Nine jurors blamed Kurt Zaner's client, a homeless man sleeping under a trailer, not the truck driver who ran him over. Still, when Kurt visited him afterwards, the man was as happy as if he'd won $10 million because someone had finally fought for him. That spirit drives Dragon Slayers, the listserv that Kurt, a Colorado trial lawyer and TLU instructor, built with inspiration from a fantasy author. Members share wins, raw losses, and referrals, guided by ideals like putting the journey before the destination and accepting that some clients cannot be saved. Tune in as Kurt tells host Dan Ambrose what AI still can't do on cross and how befriending defense counsel can mean less fight back.

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2026 & 2027 Programming

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Episode Snapshot

• After realizing his talks all drew on fantasy novels, Kurt started Dragon Slayers, a listserv whose trial lawyer members stand between their clients and "dragons" like insurers and corporations, sharing wins, raw losses, and referrals.
• Kurt answers Gerry Spence's warning that you can't be a great lawyer and a great father with "informed consent": consciously choosing what to sacrifice instead of defaulting to nonstop work.
• Despite two years on a knee cart, Kurt still exercises daily and explains why lawyers need to stay healthy for their clients, their families, and themselves.
• Kurt's firm uses Supio to write every pre-litigation demand, draft discovery, summarize depositions, and draft directs and crosses, but he credits human creativity for his most explosive cross material.
• Because a case might still end in a loss, Kurt makes a point of embracing every victory, from a $50,000 settlement to winning a deposition or a motion to compel.
• After passing on a workers' comp bad faith case that Sean Claggett successfully tried to a $145 million verdict in Colorado, Kurt learned to be happy that the client found the right lawyer at the right time.
• For the last five years, Kurt has sincerely tried to befriend defense trial lawyers, which he says makes trials more enjoyable and has even led to case referrals.

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