In this episode, I speak with Shlomy Raziel, the visionary behind Grow-Tec, joining us all the way from Israel. Shlomy shares his deeply rooted connection to agriculture, tracing back to his childhood in a Kibbutz and his family’s pioneering spirit in farming. His journey from managing large-scale agricultural projects to founding Grow-Tec is not just a career path but a continuation of a legacy. We dive into how his company is innovating in the vertical farming space, particularly focusing on fruiting vegetables, a challenging yet rewarding venture that sets them apart in the industry.

Shlomy’s insights into the evolution of vertical farming are grounded in practicality and a clear vision for the future. He emphasizes the importance of collaboration within the industry to overcome common challenges like energy costs, climate control, and labor. His approach is refreshingly open, advocating for shared progress over competition. This conversation isn’t just about the technicalities of indoor farming; it’s a testament to how a passion rooted in tradition can foster innovation that might just change the world of agriculture. Join us to hear how Shlomy Raziel is not only navigating but also shaping the future of farming with thoughtful technology and a community-focused mindset.

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Key Takeaways

00:03:38 - The Idea and Vision Behind Growth Tech

00:07:11 - Experiences in Kibbutz and Early Innovations

00:13:44 - Changes and Adaptations in Business Model Over Time

00:18:36 - Lessons Learned and Growth as a Leader

00:23:08 - Perspective on the Vertical Farming Industry

00:36:04 - Message to Peers in the Indoor Farming Space

Tweetable Quotes

"I was born and raised in a Kibbutz, just ten minutes from my office. From childhood, I was deeply involved in agriculture, starting with open field orchards and later moving on to greenhouses and Controlled Environment Agriculture (CEA) projects after university." 

"Big companies do great work with technology for the mainstream, but there's a lack of solutions for tailor-made projects. I found a niche in creating specific, precise solutions not just for mainstream agriculture but for unique, smaller-scale projects that big companies overlook."

"The future of vertical farming should involve more collaboration. We need to establish forums and associations to share knowledge and technology openly. Improving key aspects like lighting, HVAC systems, and reducing manpower through automation benefits everyone in the industry, not just individual companies."

Resources Mentioned

Wesbite - https://grow-tec.com/

Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@grow-tec8331

LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/grow-tec

Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/growtecc

Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/grow.tec.verticalfarming/

Twitter - https://twitter.com/GrowtecRP

Connect With Us

VFP - LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/verticalfarmingpodcast

VFP Twitter - https://twitter.com/VerticalFarmPod

VFP Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/direct/inbox/

VFP Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/VerticalFarmPod

Vertical Farming Jobs - http://verticalfarmingjobs.com

Vertical Farming Weekly - www.getrevue.co/profile/verticalfarmingpodcast

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Mentioned in this episode:

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Harry Duran 0:00 - 0:05

So, Shlomi Raziel, owner of Growth Tech, thank you for joining me on the vertical farming podast.

Shlomy Raziel 0:05 - 0:09

Thank you very much, Eric. It's really been an honor for me to be here.

Harry Duran 0:09 - 0:11

Where are you calling in from?

Shlomy Raziel 0:11 - 0:14

I'm calling in from our headquarter in Israel.

Harry Duran 0:14 - 0:14

Okay.

Shlomy Raziel 0:14 - 0:17

It's located in the east north part of Israel.

Harry Duran 0:17 - 0:24

Okay. Well, sending lots of prayers for everything that's happening out there right now. Hopefully you and your family are okay indeed.

Shlomy Raziel 0:24 - 0:26

Thank you very much. Good.

Harry Duran 0:26 - 0:50

Yeah. So, Shlomi, I was looking at a bit of your background, and I was kind of interested, I'm always interested how people get into this, the world of indoor farming and vertical farming. It sounds like you, even when you were looking back at some of the project management stuff you were doing and some of the engineering work you were doing, it seems like you've always had an interest, you know, maybe even coming out of university in agriculture. Is that accurate?

Shlomy Raziel 0:50 - 1:18

It is indeed, it's accurate. I born and raised in a kibbutz, which is around ten minutes from my office. And since I was child, I was involved in agriculture. So most of my life as a child and as an adult, I've been involved in agriculture, starting from open field orchards, and later on after university, started to deal with real houses and CEA projects.

Harry Duran 1:18 - 1:26

What's your earliest memory, if you can think back to, like, either your family or just being in the open field or working in agriculture?

Shlomy Raziel 1:26 - 1:47

I think that for everyone that's born in such an environment and raised in such environment, there is something that you cannot forget is the smell of the soil after the plowing. So this is something that it's still. I still have it, I still remember it, and I still, until these days, like to do it and like to have this experience.

Harry Duran 1:48 - 1:51

And is that something that goes back in your family's history?

Shlomy Raziel 1:51 - 2:27

It is, yes. My father was working in the fields. He came to Israel as a child. When? Before. After the Holocaust, before the country was built up. And he was one of the pioneers that build up the kibbutz. And on those days, all the economy of the kibbutz was around agriculture. So he was first generation. And my brothers are also been there for many years. And then I came in, and I try, even with my children, to keep this special relation with the environments and with the fields and greenhouses till these days.

Harry Duran 2:27 - 2:40

So some of your earlier experience looks like you were doing some project management work and you were doing some work with USAID. So it feels like because of this connection you have through your family, it seemed like this was the path that was destined for you.

Shlomy Raziel 2:40 - 3:09

Harry Duran 3:09 - 3:38

What was the. If you could think. I know it's hard to think back where your mind was at the time, because 20 years here is like a long time ago, but obviously, up until that point, you had been working for other companies and other projects. And I know it's always a challenge when you think about starting something on your own. So if you can take a trip back to the early days of coming up with the idea for growth tech, what was those conversations like? And what was the idea when you first came up with it? Like, what were you thinking to start?

Shlomy Raziel 3:38 - 5:17

It's a great question. And I think that there is a real connection between those dying 20 or more than 20 years ago to things that we are doing these days in rote. Because I was working in Etafim, which is probably one of the largest company in the world in this field of agriculture. And one of the most strongest impressions that I had is that big companies, big organizations are doing great work, but this great work in technology and solutions, they are for the mainstream. And I was thinking that there is a lack of opportunities and solutions for tailor made projects relating to technology, locations, specific crops. Big companies want to do a lot from the same thing. This is something that it's okay, it's related to the business plan of those companies. But in every market there are opportunities, and sometimes this opportunity, tailor made projects and solutions, they are too small for the big companies. And then there are no companies that can make this happen. And I found out that this is something that I want to do because I get bored quite fast. So I don't like to do all the time the same things. I try to find new challenges and new technologies and this is the route that I decide to go to, found a company which will do specific and very precise solution based mainly on tailor made and not only working in the mainstream.

Harry Duran 5:17 - 5:38

I'm going to pause there for a second, Shlomi, because it's very interesting to hear about this interest you have, this passion for maybe doing things differently. If I was to go back and maybe talk to your parents and your family and ask them about Shlomi as a child, would they say that you've definitely always had that sense of curiosity and then maybe looking at things differently when you were younger.

Shlomy Raziel 5:38 - 6:08

Yeah, I was single differently. I try always to go and to learn and to check mostly based on trial and error. So I was not a perfect student or something like this. So I always like to try or like to investigate. I never afraid of fails, you know, that something will spoil me and I would be so disappointed that I will leave it. So, yeah, the curiosity was always there.

Harry Duran 6:08 - 6:15

Where do you think that if you look back, where do you think that inspiration came from or who you're being inspired by?

Shlomy Raziel 6:15 - 6:55

I think that we grow up in kibbutz, which is that, you know, it's a totally different environment from cities or villages, and there is a huge space not only on the land spaces. And if you like to check, if you like to learn, if you want to get experience, it's the perfect place because there is so many different things around. And if you get involved and get the passion to learn new things, it's an amazing place. Those days. It was amazing place to get experience with so many things that today I see the children and the friends that we have today, they cannot get this experience already.

Harry Duran 6:55 - 7:11

So it sounds like that experience in the kibbutz was really instrumental for you to kind of learn and ways of thinking outside the box and ways of thinking differently, which sounds like it prepared you for what would eventually become grow tech.

Shlomy Raziel 7:11 - 7:48

Yeah, it is. I think that on those days, 35, 40 years ago, the kibbutz was kind of a closed places, and it was not so open to the outsiders. So all the solutions and all the things that was done, it was locally and all the solutions and all the know how and everything was creating by local people, educated or not, with experience, and mostly with the passion, with passion to build something, to change something. And yeah, this is something that I observed, I think, quite good those years.

Harry Duran 7:48 - 8:15

So you mentioned this idea that you had for or as you were starting to develop and build grow tech, and you mentioned your experience at Netfem as well. Were there any other mentors that you were asking for guidance from, or were there people that were helpful for you along the way to help you decide decision when you decide to start your own company? And obviously, if there's people you can turn to for advice, for guidance on the way, sometimes that's helpful to help you make some of those tough decisions.

Shlomy Raziel 8:15 - 9:17

Yeah, well, I think there are some people that I work with them either in Metasim or mainly, I think, from the university time that give me the motivations. And also I think that there was some another point that when I walk in that, you know, it was really a great time. I feel one of the best university that you can experience this technology in agriculture. But one of the things that I learned is that I don't want to work anymore in a corporate. So I believe that in a small medium companies with a very strong relations between the employees in the company. So when we build growd it 20 years ago, even today, we consider it as a summary. So there is a very good relations. The DNA of the companies and the employees is quite the same. And then we are trying to do all we can to keep very strong relations and connections between all the employees in the company.

Harry Duran 9:17 - 9:34

So as you were getting started with growth tech, what was the vision for what the business model would be back then? Because I know that you also work in cannabis and indoor farming. And I realized that the 20 year ago model may have obviously changed to what it does now. But when you started then, what was the vision?

Well, the vision when we started, I think that 20 years ago, the biggest change at that time in the fields of CA, which was mainly greenhouses and high tech greenhouses based on different kind of dutch technologies, was the revolution that started to go from soil to soils and take putting more technology in closed loop system water recycling, and start all the automations of the irrigation and fertigation and climate control. All this stuff was quite new. The biggest revolution at that time was mainly in the foreign USSR and Russia, Ukraine and all the central countries of Asia and East Europe and China, of course. And I think that it was moving from a traditional agriculture into new methods. There was lack of know how relating to soilless cultures and making all these high performance or high yields, and applying all this method. And this was a great start for us. This is what we did in growth on that time. We've been focusing on climate control, irrigation, fertigation and the recycling system for the run of water. And of course, that for these 20 years, things were changing. I think one of the big changes was the legalization of the medical cannabis in the US, in Colorado, and that Syria. And this is how we enter into this market in the US. We give services to several companies in the US for planning and build up project indoor and greenhouses, and applying these technologies over climate control and soil cultures and water recycling and all this stuff, which was not so popular in the US. And in the meantime, as long as we develop the cannabis and medical cannabis technologies and projects, we continue to do the greenhouses project with the vegetables. And for things was like two separate lines, but it always goes ahead, both of them. And then sometime three years ago, we decided to take the vegetables into the indoors. So for us it was only to do some adaptation between these two technology that we faced for a long time, and we feel quite good and strong with both of them, indoor farming and vegetables. And when we decide to go into the vertical farming of vegetables, although that we have a lot of experience with leafy green projects, mainly with NFT and greenhouses, China, Vietnam, Thailand, also here in Israel, we feel that the leafy green is the low hanging fruit, and we don't want to take a punt on it. The technology was quite basic. Many companies were running into this technology. And then we thought that we need to try again, like I told you about years ago, to try to look for something complicated, something that others don't want to touch. And we come up to the fruiting vegetable, starting with the tomatoes, cucumber these days also, and other vegetables. And we believe that we crack it. We find a way to make it whole, to make it feasible. One of the key points for us beside technology and know how, was the understanding that the unit economics should be very strong and clear, that there is no future for vertical farming only, which is going to be based on grants, loans or subsidies or whatever it is, because these things one day can disappear and then it will not be nice. So we put a lot of effort in order to understand how to make it work in terms of unit economics, and I believe that this is one of our great success to do it.

Yeah, it sounds like you've definitely done a lot of research into figuring out the models that would work, and you've had a lot of experience, like you mentioned, in the cannabis field, but then recognizing that technology had matured enough for you to try beyond leafy greens, fruiting vegetables, as you mentioned, did you see that there was more adoption in certain countries? Because you did mention several countries where you're working in, and I'm curious about your perspective, if you're seeing a different response to your technology in certain regions.

Yeah, for sure. I think that one of the important things for us in terms of the vertical farming is that we understand from day one that we are not going to save the world, and vertical farming will not save the world. Vertical farming, it's an amazing thing, it's a great technology, but we need to find the right location according to the right parameters, and to adapt the technology to the needs. So in every place that vegetable can be grown naturally, based on simple greenhouses, without an energy needs to heat or to light to cool down. Those places, I believe will continue to work with the greenhouses and traditional technologies. But on places that there is challenges due to the climate changing, due to the needed shortage of water, due to the shortage of land, or there is a remote location, the vertical farming can make a change. So I think that if we look on the markets that very important for us in growth to all this industry. So Scandinavia, north of Europe, North America, especially the east coast, the northeast coast, Singapore, Japan, and of course the Gulf countries, all those markets are the right place to adapt and to get into vertical farming projects and technologies.

I saw that in a recent press release. You were talking about how you've now yielded over 1000 cucumbers and over 600 tomatoes annually. And I'm wondering how much work went into getting to that point. Because obviously a lot of farmers and farms that are looking to expand beyond leafy greens into fruiting vegetables, there's challenges with doing that, obviously. And it sounds like you've been building up the team. You talk about the scientists that you have on your staff as well. So I'm curious if you could share a little bit of the story about the process and how that came about.

Sure. So, yeah, you know, one of the most important thing is to come to see our facility, because when you see, you can understand also, I think when you look on the movies and everything, but because the end of the day, we took some methods from the cannabis growth, mainly relating to the different stages, to nursery, vegetatives and flowering. So we adapted and we do three stages in different rooms. So we have nursery to grow up the young plant, then we move the young plant into vegetative stage, which they grow. It depends if it's cucumbers or tomatoes, but it's growing out really for a big plant. And for instance, the cucumber is growing almost 30 days, almost vegetated, and they're already flowers and having small fruit when they are moving to the other room, to the flowering room. So five days after we make this transaction, we start harvesting for 49 days, and in the meantime, the second plant is prepared. So there is always a circuit, there is always a plant in the nursery plants, in the vegetative and plants inside the growing room and in the growing room, always there is two plants in two different ages, that one of them is little bit bolder and the other one is younger, so it's covered fully with plants and every day there isn't harvest. So we do many cycles year round, we never stop and the production is constant and stable and we have a lot of plants. It's not only that we make most fruit per plan, this is also relating to the technology and the know how that the team has been developed with the time, but would change a lot of plan. So all this together, coming with a six year high, make this tremendous yield.

What has been the most? I guess there's so many lessons and things you've learned, and we're talking 20 years, we're talking all the experience you've had and everything you knew when you started. And you think about the challenges of growing a company, finding the right people, hiring the right people, building a good team. Can you think a little bit about. Sometimes it's easy to look forward and sometimes you have to pause and look back and say, wow, look at everything that I've accomplished. And so I don't know how often you get a chance to do that. So maybe we can take a few minutes to do that now. But when you look back at the moment where you started the company and all the decisions you've had to make to get to this point now, how do you think about, like, how you've grown personally as a leader, as the CEO, and in terms of to get to this point, how do you think about that?

Well, I think it was very challenging and still these days, it's still very challenging and things are changing all the time. So it's been very important, you know, to be open minded and not to follow just one direction, just believing only in one type of technologies. And I think that I'm very open. I very appreciate different opinions and people, and many people are influencing on my opinions and my way of taking the decision. So there is a very big circle of people that I like to talk with them and consult with them and try to think about the next steps. And I think that the most important thing is the team that you are building is the people that is surrounding with you, the people that walk with you. And this is something that has been very important for me to keep always learning to share it and to listen to other people's and other opinions. And in the end of the day, you are alone while you're making the decision, and you are the only one that's responsible for this decision. But it is what it is.

Yeah, it sounds like it's been a learning journey for you. Definitely along the way.

Yeah, it is. And every day it's a new lesson.

I like to ask my guests this, and the answer always changes depending on the day. But what is a tough question you have had to ask yourself recently, you.

Know, when you run a company and a business, and, you know, I run the business for 20 years. And after 17 years we decided to shift from a project company into kind of a startup company. And after 17 years, normally people start to feel about the next step, about how to relax, about how to enjoy a little bit the life and the family. And my decision was like to start from scratch with a new technology, with something that it's just been getting born in the world. So it was very challenging. So relating to your question, so the most important question that I asked myself, is it worth it? And yeah, this was the question.

And what's the answer?

The answer is yes, because I really like what I'm doing and I believe very strongly in what we are doing on the way that we do it. And I think, like I told you before, we are not going to save the world. But I think that in this specific fields of fruiting vegetables, in Indo vertical farming, we can make a change and we can influence on the industry on a way that this technology, not coming only from us, will be observed and implement worldwide, especially on the location, that this is the only solution for fresh, healthy vegetables.

So what's been your perspective on all the interest in vertical farming recently? Because I started the show in 2020 and there was a lot of, obviously a lot of VC interest, a lot of investments, a lot of failed investments. So people getting into it, maybe for the wrong reasons. And obviously based on your experience, you've been doing this for a while. So I'm curious what your perspective has been as you see other people come in and think that this is something that you can just jump into without having an understanding of the actual farming. Because a lot of people look at this as a technology game or they come at it from the unicorn mentality of the sass world. And so I see you smiling a bit. So I think you might have some opinions.

Yeah. You know, like you mentioned, in 2020 you can raise up $100 million with a presentation. These days you cannot raise a penny if there is no technology behind, if there is no unit economic. So I think that it was and still amazing journey. So it starts like you described, 2020, 2021, with a lot of newcomers. Most of them were not coming from the agriculture. They come from a different aspect, not necessarily coming from the technology part of this agricultures. And it was a huge hike. And then Berthidor was a quite big stock. And I think that these days, and I think to my opinion, especially during the last few weeks, I think that we are start to go up again. It will not go up into the same place, but it will go up to the levels that it will be. Companies and technology that supported by a real needs and a good unit economics will survive, will be making this industry into a strong and stable industry. And I really believe that one of the key points for this success is to find a way to work together. I think the most important thing for the interest industry of the vertical farming companies and technologies is to find a way to work together and to establish different kind of associations and different kind of forums that can share knowledge and information. It's true that each company can have his specific know how, specific method. But in the end of the day, if we look on the vertical farming industry, there is three major parts that make you all this. The cost of energy for lighting and the lighting technology. The cost of energy and the technology of h vac system and the manpower. And I think that if you try to look on the industry as an outsider, there is no any competition based on the technology wise on these three aspects. So it's really sometime I cannot understand why people are so afraid to cooperate and to share knowledge on these three aspects. I can understand that people can protect varieties, protect recipes of fertilizer, protect many methods, but these three items, the only way to beat them, it will come from big corporations that people will talk with people and people will establish research center or which can be in the companies. And I don't see any competition. If you are improving the lighting or the h vac, it makes sense for everyone and it doesn't come, you know, nobody lose from this situation. And I think that this is something very important, this technology wise. And also I think there is another point that it's also relating to find a way of how to work together to do to find the right blending for the product that coming from vertical farming. Because we are not organic but we are pest free, we do some reduction relating to environment and carbon footprint and all this. So I think that if the companies and if the major players in the vertical farming will find a way to stick together and find a way of how to rebrand the industry and also to put in front some standards. Because this is also something that everyone is called. It's a vertical farming. It's indoor, it's outdoor. No, it's vertical. It's vertical because it goes like this or because, you know, there is no so many double meanings for the same thing. So I think, you know, for us managers and owners in this industry, I think it's very important to clear some point and make some things that will help to all of us to go to the market in a better way.

That's such an important point. And I think I keep hearing it throughout these conversations, this idea of really collaborating and sharing ideas when it doesn't impact any sort of ip that people have. And I think moving out of this mindset of I need to protect my company secrets. And to your point, this feels like the saying in the US is all hands on deck. Like it's a moment for like all, everyone's help is needed, all the farms are needed, all the companies are needed. And even if all the companies were producing at full capacity, it still wouldn't even be enough to cover the needs that this world has for this type of solution. So I think, I really agree and applaud that mindset of being more and thinking of things more from a collaborative perspective, which I think is really important for people that may not be familiar with growth tech, or just hearing about it for the first time. Who would you say is an ideal customer for you?

I think this is a great question and this is what we are trying to understand, but I think that again, it should be consortium of few people. The client of growth, and I think other vertical farming companies as well, is not necessarily a growers or a farmer. In order to make it happen, you need to build the platform. On one hand you have the retails, the needs and the specific characters of the product that they want to put on the shelf. There is a growers, which is not necessarily, you know, 2030 years old farmers, because it's sometimes more easy to get young people that just been graduated in the university, and it's more easy for them to adapt these new technologies and methods. And then there is a technology company like Grotex, and of course that without finance it will not work. So we like to think that in order to make it happen, you need four partners. The critical one, to my opinion, is the rete and the market. And in order to make really the product that have the great needs in terms of pricing, quality and varieties. And then when there is a good demand from the retails, it's much more easy to build and bring in all the others.

It sounds like that's not something that's easy to figure out, but it feels like you have the right team in place to answer those questions.

I hope so. And again, every market is different. So it's not the same solution for us, for Europe, for JCC, for Japan, for. We need to be flexible and it.

Seems like you're also making an effort to connect more with the industry, and I think your team is going to the conferences as well. I'm wondering, what's your experience been? I've been to several since starting the show, indoor icon, indoor Agtech, Vertifarm, Agramee, and I'm curious if those are helpful in terms of getting the word out and having conversations with your peers in this space.

I think it is very helpful. Again, I feel that, you know, sometime when we go to one of these show is because we want to meet not only clients and buyers, we want to meet our colleagues. And I think that still there is kind of a frayed or there is borders between the companies. When you talk with your, let's say, competitors, you know, it's not really getting deep into detail. Still people are afraid. People are trying to protect technologies and know hows and everything, and still it's not very open and transcripted. I think that it's going there. It's different, at least to my opinion. In every show, in every conference, I feel better and better and more people are open, more people are sharing information and experience. And I think that maybe also because of the situation of the industry worldwide, people start to understand that we need to find a way to join together to talk and to share information and knowledge in order that everyone will succeed, not just one will take everything and gain, and it will be over. So for me, it's very important to take part on this different show and meet people and try to see where it goes, how it goes. It's very important.

Yeah, it sounds like it's the best place to have those types of conversations. So what has you most excited when you think about the roadmap and the future for growth tech? Are there any initiatives that you're currently working on now that you'd like to share or talk a little bit about?

I think that after three years of, almost three years of R and D, we start commercializing the system since January 2024. And we are very excited during 2024 to build up few locations out of Israel, out of the location that we have here in our headquarters, and to bring this technology into the real life, to bring it out from the lobby to the industry. And then beside the execution part, the next challenges that we are focusing here is the robotics and to try to minimize the manpower, and not only in terms of costing of manpower, also to make these factories, to becoming an autonomous platform to grow vegetables without the needs of manpower for picking and for the simple task it's not only the cost of manpower, it's only the lack of manpower in the industry and also in the vertical farming, one of the important thing is cross contamination and you can control the environment, you control the air, you clean the seeds, you can do everything. But in the end of the day, if you have big numbers of people coming and going in and out, this is a big risk for the crops. So we try to put a lot of effort and budget for the next stage of robotics. And hopefully two years down the road, we will be with a solution for harvesting later on for pruning and other tasks.

Yeah, it sounds like there's a lot of innovation happening in that space with everything from robotics to AI. Every time I go to these conferences, I'm pretty amazed by how fast things are moving. So if you do have a, obviously you've already demonstrated that you've got a really solid R and D team, so it's going to be exciting to see what you develop. And we'll be watching closely what happens in the next couple of years.

Indeed, actually, in the robotics in terms of growth, we implement something that I talk about it, you know, even now, many times, we developed all the projects until now of this vertical farming that we are doing, the fruiting vegetable, but robotic and I, we decided it will not be in house, it will be collaborations with other company. We will do the integration between different companies, but it's a big platform that we are trying to build with the good partners doing robotics, doing AI, doing cameras, doing vehicles, doing the different stuff. And we try to join together and then bring the solution that will fit for the growth system and the growth needs.

Thank you for sharing that. And I'm sure we'll be watching for updates on the website when those are available. So as we close this conversation, Shlomi, I've been leaving some space for any comments you have or any insights you have for this industry, because a lot of your colleagues in this space, other CEO's, other founders of leading vertical farming companies, listen to the show. And I like to provide a space for a conversation in it for the listeners to hear what their peers are thinking. So if you have anything that comes to mind in terms of a message for, you know, especially with your experience and having been in this industry for such a long time, I'm curious, what message do you have for your peers and colleagues in the indoor farming space?

I think that the most important message is not to try to hide behind borders and to try to share. And I think that especially when you think about CEO's and owners of company to try to create a platform that people can meet and can talk and share the core of the business and not try to find a solution that can serve everyone. Not just try to protect the company and the knowledge of the companies and technology of the companies, because it's not good for us. I think that if we join forces, we can really make a change. And I think that in this industry there are great people, many. If you look, there is a good combination between young generations and very experienced CEO's and managers. So I think that it will work. If we do it together, it will work. It's slotted range. This technology is mature, the me is there, the market is there, but we need to join together in order to make it happen.

It sounds like it's been a fascinating conversation with you. And it's so interesting to see how your experience and how you were raised and where you were raised and your experiences in the kibbutz and your experiences with the family in agriculture, how that inspired you. It's been, you know, just from this conversation, just to see how that whole journey has affected and influenced you as a person and as a leader and as someone in this space. And so it's been interesting to hear about the journey and how it's taken you to this current point. And now what I see as your leadership in this space because of the experience you've had. So it's interesting to see all the pieces in place come to play now to bring you to this point where you are. So I applaud you for your journey and for sharing and being so open with your story because I think it's really inspiring.

Thank you very much.

So for people who want to learn more, we can send them, we'll have them to the website grow dash tech.com. Is there any other place you wanted to send the listener or the viewer to connect with you? To learn more?

You can, through our website, you can send us email and contact directly. We are very happy to host anyone that wants to come and to see our headquarters and the R and D site and the POC. And really we believe that be open and sharing it will be the most important thing and this is our way to influence on this industry.

I agree. And so we'll make sure all those links are in the show notes so that they can follow if they want to connect with you. Thank you again for your time. Shalom. I really appreciate it.

Thank you very much. Thank you for this great opportunity.