Shownotes
Brad Fischer is in his 13th season as the Women’s Basketball Head Coach of the University of Wisconsin-Oshkosh. Fischer has won more than 265 games in his 12 plus seasons and guided the Titans to the NCAA Division III Championship nine of the past ten tournaments. Under Fischer’s guidance UW-Oshkosh reached the Elite Eight in 2022 and the Sweet Sixteen in 2024 in addition to numerous second and third round appearances.
Fischer earned 2014 and 2021 Central Region Coach of the Year honors from D3hoops.com as well as being named WIAC Coach of the Year four times. Fischer has helped UW-Oshkosh win 4 WIAC regular season titles in addition to 6 league tournament championships.
Fischer has led UW-Oshkosh to at least 20 victories during each of his 11 full seasons. His 260 wins entering this season ranks sixth on the WIAC’s all-time coaching list while his .785 winning percentage is fourth best among conference coaches with at least 70 wins.
Previously, Fischer spent five seasons (2006-11) as the top assistant coach and recruiting coordinator at NCAA Division II UW-Parkside. He also was an assistant for the UW-La Crosse women’s basketball team from 2003-06 after beginning his coaching career at Western Wisconsin Technical College from 2000-01 and Gale-Ettrick-Trempealeau High School from 2001-03.
Mike & Brad discuss the steps that were necessary to turn around a struggling Oshkosh women’s program into a competitive force in Division III basketball. With over 265 wins in his tenure, Fischer emphasizes the importance of building a strong culture and instilling confidence in his players. He reflects on the valuable lessons learned during his time as an assistant coach, where he gained insights into program building and the significance of adaptability in coaching strategies. Fischer also discusses the critical role of selflessness and self-awareness among players in fostering a successful team environment. As he looks to the future, he highlights the challenges of keeping all players engaged and motivated while celebrating the joys of guiding young athletes through their college careers.
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Grab pen and paper as you listen to this episode with Brad Fischer, Women’s Basketball Head Coach at the University of Wisconsin-Oshkosh.
Website - https://uwoshkoshtitans.com/sports/womens-basketball
Email - fischerb@uwosh.edu
Twitter/X - @UWOCoachFischer
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Transcripts
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Mike Klinsing:It sounds simple.
Mike Klinsing:We obviously did a lot of stuff for culture and tried to make this a place people wanted to stay at.
Mike Klinsing:And now in year 13, a lot of those things that we did in year one and two are still hallmarks of our program.
Brad Fisher:Brad Fisher is in his 13th season as the Women's Basketball Head coach at the University of Wisconsin Oshkosh.
Brad Fisher:Fisher has won more than 265 games in his 12 plus seasons and guided the Titans to the NCAA Division 3 championship nine out of the past 10 tournaments.
Brad Fisher: sh reached the Elite Eight in: Brad Fisher: pearances, Fischer earned the: Brad Fisher:Fischer has helped UW Oshkosh win four weak regular season titles in addition to six league tournament championships.
Brad Fisher:He has led UW Oshkosh to at least 20 victories during each of his 11 full seasons.
Brad Fisher:His 260 wins entering this season ranked sixth on the weak all time coaching list, while his.785 winning percentage is fourth best among conference coaches with at least 70 wins.
Brad Fisher: scher spent five seasons from: Brad Fisher: Women's basketball team from: Brad Fisher: consin Technical College from: Brad Fisher:Hey hoop heads.
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Brad Fisher:Grab pen and paper as you listen to this episode with Brad Fisher, women's basketball head coach at the University of Wisconsin, Oshkosh.
Jason Sukle:Hello and welcome to the Hoop Heads podcast.
Jason Sukle:It's Mike Klinsing here without my co host Jason Sukle this morning, but I am pleased to be joined by Brad Fisher, head Women's basketball coach at the University of Wisconsin, Oshkosh.
Jason Sukle:Brad, welcome to the Hoop Edge pod.
Mike Klinsing:Great to be here, Mike.
Mike Klinsing:Thank you for having me.
Jason Sukle:Excited to have you on.
Jason Sukle:Looking forward to diving into all the great things you've been able to do in your career.
Jason Sukle:Let's start by going back in time to when you were a kid.
Jason Sukle:Tell me a little bit about some of your first experiences with the game of basketball.
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, it's, I mean, at 45 now, it feels like a long time ago, but I went to a little parochial, parochial grade school and my dad was one of the coaches that he did all different levels, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth.
Mike Klinsing:And, and so he was, he was coaching other people's kids when I was in first, second grade and just started going to his practices and, and I think we started playing games that time as fifth graders.
Mike Klinsing:So in fourth grade I kind of jumped in with his fifth graders and, and started to play and then came home and had talks about, I mean, obviously very basic X's and O's and what we were trying to do.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that just got all of that going.
Mike Klinsing:I mean it got me in the gym a lot as a young kid.
Mike Klinsing:We didn't have a YMCA or other youth programs at that time, no clubs and things like that.
Mike Klinsing:So you played for your school and you waited until you're old enough and um, but those conversations in the house kind of led to, I think, me thinking about it a little different maybe than other kids that were just playing and, and and, you know, that's just, that's how it started.
Mike Klinsing:And, and then going up through junior high and high school, it just became.
Mike Klinsing:I got a little bit taller and, and then didn't.
Mike Klinsing:And then got taller again.
Mike Klinsing:So, so I got, I got a little training in all positions based on varying heights and comparison heights.
Mike Klinsing:And so then I learned multiple positions and I think just got a, got a really deep understanding more than other kids just being in a coach's house and then just looking at things a little bit differently as I got older and I wasn't good enough to keep playing through all of college and have that be the thing.
Mike Klinsing:So when the playing career was done, wanting to be involved in basketball kind of took hold.
Mike Klinsing:And here I am, you know, 20 some years later, still doing it.
Jason Sukle:Tell me about the influence of your dad in terms of.
Jason Sukle:When you think of yourself today as a coach.
Jason Sukle:What are some things about the way that your dad coached or the way that he approached things that you think are still a part of what you do today as a coach?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, I mean, obviously a lot simpler and.
Mike Klinsing:But I think sometimes the simplicity is the piece.
Mike Klinsing:And I remember, I think I was a sophomore maybe going into junior year, and in the summer tournament, he coached us in the summer during high school as well.
Mike Klinsing:And we were very basic and if there was a mismatch or there was a matchup on the floor that we could go after, we just did.
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, it was, it was way less sophisticated, I think, than it would be now.
Mike Klinsing:It was, hey, you got a size advantage.
Mike Klinsing:Go post up.
Mike Klinsing:And you know, we weren't, we weren't, we weren't spamming into ball screens to get switches.
Mike Klinsing:Like, it was just like, here's the matchup and go put yourself on the block and go try to score with your size.
Mike Klinsing:And, and so I think a lot of that simplicity is part of the piece, because when we talk basketball now, he has no idea what I'm talking about with, you know, tagging, ball screens and things like that, but he, he brings it back to, you know, where's, where's your advantage at?
Mike Klinsing:And I think that's probably the piece that I forget, honestly, too much sometimes, or we get caught up in the scheme.
Mike Klinsing:Get caught up in the scheme.
Mike Klinsing:Instead of taking a step back and go, where.
Mike Klinsing:Where are you better?
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, where.
Mike Klinsing:What should this game.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that piece we have taken in our program, where we look at, we look at where the, where the numbers lie and where we should have an advantage and how we're going to how we're going to do that.
Mike Klinsing:But I think that simplicity is probably the piece that stuck with me the longest.
Jason Sukle:What was your original career path when you decided that coaching was a direction that you wanted to go?
Jason Sukle:Did you see yourself being a college coach?
Jason Sukle:I know at one point you coached some high school basketball.
Jason Sukle:Where did you kind of see yourself or was it more a matter of just happenstance and opportunity that you ended up in the college game versus, let's say, being a high school coach?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, it was, honestly, it was almost neither.
Mike Klinsing:I, I got to college and, and didn't come from a super small town.
Mike Klinsing:We had 18,000 people in town.
Mike Klinsing:But we always tell our girls now you don't know.
Mike Klinsing:You don't know what you don't know.
Mike Klinsing:And so I have girls that show up for visits and aren't 100% sure of what they want to do for a career.
Mike Klinsing:And, and you know, most people it's well, what have you been surrounded by?
Mike Klinsing:Or, or what is.
Mike Klinsing:What do the people in your town do?
Mike Klinsing:And so coming from where I came from, it was pretty limited.
Mike Klinsing:Like I thought I was going to teach and coach high school.
Mike Klinsing:And then I get to college and find out and I start working in the athletic office and find out there's a job called sports Information and there's people working in promotions and there's all these jobs in sports that in a town of 18,000 people without a college, I didn't know existed.
Mike Klinsing:So I actually started working in the SID office and I was doing press releases and programs and media guides at the time and I loved it.
Mike Klinsing:Like it was.
Mike Klinsing:I'm a little bit of an introvert at times.
Mike Klinsing:So like I got to work on my own.
Mike Klinsing:I got to, you know, put together really nice media guides and I'm like this is great.
Mike Klinsing:I get to be in, in the numbers and stats and, and I still get to go to the games.
Mike Klinsing:Like I get a great seat for these games.
Mike Klinsing:So my plan was to go be an sid.
Mike Klinsing:I actually interviewed graduated in December of of my would have been my ninth semester and CO college had a SID opening.
Mike Klinsing:So I interviewed at CO for their head SID and thought well this is just perfect timing.
Mike Klinsing:Like jobs like this don't come open at semester.
Mike Klinsing:I need a job.
Mike Klinsing:And they ended up hiring internally and I had to pivot and decided then that I was going to go to grad school and pursue sport administration as a degree.
Mike Klinsing:And, and during that time I got connected after coaching in high school which really I was just doing to Stay around the game and make a little money.
Mike Klinsing:And the women's coach at UW lacrosse had offered me a chance to come help with their team with grad school.
Mike Klinsing:I was going to be on campus every day, and I was driving 45 minutes to the high school job.
Mike Klinsing:So I thought that, well, this is another good way to just stay involved.
Mike Klinsing:It won't mess up any of my grad school stuff.
Mike Klinsing:And then I got with that group, and that was my first time coaching a women's team.
Mike Klinsing:And I just fell in love with it.
Mike Klinsing:And they listened.
Mike Klinsing:They wanted to be coached.
Mike Klinsing:They really wanted to do what you asked them to do.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that was probably the biggest difference that I saw from coaching boys in high school was there was a little resistance at times.
Mike Klinsing:A lot of times, athleticism kind of overrode what you maybe wanted to do.
Mike Klinsing:Boxing out was a little less important at times.
Mike Klinsing:The fundamental pieces for some guys weren't quite as important.
Mike Klinsing:And I got to coaching women and they just wanted to do what you asked, but do it at the best level that they could.
Mike Klinsing:And I kind of gravitated toward that and then started recruiting in my second year helping out there, and that was the grad assistant that year.
Mike Klinsing:And once I started recruiting and got involved in trying to build a team and figure out what makes a good team and how do you put that.
Mike Klinsing:Those pieces together?
Mike Klinsing:I fell in love with that whole piece and then the relationships, and it just kept one thing piled on top of another and it became a passion.
Mike Klinsing:Where these are.
Mike Klinsing:These are checking the boxes of things that I didn't know was out there in a career.
Mike Klinsing:So that was never the plan, but it turned into a pretty special start, and it's continued ever since.
Jason Sukle:All right, so tell me a little bit about.
Jason Sukle:In the experiences that you have leading up to getting the head coaching job at Oshkosh.
Jason Sukle:I know you're at D2UW Parkside.
Jason Sukle:What did you learn as an assistant coach that you feel like really helped to prepare you for getting that head coaching job?
Jason Sukle:And obviously you've had the job at Oshkosh for more than a decade, so we're going back a little ways.
Jason Sukle:But just when you think about your time as an assistant, what were an.
Jason Sukle:What was an experience or two that you feel really helped you when you eventually became a head coach?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, I remember leaving the GA and I was full time for a year at lacrosse before going to Parkside.
Mike Klinsing:I remember leaving there thinking that I had a lot of the answers, and then I knew I knew I knew what I was going to do when I became a head coach or I thought I had a lot of things figured out.
Mike Klinsing:And then when I got to Parkside and it was just me and our head coach and she gave me a ton of responsibility.
Mike Klinsing:She's a great.
Mike Klinsing:I mean, I still think she's the best coach I've ever been around.
Mike Klinsing:And she played at Louisville, and Jenny Knight was.
Mike Klinsing:She was a legend in Wisconsin as a player.
Mike Klinsing:And she opened the door and said, here, you're in charge of recruiting.
Mike Klinsing:I need you to do a scout every week.
Mike Klinsing:I need you to, you know, here's the list.
Mike Klinsing:And once I got into the list, I realized that I had no clue what went into a program.
Mike Klinsing:So I was with her for five years, and my first year, I think we won maybe 11 games.
Mike Klinsing:The last year, we went to the Sweet 16 and got, I think, in the low 20s and wins 23 maybe.
Mike Klinsing:And.
Mike Klinsing:And just that whole process of building and her letting me have a pretty big stake in it, honestly, and.
Mike Klinsing:And do meeting academic meetings with kids and be involved if there was discipline or other issues.
Mike Klinsing:Like, it was just.
Mike Klinsing:I had an opportunity at Division 1 at the same time that the Parkside job came open and.
Mike Klinsing:And member in that interview being told, like, here's the two things you're going to do.
Mike Klinsing:And I think the best investment I made was taking less money at a lower level and having my hands in everything.
Mike Klinsing:And I think I learned a ton about.
Mike Klinsing:About program building, about relationship building.
Mike Klinsing:And then she taught me so much about prep and that it's your responsibility to find an answer.
Mike Klinsing:And I remember we played Drury, who is a D2 power.
Mike Klinsing:They have been as long as.
Mike Klinsing:As I've been in women's basketball.
Mike Klinsing:And.
Mike Klinsing:And I remember I had the Saturday scout for them, and.
Mike Klinsing:And I came to her on Thursday after our Thursday game when I normally would hand the scout over, and I'm like, jenny, I don't know how we beat this team.
Mike Klinsing:Like, they've got.
Mike Klinsing:They've got Molly Miller, who was.
Mike Klinsing:Who's the coach now at Grand Val or down in.
Mike Klinsing:In Arizona.
Mike Klinsing:At.
Mike Klinsing:At.
Mike Klinsing:I forget where she's at, but she's.
Mike Klinsing:She was a player for Jury at the time, and they were loaded.
Mike Klinsing:And I remember coming over with a scout, like, here's what they do.
Mike Klinsing:Here's who they are, but I don't know how we're going to.
Mike Klinsing:You know, and the next.
Mike Klinsing:The next morning she comes back after watching the film and taking my scout, and she's like, well, we're going to play one three one.
Mike Klinsing:And like, we've never played one three one.
Mike Klinsing:And, and sure enough, like Friday we put in one three one.
Mike Klinsing:And it wasn't, it wasn't like we didn't have every, every T crossed and I dotted, but, but she felt like it would mess up the rhythm and, and our kids could get behind it and they did.
Mike Klinsing:And we didn't play it the whole game, but we played it enough, especially at the start, to kind of throw them off.
Mike Klinsing:We ended up winning the game.
Mike Klinsing:And, and she taught me, when you talk about moments, she taught me that you gotta, it's on you to figure it out.
Mike Klinsing:And, and you know, we had that situation happen last year a little bit.
Mike Klinsing:We played zone for the first time in my career to start a game as a head coach.
Mike Klinsing:We played it the whole game.
Mike Klinsing:We played it again later the year, the whole game.
Mike Klinsing:And she just, she was a great reminder.
Mike Klinsing:And I think back to it all the time.
Mike Klinsing:Like, regardless of the situation, who you play, what the matchup looks like, like in your spot, you.
Mike Klinsing:It's your job to figure it out.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that that piece has stuck with me a lot and she put a lot of confidence in me that you can always find the answers.
Mike Klinsing:And we tell our team that all the time.
Mike Klinsing:If you stick with it for 40 minutes, we've got enough answers between our coaches and our players to get things figured out.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that piece has resonated with me absolutely.
Jason Sukle:I mean, that ability to adapt moment to moment, game to game, season to season, I think is one of the hallmarks of really good coaches.
Jason Sukle:As you look at your personnel, you look at who you have to play against, and then you figure out to your point, how are we going to do this?
Jason Sukle:What's the plan?
Jason Sukle:How are we going to figure it out?
Jason Sukle:And obviously it doesn't always turn into a victory.
Jason Sukle:It doesn't always turn into, hey, we're going to go undefeated in our season.
Jason Sukle:But when you have, when you have the ability to, to adapt one for yourself as a coach, it gives you so many more options in your toolbox.
Jason Sukle:And then number two for your players, when you, when you teach them to be adaptable and they're able to take what you give them on the fly and make it work, you just become a much more resilient and more difficult team to prepare for.
Jason Sukle:And I think that's something that it feels like there is, there is far less system coaches than there used to be.
Jason Sukle:I see a lot more coaches and I hear a Lot more coaches talking about what you just described, where, hey, in this particular matchup or this particular game, we need to try and do something different in order to be able to allow our team to have success.
Jason Sukle:And so I think that's a tremendous lesson that you learned.
Jason Sukle:And then the other thing that really struck me when you were talking there, Brad, was about the opportunity to go to a Division 1 school where there's obviously a much bigger staff and your responsibilities are more narrow versus going to Division 2, where you were going to have a lot more responsibilities and be able to put your hand in a lot of different things.
Jason Sukle:And it's interesting because obviously on the podcast, we've talked to coaches who have started their careers sort of in both places.
Jason Sukle:Right.
Jason Sukle:We've had coaches that have started out at the Division 1 level, and then we've had coaches that have started out at the Division 2 or Division 3 level.
Jason Sukle:And I hear that same sentiment that you just expressed from the coaches that started the lower levels, saying, I feel like I'm a way, way better coach and have a much better understanding of the totality of what goes into a program, because I started at those lower levels where I got to have a hand in the administrative stuff and the recruiting and the scouting and just everything that goes into building a program.
Jason Sukle:Whereas in Division 1, because the staffs are so large, your responsibilities are much more narrow.
Jason Sukle:And, of course, when you think out into the greater public world, most people, when they think of college basketball, they think of division one.
Jason Sukle:And so when kids are 10 or 12 or even when they're in college, that's what most people dream of in terms of getting to that level.
Jason Sukle:But when you start talking about what makes someone a good coach, I think that the ability to have your hand in so many things early in your career definitely makes for an experience that you don't always get when you're at the higher levels.
Jason Sukle:And it sounds like that's the experience that you had for sure.
Mike Klinsing:Yeah.
Mike Klinsing:And when I showed up to that interview and all the coaches were at the dinner table the first night, the assistants were texting recruits the whole time.
Mike Klinsing: And that's: Mike Klinsing:So I.
Mike Klinsing:I was not.
Mike Klinsing:I wasn't.
Mike Klinsing:I wasn't texting recruits yet at our level.
Mike Klinsing:And so there was just a bunch of those things I wasn't going to be able to scout.
Mike Klinsing:And I hadn't done a full scout in my time at lacrosse.
Mike Klinsing:So, like, yeah, I just.
Mike Klinsing:I think things would have been so different for me.
Mike Klinsing:I mean I know they would have and I could have been at eight different schools for a year or two and you know, that part I don't think fits my personality.
Mike Klinsing:So people still think when I go back and they kind of look at me sideways that I turned that down.
Mike Klinsing:Coming from a D3 because that was a huge opportunity coming from D3 as an assistant coach for three years, getting a chance to go to Division 1 at a mid major conference and it didn't make sense to a lot of people including my family at the time.
Mike Klinsing:But I felt like if I am going to do this for real, I've got a lot of learning to do and at least I feel like I had enough self awareness at that time to know that that was the right move.
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Jason Sukle:Connect Tell me about the interview process at Oshkosh.
Jason Sukle:What do you remember about it and why did you feel like it was the right opportunity for you at that moment?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, I, I felt like we had a lot of success at Parkside and we were not fully funded.
Mike Klinsing:So I felt like we got to the Sweet 16 that last year that I was, that I was coaching and it just felt like we probably hit our ceiling at five and a half scholarships and going against schools that had 10.
Mike Klinsing:And so when Oshkosh was open, I mean it was the program.
Mike Klinsing:When I was at lacrosse, which would have been six years earlier, Oshkosh was the program like it was them, Stevens Point and Eau Claire and it was the same three schools so I knew you could have success there.
Mike Klinsing:They had won a national title in the late 90s.
Mike Klinsing:So you know, there's not a lot of schools at our level that have won national titles, so I knew that part was possible.
Mike Klinsing:We've got a great league.
Mike Klinsing:So you know, when you're in our league, if you can win our league or compete at the top of our league, you can compete nationally.
Mike Klinsing:And, and I say it to girls that come visit all the time.
Mike Klinsing:If we're going to put in all the work that we do for 12 months a year.
Mike Klinsing:But especially for the players, you know, from the time school starts until the end of the end of March, like you want to have stakes when you play.
Mike Klinsing:And you know, in 13 years, every game that we've played has had something on the line.
Mike Klinsing:Whether it's playing for a conference title, trying to be an at large team, like literally whatever we're at now, 300 some games that I've coached here, going on 350, like every game has had something on the line.
Mike Klinsing:So.
Mike Klinsing:So that was the process for me.
Mike Klinsing:And.
Mike Klinsing:And luckily I just.
Mike Klinsing:I'd been in the state the whole time, which I think helped me a lot.
Mike Klinsing:My connections through AAU programs, I think moved the needle for them a little bit.
Mike Klinsing:That, you know, having been at lacrosse in the northwest side of the state and then at Parkside in the southeast corner, like I recruited Minnesota and Illinois and there was just a big web over those nine years that I had of experience going into that.
Mike Klinsing:And I was still young.
Mike Klinsing:I was like 30, 32, I think, when I interviewed.
Mike Klinsing:So to have, you know, nine years of college experience with some high school.
Mike Klinsing:So I'm in double digits at 32 with coaching experience.
Mike Klinsing:I think it was just a perfect storm.
Mike Klinsing:And you know, I was fortunate enough that that was a match.
Mike Klinsing:Cause that's the other piece.
Mike Klinsing:And I've told my assistants that I've went other places.
Mike Klinsing:Like, you can have this job that you're staring at, but you have no idea who else is interested in it.
Mike Klinsing:Like, right.
Mike Klinsing:Is.
Mike Klinsing:Is there a hall of fame alum?
Mike Klinsing:Is there a coach that used to coach that wants to come back?
Mike Klinsing:Like, you can have your eyes on places that you think that's where I want to end up.
Mike Klinsing:Like when I left lacrosse, my.
Mike Klinsing:I thought, like, I want to come back here and be the head coach someday.
Mike Klinsing:And as I've moved along, like that job had opened a few times and I realized, like, I have one of the best jobs in the country where I'm at.
Mike Klinsing:So you just never know.
Mike Klinsing:And you just got to do all the work that you can to put yourself in position for when something of like Oshkosh or a place that you can win at, that you've done the work that puts you in a position to at least have a chance.
Mike Klinsing:And that's kind of what I felt when I interviewed there.
Mike Klinsing:And I'm like, I know you can win here.
Mike Klinsing:And that doesn't mean you're going to.
Mike Klinsing:But there's gotta be an infrastructure in place that has allowed that to happen in the past.
Jason Sukle:So when you step in there, and they had been a little bit down for the couple years before you got there and obviously had a great history of the program.
Jason Sukle:And as you said, when you looked at it, you knew that the capability to win at a high level was there.
Jason Sukle:What did you have to do in your mind to come in and sort of reestablish what the Oshkosh women's basketball program had been?
Jason Sukle:What were some of the keys to those first, let's say two, three years to get the program going in the direction that you wanted it?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, I mean, there was a big confidence gap, I think, in.
Mike Klinsing:Because in our league, and I'm sure most leagues feel this way, but in our league the margin is pretty small.
Mike Klinsing:Even, you know, the best teams have typically the most talent, which I think is always true.
Mike Klinsing:But in our league, the team that finishes seventh and eighth has a ton of talent too.
Mike Klinsing:There's not like last year, our two teams that didn't make the conference tournament both had multiple ranked wins during the season.
Mike Klinsing:So like, it's just, it's a fine margin between being really good and not making the conference tournament in our league.
Mike Klinsing:And so I thought there was a huge confidence gap for the players that, that I inherited at Oshkosh and what they thought was possible because they just didn't, they hadn't experienced it.
Mike Klinsing:They were 1 in 15 the year before I got there.
Mike Klinsing:They didn't understand what's the process for making the NCAA tournament.
Mike Klinsing:Like, we, we had a parent come in, we were six and two my first year and had a parent come in that was upset that that daughter didn't play in our trip to Vegas because they fundraised for it.
Mike Klinsing:I was like, this is not, this is not AU or this is not a, this is not a club, a club trip to play.
Mike Klinsing:Like we're trying to make the NCAA tournament, which they thought was crazy, you know, at eight games into my career.
Mike Klinsing:But we finished that year 20 and 6 and, and we're on the bubble.
Mike Klinsing:D3 Hoops had us in, you know, on the night before the selection show.
Mike Klinsing:So like, they just, they just didn't understand, you know, what, what the landscape was.
Mike Klinsing:And I think once we got them feeling like they could win games, which we did right at the start, we pulled a couple upsets early.
Mike Klinsing:Like, we were able to kind of turn the, like, the investment a little bit, like, and I was really fortunate.
Mike Klinsing:I had three seniors that first year that had lost a lot of games their first three years that stuck with it, that were good players and they were willing to do anything.
Mike Klinsing:And I think they saw the vision.
Mike Klinsing:They saw how much prep was going in.
Mike Klinsing:Like, our scour reports were way different than what they had done.
Mike Klinsing:I think our purpose to practice and what we were trying to accomplish connected with them.
Mike Klinsing:So.
Mike Klinsing:And we always felt like we had a plan.
Mike Klinsing:And that's what Jenny and Parkside told me to, like, you've got to.
Mike Klinsing:If you're going to go in with a plan, you better be able to sell it and get them to buy in and be on board and feel good about it.
Mike Klinsing:Even, like you said, even if you don't win the game or it doesn't work out, like, everyone's got to go in feeling like this is.
Mike Klinsing:We're on the same page.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that group helped sell that down.
Mike Klinsing:Down the line to the.
Mike Klinsing:To the new girls, to the young girls.
Mike Klinsing:And then.
Mike Klinsing:And then going out to recruit, it was just.
Mike Klinsing:We had enough success that first year, and that felt really good about the connections.
Mike Klinsing:And people knew that we had done really well at Parkside.
Mike Klinsing:So I think they felt like this guy has at least an idea of how to help rebuild this.
Mike Klinsing:And we hit the ground running and won 20 that first year, and they've done it ever since.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that was.
Mike Klinsing:That's.
Mike Klinsing:That turn of the confidence and the purpose were probably the biggest things.
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, that sounds simple.
Mike Klinsing:Like, we obviously did a lot of stuff for culture and tried to make this a place people wanted to stay at, and they weren't just coming to try it out and see how it goes.
Mike Klinsing:And now in year 13, a lot of those things that we did in year one and two are still hallmarks of our program.
Jason Sukle:When you go out on the road and you're recruiting and whether that was early on or where you are now, what are some of the things that you're looking for in a player?
Jason Sukle:And obviously, again, I'm not necessarily talking about basketball skill wise, because there's a certain level of skill and talent that you have to be able to have in order to play college basketball.
Jason Sukle:But thinking more along the lines of intangibles culture, like, what kind of kid are you looking for that you want to bring into your program?
Jason Sukle:And then what are sort of the telltale signs that you're looking for or that you're.
Jason Sukle:When you're talking to, whether it's an AAU coach, a high School coach, a parent.
Jason Sukle:What are some of the clues that you're looking for that let you know that hey, this, this girl might be a good fit for our program?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, we always, we talk about being selfless and self aware and I think those are the two.
Mike Klinsing:Like they hear it every time they come on a visit.
Mike Klinsing:They hear it at elite camps.
Mike Klinsing:Like we want really selfless kids.
Mike Klinsing:You will have to sacrifice.
Mike Klinsing:Like we've got 15 all state players, high school, all state players on our roster and I might be under underselling that there might be a 16 or 17.
Mike Klinsing:So someone's showing up and not in the rotation that was just all state in our, in our state or in Illinois or Minnesota.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that selflessness is, is number one.
Mike Klinsing:We've had a ton of years.
Mike Klinsing:We're in another one this year where we've got like I, I'm not even sure who our leading scorer is.
Mike Klinsing:We've got, I think we've got three kids between maybe eight and 11 points a game.
Mike Klinsing:We've got a bunch of sixes and fives.
Mike Klinsing:Like that's kind of been the makeup of our team.
Mike Klinsing:We've tried to be bulletproof to graduation if, if we're doing a good job developing and we haven't focused on one or two players that need to carry us that we're going to be able to survive graduation and moving on to the next class.
Mike Klinsing:So that selfless piece is first self aware in them understanding that you know, they're not perfect nor do they need to be, that they're not great at everything.
Mike Klinsing:We don't need everyone to prove they can score at the rim.
Mike Klinsing:Hit a pull up, hit a step back three like and I think we've got a really good self awareness to ourselves as a program but also individually of the stuff we need to work on and limiting, limiting our weaknesses and making sure that we don't put everything on display for people every night that we're going to try to prove something.
Mike Klinsing:And I think those two things character wise for our girls have stood out and families have been a big part too.
Mike Klinsing:Like we've never had a player transfer out of our program to play somewhere else in 13 years.
Mike Klinsing:And it starts with parents who tell their kids, hey, like you're not getting the minutes or maybe you don't have the role you want right now, but if you keep working, you're going to have your time and your moment.
Mike Klinsing:And you know, I know when, especially when we got started and just hearing other programs and seeing retention in other places Like, I think people have a different, different sense of what college is going to look like.
Mike Klinsing:I think we do a good job of painting the picture.
Mike Klinsing:Like, it's not going to go perfect.
Mike Klinsing:There's going to be a lot of ups and downs.
Mike Klinsing:As a freshman, you may not play a ton.
Mike Klinsing:I know we've lost some players telling them that, but I know it's, I know it's the truth.
Mike Klinsing:And I.
Mike Klinsing:And then they've gone other places and not played there right away, even though they said they want to go somewhere they, where they could play.
Mike Klinsing:And so I think those, those have kind of been the hallmarks of what we look for.
Mike Klinsing:And, and I think the biggest things I've learned to listen to are when, when families come for Venice, we, we usually eat with the parents at lunch and the player will go with our players so they can ask about us and talk about what player life is like.
Mike Klinsing:But I've picked up a lot of subtle things from parents and kind of getting a sense of how, how does basketball get talked about at their house?
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, we've, I've had had parents show up and tell me the, you know, in July, the date that their kid is probably going to score their thousand points in, in December.
Mike Klinsing:And that's a huge, that's a huge red flag to me.
Mike Klinsing:Like, if, if that's, if that's the focus.
Mike Klinsing:Like, I love, I want parents that are passionate about their kids and, and really involved.
Mike Klinsing:And but if, if it's all about their stats or their numbers or their recruitment and there's obviously lanes for that.
Mike Klinsing:Like, there's certain times of the year when that, when those things do need to be the focus.
Mike Klinsing:And maybe parents feel like they do need to sell kids.
Mike Klinsing:But usually by the time we've gotten on a visit, we're not in a sales part anymore.
Mike Klinsing:Like, we've, we've talked to enough coaches.
Mike Klinsing:We've figured out where they're at, basketball wise and what kind of people we think they are.
Mike Klinsing:And we want to hear parents and families that want to show up and support the Titans or, or cheer for Oshkosh.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that first year, one of the things I saw was I had a bunch of pockets of parents around the gym that were kind of sizing everybody up and trying to figure out where does my kid fit.
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, I kind of hope this kid maybe doesn't play great so my kid gets a chance.
Mike Klinsing:And I think the evolution of our program has been we've got a group of families and parents that, you know, the.
Mike Klinsing:We've got a senior parent all the time that'll send the email, let people know, hey, this is where we're going for dinner.
Mike Klinsing:This is where we're gonna go for drinks after.
Mike Klinsing:This is the hotel we're staying at, and this is where the team is at.
Mike Klinsing:And they've just been great supporters of our team.
Mike Klinsing:And, you know, the best parents I have are the ones who.
Mike Klinsing:Whose players don't play as much as they wish, and I wish they did, that will come up at the end of the year and tell us that their kid's having a great time.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that's.
Mike Klinsing:We've been able to identify those parents in the recruiting process, better and better as time has went on.
Mike Klinsing:And now I've got a group that, regardless of what our record is, I love coaching and I love seeing their parents on Saturdays at games, or if we're at the hotel in the lobby waiting for the girls when we come back, or if we have dinners after a Friday night game that they kind of sit with our team.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that part has helped our culture and they've become our best recruiters and.
Mike Klinsing:And they've done a really good job of kind of moving things forward for what it takes to be a perennial program that's always trying to compete for a national title.
Jason Sukle:It's interesting because oftentimes I think people think of when you get to college basketball that the parental side of it is maybe less important than it is at the high school level.
Jason Sukle:And I'm guessing there's probably less communication between you and the parents on your team than there might be between a high school player and parents and a high school coach.
Jason Sukle:But still, it's really interesting to hear you talk about just how important, again, that messaging that the players get at home from their families.
Jason Sukle:Because we all know that when you have those outside influences, right, those are people in.
Jason Sukle:In terms of the parents who aren't in your locker room who don't know what's going on, you know, moment to moment.
Jason Sukle:And if that messaging coming from home is bad and gets in the earth of players, it's easy for that stuff to infiltrate the locker room and kind of knock down all the things that you've been trying to build in terms of the culture.
Jason Sukle:So when you start talking about, hey, it's right from day one, making sure that not only is the kid the right fit, but is the parent the right fit?
Jason Sukle:Because like you said, I think the idea.
Jason Sukle:This is always something that I don't think That a lot of parents, if you went to AAU tournaments and you talk to parents or players of kids who are in, let's say, seventh through 11th grade, I don't think they necessarily always understand that, you know, just because you're a great high school player or you're a great AAU player, you're not walking into any level of college basketball.
Jason Sukle:And the coach isn't just handing you the ball and saying, all right, go play your 38 minutes with the ball in your hands and do whatever you want.
Jason Sukle:Which is what everybody's dream probably is when they're in, when they're the parent of an 8th or 9th grade basketball player.
Jason Sukle:And so I think to just.
Jason Sukle:To be able to inject, you know, some realism into what this whole process and what this thing is all about, I'm sure, as you said, has benefited you in terms of how you, how you go about putting your program together.
Jason Sukle:Tell me about just the process of being on the road.
Jason Sukle:And from a women's basketball perspective, how has the AAU basketball landscape changed for you as a head coach on the women's side in terms of just the number of girls participating in the tournaments and just sort of the explosion of girls AAU basketball, which again, when you think back 15, 20 years ago, I'm sure it was much more difficult to be able.
Jason Sukle:You were scouting a lot more high school games, I'm sure, than you are today, where you just have the opportunity to be able to see all these kids at all these big AAU events.
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, it's.
Mike Klinsing:I mean, women's basketball is the best place it's ever been.
Mike Klinsing:And I was like, it's now we're in the third generation.
Mike Klinsing:A lot of cases of girls playing.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that's the biggest difference for boys is like a lot of players that I coached when I first started, like, maybe their mom played, but maybe not.
Mike Klinsing:And now I've got girls.
Mike Klinsing:Now I've got girls who's.
Mike Klinsing:Whose grandma's potentially played, but for sure their moms did, or likely their moms did.
Mike Klinsing:So that in itself has been a huge difference.
Mike Klinsing:It's why the skill level's getting gotten so much better.
Mike Klinsing:But yeah, when I first started out, like, there was a handful of AU tournaments, it was the best of the best playing at those.
Mike Klinsing:And then it was a lot of high school or high school team camps or high school tournaments in the summer.
Mike Klinsing:And it's, it's evolved a ton.
Mike Klinsing:I mean, there's.
Mike Klinsing:Now there's.
Mike Klinsing:We can't even figure out Some weekends where we should go because there's five different tournaments and.
Mike Klinsing: ecause it was, you know, it's: Mike Klinsing:We get in hotels and driving, or we've got five tournaments that we try to jump in the streams on and just check in with kids.
Mike Klinsing:So that part is.
Mike Klinsing:Has moved the needle a ton.
Mike Klinsing:I think kids are a little more willing to travel now than maybe they were back then, so we can get players from a little further away than maybe when I first started.
Mike Klinsing:But the growth of the game has been.
Mike Klinsing:Has been huge for us and it's made our level better.
Mike Klinsing:And it's just kind of trickled down from.
Mike Klinsing:From the top down where the best players.
Mike Klinsing:I mean, my.
Mike Klinsing:My players that aren't part of the rotation right now are so much more skilled and talented than.
Mike Klinsing:Than those.
Mike Klinsing:The players in that same position 15 years ago.
Mike Klinsing:And that's why I actually think the parents are more important now, because these kids are like a lot of them.
Mike Klinsing:It is their first struggle because they were the best player in high school.
Mike Klinsing:So they were.
Mike Klinsing:They were getting the ball, they were getting the minutes, like.
Mike Klinsing:And now they show up and have to look at things a little different.
Mike Klinsing:My players right now are all the best they've ever been as basketball players, but some of them don't feel like it because they're not as good relative to the people they're playing against every day.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that's a different piece that we try to pay close attention to.
Mike Klinsing:And I think as the game continues to grow and more players continue to play, I think that realization and.
Mike Klinsing:And that psychology becomes more important for girls as they move into college, because I think that has been a part of retention.
Mike Klinsing:And girls quitting or transferring is that it's such a change to what they had been used to growing up, probably being the best player or one of the best players in their area.
Mike Klinsing:So I think that part we've paid a lot of attention to.
Mike Klinsing:And I think as more and more players play and get better, that's only going to increase too.
Jason Sukle:How do you balance that in a practice setting when you have like, how many girls do you have on your roster?
Mike Klinsing:I have.
Mike Klinsing:Well, this year we.
Mike Klinsing:So we had three with ACL, so we have more than we normally.
Mike Klinsing:We have 21 in our program.
Mike Klinsing:Typically we'd have 18.
Mike Klinsing:Gotcha.
Mike Klinsing:But we knew.
Mike Klinsing:We knew this year we were going to have some people out with injuries.
Mike Klinsing:So we actually have.
Mike Klinsing:Have a couple out for the year, and then a couple working on rehab right now.
Mike Klinsing:So Normally we have 17 or 18, which is our normal.
Jason Sukle:How do you balance the opportunities in practice for maybe those girls who aren't getting the minutes and games that they would like to make sure that they're continuing to develop?
Jason Sukle:And just how do you keep their morale high?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, I mean, it's been a huge part of who we are.
Mike Klinsing:We have more players that don't play as freshmen, play little as sophomores, that become all conference players than anyone in our league.
Mike Klinsing:And I think we don't do a whole lot, like, we don't have a scout team.
Mike Klinsing:Um, we never, I mean, there's times where, you know, at the end of the year, players that maybe aren't in the rotation play together a little bit more.
Mike Klinsing:But I mean, we, we do a lot of mixing and matching and, and making sure that our young players are playing with our vets and our starters to, to get better reps and better quality reps with them.
Mike Klinsing:And, and also just to see, like, hey, they're all in the right spot and you're kind of not right.
Mike Klinsing:And when you play with four good players that have experience, like, you're going to feel a little bit out of place, but the more you do it, the closer you get.
Mike Klinsing:So it's a, it's a balance of making sure.
Mike Klinsing:Obviously we build chemistry and that the players that are playing the most get reps together in practice.
Mike Klinsing:But we try as much as we can to not really worry about in practice who's.
Mike Klinsing:Who's in what group together do we have.
Mike Klinsing:Do we have someone to take the ball out, someone to bring it up like.
Mike Klinsing:And we play five out.
Mike Klinsing:So if we've got two fours, a three and a two and a one, like, we should be good to play.
Mike Klinsing:So I think we've done a good job of trying to make sure that we're getting better every day and we're lucky.
Mike Klinsing:I think with as many good players as we have, our bar is pretty high every day.
Mike Klinsing:And I think teams that don't have the depth that we do probably have a harder time getting better every day in practice.
Mike Klinsing:So we kind of stress that piece like you're, you're surrounded whether you start and play 28 minutes or you don't play a lot.
Mike Klinsing:Like every day you're getting a nationally ranked team on the other side of you to get better in practice.
Mike Klinsing:And I think we've done a good job of just kind of being like, it kind of doesn't matter who's out there.
Mike Klinsing:And when people get hurt, like we had last year in the NCAA Tournament, like people ready to step up.
Mike Klinsing:And I think that mentality and that selflessness is a piece of that, too, where everyone understands, like, it's our responsibility to help each other get better so that when it's their time, they're ready.
Mike Klinsing:And, and whether we always say, it's never your time, it's, or it's never your turn, it's your time.
Mike Klinsing:And we've.
Mike Klinsing:We've avoided the, hey, now I'm a junior or senior.
Mike Klinsing:I didn't play much.
Mike Klinsing:Well, now it's.
Mike Klinsing:It's my turn.
Mike Klinsing:Like that your.
Mike Klinsing:Your turn is earned.
Mike Klinsing:And, and so for us, it's about being ready when it's your time.
Mike Klinsing:And I think we've done a really good job, and our players have done a good job of when it's their time and their numbers called, like, they've done the work ahead of time.
Mike Klinsing:And we had the best offseason we ever had this year because, you know, we were two points short of the Elite Eight.
Mike Klinsing:That team went to the national championship game.
Mike Klinsing:So we've got a hungry group, and they've done a really good job motivating and pushing themselves.
Mike Klinsing:So I think they've done a lot of that work for us.
Jason Sukle:All right, before we wrap up, two part quick question.
Jason Sukle:Biggest challenge moving forward and your biggest joy.
Jason Sukle:So what.
Jason Sukle:What do you see as being your biggest challenge over the next year or so?
Jason Sukle:And then what brings you the most joy about what you get to do every day?
Mike Klinsing:Yeah, the biggest challenge for me is just trying to have a program where it's impossible to keep everyone happy, but to keep everyone feeling like they're an important piece to what we're doing.
Mike Klinsing:And I struggle every day with people that don't get the playing time that they wish or that I wish.
Mike Klinsing:It's hard for me as I get older.
Mike Klinsing:When I was younger, I was way too cut through.
Mike Klinsing:I was worried about winning games and X's and O's and.
Mike Klinsing:And I still struggled making sure I have the right relationships 24 7.
Mike Klinsing:But that's the biggest one.
Mike Klinsing:The biggest joy, though, is I know what it's like to watch people go through a college career, not just as a player, but the ups and downs.
Mike Klinsing:And we deal with a lot of real stuff as time goes on over the five years from recruitment till a kid graduates and.
Mike Klinsing:And that piece.
Mike Klinsing:And Senior day is the hardest day I have, but it's also the best.
Mike Klinsing:The best day of looking Back at everyone's story.
Mike Klinsing:And I still have.
Mike Klinsing:I'm still young enough to be able to keep a good memory.
Mike Klinsing:And where was I when they committed?
Mike Klinsing:What.
Mike Klinsing:What do we talk about?
Mike Klinsing:You know, what was your career going to look like?
Mike Klinsing:And then how does it end up?
Mike Klinsing:And it never matches exactly what we talked about.
Mike Klinsing:But we've gotten so many great highs and so many great moments that when I get to senior day and write their senior speech, there's always tears because we kind of look at each other like, wow, it's unbelievable how much we've been through together.
Mike Klinsing:And.
Mike Klinsing:And then, you know, seeing them come back in Alumni day is probably the next biggest joy of, you know, we're having 30, 40 people show back up and.
Mike Klinsing:And it's.
Mike Klinsing:And they're all cheering for our team.
Mike Klinsing:They don't.
Mike Klinsing:They want our next team to be the best team.
Mike Klinsing:They don't.
Mike Klinsing:None of our alums are hoping that we don't do as well.
Mike Klinsing:So they're my team that people talk about, and I'm super proud of that.
Mike Klinsing:So, you know, we have a special program, and I'm super proud of our girls and our parents for maintaining it.
Mike Klinsing:And now we're, you know, in the top five in the country right now, and we're trying to get to a final four, which is something that we have not done during my time.
Mike Klinsing:And that's our mission.
Jason Sukle:All right, before we get out, Brad, I want to give you a chance to share.
Jason Sukle:How can people get in touch with you, contact you, email, social media, whatever you feel comfortable with.
Jason Sukle:And then when I'll jump back in, I'll wrap things up.
Mike Klinsing:Yeah.
Mike Klinsing:Fisher B.
Mike Klinsing:@ UW osh edu.
Mike Klinsing:I've.
Mike Klinsing:I've done a lot of high school clinics with people on five out.
Mike Klinsing:We run a lot of five out.
Mike Klinsing:We run the pack, which is very, very popular in Wisconsin, especially when Dick Bennett was.
Mike Klinsing:Was coaching here.
Mike Klinsing:But so email.
Mike Klinsing:I'm also on an X fill uwl.
Mike Klinsing:Coach Fisher.
Mike Klinsing:I have a lot of Milwaukee Bucks takes, probably more than my own team, but I feel a little more comfortable talking out loud about them than us.
Mike Klinsing:But there you go.
Mike Klinsing:But, yeah, and I love.
Mike Klinsing:I love pulling people's stuff.
Mike Klinsing:I.
Mike Klinsing:I got 600 plays bookmarked right now on X, so at some point, I'm going to get back in and pull those.
Mike Klinsing:But.
Mike Klinsing:But that's.
Mike Klinsing:That's been a great place for sharing and for people to connect.
Mike Klinsing:So.
Mike Klinsing:So we're still there.
Mike Klinsing:But I really appreciate it, Mike, and it was.
Mike Klinsing:It was great talking to you Absolutely.
Jason Sukle:Brad, can I thank you enough for taking the time out of your schedule this morning to join us?
Jason Sukle:Really appreciate it.
Jason Sukle:And to everyone out there, thanks for listening and we will catch you on our next episode.
Jason Sukle:Thanks.
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Mike Klinsing:Thanks for listening to the Hoop Heads podcast presented by Head Start Basketball.
