Podcast Insights with Michelle DeNio

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Welcome to podcasting one on one with me your host

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Rachel. This podcast is for female business owners and

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solopreneurs that are looking to start a podcast that add to your

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own already awesome offering. I'll give you helpful advice

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that you can take away and use in your podcasting journey. I

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hope to answer those tricky questions that just keep you

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from starting. Once a month, I'll be joined by other female

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podcasters. They'll share their journey with you and offer tips

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and advice they discovered along the way. Let's get started.

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Hi, and welcome to this week's episode. Today I have the

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wonderful Michelle Denia. On with me. Hi, Michelle. Hello,

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hello,

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how are you guys?

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Thank you so much for coming on coming on my show. I've been a

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great admirer of your podcast, which is strategy in small doses

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for a while now. So I'm really pleased that you can come on and

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share your experience of what it was like setting up your

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podcast. So do you want to tell us a little bit about why you

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decided to what your podcast is about and why you decided to

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make your podcast?

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Yeah, absolutely. So I mean, for me, podcasting was something

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that I wanted to do. But I'll tell you it sat on the

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backburner for quite a while I had, my original idea for the

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podcast was completely different. And I got overwhelmed

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with the tech with all of the logistics of it and everything

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else. And I just kept pushing it back, pushing it back, pushing

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it back. And then finally realise I was really doing a lot

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of Facebook Lives. I did a lot of Facebook lives inside of a

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private Facebook community that I have. And I don't know what or

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when or how or what. But finally, I just realised like,

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this is your podcast, actually, I think what it was what made me

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really hone in on that was I started listening to another

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podcast called Daily mind medicine. And his podcast is

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unedited, it's very short, it's every day. And I just fell in

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love with it. And I thought you know what, this is exactly what

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you do. He just jumps on shares his thoughts, you know, like

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when he's got something on his mind. And, and so that was

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really kind of how strategy in small doses was was born. It was

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basically like I have these random thoughts or based on a

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conversation that I've had or a client conversation. And I would

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just jump on Facebook Live and share them. And I thought,

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there's your podcast right there, like stop making it so

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difficult. And I was overcomplicating it in my head.

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And then as soon as I stopped doing that, that's when I

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started the podcast. So the goal was always just to keep them

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super short bite size, because the length of podcast like the

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episode length was really what was stopping me and guess and

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being bringing us on. But well, we'll dive into that a little

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bit deeper.

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I remember when I first met you when I heard you on Rosemarys

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tbz, to podcast, and we had a conversation about the short,

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snappy episodes. And it was really interesting when you

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talked about, like listening habits and how they've changed

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since COVID. And that's something that I hadn't

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considered. And that is, that is the main reason why my solo

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episodes are short as well. Because I really liked the way

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that you got across your message. And you said, what you

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wanted to say, they don't have to be, you know, like 3040

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minutes an hour, you can do them so that they're valuable in that

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short space of time.

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Yeah, actually, quite honestly, it's one of the biggest pieces

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of feedback I get on my podcast is that they love everybody

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loves that they're short, you know, they love that they're

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just short and easy to digest. Because again, really, people

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aren't commuting, we're not sitting around, we're not in the

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car for 2030 minutes. That mean that was always when I was

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listening. I used to nanny and I had like a 30 minute drive and

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that was always when I listen to podcasts and then I stopped

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doing that and I'm like I don't really listen I just don't think

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to listen to them at home unless I'm getting ready or something

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like that but even then I'm not getting ready for an hour you

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know?

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Yeah, it's made me consider that as well because that's changed

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mine I didn't I had about a half an hour commute in the end and I

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that I you listened to a lot then. So now I tried to go on a

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walk or but because I'm in podcasts I like consciously and

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I want to listen I like I want to make a decision but I think

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generally speaking and people do enjoy the fact that they are

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sure everyone has time limits on their days as well to fit so

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much so much in there's so much content to consume. So that does

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make it easier for your listeners to be engaged. So when

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you had decided to, to dive in and share your thoughts and do

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the short episodes like how much planning did you do, did you

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plan to do with Isn't Did you plan out a few months worth?

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Yeah, my goal was to have one of the things that I also knew with

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podcasting that I was what kept me kind of procrastinating on it

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for a long time was that I did not want to ever lose my

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consistency with it. And I knew that I had to get ahead of the

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game. Because if I started to feel pressure that I would, you

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know, I would give up, or it would fall through the cracks or

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anything like that. So my goal, when I launched it was to have I

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launched two episodes per week, again, because they're super

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short. So to me, it made sense to do two episodes, I could do

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probably less than that even now. But I, I really do like

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doing too. So for me, I wanted to have, my goal is always to

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have eight ahead. I don't always get that far ahead. I was you

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know, I go through spurts where I do really good. And then I get

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kind of caught up because life happens, which is exactly why I

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like to have those ahead. Because life does happen, right.

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And so in those moments when we have that, maybe slower season,

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and I can just bang a bunch of them out, I do so that when life

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gets crazy, I don't have to feel stressed about that. Because

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that to me was the one thing I knew, if I knew I had a podcast

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I was supposed to release on Monday and I hadn't had anything

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recorded, that would send me over the edge because I do not

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work well under pressure. That is not when I best record, it's

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not when my message comes across the best. I like to record when

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I'm in the moment when I'm feeling inspired when I'm

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feeling. So that's where I literally will just sometimes

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turn on my camera or I put it into a click up, doc that are

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like a click up space that I have that just kind of like,

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captures the idea in the moment so that when I get into my

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recording, I've got it there. And I can just easily pick up my

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thought again.

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So you don't I mean, I know that you don't skip them. But do you

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just have like an idea or a thought and then you you talk

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around around a little part of Yeah, it's

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usually if I have like, usually what I do is if I have like a

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thought that comes up, like for example, one that's coming up

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right now that I've yet to record is talking about

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influencers because it keeps coming up in this space about,

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you know, this competitive nature, and there's influencers

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out there that are, you know, making more money than us and

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they give less service, blah, blah, blah. So like, I'll just

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throw in the Mi clickup doc that says like, you know, we all have

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an influence or we hate, right. And I know what my thought is

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around that. And so I just did there just to remind me to like

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capture the thought like in the moment, as soon as I see

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something, and then I can go back and I think about it I you

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know, I look at it and think about what I want to talk about.

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But sometimes, you know, honestly, some of the best

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episodes are when I literally just hit the record button.

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That is grey, I think and the ability with the show episodes,

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it gives you that ability to do that. I don't think that you

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could, if you have a 30 minute episode, it'd be very difficult

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to do like an on the hoof kind of thing for half an hour, I

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think it would end up being a lot of rainfall. But you get to

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the point, so many of your episodes, have they I mean, I

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can't sing your praises enough for further further podcasts.

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Because, you know, I absolutely love it. And real I often go

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back and listen to them with my notepad sometimes if I've been

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cooking and I listen to them. And I like the fact that there

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is actionable things in there to do and to to take on board for

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your business. It really makes you think when you're coming up

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with your areas of inspiration, who do you have in mind? Who is

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your target audience

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90% of the time, I can't the main podcast topics come from a

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conversation I've either had with a client or a prospect or

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Coffee Chat, something like that somebody in my network. So when

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I am recording my podcast, it's as if I'm just having a strategy

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session with a client. That's who I'm always it. Like, in my

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mind, it's I just get on Zoom or any camera, you know. And again,

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it's I literally just view it as if I'm speaking directly to my

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client and I talk the same way. It's not edited in any way. It's

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not scripted. And I've actually gotten some feedback there. You

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know, people feel like they're listening. And they're like,

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Michelle, I feel like you're sitting right next to me. And

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that's my goal, like I want people to feel like is if we

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just jumped on a phone call, you know, you're getting the same

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exact information out of me as you would in a coffee chat as

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you are on my podcast, like nothing truly is different.

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I think that works really well. I'd agree with thinking that

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you're there right in the room with you having a conversation.

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In regards to kind of the tech side of things how you say Do

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you don't edit? Do you edit your you have I know you have an

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evergreen intro and outro that you put on do you put those

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together yourself? Or do you have someone that helps you?

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I don't and that was the other thing with tech and I knew that

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the tech side of it would send me over the edge in the show

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notes and all the preparation and the graphics and the social

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and all of that and so when I decided to start the PA I guess

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I immediately hired a podcast manager, I actually went through

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too. But I knew that I would not be able to do that on my own,

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the tech side of it held me up for a long time. So I did have

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my intro and outro pre recorded with a voiceover artist, friend

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of mine, I scripted it, she recorded it, I have, you know, I

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probably could have done it. But again, like getting the

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background music in and getting the voice, right, and all of

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that that's not my area of expertise at all. And I didn't

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want to spend time doing it. And to me, all of those things are

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just reasons why it would not have happened or things that

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would have held me up. And I, I refuse to allow that. And so I

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knew that in order to do this, I had to hire it out. And so I did

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hire out the intro and outro we use anchor, I may eventually

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switch. But again, it was a matter of getting it done, not

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perfect. And all of these other things. And I knew that I wanted

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to spend my money on somebody helping me versus a platform and

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I, I've had great luck with Ankur I've not had any trouble

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with it. Their software adds the intro and outro they have a

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software where you can upload the file and then you can add

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your intro file and your outro file and it just does it for

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you. As far as I know, I again, I literally do nothing except

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for record them. And it's been working fine. You know, I don't

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edit them out my dog bark the other day. And one of them I

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didn't edit it out one day I was recording and the trash guy

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showed up and the windows were open. It was banging all around.

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But you know, again, it's life. To me. It's not about being

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perfect. Perfect. And I want my i i Really that's an a very

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important message to me that Don is better than perfect. And so I

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don't want to edit all that stuff out. Because you know

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what? The message is still the message? Yes, there might be a

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little bit of background noise, some here and there. But

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regardless, it's done. It's done. And the message that I

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have to share as far more important than whether or not

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the trash truck is driving by.

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Yeah, absolutely. I I do feel that that side of things that

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the tech that editing is a big barrier. When I've asked them

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questions on my Instagram stories about you know, what's

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the biggest thing that holds you up tech is the number one thing

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that holds everybody up. I know some people aren't in the

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position of, you know, outsourcing or being able to pay

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for a platform, I use anchor for my first podcast. And I

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absolutely thought it was great. It did everything I wanted it to

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do. I think pretty much most of my clients use anchor as well.

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And I've gone for Captivate this time because I knew I wanted to,

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I wanted to invest in a paid platform. But for me as a

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podcast manager, that was a decision that I made as a

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podcast manager as well. And so but there are plenty of

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platforms out there for you. If you know the money side of

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things is a barrier to be able to use that work absolutely,

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brilliantly, you know, links up to Spotify, you can actually put

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music through anchor videos to anchor now and Spotify. So host

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Yeah, I'm helping one of my clients move and put their

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videos on there as well. It only goes out on Spotify, but it

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still sends the audio to everywhere else, which is a

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really great. So it's been interesting to see where that

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goes and how popular that would be for Spotify. So yeah, and

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because a great a great tool. So you mentioned you have a podcast

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manager who helps you with your promotion, do you? What kind of

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promotion do you do for your podcast? You do audio grammes

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and have some quotes and things?

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Yeah, we've, you know, the marketing of the podcast has

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definitely probably been a little bit harder than I would

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have expected it just not in a bad way. But it's something I

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feel well, there's a couple things. One is podcasting. You

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don't get aside from downloads, you don't get a lot of analytics

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on it. It's very hard to understand. Like, it's not like

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on social media where you get likes, or you get comments or

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you get this or that right, like any other social platform, you

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get all of these things and where are podcasts? You people

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could listen, I remember I had somebody reach out to me and she

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was like, I'm your biggest fan. I've listened to every one of

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your episodes. I don't even know who she is. So like, those

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things to me are like so amazing. Like when that ends,

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like how the hell do you even find that I don't even like I

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don't even know who you are. So those things to me are just mind

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boggling. So but from the promotion side of it, usually

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what we do is again, I don't do any of this. And that may be

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good or bad. I don't know I literally just upload the raw

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files and know that it's handled. But what we do do a

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mixture of audio grammes, we've started to do small video clips

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because I do record all of my episodes on video. So what I've

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been trying to do and what does seem to really gain a lot more

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traction than anything else is these little one minute snippets

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of the actual video where people can see me their caption etc. So

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between the audio Graham's the video and then usually it's a

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long form social post that captures kind of the essence of

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it. We've tried a couple different things we've tried,

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where the long form social posts we've also tried. Here are the

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three key takeaways. He's go listen, that I have not found to

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work as well. People don't really go listen, it's like not

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enough information to capture the attention. It's it's a

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little bit too cryptic. And I'd rather just get the message out

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there again, to me, it's most important to get the message out

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there. And so if people go and listen to the podcast, great if

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they don't, so be it, you know, I mean, the message is still

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received, that's what's most important to me.

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Yeah, I like I like I've seen your videos on LinkedIn, I like

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those. They're, they're nice. Video clips, I think that people

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do engage with those quite well. And the audiograms worked quite

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well as well for for social media,

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with the audiogram. So you definitely have to caption them,

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because a lot of people you know, they see it, but they're

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not listening to it. So yeah, have captions on it. They're not

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really, they don't know anything.

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Why I use headliner is quite good at, they'll catch on it

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when you when you pull it in. Yeah, so you've got the and then

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you can kind of, you can actually tweak the size of it

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and the colour and stuff, which is really cool. So I quite like

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that's like my favourite audiogram. Maker. Um, do you

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feel like your podcast has helped you helped your business?

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Like, does it aligned with what you do? Do you feel like

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it is? It's very aligned, I definitely think I can be

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utilising it more than I am. I I will say that it's one of the

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things I really, really would like to get into bigger

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promotion with it. I don't do a lot of guests podcasting. I

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don't bring a lot of guests on my show. I know that that would

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help. But again, the logistics of bringing guests on to me is

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so overwhelming. And quite honestly, you have to find the

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right guest right? Because otherwise, like they don't share

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it. And so it doesn't really gain you anything. It's just a

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lot of extra work, in my opinion. So I do think

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eventually, I will start doing that. But really the solo

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episodes if nothing else, for me, it's, it's how I best speak.

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So my goal was, or it's how I best share content. And so my

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ultimate goal with the podcast was that I could put it out

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there and then create content from that so and from that

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respect, it's done very, very well. It's really helped me stay

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consistent with my content, it's really helped me get my message

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across. As far as like, has it brought in clients, not yet. I

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don't know that. But again, I also know that when you have a

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podcast, if somebody is kind of lurking or stalking you in the

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background, they start to listen, like I had somebody

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right now who reached out to me and she goes, I just want to

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kind of hear your content a little bit more before we jump

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on a call. So she's been listening to my podcast, it's a

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great way for me to say, Hey, if you want some free content, go

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check it out. I use it more for that perspective, more as like

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an authority builder than more than a lead generation tool, if

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that makes sense.

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Yeah, I think that works really well. Like I started this

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podcast because I wanted to talk to my ideal client. And I guess

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kind of use it as a bit of a lead generator as well. But I

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also wanted to give some content to to those people as well that

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were on the fence about podcasting, or perhaps, you

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know, people who just wanted to do it themselves, and they just

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wanted somewhere to go that maybe in the future might want

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to have someone help them with their podcast. But I agree the

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same way with keeping your marketing consistent, I feel

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like podcasts are a really great way to do that. Because you're

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creating that consistent piece of content that you can then

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repurpose into the rest of your marketing, so you don't. So when

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you're thinking about starting a podcast, and you think that it's

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gonna be a lot of extra work, you can actually make it like

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work a bit more for you, then, you know, obviously it is it is

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a bit of work, because you still have to put the time and effort

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into it. But it will help with your marketing because I felt

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like that with mine as well. But it helps you have a focus for

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the week or you know, something that you can dive in a little

Unknown: 00:18:58

bit deeper, whatever you've touched on. In each of your

Unknown: 00:19:01

episodes, you can dive in a bit deeper to help your audience

Unknown: 00:19:06

a couple times is like done little mini series where I'll do

Unknown: 00:19:09

like eight steps or eight things that lead to a lead generation

Unknown: 00:19:14

or a lead magnet. I've done a mini series that kind of dove a

Unknown: 00:19:18

little deeper into my route framework. And then that led to

Unknown: 00:19:22

a masterclass Did anything come of it from the podcast? Again,

Unknown: 00:19:26

it's very hard to track. So I have to just assume that it

Unknown: 00:19:30

helps. Right? But I don't know that because you really can't

Unknown: 00:19:33

track that unless, you know, I know you. I started listening,

Unknown: 00:19:38

you know on my intros when I start my episodes. I'm like,

Unknown: 00:19:40

please, if you're listening, like reach out to me and say

Unknown: 00:19:42

hello, like, let me know you're here. Because it's so hard for

Unknown: 00:19:46

me to like understand, like who was here who's listening like,

Unknown: 00:19:49

please let me know. And I do love that. I've had a couple of

Unknown: 00:19:52

people like actually send me a message and say, Hey, I was just

Unknown: 00:19:55

listening to your podcast and you said to say hello. So I

Unknown: 00:19:57

wanted to let you know and I really appreciate that. outline

Unknown: 00:20:00

that means so much to me because, again, you don't it's

Unknown: 00:20:03

very hard to track. Unless you're 100%. And you've grown a

Unknown: 00:20:08

massive audience like some of these big names like Amy

Unknown: 00:20:11

Porterfield different things like they, I'm sure can track

Unknown: 00:20:14

like certain links coming through show notes and different

Unknown: 00:20:17

things. I don't have any of that setup right now.

Unknown: 00:20:20

No, I, I don't either. And I think that's part of the growth

Unknown: 00:20:25

aspect of like, when your podcast grows, I was talking

Unknown: 00:20:28

about this with another lady earlier today. And it is very

Unknown: 00:20:33

talking about like listening engagement and like getting

Unknown: 00:20:36

people to engage with your podcasts. And it is, it is a

Unknown: 00:20:40

long term game, I even think over 12 months, if you haven't

Unknown: 00:20:43

already got a well grown audience, when you're starting

Unknown: 00:20:46

your podcast, I think it's important not to get caught up

Unknown: 00:20:50

in in those kinds of numbers and things as well and downloads, to

Unknown: 00:20:54

try and focus on making your content as accessible for your

Unknown: 00:20:58

audience as possible. And then the rest will kind of come and

Unknown: 00:21:01

hopefully, like your social media, or your marketing, you'll

Unknown: 00:21:05

grow that little by little, but it's not a you know, a quick fix

Unknown: 00:21:11

if you want to kind of start a podcast because you think you're

Unknown: 00:21:14

gonna get the top 10 and whatever. It's not the that's

Unknown: 00:21:17

not the right reason to start your podcast. It's absolutely,

Unknown: 00:21:20

yeah, to add value to your audience, what would be kind of

Unknown: 00:21:26

your top piece of advice? For people who want to start a

Unknown: 00:21:33

podcast? Would it be there, just just go ahead and do it?

Unknown: 00:21:41

For sure, you know, don't let yourself get in your head, you

Unknown: 00:21:44

know, I had all the thoughts around it. Like who's gonna

Unknown: 00:21:47

listen to this? What happens if it takes off? What happens if it

Unknown: 00:21:50

doesn't take off? What if I get negative feedback, you know,

Unknown: 00:21:53

because, you know, a lot of the Guru's say like, you know, a lot

Unknown: 00:21:56

of what I say kind of goes against the grain and a lot of

Unknown: 00:21:59

ways, so I thought, you know, okay, this is very public. And

Unknown: 00:22:01

again, you know, it's one thing to go live in a Facebook group

Unknown: 00:22:05

where you know, the people, right, it's a very close knit

Unknown: 00:22:07

audience, you know exactly who you're speaking to. We're a

Unknown: 00:22:10

podcast, I mean, it can be shared, it can go out to a bunch

Unknown: 00:22:13

of people you don't know, and it can be very scary, you know,

Unknown: 00:22:16

those thoughts can come in and like, Oh, my God, what if people

Unknown: 00:22:19

don't like it? What if I start getting negative feedback? What

Unknown: 00:22:21

if somebody contradicts what I have to say, but the reality is,

Unknown: 00:22:24

is that there's more people out there that need to hear your

Unknown: 00:22:27

message that are there, you know, haters are always gonna

Unknown: 00:22:30

hate. You know, it's like that thing Haters gonna hate, you

Unknown: 00:22:32

know, but you have to just figure out what it is that you

Unknown: 00:22:36

like, what you feel the most comfortable with what you feel

Unknown: 00:22:39

you can maintain the consistency with and figure out why you're

Unknown: 00:22:42

doing it again, I didn't start my podcast with the intention of

Unknown: 00:22:45

it, making me 1000s of dollars, right? It's the intention was,

Unknown: 00:22:48

it's how I best serve, it's how I can get my best message out

Unknown: 00:22:53

there. And so that's why I started it, and I will grow it

Unknown: 00:22:57

and I will stick with it, and I love it. But I don't have any

Unknown: 00:23:01

expectations from it. It's I'm doing it more because it's how I

Unknown: 00:23:06

I best share and hoping that it resonates with and it is

Unknown: 00:23:12

resonating. And that's enough for me. So you have to figure

Unknown: 00:23:15

out what it is it's going to work for you whether it's guest

Unknown: 00:23:18

episodes you don't have to do if you don't like I don't like

Unknown: 00:23:21

bringing guests on my podcast. It's not because I don't like

Unknown: 00:23:23

speaking other people. It's just it's a lot of work for me. And

Unknown: 00:23:27

it, it definitely sends me backwards. And I realised that

Unknown: 00:23:32

because I've tried it a couple times. And I'm like I get

Unknown: 00:23:34

wrapped up and how are you gonna get them the information. So

Unknown: 00:23:37

don't get wrapped up in all of the shoulds, which is my message

Unknown: 00:23:41

in general, overall, is don't get wrapped up in the shoulds do

Unknown: 00:23:45

what you feel comfortable with, do what lights you up. And if

Unknown: 00:23:48

that's a two minute episode, great if it's an hour long

Unknown: 00:23:50

episode, great if it's guest great solo, great, edited, you

Unknown: 00:23:54

know what I mean? Like, it will be successful when you feel

Unknown: 00:23:58

confident about it. That's what's most important. If you

Unknown: 00:24:01

feel good about it, and you feel confident about it. And you know

Unknown: 00:24:03

that it's the messengers we're sharing. That's what's most

Unknown: 00:24:06

important. And so just do it, but find us find a system that

Unknown: 00:24:09

works for you.

Unknown: 00:24:10

Yeah, that's great advice. Absolutely. Finding something

Unknown: 00:24:13

that works for you and your business and not comparing it to

Unknown: 00:24:17

everybody else's podcast or whatever it is you're trying to

Unknown: 00:24:21

do. You just do it your own way.

Unknown: 00:24:24

Yeah, and people really don't expect perfection. You know, I

Unknown: 00:24:27

really challenge you to go and listen to all of these podcasts

Unknown: 00:24:30

that you listen to, if you're if you listen to podcasts, and

Unknown: 00:24:33

you're thinking about starting a podcast, whether it's Amy

Unknown: 00:24:35

Porterfield, Tiffany Carter, or James Wedmore, any of these big

Unknown: 00:24:38

names, they're not perfect. They're not you know, they have

Unknown: 00:24:41

a little bit more editing and maybe some bigger music intros

Unknown: 00:24:44

and all of that. But, I mean, there's dogs barking, there's

Unknown: 00:24:48

birds chirping, you know what I mean? They're not editing all

Unknown: 00:24:51

that stuff out and like think about your own listening habits

Unknown: 00:24:53

to like, all of these fears that you have about other people

Unknown: 00:24:57

judging you like think about yourself In your own listening

Unknown: 00:25:00

habits, do you listen to a podcast and think to yourself?

Unknown: 00:25:03

Oh my god, I can't believe she was took a sip of water. Well,

Unknown: 00:25:05

if your mouth is dry, you need water, right? Like you don't.

Unknown: 00:25:08

You don't think that like you don't think negatively of that

Unknown: 00:25:11

of others. So stop putting on those negative thoughts around

Unknown: 00:25:14

yourself to be happy.

Unknown: 00:25:16

That will mean we are worst on ourselves. We would never say

Unknown: 00:25:20

those things to anybody else. They don't think anything of it.

Unknown: 00:25:23

No, you

Unknown: 00:25:24

just keep listening. Right? You just keep listening. I even that

Unknown: 00:25:27

one that I listened to that. I told you, it was kind of my

Unknown: 00:25:30

inspiration. A lot of times he's walking so he's out of breath.

Unknown: 00:25:32

The wind is blowing. I don't think anything of it because his

Unknown: 00:25:36

message is so powerful that the rest doesn't matter.

Unknown: 00:25:40

Yeah, that's all you thinking about what he's talking about?

Unknown: 00:25:43

Not what's going on around him.

Unknown: 00:25:45

Yeah, so that's my advice. Just start. That's great

Unknown: 00:25:49

advice. And thank you so much for coming on and giving us your

Unknown: 00:25:52

insights into what it's like starting and running a podcast.

Unknown: 00:25:56

Thank you. I

Unknown: 00:25:57

appreciate you having me here.

Unknown: 00:26:00

Thanks so much for listening. If you've enjoyed today's episode,

Unknown: 00:26:03

please like share and subscribe. Your support means so much to

Unknown: 00:26:06

me. If there's a question or topic you'd like covering then

Unknown: 00:26:09

I'd love to hear from you. Find the podcast on Instagram at rate

Unknown: 00:26:13

g Botfield. And drop me a DM till next time bye

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