What is the value of listening?  In this candid conversation with Deb Porter, Founder of HOLD- Hearing Out Life Drama – we explore the value of having a place to just share what is on our minds.  When under stress, pressure, or in times of uncertainty, the desire to “just talk it out” can be present, but loved ones may not be the place.  HOLD offers a space where clients can move from the intensity of their emotions and thoughts by being held in space where the focus is on the sharing rather than problem solving. 

With a professional history in Pastoral Care and funeral directing, Deb uses her skills to help people be heard in their life experiences as a way to release pressure, and gain insight.

We also touch on:

• what it means to be a good listener
• the “Mr. Rogers” effect
• the difference between a confidential listening service and therapeutic intervention
• the power of HELP from the heart

About the Guest:

Deb Porter is on a mission to "Mr. Rogers" the world through teaching & practicing confidential, compassionate listening. 

To that end, she created HOLD Hearing Out Life Drama.  HOLD is a confidential listening service different from therapy, but outside the common circle of family, friends or coworkers.  She makes sure that her team of trained listeners lightens your load.

 www.hearingoutlifedrama.com

Facebook: https://www.instagram.com/hearingoutlifedrama/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/hearingoutlifedrama/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/74726969/admin/

About the Host:

Tanya's mission is to create a legacy of self-love for women that reinforces trust in themselves through our programs, coaching, podcast, and book, The Trifecta of Joy! As Founder and creator of the Trifecta of Joy Philosophy, she combines over 30 years of research and work in various helping fields, to help you achieve your greatest successes!

Using her philosophy of the Trifecta of Joy, her mission is to empower people through their struggles with the elements of awareness, befriending your inner critic and raising your vibe. This podcast is about sharing stories of imperfection moving through life to shift toward possibilities, purpose, and power in your life!

Having had many wtf moments including becoming a widow, struggling with weight and body image issues, dating after loss, single parenting, remarriage, and blending families, Tanya is committed to offering you inspiration and empowerment – body, mind, and spirit!

As a speaker, writer, and coach, Tanya steps into her life’s purpose daily – to INSPIRE HOPE.

Order your copy of the Trifecta of Joy – HELP yourself in a world of change right here.

Get in touch with Tanya and follow the fun and inspiration in other places too!

www.perfectlyimperfect.wtf 

https://www.facebook.com/PerfectlyImperfect.wtf

https://www.instagram.com/perfectlyimperfect.wtf

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanya-gill-695aa358/

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH9VaHVMPa-Vk0l4LTuc_lQ

https://www.tiktok.com/@perfectlyimperfect.wtf?lang=en

Hugs, Hip Bumps, and Go ahead and SHINE!

Xo Tanya

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Welcome to the trifecta of joy, my friends, I'm joined by an A magnificent soul. Today I'm joined by Deb Porter. And Deb is on a mission to Mr. Rogers the world through teaching and practicing confidential, compassionate listening. To that end, she created hold, which stands for hearing out life drama. Hold is a confidential Listening service, different from therapy. But outside the common circle of family, friends and co workers, she makes sure that her team of trained listeners helps lighten your load. Deb, I'm so glad you're here.

Thank you so much for having me. What a gift.

Thank you so much for being here. Okay. So when we met, I was like, holy, this is such an interesting concept, the idea of hearing out life drama, tell me a little bit about how this came to be.

So I was working as a funeral arranger. And the, my employer changed the pay structure. And consequently, I was like, Ah, shit, you know what? And I was at the time I was reading a book called Thinking Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. Yes. And so in that book, he talks about imagination. And so I began to sit with the thought of imagination. And I thought, if I could do anything, if I could do anything in the world, what would I do? And I just sat with that like, and I just let myself be five. And have that not be scary. I got a lot of trouble when I was imagining,

okay, who the imagination. So you went back to the five year old imagination that got in trouble for being an imagination, creep, creator dreamer kind of thing.

And hold came, I was I thought about life coaching. I was like, nope, nope, nope. And one day I was walking through my house, because I it's like, I could go back to school the rest of the way and, you know, do therapy, become a therapist certified, get that certification, because I already have a lot of certification. I have a master of divinity degree 96 hour in pastoral care and counseling. And I was like, but it doesn't fit. It doesn't translate well into therapy. So as I began to imagine, one day in my house, I'm walking through and I'm just thinking, and there it is, hold. Listen to people just listen to

people. Just listen to people. So okay, so hold hearing out life drama. The idea behind this is that you offer a service, where people can book and have an opportunity to just have someone hold space for them, and hear out their life drama. Absolutely. Now, why do you why do you see that as being so beneficial? What is the benefit that you offer in this?

Well, I saw the benefit. In my own life. When I was a caregiver, I was a caregiver to my spouse for eight years prior to my funeral arranging stint. And there were days during that caregiving when Oh, my gosh, I just needed somebody to hear me and my friends, I love them so much, my family, I love them so much. Sometimes they would get pulled off of their center, and they would want to fix it for me, they would want to, they would want to offer solutions they would want to help. And oh my gosh, what I needed was just to be heard, that's all I needed. Just Just hold space with me and just listen for a moment. And let me get it out. And so ultimately, yeah, being heard. It's so beneficial. Okay, first of all, the scientific benefit, right? We already know, the science proves that when we're heard, our brain changes the brain, the brain actually changes inside, we go from the amygdala, it we're able to move up to higher functions until we get to that prefrontal cortex where we can actually problem solve, but we're in when we're in the midst of something we can't, we absolutely can't. being heard also deepens our relationships with those around us. It makes it so much better when when we know another person really hears us. It just it deepens that connection. And finally, it gives a person being heard the clarity to move on.

Yeah. So so let's go back to the first one. So we know that we know that when someone is in fight or flight, we'll just go with like when someone's under high stress, high pressure, that you're right, like what you described is you know, we go into that into that animal instinct, and it's a lot harder for us to see big picture for us to feel connected. It's that sensation of needing to really truly fight or flight use, like you said, and so being heard, creates that space. Right. And, and I love how you described, you know, we all have people in our lives who are friends, our family, people that we, you know, that we know, like and trust that we can share things with. But often, just like you said, when people who love us hear our challenges or are are really trying to hold space for us, they're also trying to problem solve it, right? To make it better for us. And sometimes we just need a place to just talk it out without working towards solutions all the time, but just to be heard, truly heard. And so what you describe is that opportunity for someone to be able to just talk it out and be heard, without moving toward the problem solving in the immediate moment,

right? If people ask us and Anna hold appointment to help them, figure out a way forward, we absolutely will, but it has to come from them, they have to ask for it, they have to ask us. Yeah, we never just offer it.

So this is so this is really so it's very, very, very client centered work that you do it is holding space to have a holding space to have to have an opportunity for someone to truly just be listened to. And, and okay, so I want to talk about the process of, of sharing, like you talked about the benefit of sharing, what do you see your clients experience in after they've just come to a session or two and just shared? What do you notice in your clients,

the most beautiful thing is, it really does only take about 15 minutes. And for some, for some people one time is enough. If they're working on one thing, it's it's beautiful, because I've had several clients who have started the appointment, literally in tears. And I hold space with that, and we let that be. And then they are able to after we hold space with that, then they're able to get their breath and talk about it. And then after that happens, then there tends to be like this rush, right, this rush of of words in this sorting. And it's so beautiful, because at the end, they go, I can't believe that 15 minutes made that big a difference in my life. That was amazing. And I just I love that, that that that lights me up like you believed. It really does. I love that part. Because because it's just like Mark Goulston says in his book, just listen. When someone feels felt he calls it feeling felt Isn't that so beautiful feeling felt when someone feels felt? Oh my gosh, they've it's it's like there's that burden is lifted. There's just like, if any later in the book, he calls it an exhale is like, Ah, right, you can breathe again. And that's one client said that to me. She's like, Oh, my gosh, I can breathe again. Thank you so much. I can breathe again. Beautiful, I get to help people feel like that. I love that.

You know what? That the way you describe that breathe again, right? Because people, I think I do think that we experienced this the sensation of pressure. And sometimes we think like, I just need a pressure release, right? And we don't know what we need. And so being able to share what's going on. And then just have someone hold the space for you let you share it let you talk it out. And you know, we talk, we talk often about the different ways that we process. And one of the powerful ways of processing is by talking it out without even strategizing and planning and figuring out the path forward. It is that space of presence and just letting it out. And then like you I just love your excitement because this is what it's about, right? Like when someone has that opportunity and you experience their experience of that. Ah, right. Right. Who doesn't love that experience of just like, Ah, I'm okay. It's okay. We're okay.

Everything is okay. Yeah,

everything is okay. So so let's talk about the value of listening. What do you want people to know about the value of listening when it comes because here's the thing, you offer this beautiful service, right where people can come and they can. They can book a session with you and they can with you. We're one of your team. numbers and they can just talk out whatever is going on. They have a space where someone will hear out their life drama,

not trauma, not trauma, drama, for trauma you need, right? Because we really want those that that have trauma in their life to get professional help. That's really important. That's, and that's all over our website. It's really, really important. Yeah.

Yes. So good clarification, important clarification, you are not there to help people process trauma, you are there to help people share and experience the release of letting out and letting go of life drama, the ins and outs, the things that kind of feel sticky or hard or, you know, just like, you just need to vent without somebody trying to fix it. Right. And then you create that breathing space for them that space where you are listening for them. And so what tips would you give people who are like, you're right, you know, what, like, listening is a skill listening is an important piece of this. So how can I become a better listener? What would you tell our what would you tell our listeners? Yeah, how would you suggest they become better listeners for the people in their lives?

So we're not taught to listen, there's there's never been a curriculum, we didn't have any in school. And so if I can just teach people one thing right really quick, right now, what's going to happen when you're listening to somebody is, they're most likely going to do exactly what I described earlier, they're going to be upset, they're going to do a whole lot of I'll call it word vomit, they're going to rebuttal. And at the end, they're gonna go, and I don't know what to do. And at that point, when you're listening, what's really, really key is to ask the question, I hear you don't know what to do. Is that something that you want help with right now figuring out what to do next? Or do you just need me to hold space? If I could teach people that one thing, it would change so much the dynamics, the ripples of just that one thing would go so far?

Right? Will you please say that again, because that's, that is so powerful, that is so powerful.

So after people get through the word vomit, and they say, I don't know what to do. If you can just simply ask the question, I hear you don't know what to do. And I'm not really sure yet, if you want help figuring out what next? Or if you just need me to be here with you. And that's basically it. Yeah, I said it differently. But you can use whatever words you want. I don't have any, like magic words. It's just that's the essence of the thing.

Well, and Deb, what I love about this so much is this like, you know, you talk about health. So you know, in the trifecta of joy, I talk about in the book, the trifecta of joy, I talk about help. And my acronym for help is honor, empathy, love and presence, right? Because the true essence of helping is is yes, there are things we can do, like you said, and the most important piece is being able to have to be able to honor where that person is have empathy for them in the moment, let them feel loved as another human being having a human experience and being present with them. And, and so hold is just that hold is honor, empathy, love and presence in that space of personal sharing, and confidentiality and safety and and just allowing, yeah, allowing whatever it is, whether

it's anger, whether it's grief, whether it's sadness, whatever it is, it's okay, we can just hold that together. Yeah, exactly.

So now, if you have a client that comes to you, that, you know, share some things that like, and this is where I always get worried is like, what do you do if you have a client who comes to you who shares things that are like, this is something that needs therapeutic follow through or this client would benefit from, you know, seeing a physician or like, Do you ever do have those experiences? And how do you handle that?

That does get tricky, because we don't offer advice and to tell somebody you need therapy that's offering advice that read that right there. That's pretty strong advice. And so we're really we're really, really careful and gentle. And so we might say, I've trained my team to say, Are you are you open to considering some options? And if we get a yes, then then we'll say something gentle. Like, I really think that you could benefit from some therapy. Is that something you'd be willing to consider? I think that having an ongoing relationship with somebody to really be able to untangle all of that would be beneficial for you. And, and because I see hold as a stepping stone, not just because everybody doesn't need a stepping stone to therapy, but some people do. I mean, I see it. So I met this woman named Patricia Kane, and she talks about suicidality on college campuses, right? And she talks about the river of life and the the waterfall being that suicide ideation, right. And what we want to do is we, she's, she's trying to intervene ahead of that waterfall. And I'm trying to, I'm trying to go even farther up the river with my hold service, so that we can like get people off on a tributary, right? We don't need to go down that waterfall. It's okay. We know it's there. It's okay, if it's there. But look at the scenery over here. What What can we find? How can we get that exhale that, that redirect, so that we're not headed that way? So for people that that are already further on down, we absolutely want to get them help? Absolutely 100%. But we're not going to be able to force anyone, all we can do is offer our love, offer our compassion, and and direct them to resources. So I've been compiling, as I've been working along with people, list of names, and so people who can work, you know, across the country. And so if somebody says they're open, yes, I'll share a name. Sure.

That is awesome. And I, the way you described that, that, you know, the river and the waterfall, and then the tributaries, I think that is, is really a valuable illustration. Because as we do journey life, we run into challenges, we run into turbulence, we run into places where we need a pressure release, if you will. And so getting ahead of the really big, massive challenges, or, you know, the big mental health stuff by being able to have a space to simply share. And just process like, you know, we talk about the value of processing things, and the challenges is that our brains don't stop, right. So our brains keep going and going and going. And then right and like, it's like, Ah, I'm losing my mind, because I've got so much going on in my head, right. And so, hold is an opportunity for someone to just process it out loud, right? We talk about processing on paper, we talk about, like, there's so many different ways to process you can journal it out, you can, you know, talk it out. But and or you can move your body to, to work the energy out, there's so many different ways to process things. And to be able to process it just by letting it out, talking it out in a safe space, where someone literally holds the space honors where you are, it is empathic to the situation is there simply to listen and not be a problem solver,

or judging, I'm not going to judge either, right? I I don't have a need to judge you. It's okay, if you tell me that you have this thing. And you really wish you would have done it differently. Or, you know, it is what it is we're going to sit with it is what it is I don't I don't need to judge your life. I really don't. You're okay, just the way you are.

I really, I really believe a lot of people are looking for that to that space of just being able to be let things out and not fear judgment, right. When we're sharing with our loved ones, or, you know, or our family members or our friends or people who are close to us. I think there's always a level of concern that that person will judge where we are, what we're going through, or how we're seeing our own lives. Right. Yes. And the interesting thing is, is that I think that, that as human beings, we are actually our own worst critics. Right? So like, like, seriously, truly. Yeah. So as our own worst critics, when we're sharing with people that we love, we are automatically allowing our, you know, our negative self talk or inner critic, to try and add stories because of the relationships that we have with those people. And that complicates our thoughts and our feelings around everything. So by streamlining it down to a service where you can just go and talk it out. You're eliminating a lot of that extraneous complication.

Friends and family are sometimes too close to the problem. And sometimes it's worse than they are the problem. Either way. We listen and it's so Pam, we can help.

That's beautiful. I absolutely love it. This is so cool. Okay, Deb, I know that some of our listeners are going to be like, What the heck is this? So? Like, seriously, it's really quite an incredible service. Because, you know, Mr. Rogers thing is the way you describe this to Mr. Rogers to world, right? Like, what is it? What is it about Mr. Rogers to you? That makes you say, this is that space of holding, confidential, compassionate listening.

I loved Mr. Rogers as a kid, and I loved how he made me feel. He made it safe for all of our emotions, in his TV show, all of everything, everything was all of the feelings. Anger was okay. Sadness was okay. It was all okay. And so when we Mr. Rogers, the world what what Mr. Rogers really gave to all of us was really listening and a whole lot of love. And I just think that's, that's really what I want to do, too. If I could be like anybody, like when I grew up, I want to be like, I want to be like him. Yeah.

Oh, my God, I love that. I want to be like Mr. Rogers, because he made it safe for people to just be, right.

He did, no matter what I mean, he was on the cutting edge. I mean, if you think about the cast of characters, that that he created in the show, he really was on the cutting edge. Truly, I mean, when he had his feet in the pool with, I forget the the black man's name right now. But that was at the time that he did that. There were eyebrows being raised. And I was like, Whoa, but he was showing that we're all human. We were the same, we're all the same. And, and he could sit with anybody. I mean, children with disabilities, whatever disability, he will come to that he honored people for who they were. And yeah, I want to be like

that. It's true, actually, Mr. Rogers was very, very cutting edge in the way that he embraced diversity in ability in race, and in so many different ways to create a space where the light was shining on every human being, as a human being, having their human experience and being unique and important, and valuable.

And valuable. And he just loved people. He just, he loved people. And I think it's kind of sometimes, you know, as a business owner, like that talk about love. Oh, I'm gonna talk about Mr. Rogers and how he loves people. People make the association. Because I just love people like that. Yep.

And I do, too. I do, too. I know you do. You and, and so and that's what I think is so great about you, Deb is because it really is about about each individual's experience of their life. And, and to be able to have the opportunity to create space for them to see the value in their own life. Right, that that is, at the end of the day, that is what it is about. It's about allowing people to see their own light, allowing people to feel safe in their own light. And to know that they have so much value in being the human being that they are, even when they're going through there. What the fuck moments. Yeah. Right, because we all have them. Like, you know, that's this podcast started out as lighten up and unstuck. You're What the fuck? Because the reality is, is that we all have those YPF moments. And so that, you know, and now the trifecta of joy is the same thing. It is about awareness, right? It's about being aware that you need to share something, it's about befriending your inner critic and and allowing the space for your inner critic to be able to have a voice to write because that I would guess is often what happens in in, in your hold sessions is that people talk out and work through some of the drivel, garbage, old stories that that inner critic wants to hold right in their faces. You know, and then the last piece of the trifecta of joy is raising your vibe, and vibration and energy is everything. At the end of the day hold is a beautiful opportunity for people to have a confidential space to share and be held. Deb if people want to get in touch with you, and find out more about the services that you offer, what is the best place to send them Where should our listeners Let's go.

Well, if they're already on Instagram, we're at hearing out life drama. And if they prefer our website, it's www dot hearing out life. drama.com

beautiful. So one more time hearing out life drama.com Or at hearing out life drama, all one word.

Yeah its long. Sorry.

It's one word, but it is one word that is easy to remember hearing out life drama. Dead. This has been an incredible conversation.

I'm so excited for your book.