Shownotes
Sometimes the guest chooses you and they don't even know it.
I'd been a fan of the work that today's guest had been doing for quite some time so I was beyond thrilled when she said a big Essex yes to coming on the show.
I'm joined by the dynamic and Epic Shereen Ritchie, CEO of Buns from Home. Shereen shares her incredible journey in the hospitality industry, emphasising the importance of authenticity, embracing one's uniqueness, and the value of entry-level roles in nurturing future leaders.
**Key Discussion Points:**
1. **Authenticity & Uniqueness:** Shereen underlines the power of being true to oneself and embracing what makes you unique, a message that resonates deeply in both personal and professional realms.
2. **Ed Sheeran's Support:** A heartfelt discussion on Ed Sheeran's support for Buns from Home (and a humorous and ambitious contemplation of having him appear on the podcast in the future).
3. **Leadership Lessons:** Shereen’s experiences from her various roles across companies like TGI Fridays, Las Iguanas, and Leon, offer insightful lessons on leadership, mentorship, and the significance of developing young talent.
4. **Industry Impact of COVID-19:** The episode delves into the profound impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on the hospitality industry, including the community-driven efforts to support the NHS and the shift to virtual business interactions.
5. **Inspirational Anecdotes:** Shereen shares memorable and humorous moments from her career, including a virtual meeting mishap and a mistaken identity at an awards ceremony involving Angela Hartnett.
6. **Buns from Home:** Discover the extraordinary growth story of Buns from Home, a bakery that began during lockdown and now boasts 15 sites, thanks to its rapid innovation and sustainable business model.
7. **Impactful Food Memories:** Shereen and Phil explore the emotional significance of food memories and the role of hospitality in creating lasting, positive impacts on people's lives.
8. **Dynamic Leadership:** The evolving landscape of leadership takes centre stage as Shereen speaks on having a supportive team, understanding business processes, and the importance of nurturing talent.
**Memorable Quotes:**
To encapsulate Shereen's wisdom and energy, we have curated some of her most impactful quotes from the episode, check our social through the week. You’ll hear her heartfelt advice on enjoying the present moment, her belief in the power of the hospitality industry, and her thoughts on leadership and nurturing future leaders.
**Important Links:**
- [Buns from Home](https://www.bunsfromhome.com) - Explore the bakery that’s taking the hospitality world by storm.
- [Leon Restaurants](https://leon.co) - Learn about Shereen's impactful tenure at Leon.
- [TGI Fridays](https://www.tgifridays.co.uk) - Discover the brand that shaped Shereen's foundational years in hospitality.
**Tune in to this episode of Hospitality Meets to gain valuable insights on leadership, the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on the industry, and the heart-warming journey of Shereen Ritchie. Whether you’re an aspiring leader or a seasoned professional, Shereen’s story is sure to inspire and uplift you.**
For full show notes, complete transcripts, and more episodes, visit [Hospitality Meets Podcast](https://hospitalitymeetspodcast.co.uk).
*Subscribe, rate, and review our podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favourite podcast platform.*
**Keywords:** Shereen Ritchie, Buns from Home, Hospitality Meets, Leadership, Hospitality Industry, Ed Sheeran, COVID-19 impact, Food Memories, TGI Fridays, Leon Restaurants, Mentorship, Business Growth, Sustainability.
The Guest
Shereen is mum of 2 (Mason Wolf and Tigerlily Reign), eternal optimist and possibly Jon Bon Jovi's number 1 fan. Shereen also has 25 years of experience in everything hospitality, PR and construction and is a leader with a difference. She can give you a masterclass in how to lead by inspiration, she creates teams with the strength of lions, and her ‘Only Way is Essex’ upbringing taught her to add glitter and unicorns to everything.
She believes that business success involves balancing operational and commercial considerations with human ones. She has a proven track-record in building, leading and managing high-performing teams that have delivered outstanding revenue performance in exceptionally tough market conditions.
Her approach has helped her to turn around enterprise performance, routinely beat budgets, and create and launch a new digital business in just three weeks. She is known for agility, determination and a relentlessly positive attitude that motivates and inspires those around her. She does not back down from a challenge and her teams have made the impossible a reality.
As the former UK Managing Director of LEON she led the brand through its most successful, as well as its most challenging time. Prior to this and after a stint in PR and Construction she ‘returned home’ to hospitality and joined Las Iguanas where she grew the business and supported the sale of Las Iguanas to Casual Dining Group.
Shereen is currently the Chief Executive Officer for the independent London bakery brand, buns from home. The brand that was born during the pandemic has taken the city and social feeds by storm. With ques around the block morning, noon and night, the rapidly growing brand is not only expanding its bakeries but launching into retail and cookbooks.
Having started her journey in hospitality at 15 years old, she got an evening job cleaning tables at TGI Fridays. Little did she know at the time that this part time job would shape her future in the most significant way. She can still teach you the TGI Fridays trick of how to hold 6 glasses in one hand!
The Sponsor
Today’s episode comes to you in partnership with RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.
RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.
It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.
Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacy
Transcripts
And by God, am I giddy today, because I. Welcome to the show Shereen
Speaker:Ritchie. Thank you so much for having me. I'm very excited.
Speaker:Fantastic. How are you? I'm really good, thank you. Living the
Speaker:dream. Work is keeping me busy, and when work isn't keeping me busy,
Speaker:my two children are. But no, I am buoyant and
Speaker:positive. And as I say, super happy to be here. So, Phil, thanks so much
Speaker:for inviting me. My absolute pleasure. There's actually many reasons why I wanted to
Speaker:get you on the show, one of which is kind of the overriding one for
Speaker:me at the moment, is that in the face of all the crap that's going
Speaker:on in the world, is that you guys seem to be moving forward.
Speaker:And so I want to spread the word that business
Speaker:potential is still there. It's just a question of, I
Speaker:suppose, knowing who you are, what you want to do, and how you're going to
Speaker:get there. Yeah, it's so important. And this is obviously the topic of
Speaker:conversation. I go to a lot of events, I get to meet lots of amazing
Speaker:leaders and people in our industry, and it is the
Speaker:topic. I think what's really important to identify is that
Speaker:within hospitality, you have different sections. So you've got your
Speaker:entry level, which I class as your sweet treats, your grab and go. Then that
Speaker:leads into QSR, which then leads into your casual dining, which then leads
Speaker:into your high end. And I think what we've seen, if you look at the
Speaker:2008 2009 recession, for instance, if you've got money and
Speaker:you're going to these high end sexy fish bacchanalias, you will
Speaker:always have money to go to. These places where we tend to see is
Speaker:that if you're going to the high end, they stay there. Casual
Speaker:dining, people will still eat at casual dining, but they'll just eat less and they're
Speaker:just more price conscious. And potentially, rather than going out to a casual
Speaker:dining restaurant and spending 80 pounds, they'll go to a Lyon,
Speaker:for instance, and spend 35 pounds and try and get the
Speaker:same energy, the same experience that they had, but just for less
Speaker:money, or they will, as I say, do it less frequently. People
Speaker:that would go into a QSR, potentially, again, will go less or bring in their
Speaker:own lunch. But people from QSR have people from casual dining move
Speaker:down and sweet treats. People would always find time for
Speaker:sweet treats and for gifting and to feel good about themselves. So
Speaker:there's different sectors. So I'm in the sweet treat QSR grab and
Speaker:go space, which I feel is a good space. To be in, versus
Speaker:potentially some of the other challenging spaces. But also, when it comes to growth,
Speaker:our units, if you don't know funds from home. Actually, let me explain. Well,
Speaker:I was going to say, probably should tell the world, actually, what it. Is that
Speaker:you do. Should have started with that. Well, that was
Speaker:my fault. I just went straight into it. But, yes, probably tell the world who
Speaker:you are and what you do. I'm CEO of Buns from home. So
Speaker:buns from home was started in lockdown by our genius
Speaker:founder, Barney Goff. So he was marketing manager when Covid hit, and he moved
Speaker:back in with his mum. And he had studied, when he was 19 years old,
Speaker:in Paris rotisserie for a year. So he'd never really done anything with this skill
Speaker:set. And when Covid hit, he was like, right, I've got all this time, I'm
Speaker:gonna. I'm gonna bake. I love baking. I'm gonna use this skill that I've learned.
Speaker:So he started baking, and then he started sort of flyering his neighbors, saying,
Speaker:do you like some buns? You know, have some buns. And George
Speaker:Osborne, who was chancellor of the exchequer at the time,
Speaker:lived a couple of dollars down from him. And it was like his third or
Speaker:fourth customer and started ordering buns, started taking them into Westminster.
Speaker:So we sort of say, you know, Barney told his mum, his mum told the
Speaker:neighbors, and the neighbours then told the world, and it become this social sensation. And
Speaker:before Barney knew it, he was baking morning, noon and night. He was sleeping while
Speaker:the buns would prove. And he created this enterprise
Speaker:of this network of everyone buying buns off of him. So he borrowed some money
Speaker:off of his mum and he got his first site in Notting Hill. And then
Speaker:it really went. Went on from there. We now have 15 sites. So I
Speaker:joined the brand a year ago and we had seven sites since then.
Speaker:We're now at number 15. And we've got a strong opening pipeline. So
Speaker:we sell all different types of buns, cinnamon buns, dessert
Speaker:buns, savory buns, double baked buns. We have a core range
Speaker:of around 15 items. We then have a weekend special. So every
Speaker:single weekend, only available that weekend, then we don't do it again. We do a
Speaker:weekend special. We innovate at a speed and a rate that I don't know
Speaker:anyone else on the market that does. So. So this innovation is really important to
Speaker:us. One, because it means we can be nimble and agile and be on trends.
Speaker:It means we can keep things exciting for our social. I mean, we have
Speaker:this massive lol following that every Friday. Want to know what you know? Our weekend
Speaker:special is going to be. The teams love it, they get excited by it, it's
Speaker:really fun for them. And yeah, it's just a great addition. And this is obviously
Speaker:something that Barney created very early on. So yeah, that is what we do. We
Speaker:do everything out of one dough. So we're quite simplistic when it comes
Speaker:to scalability. We can fit into a space that is a hundred
Speaker:square foot up until 8900 square foot. So when
Speaker:taking me back to the point I made earlier around the economics, a
Speaker:casual dining restaurant. For those that don't really know square footage, a casual dining
Speaker:restaurant would tend to be 2000 to 4000 square foot.
Speaker:Whereas if I'm going into a 4000 square foot, everything becomes
Speaker:cheaper. You need less material to fit it out. There's less rent because it's
Speaker:smaller, you need less labor because you can't fit all the people
Speaker:in. So it makes the economic model quite good.
Speaker:So I think when it comes to rapid growth, at the moment
Speaker:we're able to grow rapidly. So we aim to open five a
Speaker:quarter. So because of the way it works with
Speaker:landlords and by the time you've got legal, signed and things, you know,
Speaker:sometimes can be delayed or we move forward, we sort of do it by half
Speaker:year. So it's ten every half year. So we've opened three so far. We've got
Speaker:eight more to open by mid year. And then for the second half
Speaker:of the year we'll be opening another ten. And yeah, it's super fun. We get
Speaker:to focus on stuff like doing it as sustainably as possible. We're looking at doing
Speaker:B Corps. All of these things get to interact and it's all things that the
Speaker:whole team really care about. So it is fast paced,
Speaker:but it doesn't feel like work, if that makes sense. So we're really, really lucky
Speaker:that we are enjoying the ride that we are on. But yeah, we're expanding really
Speaker:quickly, but our model allows us to do so. If I had a capex of,
Speaker:you know, 500 grand a unit, we certainly wouldn't be expanding at this rate
Speaker:because it's. It's low capex, low labor, low rents.
Speaker:We're able to move really quickly. And where we are quite nimble and agile, we're
Speaker:able to expand a fast rate, I think.
Speaker:Yeah, well, I mean, there's a. I suppose
Speaker:like Ed Sheeran, I'm a
Speaker:fan as well. Welcome on to Ed Sheeran in a second, I'm sure. But I
Speaker:did a foodie tour actually in notting hill. Fantastic experience
Speaker:that was just uh, nipping in and out of places of your lesser known
Speaker:place. And actually this was way before you guys were, I suppose, in the, the
Speaker:rapid expansion that you are now. But it was in Notting Hill and I think
Speaker:that's, that was your original site and didn't know the story until the guy who
Speaker:was leading our foodie tour took us in for, for a bun.
Speaker:And uh, there was already a queue at the time to, to get in. And
Speaker:then he told us that this whole thing blew up in the pandemic, basically
Speaker:through social. And I was like, this is just, it's remarkable.
Speaker:And I think the thing that I love
Speaker:more than anything is that effectively what you're doing is, as you say, you've
Speaker:got one dough that maybe you're zhuzhing up a little bit
Speaker:in different ways, but in actual fact that keeps things really simple, but allows you
Speaker:the flexibility to think laterally as
Speaker:well. Yeah, I remember when I met our
Speaker:chairman and lead investor now, Robbie Miller. When I met
Speaker:him, very first thing I said to him was, the simplicity
Speaker:is what makes it incredible because being simple is very, very
Speaker:hard. There isn't a leader in the business, especially in
Speaker:somewhere where you've got more menu items and you've got lots of drinks and coffee
Speaker:and you know, potentially things the instinct is to add to it. Oh, add milkshakes,
Speaker:their sell, add iced coffee that will sell, add sandwiches that would sell. Add this,
Speaker:add this, add this. But actually keeping something so simplistic,
Speaker:being a master at what you do, being best in class at what you do,
Speaker:and just focusing on that, it's actually very, very hard to do.
Speaker:So the fact that that is what Barney had done and just focused
Speaker:obsessively on what he did well, didn't let any of the other noise, didn't look
Speaker:at competitors, didn't go, oh, they're making money out of that, or they're doing this,
Speaker:I should do that. Just really focused on what he was doing. And that
Speaker:is what we've carried through. I've been in brands previously and I know leaders in
Speaker:brands that are trying to do almost little formats, little versions. I used to be
Speaker:managing director of Leon and we had spent a lot of time before
Speaker:COVID and over Covid looking at a little Leon format. You know, how do we
Speaker:get out of a 2000 square foot space into a 500 square foot space? How
Speaker:do we half the menu? And when you've got something, it's very hard to cut
Speaker:it down. Oh, you can't take wraps because people like wraps. You can't take rice
Speaker:boxes because people like rice boxes. You can't get rid of fries because it's fries.
Speaker:So, actually, how do you create something small? Whereas when you have something to
Speaker:begin with that is so scaled back and simplistically, as long as you don't mess
Speaker:around with it, just be best in class at what you do, source the best
Speaker:ingredients, you know, within the product that you have. And that
Speaker:is what makes it very, very special. So, yeah, it's very, very simplistic
Speaker:and that is the beauty in it. Without question. Without question. Well, we'll talk
Speaker:more about where you're going and what you're doing, but I'm conscious of the fact
Speaker:that we've just gone straight into this today and we're ten minutes in and we
Speaker:haven't even approached your story in any way, shape or form, so probably time
Speaker:to get stuck into that. So take us all the way back to the very
Speaker:beginning of your career. How did you get into
Speaker:hospitality in the first place? How did I get into. Yeah, we have. We've done
Speaker:this backwards, but we'll start with now how I got into hospitality. So
Speaker:I didn't come for a salubrious background. I grew
Speaker:up with my mum. That is my rock and I idolize her and my
Speaker:stone and she always will be in. In the care system. When I was growing
Speaker:up, my biological father was quite violent, so we managed to get away from
Speaker:him on my 7th birthday. So my mum had taken, obviously,
Speaker:all that stress on herself. I wouldn't change my childhood for me, I would change
Speaker:it for my mum, but I certainly wouldn't change it for me. But I had
Speaker:come from a place where potentially, it could be said that my stars were
Speaker:written, that I wouldn't make much of myself and that I was not really going
Speaker:to become anything. I didn't have any real education. I loved to
Speaker:dance and I loved to sing. I wanted to be an actress. So I used
Speaker:to go up to London and dance at Pineapple Studios. From the
Speaker:age of around 13, I did this and that was before anyone knew what Pineapple
Speaker:studios was. And it was just the best place to go and dance. So I
Speaker:would go there and do dancing and then by the time I turned 15, they'd
Speaker:put up the cost and I couldn't afford to go. So I was like, right,
Speaker:I'm going to need to get a job so I can bunk off school to
Speaker:go to Pineapple Studios to learn dancing. And I went into
Speaker:TGI Fridays at Lakeside and I met a manager and I said look,
Speaker:I'm only 15 but I'm going to be 16 soon. I wasn't 16 soon, it
Speaker:was like ten months away or something. But I'm like, I'm going to be 16
Speaker:really soon, if you've got anything, I'll do anything. And he says well
Speaker:this is a day when you could pay cash in hand. He's like look, I
Speaker:can give you a cash in hand job and you can clean tables as a
Speaker:busser. I was like brilliant, I'll do it. So joined TGI
Speaker:Fridays, which was never meant to be long term, and I adored it,
Speaker:I adored the community, I adored the family, I'm still very good friends
Speaker:with a lot of people that I worked with on my very first day at
Speaker:TGI Fridays all them years ago and I ended up staying at TGI Fridays for
Speaker:ten years. I've travelled the country with them. I lived in Manchester, I lived in
Speaker:Birmingham, Solihull, quite a lot of openings up and down the country
Speaker:and absolutely I say it now, I bleed red and white. They
Speaker:really taught me and I owe a huge amount of gratitude to TGI
Speaker:Fridays. And also I always say this, there was a manager who
Speaker:people in the industry will know, someone called Jason Cotter who was MD of
Speaker:Oldenstein and has more recently gone and moved over to Itzu, who is just the
Speaker:most incredible human. And I was a challenge Phil,
Speaker:you won't believe this, but I was a challenge as a teenager to manage.
Speaker:No, I was a manage Phil. And Mister
Speaker:Potter didn't sack me many times when he probably should have done put up with
Speaker:me and nurtured me and you know, really sort of took me under
Speaker:his wing and was a, was a mentor to me at a very, very early
Speaker:stage and he didn't even realize he was doing it. It's just Jason's nature and
Speaker:now I know him as an adult and obviously as a colleague and
Speaker:leader in the industry, but yeah, back in the day I have a lot to
Speaker:thank him for, so. And that's where I started my journey. It was
Speaker:in TGI's and then I've been in TGIs for ten years and was like, right,
Speaker:I've done a lot of growing up, probably now time to move on. And I
Speaker:ended up going into pr for a bit. I went and worked in seven dials
Speaker:in Covent Garden and did a bit in pr and then I moved over, got
Speaker:the opportunity to go and work for TfL on the underground.
Speaker:So I actually worked for a subcontractor called Tube line, and I became a contracts
Speaker:director. So I worked there for four years. I did night shift.
Speaker:I led around a thousand workmen that were on the project
Speaker:and I did that for a good few years and then I was
Speaker:like, I love this. The project had ended and they were like, would you like
Speaker:to go on? I think Aldgate was the next project. Would you like to go
Speaker:to Aldgate? I've got quite a lot of health and safety certification. And I was
Speaker:like, no, I think I want to go back into hospitality. So I then went
Speaker:and worked at La Sagranis. So I joined Lasagranas, was there for
Speaker:five years. I left about 18 months after the sale to CDG.
Speaker:And my journey with Lassegranis was amazing. I looked after London upwards,
Speaker:so I would fly to school Scotland. I was in York, Harrogate, Liverpool, Manchester.
Speaker:So that was a regional role. Yeah, yeah, that was regional.
Speaker:So everything from, from London upwards, so that was great fun.
Speaker:And then I left to go to Leon, so I joined
Speaker:Leon and what a whirlwind. I was there for four years. It
Speaker:feels like 14. And, yeah, we. We went to America.
Speaker:We had seven franchise partners that were all amazing. We did cookbooks.
Speaker:I put Leon into Sainsbury's with the team. That was
Speaker:amazing. Over Covid, we did feed NHS and feed
Speaker:Britain, which were two huge projects. Feed NHS lasted
Speaker:for the whole of COVID and, you know, quite, quite, quite a long time
Speaker:afterwards, to be fair. So feed NHS saw us feed
Speaker:101 hospitals, over twelve trusts nationwide,
Speaker:and that brought together a lot of brands. I
Speaker:think it was over 50 brands in the end, and leaders that were all working
Speaker:together to make sure we could get food and supply chain, the NHS
Speaker:and support the incredible work that they were doing. So that really was an
Speaker:experience. And it's strange because over Covid there was lots of talks and we were
Speaker:doing a lot to publicize, you know, and try and support and help in any
Speaker:way we could. But I always said, you know, rainbows come out of rain. It
Speaker:was a terrible time. I am. I am a very optimistic person. I'm a
Speaker:realistic person, don't get me wrong, but I am an optimistic person. So I was
Speaker:always trying to look for the rainbows and now I've ended up full circle at
Speaker:a brand that was born out of COVID So I found my very own rainbow
Speaker:that was born in Covid, which is obviously buns from home. Yeah,
Speaker:well, a lot to unpack here, for
Speaker:sure. I've been making notes as we go along because there's a
Speaker:few things I kind of want to explore. First of all, we kind of have
Speaker:to go back to TGI's because, I mean, obviously, that was
Speaker:your hospitality grounding, I guess, was
Speaker:that. I mean, that was obviously born out of a desire to. To get
Speaker:a job, basically. Was there a moment whereby you
Speaker:were in the role and you were developing with them where you. Where you started
Speaker:to think, yes, this is. This is the place for, like, I have found
Speaker:my home now in terms of hospitality. 100%.
Speaker:100%. I remember I would end up missing auditions
Speaker:to work shifts because I just wanted to work. I just wanted to clean
Speaker:tables and then went on to be a host. I then was a dessert wheatie.
Speaker:I then did some expo in the kitchen, and there was a bar back. Like,
Speaker:I think I did every single role within my first three years, and I just
Speaker:adored it. I adored the people. I adored the culture, and I
Speaker:realized it was something very, very special. And I think those years
Speaker:really molded me. And, you know, all the values
Speaker:that they used to have, things like swan theory and the Nike
Speaker:theory, just do it. And they're very famous for their braces and all of their
Speaker:badges. I still have my braces and I, with my badges. And, you know, if
Speaker:you've got a wow badge, which was walk on water because you've done something to
Speaker:make a guest stay, like that meant something. Getting a walk with that badge, no
Speaker:matter how many times you got one, it really meant something. And, you
Speaker:know, the training was, you know, now I realize how amazing back in the day
Speaker:their training was. You know, and there wasn't a bar manual in casual dining that
Speaker:isn't based off of a TGI Friday's bar manual. You know, they were
Speaker:doing bartender competitions where, you know, the whole
Speaker:company would come together, people from America would fly over, and they really
Speaker:were setting me up to success in how to
Speaker:run a culture, how to lead a culture, and how to truly live it. You
Speaker:know, I always turn around and say, in any business, I've been on values and
Speaker:culture, not something we write on the wall in a head office. I mean, I
Speaker:haven't even got a head office at the moment, so I couldn't even if I
Speaker:wanted to. You're in it at the moment. I don't even have a head office
Speaker:at funds from home, but if I had one, it isn't something that I could
Speaker:write on the office wall, because that isn't what values and culture are. It's something
Speaker:that you live and breathe. And as I say, I've said it many, many times,
Speaker:I believe red and white. And I a huge amount of gratitude to the
Speaker:leaders and TGI Fridays when I was growing up
Speaker:in it because they really moulded me and taught me a lot
Speaker:of lessons and a lot of things that potentially I wouldn't have learned and
Speaker:I wouldn't have seen. And they definitely helped me develop to
Speaker:be a better version of myself. And I then also used
Speaker:that as a leader. Now fast forward 25, 30
Speaker:years that I now have that responsibility.
Speaker:You know, at the end of the day, it could have been viewed, but I
Speaker:was just some kid that was from the wrong side of town, working cash in
Speaker:hand, cleaning tables. Not really that important
Speaker:potentially could have been the view. And I think it's so important
Speaker:nowadays that when we look at entry level roles, these are potentially the
Speaker:leaders of the future. I am telling you now, Jason had no idea that I
Speaker:was going to become the leader that I am now. He had absolutely no idea.
Speaker:He looked after me and mentored me just because that's a human that he was.
Speaker:And he had a responsibility for me and he just wanted to do his very
Speaker:best. And I take that now as a leader, and I take that responsibility
Speaker:seriously. You know, Leon, I had two and a half thousand people at one point,
Speaker:you know, and I. I took that on. Those two and a half thousand people
Speaker:were my responsibility. And I had to make sure that through the business,
Speaker:we did everything we could to emulate the experiences and improve
Speaker:on the experiences, you know, that we see in hospitality that are
Speaker:great, shining examples. We just wanted to be best in class. We just wanted to
Speaker:do right by people. And it isn't always that people have to stay in this
Speaker:industry. You know, there are people that use us. You know, they're studying to be
Speaker:doctors, and, you know, they have summer jobs with us. And that's a great thing
Speaker:for hospitality. You don't have to join hospitality forever. But also, that being
Speaker:said, I am on a massive campaign to have
Speaker:hospitality seen as a real industry and a real career
Speaker:where people can really make a difference. You know, that's why I love America. When
Speaker:we went over to America with Leon, what I loved was how serious hospitality
Speaker:was taken as a career and that kids in America would grow up saying, I
Speaker:want to be a supply chain director. You know, in this country, not so much.
Speaker:You know, kids don't turn around and be like, I want to be head of
Speaker:maintenance. It isn't necessarily something that is on their radar.
Speaker:And I just think hospitality is such an amazing place where you
Speaker:don't have to have an education. Absolutely. Having an education is amazing, but
Speaker:it. If you haven't got an education because of certain circumstances, it doesn't
Speaker:mean that you can't become somebody and work really, really hard. And that's
Speaker:where hospitality is great. If you work hard, if you learn and you pay
Speaker:attention and you will get back what you put in. And
Speaker:that's always my experience over all the brands that I've worked
Speaker:in and had the pleasure of being part of. Yeah, well,
Speaker:I mean, I think the thing about that is as well, is that you're kind
Speaker:of. You're almost a case in point to your own argument as well, in terms
Speaker:of you were actively trying to bunk off school, you were saying,
Speaker:so I. Hope my mum doesn't hear this because there's so much
Speaker:she still doesn't know. She doesn't realize she'd
Speaker:have a fit, honestly, that I was bunking off and going into London, honestly. So,
Speaker:yeah, there's still stuff that she doesn't know, but that is just the truth. I
Speaker:used to, yeah, bunk of school to go and dance twice a week and then
Speaker:I would go into school for three days. But I. This, and I might
Speaker:be way above my station to say this, but I think that in itself
Speaker:is a massively important message, because not every one of us is destined
Speaker:to be great in a school environment. Everybody's destined to go on
Speaker:and get a university degree or whatever that
Speaker:education might look like. And you could argue that actually the greatest education
Speaker:that exists is life experience in any case. So, you know,
Speaker:maybe there are things that you might have done differently, knowing what you know now,
Speaker:but maybe not, you know, it's just like. It's, in itself, should not
Speaker:be the barrier as to why somebody cannot aspire to be,
Speaker:you know, something. Yeah. And I think that's the point. If I had been in
Speaker:a situation that, you know, people say to me, other than obviously being an
Speaker:actress, if you couldn't be in hospitality, if hospitality didn't exist, what would you do?
Speaker:And I go, looking back now, I'd quite like to be a lawyer, you know,
Speaker:and maybe in another world I would have studied and gone into law, because I
Speaker:find that very interesting and done something like that. But, you know, I
Speaker:just think it's really important that you can change your stars.
Speaker:And that's what my mum grew up telling me. No matter where you are, you
Speaker:can change your stars. You are accountable for what happens in your life going
Speaker:forward. You know, people say when there's trauma in life, some people are like, ah,
Speaker:use that trauma to make you stronger. You shouldn't need to have trauma to make
Speaker:you stronger. I just want to make that clear. But also, some people are like,
Speaker:oh, is that trauma? You know, it will be with you forever and you'll never
Speaker:be able to move forward. And that also isn't true. So I. I think
Speaker:it's. The message has to be that you own your destiny and that
Speaker:you can change your future, and life is hard. Right. I sit here
Speaker:as the job title of CEO certainly
Speaker:doesn't make me any less human than any other person on the planet, and it
Speaker:certainly doesn't mean I've got all of the answers. It doesn't make me
Speaker:superhuman. It doesn't make me better than anyone. My goodness. Absolutely not. I am
Speaker:just a human. I'm a mum of two. I have a two year old and
Speaker:a four year old. I find life as tough as every other human.
Speaker:I feel the pinch points that every other human feels,
Speaker:so it doesn't make you immune. But I just think if you focus,
Speaker:have a long term vision, work hard, treat people how you want to
Speaker:be treated, it will all get rewarded back to you. And as I say, you
Speaker:can change your future. And that's where hospitality is amazing, because, yes, if you come
Speaker:from a background where you're not. I'm massively dyslexic. Massively dyslexic.
Speaker:And everyone has supported me on my journey, and I've learned to manage it, and
Speaker:I've learned some really great development and some great skills along the way. But where
Speaker:I am so dyslexic, like things like spelling? Like. Yeah, like, back in the day,
Speaker:a spelling test. I remember going to a job interview once and being given a
Speaker:spelling test. I just didn't make it through from that point because they gave me
Speaker:a spelling test, and I was like, I'm never gonna pass this. And I could
Speaker:have done the role. I was very competent. I just couldn't spell. So
Speaker:hospitality, you know, never given me a spelling test. They've never judged me.
Speaker:They've always worked with me and gone, right, okay, this is your learning type,
Speaker:and this is how we're gonna move forward. And it isn't. I'm obviously an extrovert.
Speaker:You may not be able to tell that, but I'm an extrovert. I hadn't picked
Speaker:that up, to be honest. But, you know, it isn't just
Speaker:extroverted people that have thespian backgrounds that can join
Speaker:hospitality, which I think is a little bit of a myth. You know, there are
Speaker:some amazing introverted people that are very analytical,
Speaker:very detailed, you know, and they're not just in the finance part of the business.
Speaker:You know, we've got some amazing bakers and there is a skill to baking, and
Speaker:it's really technical at points, you know, that are so
Speaker:technical and they love it. And they just sort of go into the kitchen and
Speaker:you see them in their, you know, in their element. And I'm just like, this
Speaker:is brilliant that so many different types of people can come into hospitality and find
Speaker:a home without question. Sorry, you caught me with a mouthful of coffee in
Speaker:my mouth there. Thankfully, it was in my mouth. Yeah, no, absolutely. No
Speaker:doubt. I mean, this is one of the joys, I think, of the industry is
Speaker:that. I think the perception sometimes is that, you know, you're either
Speaker:a waiter or you're a chef or you're a bartender, and that's pretty much it.
Speaker:But in actual fact, there's this whole raft of other stuff
Speaker:that, as you say, in this country, I just don't think is that well
Speaker:known. You know, like, literally you can think of any
Speaker:job in any sector that is. And that job probably pretty much exists in
Speaker:hospitality somewhere as well. Yeah, it's really true. Like, as you say,
Speaker:you have supply chain finance, food marketing strategy.
Speaker:It, like, it's a huge,
Speaker:huge part of our economy. I just don't understand why
Speaker:people don't put that together and go, oh, this is a, you know, this is
Speaker:a real career, this something. I think we're getting better. I had the privilege
Speaker:of giving a lecture to some students at Guildford University
Speaker:about a month ago, and they were incredible. Like, they are the future. And I
Speaker:was talking to them afterwards and a few of them have reached out and I
Speaker:look at it, I'm like, this is so amazing. And this is where it's brilliant
Speaker:that they're going to university and they're learning so much and they understand that also,
Speaker:you know, coming to do work experience and getting real life experience will
Speaker:just help, you know, hone their experience and their skill set. So
Speaker:that's really exciting as well. So that I think it's getting better. But, yeah, it
Speaker:just. It's just a shame that this country doesn't
Speaker:view our industry the way that
Speaker:some of us do. Yeah. Yet, yeah, we're on
Speaker:it. We are on it. And, like, there is some amazing. There's some
Speaker:amazing, you know, charities out there. Only a pavement
Speaker:away led by Greg Mannon, which I think is an amazing charity. And he called
Speaker:it only a pavement away, because we are all only a pavement away.
Speaker:And I think the older you get and the more wisdom you get, you realize
Speaker:that life is hard and external, things can happen and we are
Speaker:all only a pavement away. Especially from my upbringing, I very much feel that's
Speaker:relevant to me, that my life could have taken a very different turn. I could
Speaker:have been in a situation where I've made some bad choices that would have led
Speaker:me down a different road. So only a pavement away tackles
Speaker:homelessness. People that have been in the prison system, people that
Speaker:have been in the army, people that have suffered medical issues,
Speaker:breakdowns, strokes, anything like that, by getting people into
Speaker:hospitality and giving them a chance and giving them a chance to move
Speaker:on with their life. And I just think it's such a wonderful organization. And
Speaker:it isn't just only pavement away. There are several organisations that do the same thing
Speaker:of trying to make a positive difference. And I think that's what makes hospitality so
Speaker:special, is that everyone in the world has a relationship with food,
Speaker:right? Everybody. Everyone has a memory, be it a
Speaker:birthday or a wedding or a celebration or Eid
Speaker:or Christmas or Easter or whatever it may be.
Speaker:Everyone has a relationship with food and a memory with food. So you
Speaker:can make, you know, joyous occasions, you can bring happiness
Speaker:by food. And I think people being part of that, it is stressful at
Speaker:times. We all know hospitality can be quite stressful, but actually the swing to
Speaker:that is you get to see someone spend their 80th birthday with you
Speaker:and, you know, those photos are going to be around forever in that family and
Speaker:you were part of that and you created those memories. So it is something that's
Speaker:very, very special. So, although I say, you know, we don't save lives, and working
Speaker:with the NHS sort of really gave me an insight into another industry and another
Speaker:world. But we. What we do is important.
Speaker:I will still maintain that we said it during COVID We
Speaker:almost become the full emergency service in trying to get food to everybody, because what
Speaker:we do in our industry is very, very important to
Speaker:everybody. I had somebody, I think it was Eddie Tanous
Speaker:from Rotana hotels in the Middle east on the show, and
Speaker:he classified this as we might not save lives, but we definitely
Speaker:heal the experiences that we give people
Speaker:when they come into our businesses, whether it's, you know, they've just had a
Speaker:crappy day and what they're really craving is a world class cinnamon bun
Speaker:that has a healing quality to that person in that
Speaker:moment and or, you know, whether it's somebody who saved up
Speaker:half a year of wages so that they can have one night at the Dorchester
Speaker:or something like that. You know, these things have the power
Speaker:in such an under talked about way, I
Speaker:think it is. And it's in part of, as you say, in all of our
Speaker:lives and it's in different ways. And, yeah, it just makes it
Speaker:very, very special. And there isn't a person on the planet, as I say, that
Speaker:won't have a food memory. Yeah, absolutely. Anyway, I've gone all Billy
Speaker:Conley here and just gone like back to your story.
Speaker:We were still, I'm still unpacking your story. So we're still at TGi's.
Speaker:I want to talk about Jason. Not specifically Jason, but actually
Speaker:you said that you were quite a challenging employee. And I guess this
Speaker:is the secret, I suppose, to having
Speaker:mentors in your life. Right? Because I think the secret to a
Speaker:really great mentor is recognizing that actually what you really need in businesses are
Speaker:people who challenge you. But it's then about honing the way that
Speaker:they challenge. And it sounds like you maybe had that
Speaker:with Jason in your early days. Yeah,
Speaker:absolutely. I always, as I say, extrovert, always, you
Speaker:know, been outspoken. I've not been afraid to sort of stand up for something that
Speaker:I believe in. But, you know, obviously as a
Speaker:17, 1819 year old, you know, woman
Speaker:learning, you know, becoming an adult and being in an industry that
Speaker:I loved and I was in a brand that I loved, you feel that ownership,
Speaker:you feel that you have a right to have a say on everything and
Speaker:absolutely probably at times didn't deliver my opinion in the best possible
Speaker:way. And Jason would always take the time to say, your point is probably
Speaker:correct, but your delivery was shocking. So you've lost the point. So let's have a
Speaker:talk about that. And then also he would always take the time to understand because
Speaker:obviously from my point of view, so when I was, you know,
Speaker:a busser, I couldn't understand why X, Y and Z have been put into place.
Speaker:What I hadn't realized was the operational side of the business and how wider
Speaker:business works. And Jason, rather than saying, that's just the way it is, Shereen, we're
Speaker:putting this process in, it's just the way it is, he would explain to me
Speaker:and he would say, look, Sherene, this has got a p and l implication. I
Speaker:remember him explaining to me like, what a profit and lost, you know, what it
Speaker:meant and how it would run through. So I remember being 18 years old and
Speaker:I knew, I understood how a p and l of a business roughly works because
Speaker:he would talk through. He would talk it through with me and why, the decisions
Speaker:he would make. So I think he always gave me the why. And I think
Speaker:that's probably the biggest learning that I ever took from Jason, is that I always
Speaker:try and give people the why because it's important for them to know, and it's
Speaker:important for them to understand, because one day they're going to be the leaders, and
Speaker:then they need to pass that knowledge down. And the more knowledge you have, the
Speaker:more you understand the workings of a business. You know, a hospitality
Speaker:business appears sometimes from the outside to be quite easy.
Speaker:You know, there are tv shows on this, right, where people have potentially come from
Speaker:different, you know, industries and opened up a restaurant or opened up a bar, and
Speaker:then they've met challenges, because it isn't as easy as it sometimes looks from
Speaker:the outside to run a hot business. And Jason would always explain that in
Speaker:a really great way. And as I say, as a teenager, and I was a
Speaker:teenager, you know, at the time, trying to set the world on fire
Speaker:and put my mark and be like, no, you can't do this. This isn't fair.
Speaker:This isn't right. And Jason's like, calm down. This is this.
Speaker:And then obviously, things that mattered to me
Speaker:didn't matter, really, to the business. What section I got as a waitress. I don't
Speaker:want that section. I want this section. Why is it this person always gets that
Speaker:section? It's not fair. But to me, it matters. And he never, ever
Speaker:discounted that. He never turned around and said, oh, shereen, just have whatever section you've
Speaker:got. He would always be like, right, okay, what process can I put in place
Speaker:to make sure everyone feels it's fair, everyone gets a shot. Do we need a
Speaker:certification? You know, on certain areas? And he always looked at it very
Speaker:pragmatically and very process led and took emotion out of it, and I was
Speaker:very emotional. So that's why I think why it worked, because he would just
Speaker:say, remove your emotions, Shireen, and let's look at this logically. So.
Speaker:And it wasn't just Jason. There were lots of amazing leaders in TGIs that
Speaker:all works the same way as Jason. And it wasn't just Jason.
Speaker:But as I say, Jason is just the one that got stuck with me.
Speaker:Yeah, but I think that, I mean, that demonstrates real leadership, though, doesn't
Speaker:it? Because the last thing you need when you're in your formative career years is
Speaker:somebody just to say, the reason why we do this is because I
Speaker:said so. That's the thing that switches you off, right?
Speaker:Especially if you're one who likes to challenge and understand.
Speaker:And this is the thing for me, is that it could be that time
Speaker:in somebody's career is so critical in terms of whether
Speaker:we keep them as potentially amazing employees or amazing people
Speaker:that can go on to do amazing things in the industry and beyond, or whether
Speaker:they get disillusioned quickly and go, well, this is, they just mark the
Speaker:industry then with the same brush and go, this is not for me,
Speaker:it's so critical in terms of how we move things forward. Yeah,
Speaker:as you say, it really is. And I think especially now, I mean, I look
Speaker:at, when I was a teenager, I look at teenagers nowadays and there's
Speaker:so much more clued up in some ways, and they want to know
Speaker:more and they want to progress quicker and they want a development plan and they
Speaker:want to know. And I'm sure I look back and there are things, you know,
Speaker:that could have been better. You know, that I'm not saying that TGI's is perfect,
Speaker:but it was a brilliant base. And as I say nowadays,
Speaker:it's just so important that we take in all of
Speaker:these, you know, the next generation and show them what we can be and show
Speaker:them our best version. Now, you don't see your best version all the time. Everyone
Speaker:makes mistakes. Everyone drops the ball in every single business.
Speaker:But all you can do is, you know, just do your best to be a
Speaker:better version of yourself. Put processes in place and focus on people and
Speaker:culture. You know, people are the most important thing in our industry. Without
Speaker:people, it doesn't work. And that really has to be what drives
Speaker:everything. And a lot of it isn't a, it isn't rocket science.
Speaker:You know, look after people, ask the team members what they want. Don't assume.
Speaker:Someone said to me the other day in an interview, they were like, oh, what?
Speaker:What do your team like? What you putting in for your team? And I was
Speaker:like, well, I'm asking them what they want because I don't know what a 20
Speaker:year old wants. I'd love to think that I'm young and trendy. I'm absolutely not.
Speaker:Very much not. I try and work Instagram every day and realize I'm not young
Speaker:and trendy. How do stories even work?
Speaker:I had to message my market manager and I strategically, I
Speaker:know what we want to put out and I know how we should do it,
Speaker:but how it physically works. And when I'm going on to try and look at
Speaker:stuff and I'm like, can you just send it to me on WhatsApp, please, because
Speaker:WhatsApp I'm good with brilliant. Yeah.
Speaker:I suppose this is also what becoming a CEO actually becomes as well.
Speaker:It's not about you knowing how to do everything. It's about having people
Speaker:around you who really know what they're doing and then getting the best out of
Speaker:them. Oh, God. Absolutely. My biggest advice to
Speaker:anyone that is a leader in any sense, is employ people that
Speaker:are smarter than you. Absolutely. And realize and allow people the
Speaker:autonomy to have their superpowers. For
Speaker:instance, my people director, Claire Kennedy has the most amazing people
Speaker:superpower. I don't interfere. I nudge and guide when I need to. That's what I'm
Speaker:here to do. But she's awesome. Stuart, my finance director,
Speaker:absolutely incredible. Like, go do what you do. It's your superpower. That's
Speaker:why you're here, because, you know, I can't do what you do. And I think
Speaker:it's okay to say that out loud. I think that's probably one of my biggest
Speaker:learnings in life, is growing up at my entry level
Speaker:leader stage. I always wanted. I thought that
Speaker:being a good leader meant knowing everything and having all the answers. So
Speaker:you see leaders, and I was one of those leaders at the very beginning stages.
Speaker:I would probably almost shout people down and be like, yeah, that's good, but. But
Speaker:this is what we're going to do. Not because I didn't want to listen to
Speaker:them, because I thought being a good leader meant that, you know,
Speaker:everything and that you have all the best ideas. And that's what makes me great
Speaker:when actually very much it's the opposite. Being a good leader is
Speaker:letting everyone else have the good ideas, leading and supporting and just nudging and
Speaker:guiding. And you don't need to be the person with all the superpowers because that
Speaker:is impossible. You need to have the team that have all the superpowers and
Speaker:you need to support and nurture them. So that was obviously probably my biggest
Speaker:learning, which I think most leaders would say it tends to
Speaker:be. It's how humans sort of work. That tends to be the leadership cycle.
Speaker:When you go into leadership, it's human nature to sort of want to know everything
Speaker:and, you know, this is what I can do. But, yeah, that's probably one of
Speaker:my biggest learnings. And that. And thinking I was
Speaker:indispensable. Another learning. When I was younger, I remember thinking
Speaker:in certain roles, potentially or in certain businesses, it will never
Speaker:function without me. I'm indispensable. No one could ever replace me in
Speaker:what I do. And then, like, you leave, or you leave a site and you
Speaker:move somewhere else and you're like, it all crashed down. Not that you want it
Speaker:to, not in that way, but, you know, I. Know what you mean. You know
Speaker:that you're indispensable. And then you look and it's like, oh, they've just had a
Speaker:record week. They're not. I'm not indispensable. I'm not indispensable at all.
Speaker:No one is indispensable. Not any person. And the higher up the chain you get,
Speaker:the less. In some ways, the less. I always say in the business, I am
Speaker:the least important person in buns from home. If you took me out of buns
Speaker:from home, it would run. It run. You know, if you took out the directorship,
Speaker:the senior leadership team, it would run. If you took out all of the
Speaker:bakers, it would stop immediately. Yeah, yeah. If you took
Speaker:out casual dining, all of the waiters and waitresses, it would stop
Speaker:immediately. So it really is understanding who the important people are in the
Speaker:business and who make the business. Yeah. I had somebody just the other day actually
Speaker:classify. When you become a CEO, leader or whatever, actually your
Speaker:job is, is about working towards making yourself
Speaker:redundant. And I thought that's quite, that's an interesting perspective,
Speaker:but I kind of get it. Like, it's about, as you've just said,
Speaker:like, if you, and, you know, I don't know whether you're happy for us to
Speaker:air all of this in public, but you take yourself out of that business right
Speaker:now and it would carry. It would carry on in some form.
Speaker:Now, there's obviously things that you've got your head in day to day that
Speaker:would be affected by that. And that's, you know, that's probably a lot around
Speaker:future strategy and things like that. But I quite liked, I quite liked
Speaker:the concept of actually leadership should be about working towards making yourself
Speaker:redundant. And that's what I think the best leader is. I
Speaker:think any leader, if you go on holiday, and that's always how I think people
Speaker:should judge. If you go on holiday and the world falls down, it doesn't mean
Speaker:that you, oh, look how important, how indispensable I am. It means you haven't done
Speaker:a good job. It means you need to work on, you
Speaker:know, putting process in place, putting team or training or
Speaker:something. So that doesn't happen. If I go on holiday for two weeks, unless
Speaker:there was something out of the ordinary that happened, the business should just run absolutely
Speaker:fine. And of course I'll be on the phone, but that should run absolutely fine.
Speaker:And yes, you know, as a CEO and a leader, you know, my job to
Speaker:deliver for the ball is obviously the finances and then it's a strategy and it's
Speaker:things like allowing the team and freeing up the time to be able to focus
Speaker:on sustainability or to be able to focus on giving back. And you know,
Speaker:when my people director says to me, right, I want every single team member to
Speaker:be able to have a paid day, to go and work for a charity and
Speaker:do some voluntary work that I make that, you know, and I facilitate that with
Speaker:the board and that that can happen. That's what I'm there to do. I, you
Speaker:know, the team are there to, they run the day to
Speaker:day, you know, they, they are absolutely qualified and skilled and that's the way it
Speaker:should be. Employ people that are smarter than you. Yeah,
Speaker:absolutely. Right. Back to your story again, TGI Fridays for ten years,
Speaker:just very quickly skirt over the roles that you, how
Speaker:you developed in that ten years. What were the roles that you had? Oh
Speaker:crikey. So I did, I think every single role in
Speaker:TGI Fridays it feels like. So I did,
Speaker:oh, I did bussing, hosting expo
Speaker:kitchen, pot wash bar management,
Speaker:NSo manager, NSO trainer. Yeah, I think
Speaker:that was it. Got you. And so what was it then? Because it was at
Speaker:that point, wasn't it, that you then moved over into PR? So
Speaker:yeah, I went and worked in PR, I'd been in TGI Fridays, I took a
Speaker:sabbatical, I went to Australia for a little while. I did take a sabbatical within
Speaker:that ten years when I was around 21. But I've been at TGI Fridays for.
Speaker:Ten years, as everybody should, by the way, because
Speaker:I did the same, I did it at 23. I think
Speaker:the greatest experience, I was amazing. I went to Australia for a year, I got
Speaker:working visa, I went straight back into TJ Fridays, I think three days after
Speaker:I returned to the UK. They were amazing, they supported me, they were like, yay,
Speaker:go do it. This was before, like, you didn't have Facebook and that at the
Speaker:time I'm very old, so you didn't have Facebook and that at the time. So
Speaker:I remember I used to ring once a month the store on a Saturday morning
Speaker:and speak to whoever was there and they always knew like on the first Saturday
Speaker:of every month I would ring them and yes, I went back to Lakeside
Speaker:where I'd started my journey after my time in
Speaker:Australia, after ten years, it was time for me to
Speaker:leave and it's okay to say that if I'd stayed at
Speaker:TGI's, I certainly wouldn't be a CEO right now. I'd learn a lot
Speaker:there. I have a lot to thank them for. But I was ready to leave
Speaker:and it was time for me to see and expand my
Speaker:growth elsewhere. So I'd always liked the idea of PR. So I went and
Speaker:worked for a PR company called Street Printhead and
Speaker:I at the time still had some contacts, so we were doing some stuff with.
Speaker:There was a tv show called so you think you could dance and it was
Speaker:a Saturday night tv show, like an X Factor style tv show. I remember
Speaker:it, yeah. So I've got them
Speaker:the big contract to do like the pr for the, for the, for
Speaker:the show. And on the back of it they sold company. So I sort of
Speaker:did myself out of a job by getting that contract. But I
Speaker:worked there, I think it was around a year, and that was great, seeing a
Speaker:marketing side of the business and the PR side of the business. And I didn't
Speaker:actually realize that the stuff that I was doing with Street PR
Speaker:I've really used in later life, especially in
Speaker:places like Leon, when leading the marketing team and working
Speaker:out strategies and stuff, I would always sort of go back to stuff there.
Speaker:So that sort of set me up with a good base of marketing and
Speaker:branding understanding. And then from there I
Speaker:went and worked for London Underground and I was a contract
Speaker:director and I specialized in lift and escalator safety. So I've
Speaker:got. Of course, I mean, it was the next natural step, wasn't it? That clearly
Speaker:is your next step. Yeah. I had the opportunity of someone that
Speaker:I knew actually through hospitality that had then gone and worked in the
Speaker:plumbing side to become a plumber and was working as a plumber for tube lines.
Speaker:And then they said, look, why don't you come over? So I went and worked
Speaker:for tube lines and I loved it. I worked nights. I was, you know,
Speaker:hard hat, rigger, boots, full PPE. We would start
Speaker:at like midnight, I'd finish at six in the morning. But I loved it. And
Speaker:I was surrounded by big burly workmen that were
Speaker:incredible, very different people to what I've been used to working with. But again, I
Speaker:learned so much off of them, not just in technical skills. So I'm a little
Speaker:bit handy when it comes to maintenance. So I learned that
Speaker:which has actually, again, been useful when it comes to, especially when energy costs
Speaker:have gone up and, you know, to be able to understand how wattage and ampage
Speaker:works when you're looking at restaurants, especially in
Speaker:Leon, when we were looking at, you know, what does an oven pour? What does
Speaker:a microwave pour, and how does that equate on the bottom line and even down
Speaker:to when you're building, you know, understanding how circuits work and how
Speaker:much, you know, you don't want to overload capacity. So again, it's all been part
Speaker:of my journey. So I spent four years, about four years,
Speaker:three, four years doing that. And I was at Heathrow. I did the Heathrow
Speaker:123 tube station refurbishment. And then when
Speaker:that finished, I was offered to go. Yeah, I think it was all gate. I
Speaker:was off to go to Aldgate or to another station, and they were like, do
Speaker:you want to. Do you want to move over? And I was like, no, no.
Speaker:I've sort of looked around now. I've got some experience. I've got some
Speaker:life experience. Hospitality. It was always hospitality. It always was
Speaker:hospitality. So I then went and joined La Saguanas while
Speaker:Erin was still the founder. Erin was. Was in place, and it
Speaker:was. It was an amazing journey. So, Latin America, I got to. Travelled to
Speaker:Rio again. The culture of La Sagranas was unreal. There were some
Speaker:amazing, amazing people that I'm still very, very good
Speaker:friends with. And, yeah, had a real journey. I was
Speaker:there when the sale happened to CDG. So that was my first exposure to a
Speaker:big transaction, understanding how a transaction
Speaker:impacts the business short term and long term. So, again, that was great learning.
Speaker:And I left 18 months after the transaction to
Speaker:CDG, and then I went to Leon. Indeed,
Speaker:yes. Which is probably about the time that I became aware
Speaker:of you. And especially, I suppose, in the midst of, there was a lot more
Speaker:people I became aware of in that time because obviously, that coincided with COVID as
Speaker:well. So as my day job being a recruiter, you know,
Speaker:we didn't have any work going on. So it
Speaker:was literally, that's why this podcast was started. But I. But
Speaker:seeing all of the amazing work and you guys were front and center and a
Speaker:lot of good stuff that was happening around that time and that coincided
Speaker:with your tenure there as well. I started in Lyon, actually, in
Speaker:2017, so I started in 2017, and we were
Speaker:struggling, struggling, but the P and l wasn't where we wanted it to
Speaker:be. And I joined in the May and we were a
Speaker:negative, like, for likes, and things weren't going in the direction that we hoped to.
Speaker:We made some very quick changes. There's some amazing team there. And then
Speaker:by. By September of 2017, we sort of swung the light for
Speaker:likes and then 2018, 2019 were two record
Speaker:years. We had done pop ups. We had done sub
Speaker:brands, cookbooks. We'd gone into, as I say, gone into
Speaker:Sainsbury's. We had done a huge amount. We were. Then we
Speaker:just got some investment just before COVID hit, and we were gonna get two more
Speaker:franchise partners. We had America with five sites in America at that point,
Speaker:we were going to open more american sites and we were going to open 25
Speaker:more owned sites within the UK. So we had big plans for
Speaker:2020. And then obviously in February, there is. Oh, there's a virus. And we're
Speaker:like, ah, it'll be nothing. Don't worry. Keep going. Yeah. And obviously it wasn't
Speaker:nothing. And then. Yeah, Leon, very much. And that's where John's
Speaker:superpower, our founder, John Vincent, his superpower absolutely kicked
Speaker:in. And obviously he has a huge network, huge connections, and then suddenly
Speaker:we are. I've never worked as hard. I've always worked very, very hard, but I've
Speaker:never worked as hard as when Covid hit. Whereas a lot of people I know
Speaker:were like, right, okay, furlough or, you know,
Speaker:start podcasts. Yeah. Look at
Speaker:how the industry. And I think, you know, the industry, I speak about it now.
Speaker:The community that was created, again, looking at rainbows that come out of
Speaker:COVID the community that was created through Covid,
Speaker:like, it was unreal. I think our industry, in some ways is better
Speaker:for it. Like, I can ring up an OD or a CEO of a brand
Speaker:and ask questions and talk to them in a way that I never would have
Speaker:done beforehand. I think everyone lowered their guard. Everyone sort of just
Speaker:pulled together and says, right, we win together or we lose together, right? This now
Speaker:isn't a competitor advantage. Covid is not a competitor advantage here. We need
Speaker:to work together to all get through this. And everyone instinctively was
Speaker:able to do that. Overnight. Overnight, everyone just went, right.
Speaker:Yes, we're all on the same page. Let's hold hands, let's pull together.
Speaker:Let's all get through this absolute disaster, you know, of
Speaker:a situation. And that's what we did. Yeah, no doubt, no
Speaker:doubt. And in that time as well, before we turned the microphone
Speaker:on, there was a story you were telling me, which tears covered my eyes, so
Speaker:we have to go there. But
Speaker:we were actually talking about one of the other byproducts of that is
Speaker:that. Look at us having this chat today, virtually. That is kind of
Speaker:now the way that business is done, it's not always a case of having to
Speaker:be in the same room with somebody it doesn't stop stuff getting done. And
Speaker:it's just now the accepted norm that that is part and parcel of what we
Speaker:do. And we were talking about that poor chap who was on the BBC News
Speaker:that time and his child walks in in the background and
Speaker:the roller. And then the nanny comes in, or his wife. Yeah. And
Speaker:everybody's like, ha ha ha. That's hilarious. That's the sort of thing
Speaker:that never happens. And now it's the sort of thing that just happens. And you've
Speaker:got your own version of that story, I believe. I do. I do have my
Speaker:own version. So earlier on into Covid, there was quite an important
Speaker:culprit in people from government was on it, Matt Lucas was on
Speaker:it, Helen McCrory. Does that look as important?
Speaker:Oh, no, not important. But it was. It was an important call that
Speaker:everyone was briefed on as government and it was a really
Speaker:important subject. It was about how are we going to raise money to feed the
Speaker:NHS? How are we going to make a difference? Because we're in a situation that
Speaker:people in the world, you know, in the country, can't get food. Food is rotting
Speaker:in other places. We've got restaurants all over the country with
Speaker:fridges full. How can we. How can we put this all together?
Speaker:And, you know, the public will want to help as well. How can we raise
Speaker:money? So it was a really important call and everyone had been briefed and everyone
Speaker:in. Leon was briefed and when it was your time to talk, someone from government
Speaker:had gone just before me. And as it was about to be my time to
Speaker:talk, my son at the time had just turned two. Well, no, he hadn't
Speaker:even two yet, but anyway, we were potty training him and he walked
Speaker:in and he pulled his pants down and he. We'd all over my feet.
Speaker:So the camera's on me. I'm now sat where I am now, trying to have
Speaker:this conversation and my son is just doing the longest known to man.
Speaker:We all over, me and I, four. Cups of coffee that
Speaker:morning. So, yeah, I am game facing, so I'm trying to go through
Speaker:and what I'm actually thinking is, please don't cry, don't cry. And then he
Speaker:sits in it and he's splashing the wee. So he's like, it's like this big
Speaker:wee puddle that he's splashing and he's rubbing it into my legs, he's
Speaker:rubbing it into the table and I'm like, just keep going,
Speaker:Shereen, just keep going, don't engage, just keep talking about
Speaker:what you're talking and just get through. So, yeah, that was. That was something
Speaker:that I remember. Horrified at the time, but, yeah, I
Speaker:can't be the only person, right, that has those stories, because I won't be.
Speaker:No. I mean, not on the same league. But we have a dog. And
Speaker:usually, as I learn very early on, if I have. If I'm
Speaker:talking to somebody, that's the time there. She loves to come and say hello, and
Speaker:she'll just start whining down there, and I've got a, you know, stroker and all
Speaker:that. So now we can shut the door on her. So she never comes in.
Speaker:She hasn't weed on my feet, though, so you win.
Speaker:Normally, my kids run in. I was half expecting them to run in with my
Speaker:boys at school, but I was half expecting my little girl to come running in.
Speaker:Everything is pepper, so. Screaming pepper at you, Phil. But that hasn't happened yet. So,
Speaker:yeah, blessed. Yes. There's another story, actually, and I don't know when this
Speaker:happened. At the Katiesen.
Speaker:At the Katies. So, yeah, I've been fortunate enough to be invited to the
Speaker:Katies three times. And on this occasion, I had been
Speaker:invited to the Katies by Chris Brazier, an amazing human that
Speaker:runs amazing events and casual dining awards. But I'd been very, very fortunate. I'd
Speaker:been invited. So sat down at the table, and we're right by the stage. So
Speaker:it's huge, beautiful dining room, massive chandeliers, black tie event. And
Speaker:I'm sat right at the front. So I'm like, oh, my God, I'm right at
Speaker:the front. This is amazing. Sat down. You know, some people from the industry. So
Speaker:this was a few years ago now. This was just before COVID This was the
Speaker:case before COVID So I think it was. Or it was first cases
Speaker:after coach, I can't remember. But anyways, a few years ago now, sat down, and
Speaker:I'm sat next to a lady and I'm like, oh, I know you. We
Speaker:work together at TGI Fridays. You was in accounts. You like, you're
Speaker:amazing. So I'm chatting away. I'm like, how's your family? You've got two kids of
Speaker:you. How are your kids? We're having the dinner, and she's a talking
Speaker:to me, and she's telling me a little bit about her family. And then, obviously,
Speaker:the table's having discussion around the industry in the evening and very generic
Speaker:conversations, and we're all getting on fabulously. And I'm drinking more and more, and it's
Speaker:a fabulous evening. And then at the very end, that's the awards is going, we're
Speaker:all clapping, we're all talking about how wonderful everyone is. And every now and then
Speaker:I'm making a reference to TJ Fridays and, you know, where we've all sort
Speaker:of come from. And then the gentleman that's hosting it gets on stage and he
Speaker:goes, right, and the big award of the evening is the lifetime achievement award,
Speaker:because now I just want a massive. And he does this big piece on who's
Speaker:won the lifetime achievement award. And I'm like, oh my God, who is it? This
Speaker:is like the most incredible human. What amazing things they've accomplished. And
Speaker:he goes, can everyone welcome up Angela Hartnett to the stage? So everyone's
Speaker:clapping, I'm clapping. And then the lady sat next to me, stands up and walks
Speaker:on stage. Because it wasn't Sandra from accounts, it was Angela
Speaker:Hartnett. And that's why I recognized her, because she had sat next to me
Speaker:the whole dinner. The whole dinner. And I was
Speaker:doing. I was horrified. I was like,
Speaker:oh, my God. But absolutely. How amazing that she embraced me and
Speaker:wasn't rude to me. And I vaguely remember later on that night, Gary Usher coming
Speaker:up to me going, yeah, that's Angela Hartnett. Me going, yeah, yeah,
Speaker:I realize that now. Now I understand how I
Speaker:recognized her. Horrified, Phil.
Speaker:Brilliant, brilliant. But, you know, this is the. There's so much humour comes
Speaker:out with moments of vulnerability, right? That's the thing that we. And we should
Speaker:embrace that because I just think humour is the greatest tonic for life,
Speaker:especially in the face of adversity. Oh, absolutely. You've got
Speaker:to be able to laugh. Like I say to my team now, as I say,
Speaker:we're growing rapidly. It creates some stress, right? Even though it's a simplistic model, it
Speaker:creates stress. And I say to them, guys, don't sweat it. You've got to enjoy
Speaker:the ride, right? There are things that we're worrying about today you won't even remember.
Speaker:Just enjoy the ride. If it isn't a big deal, don't worry about it. You
Speaker:know, there's buttons and coffee. We're going to get there, we're going to open. Any
Speaker:problems will work out together. Like, don't worry about it, just enjoy the ride. I
Speaker:think that's probably the biggest bit of advice I've ever been given. I went through
Speaker:a stage of my career of so focused on what comes next and where do
Speaker:I go next and what is a smart move for my career and I need
Speaker:to get a mentor and I need to learn this and I need to. Someone
Speaker:says, look, that's great, but don't forget to enjoy the moment that you're in
Speaker:and enjoy the time that you're in. Don't wish it away, because the older you
Speaker:get, the faster it goes. And it's so true. Right? The older you get, the
Speaker:faster it goes. God, isn't that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What's
Speaker:that? I said a saying on another podcast once upon a time, which
Speaker:was that the journey is more interesting than the destination. But then
Speaker:I had to caveat that with, unless you're on, like, a long haul flight, right?
Speaker:Because that's. The journey's a bit crap at that point,
Speaker:but no, that's wicked. Look, I feel like I could sit and talk
Speaker:to you forever because, one, I'm just a big admirer of your career
Speaker:and how you lead and. And all of these things, and I'll perhaps get
Speaker:you back on, because I think one of the things that you talked about was
Speaker:that you could deliver a masterclass in leading by inspiration.
Speaker:And I think that's very, very clear in the energy that you bring to what
Speaker:you do. It's out there for everybody to see, and
Speaker:who wouldn't want to get behind that? I mean, you know, even from the outside
Speaker:looking in, I'm a massive fan. Oh, well, thank you so much. And as
Speaker:I say, for the brand, it's the team. And, yeah, for me, I think
Speaker:I'm. Now, I said it a little while ago for International Women's Day. You
Speaker:know, I am not always everyone's cup of tea. I'm aware of that. I'm
Speaker:absolutely fine. But I made more out of my life by being marmite than I
Speaker:ever did by being jam. So embrace yourself. Embrace everything about
Speaker:you. Be a decent human, right? Have good morals
Speaker:and just try hard. And that's all you can do as a human. Just be
Speaker:kind. Hey, hey. Yep, that's the one right there.
Speaker:I actually nearly signed off without talking about Ed Sheeran. Ed
Speaker:Sheeran. Oh, we love Ed. Thanks, Ed. Honestly, Ed, you
Speaker:love you. I mean, how amazing. I've had about 20 people
Speaker:message me. So for anyone that doesn't know, there is a
Speaker:site called Top Jaw. It's all over Instagram where they ask people to
Speaker:rate their favorite different areas, favorite places to eat, favourite
Speaker:bakeries, and also most overrated. Now, we
Speaker:had been called out once or twice as overrated. Unfortunately, we
Speaker:work very hard, so that isn't the case. But when Ed Sheeran was on top
Speaker:jar and he got asked what was his favourite bakery? He was like, buns from
Speaker:home. They're amazing. And the presenter said, actually, I'm really pleased you said that, because
Speaker:they get a little bit of heat over overrated. And Ed was very kind in
Speaker:the sense of saying, oh, look, sometimes people just want to hate on those
Speaker:that are doing well. And, yeah, he bigged us up and. We'Re very
Speaker:grateful for him. He also didn't just use words.
Speaker:He didn't just use words. He gestures as well. He gestured
Speaker:as well and was very supportive of funds from home.
Speaker:And Ed, we absolutely adore you. We've dropped funds to his team
Speaker:at Bertie's. And I'm like, reach out to Ed. Let's do something
Speaker:with him because. Yeah, yeah. He's just awesome, right? He's just a nice guy.
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely. I mean, to get him on this podcast because he's getting involved in
Speaker:hospitality stuff. So, Ed, gearing on the podcast. Absolutely. Do you
Speaker:hear that, Ed? If you listen, I listen to you often enough. It's
Speaker:time you came and listened to me.
Speaker:Brilliant. Shereen, thank you so much for your time. I know that you're busy beyond
Speaker:words, but, yeah, that massive, massive power in your story and
Speaker:wish you guys all the very best in the next chapter. It sounds like it's
Speaker:super exciting. No, and thank you, honestly, I'm so humble. Thank you so
Speaker:much for wanting to speak to me. Yeah, thank you. You're
Speaker:very welcome. Have a good one. Cheers. You too.
