In this Episode we are talking to the lovely Lucy King from Gelar Property.

Lucy and I delve into inspiring discussions featuring Lucy King, a seasoned surveyor excelling in a typically male-dominated industry.

We emphasise the balance between business life and self-care.

Learn about overcoming challenges, importance of mentorship, managing that wonderful 'work-life' balance, and fostering personal well-being for success and happiness.

We also chat about donoughts!

You can find the lovely Lucy at the following places:

LinkedIn: (2) Lucy King | LinkedIn

Website: Home | Gelar Property | Commercial Property Advice and Services

You can keep up to date with the host Helen here:

https://linktr.ee/Helencorsicadmore

Liked this episode? Remember to subscribe and leave a review! Or if you want to be a guest then contact me at hello@helencorsicadmore.com

Thank you,

Hels x

Hello and welcome to another

episode of Fabless and Female.

2

Today, I am delighted to be joined

by the lovely, lovely Lucy King.

3

Lucy and I,, met by chance at

a networking event, um, going

4

back now about 18 months ago.

5

And I really wanted to get Lucy onto

the podcast because Lucy is a qualified

6

chartered surveyor with over 20

years commercial property experience.

7

Lucy is also the owner and founder

of property consultancy Gellar

8

Property and also the co owner of

Borkham Property Compliance, both of

9

which are in their scale up stages

of growth, which is super exciting.

10

Lucy is fortunate to be enough to

have worked in both the private

11

practice and client side for a

number of corporate entities across

12

the UK, including more recently

the well known brand Halfords PLC.

13

And in her guise, Lucy is now proud

to be working for some big blue chip

14

occupier clients, including the Scoffs

Group, which if you've never heard

15

of them, is one of Costa Coffee's

largest franchisee, Linnaeus Veterinary

16

Group, owned by Mars Pack Care.

17

Helping Hands Home Care and Pure

Electric, just to name a few.

18

When she's not busy running the two

businesses, she can be found out

19

riding the family's horses with her

two tweenage girls, Ellen and Georgie,

20

or walking the family dog, um, with

her very patient husband, Rich.

21

So lovely to have you, welcome,

and welcome to Pockets Lucy.

22

Thank you very much, Helen.

23

Thank you very much for having me.

24

I am a podcast virgin.

25

So yeah, I'll get it out there now

whilst we're talking now at the start.

26

Well, I wanted to have you on

because I've never had anybody that's

27

really worked in property before.

28

And I think it's really important to

have a broad range of people on the

29

podcast, but also your industry, from

my opinion, is very male dominated.

30

And I thought, do you know what?

31

Lucy has done plenty

amazing in her role so far.

32

And then when I said like 20 years

experience, I'm like, oh my god,

33

that just shows like my age as well.

34

We're similar in age, aren't we?

35

I think.

36

Um, yeah.

37

So, before we get into more about

your, um, your professional side

38

of, of your life, I'm going to ask

you a couple of quickfire questions.

39

I've only just started doing

this and I actually love it.

40

It's a lot easier.

41

Okay, cool.

42

I'm ready.

43

You're ready.

44

You're like hit me up with it.

45

Okay.

46

So first things first.

47

Dark or milk chocolate?

48

Oh, see milk chocolate is, I

love, but it's really bad for you.

49

It's got so much sugar in and Rich

has been trying to get me to eat more

50

dark chocolate because otherwise,

you know, you know, when you open a

51

bar at Cowbray, you're like, Breeze.

52

Chocolate . Yeah.

53

Gone within like a second.

54

Exactly.

55

Whereas you open something like the

green and Blacks, which is a bit

56

more expensive, but you can actually

savor it and you can have a couple

57

more pieces rather than it all go.

58

So it means that when you go in

the cupboard the next day, it'll

59

still be there rather than you

decimating a bar of Cadburys.

60

So, right.

61

So go on.

62

My heart says milk, my head says mush.

63

Now, once you start to love dark

chocolate like I do, it doesn't stay

64

in the cupboard for the next day.

65

It is literally gone.

66

It is literally gone.

67

Bam.

68

Right.

69

Yeah.

70

No.

71

Okay, so we've gone the chocolate.

72

Right, now, this will be a test.

73

Salt and vinegar crisps

or cheese and onion.

74

Okay.

75

Oh, see, I like both.

76

Yeah, I don't know.

77

I've got a favorite.

78

I think they're on an equal playing field.

79

I, I could, yeah.

80

If you chuck smoky bacon in,

then they would adapt it to

81

be my favorite every time.

82

I would never chuck smoky bacon in, ever.

83

It would be like the bottom of the pile.

84

Corn cocktail can do one, but

smoky bacon, yeah, I love it.

85

Oh, okay.

86

Yeah, equal playing field.

87

Equal playing.

88

All right then.

89

Um, Beach, snow.

90

Oh, they, again, these are really

hard because as you know, I love

91

my ski holiday and every year

I love my beach holiday too.

92

But we had this debate when we were away

skiing actually, my husband and I, and

93

I, I think for me, As much as I love

skiing, I think it would be the beach.

94

Yeah, good.

95

Bit of sun, not too much, you know,

with wind protection, good for

96

your, you know, Especially with the

weather over here, is it isn't it?

97

It's so much.

98

So yeah, I'd say as much as I absolutely

cannot miss a ski holiday, to me,

99

the beach and that bit of sunshine.

100

Yeah, I think, do you know what?

101

It's interesting, Mike, because I reckon

if we lived in a, a warmer country or we

102

had our definite seasons and they didn't

just last for like months and months and

103

months and months of rain we'd probably

be more like yeah let's go you know skiing

104

but actually because we don't get it

yeah it's like oh anyway okay last one

105

tea or coffee Oh, I can't drink coffee.

106

So my tea is absolutely, there we are.

107

That's a dead sit.

108

I wish having run two businesses and with

two small children, I could drink coffee.

109

But yeah, tea, tea, tea, tea, tea.

110

Yeah, half, half a cup, half a

teaspoon of sugar, not half a cup.

111

Half a cup?

112

What's the point?

113

What's the point?

114

Oh, half a cup of sugar?

115

Yeah, you'd be flying.

116

You wouldn't need the coffee.

117

Exactly.

118

So no, half, half a teaspoon of

sugar, a little drop of milk.

119

It's got to be absolutely

skimmed milk, nothing else.

120

So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

121

There we go.

122

Right.

123

Isn't this interesting?

124

So I'm sure the audience will already

know a little bit more about Lucy.

125

She can't make a decision.

126

And she nearly likes half a cup of sugar.

127

Anyway, right, that's so interesting.

128

Okay, let's go back to what

the podcast is all about.

129

So business, balance and burnout.

130

So let's take a step back.

131

So when I introduced you, um, with

your professional bio, what I'd

132

love to know is what really inspired

you to get into that industry?

133

or the industry you're in.

134

Yeah it's funny because I get, I get

often asked this question because is,

135

as I, and I see it with my children

now, it's kind of this decision where

136

do you, where does that seed start in

terms of you're in school and, and, and

137

everything else and it's funny because

I always, as a child, wanted to be, um,

138

my parents laughed, my husband laughed

at me with this, is that I either

139

wanted to be a doctor or a solicitor.

140

And I loved sort of the thing of

knowing about people's, you know,

141

bodies and sort of just about

illnesses and all that kind of stuff.

142

And I used to love a conversation around

the dinner table with my brother in law

143

when he was in medical school about, about

what's the worst thing he's ever seen.

144

Oh my god, can you share?

145

Well, yeah, I can, and I'll come back

in a minute because it's always quite

146

funny, because it was always funny

looking at my husband's face when

147

when we were obviously just still

boyfriend and girlfriend at this point

148

in time, and him being very squirmish.

149

He hated that conversation.

150

Me too!

151

I know.

152

So Dark Zoo was always

something I fancied.

153

Plus solicitor and it's, I always

felt, and it's wrong, it's wrong

154

to say this, but I always thought,

Oh, I'm never going to be that

155

clever enough to be either of those.

156

So I don't know what, you know,

maybe I started as a youngster.

157

It's funny.

158

But then I, I don't know, I started

doing a bit of, sort of, um, summer

159

work and then got a Saturday job in

Darlow's Estate Agent back in the day.

160

Yeah.

161

You know, showing people around houses

and I loved having a nose in people's

162

houses and, you know, taking people out.

163

It's better than working

in a shop than just Yeah.

164

Landing behind serving customers

and I really enjoyed that but I

165

thought oh my god, I'm the kind

of person who can't sit still.

166

No.

167

I know, right, isn't it?

168

And I kind of thought is it

going to get a bit boring just

169

showing people around houses?

170

Not that I, you know, underestimate the

role an estate agent does in any way.

171

Because I know you've done that.

172

I have done that for many years, yeah.

173

And, you know, but I just thought,

am I going to get a bit bored?

174

Is it going to, you know, I

want something a bit more scope.

175

And yes, you could have gone

down a bit more of the, you know,

176

residential property development

route, that side of things.

177

But then one of our family friends

had a property development business,

178

a commercial property development

business based in North Cardiff.

179

Yeah.

180

And he is still a family friend now.

181

And he had me working with him over the

summers and sort of being a bit of a,

182

sort of, Going out, shadowing him on

the property stuff he'd done, he'd done

183

quite a few big office developments,

industrial developments that, the

184

likes of kind of some of the stuff in

Llanysan Trading Estate where he built.

185

Um, so he was If no one's familiar,

just to interrupt there, Luz, if no

186

one's familiar with, um, Carliferia,

Llanysan is a Lovely area, really nice.

187

And it's, it's a mixture, isn't it?

188

It's got some, um, trading.

189

It's got a lot of residential, yeah.

190

It's like about 10 minutes

drive from the city.

191

So, yeah.

192

And it was really, yeah, apologies.

193

I need to give context on that.

194

And he, he was obviously quite an

accomplished property developer.

195

Anyway, he took me under his wing.

196

And he knew a lot of the guys in, sort of,

I say guys, and that's quite an important

197

thing to come back to that in a minute.

198

Yeah.

199

That was a slip of the tongue.

200

Yeah.

201

I'm not.

202

They, it just goes to show.

203

Yeah.

204

So I ended up, he was very, very good

friends with the, with the national

205

brands at the time that was called King

Sturge and they were based all over the

206

UK and they had regional offices and I was

doing, again, started doing the summers

207

with them and then, sort of, they offered

me a placement, um, and they offered me

208

a job following my university degree.

209

Because that, it started, that sort

of inspiration sort of started,

210

if you like, from the age of

sort of 16, 17, and just grew.

211

And that's how I got into it.

212

And you know, The next steps then.

213

But it kind of opened doors for

me by being under his wing and him

214

having the contacts and me seeing

what he'd achieved and what he'd done

215

and I thought, oh, I could do this.

216

And yeah, I was just gonna ask,

was that a big thing to see?

217

Oh, look how, look how

far or well he's done.

218

And I want a bit of that.

219

Yeah.

220

And I kind of, I, I really,

it was really exciting.

221

It was really the whole architecture

has always really interested me.

222

Yeah.

223

Yeah.

224

I'm not your typical person

just to walk down the street.

225

I will walk down the street and I

will be looking up at a bird around

226

me because I love these buildings.

227

And, you know, I bore my husband's a

bit sometimes because I'll say, Oh my

228

God, look at the, you know, look at

the front facade and that building.

229

Really?

230

You know, whilst you're

thinking about what time the

231

football match is on, you know?

232

So, it's just But it'd be boring

though if we had all the same

233

interests though, wouldn't it?

234

Yeah, absolutely.

235

Come on, yeah.

236

Absolutely, and yeah, and I think that's

what inspired me, was that ability, and

237

I suppose I quite liked architecture,

you know, I liked that side of, that

238

was an avenue as well, but for me, the

commercial property sort of scene, I just

239

really enjoyed, and then I sort of Mm hmm.

240

He started looking about what a

surveyor was about and I thought,

241

well, that's quite interesting.

242

And yeah, you went from there.

243

Yeah, it is.

244

Let's go back to that thing you should

have come back to about the guys.

245

Flip of the tongue.

246

It's funny because, you know, I

think back to my university course.

247

And so I, I studied in, um, the, trying

to think what it's actually called.

248

University of the West of England.

249

Oh yeah.

250

Yeah.

251

It was around the time I was supposed

to be going to the Morgan, but.

252

The RACS, the Royal Institute of

Charter Surveyors stripped the, um,

253

university of the accreditation because

the standards, they were starting

254

to go back literally just before

I was about to go to university.

255

Um, so I went, yeah, it was

quite a mad time because it

256

affected quite a lot of people.

257

And I got an offer to, um, Reading,

got an offer to Liverpool John

258

Moores and got an offer to Bristol.

259

So I just decided to go to Bristol.

260

Hmm.

261

And the amalgamation, of course, is

with things like, oh, I don't know,

262

business in property, um, you know,

investments in property, all these kind

263

of things, various different titles.

264

But we, and we used to do

a lot of lectures together.

265

And I remember my course in

particular, which was a, you

266

know, sort of property management,

asset management sort of led role.

267

There was four girls on the

course of a total of around 22.

268

And the reason I said about the

amalgamation of the other was quite

269

important as well, because likewise,

you know, you think spread across

270

all of these courses that were coming

together, joint lectures out of a

271

handful, you know, I think back to our

lectures and our lecturers as well.

272

But they all mail.

273

Yeah, I didn't have one lecturer, and I

didn't have, um, yeah, I didn't have one

274

female lecturer, and I think probably

there were about four females per course.

275

It's crazy, isn't it?

276

It is crazy, and it is mad, and then,

you know, when we talk then about kind

277

of, I said the slip of the tongue,

you know, from then, from what I said

278

about the guys, I think back to those

times when I was early days in King's

279

Sturge, And sadly, the only females that

were there were, and I hope I get this

280

right, because if, if somebody was to

listen, but this was about, you know,

281

I think there was one female management

surveyor, which you often used to get

282

the manic, the female, the token female.

283

Yeah.

284

Yeah.

285

And I think the rest of the team were all

male because, but the only female were

286

the admin staff and the it was like, I

would say that's probably about right.

287

There was one secretary per

two, you know, surveyors.

288

Yeah.

289

Everything was typed

up and everything else.

290

So there was, you know, he was an

office manager that was female.

291

It was just, that was just the thing, you

know, and I, and even as a graduate as

292

well, in, because of course there used to

be a lot of things, the Cardiff graduates.

293

Yeah.

294

Again, you know, I was the only female

industrial surveyor at the time.

295

That's crazy, isn't it?

296

And this is going back 20 years.

297

Yeah, so you know, yeah, actually

that long ago is that it's not I guess

298

you know things, I would, I would

like to think things have moved on.

299

Let's just touch on that though so you

are, you know, in uni, you're surrounded

300

by predominantly males in, Not just your

course, but from the lecturers as well.

301

Did that make you more determined?

302

Did it have, actually, no,

did it have any impact?

303

Did you even notice it back then?

304

Not really, because I've always been,

um, I've been always quite an ambitious

305

and determined individual anyway.

306

I mean, my, my dad, you know, it

makes me laugh, and he doesn't

307

realise how MPC it is to say it,

but he used to call me a squat.

308

You know, and that's that.

309

And he still says it now.

310

You always were a sport, Lucy.

311

Yeah, you always were.

312

And he says it, but actually

now we know, you know, I'd

313

never say that to my children.

314

That was just a generational thing.

315

But yeah.

316

So no matter, I think I

was always quite academic.

317

You know, I always wanted to

achieve and achieve highly.

318

I just, that was always my way.

319

And I always wanted to

do something properly.

320

So whether or not I subconsciously,

you know, push myself harder

321

or not, I don't really know.

322

I don't, I don't think it

would have made any difference.

323

Yeah.

324

Yeah.

325

That's just the person you are anyway.

326

Yeah.

327

Yeah.

328

It certainly made me more aware

of it as I've gone through life.

329

Certainly, you know, I'm sure we'll

touch upon it, you know, things to

330

do with management opportunities and

things like that, um, which I think I

331

have been impacted by being a female.

332

Um, and, and, and I, and I, you

know, a maternity cover, you know,

333

maternity leave and having to

So, but in those early stages, I

334

certainly wasn't consciously aware.

335

Yeah.

336

Okay.

337

That's really interesting because

like, knowing you, I can imagine it

338

probably wouldn't have made, and I'm

glad you kind of said that it wouldn't

339

have made much difference because

that's the kind of person you are.

340

You want to succeed and you want

to get on in your way, regardless

341

of if, you know, gender or whether

you, you know, you identify as, but

342

let's, let's just talk about that.

343

So that was my next question, actually,

and you obviously read my mind.

344

What, what sort of challenges, um,

I'm going to use the word challenge.

345

Yeah.

346

Did you come up against in,

in the, or have you come up

347

against in the time as being.

348

Identified as a female.

349

I think there's a couple of things that

strike me and I've got to be careful

350

of how I say this and what I say

because obviously, you know, I don't

351

necessarily like to sit on, you know,

that shelf that sort of, oh, I'm a woman.

352

I'm, you know, I, it's,

it's actually, yeah.

353

You know, I've achieved what

I've achieved, um, and I'm happy

354

with what I've achieved so far.

355

And actually, yes, I've had certain gender

barriers and yes, I've kind of, there has

356

been times, um, which, yeah, which I could

have taken things further, shall we say?

357

Yeah.

358

Yeah, which I've chosen not to, because

actually, again, It could have been

359

detriment to me and my reputation and,

and I don't like to, you know, I've,

360

I've been able to prove myself without

actually throwing my weight around saying

361

that this is, you know, this is a person.

362

I love that.

363

Yeah.

364

Do you know what I mean?

365

I, I bloody love that.

366

Will you say that again?

367

Honestly, I've proven myself

without having to throw my weight

368

around about if I'm male or female.

369

You've just done it.

370

Yeah.

371

And I genuinely think that's

a big thing because I.

372

It, it does, it does annoy me.

373

You know?

374

And, and I'm not a feminist.

375

I'm not a fe, but you know,

I'm not, not a feminist.

376

I'm not a feminist, you know?

377

Yeah.

378

But it does annoy me that there is

sometimes this, this whole sort of thing

379

about women, you know, not getting a

position or, you know, there's not enough

380

women on the boards and things like this.

381

Mm.

382

And then you become a token woman

in this, and, and, and I don't.

383

Agree with that stance on things because

actually you, you're, you don't have to be

384

female or male to be good at what you do.

385

And, you know, if you can prove it,

then I think that's a big thing.

386

And that's what I've ultimately,

ultimately maintained, you know, because,

387

and yeah, people come to you because

of reputation, because of what you've

388

done and I think that's a big thing.

389

You, you know.

390

You could be male and could

be awful at what you do.

391

You just, you know.

392

Yeah, yeah.

393

And that's so true.

394

And I, you know, I'm often in the middle.

395

I'm like, you know, can't make a, can't

make a decision as well sometimes.

396

Yeah.

397

You know, and I get it.

398

I get it.

399

And I think I love that, what you just

said about, you know, you've, you've,

400

you've done what you've done on your own

merit, regardless of, of being a female.

401

Yeah.

402

And, you know, and, and

has I got a lot of male.

403

allies as well as female allies.

404

Yeah, yeah.

405

And people, and, and, and I'm

happy to support that the other

406

way around as well, you know.

407

Yeah.

408

I think, yeah.

409

Absolutely.

410

And you know, on that though, and I'm,

I'm very agree with what you said, but

411

I think on, on merit as well, let's

actually lean into the fact that you're

412

still You're still really predominantly

in a, in a, in a male driven industry, but

413

you've proven that you don't, you don't

have to be male to get where you are.

414

No, absolutely.

415

I mean, you know, arguably, yes, it's

probably constrained me in some ways,

416

but I've looked for the opportunities

when there's been those pushbacks.

417

And I think, and I think

that's a big thing.

418

You know, there's a lot of, there's

always, The talk of, or it's, you

419

know, jobs for the boys kind of thing.

420

And, you know, and I always, and it's

quite funny, you know, I play golf and,

421

you know, you see a lot of the guys

playing golf and things like this, I get

422

asked what my handicap is and it's kind

of, Oh, you know, it's, it's, and it's

423

always great to have that answer back

as well, because they are starting out

424

and it's like, Oh, come to our golf day.

425

Yeah.

426

And then I have a conversation.

427

I mean, but ultimately, I, you

know, I do think, yeah, you,

428

you look for those opportunities

if you get pushbacks on others.

429

Yeah.

430

Yeah.

431

Brilliant.

432

Is there anything that you would do or

have you done differently in You know the

433

last, this is a big question now isn't

it really, in the last 20 years that you

434

go oh actually yeah maybe I would have

done x y differently to achieve something

435

a bit faster or or gone a bit slower.

436

Is there anything that really stands out

you think you would have done differently?

437

I, it's funny because I, I do reflection

every now and again, you know when

438

you set your goals and things like

that and obviously work we've done.

439

And, you know, your, your journal

and things like that, where you,

440

where you reflect on what you,

where you've come from and where

441

you are now and where you're going.

442

And, uh, it's funny because I

actually see it the other way in

443

that, you know, I got made redundant

444

And actually, I was very complacent.

445

I had my comfort blanket.

446

Yeah.

447

And I remember vividly walking.

448

We were living up in

Gloucester at the time.

449

And I remember it was snow

because it was around February.

450

And I remember walking.

451

We didn't have a dog or anything.

452

I just went for a walk because I was.

453

I thought it was a reflection on me that

I'd been made redundant and, and I walked

454

the streets around the house thinking,

cause I just needed that time out.

455

And I thought, Hmm, this is

that push I actually needed.

456

And actually, you know, it's funny

because, you know, leaving the business

457

last year, which, you know, we've talked

about and, um, and actually it's kind of

458

sometimes These things happen when you

don't realize they're going to happen.

459

And actually they happen for a reason.

460

And therefore, you know, to have that

regret or that, or actually would

461

I've done something kind of thing, not

necessarily regret, but the thing of, or

462

would I've done something differently?

463

I reflect on those incidents actually,

rather than actually thinking about

464

and thinking about, well, what,

where did that junction then take me?

465

And I have to say 2009 was a quite an

important part, you know, point in time in

466

my life because I into the retail world.

467

Yeah, absolutely.

468

And, you know, exactly.

469

I had a job offer from, you know, Tesco.

470

I had a job offer from Store 21 and I

had another offer from a company who did

471

a lot of work for retail down in Oxford.

472

And I would never have got

into that position had it not

473

been being made redundant.

474

So I think every.

475

You know, these things, these life

events happen for a reason and often

476

happen when almost kind of naturally,

you're ready for that change.

477

Yes, absolutely.

478

I'm a massive believer

in fate and, you know.

479

Yeah, something's happening for a reason.

480

Yeah, and it comes on, before we came on

live, we were trying to think of a phrase.

481

We were talking about letting

go of certain clients and

482

opportunities and things like that.

483

And there was a phrase, and I

still can't pledge you remember it.

484

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

485

That's it, what doesn't

kill you makes you stronger.

486

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

487

And it's, it's something

that, Well, I can remember it.

488

Actually, it kind of does resonate with

me as well, because, you know, these

489

things are out of your control, right?

490

The, the redundancy is out of

your control, and it's what you

491

can take from those opportunities

then, will make you stronger.

492

And, you know, the likelihood of, if

that hadn't happened, we, I don't know,

493

we may never have met, because you would

still be living in Gloucester, you know?

494

All of these, all of these things

come around full circle, don't they?

495

Absolutely.

496

Um, so.

497

Let's just talk about a little

bit how, how we did meet and I

498

mentioned the beginning we, we

met at a, a local networking.

499

I think we were just chatting about

like, getting focused and how we

500

really focus on goals and how we

stay productive and focus and then.

501

You reached out to me a couple of

weeks later, wasn't it, saying,

502

oh, I'd love to have a chat.

503

And I was like, oh God, yeah, great.

504

And you said something about like,

oh, you know, you really helped

505

me in that short space of time.

506

And it's funny because that's just,

I was just talking in general, you

507

know, it's what I do all the time.

508

Um, but you realized at that point

you needed some, Somebody that wasn't

509

already in your world, in your, you

know, in your present company to go,

510

right, I need somebody to help with

whatever it is we worked on, the focus.

511

Yeah, I think it was confidence

and focus, wasn't it?

512

And I think that was the big thing.

513

And, you know, sort of that ability

to kind of, um, to move forward

514

from something that You know, a life

event and something that had gone on.

515

And I remember you, I remember telling

you that I'd sort of interviewed, you

516

know, let's call it interview more like,

you know, you have an informal chat

517

with people sort of from a business

coach sort of, um, you know, sort of

518

role and, and you and I click, cause

I think you got it because you'd been

519

from a retail background and across.

520

It's my passion too.

521

And, you know, that ability to understand

what I'm talking about when we're

522

talking about shopping centres and

retail and all that kind of malarkey.

523

All the stuff that you and I love.

524

I couldn't be more boring for some people.

525

It's like double Dutch.

526

It's like, what the hell are we on about?

527

You know?

528

So, yeah.

529

Yeah.

530

And I think we just gelled and similar,

as we said, similar age group, you know,

531

so kind of nice to be able to talk it

through and putting those things in

532

place then to help me kind of focus as

to, you know, the, the sort of KPIs we

533

put in place and those kinds of things.

534

And there's focus about thinking

about, right, where do I want

535

to get milestones, et cetera.

536

And yeah, and I'd love to just take a

couple of steps back there if we can.

537

So.

538

And not really to do with me, but what,

when did you realize that, you know, you

539

were, you were busy, you were doing, you

were doing well, what you're, what you're

540

doing, but you, you realize that actually,

I can't do this on my own right now.

541

I need some, I need some support.

542

Were you at that stage where you

were thinking, right, I'm going to

543

burn out, or I'm going to go in a

direction I'm not going to go in?

544

What really hit home with you and

thought, right, I need, I need

545

to do something here for Lucy?

546

So, so it's obviously difficult to talk

about, um, but essentially, I mean, I kind

547

of got to a place at the back end of 2022

and realized that being in a business, you

548

know, sharing the business with somebody

else and, and being, you know, director

549

of another business and not being it, not

being my own, shall we say, I was getting

550

quite frustrated with, and I wanted,

you know, A lot of sort of who I was

551

working with my own clients and I wanted

to actually work and have those clients

552

solely in my business perspective and then

also be able to decide the journey and

553

the path that my business wanted to take.

554

Therefore, I was the curator

of that, rather than having

555

to make decisions on my own.

556

With somebody else, I think

that was a big thing for me.

557

And it was taking that step of,

you know, I went to the States in

558

October 22 and on a family holiday.

559

And I remember just having that

time out, you know, I remember

560

vividly sort of lying on a, on a

sun lounger in this fabulous hotel.

561

We were staying in thinking, right.

562

I've just got to do it.

563

I've got to, I've got to take that gem.

564

But at the time I was thinking,

you know, I had a number of clients

565

saying to me, you can do it.

566

And I, at the time I was thinking,

well, can I, can I, so I decided over

567

Christmas, that was it, you know, I

was going to tell my business partner

568

that I was wanting to leave and.

569

Decided then, you know, early January

to set the business up and, and that's

570

where we got to really in the case of,

you know, let's go for it and let's do it.

571

And then that obviously.

572

At that point, because I was kind of in

quite a vulnerable, sensitive place, I

573

suppose, if you like, I just thought I

needed that extra support and somebody

574

to be able to provide me with the tools

to help me sort of think about, look,

575

you know, you know, I know I can do it,

but confidence to know you can do it.

576

And to make those next steps.

577

And that's where, you know,

where we got to really.

578

Yeah.

579

In a nutshell.

580

Yeah.

581

No, and thanks.

582

Thanks for sharing that.

583

Thanks for being so, so honest as well.

584

And, and the reason I wanted to, to

get you to, to really just say that is.

585

I think a lot of people get stuck and

a lot of people don't have that, the

586

confidence or, you know, the support

even, or the drive or the want to go,

587

do you know what, I'm meant for more.

588

And I want to be, like you said,

I love that phrase, the creator of

589

your own journey, um, and then, you

know, having somebody, whoever that

590

is, whatever that looks like, you

know, it could just be talking to

591

your friend, your partner, whoever.

592

But someone independent, I think.

593

Yeah, it is better.

594

And I think, I just think somebody

who, you know, we didn't really know

595

each other at that point in time.

596

You don't know any of my history and

actually I can sit and talk to you about

597

actually, this is what I'm thinking.

598

What do you think?

599

This is what I want to achieve.

600

This is what I want to get out of it.

601

And the ability to kind of, You

know, just kind of set up a path

602

really is where you take it.

603

And, and it's funny, and it's funny what

you're saying, because I've had many

604

a conversation with friends and peers.

605

And if they listen to this,

they'll know who they are.

606

They've sort of said to

me, how did you do it?

607

You know, how did you do it?

608

How do you find, and

listen, it isn't blooming

609

straightforward and it's not easy.

610

And, you know, You know, you know,

one of my friends very well and her

611

and I have had this conversation

about when you're running a business,

612

but he thinks it's very glamorous.

613

And, you know, you can Friday whenever

you fancy, you know, you can go for

614

lunch, you know, whenever you think so.

615

It is flipping hard.

616

The worry of your pipeline and, and, you

know, your competition and what you, you

617

know, yeah, your competition and what

they're doing and what they're doing.

618

Yeah.

619

And you know, yeah, sorry.

620

Yeah, no, I was going to say, and

that's, that's so true because yes,

621

you can choose to finish when you want,

you can choose to take those lunches

622

and we'll come on to a bit of self

care and how we look after each, you

623

know, you as a person in a bit, but.

624

But actually there's, there's so much

more that comes with, with having your

625

own business, running your own business.

626

You know, you are, you

are the brand, right?

627

You are the brand.

628

And you become head of HR, head of

finance, head of IT, head of sales,

629

head of marketing, all of these things.

630

Yeah.

631

And this is why I say though, like,

yes, you are all those people.

632

But get the support around you, you

know, find those people that actually,

633

it might be not, it might not be

your zone of genius to, you know,

634

all about your finances, that's okay.

635

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

636

Don't think you have to

do it all on your own.

637

And if you're in a position where

you can outsource or get, you know,

638

really undertake some free classes

or something or spend a bit of

639

money, absolutely do that because

otherwise you'll get to a point where.

640

You don't do any of it because you've

burnt out and you don't and it's funny

641

because I always remember someone saying

to me as I was sort of progressing

642

at the kind of career ladder that

it was, it was actually my old boss.

643

He said to me that as soon as you become

that sort of head of doing the fun stuff.

644

Yeah, the stuff that you originally

did, you know, the deals making all

645

that kind of stuff, because all of a

sudden you are writing contracts, you

646

know, as in employment contracts, you're

trying to keep on top of your P and L,

647

you know, and it's things like that.

648

And it's, and it's funny, cause I'm just

in the process of changing my accountant

649

for this reason, because I've got a

new accountancy firm coming on board.

650

They help with businesses

that are scaling up.

651

They do things on your HR, you know, they,

they offer this fully fledged service.

652

And I, that will, even though it's a

bit more expensive, the way I looked

653

at it is that actually the money

that I've got to spend a little bit

654

more will save me time and I can

carry on with my value adds stuff.

655

You know, yeah, exactly.

656

You're so right there.

657

You're so right.

658

Because actually a lot of people get

scared of investing and I'm glad you just

659

said that because people think, Oh, but

I can't afford to pay for an account.

660

I can't afford to do that.

661

But actually, what are you

going to gain from doing that?

662

Right?

663

What are you going to gain

from spending a bit of money?

664

You're going to get more energy.

665

I'm actually going back to the things.

666

The reason why you've set up a business

is to do with the enjoyment side of it.

667

Yeah.

668

Okay.

669

So if you did want to clock off at, you

know, two o'clock on a Friday, if you

670

did want to go for lunch for somebody,

how do you actually do that now?

671

How do you look after Lucy King?

672

Well, it's funny, actually, because having

said all that, I've just, I've had quite

673

a tough week with, uh, and my husband

said to me the other day, he said, He was,

674

he's off on Friday, this, tomorrow, and

he said, can I take you for breakfast?

675

Yeah, you can!

676

Yes!

677

Did you say yes straight away?

678

Yeah!

679

I thought, it's funny, because I thought,

after the week I've had, I thought, you

680

know what, actually, it's nothing best.

681

And actually, tomorrow afternoon, um,

as you know, I've got the horses, I'm

682

actually going to go riding the horse.

683

I'm going to go out for breakfast in

the morning, and I'm going to ride

684

the horse then in the afternoon.

685

Brilliant.

686

brilliant because actually, you know,

I think self-care, I've realized, you

687

know, I, I think back to that time

in October when I was on holiday,

688

when I was literally, yeah, on

the verge of a breakdown and, and.

689

I went and bought the horse actually

not long after he came for this very

690

reason, it's kind of like, it's that

ability to with children, of course,

691

you've got to look after them, you

know, and obviously, you know, But

692

they're in the house with you, you

know, you can make them tea, et cetera.

693

You can juggle at home with working.

694

The nice thing is with the horse is

that, you know, okay, yeah, we've got a

695

loaner that will cover them a couple of

days a week, but most nights I've got

696

to go down and I've got to sort her out.

697

Yeah.

698

Well, both of them out now.

699

And, um, and it's like, you know, Okay.

700

I've got, I've got, you know,

you've got responsibilities now.

701

Yeah, yeah.

702

You've gotta, you've handed another

two children to your life early.

703

Yeah, exactly.

704

Exactly.

705

So I've gotta get, you know, I've

gotta be able to do that now.

706

Okay.

707

That might mean I've gotta be back in

front of my laptop at seven o'clock,

708

but that's a choice that I make.

709

Yeah.

710

And you know, the balancing act and you

know, and you've benefited from it, right?

711

Absolutely.

712

'cause actually.

713

You know, yeah, and your time

that, and I'm so glad you're in

714

a place where you can go, yeah,

actually take me for breakfast.

715

I'm going to go riding

because you know what?

716

Nobody is going to die if you take

a Friday afternoon off, right?

717

We are not, I say this all the time.

718

We are not life saving,

you know, heart surgeons.

719

It's okay if we can step away.

720

It's okay.

721

And often I've, you know, read a few

books, which basically, you know, it's

722

the whole thing about the burnout.

723

It's about, you know, sort of self

preservation and these kind of things.

724

If I was just to work full on day

tomorrow, I wouldn't be motivated.

725

I would be gutted because I'd

missed out on breakfast with Rich.

726

Yeah.

727

And, you know, I would be, you know,

on Facebook on, you know, Yeah.

728

The socials.

729

Yeah.

730

You know, staring out the window

actually by taking that time out

731

tomorrow means I'll come back into

the office on Monday morning or even

732

Sunday night because that's most of

the time and actually be motivated

733

all over to do it all again because I

will be better frame of mind because

734

I've had that time out just to reflect

and have some time out away from it.

735

And actually, and I, do you know what

I think is so, so important and I,

736

and it's funny because I listened

to Rachel Flanagan, um, who again,

737

very inspirational individual.

738

And she has done, you know, you know,

testing gender, you know, sort of

739

stereotypes and things like this,

you know, she's done incredible.

740

And she, she basically said, and I thought

this is brilliant that she every year.

741

Takes herself off.

742

They, they go on some sort of

walking, some hiking for like a

743

week, 10 days, something like this.

744

She was saying, and she did it in

a, she said it in a talk recently.

745

And she said every year

she's already booked.

746

She goes just because she has

some time out and that's the time.

747

Okay.

748

It's not with a family, but it's

her time for her to have that,

749

you know, that time away from it.

750

Um, and I think it is.

751

And, um, I remember when we, you know,

around the fifth time when we met,

752

it was, what do we do for you, Liz?

753

And you were like, um, um, it was very

much that kind of like, oh, nothing.

754

Right.

755

Okay.

756

Well, let's build some of that in.

757

And I'm just, I'm so happy.

758

And I love what you said, right?

759

It'll still be there Monday.

760

You're going to be more motivated.

761

Um, because again, if you work

tomorrow, you're just going to be sat,

762

I think you're going to be probably,

you know, whatever you're working on.

763

You're not going to give it your

all because your mind's going

764

to be thinking somewhere else.

765

I call it daydream Dolly, you

know, that's what I'll be.

766

I won't be concentrating at all.

767

Or Dolly the daydreamer.

768

Dolly the daydreamer.

769

Yeah, that does.

770

Okay, so.

771

For anybody that's thinking of starting

out on your own, you know, if you're in a

772

position where you were thinking, right,

I need to, I need to kind of break free

773

or let go from, from what I'm doing.

774

What is there a top tip

that you've got for them?

775

I think the more you procrastinate

about thinking about it, more self

776

doubt you'll put into your mind.

777

So if you've got, if you've got an,

sort of an itch, just go and do it.

778

I mean, the things I think that you can

put in place to give yourself some comfort

779

that, because often a lot of it is doubts

around where your book of business is and

780

where that is going to be, you know, you

know, if you are leaving, you know, sort

781

of one of the biggies, you know, the big

sort of entities in, You know, the UK,

782

the sort of the consultancy firms, et

cetera, which are turning over quite a

783

bit of money, et cetera, you will already

have existing clients now, you know,

784

it may not be that you can target those

because you might have non compete, et

785

cetera, but you know, there's ways and

means to, to have those conversations.

786

And I think, you know, a lot of these,

these people will be working for bigger

787

organizations and we'll be wanting to

make the leap and their clients, you

788

know, We'll be there because of them,

not because of the actual organization.

789

It's often you, that person

rather than the organization.

790

And, and I think, you know,

that would go for any industry.

791

If you've got that down,

you've got that itch.

792

And I, and I, and I think it's.

793

Yeah, it's an interesting one because

I think, ultimately, if you've got that

794

itch, that itch will demotivate you.

795

Yeah, absolutely.

796

It's like, go and scratch it, right?

797

Yeah.

798

You know, the likelihood

is you can always return.

799

Exactly.

800

You can always return.

801

That's what a number of people said to

me when I was my little self doubter.

802

Yeah, amazing.

803

Amazing.

804

Right, I could talk to you for days,

um, because I'm so, and obviously

805

I love property and backgrounds, we

haven't even touched on that really.

806

Um, a really important question

for you now, Liz, if you had to

807

choose now, and you couldn't spend

all day procrastinating, what

808

would be your favourite cake?

809

Oh, I think a jam donut.

810

I love a jam donut.

811

I love a jam donut.

812

Sorry, I've laughed so much that

nobody's ever said a jam donut before.

813

Jam donut.

814

It's really simple.

815

Yeah, because, you know, you just

think about it and then they try and,

816

they try and complicate it by making

it vanilla or chocolate or blueberry.

817

Yeah, just if you want a donut,

just have a bloody jam donut.

818

Jam donut.

819

Love it.

820

They, do you know what, yeah, you can

get like four for, did you say like

821

four for a quid, that sort of thing?

822

I don't know.

823

I've had a jam donut for years.

824

And most places sell them, so you

never have issues over, you know.

825

Yeah, you can't get a

jam donut, love that.

826

I'm a simple girl, like the

daydream whilst eating a donut.

827

I love it.

828

Right.

829

If people are interested in getting

in touch with you for any aspect of

830

what you do, how can they find you?

831

Amazing.

832

Um, they, well, I've got my website.

833

So, um, www.

834

gellarproperty.

835

co.

836

uk or they can easily drop me an

email at lucy at gellarproperty.

837

co.

838

uk Wow.

839

That's probably the way.

840

Great.

841

And you're on LinkedIn?

842

On LinkedIn?

843

Yeah.

844

LinkedIn investment.

845

Best ones.

846

Yeah, absolutely.

847

Um, yeah.

848

Amazing.

849

Thank you so, so much.

850

It's been an absolute

pleasure having you on.

851

Thanks.

852

I've really enjoyed it.

853

I've really, I, yeah, I was really

nervous about doing a first podcast.

854

Oh, really?

855

Enjoyed it.

856

Podcast version has smashed it.

857

Absolutely.

858

Thank you very much.

859

Thank you, Lucy.