What’s the real difference between joy, fulfilment, and striving? In this episode, psychologist Leila Ainge explores the psychology behind our endless chase for more—and why true joy often hides in life’s quieter moments. Drawing on research into hedonic adaptation and flow, Leila unpacks how to tell the difference between healthy ambition and the anxiety of overstriving. You’ll learn how to savour success, sustain motivation, and find balance between progress and peace.

Plus—Leila shares exciting news about Season 4 of Psychologically Speaking and a live Joy Experiment you can join to put the science of joy into action.

Hi, I'm Leila Ainge, psychologist, researcher, and someone who's been thinking a lot

lately about what makes life feel really good.

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Welcome back to Psychologically Speaking.

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This is a podcast all about human behavior, bringing together fascinating research,

insights, and real life experiences.

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This season, we're exploring joy.

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Not just the theory of it, although we will get into that, but how joy actually moves.

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through our lives, how it shifts us and what it makes us do.

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Over the last couple of episodes, we've heard from different guests about their

experiences of joy in their business.

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But today we're going to have a reflective feel and think about what joy means for us and

also the idea of joy as a performance.

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So just a note, today's podcast is being broadcast from the park and ride in Nottingham.

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I'm in my car, my little boy is being homeschooled for the next couple of weeks and I

cannot find a quiet space in my house.

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if there are any unexpected sounds today, you know why.

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when you finally get the thing that you've been working towards.

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Maybe you've got a client that you've been chasing for a while, you've finished a big

project, maybe you've cleared your inbox, perhaps it's a project at home.

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I've recently been plastering my hall stairs and landing.

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I know, bit of a nightmare, very dusty where I am at the moment.

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But instead of feeling what you might expect to be an overwhelming sense of joy or

elation, perhaps it's a little bit quieter than that.

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And it wouldn't be disappointment, but perhaps it's more of a stillness or quietness after

the busyness of doing all of the activity that says, what was that?

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What am I feeling?

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And that's what I want to talk about today because this strange

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kind of looping relationship between fulfilments, striving, performance and joy is

something that we're constantly chasing.

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But it's also important to ask those questions about how we rest and how we recognise when

something is enough, even when we're striving for more.

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striving feels like the air that we breathe.

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Perhaps that's the whole reason you're in business or the reason you get up in the

morning.

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It's the thing that keeps you going.

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Some people are really built on goals

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It makes lots of sense, Because we know that this em hormone, dopamine, is really lighting

up when we're hitting our goals, but not just hitting them, but in that journey towards

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it.

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We know the anticipation.

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Remember one of the episodes we talked about the fact that it's the anticipation of

working towards something that also gives us that reward and that feedback.

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So the thrill of nearly there feels just as strong or even stronger sometimes than the, I

did it.

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And that's the point, isn't it?

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So if you've managed to achieve something and you're feeling a little bit flat, perhaps

it's because that dopamine or that reward has come to you as part of the process rather

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than the conclusion.

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And that's how our system works really.

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And it's easy to see that, isn't it?

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Why fulfillment can be so slippery.

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So if you're somebody who likes to move the goalposts, somebody who nearly gets to where

you're going to go and thinks, how do I make this harder?

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How do I make it trickier?

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How do I go for more?

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You're somebody who people say you never rest, you never stop.

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You keep going for the next big thing.

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That might be a sign actually that you are using this momentum of the dopamine and the

thrill of the chase to sustain yourself and to keep going.

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it's useful to think about the last time you noticed yourself rushing through a moment,

perhaps that deserved to be savored.

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So there's nothing wrong in jumping from one goal to the next, to the next.

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And we know that lots of people strive to do that because that is, um you know, really

helpful in building on our goals.

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But.

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That's okay if you are remembering to celebrate your success and you are remembering to

really savour the experience and all the good feelings that you've got on the way.

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It would be such a shame, wouldn't it, to go from goalpost to goalpost to goalpost and to

not savour that.

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I think that's when we move from striving for something to really grinding away into that

daily grind feeling.

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So in psychology land, we call this something called hedonic adaption.

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And this is the tendency for us to return to this idea of a baseline of happiness after

change.

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So this can be negative or positive change.

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And it's a really good thing.

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It's good that we bounce back and it's good that we come back to some kind of equilibrium.

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The way in which our mind is going to normalise that means that you might be striving for

the next thing and the next thing.

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So when we think that fulfilment is going to arrive at a summit, and let's go back again

because remember I talked about Maslow's hierarchy of needs, this triangle that

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everybody's seen on presentations and it's taught in every motivational goal-setting class

that I've ever been in.

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And this idea that psychologists are saying actually can we move away from this idea that

you have to reach a pinnacle and when you've got there then that's it you've achieved it

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because the science, the psychology is telling us the absolute opposite.

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It's saying when you get to the top guess what you're gonna stand there you're gonna look

around and go what's next.

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So this really interesting idea then that we think about

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motivation, not as a pinnacle or something to achieve, but part of a real journey and

process.

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And there's that difference, isn't there, between growth and grind?

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You know, one of those is going to energize us and the other one is going to really

deplete us.

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So I'm going to invite you today to just pause really, and I want you to think about in

your life right now, where are you really pushing hard?

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And then

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The follow-up question to that is, but what's that effort in service of?

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You know, what's the feeling?

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What are you trying to express?

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There's a really sweet spot, isn't there then, that I think we're starting to establish,

which is this place between burnout and boredom.

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And so we can then turn to the work of the great psychologist, Mihyl Csikszent mihyl and

he called it Flow.

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And you've heard me speak about his work previously.

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His book is an international bestseller.

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And he talks about this total sense of absorption where

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time just literally disappears.

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And the interesting thing about this is that it doesn't have to be an activity that is,

you know, completely fulfilling.

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I'm going to use an example here, which is one I love to hate, which is ironing.

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And I hate ironing.

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I always have a massive ironing pile.

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And, you know, I don't look at my ironing pile and think, great.

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When I start ironing, I'm going to get into a flow state and all my best thoughts and

ideas are going to happen.

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But do you know what?

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On reflection, that is what happens.

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So I'll pop a podcast on I go for the same podcast and it's a psychology one that I really

enjoy.

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And that podcast has such interesting guests and subjects.

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And then I get into that state of contemplation and reflection.

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My head's gone into this idea of, okay, I'm doing this repetitive motion of ironing 1

million t-shirts and...

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Then suddenly I'm in this place of thinking through ideas, maybe everything that's been

happening in the week all comes together and I have, you know, an idea for the podcast or

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an idea for one of my clients for a psych insight report.

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It's really interesting when we think about what we think flow should look like, whether

it's, you know, doing something that feels really meaningful, but actually doing

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meaningless stuff.

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I had a really good day recently where I sat down one morning and was at my desk all day

and the writing just came.

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But I think those moments where we expect flow to align fully with our work are probably

less frequent than when flow shows up in the more mundane.

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And I think that's something really interesting to think about.

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So this idea of fulfillment, it's not saying stop striving for stuff, but I think what

we're saying is why don't you just notice the moment and stay present in it for a little

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bit?

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Because there's this idea that perhaps that we're trying to move

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pass things or through things very quickly and we miss a bit of the enjoyment from it.

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One of the questions you could ask yourself today is, what activities do make you lose

time, lose track of time?

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Where does time seem to kind of walk around for you?

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And can you build more of that into your week?

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Is it surprising?

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I was rereading one of my favourite books recently and it's by a psychologist called Amy

Cuddy.

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this book, Presence, is really interesting.

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there's a section that begins, you already have the tools that you need.

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she describes a fascinating experiment, and this was by a neuroscientist, Pierre Philpott.

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in his experiment he asked participants to change their breathing the only instruction

they had was make yourself feel an emotion so some of these participants had the emotion

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of joy so if i was to say to you right now i want you to adapt your breathing but adapt it

to feeling the emotion of joy that's it that's all they were asked to do and you might

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think that's a bit woo and

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You know, how can you scientifically say that they actually were feeling joy?

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Well, here's what he did next.

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So he got another group of participants who were asked to emulate or copy the breathing of

the group who were doing the joy emotion, except they weren't told that the emotion was

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joy.

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They were just told to copy the breathing.

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afterwards he asked them, what emotion did you experience while you were doing that?

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And they said, joy.

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Isn't that remarkable?

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Those people naturally slowed their breath, it became deeper, the ribcage became relaxed

You can practice this at home.

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see if you can get somebody in your household or your friend to copy your breathing

without telling them the emotion and see if you get that transference.

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There's a lot of science around breathing and genuinely breathing is one of the things

that we all do every day.

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So if you can use that in some small way to emulate joy, go for it.

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So I want to talk about striving and the dark side of ambition, if you like, you know,

when achievement becomes a real proof of our worth, that's when it becomes really

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conditional.

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And I talked earlier in the series about, you know, when our to-do list becomes, a

to-prove list instead of a to-do list.

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And this is exactly this sentiment here.

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We start to confuse something like productivity with progress.

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And this is when we're ticking all the boxes, but we're still feeling like we're behind.

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And that isn't ambition, you know, that is probably something like anxiety and stress

wearing ambitions clothes.

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So the antidote there or the reversal of it isn't to give up or to stop caring.

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I suppose it's to try and think about where your identity is sitting in that.

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Why is this mattering to you?

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What is it that you you'll be coming as well as what are you producing?

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And I like to think about this with my own business.

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So over the last year I've pivoted and I'm now doing more work with businesses.

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I'm working with them in collaboration to produce insight reports.

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And I've noticed that I am becoming more of the psychologist that I always wanted to be.

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And I'm not having to prove anything to anyone else.

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I mean, I've got my PhD study, which is very much about that.

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But the really wonderful thing about this striving that I'm in at the moment is it's very

connected to the identity that I feel and I have become over a period of five to eight

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years.

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and it feels really congruent.

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we can look at things like this over and think about how that works with where we're

striving.

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So the psychology of fulfillment is really interesting to think about here because when we

look at motivation and we look at things like fulfillment, that Maslow hierarchy, which

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we've talked about in this season, we're switching that with other theories and models.

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And one of them, which I find really useful here is something by Deci and Ryan, and it's

the self-determination theory.

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I've mentioned this previously, I in conversation with Katie Elliott, we talked about

these three ideas of autonomy, competence and connection.

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when you act with autonomy, you get choice.

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you grow in competence, you're making progress.

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And when you connect with other people, you get that meaning.

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So those three things we said really.

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brought joy for Katie in the episode where we talked about HR and how she runs her

business.

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But also for you, if that joy for you at the moment is feeling a little bit distant, maybe

it's in the horizon, then I would be asking what one of those three things are you missing

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out of the equation because that is going to bring the joy fulfillment.

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So right at the start of the podcast today, I said, you know, we're going to ask that

question of around when have you got there?

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When you get there, how do you feel?

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Is it elation?

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Is it a sense of quiet?

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Is it deflation?

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And this is the thing, fulfillment doesn't really announce itself in the way that, you

know, a goal intention or expression might.

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It might be a quieter landing than you expected.

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Actually, the real achievement or goal that comes from the original intention that you set

might happen halfway through your journey.

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It might be something you didn't even expect.

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And this is the beauty of goal setting.

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So I once heard somebody though describe fulfillment as the absence of noise.

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And I do wonder if that is a helpful way to think about, have I got what I wanted?

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know, have those thoughts dialed down, the thoughts around what if, or could I do this?

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When they become quieter, you realize you're just there.

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And I think that's a realization that I had with my own business this year, which was,

wow, I don't have to wait, I can do this now.

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And then when I do do it, wow, I'm doing it, I'm there.

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It's a wonderful paradox, isn't it?

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Because striving and joy can coexist.

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You know, don't have to have reached a pinnacle to still be striving and to feel joy.

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And we don't have to find joy at the end of the journey.

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So as you move through this week, I really want you to notice a couple of things.

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One, where is striving or progress and joy towards your goal energizing you?

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And where are you in that flow state and why?

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What activities really get you going?

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Please don't say ironing.

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I think I'm probably a little bit bonkers there.

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You might also start to see where

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things feel heavy.

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So the next question is, you know, are you noticing where your performance zone sits?

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Are you performing in the middle of your perfect zone?

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So if we were to say that performance is very slow or performance is very hard, are you in

that middle zone?

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If you're not, what can we switch around and think about that autonomy, competence and

that connectedness?

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And the final thing is I think each day

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Even if you do this maybe for three or four days or if you can a whole week, what is it a

moment in each day that has been really quietly fulfilling for you?

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Even if, even if in the grand scheme of any big goals that you've got, you've not ticked

off a box or you've not ticked off something on your to-do list.

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You know, this is where I'm saying, when did you feel fulfilled even if you've not proved

anything?

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I am so excited about where the podcast is going to go next.

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In the next season, we're going to take everything that we've learned about imposter

phenomenon about joy and we're going to stand by people and follow them on the journey as

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they set goals with us and they're going to let their journeys unfold with us.

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We're going to follow

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where joy comes in and out, we're going to look at where they feel fulfilled, we're going

to ask them about flow states.

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will the goal that they set be the goal that they achieve and is that okay, not okay?

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And I can't wait for you to hear these stories and join me on season four.

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We've got a few more episodes in this season, but I am going to be busy over the next

couple of months preparing those episodes for you.

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If today's episode resonated, you can find more reflections and psychology informed

coaching tools at www.leila ainge.co.uk.

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Also a reminder that I partner with businesses To bring psychological insights to your

work.

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I'm looking forward to diving deeper into the psychology of goals, why we set them, how we

sustain them and what happens when they start to change us.

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Until then, thanks for listening.