What’s the real cost of change for NGOs in a rapidly evolving global landscape?

In this two part series special guest Tosca Bruno-van Vijfeijken shares over three decades of experience in change management, which she often discusses on her own podcast "NGO Soul and Strategy".  In this first part we discuss some practical ways you can navigate change with confidence in our ever changing humanitarian world.

Here are some of what you'll gain by listening:

• Understand the psychological and emotional impacts of organizational change on staff and leadership.
• Learn proven strategies for navigating uncertainty, communicating effectively, and minimizing resistance to change.
• Gain insights into fostering resilience and honoring the past while paving the way for impactful transformations.

Here are some ways to learn more about Tosca and her work:

• NGO Soul and Strategy Podcast
• Tosca Linkedin
• Tosca website
• Download free chapter of book:  Between Power and Irrelevance: The Future of Transnational NGOs
• Tosca's email: tosca@5oaksconsulting.org



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This podcast empowers international development and humanitarian leaders to achieve high performance teams, fostering diversity, inclusion, and wellbeing, overcoming burnout and overwhelm, while maximizing impact and productivity.

Discover practical tips to manage difficult change as a humanitarian and

development leader on today's episode!

Welcome to The Modern Humanitarian and Development Leader podcast, the

podcast, helping humanitarian and development supervisors make a greater

impact by taking control of your time, leading more inclusively and

empowering your team all the while avoiding stress, burnout, and overwhelm.

I'm your host, leadership coach and former aid worker, Torrey Peace.

Are you ready?

Let's get started.

Hello, my aspiring modern humanitarian and development leader.

I hope you are having a wonderful week.

Today we have a special treat because I am joined in this episode

by a guest for a two part series.

This one will focus on one of the constants in all of our lives.

And that is change.

And I don't know about you, but it seems lately we've been going through more

change than ever with all the things that are happening globally around the world.

It's never too late to learn how to manage change as a leader.

And so in this episode, you're going to discover: how global and recent

changes are driving major shifts in the nonprofit and humanitarian sectors.

What leaders should consider when managing change in order to reduce anxiety and the

powerlessness that your team may feel.

And then finally, why honoring the past is key to effective change management.

And I'm really excited today to be joined by my special guest Tosca Bruno-van

Vijfeijken.

And she has a lot to say about organizational change management

because she has over three decades of experience helping leaders in civil

society, manage change and invest in cutting edge leadership development, as

well as strengthen their effectiveness.

So she's a perfect guest for today's topic and as a thought leader,

Tosca also has her own podcast.

Maybe you've heard of it.

It's called NGO Soul and Strategy.

I recommend you check it out.

I'm going to be sharing some links in the show notes.

And this podcast is to help leaders look change right in the eye which

is a lot of what we discuss today.

All right.

Let's get started.

As you know, Tosca, there's so much going on globally right now in humanitarian

and international development.

And if you work for a nonprofit in general, there's so much, it seems like

every year, more and more opportunities to help others, given the, the political

climates and many different countries, including what happened just last

now in Syria and what's going on in the Ukraine and what's going on many

other parts of the world, this all really accumulates to a lot of change.

And I'm curious, what kind of change, I have my own perspective on this,

but I would love to hear what kind of change have you been seeing in

the, development and a nonprofit sectors because of all of this?

What types of change and you're talking about the last,

four, five years, let's say?

I think we need to start saying that in terms of the nature or types of changes.

Well, there's changes in the external environment, which you've just

typified a few of those, right?

There were, this is obviously not the first wave of external change that

NGOs and nonprofits go through in terms of that external environment.

And the kind of organizational changes that come with that.

I mean, I don't, I don't think I'm going to say anything new when I say in the

last five years, there was the tremendous impact of the, global pandemic on NGOs

and nonprofits in terms of initially fears that it would affect fundraising.

And then of course the big movement following Black Lives Matter here in

the US globally for getting to a much more, greater action on, racial and

ethnic, equality, for instance, anti racism, et cetera, decolonizing aid,

all of those things have been happening.

And then in the meantime, of course, now after the global pandemic, we

see how the fundraising environment is getting ever more threatening,

especially for INGOs, right?

You see the enormous waves of cutbacks in funding from European bilateral

donors and you see now in the U.

S.

Here with Trump coming into power again that that will likely, we

don't know yet, but likely is going to lead to significant less emphasis

on international development aid.

And therefore also cuts to grants and contracts, et cetera, coming

from those sources for INGOs.

Now, there's still the public, but even the, the public giving in the US at

least has been in some ways plateauing.

I'm not an expert on that, but that is the overall sense.

So lots of changes in the external environment.

And in addition to all the Wars and crisis, et cetera, and climate

change et cetera, that's happening.

So yes, NGOs are going through another wave also of being prompted by these

external drivers to pursue organizational change internally to their organizations.

And that is what, what I am very into, let's say change management.

In addition to finish up on this, sometimes NGOs and nonprofits have

internal drivers to change right?

That are not necessarily related to these external drivers but for

instance, there is a push amongst quite a few to to shift power and

shift decision rights and authority, et cetera, to to the local level.

Partners and NGOs shift resources and there is also a a bigger push to

create to attempt to create more flat, less hierarchical or organization.

So that I think is part of the picture as well.

These internally felt needs for changes.

Yeah, I think you, you captured that all beautifully.

And I don't really have a lot to add to that from my perspective,

except perhaps yeah, like a, a kind of a push of localization.

And, and I think that is seen with the way donor funding is going as well?

Like funding more local organizations trying to prioritize or getting them

more in a position of prime over some of these international organizations.

So, yeah.

I think I heard the term in the, in the RINGO project context of

reverse call calls for proposal, like the Zambian government, I believe is,

is is experimenting with at the moment.

Ah, okay.

Interesting.

Sorry.

Reverse call for proposal.

Meaning?

Meaning, again, I don't know enough about this.

Our RINGO colleagues will be able to fill that in more, but we're for instance,

Well, national government donors put out a proposal to local NGOs, national NGOs in

their own country as the assumed to be the lead and that international NGOs only will

be called in if needed to partner with the national NGO and not the other way around.

Interesting.

That's my understanding.

But again, please.

Fascinating.

So, so yeah, so I, I mean, in terms of, because like, like you just

mentioned, I mean, there's a lot of change happening right now, and I'm

sure a lot of people listening to this are going through a lot of change.

So, I mean, maybe like, because I would like to go into organizational

change and how it impacts us and, and, you know, what we can do at a more

practical level, however, perhaps, but like, how do you see that humans

experience organizational change?

Yeah, that's an endlessly fascinating topic for me, at least.

So, . Yeah, I mean, there's again, Torrey, let me also say at the outset,

change management, organizational change management is a huge field.

Mm-hmm . It, it just, it's intrinsically very broad, right?

Because it's, it's amongst others about people, as you said,

and the psychology of change.

It's a, it is also about power, formal and informal forms of power.

It and, and, and it's about the mechanics.

And so much more.

So it's huge.

I'm just going to mention a few things that relates to the psychology of change.

There could be many others we could also talk about.

We undoubtedly won't have time for that.

So to start with one is organizational change inside the organization

obviously tends to create

lots of feelings, lots of emotions, and one of them is anxiety.

Because anxiety is basically consists of people feeling uncertain about what

will happen to their organization, to their NGO in this case, what they think.

about that, that direction of change.

The ever present question, what will this do for me or how will it impact me?

Although I will say as a side note, I don't think our sector is.

People in our sector are not always that honest in coming forth that really

what's in it for me is behind also a lot of the questions that are asked

about organizational change processes.

But anxiety consisting of uncertainty about that picture,

plus feeling relatively powerless.

Right.

So that's, that's, I think it's kind of a base feeling that leaders

and managers in these organizations need to be aware of right away.

What do you think about that Torrey, that thing about uncertainty And how

people respond to that compared to a combined with some sense of powerlessness?

Yeah, I mean, I think that that sounds quite accurate.

And I think you're a little more of an expert in this than me.

But I, I from what I've seen, when I was like, for example, a country

manager is when there's a change in policy, let's say that, you know,

if certain steps aren't taken by the leader or people don't have information,

they will naturally fill in the gaps.

And a lot of time that will lead to things like gossip which will

just amplify the anxiety and all the, the other, the other things.

So I, I don't know how you feel about that.

And maybe I'm going more into like the remedies around this,

but I, I've seen that happen.

and when people are not given even just the opportunity to talk about, what

they're experiencing or what they're feeling or even if nothing is done about

it, just giving them that opportunity.

I feel like you know, kind of sometimes will address some of that

anxiety you're talking about, but I mean, what are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, that brings in brings up two thoughts in me, actually.

Absolutely, you're right, giving people the opportunity to talk about the

organizational change that is on the horizon, if you will, the immediate

horizon is obviously very important.

It is tricky, though, in our sector, because often There is this old principle

within the field of participation that there is a difference between

one way information sharing that an organization may do to its employees.

The second level being consultation, which is where people are invited to offer

their opinions, perspectives, right views.

Et cetera, and advice.

But where the organization is not committing itself to following all

of that, those opinions, views, et cetera, to taking those on board.

So that being consultation.

And the third level, which is more of a co decision making right?

Where people have real influence that is kind of built in from the beginning.

And I think our leaders and managers, if they've If they're not very explicit

in the, in, in managing and negotiating expectations around that difference

between consultation and participation then there's a lot of miscommunication

and also resentment, et cetera, that can come out of giving people the opportunity

to talk about the, the upcoming changes.

Interesting.

That's the first thing I will say.

And the second thing is, yeah.

You know, I have talked to, listened to, interviewed so many senior INGO

leaders over the last 20 years or so when they listened to them talk about

what they learned, often the hard way about how to lead and manage change.

And the one thing that you hear is the biggest lesson is do not ever forget to

communicate, communicate, communicate in a way that often for many senior

leaders and especially for the more charismatic founder types amongst us.

And there are, you know, some of the hosts, it's very boring to them.

They don't want to spend nearly as much time on that as they.

really should.

And they often will say, in hindsight, I regretted that I

did not communicate even more.

And if I can say one more thing about that and then see what you think.

So that communication in, in change management really has to happen via

multiple channels, because, and in multiple ways, because different

people have different needs.

So just to give you an example, some people want to be told and reminded all

the time about the big picture, right?

The why, the purpose of this change.

They want to know the big vision towards the future, where are we going?

Okay?

Other people They're not so into that big vision, the why, the purpose.

They just want to know what does it mean for me next week?

What does it mean for my task load?

What does it mean for my team?

My budget, my power is kind of an unstated you know, a source

of question and anxiety as well.

They want to know very tactically what does it mean for for the

next couple couple of months?

And so you need to communicate to both of these type of groups and more and then

in multiple channels in multiple ways.

So not just, you know, an email.

In fact, somebody told me yesterday without mentioning names that a

big organizational change process in a big INGO a couple of years

ago was announced via an email.

And that was the first time.

Now, of course you need email, right?

Especially for large organizations, but that needs to be complimented by Video,

it needs to be complemented by having an immediate way of reacting for staff

right in a, in a, in a constructive way.

It needs to be complemented by face to face both again on, on video,

so that people's faces and eyes etc can be seen, but also in town hall

meetings, in one on ones, in focus groups, in open door policy, etc, etc.

What do you think about this, this kind of big field of communication

within change management?

Yeah, I mean, I just think that's so fascinating, Tosca, I really

appreciate that you brought this up, not only this idea of communicating

in multiple channels, and but also that Different people will want like

different questions answered and that's such an interesting and you're right

like I think that's such a great point.

I've also heard and I think this is even like a marketing thing that

people have not heard something until they've heard it like nine times.

Yeah.

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

So if you're just like sending an email and maybe having

one conversation, that might not be enough, depending on the type of

change that we're talking about.

But also one thing I see that leaders struggle with, and I'm really curious

what your thoughts are on this, is when there's some type of change, like a lot

of, for example, a big group of layoffs or uncertainty with project funding

or when projects are ending and so on.

And so you don't know you know, you don't even know as a leader what's

going to happen or how many staff you're going to be able to retain or so on.

And I see leaders really struggle with how to manage that.

And I'm very curious your thoughts on that, that particular scenario.

Well, this could get us into a larger discussion.

We probably should not go there.

I'll just signpost that for another time is yeah, how NGOs and nonprofits

engage with the need to not just reduce budget significantly, but

lay off people is really quite different from in the private sector.

And there are many important and lovely aspects to that, but this sense that we

have, maybe because of the nature of.

people drawn to this sector, although I think sometimes we actually

generalize a bit too much about that, but I'll park that as well.

This idea that the organization is a family that, you know, right?

Also that some NGOs, they call there in a confederated or federated or network

setting, they call each other, the family and and that's often heralded as

something very warm and fuzzy and good.

I actually have some, I have some issues with that.

One of the issues is that it becomes very difficult for us to then reallocate

resources including people, et cetera, to do things, for instance, like to

decolonize our organizations, right?

Or to stop having a country, a footprint, quote, on quote, and work

entirely through partners, et cetera.

I hear so many stories of organizational change process that were set up as

large, very impactful things that would include also for instance,

reduction in staff force, right?

But then end up not changing that much.

Now you might think that's easy for me to say I'm not impacted by that.

That is partially true, but at the same time, just, you know,

we as coaches, team coaches and consultants are also impacted by that.

And we also need to change course, right?

And pursue different professional training, et cetera.

So it impacts all of us in, in a certain way, but I think we have great

difficulty with that, the, the people side of of organizational change.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, it does.

And I'm just wondering, like, if you have any thoughts for the leader who is,

and, this particular one comes into mind and, and this is even before all of this

the change of the last four years started happening.

I remember there was an INGO that had like 200 staff that they had to

lay off and that was like for the, the leader, I, remember talking

with them and I think they really struggled with how much do I share?

How much do I you know, like how do I communicate, but not, overshare?

Because I also want to manage expectations and it's such a difficult position and,

and, and add it on top of that, even more difficult with the things that you just

mentioned, which are like, you know, this, this family kind of feeling, or like this

feeling of you know, we're humanitarians, we take care of each other too.

But but yeah, I'm curious if you would have any advice.

for that leader that would be struggling with something like that?

Well, that's a very big question.

And I'm sure I will not be able to give an adequate answer to that in general,

not being able to, but also not for the purpose of this conversation, right?

Because we have to keep it relatively short, but I would say, yes.

The more transparent you can be, the better in principle.

The moment people think that you are hiding significant things and

for nefarious reason, especially if it's around people's values,

like, oh, this organization needs to care about this programmatic

direction, or that priority, etc.

And I think I have a sense it's now endangered, right?

It's at risk.

That is is...

people start to really become both anxious, but also,

and we've seen this, right?

There's a lot of resistance that then builds up.

And I don't know if we'll have enough time to talk about, you know, what this, this

famous thing around resistance to change.

Is it true?

Is it not true?

Should we frame it differently, et cetera.

But that is one thing that transparency, by the way, also includes saying, "I

don't know yet as a leader or manager, what the implications are exactly

of what we're embarking on here.

This is how we are going about investigating that.

We promise you, we commit that we will do X, Y, and Z and keep you up to date

every time when we know the next step."

But to some extent, organizational changes are so complex.

They have so many moving parts that even change managers don't

know exactly what's coming up.

So also saying, "I don't know yet.

But we'll let you know the moment we do".

I think that combination is, is really important.

Yeah, yeah, it sounds like it takes a good amount of vulnerability

and being willing to be uncomfortable and share, but and communicate, like

you said, and I want to respect the time of our listeners and our each other.

So maybe we can wrap up this part one, I would love to hear your parting thoughts,

but also just to say that you know, all of this change and like, like what

we're talking about with leaders and how they can manage change and so on.

Part of that, this whole process to me is also evolving as leaders ourselves.

And I think that's what we'll get more into, into part two.

But I would love to hear, like, what are your, your parting thoughts around

what we've discussed today so far?

Yeah.

Yes, you know, we barely, we barely scratched the surface of only one element.

I know, we just got to the first bullet.

The first bullet of four.

Oh, exactly, exactly.

So, just want to say to our audience again.

People, this is a huge field.

Torrey and I only scratched the surface on one element, and only scratched the

surface on that, namely communication around how people experience change.

There are many, many, many other components to this.

So, if you want to, learn more and get help with that, et cetera, then

Torrey and I are here to, to support you with that broader field of, of

change management in your organization.

My parting thought Torrey would be so organizational change also leads to a

sense of loss and grieving around that often, depending, especially obviously

there are painful aspects to it.

Right.

And because one could say that yes, people can definitely feel threatened

by organizational change, but they also, and that's often overlooked

experiencing a sense of loss.

And the one thing, if I have to select one thing that I would say to a change

leader is try to do everything you can to make sure that you communicate

and signal over and over again that the fact that we have decided to

change or need to change, right, does not mean that what you as employees

did in the past no longer has value.

You need to do a lot of honoring of the past and celebrating of the past

and also taking as much from the past in terms of the culture, the

organizational culture that got that organization to where it is now, that

you say we are honoring all of that, that was valuable, is still valuable.

It is just that we need to pivot because so and so.

If you don't do that, if you If you inadvertently give people sense,

Oh, you mean that everything I did was kind of useless till now?

That creates an enormous amount of grief and grievance sometimes as well.

And definitely coming from that sense of loss.

So maybe that's one thing.

How does that land with you?

Yeah, I think that that's such a great point.

I'm glad that you, you mentioned that.

And also, Yeah, I mean, that kind of mental health is also and well

being in general is also a big topic of discussion these days.

And, and, and that this whole thing definitely contributes to people's

well being and mental health is how they see their value in their work.

So, yeah, I think that's a really great point.

And I just want to also add that Tosca, you have so much knowledge

about organizational change.

And I, I think it's just, It's very fascinating.

And so I do want to remind listeners to go and check out Tosca's podcast

on "NGO Soul and Strategy" because you can find out so much more about

those topics there at like a, you know, broader level, but also practical.

So anyways, Tosca, so yeah, that's that wraps up part one

and I'll see you in part two.

See you in part two.

I can't wait to to do that with you, Torrey.

Okay.

So just a quick recap on some of the things that we discussed in this

episode today on how to manage change.

So one is that you, as a leader can prioritize clear

and multichannel communication and to communicate frequently.

So remember, some people want to know the big picture like Tosca mentioned, and some

people might want to know what's going to happen or how this is going to impact

them personally, or even as of next week.

So more short-term view.

So keeping all that in mind, when you are communicating and also

communicate, communicate, communicate.

The second thing is acknowledging and addressing employee concerns and emotions.

Even if there's nothing you can do about them immediately just talking

about them or giving the space to your team, to talk about how they're

feeling is something that really will allow them a space to do so, so that

they don't do it behind your back.

And to be as transparent as possible with what you can share and what, you know.

And of course, if you don't know anything, that's something

you can communicate as well.

And then finally building a participatory approach to change.

Of course, if you are part of change or you are experiencing change, the

more you can be involved in it the more control you will feel you have, or at

least some kind of role in the process.

Of course that's not always possible, but the, to the degree it is, or at

least, like we said, allowing people to express how they're feeling can be

very powerful way of allowing people to feel part of the change process.

I love what Toska said toward the end about reminding people of how all the

work and everything that they've done so far has been a great contribution and

continues to be a contribution to your team and your organization's mission.

And if you want to learn more about Tosca or find out how you can work with her and

her consulting firm you can find links in the show notes, her LinkedIn page, her

website, and more about the services she offers around change management and more.

I hope you will tune in next week to part two of this two-part series,

where we'll be talking even more about how you as a leader can

evolve in this ever changing world.

All right until then keep evolving!

Bye for now!

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