The Athletic's investigative reporter Katie Strang joins Neil Smith and Vic Morren for an unflinching discussion of hockey's unseemly side. Six weeks before training camps open, the July 24, 2024 London Ontario trial concluded with five former NHL players found not guilty of sexual assault. Katie explains the circus-like proceedings, two discharged juries, inadmissible evidence, and split public opinion. From her personal connection to the Larry Nassar case to scrutinizing junior hockey's billeting system, Gary Bettman's eligibility decisions without codified policies, NHLPA labor battles, and the media's responsibility covering systemic abuse. Plus insights on CTE, concussions, Kevin Lowe's brain injury, and why loving hockey means holding it to higher standards.

IN THIS EPISODE:

[00:00] - Welcome: Pulling Back the Curtain - hockey's unseemly side July 24, 2024 London trial

[01:00] - Katie Strang: investigative writer with The Athletic, top of class with Rick Westhead

[02:00] - Rick Westhead: dogged journalist exposing underbelly of sports, dear friend

[03:00] - Investigative journalism not initial career plan: Athletic empowered pursuit

[04:00] - Larry Nassar case: purpose-driven work, indelibly imprinting personally and professionally

[05:00] - Personal connection: competitive gymnast, coach went to jail for sexual abuse

[06:00] - Michigan State: knew victims, attended court every day, heavy difficult assignment

[07:00] - Processing toll: supportive husband gives grace, kids' joy providing perspective

[08:00] - Wanting world safer for kids: every story like potentially my children in crosshairs

[09:00] - July 24, 2024: five players found not guilty by Justice Maria Caria

[10:00] - Michael McLeod, Dillon Dube, Cal Foote, Alex Formenton, Carter Hart acquitted

[11:00] - Witness "EM" found not reliable or credible after 2018 World Junior incident

[12:00] - Circus from start: most generous interpretation of how trial went

[13:00] - Two juries discharged: deeply problematic, offensive, upsetting

[14:00] - Juror misconduct allegations against defense counsel not tested with rigor

[15:00] - Both juries dismissed: treated jurors disrespectfully after entrusting them

[16:00] - Escalated concerns kind of dismissed when warned to report any issues

[17:00] - First mistrial set tone: bizarro developments almost every day

[18:00] - One hour timeframe: someone arrested for recording with smart glasses

[19:00] - Public observer explodes on reporter, banned from premises same hour

[20:00] - Delays with tech, AC, clocks: weird mundane things derailing justice

[21:00] - Strange experience: lives at stake but technical issues constant

[22:00] - Bench trial after juries discharged: public opinion very split on verdict

[23:00] - Acquitted of criminal wrongdoing: crown didn't meet burden beyond reasonable doubt

[24:00] - Moral component: what happened in hotel room, power dynamics at play

[25:00] - Inadmissible evidence: people not constrained by court parameters considering

[26:00] - Neil: disgusting even for former pro/junior/college player, cringe-inducing

[27:00] - Words Katie had to write, actions taken by young lady, things done by players

[28:00] - Players knew better than going to hotel room: stained for life

[29:00] - Victim "EM" initials only: five names public, what happens from here?

[30:00] - Pre-verdict speculation: would any play again? Not surprised by acquittals

[31:00] - Evidence ruled admissible/inadmissible: judge ruled for defense on every matter

[32:00] - Katie not interested in "will they play again" conversation in her work

[33:00] - Missing important step: NHL and Gary Bettman weighing in on eligibility

[34:00] - Bettman immediately after decision: players not eligible, incredibly wide latitude

[35:00] - No codified sexual abuse/domestic violence policy: legitimate criticism

[36:00] - Bettman wants wide latitude: judge and jury, case-by-case basis

[37:00] - NHLPA emphatically pushing back: interesting in broader labor context

[38:00] - Marty Walsh and Gary Bettman: strong working relationship, lack of enmity

[39:00] - Interesting battle: period of relative labor peace being tested

[40:00] - CBA collectively bargained: those powers afforded to NHL

[41:00] - PA pushing back whether powers actually afforded or not

[42:00] - NHL's own investigation: complete totality of evidence plus more

[43:00] - Nothing prohibiting considering inadmissible evidence: NHL privy to additional details

[44:00] - Will union push back hard? Will clubs want this on roster?

[45:00] - Stan Bowman example: after Chicago situation, would he sign Carter Hart?

[46:00] - Teams with domestic assault players: people outside with protest signs

[47:00] - Neil: can't see clubs signing guys who did bad stuff even if acquitted

[48:00] - Katie: what happened in room not in dispute, just whether consent

[49:00] - Teams will take cues from Bettman: if he clears them, teams will consider

[50:00] - Don't see owner taking on Bettman over Carter Hart who hasn't played meaningful games

[51:00] - Neil in 2025: wouldn't want that around, attitude changed from 1990s

[52:00] - Joel Quenneville and Bowman: turned blind eye vs players taking actions themselves

[53:00] - Can't criticize Pat Verbeek or Oilers: don't know what you'd do until that situation

[54:00] - Governing bodies responsibility: Hockey Canada, NHL with abuse history

[55:00] - Graham James 1990s: Theo Fleury and Sheldon Kennedy assaulted, served two jail terms

[56:00] - 2018 Katie piece: David Gove and Chris Weiss abused by Boston-area coach

[57:00] - Bettman and Marty Walsh connection: what's responsibility with awareness now?

[58:00] - Systemic issues acknowledgment: not reductive to condemn all hockey culture

[59:00] - Patterns dating back decades: ritualized hazing, sexualized violence, group assaults

[01:00:00] - Harms players too: not just community, players being harmed by system

[01:01:00] - Junior hockey billeting system: American perspective as outsider

[01:02:00] - Kids isolated from nuclear family during formative development

[01:03:00] - 15-16 year olds living far away with strangers, teammates could be 20

[01:04:00] - Team becomes central support: wonderful when healthy, corrosive when toxic

[01:05:00] - Pattern with junior hockey: requires all stakeholders to address

[01:06:00] - Reflexive defensiveness when critiquing hockey culture: sport central to identity

[01:07:00] - Reframe criticism: when you care about something, hold to higher standard

[01:08:00] - Larry Nassar and Michigan State: because loved place, criticism incumbent

[01:09:00] - When you love something, want it at its best iteration

[01:10:00] - Media role: Rick Westhead's "We Breed Lions" book coming November 2024

[01:11:00] - Dressing room attitudes, billet families: underlying problem still exists

[01:12:00] - Can media do more? Yes, with caveats about commitment from outlets

[01:13:00] - Rick and Katie's work: intense commitment, resources, not cheap or easy

[01:14:00] - Exhaustive editorial and legal review: 10 stories, two cross finish line

[01:15:00] - Constricting budgets, slashing staffs: hard to criticize reporters without support

[01:16:00] - Concussions: coming into focus when Neil was GM in 1990s

[01:17:00] - Kevin Lowe brain injury: brain tells you when wrist ready, but what tells brain?

[01:18:00] - Reporters laughed thinking Neil joking: totally serious about brain injuries

[01:19:00] - Sports world doing enough? Football and hockey addressing brain damage

[01:20:00] - Kids in leagues and up-and-comers: concussions at 12 years old

[01:21:00] - Attitudes evolved in 20 years: Neil ahead of time on Kevin Lowe response

[01:22:00] - Cultural shift takes more than scientific evidence: different factors involved

[01:23:00] - Gary Bettman still not acknowledging connection between head blows and CTE

[01:24:00] - Until connection acknowledged: long way to go

[01:25:00] - Echo of trauma: depression, suicidal ideation, anxiety, substance use disorder

[01:26:00] - Holistic awareness: unfortunate byproducts of head injuries increasingly important

[01:27:00] - Retired NHL players: require great care, support, resources, really struggling

[01:28:00] - Dynasty Islanders at current games: memory loss being discussed

[01:29:00] - Katie: enjoy wrong word, find work intriguing and illuminating

[01:30:00] - Offbeat episode: usually hockey person, GM in Katie's seat

[01:31:00] - Listeners finding this interesting: heavy stuff pulling back curtain

[01:32:00] - Katie doing job most wouldn't want: reporting truth creates enemies

[01:33:00] - Feels good about work: important to stop this behavior, does it well

[01:34:00] - Katie and Rick Westhead: two people making impact as hockey evolves

[01:35:00] - Hope there's always platform for investigative journalism to get information out

[01:36:00] - One of most revealing interviews in almost 20 months together

X: https://twitter.com/NHLWraparound

Neil Smith: https://twitter.com/NYCNeil

Vic Morren: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vic-morren-7038737/

NHL Wraparound Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nhlwraparound/

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