You’ve heard it before: Timing is everything. On this episode of The Retirement = Freedom Podcast we’re learning about the ins and outs of the Roth IRA and why it’s such a fantastic savings tool, so long as it's executed correctly. Host Josh Bretl gets into the finer points of tax-deferred versus tax-free distributions, what conditions must be met to make Roth contributions and the peace of mind that can come from leveraging the option. It’s one of the few vehicles that we can count on to maximize savings while minimizing future tax burden.

Like all things financial planning, the timing of when to contribute is highly individualized and has to be part of a broader strategic approach. With help from his fearless sidekick, Dave Schmidt, Josh teases out some of the specific benefits Roth IRAs confer, even after death, and also how they work as a potential investment opportunity in down markets like the one we’re in today.

Finally, you’ll learn why the Roth IRA offers a tremendous hedge against future taxes and why income earners who plan now can enjoy peace of mind (and generous post-tax distributions) later on in retirement. (And, no, Dave. It’s not the same thing as hoarding TGI Fridays rewards points that actually belonged to the friends who paid for your high school burgers and fries!)

Click here to learn more about or listen to previous episodes of The Retirement = Freedom Podcast. And don’t forget to join our new private Facebook group, which you can find here.

Ready to blast off with some high-octane (and delicious!) Cometeer Coffee? Click here to get $25 off your first order. It’s the greatest!

Click here to explore the services that FSR Wealth Strategies offers and schedule a discovery call with one of the team’s CPAs. When it comes to living your best life, it’s never too early to get started!

Inside of an IRA, all that money is

growing tax deferred, but when you take it out, you're

gonna pay taxes on it.

Inside of a Roth, the earnings aren't taxed every year.

And then when you go to take it out, it's not even

reported on your tax return.

So that one of the best things it does is it doesn't

get reported anywhere in your adjusted gross income,

so those distributions are always tax free.

You've heard it before.

Timing is everything.

On this episode of the Retirement equals

Freedom Podcast, we're digging into Roth IRAs.

Josh gets into the finer points of tax deferred versus tax free.

Listen in as Josh and I talk about specific benefits

of Roth IRAs, even post death, and how they work

as a potential investment opportunity in down markets

like the one we're in today.

There are conditions to making a Roth IRA contribution.

Do you meet those requirements?

And finally, listen in as I learn that Roth IRAs are not

the same thing as hoarding TGI Fridays rewards points.

Huh?

This is the Retirement equals Freedom Podcast.

Your host, Josh Bretl, is the owner and founder

of FSR Wealth Strategies.

For the last 18 years or so, he's been helping

people just like you thrive in their retirement.

And me?

I'm Dave.

Josh's longtime friend, co-host, and financial project.

I'm here to make sure Josh doesn't get too technical.

I'm also here to keep things lighthearted.

And now let me, let you, let me end this introduction,

so you can enjoy the show.

FSR Wealth Management is a registered investment advisor

located in Elmhurst, Illinois.

Information and opinions contained in this audio

have been arrived at by FSR Wealth advisors.

All information herein is for informational purposes

and should not be construed as investment advice.

It does not constitute an offer, a solicitation or recommendation

to purchase any security.

FSR is not providing legal, tax, accounting, or financial

planning advice in this audio.

These views are as of the date of this publication

and are subject to change.

Would you say we started off with technical difficulties this

morning, or would you say it has been pretty smooth sailing?

I think it's pretty smooth sailing for us.

I mean, we got excited, we bought a new toy.

We didn't really buy a new toy, we just exchanged an old

toy for a new toy, and we had to set it up a little bit,

so we took some setup time.

I was just saying, Brian's MVP when it

comes to technical stuff.

Oh God, yeah.

Without Brian-

There's be no podcast.

And if there's no podcast, you know how many people would be

missing out on our messages?

The number of people that wouldn't know

about Cometeer Coffee.

Oh my gosh.

Like three or four, three or four people tops.

So Josh, you just had a really nice client event on Tuesday

and it was a great turnout.

And I was telling my dad who's in town.

I said, when we were sitting around afterwards having pizza

and having some drinks, the joke was that everyone in your

office on Wednesday morning would be super unproductive

because everyone was kind of tired and burned out.

I said to my dad, "Should I be feeling the same way?

Because man, I'm struggling, like getting

moving this morning.

That event took a lot out of me and I just sat

in the chair all night."

I think it was the pizza and beer afterwards.

I mean the event ended, the last person left around nine

o'clock and took us a few minutes to clean up and we went

and had some pizza and beer.

And I mean, I left before you and I didn't get home until 11.

And I'm normally out cold by like 10.

So, I don't know where you are in that spectrum.

Old man bretl, out by 10.

No, it depends.

I got home at like 11 15, 11 20, and my dog is, Teddy,

he's like almost nine.

And when he gets excited-

He's nine?

Nine in September.

Oh, that fur ball.

When he gets excited, he coughs.

He has like coughing attacks.

Vet's like "Nothing to worry about, it's

just him getting old."

My dad is sound asleep on the couch in the basement.

I get pulled in the garage in the basement

and Teddy goes nuts.

Like has the biggest cough attack I've ever heard.

And he's running in circles by my dad, jumped up on

the couch, hit my dad in the face with his tail.

I was cracking up.

I'm like my old man just can't catch a break.

Poor old Mike.

But we told him, I said that's a compliment.

That means Teddy loves you if he wakes you up with this old

man hacking and tail wagging.

No, it was a fun client event.

I actually think we'll do a whole podcast on this.

We talked about it earlier.

The client event was on The Psychology of Money

book by Morgan Housel, and I've recommended that book

to clients, clients' kids.

It is really good for anyone in their saving and money journey,

I think that would make a great podcast in the future.

We've talked about doing this as an episode and I

do like a lot of the comments from your clients that were

there said they wish they had this book 20, 30 years ago.

Yeah.

I see that.

I see why they say that.

I focus on a few of the chapters on Tuesday night to go through,

but there's some chapters that are unbelievable for savings.

I mean, the mindset that goes into that's pretty cool.

And here at the Retirement = Freedom

podcast, we are all about the mindset change that it

takes to thrive in retirement.

That was fun to talk about there too.

I think it really hit home to a lot of people.

I mean, there are people that have been clients for years

and years and years, and even they, I think, saw it in a

different light on Tuesday.

And you made no less than two people cry, which

means mission accomplished.

In a cry in a happy way.

Like, "Gosh, thank goodness we have people

like Josh helping us."

It was.

It was endearing.

And I asked some other people in my office like right afterwards.

I mean, I guess I had great replies and great feedback,

but normally when I give a workshop, I'm talking

about technical content.

Like today, we haven't even mentioned what we're talking

about yet today, but I have a topic that's usually it's taxes

or investments or something.

And I try and simplify it and apply it to their situation.

But a book called The Psychology Of Money is very, for lack

of a better term, fluffy.

I came in the back and I was talking to my father and Erin

and I said, " Was there any content or did I just talk

about fluff for an hour?"

And actually my dad said, "Well, this was a point where

the fluff was the content and people just adored it."

So I was worried we have some technical, we have some

engineer clients, we've got some people that are pretty high-

Some doctors in there, I know.

Yeah.

And even they thought that content was great.

So, I'm excited.

It will definitely be a podcast.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I love how it was a much more personal presentation.

You talked about more personal things than you did before.

I thought it was great.

Yeah.

What's not great is this is not Cometeer coffee again.

This is Starbucks, Josh.

We need to get our Cometeer coffee going.

And I did notice the episodes that we drink Cometeer

our subscribers are triple that of episodes we don't

drink Cometeer coffee.

Hashtag not a fact, made up stat, but still, nonetheless,

Our compliance is going to check that.

There's going to be a disclosure here in the

middle of the podcast.

I can make a spreadsheet.

All right.

So I was listening to episode 10 on the way here

and you made a joke like, "Hey, we're five minutes in.

We haven't started even talking about the topic."

Right now we are six minutes in.

No mention the topic.

So Josh, I think it's now time to talk about Roth iRAs.

Do you have a fun like cheering button or anything?

Oh, I do.

Yeah.

Roth IRAs.

I mean, I stay up at night thinking about how

lucky I am to have a Roth IRA.

No, it's not true.

I heard it described as the most misunderstood

financial instrument.

And Roth IRA is something that we refer to as the single

greatest benefit granted to most retirees by the tax code.

And for what it does for people.

So I thought I'd start with what is a Roth IRA?

Just the bare bone basics on this.

And a Roth IRA the first year we had it even

available to us was 1997.

I mean, you and I were in the throes of our magical high

school basketball careers.

But the first year was available was 1997.

And it got its name Roth from the Senator who passed the bill.

I mean like any good financial instrument it's

named after a politician.

But we've had IRAs.

IRA stands for individual retirement account

for a long time.

And a Roth is very, very similar.

The only difference is the taxation.

And once again, like my son Alex says, hashtag tax nerd.

the difference in an IRA to a Roth IRA is how it's taxed.

So when money goes into a Roth IRA, you've already

paid tax on that money.

You pay tax when you make the contribution.

Yes.

Sort of.

Sort of.

I'll get to that.

The theory is the money that goes in has already been taxed.

Okay.

And the way that money grows is it grows tax free.

And when you take it out, that money comes out tax free.

Okay.

Now, when we talk about the Roth IRA for people, that tax-free

growth is very advantageous if you think tax rates are going

up and if you don't want to be in a higher tax bracket.

So when we've talked about having control over your

investments and control, not having the government in as

much control, this Roth IRA is a great option there.

So we always told there's three ways to put money into a Roth.

Okay.

Most people are only familiar with one.

All right.

The first is something called a contribution.

Like I mentioned earlier.

Like you mentioned earlier.

And contributions are limited.

Okay.

There's very specific rules.

One rule is that you have to be working.

You have to have something called earned income.

So a paycheck, or if you own your own business,

you can put money in.

And two is, your income cannot be too high.

So, for a married couple, it's about 200,00, for a single

person it's about 100,00.

If your income crosses that threshold, you

can't put money in.

Interesting.

Okay.

The second way is a conversion, and a

conversion is taking money from your traditional IRA

and moving it to a Roth.

Okay.

On a conversion, I always tell people, it's kind of

like you have the ability to not fix a mistake, but it's

kind of one of those ideas that, all right, we did this,

we thought this was good.

And now we're going to go and do this because it's better.

That conversion is taxable.

It is taxable.

It is taxable.

Okay.

So when I say money is taxed, that money that's going over

there is you have to pay that tax as it goes over.

Can I ask a question about

the second option here?

Do I have a choice?

No.

Okay.

Go ahead then.

I just don't want to be rude.

Becks raised me right.

"David, always ask for permission to

interrupt somebody."

I don't know if she said that, but.

So contributions, there is an income

requirement or limitation.

For conversions, you still have that same income limitation?

No, but you do have a tax limitation.

Okay.

So when you do a conversion, it just gets added

to your other income.

So if you're normally in the 22% tax bracket and all of

a sudden you do such a big conversion, it goes into the

32% tax bracket, you've just increased your taxation.

Okay.

So you are making a choice as to what the tax is going

to be at that point in time.

Cool.

All right.

So the last way is a tricky way.

We're not going to talk too much about it.

It's called a backdoor Roth.

And this came in the news a few years ago.

It's gotten some press.

But backdoor Roth is pretty much taking money into a Roth,

I'm sorry, into a regular IRA, not taking the deduction, and

then moving that money over.

It's a little more complicated.

It's not something for most retirees to even worry about,

but that's the third way.

Maybe your kids need to worry about it, but most

retirees, it doesn't matter.

For most retirees, we are looking at the first two.

'Cause the third one, I think backdoor,

I think of how quick and agile, almost like a mongoose,

you were in basketball.

And so we would always be looking for you to do a backdoor

cut to get an easy hoop.

My boys are starting to learn to play basketball

and a hoop in our driveway.

And it makes me smile inside to see them pull

the basketball out.

Oh man.

And so I go out there and I play with him.

And Alex, he can't start from the bottom and work his way up.

He has to be a star in his own mind.

And he goes, "Dad, can you pass it to me behind your back?"

And there's no chance.

Couldn't do that when I was

hundred pounds lighter.

Oh, so sorry to interject.

But when you get money into a Roth, the best part

is that money grows tax free.

So once you get it in there and I would say, I have to

compare it to the other options.

So if you're not in an IRA at all, all that growth is taxed.

Those dividends, those capital gains, the interest, it's all

taxed as it goes in there.

Okay.

Inside of an IRA, all that money is growing tax deferred.

But when you take it out, you're going to pay taxes on it.

Correct.

Inside of a Roth, the earnings

aren't taxed every year.

And then when you go to take it out, it's not even

reported on your tax return.

Wow.

So one of the best things it does is it doesn't

get reported anywhere in your adjusted gross income.

So those distributions are always tax free.

That's amazing.

And the distribution tax free is the key.

I've made the example before of, it's great if you can

take off in that airplane and that's what savings looks like.

But in order to actually make the airplane beneficial to

you have to land somewhere, and that's taking money out.

Landing is that taking money out.

So, those distributions being tax free is the

true key to all of this.

Is it similar to our previous episode,

we talked about IRAs and 401k distributions.

And there is a certain point, I think when you said

you reach age 62, you're required to take money out.

I know the age, I'm probably wrong with that, but-

72, but yeah.

No, there are no required distributions on this.

And if you pass away with this money, your kids

under current law have 10 years to take it out.

Oh, tax free.

Tax free.

So they can let it grow tax free.

And over those 10 years, take that money out.

So it's beneficial to pretty much everybody

along that chain there.

This is fascinating.

Can I ask you another question about Roth IRA?

Please Dave.

And I know the way I sometimes structure

my questions, I swear these are not scripted.

They're not scripted.

No.

I mean, literally I handed him a sheet of, this is

what we're going to talk about, five minutes ago

before we started talking.

And so when Josh calls me financially

illiterate, he's legitimately, I mean, that's what I am.

But okay.

So there's an income cap for contributions, but

let's say that money's sitting in there tax free.

What if during like that time you go over 200,000

as a household, can you stop earning money in it?

No.

So, once it's there, it's there.

And this actually, Dave, it was a good leading question here.

So Congress changes rules, they change the laws all the time.

And people like to ask me like, "Should we be

worried that Congress can take away these benefits?"

And I always tell people yes and no.

All right.

Yes, we should be worried.

I think they're going to change the rules.

I think they will limit conversions.

I think they will say, "Hey, once you get so

much in here, you can't put any more money in."

They may stop contributions all along.

They've done that in the past for other assets.

But no, once that money goes in there, I'm not worried

at all about it being taxed.

Dave Schmidt:

That's really cool.

So no, that generally that is never an

issue that Congress does there.

So, yes and no.

So right now there's no limits.

Once it's there, it's there.

And I had it described to me as right now assets are kind

of depressed, the market's down as we record this.

And it's kind of like having this spring and as this

spring is compressed, it's going into this Roth IRA.

And as the spring expands and the market comes back up, all

that growth goes tax free there.

So it's a pretty cool concept.

That is really cool.

And we talked in a prior episode about

the importance of taxes.

You can invest in exactly the same things in an IRA

that you can at Roth IRA.

It doesn't matter.

Really?

And so the only difference is taxes.

And when we have taxes being such an integral part into

anyone being able to spend their money, it's a big deal.

I was listening to a prior episode.

We were talking about the difference between somebody who

has a million dollars in an IRA and someone who has $800,000

in a Roth, most people would think, Hey, that person with a

million dollars has more money than that person with $800,000.

But that person with $800,000, that money is all theirs.

The person with that million, if they have to pay a 25%

tax, they only have 750,000.

So, it's not all it's cracked up to be.

And-

yeah, no, I remember that.

I think that was one of our recent episodes.

Now can, and do people have both traditional and Roth?

Yes.

And it's sometimes recommended.

It's really kind of funny.

I tell people here we live in the state of Illinois.

So Illinois has some unique tax laws.

And when you put money into an IRA or a 401k in

Illinois, that money goes in without being taxed.

But Illinois does not tax retirement distributions.

And so as the money goes from the IRA to the

Roth in a conversion, you also don't pay tax.

So for an Illinois resident, you have two options.

If you want that money into a Roth, you can go

directly to the Roth.

And if you do that, you'll pay federal and state taxes.

But if you go into the IRA first and then into

the Roth, you're going to save the 5% illinois tax.

How about that?

And Illinois doesn't charge taxes for pensions, right?

Correct.

Any retirement income.

So IRA distributions, 401ks, pensions, social security is

not taxed in Illinois currently.

And is that pretty rare for the

other like 49 states?

Or are we one of the few that don't-

We're one of the few that has an income

tax, that doesn't tax it.

So, there's other really beneficial tax states, and

that's part of the planning process as part of, we have

clients who live here in Illinois and they're going

to move to the Carolinas.

Well the Carolinas tax your retirement income.

We've got clients that live in Wisconsin and they're going

to buy a place in Florida.

Well, Florida has no state income tax.

So those part of the things we have to talk about.

This would be an interesting topic

for a future episode, where you should retire.

I think we should talk about that, Josh.

Oh, some foreshadowing, David?

Foreshadowing.

Yes.

You remember, see, I taught you a few things for my artsy days.

I used to watch movies and be like, "Josh,

they're foreshadowing what's going to happen."

One of my worst subjects in high school was

English because they wanted to look at, for reading a book and

they say, "Oh, look, that is symbolism of this and that."

And I can't pick up on that to save my life.

I am such a literal person.

It's like, no, it means nothing.

I don't see any of that.

You know what I do see though?

I do see you hitting that button over there, Josh.

Dave Relates To Retirees.

This is my favorite part, by the way.

Hold on.

Before you get into this, my parents now sing the jingle,

Dave Relates To Retirees.

You got to be kidding me.

I walked in to my father the other

day in his office going Dave Relates To Retirees.

That's amazing.

Take it away, Dave.

But the thing is, I toy you with the idea

of having that professionally recorded with like an

actual lyricist and singer.

And now I'm thinking maybe not.

I think it will lose some of its charm if I do that.

It's charming.

I appreciate it.

All right folks, Dave Relates To Retirees.

This is how I relate to Roth IRAs.

I know I do not have a Roth IRA for the record,

hashtag not shocking.

We're going to get you one this year.

Okay.

So before or after I file my taxes.

All right.

So we talk a lot about our 90s and our glory days.

And there was a handful of spots that we would visit

as kids, California Pizza Kitchen, Bruegger's, Arby's,

your Chrysler LeBaron.

But one spot we've not talked about yet is TGI Fridays.

And TGI Fridays, I don't know if it was Downers Grove or Lombard,

but it doesn't really matter.

There's two really awesome memories that I have.

One, it was like a melting pot of our different

groups of friends.

All right.

Some of my buddies started dating some of like your

friends that were girls, and also you and I were kind of

courting each other like-

oh yeah.

Yeah.

I was like, "This Josh guy, he might be a long term friend.

I got to see if he'll buy me a few appetizers first."

And you're like, "Dave is like the best basketball

player I've ever seen.

I kind of want to be friends with him."

So there is that.

No?

What do you think?

Am I wrong or right?

It was really when I came to your house and your

dad offered me a Puddin' cake.

Correct.

That was another very common place we'd visit the freezer

in my basement, grab a Puddin' cake, come back upstairs.

But the also second great memory at TGI Fridays

was the rewards program.

All right.

And of the, let's say on average, we'd have

10 to 15 people go to TGI Fridays with us.

And I was the only one that had a rewards card.

I was also the one that would never pay.

So, what would happen is, and you're learning this

for the first time because you're looking at me like with

these inquisitive eyes, like where's he going with this?

Here's where I'm going with this.

Like a Roth IRA, I would sneak my rewards card in

every time you guys would pay the bill and I would rack up

all these TGI Friday points without you guys ever knowing.

And then I would take Carla on dates and I would redeem, I wish

I was kidding, I would redeem those points for free meals.

I was getting those free meals, quote unquote tax free, because

I had all the rewards points that y'all paid for and didn't

know that I was accumulating.

And I remember one time Carla was like, "Why do you keep

getting these free points?"

I'd be like, "Carla, I know people.

Like you're dating the right guy.

I know everybody at TGI Fridays, so I got the hook up."

And now Josh, I would like you to relate that

to retirees and Roth IRAs.

Dave Relates To Retirees.

Yeah.

I didn't talk over that yeah.

I appreciate that.

I do appreciate that.

I know it makes you angry.

It does.

When we started this and you were telling

me, you never tell me what the story is beforehand.

And you're like, "Oh, you're going to be able

to take, and you'll relate to this one, no problem."

I'm going to have to change how you think a little bit, but-

Well, first, can I ask you, am I thinking

of Roth IRA as a correct way?

I mean, I was able to redeem all these points that I got

from you guys and I didn't have to like pay for the food when

I was redeeming the points.

Is it similar?

Well, no, it's not because taxes have to be paid.

Unlike you paying for your meal, taxes have to be paid.

I would pay, I mean, I wouldn't get my

entire meal free with Carla.

I would have to pay for something with some

taxes, some food tax.

The benefit of the Roth, the benefit of the Roth to

a retiree is the fact that the income grows tax free and that

the distributions are tax free.

Okay.

So the benefit that you were receiving was free points.

Yes.

Now, for the retiree, they have to pay taxes

to put money into the Roth.

Unlike you, who didn't pay anything to get the points.

So what you're saying is retirees

should be jealous of me.

Yeah.

And no longer is there a TGI Friday's there and you

might be the reason, but-

Okay.

Let me just pause you.

I've closed down banks.

I've closed down TGI Fridays.

I've closed down Bruegger's Bagels.

Our clients are going to be nervous.

You're spending a lot of time here.

Oh my goodness.

But, the way you were right is you took

advantage of something.

And the number of people that come and sit down in

our office and say, "I never knew anything about this.

No one's told me about why I should do this.

No one's talked about what a Roth could do, what

the tax benefits can do."

And therefore the majority of people aren't taking advantage

of them and the vast majority aren't taking advantage to

the level that they should.

Okay.

So you took advantage of a rewards program.

I mean, it might be slightly underhanded and our friends

may make fun of you the next time we all talk, by the way

you owe us like a lot of food.

You keep mentioning this in

podcasts after podcast, and I'm getting nervous.

I'm like, shoot, they're finally onto me, but I'm like, eh-

"I'll just stop showing up to things!"

But for retirees, like having that benefit is huge.

And what it means for that retiree is that they don't have

to worry about one extra thing.

And any money that's come out of that Roth, we don't have to

worry about how it impacts this taxation on social security.

We don't have to care about, oh, it's going to

raise my Medicare cost.

We don't have to care about, Hey, Congress is going to

pass this new law and they're going to raise taxes 10%.

That doesn't matter.

So it's this sense of feeling really good.

And everyone wants to have a safe and secure retirement.

And everyone worries about the stock market.

But taxes is another thing to be worried about.

And the Roth is one of the very few ways that we have

available to us to take that tax worry off the table.

Now, you don't want to have to cut off your

arm to save your finger.

I don't know if that's the right analogy there.

But, doing it in an intelligent way is I guess kind of like

you and your rewards points, where you want to make sure

that we're really optimizing for your individual situation.

Well, maybe we can tie that in here a little bit.

In your individual situation, Dave, you had friends who

just loved being around you so much, they didn't care.

And actually, it wasn't sneaky.

We all knew you were putting your rewards card

in there, I'm pretty sure.

Probably.

That we were going to benefit you

and let you do that.

Does it make more sense now, I'd always

be encouraging y'all to order like, "Order more

appetizers guys, just do it."

'Cause I would get the points.

No, because you wanted the appetizer.

Well, yeah, that's a good point.

But, that Roth growth, that individuality

is important because for some people it doesn't make

any sense, but the vast majority of people it does.

And how you do it is very specific.

There are other people out there who don't have friends as

nice as you have, who would've never allowed you to do that.

So it's an individual situation.

For people in retirement, having a Roth, the timing's important.

And so if you're at the end of your career and you've

got a really large incomes right now, you may not

want to do it right now.

You may want to wait a few years.

Or maybe now's the absolute best time.

So, there's all sorts of things that we need to look

at as that comes into play.

Sure.

Like everything else, it's totally personalized

to the individual.

Boy, Roth IRAs, who would've thought they'd

be as much fun as TGI Fridays.

You know, Josh, you give me a challenge, and

I am pretty much 10 for 11 on meeting you at that challenge.

10 for 11?

10 for 11.

Which one do you think you failed at?

Well, there was one episode where I

didn't really have a Dave Relates To Retirees, and I

think it was episode one.

We just weren't that cool yet.

Oh man.

We better rerecord that.

I know.

We're getting close to lunch.

You want to get TGI Fridays?

Is there one by us here?

I have my reward card.

I owe you lunch anyways today.

So yes.

Sure, let's go.

Roth IRAs, sorry.

Who would've thought that they would just be so, oh, riveting.

I mean you just take the most boring topics and

make them awesome, Josh.

So thank you for including me in this conversation.

I'm thinking back and thinking was this

fun and maybe inflation was more fun than Roth IRAs,

but it was pretty good.

I enjoyed myself thoroughly so I think we

should put a wrap, unless you have anything else to say?

The one thing I was going to encourage people to do

at the end of this episode was, we have created a Retirement

= Freedom Facebook group.

And we're going to post a lot of show notes in there.

We have a lot of interaction between Dave and myself.

And we want to see what your retirement freedom looks like.

So I encourage everyone to find the Retirement

= Freedom Facebook group.

We are the only one out there.

And we look forward to seeing you there.

What do you think Josh?

Should we maybe eventually start posting like some

bloopers and B rolls?

Maybe videos of you and I eating.

I think people love that.

Oh, maybe even old high school basketball pictures.

Yes.

Oh man.

God help us.

Retirement = Freedom Facebook group.

We will post a link.

I think it's important to know Josh that we do have to, what's

the word I'm looking for?

We're going to try and to avoid the spam bots

out there that listen to us.

So it will be a private group.

You just request to join.

And Dave and I look forward to seeing you inside there.

Yeah.