Transcripts
Welcome to Animal Posse, the podcast dedicated to the
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:people and rescues making a
difference in the lives of animals.
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:Today's guest is Christy Keith.
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:With over 30 years of experience, Christie
helps animal welfare organizations sharpen
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:their message and reach more donors.
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:She's worked with industry leaders, and
she's here to help us navigate some of the
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:toughest conversations in rescue today.
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:Christy, welcome to the show.
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:Christie: Hi, Dixie.
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:Dixie: You are quite a powerhouse
in the animal welfare industry.
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:I've been looking at your bio and you have
worked with some incredible organizations
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:from Maddie's Fund to University of
Florida Shelter Medicine program.
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:You do a lot.
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:Christie: I do.
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:I've been really lucky to work
with some great organizations
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:and people in my career.
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:Very lucky.
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:Dixie: I am looking forward to our
conversation today because I wanted to
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:talk about a topic you suggested, which
was handling the growing controversies
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:surrounding early spay neuter
through the lens of harm reduction.
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:And I would also like to get
into some social media tragedies
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:that you use to ensure that those
saved lives actually find homes.
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:Christie: I would love that.
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:That sounds great.
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:Dixie: When we hear about the growing
debate about the long-term health impacts
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:of early spay neuter, how do we frame
the harm reduction model for a public
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:that only sees things in black and white?
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:Christie: I think that it's really
important to think about who you're
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:talking to, and I've noticed that
there's a lot of argument going on
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:within the animal welfare world.
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:About this because you have a lot of
volunteers, fosters and rescuers who
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:have a different perspective because they
have one foot in the pet owner world and
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:one foot in the animal welfare world.
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:And then you have shelters and shelter
medicine experts who come from a
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:more institutional perspective and.
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:Both of them have a set of data that it
seems to be somewhat contradictory, and
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:I've seen a lot of very hostile arguments.
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:This has been about spay neuter and
early spay neuter, and I've also
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:seen it over early vaccination.
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:There was a really interesting study
that just came out of uc Davis last
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:year talking about vaccinating,
literally newborn kittens and puppies.
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:Which horrified a lot of people who just
felt that this was dangerous and risky.
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:But when you're looking at the
animals who come into shelters.
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:A lot of the pregnant animals
who come into shelters don't
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:have immunity to these diseases.
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:When they do titer tests on them, they
find that a huge percentage of them,
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:I don't remember the exact numbers,
but , I believe it was around one
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:third, didn't have immunity to common
diseases like distemper parvo and.
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:When you're making decisions about how to
best protect these incredibly vulnerable
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:kittens and puppies, it's a different
decision making process than when you're
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:looking at owned pets in a home or
eight week old, or 12 week old puppies.
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:And.
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:It's same with spay neuter, that the
math is different when you're talking
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:about a shelter population than when
you're talking about, my own pet at home.
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:I don't wanna get them spayed
or neutered at a few weeks old.
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:At two pounds.
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:I'll wait.
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:But in a shelter environment, you're crazy
to wait because your math is different.
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:And I feel like.
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:I've seen way too many hostile
fights between people and animal
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:welfare who don't seem to be able to
look from the other person's point
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:of view and understand that we all
want what's best for the animals,
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:but we all have different realities
that we're making our decisions in.
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:So I guess I just wanted an opportunity
to talk about that a little bit and say.
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:We can't have the same set of medical
guidelines for shelter animals that
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:we do for owned pets and homes because
the circumstances aren't the same.
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:Puppies and kittens and shelters are
incredibly vulnerable to disease and
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:are incredibly prone to going out of
the shelter without being spayed and
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:neutered If we're not doing early spay
neuter on puppies and kittens and.
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:Possibly becoming another
statistic in overpopulation.
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:So we need to try and have a more holistic
view of this issue and understand that
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:sometimes the decisions that we make for
shelter animals in their own best interest
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:are different than the ones we would
make for our own pets in our own homes.
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:Dixie: When you say shelter environment,
are you talking strictly about,
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:say, like a municipal shelter or
are you talking about, say rescues
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:that house a lot of animals as well?
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:Christie: I think it
depends on the environment.
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:So when I say shelters, I'm talking
about a sort of institutional setting
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:where you have crowding and stress.
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:It doesn't have to be municipal,
it can be a private shelter,
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:can even be foster homes.
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:I think that you and I probably
both know that some rescue groups
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:overstock their foster homes
because they're desperate, right?
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:If they have more animals than
they have homes for, than they have
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:foster homes for, they're trying
to save as many lives as they can.
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:And they may be doing things like
bringing in young kittens when there's
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:already kittens in the environment.
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:They may be having pregnant cats and dogs
who are giving birth in foster homes when
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:there's other animals still coming in.
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:It really just depends on the
environment, but I am primarily
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:talking about brick and mortar shelters
rather than rescue and foster homes.
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:Dixie: Yeah, I would definitely
like to dive more into that.
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:Now, I know from my personal
perspective, the vets that we
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:have in my area are very good.
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:They will do a kitten as
long as it's two pounds.
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:Yes.
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:And I know different vets
have different rules.
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:If a vet feels comfortable
doing it at two pounds, great.
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:Other vets have other rules, where they
might want 'em three pounds or even
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:more than three pounds, and I understand
that, but a lot of the vets that I
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:work with will do 'em at two pounds.
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:Personally, I find I like to get
'em done at two pounds because I
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:find that they really don't know
anything has been done to 'em.
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:But if you wait till they're a little
bit older, they have a little bit more
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:difficulty with the recovery from it.
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:You could tell that it's bothering 'em.
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:It doesn't heal up as fast.
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:But I would definitely like to dive
more into the studies that you've
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:gone over and the advantages and maybe
disadvantages of doing them so young.
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:Christie: In the vaccine study that
I was just looking at from last
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:year, from uc, Davis, it was really
interesting to me because they used
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:language, something along the lines of.
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:The risks are largely theoretical
and the dangers are imminent.
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:That might not be a direct quote, but
that was essentially what they said
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:when they're talking again about shelter
animals, that the risk of being adopted
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:out without being altered first or
the risk of this was a vaccine study.
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:So they were talking about the risk of
not vaccinating young enough because
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:you can't count on the mother's immunity
to protect the puppies or kittens.
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:Outweighs the potential risk of, in
the case of vaccines, they say if you
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:vaccinate them too often or too young, it
might damage their kidneys in adulthood.
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:And they say that when you do
early spay neuter, it is associated
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:with the increased risk of certain
health problems, which when you
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:increase the risk of something.
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:It doesn't mean that they
will definitely get it.
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:It doesn't even mean that
it becomes a huge risk.
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:It means that the risk
itself is increased.
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:I've seen a lot of people say, oh,
there was a 50% increase in something.
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:That's a meaningless statistic unless you
know what the baseline risk was, because
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:it may have increased by a hundred percent
and still not be that much because the
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:risk itself was incredibly low already.
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:So you have to really understand.
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:What are you talking about
when you say the risk of.
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:Bone cancer or kidney disease
is increased because of early
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:vaccination or early spay neuter.
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:Now again.
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:I believe in both sets of data.
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:I think that there are
drawbacks to early spay neuter,
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:especially for giant breed dogs.
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:I don't think that's made up.
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:But I think that you have to weigh
the benefits versus the risks, and
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:those things change depending on the
background that you're talking about.
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:Again, puppies and kittens being
adopted out of a shelter, it's much
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:safer for them to be sterilized
and vaccinated than to wait.
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:It's just a fact and maybe that any harm
that might come to them down the road,
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:which again is not something that will
definitely happen, it might be worth
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:the risk because you saved their life.
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:If they're not gonna survive,
what difference does it make?
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:What their risk is later
in a life they don't have.
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:Dixie: When you're saying risk too,
you're just talking about the risk of
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:it increasing, not necessarily the Yes.
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:Potential.
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:Yes.
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:Okay.
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:Okay.
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:That's what I just wanted to make
sure I was understanding that.
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:You said that there's this new
study about vaccinating newborns.
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:Yes.
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:Yes.
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:Okay.
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:I do wanna ask you about that
since you've read the study, I do.
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:The bottle kittens.
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:So I'm dealing with the tiniest, little
babies that you could possibly deal with.
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:I've done newborns.
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:I do 'em a couple of weeks old.
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:So when we're dealing with the babies
that size, if they get sick, the amount
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:of meds that the vet may tell us to give
those babies is like such a minute amount.
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:It is literally like a drop.
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:So I know when you do the
vaccines come as one mil.
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:So would you give that whole amount to the
baby or do you like have to dose it down?
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:Christie: I'm not a veterinarian,
but my understanding is that a
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:vaccine is different from a drug.
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:A vaccine is a biologic and it
represents an immunizing dose.
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:So when you put a puppy or kitten
in the environment, the dose of
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:exposure to a virus or a bacteria
that they encounter is gonna be the
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:same, whether they're the size of it.
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:Peanut or a great Dane, right?
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:So you need to protect them
with an immunizing dose.
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:You need the dose that will cause their
immune system to react appropriately.
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:So it's not really the same as
a drug which has got a direct
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:physiologic impact on body systems.
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:Now, again, I'm not a veterinarian
and I may be understanding that
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:incorrectly, but that's how it's
always been presented to me.
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:Dixie: Okay.
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:I understand.
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:I was just wondering if the studies
made any kind of mention of that,
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:the ones that you have read, this
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:Christie: particular study does not.
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:This study is called you can
find it, neonatal Vaccination
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:recommendations on the uc, Davis Caret
Shelter Medicine program website.
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:And if you just Google caret
and neonatal vaccination
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:recommendations, it'll pop right up.
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:Dixie: Now let's talk about the advantages
since you've covered the disadvantages.
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:Let's go over some of the advantages
of the very early spay neuter and then
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:as well as the early vaccinations.
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:And getting back to the spay
neuter since I did mention that
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:they do 'em around two pounds.
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:Is there any talk about
doing 'em even like smaller?
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:Christie: I think that right
now everybody's pretty much
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:hovering at two pounds.
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:I think that smaller than that,
they can become hard to sterilize.
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:It's harder to do the surgery and they
want them to be at about two pounds,
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:but I think that there was a time when
they wanted them to be three pounds.
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:They found that two pounds
was actually easier.
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:The surgeons were finding it
easier, and as you noted, they
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:recovered faster and more easily.
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:And I think that some of this is just
going to be a matter of learning as you
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:go, and, but I know right now, as far
as I'm aware, the two pound limit is
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:pretty much universal at this point.
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:The number one advantage in my mind is.
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:They're sterilized.
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:They can't reproduce.
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:And people want to adopt kittens,
when they're cute and little.
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:They don't wanna wait.
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:They don't wanna sit there and
wait until they're 12 weeks old.
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:They want them at eight weeks.
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:They want them young.
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:And some rescues won't adopt them out
that young, but shelters certainly
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:do because they're better off in
a home than they are in a shelter.
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:I don't think people really understand
how young a cat can get pregnant.
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:I have found a lot of people think they
can't get pregnant until they're six
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:months old and, they can practically
be grandmothers at six months old.
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:I don't mean that literally,
of course, but you really.
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:Have to try and wrap your brain
around how much risk a cat is at of
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:teen pregnancy to understand why it's
so important to spay them young and
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:spay them before they're adopted.
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:And so pet overpopulation preventing
unwanted litters is, without
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:question the single biggest benefit
of early spay neuter, however.
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:Surgeons comment that the surgery
is easier and many people involved
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:with helping them recover say
recovery is also easier on the,
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:these very young kittens and puppies.
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:And for this reason, and I'm talking a
lot about kittens because they're smaller.
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:Of course there are toy dogs, but most
dogs that are in shelters are bigger dogs.
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:And so of course they're larger When
they're the same age as the kitten,
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:they're much bigger than the kitten, so
people don't react to it as negatively.
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:But in fact, many of the risks are greater
with dogs, especially the larger dogs.
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:Of, orthopedic problems
associated with early spay neuter.
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:So there is a lot of argument going on
about whether or not the risks outweigh
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:the benefits, but you only have to
understand that medium to large size
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:dogs represent most of the dogs in
shelters, and these dogs are young.
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:Intact and huge percentage of them do
not have immunity to common diseases.
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:So this is a very at risk population
that could have been prevented.
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:A lot of their challenges could
have been prevented with early spay
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:neuter, either because they wouldn't
have been born in the first place or
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:because that individual dog would have.
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:Fewer behavior issues.
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:A lot of times, I don't wanna say
that intact status directly causes
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:behavior problems because that
really hasn't been my experience
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:with at least dogs that I've known.
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:But what I will say is that
there's an association.
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:Dogs entering shelters with dogs not
being intact with dogs who are intact.
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:So intact dogs are more likely
to come into shelters, and intact
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:dogs are more likely not to
be immune to common diseases.
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:So it's a perfect storm of
vulnerability and problems.
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:So early spay neuter, again,
steps in and prevents a lot of
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:these problems from happening.
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:Dixie: And I think even a lot of times,
especially like you said with the
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:cats and the kittens getting pregnant
at four months, even people with the
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:best intentions, I don't think they
always understand, they may be 100%
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:pro spay neuter, but when they get a
kitten and it's three months old and
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:they say, okay, we're gonna keep it
inside we're not gonna let it outside.
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:We want an indoor only cat.
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:I don't think that they realize a lot of
the times when they come into maturity
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:that they're trying to get outside and
they will find a way to sneak outside.
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:And when they are tiny, they're easier to
sneak outside than when it is a big cat.
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:Even though the big cats can
do it too, and so That's right.
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:I find that's definitely an issue.
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:I've seen that happen many a times when
people are like we had the spay neuter
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:appointment set up and she got outside.
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:Christie: Yeah, you hear that
a lot when you have these very
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:young cats having kittens.
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:You have people who say, not only
did they not know they could get
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:pregnant that young, but I can't
tell you how many, litters of kittens
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:I've seen where the people swore that
they were indoor only cats who were
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:too young to get pregnant and they
couldn't believe that it had happened.
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:Dixie: When you're working with
all of these groups , do you
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:Help to educate them about these
new findings, or are they the
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:ones approaching you with it?
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:Christie: They're the ones who educate me.
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:I've been so lucky to work with so
many great shelter medicine vets.
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:I was the communications manager for
the Million Cat Challenge, which was a
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:joint project of the uc Davis Shelter
Medicine program in the University
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:of Florida Shelter medicine program.
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:It's was a Maddie's fund project,
and so much of what I learned about
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:cat spay neuter, and just cat.
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:Population management in general was from
the seven years that I worked on that
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:project, it was an incredible opportunity
to learn from people who are truly in the
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:trenches and really know what's going on.
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:And just Dr.
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:Kate Hurley and Dr.
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:Julie Levy are two of my
heroes, and working with them
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:was the honor of a lifetime.
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:Dixie: I would like to switch gears
a little bit and talk a little
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:bit now about the social media.
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:Yes.
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:Okay.
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:'cause it's one thing.
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:So first you, of course you wanna
use social media to get homes.
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:Yes.
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:You also wanna use social media to
spread awareness of spay neuter.
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:Christie: Yes.
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:Dixie: But I find that,
like for me personally.
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:It's like all of my social media friends
and all the people that follow my social
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:media page are pretty much all people that
are already all on board with this, and
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:they are at their capacity of animals.
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:So how can you leverage social media to
get that message across to new people?
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:To find more homes for animals, to
spread more awareness of spay neuter.
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:Christie: That's such a
great question, Dixie.
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:I love that you asked it.
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:I think there's two answers to it.
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:One of them has to do with what
you're saying and the other has to do
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:with the channels that you're using.
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:Not you personally, but just
all of us in animal welfare.
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:I think that sometimes we are just
preaching to the choir, both in terms of.
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:What we're saying and in terms
of who we're talking to, and by
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:being able to spread out and try
and get our message in front of.
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:An audience who's not sick and
tired of hearing about it is tricky.
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:And I've noticed a lot of benefit to
posting to local groups like Nextdoor and
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:groups that are set up to like community
groups, like for a particular town.
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:We have a lot of them in the
area where I live on Facebook,
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:for example, where you'll have.
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:Facebook group for this town or
that town and that there's a lot
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:of people who like to spread animal
welfare messages, but those audiences
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:respond to different things than
animal welfare audiences respond to.
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:And this is something that
I've been talking about now for
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:probably 15 years, is that we talk.
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:In ways that appeal to us and activate
us and motivate us, but we have to
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:start talking in ways that motivate
not us, that motivate regular people.
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:One of my colleagues is Sharon Fletcher at
Maddie's Fund, and she used to always say.
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:She would talk to her neighbors and she
would run messaging by her neighbors.
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:And we started calling it the
Sharon's Neighbors Test, and
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:I still use it to this day.
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:And I say, okay, what would
Sharon's neighbors say about this?
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:Or how would they hear this information?
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:And I was on a really
interesting call the other day.
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:I'm the Michigan State
representative for the.
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:United Spay Alliance and I went to a
United Spay Alliance meeting and we were
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:talking about messaging around spay neuter
and someone made the comment that spay
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:neuter isn't sexy and it's really hard to
message spay neuter to the general public.
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:And I was thinking about it a lot and
talking it over with another colleague
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:and we were saying, spay neuter is.
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:Sexy . There's a lot of really
powerful stories around spay neuter.
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:The pet overpopulation story is powerful,
but there's the health benefits story
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:and there's, because, we talk about
the health risks of early spay neuter,
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:but spay neuter itself in general
does have a cumulative positive.
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:Impact on health and and
longevity, especially in dogs.
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:And you can reach people with messages
that touch on preventing homelessness and
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:suffering, preventing health problems.
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:You can really get to people and
make them think, whereas so often.
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:When we message spay neuter, we
do it in this really lecturing
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:way that is not very sexy.
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:It's not very interesting and appealing.
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:It doesn't touch people's hearts.
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:It doesn't tell people
what's in it for them.
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:It.
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:It misses all the opportunities
that we've learned about in public
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:speaking and persuasion to really grab
people by their hearts and make them
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:understand something in a different way.
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:So does the same with adoption.
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:We tend to tell these heartbreaking
stories about our animals.
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:Because those are very motivational
for a rescue audience, and a lot of
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:times that's who we're talking to.
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:The average people want happy,
healthy pets who are gonna sleep
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:at the foot of their kids' beds.
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:They don't want a project, they
don't want a pet who's suffering
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:from post-traumatic stress disorder.
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:They want.
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:A moment of happiness and joy.
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:That's what they want.
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:I'm not saying that people can't be
reached by heartbreaking stories.
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:We all know that they can.
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:I'm saying that the more you tell
those stories, you run the risk of
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:poisoning the well for adoption.
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:For people who aren't looking
for that, who outnumber.
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:People who are looking for that project
PET or that heartbreaking story to
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:feel like they've rescued an animal.
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:PetSmart Charities did some interesting
research on this, and again, I don't
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:have the research in front of me.
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:I can't quote from it directly,
but they were talking about what
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:it was that people were looking for
in a pet and all the things that
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:motivated them to want that pet.
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:The story, the pet's background
story was the least important
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:and humorously enough, the number
one thing that they liked about a
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:dog was that the dog jumped on them.
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:So we spend all this time training
dogs not to jump on people, but in
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:fact the doctors seemed to like it.
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:But yeah, so I think
that we really need to.
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:Be very conscious of the audience
when we're trying to get our message
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:out beyond our core following, to
look for these opportunities to put
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:the message in a different place.
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:A place that's not already saturated
with our messaging, but to talk
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:about it in ways that appeal.
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:To the general public who are looking
for these joyful experiences and humor.
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:One of my clients for 14 years
was the Shelter Pet Project,
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:which was the ad council's public
service advertising campaign.
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:And all our ads were funny or
heartwarming, and we never did any
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:sad or, the first set of ads that
we did were all very humorous.
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:And we got a lot of attention for that
because this was back in, I'm just trying
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:to think what year it must have been.
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:Must have been maybe the early
two thousands I'm thinking.
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:We were.
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:Mid two thousands and it was
really uncommon at that point for
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:people to do ads for pet adoption
that weren't heartbreaking.
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:Arms of the angels and all that.
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:Which to be fair are mostly fundraising
ads, not adoption ads, but in rescue.
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:I'm sure you've seen just the
avalanche of stories of, this tragic.
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:Background that the pet has and how we're
gonna save them from this terrible trauma.
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:And and we've really become overly reliant
on that is the only note that we have.
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:And to remember that humor and
touching people's hearts in a
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:positive way is more popular.
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:Dixie: Yeah, I can agree with that.
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:I can actually see that now
that you mentioned that.
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:Because if you do have that
heartstring case that you tend to
413
:attract somebody that has already
has a rescue pet, essentially.
414
:Now, I'm gonna say like , in some
special needs cases that might
415
:be who you wanna attract anyway.
416
:So in that approach it might be good.
417
:Absolutely.
418
:But
419
:Christie: Absolutely.
420
:Dixie: Yeah.
421
:But for the general.
422
:Adoptions.
423
:I can see that, if you say, oh I
rescued these puppies off the side
424
:of the road and they need homes.
425
:And I think people sometimes might think
why were they on the side of the road?
426
:Was there something wrong with them?
427
:So maybe that's not a good choice for us.
428
:So , I can see what, if you frame it in a
more positive light, how it would attract.
429
:Different people,
430
:Christie: soccer moms.
431
:Dixie: Yeah.
432
:Yeah.
433
:I , can see that what I always in my
434
:Christie: head is.
435
:Yeah, exactly.
436
:Exactly.
437
:And there's more of them.
438
:They outnumber us.
439
:Dixie: Yeah.
440
:Yeah.
441
:And in your audience, and I will say
too that I've noticed on the, my latest
442
:adoptions, I have a good sense of humor.
443
:So I tend to do a more
comical twist on things.
444
:Good.
445
:So I do see that since I've started doing,
and letting my kind of humor come out that
446
:I do see my adoption rates are going up
and then I'm also getting adopted faster.
447
:Another thing that I would like to ask
you too is I see on your LinkedIn that
448
:you're a Reagan AI certified communicator.
449
:Christie: Yes,
450
:Dixie: I
451
:Christie: am.
452
:Dixie: Okay, so what is that?
453
:Christie: So I took a course, a
certification course in working with ai.
454
:I was very interested in it when it first
appeared on the scene and, some of the
455
:negative things that, that we've learned
about AI since then have maybe given
456
:me a little bit of pause, but I still
think that it's a really powerful tools.
457
:For tool for animal welfare, especially
when we, nonprofits in general, but
458
:animal welfare specifically because
we run so lean in terms of only
459
:the biggest shelters have an entire
communications team or marketing team.
460
:And rescue groups often don't have
anyone with marketing or communications
461
:experience, and they still have
marketing and communications needs.
462
:So I wanted to be able
to really understand how.
463
:I could advise people to use AI to write
adoption listings, pet bios, social
464
:media posts newsletters fundraising,
appeals, grant applications, all the
465
:things that AI can help you with.
466
:I wanted to be sure that I knew
how to advise them to use those
467
:things or avoid them, and.
468
:What, how to avoid making mistakes
with them and how to get the most out
469
:of an interaction with an artificial
intelligence because what you put
470
:into it determines what you get out
of it, but it is still a huge time
471
:and money saver for nonprofits.
472
:So I really wanted to pursue that
so that I could bring that to the
473
:table with my clients and make sure
that they got the benefits of working
474
:with AI if it would help them.
475
:Dixie: Has it been beneficial to
them in terms of writing adoption
476
:bios and maybe social media posts?
477
:Christie: I don't know.
478
:I can tell when I'm on Petfinder
when bios have been written by ai.
479
:They're just obvious.
480
:I don't know if it matters.
481
:Sometimes I think that.
482
:We need to spend more time educating
people on how to write good AI prompts and
483
:because they're just going in and they're
not giving the AI the right information
484
:to really produce good results.
485
:So I think there's still a lot of
work to be done, but I think that
486
:other times it's like plastic surgery.
487
:The ones and you notice are the bad
ones, but the good ones you don't know.
488
:You because you can't tell.
489
:I think that's probably true of AI too.
490
:There's probably really good
work being done out there that is
491
:invisible because it's so good.
492
:And so I'm not a hundred percent sure,
but of my clients, I try to work with
493
:them on how they do their prompts.
494
:That's the number one
thing I work with them on.
495
:Dixie: One more thing too before we
end the call that I would like to
496
:touch on is negative comments Yes.
497
:On social media.
498
:How do you handle those?
499
:What is the best way to handle that?
500
:Whether it's, you're either promoting
spay neuter and somebody has that
501
:negative comment to say, or somebody
gets mad because they wanna adopt from
502
:you, and either that animal has already
been adopted or you might not think
503
:they're a good fit for that animal.
504
:Christie: I have become much
more hard-ass about this.
505
:In my old age here, I used to be
much more soft about it, but I've
506
:seen way too many derailments of.
507
:People's social media platforms by
people who weren't being genuine,
508
:who were just stirring up trouble.
509
:So when you get a negative
comment, it might be the most
510
:valuable thing that you're.
511
:Organization will ever get, it's the
cheapest focus group you'll ever have.
512
:Is someone pointing out a problem
saying to you, why did you do this?
513
:What is happening?
514
:I went on your website and I
saw this and I don't understand.
515
:Why are you spaying neutering at.
516
:Two pounds.
517
:It's terrible.
518
:Whatever the negative comment is, this
is really useful information for you
519
:and you should be grateful for it.
520
:And so I always say the first thing
you do when you get an a sincere,
521
:negative comment, like something
that doesn't appear to be trolling,
522
:is you say, thank you very much
for bringing this to my attention.
523
:And then you say something like,
we would love, you know it.
524
:It depends on what they said.
525
:You can either say.
526
:This is what we do because this is
the recommendation of, the Association
527
:of Shelter veterinarians or something
appropriate and fairly short.
528
:Sometimes it's appropriate to say, please
contact so and so at such and such email
529
:address so we can, we can get to the
bottom of this with you that might be
530
:more appropriate for a customer service
type complaint where they say, I left
531
:a message and no one called me back.
532
:Or I filled out an adoption
application and I never heard from
533
:anyone, or something like that.
534
:You might wanna get them off social media
and direct them to an email address so
535
:that this isn't happening in public.
536
:But for trolling comments.
537
:Your response is not going to be
for them because they're not a
538
:sincere player in the conversation.
539
:They are just there to make trouble,
and what I do with them is I make
540
:one answer that sounds sincere and
polite and even welcoming because
541
:I'm not answering it for them.
542
:I'm answering it for all the people
reading it, and then I delete everything
543
:after that because we're done.
544
:It's over and if it becomes a
really hotbed of flames and I
545
:can't control it anymore, I just
delete the original comment.
546
:I didn't use to be like that.
547
:I used to feel like we shouldn't be
deleting all these comments, and now I'm
548
:just like, if they're not sincere, if
they're just there to make trouble, they
549
:don't need to do it on my real estate.
550
:So I usually advise people to be
pretty tough with trolling comments.
551
:Dixie: That makes a lot of sense.
552
:What would you say about the ones that
say they fill out an adoption application?
553
:You call them up, but you tell
'em, Hey, this animal is not
554
:a good fit for your family.
555
:We're not approving your application.
556
:Because I do see that a lot where a
lot of them will go onto rescue pages
557
:and they'll try to get their friends
on there too, to say, go leave bad
558
:reviews and do things like that.
559
:So how would you handle those?
560
:Christie: Yeah, that's so
difficult because there's so
561
:many channels for them to lead.
562
:Bad reviews too.
563
:It's not just social media, it's also
Google reviews and Yelp reviews, and
564
:it can become really time consuming
for a small nonprofit, especially
565
:to track all these things down.
566
:But usually I would say first of
all, I always try to frame turn
567
:downs as positively as possible.
568
:So let's say someone has tried to adopt
a specific cat and you don't think that
569
:cat would be a good fit with this family.
570
:I would just try to steer
them to another cat.
571
:Unfortunately, sometimes you wouldn't
adopt to them at all, and they're, you
572
:are just, you're just turning them down
and inevitably people are gonna be upset
573
:about that because no one likes rejection.
574
:So you are inevitably
going to face this problem.
575
:And I would say I'm very sorry that
this didn't work out for you and us.
576
:Please.
577
:Contact us at this email address
and try and get it off social media.
578
:And then I would also leave responses
to like one of the things that I
579
:recommend that people do for reputation
management is to answer their reviews.
580
:And I always would say, we're so
sorry that this didn't work out.
581
:We hope that we wish you luck
in your search for a new pet
582
:because again, it's not for them.
583
:Nothing that you say
is gonna satisfy them.
584
:They're not there to be satisfied.
585
:They're upset, they're lashing out and
they blame you and they feel like they're
586
:being told they're a bad pet owner and
irresponsible and all kinds of terrible
587
:things, and there's not really nothing you
can do about that except be professional.
588
:Try to keep it from taking over your
social media, which is hard because like
589
:you said, they'll drag their friends
in on it and they'll also post lies.
590
:And that's another thing that
I recommend doing is saying.
591
:We've gone through our records and we
don't have any record of an adoption
592
:application from anyone with your name.
593
:Can you let us know what name your
adoption application was made under?
594
:So we can get to the bottom of this?
595
:Because what you're doing there is
signaling to the public who maybe
596
:is reading these reviews that the
person is fake without coming right
597
:out and saying the person is fake.
598
:And usually they don't answer you.
599
:So your response is just hanging there.
600
:You responded, you were professional,
you signaled that they were fake.
601
:You didn't say anything objectionable.
602
:That's the best you can
do in that circumstance.
603
:But that would be for a review
more so than a social media post.
604
:Dixie: Yeah, it's very good advice.
605
:Thank you so much for
speaking with me today.
606
:Christie: Oh, Dixie, it was a lot of fun.
607
:I really enjoyed speaking with you too
608
:Dixie: that's it for today's
episode of Animal Posse.
609
:If you love what we're doing,
please consider becoming a member.
610
:Your support directly helps us continue
highlighting the people and stories
611
:that save lives across the country.
612
:Just a quick reminder, the views
and opinions expressed by our
613
:guests are theirs alone and are
provided for entertainment purposes.
614
:They don't necessarily.
615
:reflect the official position of the show,
and this information should never replace
616
:the advice of your own veterinarian.
617
:Thanks for listening, and
we'll see you next time.
