Mastering Public Speaking & Business Soundboarding with Phil Fraser

In this episode of Present Influence, host John Ball dives into the importance of presentation skills in professional success and how being a confident speaker can give you a competitive edge in business.

John sits down with guest Phil Fraser, who shares his unique role as a business sounding board, helping small business owners combat the loneliness of leadership and provide much-needed guidance.

The conversation covers Phil’s background in presentation skills, tips for handling Q&A sessions, and essential elements that make speakers listenable.

They also discuss the impact of podcasting on professional growth and valuable lessons in hosting and guesting on podcasts.

Tune in for practical insights and strategies to enhance your public speaking and leadership capabilities.

keywords

business sounding board, business coach, business mentor, small business owners, loneliness, challenges, presentation training, communication skills, Q&A sessions, podcasting, podcasting, guesting, audience building, business sounding board, Leeds Business Podcast, entertaining, educational, motivational, inspirational, strategy

takeaways

• A business sounding board is a combination of a business coach and a business mentor, providing support and guidance to small business owners.
• Having someone to talk to and bounce ideas off of can help alleviate the loneliness and challenges of running a business.
• Effective communication skills, including presentation skills, are crucial in business and can boost professional credibility and confidence.
• Handling Q&A sessions during presentations can be done by using specific phrases like 'Who has the first question?' and 'Who has the final question?' to encourage audience participation and maintain control.
• Podcasting is a valuable tool for reaching a wider audience and sharing expertise and insights. Guesting on other people's podcasts can help build your audience and raise your profile in a specific community.
• Creating your own podcast allows you to stand out and target a niche audience.
• Podcasts should be entertaining, educational, motivational, and inspirational to keep listeners engaged.
• Being a podcast host can enhance your positioning and credibility in your industry.
• As a business sounding board, Phil helps small to medium-sized business owners create a strategy to achieve their goals.

titles

• The Power of Podcasting
• Tips for Handling Q&A Sessions The Benefits of Hosting a Podcast

Sound Bites

• "I work with small business owners to stop them being lonely at the top."
• "I help business owners to be better business owners and to not be lonely at the top."
• "My background going all the way back, my initial first half of my career, I sold advertising space."
• "I will guest on other people's podcasts... I'm piggybacking on your audience."
• "How hard can it be to run your own podcast?... It's a lot harder than it looks."
• "I launched the Leeds Business Podcast... to raise my profile in the Leeds business community."

00:00 Introduction to Presentation Skills

00:24 Meet Phil Fraser: Business Sounding Board

01:32 The Role of a Business Sounding Board

05:43 Phil's Background in Presentation Skills

09:03 The Power of Public Speaking

09:57 Transformative Journey of Public Speaking

16:17 The Importance of Presentation Skills in Education

18:53 Mastering Q&A Sessions

20:31 Effective Q&A Techniques

21:45 Podcasting in the Professional World

22:01 Phil's Podcasting Journey Begins

22:30 Guesting on Other Podcasts

23:22 Creating the Leeds Business Podcast

25:04 Local vs. International Podcasting

26:03 The Art of Good Hosting and Guesting

30:44 Balancing Entertainment and Education

34:08 Professional Benefits of Podcasting

36:50 Phil's Ideal Clients and Strategy

40:35 Final Thoughts and Takeaways

How does having great presentation skills give you a serious

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edge in your professional life?

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Being able to step forward as a good

speaker and presenter is going to give you

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a huge competitive edge in business most

people are terrified of public speaking.

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How grateful do you think your colleagues

are going to be when you are the go

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to Presentation and public speaking

person that they can breathe a sigh of

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relief that it's not going to be them.

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My guest today is Phil Fraser and in the

show Phil's going to explain his unique

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role as a business sounding board and how

he distinguishes that from traditional

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business coaching and mentorship.

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Phil generally works with small

business owners who are looking

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to generate serious revenue.

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You know how they say

it's lonely at the top.

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Phil is there to help people combat

the loneliness of leadership Now he's

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also going to delve into some of his

extensive background in presentation

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skills detailing how his experience

as a sales trainer has given him a

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unique edge and he's going to share

some practical tips for managing Q& A

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sessions and one of my favorite parts

is that Phil is also going to share four

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things that make you very listenable.

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So welcome to Present Influence the

show that helps business leaders develop

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the skills to influence and inspire.

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My name is John Ball, I'm a keynote

coach and professional speaker and your

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guide on the journey to leadership level

communication and presentation skills.

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My mission is to provide rising

business leaders like you with

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everything you need to maximize your

impact and present with influence.

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Follow the show on your favorite

podcast apps for weekly episodes and

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interviews with influence experts.

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As we kick things off on the show today.

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Phil is going to explain what a

business sounding board does as a role.

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I would say one of the most

important things is that he becomes

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that trusted voice, for people

who may be don't have anyone that

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they can turn to in a business.

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But let's hear from Phil.

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Phil Fraser: Thanks

for having me on, John.

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okay, what's a business sounding board?

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In very simple terms, it's sort

of somewhere between a business

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coach and a business mentor.

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So I work with small business owners.

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So anyone between, let's say half

a million turnover to about three

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million, usually the staff of sort

of three to 12, that sort of size.

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And I work with the business owner

to stop them being lonely at the top.

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Cause we all know running your

own business is lonely at the top.

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When I first thought about doing this

I didn't want to call myself a business

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coach because I think business coaches,

definition, teach a certain skill.

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So it might be sales training.

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It might be presentation training.

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It's a coach, it's like a sports coach.

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It teaches you to be something better.

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And a business mentor often is business

or sector specific, and it tends to

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be somebody who's a bit further down

the road than you are in your role.

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So you need a mentor, somebody

who's walked the same path

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that you're about to walk.

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And I felt I didn't do either of those.

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I mean, I ran my own

business for 18 years.

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So I was very much a generalist, but

having run a business, I have, I'd

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always felt that lonely at the top.

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Who can I speak to?

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As business owners, hands up,

everybody, we all feel like we're

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making it up as we go along.

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And you can't sit in front of your team

and go, Hey guys, I'm going to I'm not

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really sure what we're doing here, but

this feels like the right way to go,

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which tends to be how business works.

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But if you've got somebody to talk

to, somebody outside the business,

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somebody who's been there and done that.

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Somebody you can sit down with and

say, Hey, Phil, I don't know what

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I'm doing, or I've got this problem.

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I don't know how to solve it,

or I've got this opportunity.

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I don't know how to maximize it.

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Or just to be an accountability partner.

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So, great running your own business.

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You make your own decisions,

but you tend not to do the

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things that You should be doing.

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you need somebody to go, John, last week,

you said you were going to do X, Y, and Z.

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Did you do them?

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And you're like no, I did

the things I like doing.

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I didn't do the horrible things I'm

supposed to do as business owner.

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So that's what I do?

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I help business owners to be

better business owners and

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to not be lonely at the top.

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So that's why I call myself

a business sounding board.

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John: One of the things that I shared

with Phil here was that myself and

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a friend that had an idea about

kind of being like a surrogate

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boss for people who are business by

themselves and don't have a boss.

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Because sometimes we need that person to

be able to tell us what to do and hold

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us accountable so that we can be our

own employee, as well as our own boss.

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One thing's for sure that people like

Phil needed because the old adage is true.

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It's lonely at the top.

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Phil Fraser: Yeah and you can

define it in lots of different ways.

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Sometimes it almost feels like being a

non exec director for a small company

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that doesn't need a non exec director.

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Sometimes it is being that accountability

partner, but most of the time it's me.

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Asking questions of the client and

saying, have you thought about this?

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Have you thought about that?

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How does that feel?

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How does that work?

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And the classic, why

do you do it like that?

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We've always done it like that.

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And obviously somebody looking

from the outside in can go, well

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why do you do it?

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Have you considered this?

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Have you considered that?

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And often clients will have

problems that I came across.

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In my business career.

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And it's not me saying I did it.

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I had that problem.

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I did this.

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You should go away and do it.

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It's I had that problem.

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This is how it played out for me.

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Have you considered this?

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Have you considered that?

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Have you considered the other, and

then they can go away and go, ah,

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now I know what I should be doing.

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I'm not telling them what to do.

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I'm helping them work out

what they should be doing.

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John: Now if you're a regular

listener to the show, you will know

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that one of the key areas that I

focused on ever since the show began.

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Is the area of influence and persuasion

and especially operating those

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things within an ethical framework.

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Now I wanted to find out from

Phil what his thoughts were around

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the importance of influence and

persuasion in his professional life.

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So here's what he had to say.

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Phil Fraser: Yeah.

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So my background going all the

way back I sold advertising space.

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So it was a lot of face to face stuff.

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It was a lot of telephone stuff.

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So I'm used to not presenting in

the standard sense of standing

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on a stage and talking to people,

but I'm used to selling to people.

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I then joined an ad agency and the ad

agency had this fantastic thing whereby.

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Everybody who joined the agency,

whether they be secretary or a director

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would go through an in house two day

presentation skills training course.

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So it was, Yeah,

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it was part confidence building.

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It's part team bonding.

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It was adding skillsets

to it, to everybody.

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And after I'd been through

that two day training.

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Eventually I was asked to be one

of the trainers and we did this.

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It was a two half days training

course about presentation skills.

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It was sort of based on

loosely based on Carnegie.

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But it had been sort of shuffled

around a bit and we talked about.

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Presentation deliverer.

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We talked about presentation structure.

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We talked about, , answering

questions at the end of presentations

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content and, this dates it slightly.

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We did it before PowerPoint.

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So it was like using, so we

were using props and visual

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aids and things like that.

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Then as PowerPoint came in, it was

like, okay, how, how not to use

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PowerPoint, Don't look at the screen.

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Don't just put words on,

all that sort of stuff.

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John: a quick aside here.

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I know how important PowerPoints are and

I know a bunch of people who love them

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on a bunch of people who hate them in

terms of speaking and presentation work.

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However, I'm going to be bringing in

a guest to the show very soon who's

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going to help us if we are going

to be using PowerPoint, help us to

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have the most beautiful and creative

PowerPoints and effective ones as well.

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So look forward to that coming up.

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Back to the show.

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Phil Fraser: So I'd been

training this as a freelance.

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So I left the agency and they still

brought me back in as a freelancer.

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So I'd been training this quite a lot.

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When I launched my own business

it was quite new in my sector.

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And the best way I thought of getting

myself out in front of as many people

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as possible, as quickly as possible was

to put my hand up and say, I'll speak

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at your conference, I'll speak at your

conference, I'll speak at your conference.

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So I was wheeled out on a regular

basis speaking at conferences.

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Eventually I ended up

chairing an annual conference.

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So, so I'm very used to being out there

in front of people doing presentations.

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And to be honest, I actually prefer

standing up on a stage and doing

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presentations than I do sort of like

a networking event doing one to one.

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A lot of people.

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There's a, what's the stats on like

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75 percent of people, 75 percent

of people fear dying, sorry, fear

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speaking in public more than dying.

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It's weird.

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People hate talking in public, but

if you've been trained to do it

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and you'd be given a structure,

you'd be given the tools, it's

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actually quite straightforward.

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And the other thing is, we used to

tell people this all the time and

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it's worth people noting is when you

go and stand up on stage and you look

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out there and there's all these faces

looking at you going, go on then.

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Everybody's rooting for you.

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They actually want you to be

a success and not to fail.

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So you're standing there going, oh shit.

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And then everybody in the

audience is going, come on.

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You can do it.

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You can do it.

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You can do it.

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And the other thing we used to tell people

is people don't know what you're going

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to say, so you can't get it wrong because

they don't know what you're going to say.

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And it's all about easing the

nerves and all that sort of stuff.

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But as with everything,

it's practice makes perfect.

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You just gotta go out and do

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John: It's amazing to me how many

people don't do things like getting

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up on a stage to speak just

because of the scared of it.

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Because they don't feel like it.

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They maybe don't feel

that they're good enough.

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And the reality is you're not

going to be, unless you get

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up and do it and practice it.

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So Phil's absolutely right that we have to

be willing to put ourselves out there and

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get up on stage in front of other people.

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And the more do it the better

we're going to get at it.

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So take note of what Phil says here and

how much of a professional edge that

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speaking and training has given him,

that it can also do the same for you.

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But there's another side to

this as well, which is that.

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By making ourselves uncomfortable

and putting ourselves out there

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as a speaker and trainer doing the

stuff that we're often afraid to do.

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And sometimes even unwilling.

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We become better versions of ourselves.

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There is a journey of personal and

professional transformation and

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development, but happens as we do this.

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And I wanted to find out from Phil,

what that has been like for him.

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Phil Fraser: Well, two sides to that.

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When we did the training course

the breakthrough on day two when

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people put things in, we used to

video them and then they'd watch.

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So we'd do them a, like a first video

before we did any training, then

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we'd do the last one after training.

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And the breakthrough with

everybody was just, Oh my God,

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this is absolutely amazing.

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From my point of view, What I used to

like about it was, yes, it gives you

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the opportunity to do a big sell to lots

of people all in one, all in one go,

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but also I, yeah, for years people had

come up to me and go, Oh, hi, Phil, and

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I'd look at them and go, no idea who

you are, but they think they know me

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because they've seen me talk on a stage?

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or something like that.

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So yes, transformational because it's such

a great way of getting your message out.

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To lots of people all at, all at one time.

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And, I'm still doing it now.

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I presented at a networking

event a few months ago.

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It's just one of those

things I love doing.

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And it's just as a sales

tool for anybody in business.

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It's just one of the, often it's free.

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It's, it's free marketing to an audience

who, if it's the right audience, want

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your product, it's better than cold

calling, it's better than direct mail.

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It's better than, Advertising.

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You're just there in front of people.

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It's just great.

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And more people should do it

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John: It sounds like it gave you

a real boost in terms of your

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own professional credibility.

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Did you also find that that boosted

your confidence as well as a

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professional person, as a leader?

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Phil Fraser: Very much.

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So very much so.

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And yeah, the sector I got into once

I launched my own business, we were

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in we were an online bingo affiliate.

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So we were part of the whole online

gaming industry because we were there

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quite early and cause I was wheeled

up on stage as, the bingo person, I

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was sort of given the moniker, Mr.

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Online Bingo.

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Huge credibility in the industry

and seen as one of the early movers

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in the sector, pretty much by me

being the one who got wheeled out

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regularly at industry conferences.

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It's great free PR, but it's

great for your personal brand.

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And it's great for credibility.

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If, Yeah.

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It says on your, on the screen

here, John Ball coach and speaker.

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So actually by you saying

speaker, you are saying you are

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giving yourself credibility.

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And it's, as I say, it's quite

easy, you and I've done it.

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It's quite easy to get that credibility

to be able to go, I'm a speaker.

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John: Yeah.

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I do find there is something about

being on a stage that there is a

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level to which unless you prove your

audience wrong, they assume some

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level of expertise by the fact that

you're Up on a stage in front of them.

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So I do appreciate that.

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A lot of people have fear , in

professional situations especially I

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that can really turn up the dials on the

fear here, about getting up and speaking

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and presenting in front of people.

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Did you have experiences of things

going very wrong or were there some

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particular times that stand out for you

as being like , horrible experiences

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moments in a positive way as well?

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Phil Fraser: I mean, it's like

any type of performance might

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be a sporting performance.

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It might be a professional performance.

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If you haven't got those butterflies

you're not psyched and ready.

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I am petrified.

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Every time before I stand up on stage,

but then it's about, more and better

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people to talk about this than me, but

it's about controlling their nerves and we

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used to talk about getting the butterflies

flying in formation like red devils.

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So rather than them go around in a circle,

you go, okay, let's just control this.

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And also, if you go up on stage

and you're talking to, 20 people, a

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hundred people, wherever it might be.

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Unless you've got that, I feel, unless

you've got that sort of adrenaline

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buzz, you're going to sound quite flat.

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In terms of anytime anything went

particularly wrong I don't think

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anything's gone particularly wrong.

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I, one thing that, that, Hugely stood

out for me and you have to be really

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confident in what you're doing to do this.

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I was, industry conference stood up on

stage, next speaker is going to be Phil

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Fraser stood up and there were two,

three people in the audience talking,

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just talk to the guy next to them.

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So I didn't say anything.

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I just waited and waited.

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And eventually they sort of thought,

oooh and then stopped talking.

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Silence is one of the best tools

you can use in presentations.

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But that, that still stands out for me,

cause I was like, yeah, and it was quite

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a senior guy in the industry as well.

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So I was,

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John: That's good, I love that.

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There's a lot of power in the

pause, a lot of power in the

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silence, I 100 percent agree.

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Were there any experiences from your

earlier life, like school or just

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when you were young, that maybe gave

some indication that this might be

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something you were good at or perhaps

helped to prepare you in some way for

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Phil Fraser: completely

opposite, completely opposite.

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I,

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I was quite shy at school.

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And I think a lot of the fear of

presentations and standing up in

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public, I think comes from school.

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I think schools have got a lot of,

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a lot of blame here.

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They go John sat at the back of class

when he's 10 years old and the teacher

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says, come on, John, you stand up and.

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read from the book or do a presentation

or do a talk about something with no

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practice whatsoever no training in front

of your peers and that seed from the age

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of eight nine ten eleven twelve, whatever

it, might be of humiliation failure fear

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¡ When you get to 25 30 and somebody goes

right, Present to the board or present

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at a conference You immediately go back

to that 10 year old and go, bollocks to

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that, I'm not doing that, I'll, I'll let

somebody else do it And schools have a,

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a lot of blame for that sort of thing, I

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John: Yeah,

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Phil Fraser: And that happened to

me as well, at no point at school

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would I have ever said, that kid

there will love standing on stage.

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John: Now, one of my favorite Ted talks

ever was by the late, great Sir Ken

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Robinson, which is all about education

and how often education is de-geniusing

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kids and what we can do instead.

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And really part of that to me, I

think to Phil as well is about being

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able to have those presentation and

speaking skills that are going to help

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people become amazing communicators.

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So I had a chat with Phil about

what he would like to see happen in

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the educational world, that could

change things for the better, ¡ For

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the prospects of younger people.

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Phil Fraser: I think the logical thing

to do and, this is a huge can of worms

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now, is like, what do schools prepare

kids for, or what should they do?

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Basic presentation skills, it's one

of those things that you probably, if

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you're in anything fairly commercial,

fairly competitive, you are going

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to, in its broadest sense, present.

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It might be presenting an idea

to three of your peers at work,

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or it might be presenting to the

board, or just talking in public.

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Schools don't teach you that.

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There's tons of things schools

don't teach you that, I did I did

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You know, like logarithmic

tables and things.

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Absolutely zero use.

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Immediately the exam bell finished.

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This is a huge, this is a huge topic.

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What should schools be preparing

kids for in current time?

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But yeah, it's one of the

basic things I think schools?

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should possibly teach.

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John: I would love to see that myself,

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there's an expectation in leadership.

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A lot of the time that you are

supposed to be able to get up and

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speak, that you should be able to

be the Steve Jobs of your business.

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If you are a leader, and to be able to

deliver presentations the way he did

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well, if you know anything about some

of Steve Jobs most famous presentations,

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you might know how much effort,

energy and practice went into those.

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And before he delivered them,

they were well-rehearsed

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well-crafted and well presented.

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They didn't just happen.

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But he is also someone who was willing

to put his vision out into the world in a

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way that made sense and to tell a story.

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There was so many things that pay here.

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We are not going to become amazing

speakers and presenters overnight.

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However it is something that could

make the biggest difference in terms

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of your development, and your ability

to influence and persuade others.

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But what about that stage

fright that often comes up when

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you're about to get on stage.

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Here's what Phil says.

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Phil Fraser: The agency I was at,

everybody who'd come through the door

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as new recruits would go on this course.

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And we'd often find, with all

due respect, the secretary would

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actually end up doing a better

presentation than the account director.

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Cause they've sort of, I don't know,

for lots and lots of different reasons.

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So yeah, it's, it is, it's the whole

Peter principle in its broadest sense.

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You get promoting almost past

your ability level and by the time

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you're a senior executive, you're

expected to be able to present.

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I've seen senior executives who

are, you, I mean like painful,

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painfully poor at presenting.

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John: Now here we're going to get

into, were Phil tells us one of

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his favorite parts of training

was running Q and A sessions.

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Something that I personally haven't

always enjoyed doing, but Phil is

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going to give us some expert advice.

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On how to have excellent Q and A.

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So listen in.

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Phil Fraser: The thing I love,

this was part of our training.

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We did a, we used to do a

segment on questions and answers.

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So yeah, person does a presentation

and often just ends, it just dies.

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We used to do this thing where we teach

people to say, who has the first question?

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So you stay in control

of the presentation.

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So by saying who has the first question,

you're expecting questions, you're staying

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in control, you're expecting more than

one question, encourages people to ask

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questions, and we did this training

internally at my business as well.

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So anytime, even if we

did it like an internal.

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The management team report or something,

we don't, everybody would do it.

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So anytime somebody didn't do it,

it was like, ah, he didn't do it.

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He didn't do it.

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He did it.

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And I often watch people do

presentations and that bit at the

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end where they just finish and go,

does anybody got any questions?

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Yeah.

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The whole thing falls apart.

402

That's the thing that really

stuck with me from the training.

403

John: And I absolutely love that.

404

that's particularly helpful for a

listener because a lot of people do have

405

these Q and A sessions and really don't

know how to handle or arrange them.

406

I personally tend to stay clear of some

of them, not because I don't know how

407

to approach it, but because it just

doesn't, isn't relevant unless I'm doing

408

a workshop, but , I wonder if there

are any other elements to running Q&

409

A that you might be able to share that

could be helpful for our listeners.

410

Phil Fraser: Okay.

411

Q and a couple of things for Q and a.

412

So, so.

413

You have to say those exact words.

414

Who has the first question?

415

Five words.

416

A brilliant tip I was given is if

you put your hand up while you're

417

saying it, it encourages people to

put their hand up and ask questions.

418

If you say who has the first

question and nobody has a question,

419

you then ask yourself a question.

420

So I'm often asked or I'm usually

asked X, Y, Z and you keep your

421

hand up and then you go again.

422

So who has the next question?

423

So it's just, it's encouraging

people to question.

424

And then, from a timing point

of view, if there's a couple of

425

people, you go, Dave, I'll take your

question, and Mary, I'll come back

426

to you, so you don't forget people.

427

And then, when you're closing it

out, you then do the same thing,

428

who has the final question?

429

Because you're saying, right,

that's it, that's the last question.

430

So, throughout this whole Q& A session, as

the speaker, you are totally in control.

431

And when there isn't a question,

you can ask yourself one.

432

From a timing point of

view, you can control it.

433

It encourages people to ask questions.

434

So that's, you can all use that.

435

Take that away.

436

But you've gotta use those five words.

437

Who has the first question?

438

John: I love that.

439

I'm always curious to know why people get

into podcasting in the professional world.

440

And how they get started, whether

they actually start off as a guest

441

or whether they start off as a host.

442

And some people, no.

443

Certainly some people come in

and just do one side of that.

444

Just the guesting or just the hosting.

445

So I wanted to know from Phil

what happened, the positive

446

effects of podcasting for him.

447

Phil Fraser: Okay.

448

So, I listen to a lot of podcasts,

mainly business and football.

449

I'm a Leeds United fan, so I listen

to Leeds United podcasts all the time

450

and I listen to business podcasts.

451

So when I launched myself as a business

sounding board, and again, I have an

452

advertising and marketing background,

okay, how do I get my message

453

out to as many people to relevant

audience as quickly as possible?

454

So I thought, I know what I'll do.

455

I will guest on other people's podcasts.

456

Because what you're doing

and hands up, this is What?

457

I'm doing here.

458

I'm piggybacking on your audience.

459

It's great.

460

I don't have to build an audience.

461

You've got one.

462

I can do my song and

dance to your audience.

463

So I started putting myself out on

464

lots

465

of other podcasts.

466

And actually, if anybody does want to

be a guest on podcasts, there were two

467

things I used a website called podmatch.

468

com.

469

And a website called matchmaker.

470

fm, both of which match podcast

hosts and podcast guests.

471

Fantastic.

472

So I did lots and lots of guesting on

other people's podcasts, explaining

473

what a business sounding board was, what

my offer is, all that sort of stuff.

474

And then, and this comes to us

all, and you've had this epiphany,

475

John, you say, how hard can

it be to run your own podcast?

476

And the answer is, it's a

lot harder than it looks.

477

So I thought, okay, I'm

getting used to this guesting.

478

Why don't I do my own podcast?

479

And again, very clear marketing

thought process was okay.

480

What am I trying to do?

481

I'm trying to get my message

out to my potential audience.

482

I'm based in Leeds.

483

I work with small business

owners, or medium sized business

484

owners, or large business owners.

485

So I created the Leeds business podcast.

486

So if I'm, or anybody is searching

through Apple or Spotify I want

487

to listen to a business podcast.

488

yeah.

489

there's hundreds out there, starting

from Diary of a CEO and Joe Rogan

490

and sort of working your way down

and I will, how do I stand out?

491

So if somebody who is in Leeds and goes,

Oh, I'm from Leeds, I own a business.

492

I'll listen to that rather than a

sort of a general business podcast.

493

And I love.

494

Listen to business owners,

business journeys and stories.

495

So, you go on holiday or you're on a

train, you start speaking to somebody

496

and they go, Oh, what do you do?

497

And they go, Oh, I, I make pencils.

498

And most people go what'd you

watch on Netflix last night?

499

They'd sort of move it on.

500

Whereas I'd go, you make pencil?

501

Wow.

502

That's really interesting.

503

How'd you do that?

504

How's it, how'd you market them?

505

How'd you get into that?

506

How'd you make a pencil?

507

So I love that all that sort of

story and so that's what I did.

508

I launched the Leeds Business Podcast

interviewing Leeds business owners

509

about their business journeys.

510

With the aim of raising my profile

in the Leeds business community

511

so that I could sell my services

as a business sounding board.

512

And that's how it came about.

513

So every week, every Wednesday 7

o'clock in the morning is a new episode.

514

And we're just I think we just hit 51.

515

So quite pleased with that.

516

John: now Phil has a local

based podcast in Leeds.

517

wondered if he was very selective about

being on podcasts that were also local.

518

Here's what he had to say.

519

Phil Fraser: Well, there are two or

three, maybe three or four Leeds based

520

podcasts that I'm aware of that I

have been on, but whilst I, I focus

521

on Leeds because I wanted to keep

it niche, the service I offer, I can

522

do remotely and I can do to anybody.

523

So I've been on Australian podcasts.

524

I've been on New Zealand podcasts.

525

I've been on lots of American podcasts.

526

So my service doesn't matter

where business owners are based.

527

And some of the international podcasts

and obviously they feel international

528

to us, but they're local to them

is really interesting cause yeah,

529

there's different perspectives and

different ideas and different views.

530

So, What the Americans do as normal,

is different to us and the same

531

with Australia or New Zealand.

532

So, yeah, I've been on, I've been, I'm an

international podcast guest, I can say.

533

John: Oh, that's cool.

534

Have you found that some podcasts

have moved the needle for you more

535

than others when you've been guesting?

536

Phil Fraser: In.

537

I mean, it's interesting and you said

you've done it the other way around,

538

having been a guest and then hosting.

539

It opens your eyes to what is good

hosting, what is poor hosting, what is

540

good guesting, what is poor guesting?

541

I've been on podcasts where it

almost feels like I'm a vehicle for

542

the host to put their opinion over.

543

Whereas when I'm the host, I feel I've

got the listeners in my ear going,

544

ask him this, rather than it being

a vehicle for me to give my opinion.

545

So, yeah, so it's interesting

how different people do that.

546

And, whether they've done research

before they've come on this show,

547

whether they've listened to episodes,

whether they even know who the guest is.

548

And then you've got, bigger podcasts

who have, assistants who book you

549

and make you fill in forms and

stuff like that, which just feel.

550

Almost like you're sort of being

wheeled out in front of the, In.

551

front of the host and sort

of wheeled out the other end.

552

Whereas, good hosts will do the research.

553

I mean, one of the things I do and you

did it to your credit as well, is I

554

do a pre interview chat with people.

555

So, A, when we're talking on a podcast,

it's not the first time we've ever met.

556

And that works just from a

basic chemistry point of view.

557

But also, If you do a pre chat and

you'll have found this, all right,

558

you can look at my LinkedIn, you can

look at my website, you get, you can

559

get a certain amount of information.

560

There's probably bits we spoke

about when we did our pre chat.

561

And I find this with my guests that

you think, Oh, I didn't know that.

562

I'll, that's going to be a

really good part of the show.

563

And that actually then

contributes to a better show.

564

So as I say, being a guest

does make you learn stuff.

565

And from a podcasting point

of view, but also as from a

566

guesting point of view, it's.

567

You can feel who's a good,

who's a good host and who isn't.

568

You're a

569

good host, John.

570

John: So, Phil's giving away some of

my inside secrets here in podcasting,

571

but yes I do pre-interview my

guests with very rare exceptions.

572

That whole process of pre-interview is a

valuable part of a decision-making process

573

and just know that it's okay to take your

time and to decide whether someone is

574

going to be the right fit for you and your

show, or whether you are going to be the

575

right fit for someone else as a guest.

576

Phil and I are mostly in agreement about

what makes a good podcast and what makes

577

you a good guest experience for a show?

578

And thankfully Phil enjoyed his

experience being in Present Influence.

579

But I was very curious, without wanting

to shame anyone, but what had been some

580

of his best and worst podcast experiences.

581

Phil Fraser: I think the one that

stands out as the worst, I think

582

was was the guy who was, so the

structure was he asked me a question.

583

I give my answer.

584

Then he gives his answer.

585

Then he asked me a question and I give

my answer and he, so it's like, And

586

that's not me being all precious and

ego, it's like, I'm sure, And this was

587

another business owner, it wasn't somebody

famous that people wanted to hear.

588

I'm sure people want to listen to what

the guest has to say, not what you have

589

to say, so the balance on there was wrong.

590

Any that stand out particularly

from a positive point of view?

591

No, I don't think there's any.

592

that, that stand out and

go, wow, that was amazing.

593

I think any of them that, that flow well,

that the host asks interesting questions,

594

but also you'll know this as a host.

595

And I try and do it as a host is

you're trying to, in your mind, you're

596

thinking, what will the listener want?

597

How will the listener benefit?

598

Will they get out of this?

599

What I want them to get out of this.

600

And, we want our listeners to end that

episode and go, From my point of view, I

601

always aim for interesting, motivational,

educational, and entertaining.

602

So if I can tick all those

four boxes, I think, yeah, the

603

listeners got something out of it.

604

And one of the things I've

crafted a couple of things into

605

the show to try and do that.

606

One is, I ask every week I ask

guests to do a how to so they

607

can share some experience, some

expertise with our audience.

608

So, and you'll know this as a

coach, and I found this as a coach.

609

We often in our minds will think, well,

everybody knows that, but they don't.

610

So, so all my guests have got

lots of things in their head that

611

they think, Oh, everybody knows

that, but actually we don't.

612

So that, that sort of

ticks the educational box.

613

And then the rest of it, I'm

hoping, By my guest selection,

614

they're going to be entertaining,

motivational, and inspirational.

615

John: side and, and I think

a lot of people miss that.

616

Podcasts need to be

entertaining to a degree.

617

I work with a lot of people on

keynote presentations as well.

618

And that's what they nearly always

miss, especially if they've come from

619

a training and workshop background

where the intuition is to teach and

620

to teach and to teach some more.

621

And it's great in a workshop,

although there still needs

622

to be some variety, I feel.

623

But it's not so great.

624

Not great.

625

in a keynote certainly

not great in a podcast.

626

interview where and maybe you've

had this experience as well of

627

going to someone else's show.

628

I hope I haven't really done this

myself as a host, but tell us about

629

yourself and all the typical questions

that kind of show they haven't

630

really got interview skills yet.

631

And And it really isn't, it isn't

It isn't kind of interesting.

632

It's just somebody droning on about

the life story for most of the episode.

633

So entertainment piece I think is.

634

So critical.

635

what do you do to maybe inject

some lightness or humor into your

636

appearances or your own show?

637

Phil Fraser: I always look at this

as, and I do this with clients.

638

And one of the things I encourage

clients to do is I use JFDI, just

639

do it, I'll miss the adjective out.

640

And the other thing I say within

that is look, We're not doing brain

641

surgery, nobody's going to die,

what's the worst that could happen?

642

So let's have a bit of fun with

it, and going back to the, so, so I

643

try and just keep it light anyway.

644

So if a guest says something that's

a bit funny or a bit odd or, just

645

a bit, whoa, I gotta say that again.

646

What was it you said?

647

You've just got to do that because,

we are being given as podcast hosts,

648

Somebody is giving us their attention

for half an hour, 45 minutes.

649

That's valuable.

650

There's a million other

things they could be doing.

651

So you've got to respect that and

honor that and make it entertaining.

652

Yes, it could be educational, but it's

got to be entertaining at the same time.

653

And some of that is, is how people

speak and how people deliver.

654

And, on one hand, you can argue

that, the way people talk.

655

They can't really help it, but

actually they can, going back to the

656

presentation skills we talked about.

657

What part of the training we talked about

was pause and pace and intonation and

658

impact and all those sorts of things.

659

They can all be taught.

660

You don't have to drone just

because you are naturally a droner.

661

You don't have to stay a droner

that talks like this all the

662

time and is very monotone.

663

It can be taught.

664

So it has to be entertaining.

665

So, but you know, somebody sat in

the car, then the gym, then on a dog

666

walk, they've got us in their ears,

it's very easy to go, geez, this is

667

really boring, I'll go somewhere else.

668

So you have to make it entertaining.

669

If you can make it entertaining and

educational and inspirational and

670

motivational all at the same time.

671

And something that, I mean, I had, I

think the best podcast I've listened

672

to for a long time was Daniel Priestly

on Stephen Bartlett's daughter, if

673

you see I was driving, listening

to it and it got halfway through.

674

And I thought I'm going to have to

go home and listen to this again.

675

Cause I'm going to need a pad and a pen.

676

And if you can get to that level of

inspiration and motivation, education,

677

John: yeah.

678

Daniel's been on this show before.

679

He is a great guest.

680

Awesome.

681

Yeah.

682

Yeah.

683

Yeah.

684

Phil Fraser: on as well.

685

John: He's a, He's an interesting guy.

686

Phil Fraser: He's brilliant.

687

Absolutely brilliant.

688

John: That's fantastic.

689

Thank you.

690

There's some great insights there

Do you find that hosting a show

691

has been professionally beneficial?

692

Have you picked up clients

through guesting and hosting?

693

Phil Fraser: I've, I haven't

specifically picked up clients

694

but the aim I had was twofold.

695

One was.

696

Raise my awareness in the

local business community.

697

And that has a big tick, of people

coming up to me in networking

698

events, go, Oh, I love your podcast.

699

It's great.

700

And I go, Oh, goodness me.

701

This is really, it's a real like, Oh my

God, I'm honored that you actually, A,

702

you listen and B, you think it's good.

703

But I think the long term part

of it is as a podcast host, you

704

are there to interview the guest.

705

As a business sounding board.

706

I want people to feel that they are

comfortable with me and to work with

707

me, so it's a whole know, like, trust,

which is more of a long term play.

708

So I don't think anybody's gonna

listen to me interviewing somebody

709

and going, He's a great interviewer, I

want him as a business sounding board.

710

That gap's too big, so I

need to close that gap.

711

And there's ways and means I'm

trying to do that at the moment.

712

To go, I'm a podcast host.

713

I'm a business sounding board.

714

Come and work with me.

715

But if I've been in, and you'll know this

as well, if you've been in somebody's

716

head for two or three years, I've only

been in a year, you've been in a lot

717

longer than I have, eventually they come

to know you as a person, they understand

718

you, and then they get to the point where

they go, I'd like to work with that guy.

719

And also a lot of people who listen

to podcasts might not be at the point

720

in their business journey where they

721

feel they need one, but

Well, they need my services.

722

But it's often like that with marketing

you try and stay front of mind so that

723

when they do need you, they go, ah, if I'm

going to, if I'm going to get a business

724

coach, business mentor, business sounding

board, I'd love to work with Phil.

725

Cause I've been listening to him

for weeks and weeks and weeks.

726

And I feel like I know the

guy and I trust him and.

727

I like the way it works and whatever.

728

John: It reminds me of what my good

friend Bob Gentle says, he has a great

729

show he said, even if it, even if he

didn't have the level of listeners

730

he had, he still thinks it's worth

doing for the positioning that it

731

gives you and the access to people.

732

And which I 100 percent agree with

is great for your positioning, and

733

it's certainly great for things like

credibility, and I found it's given me

734

the, , the bravery, if you like, to be

able to go and approach people who I

735

probably never would otherwise approach,

but I would really want to, say, would

736

you be open to coming and being a guest

on the show, because I can do it for

737

the the audience , it's not just for

me, because I want to connect with them,

738

And I found that doesn't always work

out with a yes, but so often it does as

739

well that makes it really worthwhile.

740

It's great that it relates

to what you do now as well.

741

who do you generally end up working

with as a business sounding board?

742

Is it mostly business owners or

people inside other businesses?

743

Who do you really help?

744

Phil Fraser: So I work with business

owners rather than something

745

like C Suite or stuff like that,

although I suppose I could.

746

So if you're a business owner with

between three and fifteen staff, half

747

a million turnover to three million

turnover, I find those business

748

owners are still, whilst, they've got

businesses making money and, things

749

are starting to work, there's lots of

bits in that part of the journey where

750

they're still learning and they don't

know what to do, or they're stuck, or

751

they don't know how to get to the next

stage and that Is my sweet spot and

752

they're the people I tend to work with.

753

I always start, with clients with what

does perfect look like in a year's time?

754

And you think, well, that's a

simple question, more sales.

755

And you go, well, all

right, it's more sales.

756

What you really want to go.

757

Well, actually, I'd like to

hit a million pound turnover.

758

You go, okay, so is that the target?

759

Well, actually, do you know what?

760

I'd like to work four days a week.

761

And I actually had this with a client.

762

I want to play golf on a Friday.

763

That's what perfect looks

like in a year's time.

764

And then what I do with my clients

is I work backwards from there to

765

build a strategy to deliver that.

766

So that's how I help business owners.

767

And I use a, I've got a five step very

basic strategy system, which I call the

768

Fraser five step so that I can write

FFS on an email and snig it to myself,

769

it's very childish very childish.

770

and We use this five step process

to, to put a strategy together.

771

So, okay.

772

If perfect is.

773

What do we need to do?

774

What do we put in place?

775

How do we make it.

776

deliver?

777

Who's going to do It

778

Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

779

And that's how I work with business owners

because they can control all of that.

780

And that question, what does

perfect look like in a year's time?

781

sounds really simple, but actually

when you think about it, it then

782

really gets the brain going.

783

So yeah, if anybody wants to wants a

copy of the FFS drop me an email at Phil.

784

philfraser.

785

co.

786

uk.

787

Happy to share it with you.

788

It's a very simple document.

789

You can fill it in yourself

or I can help you fill it in

790

John: sounds good, Phil.

791

Phil Fraser: And you can snigger

to yourself that somebody

792

professionals for FFS in

793

John: You know, if

794

sometimes my mom listens

and she'll be she'll again.

795

What's FFS?

796

So she Googles that I'm coming back to you

797

Phil Fraser: Sorry, Mrs.

798

Ball.

799

John: so that'll be in the show

notes for anyone who wants to come

800

and check that and get in touch with

you and I think that sounds like a

801

great form and a really simple a lot.

802

I like that.

803

It was really just You just ask

that question, what does perfect

804

look like in a year's time?

805

And then just, is that

what you really want?

806

Is that what you really want?

807

It's not that hard to drill into it.

808

And yet we need those need to have

as business owners or entrepreneurs

809

or whatever level we're in, really,

or business, that thinking time,

810

that ability to ask the questions.

811

One of like, one of my favorite books is

, The Road Less Stupid, if you've ever come

812

across that, which is Keith Cunningham.

813

And that's all about business owners

or business people asking themselves

814

important questions and taking some

time out to think, but structured

815

time out to think, where you're

asking yourself relevant and important

816

questions, because if we don't plan

those times with someone like you

817

or for ourselves, It doesn't happen.

818

We just get caught up in the busy.

819

So I really love that you're out there

giving people the opportunity to take

820

that big picture, the overview and

have someone to sound stuff out so

821

they can get clarity and create that

plan to what they really, really want.

822

Phil, I hope people will

get in touch with you.

823

It's been awesome having you on the

show and I really appreciate all that.

824

Knowledge bombs that you've dropped

and the valuable information that

825

you shared and that if only one thing

people remember from this is like what

826

does perfect look like a year from

now or they remember the Q& A stuff.

827

Awesome, we've done it.

828

We've done our job today.

829

So, Phil Fraser, thank you for coming

and being a guest on Present Influence.

830

Phil Fraser: It's a pleasure.

831

Thanks for having me on John.

832

John: I really enjoyed the chat.

833

I got the half with Phil and the fact

that we both shared understanding

834

of that presentations and guest

appearances need to be entertaining.

835

You need to have some value that

you're going to give and you need to

836

be somewhat animated and have a level

of charisma about you whilst you do it.

837

Over the years I've generally found that

people are unwilling to put themselves

838

forward, often talk themselves down or

talk themselves out of being able to

839

be that person who gets up and does the

training gets up and does the presenting.

840

Without sometimes being put in

the position where they're told

841

they have to do it or where there

really is no other option.

842

But why wait?

843

Because you may never really get put in

the position where you have to, but for

844

something that can be so advantageous to

your professional growth and development.

845

And you're positioning.

846

You may want to consider how you

could be getting up in front of people

847

in your professional life, whether

that's as a speaker or workshop

848

leader, as a podcast host, as a

podcast, guest, all these things are

849

going to enhance your credibility.

850

And potentially your positioning as well.

851

If you are a business owner,

852

one of the things I will especially

be taken away from this episode is how

853

to effectively run a Q and a session.

854

And some of the great questions

that Phil says to ask in the right

855

way that sets you up for success.

856

I hope this has been great value to you.

857

I'm going to be back next week with

another episode, which is going to be the

858

follow on in my keynote creation series.

859

We've already talked a little bit

about the keynote development and

860

expert positioning that I've been

working on, now I'm going to take

861

you forward into creating what's

called an abstract for the talk.

862

And the actual talk

title and concept itself.

863

So, it's going to be a fun episode.

864

If you are writing keynotes or you're

interested in creating keynotes.

865

You might want to tune him for that.

866

And if you're looking for help with

your own keynote creation and delivery,

867

you might just want to get in touch.

868

And you're very welcome to do that.

869

You can email me,

john@presentinfluence.com.

870

Either way.

871

I hope you'll stay tuned to the show and

will listening for the keynote series and

872

for future interviews, guests that I have

coming up, I'm getting so many wonderful

873

guests coming forward for the show that

I can't wait to bring them all to you.

874

So wherever you're going,

whatever you're doing.

875

Have an amazing week.

876

I will look forward to

seeing you next time.

877

Bye-bye.