them to do good.

So I'd like to show my support to the team whenever I can.

I mean, it's absolutely Insane to think about some of these things.

So all around athlete, basketball player, on the track, doing it all.

Pat to you, you've had three daughters choose college basketball.

How do you balance allowing your kids to make decisions on their own versus like, choosing what college to go to or if they want to transfer and spend another year somewhere else, versus just kind of making the decision by themselves?

And maybe, you know, on, you know, other times, you have to guide them.

I try to facilitate the whole thing.

I mean, very lucky.

You know, my wife Karen and I are both physical education teachers and coaches, so they've been around it their whole time.

And their passion for athletics aligns with us, which is great.

So, you know, we encourage and we push them to do whatever they want to do and just, you know, for them, they've all chosen athletics.

And for us, it's like, hey, if you're going to work at it, just do the best you can.

We don't force them to do anything, but if you love it, we'll do what we can to make you succeed as best you can.

So, you know, for them, it's always been one of my favorite lines is I don't mess with happy.

And as long as they're happy and they're doing things, I'm going to do my best to support them.

And it's bad athletics, which, like I said, it aligns with what we do, which has been fantastic with all of them.

So moving forward, I don't want to get out of the story, but just kind of taking a look forward.

Ryan, what are your thoughts in terms of next year in your college pursuits?

Are you focusing on basketball?

Are you keeping all your options open now with all different sports?

What are you thinking?

You know, what would be a great scenario for you?

I want to play college basketball, just like my sisters.

Yes.

But I mean, next year I plan on.

If any school gives me a scholarship, I plan on just taking it and applying basketball.

Good.

Is there any schools you'd be comfortable talking about right now that are recruiting you or are you just kind of keeping everything open?

I'm keeping everything open so far.

I mean, I've reached out.

I've talked to a few D2 schools, a bunch of D3s and some prep schools so far.

Gotcha.

Yeah, I was going to say that now at this point.

I mean, your sister's just tremendous basketball players.

I mean, obviously I coached against them and just tremendous players.

Your mom, fantastic coach, you guys, your family's a class act.

You do it all the right way.

So I'M sure whatever avenue you decide to go, we'll be right there.

I've come more to the prep school kind of route just in terms of players that I've heard where it's really helped them.

I'm sure you know, the Weiss family, Ryan Weiss did that.

Whatever happens.

And again, we'll get back to the current story.

I just hope that, as your dad said, you know, it's a happy process for you and that this fall doesn't take away from what's going on.

Yeah.

Thank you.

I try to not let it.

Well, it's probably easier said than done, but you sound, and with the support, you sound like you're on target.

And I know, Chris, you had a follow up on that.

Yeah.

I know one of them that's one of them on the line is not one of them.

But, you know, with an all around athlete there, I think you probably have a good head on your shoulders.

You just have to, you know, find the right situation going back to where you're at right now.

Is there any chance of getting all of these people in one room just to have one more conversation about this?

We've tried.

We wrote a letter to the Board of Ed to discuss it.

I hope so.

I hope so is all I can say.

I think the greater good for everyone is to get Ryan back out there.

But quite honestly, I'm not overly optimistic.

They seem to draw a line and I'm not sure they're going to change their mind, but which is hopeful.

I mean, the shave of it all is, you know, you have a kid who's been doing the right thing all along, and on a lot of levels he's been.

He feels like he kind of did something wrong because he, you know, as he said early on in the process, that he can't win, he can't make a good decision.

He's either letting down his football buddies or he's letting down a soccer team.

And there's no good decision here for him.

He was put in just a very, very difficult spot.

And, you know, he's handled with great maturity.

You know, he doesn't speak about how hard it's been, how hard it's been early on, how disappointed he is not to be out on the field, how hard it is to go to games and watch.

He really has just kept his head up and just kept working.

And like I said, he's had an incredible maturity about the whole thing, which includes meeting with kids on the soccer team, meeting with the soccer team setting an appointment with the superintendent to meet with him individually.

He's done a fantastic job, so I'm very proud of how he's handled it, and I'm hoping they kind of see that and go, hey, let's do the right thing and let them play soccer.

Once again, we're talking with Ryan Leary and his father, Pat.

We've talked a little bit about the situation where he's playing football, but at this point, the school is not allowing him to play soccer as well.

Ryan, if for whatever reason the school keeps this decision, doesn't allow you to play soccer this year, you've been there, you've been an athlete there from seventh grade to 12th grade, you know, playing at the varsity level in eighth grade.

Is it going to leave a little bit of a sour taste in your mouth for Carl plays I feel like.

For a little bit, but, I mean.

This is really one of the only.

Negative things that's happened to me here.

I mean, I love this place.

I love the town.

I love the people here.

So, I mean, I feel like for a little bit, I'm going to be upset, especially for the.

At least the remainder of the fall, even into the winter, But I feel like I'm going to eventually get over it a little bit.

Well, you know what?

I think your dad kind of hit it on the head there, too.

And I'm sure you feel the same way.

Maybe you don't get the answer that you're looking for, but for at the very least, to get everybody in a room to have one conversation, I mean, I think that's.

That's only fair.

You know, again, you want to.

You want a better resolution out of it where you can do everything you want, But I can't see any logic or any spin where a school district can say to a family and to a player, hey, we're not going to meet on this.

We're not going to sit down.

It doesn't have to be in public or whatever, but just everybody sit down, let you guys talk and say what's on your mind, and then the decision is made.

It's not a great look, in my opinion.

I don't think anybody would think so.

And I can't see where a school district wouldn't want to do that.

You know, especially there's.

I'm sure there's other channels you've discussed and that you could go, but you're not even.

You're not even going that route.

You're not looking to embarrass the school.

We just want him to play.

I just want him to be happy, you know, and they've created this less restrictive environment, and they talk about concerns for his safety when, you know, my job as a dad is to keep him out of harm's way.

And if I'm not concerned with it, I'm not sure why they have to be overly concerned with it.

And, you know, Pat Pizzarelli from Section 8 said in 40 years, he's never seen a school deny a kid an opportunity to Play More.

Section 8 doesn't have a rule, and New York State doesn't have a rule.

So I don't understand why Cole Place feels the need to have a rule.

And I guess this is a district by district choice.

Pat, have you found anything else out there about people playing two contact sports within the same season that you'd be able to go to Car Place and say, hey, listen, this has happened before.

What's happened within Car Place with the girl playing competitive cheer and gymnastics, which are both, you know, both have high injury risks.

Be it different than football and soccer with, you know, famously, Max Sebald did Eddie Hewitt.

Max Sebald was an all American lacrosse player who ended up being the national player of the year in lacrosse at Cornell.

And he played both.

He was all county, both soccer and football for Hewlett back in the day.

So they found a way to take a special athlete and promote that.

And like I said, I don't know why.

To me, it's a great story.

I don't know why they wouldn't do it.

You know, a kid like Max was special kid.

And I remember playing against him on the soccer field, and they allowed him to do his thing, and I don't know why Complex would not allow him to do his bribe thing, you know?

Yeah.

And you know, Pat, I've got kids that are on Unified Basketball and jumping high jump at the same time.

So, you know, we steal them from wherever we can.

And, you know, we never had an issue with it.

It's just you try to keep the community going.

And unfortunately, in this situation, it's just some walls that you guys haven't been able to jump over.

Well, in small districts, you know, we need to share kids.

That happens.

And East Rockaway is a small district, and Cold Place is a small district.

We have graduating classes of under 100.

You really need to share kids.

But the more I've discussed it with other districts and other coaches and other ads, and we've discussed it with superintendents, they do it all the time.

Districts do it all the time.

It just never.

People don't talk about it.

They do it all the time.

They allow kids to shine.

Well, I can tell you from my own experience in my coaching with high school basketball, I've had a player who played basketball and also did winter track and did high jump and all sorts of things.

So it's certainly not.

It's not unprecedented.

And unfortunately, it is district by district.

I was under the impression, and I'm glad that I got this education tonight.

I figured that Section 8, being the governing body of sports might be the last word on this, but I guess not.

In fact, Dave, you know, Pat Deserrilla said several times, and he called both the superintendent and the athletic director and let it be known personally.

Personally that it was allowed.

So getting a little baffled by the whole thing.

But it does happen all over the place.

And it happens.

And it's able to happen because the coaches sit down and they work out the schedules.

You know, the kid chooses a priority.

I'm going to make this and make this.

Are you guys okay with it?

Sure we are.

And then let's move forward.

And that never happened.

There was never the adults in the room, so to speak.

The coaches and the athletic director never sat down and had a conversation to see if it could possibly work.

And that's.

That's a shame.

I'm sure on your end you're working on with basketball and track and you say, okay, he's going to miss this and miss this, and are we okay with it?

Sure, let's go.

It's good for the kid.

Well, like you said, it's all about happy.

Well, we appreciate both of you coming on.

Ryan, I just want to give you the last chance to say anything you wanted to say that we didn't ask you tonight.

Not.

I think you basically covered it all well.

Again, I hope you can get yourself back out there because you've been playing soccer since you're a little kid.

We know you're going to be out there on the football field eventually on the basketball court again, and that's why I'm glad you still have that.

But I just feel like for something you've done for so long, you know, give it another shot and, you know, maybe something happens in the next couple of weeks and we can get this going.

Yeah, hopefully.

Yep, that'll be great.

It certainly seems, though, whatever happens, that you're the kind of kid that's going to take this and use it to your advantage and gain strength from it and be a role model out of this because you're doing great so far.

Hang in there.

And no matter what happens, we hope you have a wonderful rest of this season, rest of your school year, and good luck with your college search.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

And thanks to Karen and also Pat.

We appreciate it.

Thanks tonight.

Thanks for having us, guys.

I appreciate you.

Absolutely.

All right.

Take care.

Take care.

All right.

So just a real kind of head scratcher here.

You know, it's tough for me having being a coach and, you know, coaching against the district that he's in and certain people.

So I want to try to kind of stay out of it in terms of, I mean, you could probably tell that at least I'm, I'm pulling for the kid to do or to get to do what he wants to do.

Mike, if your best friend was the coach of the, of the team that wasn't letting him play, you'd still want the kid to play.

Of course, you know, it just, you get to a point where it's like, why are we restricting kids from doing things?

I hope it's just not.

You know, when Covid came around, the last thing you wanted to do was restrict kids from playing a sport just because of something going on around here.

But yeah, we were so, I mean, we're talking five years ago where it was like we were barely happy to get anybody on a court to participate.

And here, you know, we're in this great situation right now.

No matter what you can say, though, very impressed with the young man himself and the family.

I mean, just tremendous stuff.

Any, any, any thoughts on that?

We're going to come right back in just a couple minutes.

John Hanson, talk a little New York Mets.

It's a tough one today, this weekend, but we'll be back in just a minute on Sports Talk New York.

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And now back to the show.

If you'd like to give a call to talk about Ryan Leary and his situation.

Also, we're going to talk a little Mets and get into a little football before it's all done.

Big sports day here in New York.

You know, if you have listened to this program before or if this is your first time, I will tell you the Mets are a big part of it.

And with Cappy being part of the seven line army, he's scribbling on the other side of the if you could see right now, I don't want to say give it out right now what he's writing down.

It's not bad, but it's pretty aggressive because he's there all the time and he knows the team a lot better than I do.

But can I say what it says there?

Yeah, I don't care.

It says Mets and then D O N E with an exclamation point in big letters.

But to get a little different perspective on it, we'll welcome right now John Hanson is going to join us.

And John, welcome to the program.

And I don't know if you feel the same way, but I'm going to try to go a little bit that they're not done.

But what are your thoughts going into a series with the Cubs?

I think it's hard to hey, Mike and Chris, I think it's hard to to say that they're not done.

I hate to say that I agree with Chris, but there's no reason that this team has given us since, you know, mid June to think anything else.

I mean they're 712 the month of September when they had everything right in front of them.

That's coming off a month in August where they went 11, 17.

I mean they've played 405 baseball since mid June.

So to think now that they're going to come out and somehow win five of their last six when they haven't done that in God knows how long, it's hard to see how they can do that on top of the fact that they don't have the tiebreaker with Cincinnati or Arizona.

Remember, there's no more game 163.

Yep.

So you know, it it's going to be hard to see that especially, you know, again, they've done nothing.

I think the most likely outcome, Mike and Chris, is they win two out of three in Chicago and they lose two out of three in Miami when they if they win two out of three, they be in.

But you know, again I think the three of us could put on Marlins uniforms and beat the Mets the last weekend of the season based on history.

So you're right, Mike, they're not mathematically done, but this team seems like they've been, they've been done for some time.

Yes.

And I think, John, you're right.

It's going to come down to the last weekend in Miami, but not to a point where the Mets control their own destiny.

They're not going to be a game up on either the Diamondbacks or Cincinnati.

They are going to be either even, which really means they're a half game behind or even worse.

You know, we've talked about this.

Sit there.

You know, you and I can talk and say, oh, well, 86 wins might get you in and, and 88 wins and this and that.

There's a chance that this team could finish under.500, you know, by, by losing the last six games of the season or finish at 81 and 81, which is a downright disappointment.

When you start the season out 45 and 23, it's an absolute.

Another collapse.

And this is unacceptable.

And sitting here and watching this team go through this day after day after day and finding a way to lose and nothing changes.

And all I keep hearing is, look in that clubhouse, there's talent over there.

You know, someone's gonna come through.

No, they're not.

This is awful.

And I feel bad for these young kids that have been called up.

Well, the truth is now, you know, if you look over the last week or so, there's three, there's three guys that are doing it.

It's, it's Lindor, Soto and Alonzo.

Other than that, every, I mean, Marque's been pretty good, but he's a part.

Time player, can't play every day.

Nemo's done, Nimmo's done nothing.

I mean, Nimmo yesterday, coming up with the bases loaded, that was it, in the bottom of the ninth, striking out.

That's, that's, you got to put the ball in play.

And John, that's, that's a righty against a lefty.

You got to put the ball in play.

That was the season right there, you know, that was the absolute.

They had to win that game.

I'm going through this game.

They Got it to 3, 2 on a Vientos double.

Okay?

Then they, they go into the, and obviously they, you know, with Vientos on base, they had a chance to tie the game, didn't go into the ninth inning.

Soto singles to tie the game.

Three Three.

Everybody's going crazy.

Now, here's one of the things that I have as a negative against Soto.

I think he's been great today.

Gets picked off base because he's trying to get to 40.

40, okay.

And then yesterday, Lindor steals third, and Soto follows him.

By Soto following him, do you know what they did?

Sure.

They intentionally walk Alonso, and that's like a selfish move.

Otherwise, Alonso would have had a chance to end the game.

Nimmo strikes out.

Marte strikes out.

We go to the 10th inning, and you get that weird bunt single by Acuna.

Now first and second.

Alvarez grounds into a double plate.

I know there's nobody left on the bench and his fingers messed up, but Alvarez needs to bunt there.

You need to get the guy over to third base.

I agree, but, I mean, that's a lost art in today's game.

Very few guys know how to bunt.

Let's be fair.

Even Acuna's bunt wasn't anything.

I mean, he was lucky that that wasn't, you know, caught in the air like the Cincinnati was in the previous inning.

And even, you know, and I understand what you're saying about Lindor and Soto trailing him, but the fact is, in the bottom of the ninth, you know, it wouldn't have shocked me either if they walked Alonzo anyway.

Soto's run at that point meant nothing.

So they might have felt better versus nimble than allowing Alonzo to possibly get a fly ball in the game.

I think Alonso, they think, is possibly going to hit into a double play at that point, because he just always does.

But, John, it's just been day after day and today the same things, and all we keep doing is throwing the same stuff out there.

And then what's with Mendoza today putting mania in as the first guy and Clay Holmes is the second guy when last time the piggyback worked well, the other way.

It's absolute, asinine moves that he's making.

I have no faith in this team to win.

Because here's the thing, John, you tell me right now, okay, straight up, here's the question to you.

The Mets have six games remaining in the season.

They are even, which means they're a half game behind.

How many games do the Mets have to win to pretty much guarantee that they're in?

I have to win five out of six.

Okay.

That means that the other team has.

Whoever's below them has to go 4 and 2, right?

Yeah.

Yep.

And, you know, I know the Cubs just laid down it with Cincinnati, but they're not going to lay down with the Mets and the Marlins are not going to lay down with the Mets.

So you're expecting the mess to win five out of six when they haven't done that in forever.

They can't win nine out of 15 games.

That's basically what we asked them to do.

No, I don't, I don't think they will.

I don't, I don't think they will.

I think that they'll do the tees.

I think they'll win, you know, I think they'll win two out of three in Chicago right?

Now, remember now, Chicago is going to do everything they can to line up their pitching, correct?

Because they, you know, they are playing in the first round.

They are not going to get a first round bye.

So, you know, you might see some of their starters come in for 3, 4 innings and then you line up the bullpen there.

And I think that's really also the issue with Cincinnati and Arizona as well, because Arizona, you know, they're going to be playing the Dodgers for three.

Now the Dodgers are going to be playing in the first round as well.

Now the Dodgers may want to try to keep Arizona out, right?

So perhaps they will play hard these next three days.

But then they're playing San Diego, who again, they are going to be lining up their pitching for their first round.

So Arizona does have an advantage going into these final six.

And then Cincinnati is playing Pittsburgh and Milwaukee.

Now again, Milwaukee's got nothing.

Milwaukee, they don't.

But they are going to, you know, they are going, they're going to have their starters go because they're going to have that week off.

So they probably will have their starters go in that last series.

Now they did put Brandon Woodruff on the, on the injured list today, so he won't pitch in that series where he probably would have.

But you're right, Chris.

I don't, I don't see.

It's hard to believe at this point how the Mets could go in and win five out of six, especially with the, they're throwing Peterson on Tuesday in Chicago and Peterson's been horrible the second half.

He has not been able to give you any length.

There's another situation where I probably would have tried to piggyback Peterson because I think Peterson at this stage of the season, you know, again, he's still a young pitcher not used to going 150, 175 innings a season.

You know, last year in October, he did great coming out of a bullpen a couple of times he showed the ability to do that.

I would have thought about doing the same thing with him and.

And looking who else you could have maybe paired him up with for Tuesday.

And I would have had him come in the third or the fourth inning.

But you're right, Mendoza, I think, has had a horrible season.

I think he's had a really rough time.

And you're right, he does say the same things after every press conference, which is also the same thing the New York media got on Boone for all season.

There's, you know, when these guys talk twice a day, there's not much else they can say, you know, And Mendoza is clearly not a guy that's flipping tables over or, you know, holding people accountable.

I shouldn't say he's not holding accountable.

I can't speak to that, John.

He's not holding people accountable because if he was holding people accountable, Jose Siri would have been pulled from the game the other night.

What he did was an absolute abomination to the game.

Dropping a fly ball, letting the ball go by him.

That is stuff where you should be taken out of the game for now.

I believe that the shortstop from Washington was taken out of the game because he tried going a third on a ground ball.

I don't know if he got hurt, but that's something where the manager needs to step up and make a statement.

Yeah.

Again, I think.

I don't disagree with you.

I think it's probably a little bit different doing it, you know, with a team that's won 63 games versus a team that he's trying to maintain things.

Plus, the reality is.

Chris.

Who's he putting in there?

Cedric Mullen?

No.

No.

Do you want to see him?

No.

Jeff McNeil goes to center field until late in the game, and then maybe you put one of those guys in.

Yeah, it's terrible.

And, you know, the fact that Tyrone Taylor is down at AAA today and nobody knows where.

I don't know where he's going next.

Are you kidding me?

The guy's going to center field.

You're dfa' ing a guy by the name of Mullins who stinks.

He's gotta go.

And by the way, Jon and I know Mike wants to get in on this, too.

David Stearns did a terrible job putting this team together.

He did an awful job at the trade deadline.

And these guys are suffering and nobody is there to pick them up and.

And he needs to take some of the blame, too.

Well, I will.

I will say this about his trade deadline.

None of it's worked.

Rogers has Been okay.

But to be fair, to be fair, everyone after the trade line said he, he had a great trade deadline for the bullpen.

Pictures do need to be accountable.

Yes.

But he did nothing for a bat.

He went out and got a guy that was batting.210 to play center field.

When we didn't really need that, you know, we needed a bat.

We didn't, you know, we had a defensive replacement.

We had Tyrone Taylor.

So I am just absolutely furious at what this team has put forward.

And a lot of it has to go to the players.

A lot of it does.

But also the manager and the general manager have done a terrible job for July, August and September.

And some of it was in the offseason because they really did not address the pitching issue.

Sean Miniah was not the answer at three years and $75 million.

No.

I think.

I think, again, not that we want to talk about the offseason on September 23rd, but I'm sorry, 21st, but I think Stearns is going to have to relook at, you know, what he considers a viable starting pitcher, because there's no doubt about it.

Not a him deal, he had a horrible off season.

Jose Siri was injured and did not play well at all.

The trade deadline, we went through it.

Rodgers, Helsley, Soto, Greg Gregory, Soto and Mullins have been, you know, you know, disappointments.

I mean, Soto is what he is, right.

He has a couple good outings.

Couple, you know, a couple not so good.

You know, he was good today.

Don't bring him in with guys on baseball.

Yeah.

So Stearns has had.

And obviously, you know, we don't have to go through the woes and the tails of Frankie Montas, but we're going to.

Stearns is going to have to really reevaluate how he looks at starting pitching for 20, 26 and beyond.

Yeah.

Because, John, even if they do find a way to pull this out, make the postseason, we don't.

They're not going anyplace.

It's not even a Band Aid.

I mean, they have to absolutely reevaluate how they do things.

Again, we could say this number.

Till the Cows come home, 0 and 67.

When they're trailing after eight innings.

Six, seven.

Gosh.

If you're in school, that's all you hear.

Now, if you're a middle school teacher like we are.

But yeah, I mean, obviously there's some type of intangible I mean, we've talked about all the, you know, the pitching stinks, the hitting's good, vice versa, all these moves.

But what's the intangible?

Last year this was a fun team, had spunk, you know, grimace, all that stuff.

It was a little bit, almost too much at times, but they just seem so flat now with it, with a guy who is, you know, Soto.

I mean, could it be that it's just as simple that he has some kind of thing where he's rubbed his team a little soft and they're just not behind it?

Or what is it about, in your opinion, about this year's team that is just so flat compared to last year?

I think a lot of that probably has to do with just the lack of the late inning comebacks.

I think a lot of that, you know, when you have a lot of exciting wins and victories like the team did last year.

Right.

All of a sudden chemistry becomes this great thing that, you know, seems to take off.

You know, no one was questioning the chemistry of this team, you know, in early June when they were 20 games over.500 and had a seven plus game lead over the Phillies.

No one was questioning the chemistry of the team when they swept the Phillies in early, earlier, I'm sorry, late August, as they were trying to mount a comeback.

So I think a lot of that is, is probably, you know, just kind of media type speculation to try to drive a wedge in or to explain something that's unexplainable.

Do they have a rah rah or.

You know, my friend Chris loves a clubhouse guy in there like the great Lenny Harris.

They might not have that.

Well, they had Jose Iglesias and they, I mean, I think he was kind of like that.

They gave him a video tribute the other day.

I think all those guys that could have provided that are on other teams now.

Yeah, but I mean, Iglesia's doing nothing in San Diego.

No, absolutely.

Yeah.

I mean, I don't mean to infer that he would have been the key, but I just think that, I think that they vastly underestimated how they needed someone in that role to kind of, you know, take, take over a little bit.

I mean, how about when, when David Wright retired.

I mean all the things where they're going to pass the captaincy to Lindor and I mean he's, I think he's a great guy and fantastic player, but he's not ready for that.

The team, just for a team that's still fighting for a playoff spot, what's the identity Is there one?

No.

I think they have a lot of underachieving players.

I believe this team relied way too much on Mark Vientos.

You know, all this offseason where you could have went out and gotten guys like Garrett Crochet if you were to.

To look and make a trade for a guy like Vientos.

All I heard was, you can't trade Vientos.

You can't trade Vientos.

They.

They relied on him.

I mean, if you remember, Vientos was the guy that was going to replace Alonzo if Alonzo signed somewhere else.

So I think they just over.

I think they overvalued a couple of their, their younger players that just did not pan out.

Because again, truthfully, outside of Lindor, who even hasn't had a great year, but outside of Lindor, Soto and Alonso, most of this team has underachieved.

I mean, Nimmos had some nice moments.

He's terrible defensively, but not, not consistent enough.

Yeah, not consistent enough.

I think he's just.

But other than that.

I'm sorry, say that again, Mike.

Yeah, I think he, I mean, he's playing through stuff.

Yeah, I think he's dinged up a lot, and, and his, his defense really improved previously, but yeah, he just, he just looks off.

Yeah, there's, there's just.

I, but I, I understand the point about not having that quote, unquote clubhouse guy, but, yeah, there's some.

There seems to be.

There seems to be something off with, with this group.

I'm not sure what it is.

And you know, Winker, you know, I think Winker is a guy that could have provided some of that, but he's been injured all season.

Yeah.

Five, one, six.

Go ahead, John.

No, he would have provided some of that.

Yeah, the excitement.

Yeah, some of that.

Yeah.

And things like that.

That's a good point.

Yeah, because he, he would have provided that.

And he's, he's been hurt.

And so it wasn't, it wasn't like they completely, you know, went.

Went down with the ship.

So as we kind of wrap it up here, my.

One of my major questions to you is I know we don't want to look into the off season too much, but has Pete Alonso taken his last at bat at Citi Field as a New York Met?

I don't believe so.

Okay.

I would be stunned if that, if that is what ends up happening.

I think he, I think he wants to be here.

I think he's proven this, this season, you know, how important he is to this team, to this Fan base and to Soto.

I mean, he provides a lot of protection to Soto.

Now, if someone goes out there and gives the guy $50 million a year, do I think.

Do I know if the Mets will do that?

No, but I don't think that'll.

I don't think that'll happen.

I think.

I think someone like Alonzo is, you know, most important to this, to this franchise and to this city.

And I think that they will.

I think they will come to some type of understanding.

If it were me, if I were the Mets, I would try to go to him and extend this deal, ask him not to opt out, and then extend that deal, you know, another four, four years in the, you know, 120, 130 range.

And then you put it all together, he would have gotten his $200 million contract over the six years.

And I think everybody could save a.

Little bit of fates.

Yep.

If anybody wants to call in, we still have some time here.

John, just give me some positives.

What have you thought of these young pitchers?

And you know what?

They might even be able to help in these last six days of the season?

Yeah, I think.

I mean, again, hopefully, you know, between the three of them, they can give you some length over these last six days.

I do think, though, if for some reason, you know, things go very poorly in Chicago, you might not see them in Miami because, you know, I think they are cognizant of the innings that they've thrown, but they've been very good.

I mean, McClain and sprouts have been great.

I think McLean's been the best of them.

You know, obviously we've seen him the most, but McLean knows how to pitch.

You know, he's even had a couple of sports where he hasn't had his best stuff, and he's really had a pitch and he is.

I'm not sure about.

I mean, they might want to give him a little more seasoning.

I think he is up here because of the lack of depth in the Met starting pitching.

But I think, you know, when you look at next year, I think you're going to start your rotation out with, you know, knowing that you're going to have a list of trades.

Well, as we look at it, the Mets have lost 11 out of 15.

Some people want to say the Mets have won four out of their last seven.

You know, so you can.

I mean, you can look at it two different ways.

If they didn't win that afternoon game, that Thursday game with San Diego, it would have been a total downfall.

But here, here we are two days later, and we've lost two out of three to Washington, where those, you know, games.

I always think the games in the nle, the bigger.

It probably could have helped us with a tiebreaker against the Diamondbacks.

But at this point, John, you just got to go out there and hope that Peterson outdoes everybody.

Tong pitches a great game on Wednesday night, and, you know, maybe you get something from Sproat and Amanga only goes four or five innings.

You know, I.

Honestly, Mike, I thought about.

With the days off, I thought about trying to make that trip, but I can't put myself through this anymore.

You know, I'm going to watch.

I wouldn't let you.

I'm going to watch from the living room.

But it really has gotten to the point where I look up at the scoreboard and I see 3.1 million fans showing up.

Then I see that the tickets are going up by an average of 22 to 33, 30% next year.

It's terrible.

That much depending on where you're sitting.

Certain people have said they're going up 30%.

So if they had season tickets, you know, we're an average of 100 a ticket or up to, like, 130 bucks now.

And, you know, I'm just waiting to get that bill because they're holding my playoff money right now.

And, you know, I don't expect to step foot back in that building this year.

The fans did come out this year, you know, to their credit, because Cohen did, you know, mention that in March and during spring, saying, you know, you know, they want to see the fans.

I mean, the Mets fans have come to Queens this season and they've unfortunately seen a poor product, but they did come out.

Yeah.

Yeah, there's really.

There's not a lot of blame to be thrown around other places other than looking in the mirror.

And I think that the best point that came up, John, that you made is that Stearns has to just reevaluate, especially starting pitching, about what that means for this team.

And when you had a prolific August like they did, you know, unlike any other, you have Soto having the year that he's having.

You know, offensively, they know how to Put it together.

But the pitching has just been abominable.

It's just terrible.

The results are bad.

You got to be able to win some games.

But thanks for coming on, John.

Hopefully in a couple weeks, maybe a miracle happens and, you know, the Mets are still playing.

But thanks again for giving us some insight and being my therapy.

You got it, guys.

Thanks for having me.

Talk to you soon.

Absolutely.

John Hanson, thanks so much for being on.

Yeah, he's.

I don't think anybody sums it up any better or gives insights like he does.

Kind of talks.

Talks us both down.

You know, he's a passionate guy, but he's got his finger on the pulse of what?

What's up with the team?

I think the million dollar question that I still believe nobody has the answer to is what is missing?

A lot.

Yeah.

It's not just one thing.

No, a lot.

But I mean, look at it this way.

You're missing a couple position players.

The bullpen's terrible.

But just even.

All right.

And this is going to sound very trite, but.

And maybe there's no answer to this, but so last year, you know, of course, exciting group, whatever else you add.

Juan Soto.

Yes.

Right.

And now, like, we don't even like the team.

No, there's nothing to like about them.

No, you're missing a lot.

Yeah.

I mean, spunk.

Listen, there is none.

I'm going to finish with this because I know we only got a couple minutes left.

It's about results.

You know, you could be happy that the Mets came back and tied the game.

And the Mets were competitive and the Mets kept it going.

We're playing meaningful September baseball.

But the New York jets have not won a game this year.

The New York Giants are down 3 nothing tonight.

Have not won a game.

No, no, no.

The results are you lost the game last week to Dallas.

You lose another game.

Who got smoked by Chicago today.

You know, if the Yankees, for whatever reason get knocked out in the first round and wind up being the first wild card or whatever, they have home field advantage.

That's bad.

You know, it's got to be better results.

And unfortunately, people right now are happy with kind of just this contention.

This is New York.

We deserve better.

Couldn't.

Couldn't have said it any better myself.

And literally, as hockey is on, it was the last day of summer today.

And they practiced twice.

They play preseason.

Preseason hockey is going right now.

I don't even know each other's names.

I'm telling you, it's nuts.

Who knows?

But, yeah, if you are a Jet fan and you watched Aaron Glenn kind of shimmy down the sidelines and then they lost on the last second field, you're not surprised.

Great show.

All the best to the Lurie family.

Cap, Great job getting everybody on tonight.

Thank you.

Brian Graves.

Brian Graves, behind the glass.

Mets give us six in a row.

Yeah.

I'll take five out of six and pray.

Yeah.

And just pray.

Yeah.

Six in a row is kind of what you need.

We'll see you in two weeks, everybody.

Have a good one.

The views expressed in the previous program did not necessarily represent those of the staff, management or owners of wgbb.